Magplar PvP

TheDoomsdayMonster

Those b@st@rds!!!!

How DARE they hit my precious Swift jewelry so hard with the nerf bat...


Now I gotta decide if Swift x3 is worth it at 18% movement vs 30% movement...

Grrr...


Well, I do kinda miss the dps I lost from having Arcane x3; it makes a big difference on how hard Devouring Swarm hit...

I might have to revisit that...

LordSlif

Minno wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

it is a direct dot \_(• _ •)_/
ZoS should review this line between
DoT 《Channeling》 Direct
Templars are ^here

@LordSlif

As far as I know these are the different types of damage applications there are in the game.

Direct Damage: Melee
Direct Damage: Ranged
Direct Damage: Projectile
Direct Damage: Area of Effect
Damage over Time: Melee
Damage over Time: Ranged
Damage over Time: Projectile
Damage over Time: Area of Effect

Channels are Ranged Damage over Time. Something like the DoT from Flame Reach for example would have its original direct damage be ranged but its DoT would be "melee" since its applied on the person and stays on them. One big thing to remember is the difference between Direct Damage and Single Target. DoTs can be Single Target and AoE and Direct Damage can be Single Target and AoE. Direct Damage=/=Single Target. Some skills do blur the line, like Jabs for example, its a Melee AoE DoT. You could write that as its own type of damage application but I think its the only one? Not sure, maybe I need to update my list. But yea, maybe this will help a bit.

thats the point direct =/= dot, but there is a limbo in this game and some skils are there. sometimes will works as dot and sometimes as direct.

@LordSlif

Can you give an example of a skill that is both? Other than the obvious ones that have a direct damage bit first and then a DoT like flame reach, those are specifically described as such in their tooltips. Like is there a skill that you know of that will have increased damage from putting points in both Mighty/Elemental Expert and Thaumaturge but is not divided into 2 separate damage attacks?

it is not the point... Cps
look it:
bubble: Envelop enemy in a lightless sphere, causing x Magic Damage each time they use a *direct damage attack*.

if u cast sweeps inside the bubble it will reflect sweeps

puncturing: Launch a relentless assault, striking enemies in front of you four times with your Aedric spear dealing x Magic Damage to the closest enemy and x Magic Damage to all other enemies.

So... is it direct or dot? did u get it?
It is a composition of 4 direct atks, so makes sense it be reflected, we are locked in this skill while we are doing dmg, we cant deal this "dot dmg" plus a direct dmg atk at the same time... it is no "x dmg over y seconds", its x dmg per strike like crushing shock, but not instant.

So... in game Puncturing is a composition of directs atks and its = DoT (cp dot, valkyn... BUT the bubble reflect it)
Btw its a direct dmg 4 me. LOL

So this is the line.

Please tell me if im wrong in someway

you'll have to make sure burning light isnt the proc on that. From some forum investigating I found some posts that said jabs/sweeps turns into a "direct attack" for the application of burning light. IDK if this was tested or not, but burning light is direct damage and would be the culprit in procing total dark not sweeps/jabs dmg itself.

More info; a stam sorc in another thread couldnt understand why his hurricane was procing against total dark. What I found out he was using rending slashes and it has 3 direct dmg components before it becomes the thamaturge scaled dot (initial hit, application hit for snare and first tick of the DOT). It is my understanding, that the game cannot just make attacks appear out of thin air, DOTS almost ALWAYS have their first hit scale off direct damage because the game is hitting your target directly and then applying it's damage over time component. This logic is confirmed with elemental enchants procing their status effect; you get a little mini dmg from the enchant which because of elemental resistance can make your toon immune to that status effect (like nords against frost enchants are immune to chilled from that enchant; their resistance "cancels" the dmg that is used by the game to apply status effects to targets).

Hope this makes sense.

yup ure right, but @Minno look this https://1drv.ms/v/s!AgnbTcTXhE9eiipbVl1kIrYH9TXx

That actually is different than what I was describing. I commented in another thread where you post this vid, but I will reply here for consistency.

Jesus beam is a single target ability and deals it's damage over time via a channel. Therefore it will proc both skoria and calurions.

yep i was out of my mind LoL

paulsimonps

Minno wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

it is a direct dot \_(• _ •)_/
ZoS should review this line between
DoT 《Channeling》 Direct
Templars are ^here

@LordSlif

As far as I know these are the different types of damage applications there are in the game.

Direct Damage: Melee
Direct Damage: Ranged
Direct Damage: Projectile
Direct Damage: Area of Effect
Damage over Time: Melee
Damage over Time: Ranged
Damage over Time: Projectile
Damage over Time: Area of Effect

Channels are Ranged Damage over Time. Something like the DoT from Flame Reach for example would have its original direct damage be ranged but its DoT would be "melee" since its applied on the person and stays on them. One big thing to remember is the difference between Direct Damage and Single Target. DoTs can be Single Target and AoE and Direct Damage can be Single Target and AoE. Direct Damage=/=Single Target. Some skills do blur the line, like Jabs for example, its a Melee AoE DoT. You could write that as its own type of damage application but I think its the only one? Not sure, maybe I need to update my list. But yea, maybe this will help a bit.

thats the point direct =/= dot, but there is a limbo in this game and some skils are there. sometimes will works as dot and sometimes as direct.

@LordSlif

Can you give an example of a skill that is both? Other than the obvious ones that have a direct damage bit first and then a DoT like flame reach, those are specifically described as such in their tooltips. Like is there a skill that you know of that will have increased damage from putting points in both Mighty/Elemental Expert and Thaumaturge but is not divided into 2 separate damage attacks?

it is not the point... Cps
look it:
bubble: Envelop enemy in a lightless sphere, causing x Magic Damage each time they use a *direct damage attack*.

if u cast sweeps inside the bubble it will reflect sweeps

puncturing: Launch a relentless assault, striking enemies in front of you four times with your Aedric spear dealing x Magic Damage to the closest enemy and x Magic Damage to all other enemies.

So... is it direct or dot? did u get it?
It is a composition of 4 direct atks, so makes sense it be reflected, we are locked in this skill while we are doing dmg, we cant deal this "dot dmg" plus a direct dmg atk at the same time... it is no "x dmg over y seconds", its x dmg per strike like crushing shock, but not instant.

So... in game Puncturing is a composition of directs atks and its = DoT (cp dot, valkyn... BUT the bubble reflect it)
Btw its a direct dmg 4 me. LOL

So this is the line.

Please tell me if im wrong in someway

you'll have to make sure burning light isnt the proc on that. From some forum investigating I found some posts that said jabs/sweeps turns into a "direct attack" for the application of burning light. IDK if this was tested or not, but burning light is direct damage and would be the culprit in procing total dark not sweeps/jabs dmg itself.

More info; a stam sorc in another thread couldnt understand why his hurricane was procing against total dark. What I found out he was using rending slashes and it has 3 direct dmg components before it becomes the thamaturge scaled dot (initial hit, application hit for snare and first tick of the DOT). It is my understanding, that the game cannot just make attacks appear out of thin air, DOTS almost ALWAYS have their first hit scale off direct damage because the game is hitting your target directly and then applying it's damage over time component. This logic is confirmed with elemental enchants procing their status effect; you get a little mini dmg from the enchant which because of elemental resistance can make your toon immune to that status effect (like nords against frost enchants are immune to chilled from that enchant; their resistance "cancels" the dmg that is used by the game to apply status effects to targets).

Hope this makes sense.

yup ure right, but @Minno look this https://1drv.ms/v/s!AgnbTcTXhE9eiipbVl1kIrYH9TXx

That actually is different than what I was describing. I commented in another thread where you post this vid, but I will reply here for consistency.

Jesus beam is a single target ability and deals it's damage over time via a channel. Therefore it will proc both skoria and calurions.

Yea, that one is pretty obvious

Caluurion’s Legacy "When you deal Critical Damage with a single target Magicka ability"
Valkyn Skoria "When you deal damage with a damage over time effect"

Radiant Oppresion "Burn an enemy with a ray of holy fire, dealing X Magic Damage over 2.8 seconds"

One Target "An Enemy" aka Single Target. Over 2.8 Seconds, or Damage over a period of time aka a DoT. A Single Target DoT.

Minno

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Those b@st@rds!!!!

How DARE they hit my precious Swift jewelry so hard with the nerf bat...


Now I gotta decide if Swift x3 is worth it at 18% movement vs 30% movement...

Grrr...


Well, I do kinda miss the dps I lost from having Arcane x3; it makes a big difference on how hard Devouring Swarm hit...

I might have to revisit that...

Honestly, knowing how you want to build, just roll those into infused with SD/cost reduction. Turn mist form into a cheap defensive spamable lol.

TheDoomsdayMonster

Minno wrote: »

TheDoomsdayMonster wrote: »

Those b@st@rds!!!!

How DARE they hit my precious Swift jewelry so hard with the nerf bat...


Now I gotta decide if Swift x3 is worth it at 18% movement vs 30% movement...

Grrr...


Well, I do kinda miss the dps I lost from having Arcane x3; it makes a big difference on how hard Devouring Swarm hit...

I might have to revisit that...

Honestly, knowing how you want to build, just roll those into infused with SD/cost reduction. Turn mist form into a cheap defensive spamable lol.

That's not a bad idea...

TheDoomsdayMonster

Hmmm...

With the Swift nerf what a Magicka Templar can obtain still isn't bad:


Elusive Mist (30% movement)...
Swift x3 (18% movement)...
Accelerating Drain (10% movement)...
Wild Running (2% movement)...

Thats 60% Movement rate Elusive Mist total (but only 50% in those "oh s***" moments when you don't have time to cast Accelerating Drain)...

This isn't bad, but it does make you slightly slower than a player sprinting with Major Expedition (and significantly slower if you are not buffed with Accelerating Drain)...


Tomorrow I need to test Swift x2 and gauge the difference it makes to my survival/escape capability as 20% vs 18% Movement Bonus should be comparable...

Elong

Well, I was having fun on my magplar.

Thanks ZOS...

Kartalin

Yep, been running two swift and it’s real nice. Ahh well.

Elong

Kartalin wrote: »

Yep, been running two swift and it’s real nice. Ahh well.

Like, I don't think my Kill/Death ratio is any different having put Swift on, I've just had more fun playing this game. I know swift is amazing for some classes, and potentially abused, but for magplar? Come oooooooon.....

They should have just lowered the max speed cap.

Kartalin

I know what you mean, it's just nice not feeling stuck in the mud like playing magplar normally does.

Elong

Kartalin wrote: »

I know what you mean, it's just nice not feeling stuck in the mud like playing magplar normally does.

So I decided to play tonight without swift and try a completely different out take on Magplar.

I went Clever Alc, Burning Spellweave, Skoria/Bloodspawn. 5 Light. Getting my spell dam to 6k and trying to just blow things up.

Not great sustain, even with resto, but very very fun. Always good to mix it up once in a while.

VirtualElizabeth

Elong wrote: »

Kartalin wrote: »

I know what you mean, it's just nice not feeling stuck in the mud like playing magplar normally does.

So I decided to play tonight without swift and try a completely different out take on Magplar.

I went Clever Alc, Burning Spellweave, Skoria/Bloodspawn. 5 Light. Getting my spell dam to 6k and trying to just blow things up.

Not great sustain, even with resto, but very very fun. Always good to mix it up once in a while.

Interesting! How do you think this might work when the new patch drops?

KingExecration

Elong wrote: »

Kartalin wrote: »

I know what you mean, it's just nice not feeling stuck in the mud like playing magplar normally does.

So I decided to play tonight without swift and try a completely different out take on Magplar.

I went Clever Alc, Burning Spellweave, Skoria/Bloodspawn. 5 Light. Getting my spell dam to 6k and trying to just blow things up.

Not great sustain, even with resto, but very very fun. Always good to mix it up once in a while.

I ran similar patches ago but spell power cure on the back bar for controlled procs. I had a ton of fun with it too, people couldn’t handle it at all.

SugaComa

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

it is a direct dot \_(• _ •)_/
ZoS should review this line between
DoT 《Channeling》 Direct
Templars are ^here

@LordSlif

As far as I know these are the different types of damage applications there are in the game.

Direct Damage: Melee
Direct Damage: Ranged
Direct Damage: Projectile
Direct Damage: Area of Effect
Damage over Time: Melee
Damage over Time: Ranged
Damage over Time: Projectile
Damage over Time: Area of Effect

Channels are Ranged Damage over Time. Something like the DoT from Flame Reach for example would have its original direct damage be ranged but its DoT would be "melee" since its applied on the person and stays on them. One big thing to remember is the difference between Direct Damage and Single Target. DoTs can be Single Target and AoE and Direct Damage can be Single Target and AoE. Direct Damage=/=Single Target. Some skills do blur the line, like Jabs for example, its a Melee AoE DoT. You could write that as its own type of damage application but I think its the only one? Not sure, maybe I need to update my list. But yea, maybe this will help a bit.

Direct damage and dots can come from the same skill


Example

Vampires bane

The first hit is high impact, this is direct damage ... The burning effect that follows that's Damage Over Time

Many skills work this way

Elong

VirtualElizabeth wrote: »

Elong wrote: »

Kartalin wrote: »

I know what you mean, it's just nice not feeling stuck in the mud like playing magplar normally does.

So I decided to play tonight without swift and try a completely different out take on Magplar.

I went Clever Alc, Burning Spellweave, Skoria/Bloodspawn. 5 Light. Getting my spell dam to 6k and trying to just blow things up.

Not great sustain, even with resto, but very very fun. Always good to mix it up once in a while.

Interesting! How do you think this might work when the new patch drops?

I'll be using the new Magicka Bone Pirate set for sure next patch, probably with shacklebreaker to start with. I think Shacklebreaker really is a nice set to fall back on, sometimes keeping it simple works best. My favourite build is still Shackle/Lich/Skoria.

Kartalin

I tend to run bone pirate, shacklebreaker and blood spawn on my stam builds as a nice all around setup, I feel like I could run the exact same type setup with magicka next update with that new set and have it be pretty solid.

At least the magicka bone pirate should be easier to farm compared to original bone pirate.

DeadlyRecluse

You'll need a profound reason NOT to run magicka bone pirate next patch, especially in noCP.

Pure healing and pure range damage might not need it--but almost any other playstyle will probably want it. So efficient.

M'bone Pirate+Shacklebreaker+Skoria, with tri-glyphs and the gold drank? That's going to be the new all-around, easy-to-recommend templar setup. Easy to get gear, too, with vCOA2 being the hardest obstacle (and not much of one in 2018/19).

Minno

Kartalin wrote: »

I tend to run bone pirate, shacklebreaker and blood spawn on my stam builds as a nice all around setup, I feel like I could run the exact same type setup with magicka next update with that new set and have it be pretty solid.

At least the magicka bone pirate should be easier to farm compared to original bone pirate.

It will let you run full SD except run tri food drink for Budgetplars yet still get 1700-1800 Regen.

Will be running it as well. Mag bone pirate farming party? I just need body pieces lol.

Joy_Division

Can we use the name of the set please "Bright-Throat," it's only two syllables

Minno

Joy_Division wrote: »

Can we use the name of the set please "Bright-Throat," it's only two syllables

Rhymes with:


(Obviously PG lol)

Syiccal

you could always use dubious with it and get nice all round stats

WreckfulAbandon

Syiccal wrote: »

you could always use dubious with it and get nice all round stats

paulsimonps

SugaComa wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

it is a direct dot \_(• _ •)_/
ZoS should review this line between
DoT 《Channeling》 Direct
Templars are ^here

@LordSlif

As far as I know these are the different types of damage applications there are in the game.

Direct Damage: Melee
Direct Damage: Ranged
Direct Damage: Projectile
Direct Damage: Area of Effect
Damage over Time: Melee
Damage over Time: Ranged
Damage over Time: Projectile
Damage over Time: Area of Effect

Channels are Ranged Damage over Time. Something like the DoT from Flame Reach for example would have its original direct damage be ranged but its DoT would be "melee" since its applied on the person and stays on them. One big thing to remember is the difference between Direct Damage and Single Target. DoTs can be Single Target and AoE and Direct Damage can be Single Target and AoE. Direct Damage=/=Single Target. Some skills do blur the line, like Jabs for example, its a Melee AoE DoT. You could write that as its own type of damage application but I think its the only one? Not sure, maybe I need to update my list. But yea, maybe this will help a bit.

Direct damage and dots can come from the same skill


Example

Vampires bane

The first hit is high impact, this is direct damage ... The burning effect that follows that's Damage Over Time

Many skills work this way

@SugaComa

I know, I gave Flame Reach as an example and explained exactly that, what I asked was if he knew of an ability that did not divide up the damage like that and scaled both as a DoT and a Direct Damage skill.

SugaComa

paulsimonps wrote: »

SugaComa wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

LordSlif wrote: »

it is a direct dot \_(• _ •)_/
ZoS should review this line between
DoT 《Channeling》 Direct
Templars are ^here

@LordSlif

As far as I know these are the different types of damage applications there are in the game.

Direct Damage: Melee
Direct Damage: Ranged
Direct Damage: Projectile
Direct Damage: Area of Effect
Damage over Time: Melee
Damage over Time: Ranged
Damage over Time: Projectile
Damage over Time: Area of Effect

Channels are Ranged Damage over Time. Something like the DoT from Flame Reach for example would have its original direct damage be ranged but its DoT would be "melee" since its applied on the person and stays on them. One big thing to remember is the difference between Direct Damage and Single Target. DoTs can be Single Target and AoE and Direct Damage can be Single Target and AoE. Direct Damage=/=Single Target. Some skills do blur the line, like Jabs for example, its a Melee AoE DoT. You could write that as its own type of damage application but I think its the only one? Not sure, maybe I need to update my list. But yea, maybe this will help a bit.

Direct damage and dots can come from the same skill


Example

Vampires bane

The first hit is high impact, this is direct damage ... The burning effect that follows that's Damage Over Time

Many skills work this way

@SugaComa

I know, I gave Flame Reach as an example and explained exactly that, what I asked was if he knew of an ability that did not divide up the damage like that and scaled both as a DoT and a Direct Damage skill.

Sorry ... But didn't get that from your post I just very confused as I was tired ... So I tried to dumb down what I thought you were trying to get to ...sorry if I misunderstood

As for your query only ones I think don't work that way are dual weild abilities and some stamina nightblade abilities

As although bleed is a dot ... It's not a dot in the same way as burning or magic damage over time

But I could be wrong

Datolite

Minno wrote: »

except run tri food drink

Ah, the lesser known food-drink buff.

CatchMeTrolling

Not entirely magic food but is the gold arteum food meant to be a drink or food because it still doesn’t work with bone pirate when I tried it yesterday.

casparian

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Not entirely magic food but is the gold arteum food meant to be a drink or food because it still doesn’t work with bone pirate when I tried it yesterday.

It's meant to be a food. Confirmed by Gina in a thread a while back.

(Still doesn't work with Green Pact or food passives though.)

CatchMeTrolling

casparian wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

Not entirely magic food but is the gold arteum food meant to be a drink or food because it still doesn’t work with bone pirate when I tried it yesterday.

It's meant to be a food. Confirmed by Gina in a thread a while back.

(Still doesn't work with Green Pact or food passives though.)

Oh then they should change it from saying drink. Plus, it seems bugged all around. Could’ve made some interesting builds if it was a drink.

It just sucks cause it’s still pretty expensive for it not to be working properly. It’s normally priced at 10k or more.

Mrsinister2

I've finally leveled 2 hander for FM just in time for it to be nerfed. Do you guys think 4 seconds of snare immunity is even going to be worth using over a staff or duel wield now for magplar?

Elong

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I've finally leveled 2 hander for FM just in time for it to be nerfed. Do you guys think 4 seconds of snare immunity is even going to be worth using over a staff or duel wield now for magplar?

I think it will be useful still although I have recently turned into a vampire again in preparation for the new patch. Also the other passives for 2h are nice, it's my weapon of choice.