Solving AotP

Haashhtaag · November 2018

Wrathmane wrote: »

So this is ultimately the problem I've been having as well....... my question is how do they stay log on? how come they don't constantly crash.... last night I made the mistake of getting to close to Sej while AP was capturing it...... after my crash I got the "unable to connect to the game server" five times before I was able to get back in...... Thats a problem.... and I'm EP.... when your crashing out your allies. Why is it so bad to spread your raids out to multiple objectives instead of taking one crashing everyone out around you then moving to the next.... while leaving the one you left behind to fall...

I don't know..... I like PVPing, been doing it since launch....... this is the worst this have been..... and if it being caused by my "allies" and they are laughing about it.... so not good.

Because my group of 4-8 can wipe 16-24 of theirs. And they’re scared of that so much so that when we farm them they showed up with their whole raid of 50-70 to kill us at a resource.

Ahtu · November 2018

Wrathmane wrote: »

So this is ultimately the problem I've been having as well....... my question is how do they stay log on? how come they don't constantly crash.... last night I made the mistake of getting to close to Sej while AP was capturing it...... after my crash I got the "unable to connect to the game server" five times before I was able to get back in...... Thats a problem.... and I'm EP.... when your crashing out your allies. Why is it so bad to spread your raids out to multiple objectives instead of taking one crashing everyone out around you then moving to the next.... while leaving the one you left behind to fall...

I don't know..... I like PVPing, been doing it since launch....... this is the worst this have been..... and if it being caused by my "allies" and they are laughing about it.... so not good.

First of all, I definitely know how frustrating it can be to crash and apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused. I had no idea that people were having performance issues before reading this post as I never experience any problems myself. Ever since I changed my video settings to default values and disabled most of my add-ons the game runs perfectly for me.

Ranger209 · November 2018

Wrathmane wrote: »

So this is ultimately the problem I've been having as well....... my question is how do they stay log on? how come they don't constantly crash.... last night I made the mistake of getting to close to Sej while AP was capturing it...... after my crash I got the "unable to connect to the game server" five times before I was able to get back in...... Thats a problem.... and I'm EP.... when your crashing out your allies. Why is it so bad to spread your raids out to multiple objectives instead of taking one crashing everyone out around you then moving to the next.... while leaving the one you left behind to fall...

I don't know..... I like PVPing, been doing it since launch....... this is the worst this have been..... and if it being caused by my "allies" and they are laughing about it.... so not good.

I believe it is kind of like when you approach a very large scale fight that if you run in too fast you have a good chance to disconnect with the server. If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client. Take that one small spike times 100 new players all coming into range for you at the same time and it will decon you. The issue with AP is that it is moving at you rather than you moving at it. So you have no control over how fast you converge with the group. The clients of the AP players, on the other hand, already have all of those players on their lists and are coming at a few at a time. If they run into another zerg I would guess they have the same issues.

booksmcread · November 2018

TBois wrote: »

If everyone loses a third of their grp during a crash, a normal raid will have 16 while they will have 2 full raids

Part of the problem is that if you have 70 people in your group, everyone is pre-rendered as you've probably gathered at a keep during a non server or client-stressed time before moving out. When that large group of 70 encounters a group of 16, their clients only have to render in 16 enemy players and the server only has to transmit the data of those 16, whereas the group of 16 has to render in 70 enemy players into each of their clients and the server has to transmit a much higher amount of data to those individual clients. This is what causes the client-side lag that causes some people to crash. The group of 70 players will not have the same client-side stress as the group of 16 and a significantly smaller percentage of their group will experience issues.

Ruckly · November 2018

RDMyers65b14_ESO wrote: »

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frozywozy wrote: »

Yesterday I was playing with 6-8 friends in a group. AotP moved toward us with 60+ players at high speed and half of my group crashed. I mentioned in zone chat and got as a reply a bunch of their people being proud and laughing about it.

I heard that they have a discord lobby dedicated to the rage whispers that they all laugh about.

I mean, they do bring 70 players together so they must have some ultimate sentence they bring to justify their behaviors and make them feel better about themselves. I wonder if it's still the good old "It's on ZOS to fix their game, we are just doing what was promised at release, epic large scale battles".

When you have one of the members of the most COMPETENT EP guild saying that AP is a problem, then it is a very serious problem. I know that my PVP guild would rather fight a fair fight against DRAC who runs in about equal numbers anyday over the zergblob that is AP. Even though Drac wipes us more than not, it is fun. Crashing due to lag, being told by the game 'Unable to connect to the game server' multiple times and then finally after 10 to 15 minutes and then back in queue only to get back to Cyrodil is NOT fun.

But, I think that I have it figured out. AP HATES PVP. Therefore, they are going to destroy Cyrodiil to make it safe for PVE.

That is possible. Cyrodill is pretty much log in and join any group or surf with a group providing support. This compared to PvE raid schedules where there is an upper limit on raid caps and thus politics and intrigue. Maybe we are having more fun in cyrodill and they are envious. Maybe they want to bring politics and intrigue to cyrodill. Or if they can't simply lag everyone out.

Ackwalan · November 2018

If the other alliance faction stacks, they are cheating and wrecking the whole campaign. If my alliance faction stacks, we are being strategic and playing the campaign the way it was meant to be played.

WaltherCarraway · November 2018

hypocrisy here is thicker than cvn-65's hull.

ShadowProc · November 2018

WaltherCarraway wrote: »

hypocrisy here is thicker than cvn-65's hull.

Rest In Peace USS Enterprise.

frozywozy · November 2018

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which does not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

Wrathmane · November 2018

frozywozy wrote: »

show previous quotes

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which doeultra s not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

I've always ran this game at ultra high graphics and max view distance, since launch.... since this problem started I've busted down to the opposite minimum graphics and 0 view distance.... it makes absolutely no difference..... its exactly as Frozy said there is a line that you crash at.

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · November 2018

Wrathmane wrote: »

show previous quotes

frozywozy wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which doeultra s not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

I've always ran this game at ultra high graphics and max view distance, since launch.... since this problem started I've busted down to the opposite minimum graphics and 0 view distance.... it makes absolutely no difference..... its exactly as Frozy said there is a line that you crash at.

You are better off with higher view distance (37 for example) this then allows you to render some of the map components separately from the players. Also if you do crash you can lower to 0 and generally get back in. If it's at 0 and you crash you won't get back in until 4 relog attempts

Wrathmane · November 2018

Ackwalan wrote: »

If the other alliance faction stacks, they are cheating and wrecking the whole campaign. If my alliance faction stacks, we are being strategic and playing the campaign the way it was meant to be played.

This I disagree with... I've played solely EP since launch and and I don't think its great to stack 3 raids on top of each other even if they are my faction.... one raid maybe and even that is lots IMO.

Ruckly · November 2018

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

Wrathmane wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which doeultra s not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

I've always ran this game at ultra high graphics and max view distance, since launch.... since this problem started I've busted down to the opposite minimum graphics and 0 view distance.... it makes absolutely no difference..... its exactly as Frozy said there is a line that you crash at.

You are better off with higher view distance (37 for example) this then allows you to render some of the map components separately from the players. Also if you do crash you can lower to 0 and generally get back in. If it's at 0 and you crash you won't get back in until 4 relog attempts

I use the following

https://www.esoui.com/downloads/info1732-ESOGraphicsExtender.html

at 1366x640 resolution and I still crash. It puts the render distance very far and removes the fog. The crash line is about the same on approach of a fort. It makes the game look like everquest? or some older brighter mmo. I swap between this and normal everything is relative so I often run ESO low resolution and whatever game I play after at normal resolution and notice the graphics more. Because ESO has good graphics no matter what for an mmo imo it's better to have jags and such to give depth cues because people tend to play mmos for long stretches and making the game "more gamey" and "less realistic" is probably better for your health. This is conjecture I might be completely wrong.

Haashhtaag · November 2018

Wrathmane wrote: »

show previous quotes

frozywozy wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which doeultra s not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

I've always ran this game at ultra high graphics and max view distance, since launch.... since this problem started I've busted down to the opposite minimum graphics and 0 view distance.... it makes absolutely no difference..... its exactly as Frozy said there is a line that you crash at.

The funny part is at times you can literally see the line where u will disconnect if you run fast in it. I’ve seen it many a times running around nikel lol

Ranger209 · November 2018

frozywozy wrote: »

show previous quotes

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which does not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

Yes except now the line is moving toward you which is worse. "Render Line" is that your term or is that a thing? I agree with you that there is a distance at which other player characters start to render, I believe it is more radial at a set distance with you at the center than a straight line. In addition to graphical rendering though there is all of the other information that starts hitting you as well. The HP of all the characters bombarding you at once, along with the x,y,z location of all of them so that your client knows where they are and their clients know where you are. Any ability calculations from them that are hitting the server, etc., etc.

Now I don't know, but believe this all happens at the same distance. If that is so, what would be great is if they could create another "Line/Bubble" with you at the center that deals with say xyz location and hp, and another that deals with any ability calculations. Maybe it already works this way, but if not this would allow data to be graded in or partitioned in based on distance.

So say you get within 120 meters of 100 player characters the server starts exchanging information about your xyz location and theirs. At 90 meters it starts exchanging data about what abilities you are using with them and them to you. Then at 60 meters if finally starts to render them to you and you to them. These are numbers I am pulling from the air, can't quite recall exactly where that render distance currently is, but the point is there is a bigger problem than just graphical that is spiking people with a ton of data, and if it could be phased in incrementally it might reduce the impact of that moment of "confrontation" to peoples clients. There may also be bunches of data that I am not accounting for with this crude example that could also be phased in at different distance intervals.

Thoragaal · November 2018

I'm still here.. hoping someone will come up with a constructive way to solve the issue..
It's not gonna change on an individual level. "-You suck and should change! -Lawl, no! -Well.. now what?"

Maybe ZoS could change the layout of the map?
Maybe separate the resources from keeps?
They recently gave people those teleportation stones (to teleport to keeps), maybe adjusting that to avoid large groups?
Maybe having a huge meltdown from Molag'Bal to come down and kill everything in his vicinity?
Could we try to narrow down the issue, outside of AotP specifically? (because people zerging is happening organically as well, so removing a guild wouldn't result in no lag at all)
Should ZoS lower the max amount of players per faction (again), but open more campaigns?

Greasytengu · November 2018

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

Wrathmane wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

If, however, you run in slow and don't force feed all of that data of new players incoming into your client all at the same time, you can slowly enter the area and not disconnect. It's like when the client acknowledges a new player that is now exchanging data with you through the server there must be a small spike to your client.

I have tested this myself times and times again, even on stream in front of 30 people. Here is how the rendering system works in this game. No matter if you set your game to 0 view distance or 30 view distance, it won't change much because even if you move one meter at a time very carefully, the game client will render a large area in front of you when you pass what is called a "render line".

You can witness those render lines if you go close to a well contested objective watching people riding in. They will stop at the exact same place and disconnect (go invisible) after 5 to 10 seconds. I have waited one meter away from that render line for 10 minutes once and as soon as I moved one meter closer I crashed instantly because my client rendered a large area in front of me instead of a single meter.

The reason why AotP or before, Vae Victus don't crash is because they have slowly rendered each and every player when they built their group in the beginning of their event. Since then, they have always been together, except when they resurrect at a transit shrine, which doeultra s not create a huge impact on rendering since they all resurrect progressively and not instantly.

When they ride from one place to another very stacked together at full speed with Maneuvers, they become a bomb for anyone they cross because those players have to suddenly render all of them just as if they would move close to them.

I've always ran this game at ultra high graphics and max view distance, since launch.... since this problem started I've busted down to the opposite minimum graphics and 0 view distance.... it makes absolutely no difference..... its exactly as Frozy said there is a line that you crash at.

You are better off with higher view distance (37 for example) this then allows you to render some of the map components separately from the players. Also if you do crash you can lower to 0 and generally get back in. If it's at 0 and you crash you won't get back in until 4 relog attempts

Ive been having issues with the "Stuck on terrain bug" for a while and I have a very strong hunch that the "render lines" that people are crashing at and the "mashed potato terrain lines" that people are getting stuck on are the same. (Men-Do has a thread about the persistant bugs found in Cyro that has some examples of this bug)

Next PVP night Ill set my view distance up some and see if it helps any with both the crashing and the bug. Would be great to have anything resembling a workaround for both.

Ruckly · December 2018

The disconnect on approaching a keep needs to be fixed. I can't approach a home keep without disconnect and I think the numbers might be 40+ vs 20+. Nothing extraordinary. If a keep can't be reinforced this is PvD. I don't see how rendering could possibly be an issue since that has to do with gpu and not bandwidth throttling. 60 player states isn't a big number. A battlefield server can do 64 constant no lag.

Thoragaal · December 2018

Ruckly wrote: »

The disconnect on approaching a keep needs to be fixed. I can't approach a home keep without disconnect and I think the numbers might be 40+ vs 20+. Nothing extraordinary. If a keep can't be reinforced this is PvD. I don't see how rendering could possibly be an issue since that has to do with gpu and not bandwidth throttling. 60 player states isn't a big number. A battlefield server can do 64 constant no lag.

I think it's down to coding.
And a possible solution is to change your ethernet cable. It seems the slightest hic up in connectivity can get you DC'd from Cyrodiil, while at virtually anything else you do online it would be just that; a hic up..

Ruckly · December 2018

Thoragaal wrote: »

show previous quotes

Ruckly wrote: »

The disconnect on approaching a keep needs to be fixed. I can't approach a home keep without disconnect and I think the numbers might be 40+ vs 20+. Nothing extraordinary. If a keep can't be reinforced this is PvD. I don't see how rendering could possibly be an issue since that has to do with gpu and not bandwidth throttling. 60 player states isn't a big number. A battlefield server can do 64 constant no lag.

I think it's down to coding.
And a possible solution is to change your ethernet cable. It seems the slightest hic up in connectivity can get you DC'd from Cyrodiil, while at virtually anything else you do online it would be just that; a hic up..

I think AotP caused something in the server mainframe to overheat and crack. Or mine and everybody else's ethernet cables needs to be replaced.

I'll try again next campaign I think. Or next patch or next dlc.

Thoragaal · December 2018

Ruckly wrote: »

show previous quotes

Thoragaal wrote: »

Ruckly wrote: »

The disconnect on approaching a keep needs to be fixed. I can't approach a home keep without disconnect and I think the numbers might be 40+ vs 20+. Nothing extraordinary. If a keep can't be reinforced this is PvD. I don't see how rendering could possibly be an issue since that has to do with gpu and not bandwidth throttling. 60 player states isn't a big number. A battlefield server can do 64 constant no lag.

I think it's down to coding.
And a possible solution is to change your ethernet cable. It seems the slightest hic up in connectivity can get you DC'd from Cyrodiil, while at virtually anything else you do online it would be just that; a hic up..

I think AotP caused something in the server mainframe to overheat and crack. Or mine and everybody else's ethernet cables needs to be replaced.

I'll try again next campaign I think. Or next patch or next dlc.

I think of it like this: 15 players around an area isn't, comparatively, that much information, and usually doesn't cause any issues. But when there's 30 players it's not just twice as much information that needs to be processed. Since buffs/debuffs/heals/aoe etc affects surrounding players differently it's way more than just double the amount of data that needs to be transfered. So everything scales multiplicatively (in terms of information). The more players, the more information needs to be sent from server to client and then client back to server. The more information the bigger the chance is that something goes missing. When something goes missing you DC.

This happens all the time though, with everything you do online. But for some unclear reason ESO seems extremely sensitive to it, and instead of caching information it just promptly kicks you. Or maybe it's the coding that wasn't designed with intent to handle all this information at once.
It's not AotP, this issue has been there for several years. But it's more evident nowdays since it's way more of everything.
I wish ZOS would come out and explain this though. However I find it unlikely. Maybe, what AotP is doing will cause some kind of reaction when enough players have DC'd. I'm also wondering how many people actually take their time to report their DC's.

Delsskia · December 2018

Guilds that stack 2, 3, 4 or more raids to exploit the horrible performance issues are bad for Cyrodiil. They are a real problem and they are exploiting known issues. The problem is that ZOS doesn't want to spend the resources to fix it.

1. ESO was built on an old and bad game engine.

2. Soon after the game was released, most of their best and most experienced coders were let go. Since release, the new content has been coded by entry level coders, for the most part, and their documentation has been sparse at best. This has resulted in every new batch of coders not knowing exactly how all of the previous coders achieved their desired outcomes causing millions of lines of spaghetti code and introducing more bugs than can be managed with bandaids. And all of this on top of a bad and old game engine.

3. There are loads of bandaid "fixes" that ZOS and players both have tried/suggested, but those aren't solutions they're just attempts at addressing the symptoms of the underlying problem.

4. The solution is to rewrite the game, with real documentation, on top of a modern game engine that's actually capable of handling large scale combat. In the nearly 5 years since release ZOS has had ample time to do this and it should have been done with the 64 bit client releases. They've had ample time to do this since the release of the 64 bit clients. That they haven't done this implies that they just simply don't want to, for whatever reason.

5. A good intermediate step would be to use Battle Spirit to disable ALL proc sets so that, at least in Cyrodiil, the game engine and servers wouldn't get stressed to the point of freezes, crashes and unacceptable lag levels.

6. Another good intermediate step would be for ZOS to open a new CP enabled campaign that REQUIRES a minimum group size of 10 or 12 to even enter, giving ball groups and organized/guild groups a campaign intended specifically for those play styles to release the pressure valve on Vivec.

ZOS has the resources to solve the performance issues. It's on them to adopt a long term vision for their game and not allow stagnation and status quo to prevent updating to modern performance solutions.

frozywozy · December 2018

Delsskia wrote: »

Guilds that stack 2, 3, 4 or more raids to exploit the horrible performance issues are bad for Cyrodiil. They are a real problem and they are exploiting known issues. The problem is that ZOS doesn't want to spend the resources to fix it.

1. ESO was built on an old and bad game engine.

2. Soon after the game was released, most of their best and most experienced coders were let go. Since release, the new content has been coded by entry level coders, for the most part, and their documentation has been sparse at best. This has resulted in every new batch of coders not knowing exactly how all of the previous coders achieved their desired outcomes causing millions of lines of spaghetti code and introducing more bugs than can be managed with bandaids. And all of this on top of a bad and old game engine.

3. There are loads of bandaid "fixes" that ZOS and players both have tried/suggested, but those aren't solutions they're just attempts at addressing the symptoms of the underlying problem.

4. The solution is to rewrite the game, with real documentation, on top of a modern game engine that's actually capable of handling large scale combat. In the nearly 5 years since release ZOS has had ample time to do this and it should have been done with the 64 bit client releases. They've had ample time to do this since the release of the 64 bit clients. That they haven't done this implies that they just simply don't want to, for whatever reason.

5. A good intermediate step would be to use Battle Spirit to disable ALL proc sets so that, at least in Cyrodiil, the game engine and servers wouldn't get stressed to the point of freezes, crashes and unacceptable lag levels.

6. Another good intermediate step would be for ZOS to open a new CP enabled campaign that REQUIRES a minimum group size of 10 or 12 to even enter, giving ball groups and organized/guild groups a campaign intended specifically for those play styles to release the pressure valve on Vivec.

ZOS has the resources to solve the performance issues. It's on them to adopt a long term vision for their game and not allow stagnation and status quo to prevent updating to modern performance solutions.

Number 2 and 4 is Bingo.

Now and as I said in another post, ZOS and even less Bethesda aren't interested to invest any money to start from fresh, unless their crown stores system would bring an insane amount of resources and even there, I don't believe they will restart from the beginning and rewrite everything. They will keep bringing bandaid fixes, spaghetti code on top of spaghetti code and will think ahead of their next mmo instead of fixing what could have been the best mmo ever made. Sad reality.

Ruckly · December 2018

It would almost be better to split the map in three with a lane between each faction and a pop lock on each lane. Players can't be depended upon to keep lag down that is very obvious and people don't want to play with lag and splitting the map would solve a lot of problems imo. The AD-DC lane would run very smooth.

NBrookus · December 2018

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zyk · December 2018

NA prime time and EP has all scrolls and emp. What an absolutely horrible experience AvA will be tonight.

evivnada · December 2018

It'll probably be boring for EP cause AD will not attack until DC pushes.

zyk · December 2018

evivnada wrote: »

It'll probably be boring for EP cause AD will not attack until DC pushes.

Yeah, because AD will be too busy defending against DC who will ignore the depose because they're playing for second place. If DC players were less interested in competing for second, we'd actually have a competitive scoreboard from pushing our mutual enemy this cycle, EP.

Ruckly · December 2018

zyk wrote: »

show previous quotes

evivnada wrote: »

It'll probably be boring for EP cause AD will not attack until DC pushes.

Yeah, because AD will be too busy defending against DC who will ignore the depose because they're playing for second place. If DC players were less interested in competing for second, we'd actually have a competitive scoreboard from pushing our mutual enemy this cycle, EP.

DC isn't playing for second. Maybe pugs but I very much doubt guilds or regular zone generals care. This sounds like a rest day for DC guilds. I wouldn't be surprised if a DC guild holds carmala and an AD guild holds vlas and they take turns fighting over and capping brindle for AP. Scrolls and emp aren't worth any AP(aside from the scroll quest) and the campaign is over anyways. Worst case scenario EP generates a bunch of lag jumping into a fight between DC and AD.

zyk · December 2018

No faction has done more to suck the life out of this game than EP since 1.5 TB.

Prime time PC/NA/Vivec @ 8PM EST:

AvA is dying.