[Class Rep] Templar Feedback Thread
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FoulSnowpaw✭✭✭Passives
Templar passives need to be reworked to solid perks rather than proc or conditional perks.
Aedric Spear
Burning Light is hardly a damage buff to any of the templar abilities since the proc is a 1 in 4 chance followed by a 0.5 second global cooldown. Puncturing Strikes and morphs is literally the only ability that truly benefits from the passive but you may as well make burning light part of Puncturing Strikes ability itself rather than a pseudo passive for the rest of the skill tree.
Burning Light passive should be replaced with a 15% Critical Damage buff with an Aedric Spear Ability Slotted
Piercing Spear should provide a Physical and Spell Penetration bonus of 660/1320 or so, while maintaining the 10% damage done to blocking targets. The 10% Critical Damage buff should be moved to Burning Light.
Balanced Warrior only gives a 6% Weapon Damage buff. There is no consideration for Spell Damage at all... This also does not near come on par with some SC reverse execute flat damage done and flat 5% damage done with physical and shock damage, WD Advanced Species damage done along with bird of pretty minor berserk passive slot, DK 50% status effect damage buff and upcoming 10% damage buff to Ardent Flame abilities.
Balanced Warrior needs to give 8% buff to Weapon AND Spell Damage.
Templars are greatly lacking Major Buffs so here's to adding them some time!
Puncturing Strikes is a relatively weak damage ability as a base.
Puncturing Strikes should heal as a base ability. Morphs should give either Major Prophecy or Major Sorcery.
Sunfire should give Major Sorcery while transferring Major Prophecy to Puncturing Sweep. Templars have no source of major sorcery in class skill line compared to other classes.
Dawn's Wrath
Nova is largely underpowered in terms of damage and range. The ultimate requires strategic placement along with high ultimate cost... followed by a relatively short duration for an okay Major Debuff. Not that great compared to other class's field-changing ultimates that move, last longer, or stuns.
Enduring Rays only affects about 2 abilities in the skill tree. The third affective is largely conditional if morphed to the one it wants; basically dark flare benefits nothing from this passive.
Enduring Rays should increase the duration of select abilities from 2 seconds to 4 seconds to make up for the other abilities that cannot have its duration increased because of damage threshold bursting(but I suppose it's not impossible).
Restoring Spirit needs to be buffed slightly considering templar sustainability is pretty lacking compared to DK, Sorc, and Warden. DK battle roar and recent passive rework gives them free resources without much of a need to use heavy attacks; even their heavy attacks get a buff from molten armaments. Sorc have resource conversion and persistent damage dealing with pets; little opportunity cost on channeling conversion. Warden's netch and low cost of class abilities in itself. Abilities deal high damage while having recovery tick time in between casts.
Templar's Radiant Aura does not count as a genuine sustain ability as it is easily replaced with Elemental Drain which does practically the same thing but better. Magicka Steal is pretty much 100% uptime from healers in pve content. I doubt a slot will be wasted for the minor buff to recovery, since 10% is not game changing at all.
Templar's Rune Focus costs resources and requires staying in one spot unless you want to spend resources to recast, which is illogical because you need resources of which is why it was cast to begin with.
Restoring Spirit should just be buffed from 4% to 8%
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Delparis✭✭✭✭✭FoulSnowpaw wrote: »Passives
Templar passives need to be reworked to solid perks rather than proc or conditional perks.
Aedric Spear
Burning Light is hardly a damage buff to any of the templar abilities since the proc is a 1 in 4 chance followed by a 0.5 second global cooldown. Puncturing Strikes and morphs is literally the only ability that truly benefits from the passive but you may as well make burning light part of Puncturing Strikes ability itself rather than a pseudo passive for the rest of the skill tree.
Burning Light passive should be replaced with a 15% Critical Damage buff with an Aedric Spear Ability Slotted
Piercing Spear should provide a Physical and Spell Penetration bonus of 660/1320 or so, while maintaining the 10% damage done to blocking targets. The 10% Critical Damage buff should be moved to Burning Light.
Balanced Warrior only gives a 6% Weapon Damage buff. There is no consideration for Spell Damage at all... This also does not near come on par with some SC reverse execute flat damage done and flat 5% damage done with physical and shock damage, WD Advanced Species damage done along with bird of pretty minor berserk passive slot, DK 50% status effect damage buff and upcoming 10% damage buff to Ardent Flame abilities.
Balanced Warrior needs to give 8% buff to Weapon AND Spell Damage.
Templars are greatly lacking Major Buffs so here's to adding them some time!
Puncturing Strikes is a relatively weak damage ability as a base.
Puncturing Strikes should heal as a base ability. Morphs should give either Major Prophecy or Major Sorcery.
Sunfire should give Major Sorcery while transferring Major Prophecy to Puncturing Sweep. Templars have no source of major sorcery in class skill line compared to other classes.
Dawn's Wrath
Nova is largely underpowered in terms of damage and range. The ultimate requires strategic placement along with high ultimate cost... followed by a relatively short duration for an okay Major Debuff. Not that great compared to other class's field-changing ultimates that move, last longer, or stuns.
Enduring Rays only affects about 2 abilities in the skill tree. The third affective is largely conditional if morphed to the one it wants; basically dark flare benefits nothing from this passive.
Enduring Rays should increase the duration of select abilities from 2 seconds to 4 seconds to make up for the other abilities that cannot have its duration increased because of damage threshold bursting(but I suppose it's not impossible).
Restoring Spirit needs to be buffed slightly considering templar sustainability is pretty lacking compared to DK, Sorc, and Warden. DK battle roar and recent passive rework gives them free resources without much of a need to use heavy attacks; even their heavy attacks get a buff from molten armaments. Sorc have resource conversion and persistent damage dealing with pets; little opportunity cost on channeling conversion. Warden's netch and low cost of class abilities in itself. Abilities deal high damage while having recovery tick time in between casts.
Templar's Radiant Aura does not count as a genuine sustain ability as it is easily replaced with Elemental Drain which does practically the same thing but better. Magicka Steal is pretty much 100% uptime from healers in pve content. I doubt a slot will be wasted for the minor buff to recovery, since 10% is not game changing at all.
Templar's Rune Focus costs resources and requires staying in one spot unless you want to spend resources to recast, which is illogical because you need resources of which is why it was cast to begin with.
Restoring Spirit should just be buffed from 4% to 8%
You are wrong about burning light only proccing from puncturing strikes as they proc also from shards (major skill that proc them).
I agree that that .5 sec cooldown is a bad idea. Also burning light only proc on 1 target per .5 sec so don't help much with packs or mobs.0 -
Baconlad✭✭✭✭✭
✭I only really care for nova to be changed.
-Make it 200 ult base
-When you cast it, make it hit the ground and pull and snare
- give the synergy the direct damage big bang and major debuff
- one stamina morph, one mag morph, identical capability
For balance sake give it the telegraph and long travel time of that psijic AOE stun, so enemies have a chance to get out of dodge. Also it needs to keep its range. It's a pretty cool ultimate in reality. Would love to see it fall more in line with being a good outnumbered ability. Would use crescent sweep for 1v1 burst, would use nova on backbar for outnumbered chokepoints. I think it would be awesome solo outnumbered. Akin to magsorc atronach solo
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turlisley✭✭✭✭Darkmage1337 wrote: »
I couldn't have said it better myself.
So, it has been over a year since these feedback changes were first posted.
@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_MattFiror @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_RobGarrett @ZOS_Gilliam
When will we start to see some positive changes for Templar?
The Balanced Warrior passive is very unbalanced and the Master Ritualist passive belongs in the Alliance War Support tree, where it is relevant and useful.
The class passives for Templar are useless and make no sense in respect to Templar's class abilities.
These are extremely simple and justifiable changes that can be done in minutes.ESO Platform/Region: PC/NA. ESO ID: @Turlisley3 -
agree, but here is big problem bc its look all ZOS team rly rly hate templars players, and they are dooing everything to get them from game
Adraria Argentum Draco - imperial Stamplar
Bevdyen Tus Ntxhuav - Orc Stamplar
Celestun Ira Dei- Imperial Tankplar
Halldis Rautt Höfuð- Nord Tankplar
Misawa Yoshike - Breton Healplar
Lae'ozhael - Dunmer Magplar0 -
Animal_Mother✭✭✭✭
That guaranteed off balance tho. Some crappy weapon gap closer doesn’t compare.
Edit: the DW gap closer is garbage since especially this patch stamina will need the rally heal so its redundant and a pos. It doesn't even gap close on the initial activation I don't think. I think people just hate stamina templars really. Every time I suggest a buff for them people *** their pants lol. Stamina Templars must be the least played class in PvP overall. Theres a reason for that. All the respect to my Magplar comrades but you guys are kinda hording the class skills. Any other classes aside from maybe sorcs have to share a bit more.
Even this thread which is supposed to be the Templar Class thread is clearly 98% the Magicka Templar thread.
Remember that for years our class closer was absolute garbage and no one in their right mind would have chose it over the S&B or 2Handed ones. It took a very long time, but ZOS finally got ours working.
I tried to to play Stam, I really did. For the first year of the game I was a hybrid Temp, then Stamplar, and finally, Magplar.
Magplar was by far the easiest, even as a Bosmer main. I would try to go back to Stam, but the OMG heal just wasn’t there.
I think the problem with playing the original classes as Stam, is that they just weren’t designed that way; stamina was an after-thought. Necro and Warden play great as Stamina, partially because they were designed from the beginning to allow Stam play.
I would love to see Stamplar get an “Oh, crap heal” and a stamina-based ward (to proc Sacred Ground). Or if we have to use Magicka for a ward, have Sacred Ground deal damage based on highest weapon type.0 -
kalunte✭✭✭✭✭hi there, just here to say a loud GOOD JOB to your class rep who managed this class to bypass half the aspects of "standardization" with piercing javelin keeping its 28m, radial sweep undelayed, RoR doing dmg+heal+cleanse+synergy at the same lvl of skills that only have 1 of the for effects and Eclipse being unbreakable.
massive job here, congratz.0 -
No_Division✭✭✭hi there, just here to say a loud GOOD JOB to your class rep who managed this class to bypass half the aspects of "standardization" with piercing javelin keeping its 28m, radial sweep undelayed, RoR doing dmg+heal+cleanse+synergy at the same lvl of skills that only have 1 of the for effects and Eclipse being unbreakable.
massive job here, congratz.
- class abilities > weapon skills. If that means jav keeps its range while bow/destro lose some range, then so be it. Also you forgot it costs 3.3k mag per cast and only deals instant magic/physical dmg so theres no chance for a status effect proc or special heal/dot lol. Unless you are also asking for bow/destro to get 3300 cost/no dot/no effect? Up to you.
- radial sweep requires targets to be in front in order to get 60% dmg buff. Otherwise its just a 10k tooltip spell and melee range. And once again, class ability should be functionally better than outside sources, if that means dawnbreaker gets a cast time, then so be it. Not to mention, DBoS stuns+buffs your weapon dmg number, sweep does not.
- RoR is also a class ability. Once again it should outperform its counterparts if you want players to pick classes over weapons. It's also 4k mag (my cost before was 3800 so it got a huge cost increase not to mention only removes 2 effects lol)
- eclipse might be persistent but its not without its counters, and it too got a cost increase (3600 for me instead of 3400). UC only impacts 1 target, and it resets to stage 1 when you keep spaming it. If you buff up at the end, it resets to a 30% snare which you'll have immunity skills anyway and the cc immunity pot removes ALL PROCS FROM HAPPENING.0 -
Anti_Virus✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Explosive charge should be stamina imo, so much cooler looking than dw and 2h gap closer.
That guaranteed off balance tho. Some crappy weapon gap closer doesn’t compare.
Edit: the DW gap closer is garbage since especially this patch stamina will need the rally heal so its redundant and a pos. It doesn't even gap close on the initial activation I don't think. I think people just hate stamina templars really. Every time I suggest a buff for them people *** their pants lol. Stamina Templars must be the least played class in PvP overall. Theres a reason for that. All the respect to my Magplar comrades but you guys are kinda hording the class skills. Any other classes aside from maybe sorcs have to share a bit more.
Even this thread which is supposed to be the Templar Class thread is clearly 98% the Magicka Templar thread.
Plus you are physically running at someone.Power Wealth And Influence.2 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭
What?!
Clarification: if I am run on top of a target, and cast Toppling, my character does like this backward loop and then charges. It's functional but looks awful.0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Living Dark is the strongest defensive skill in the game.
Change my mind.
Which morph is that again?
Either way, I think they are pretty potent except for the DOT meta is going to have people using them and more people running some sort of a cleanse.
The self applied 1, you just apply DOts and/ or cleanse your own and let them waste their over 4k magicka. I tried this and it's good still if you are getting zerged and they are not somehow all just spamming DOTs and proxy.
The target 1 got applied to me. I got the initial hit from them timing it in my attack similar to the old eclipse strategy, but it was barely noticed and 8 cleansed right away because DOTs everywhere.0 -
mRbLSoul Shriven1. Luminous Shards
Stun instead additional magicka/stamina
2. Honor The Dead
Burst self heals based on missing HP - similar to Green Dragon Blood from DK.
Extra CC and self burst heals for more efficient tanking.0 -
kalunte✭✭✭✭✭@No_Division
based on your statments, you may be able to help me with:
-incap vs DBoS/Onslaught
-mass hysteria vs turn evil
-executioner that scales up to 400% and is cheaper and assassins blade
also, scatter shot base cost is about 3270.
i love the "class abilities should be better" arguing, it's just sad that it does not applies to all classes.
this is not a nb class rep thingy and i dont know other classes enough to compare all the skills that are underperforming compared to generic skills, i was only pointing at inconsistencies about templars that makes it so popular with u23.
ps: you should drop your "class skills should be better argument" when other classes are about to be nerfed someday..0 -
No_Division✭✭✭@No_Division
based on your statments, you may be able to help me with:
-incap vs DBoS/Onslaught
-mass hysteria vs turn evil
-executioner that scales up to 400% and is cheaper and assassins blade
also, scatter shot base cost is about 3270.
i love the "class abilities should be better" arguing, it's just sad that it does not applies to all classes.
this is not a nb class rep thingy and i dont know other classes enough to compare all the skills that are underperforming compared to generic skills, i was only pointing at inconsistencies about templars that makes it so popular with u23.
ps: you should drop your "class skills should be better argument" when other classes are about to be nerfed someday..
- I agree, incap should defile, be instant cast and lose the silence.
- I agree, turn evil should be 6-7k cost + have a 1-2s delay to match psijic stun.
- executioner/assassins blade is a weird discussion; for blade, its disease dmg so 10% chance to cause major defile, can heal you if you get a kill, chance to get 1800 mag+stam on the kill and you get 400 CHC\10% CHD when slotted. Versus executioner, where you can buff it by 10% if you heavy attack first, procs enchants/poisons, but otherwise its just physical dmg so it doesnt proc things, and it also gives 30% stam recovery on kills. Id say, assassins blade already has more flavor and thus gives NB a class ability is better argument.
But why post this in a templar thread? why not make a thread that highlights this instead of being combative/hinting at nerfs? Templar has its issues regarding consistency, but its also something that got adjusted too that makes their kit work again (look at Cinbri's post about all of his pain points being solved, most of which are related to "inconsistencies" when you compared our abilities to other ones that worked.)0 -
No_Division✭✭✭Living Dark is the strongest defensive skill in the game.
Change my mind.
- attacks from ganks ignore the heal
- channels and DOTS ignore the procs.
- subject to defiles
- costs 3600 as imperial in light armor and can be avoided by rebuffing.
- and in the case of UC, immovable pots cause both dmg/cc effects to not go off.
But no idea if they changed some of this to live (i wasn't paying close enough attention without addons)0 -
Solariken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No_Division wrote: »
- attacks from ganks ignore the heal
- channels and DOTS ignore the procs.
- subject to defiles
- costs 3600 as imperial in light armor and can be avoided by rebuffing.
- and in the case of UC, immovable pots cause both dmg/cc effects to not go off.
But no idea if they changed some of this to live (i wasn't paying close enough attention without addons)
All of those things pale to the benefits. The heal is good but the control it gives over a fight is what makes it shine. I'm dusting off my speedy guerilla magplar build to see if I can still sustain without master destro.
The new Unstable Core is garbage though I don't see it getting much use which is sad
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No_Division✭✭✭
All of those things pale to the benefits. The heal is good but the control it gives over a fight is what makes it shine. I'm dusting off my speedy guerilla magplar build to see if I can still sustain without master destro.
The new Unstable Core is garbage though I don't see it getting much use which is sad
UC is bad, i tested it and decided if I wanted a stun or dmg, I am going to slot either of those that cost less than 3k lol.0 -
GallantGuardian✭✭✭✭Ok so as a tank everyone keeps telling me for Templar I’m going to want the ground effect from
Fighters guild can’t remember the name ... cause it fears ... I don’t want to fear enemies as that makes them run around i want to lock them in place
So how does the morph living dark morph seem? Does it feel worth it or not ?0 -
crazywolfpusher✭✭✭GallantGuardian wrote: »Ok so as a tank everyone keeps telling me for Templar I’m going to want the ground effect from
Fighters guild can’t remember the name ... cause it fears ... I don’t want to fear enemies as that makes them run around i want to lock them in place
So how does the morph living dark morph seem? Does it feel worth it or not ?
Fear no longer make the enemies flee, insteand they are now unable to attack or move in their position. Fairly good option for non dk tanks.0 -
No_Division✭✭✭GallantGuardian wrote: »Ok so as a tank everyone keeps telling me for Templar I’m going to want the ground effect from
Fighters guild can’t remember the name ... cause it fears ... I don’t want to fear enemies as that makes them run around i want to lock them in place
So how does the morph living dark morph seem? Does it feel worth it or not ?
I think fear was changed so your targets stay in place. Test it and see.1 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭UppGRAYxDD wrote: »
Blinding Light can work like fear but disorient instead, so the player lose control of the toon which will start walking in random patern for 3 sec2 -
GallantGuardian✭✭✭✭crazywolfpusher wrote: »
Fear no longer make the enemies flee, insteand they are now unable to attack or move in their position. Fairly good option for non dk tanks.No_Division wrote: »
I think fear was changed so your targets stay in place. Test it and see.
Oh wow this is definitely going on my load out then thank you guys so much for the info
Blinding Light can work like fear but disorient instead, so the player lose control of the toon which will start walking in random patern for 3 sec
I agree with you plus I’ll actually get to use all my Templar passives I’d its in the old tree it was inEdited by GallantGuardian on August 16, 2019 3:40AM1 -
No_Division✭✭✭GallantGuardian wrote: »
Oh wow this is definitely going on my load out then thank you guys so much for the info
I agree with you plus I’ll actually get to use all my Templar passives I’d its in the old tree it was in
you welcome! let us know if that helped your templar tank!0 -
Delparis✭✭✭✭✭can't living dark just works like Defensive Rune but with 6 sec duration and no cap to targets
https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/defensive-rune
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RebornRequiem✭✭✭can't living dark just works like Defensive Rune but with 6 sec duration and no cap to targets
https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/defensive-rune
No thank you. I think the healing is a good idea, it just needs to be the right healing number.0 -
UppGRAYxDD✭✭✭✭✭
✭Living dark should get a minor Hot like 2k (before battle spirit )for 3 secs and attach blinding light for 1 sec every time living dark activates on an enemy.
#BringBackBlindindLightEdited by UppGRAYxDD on August 20, 2019 1:51PM"Stendarr's mercy be upon you, for the vigil has none to spare."2