"It will always be items worse than what you can craft" №2

ClockworkCityBugs

back in a days we raise a huge cry when they added Grand Crown exp scrolls in game
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/292748/it-will-always-be-items-worse-than-what-you-can-craft-topic/p1

as a result of 15 page thread, less than in a month ZOS added Aetherial Ambrosia with recipes

right now similar situation took place, but i think people just forgot, become lazy and too forgiving?

@ZOS_GinaBruno i must to ask you now, and it will be a huge voice from all community

WHERE is ingame version of this scrolls? I hope you not forgot to add them to Rollis Hlaalu?
Any plans to add them to the game later?



P.S. according to this topic you can become an instant master crafter for only ~2000 usd
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/399756/pay-to-win-the-math-on-research-scrolls

xaraan

I didn't go in game to the guy and check, but I thought the writ voucher dude sold something like this?

ClockworkCityBugs

xaraan wrote: »

I didn't go in game to the guy and check, but I thought the writ voucher dude sold something like this?

only 1 day scrolls Rollis Hlaalu have
not 7 or 15 like in Rip-Off Store

xaraan

ah ok, yeah, they should add those to that vendor as well then, or something very close to it

WakeYourGhost

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

Rip-Off Store

...I'm debating withdrawing my support...

Furcula

Just playing the devil's advocate, the whole argument over the exp pot was it was a craftable consumable, which arguably limits that argument to only be consisted of food, drinks, potions and poisons. Consumables that are all craftable.

The current reduce research timers are not craftable, but bought from an in game NPC, which is different from crafting them. So technically, they didn't do anything wrong.

ClockworkCityBugs

Furcula wrote: »

Just playing the devil's advocate, the whole argument over the exp pot was it was a craftable consumable, which arguably limits that argument to only be consisted of food, drinks, potions and poisons. Consumables that are all craftable.

The current reduce research timers are not craftable, but bought from an in game NPC, which is different from crafting them. So technically, they didn't do anything wrong.

and your own opinion is? do not add them in game?

Slick_007

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

and your own opinion is? do not add them in game?

let the rage flow through you. yes, yes.

a valid counter point is provided and you feel the need to reply with drivel?

Sergykid

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

ClockworkCityBugs

Sergykid wrote: »

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

and this is the pay to win point of view

Ronzar

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

and this is the pay to win point of view

I think he is saying the crown store only really adds cosmetic stuff to the game and cuts time on some things. I don't see how that is pay to win at all. If that was the only way to do something then sure, it would be pay to win. This way they have to spend a bunch of real $ to decrease research time. No other benefits.

TarrNokk

I don't see any need in those scrolls as research is an aspect of the game we PLAY.
If you people don't like to PLAY the game in all aspects then you can't participate in all aspects.
I think it's bad enough that people can buy such things in crown store for real$.
P2W kills the game.

Feanor

Getting to a reasonable amount of traits researched quickly isn’t exactly hard without the scrolls. Just takes some planning.

Jhalin

I cant think of any case in which having a fully traited crafter directly benefits me in my gameplay.

Gear? Not really hard pressed to research the three or four top traits for transmuting, which takes hardly a few weeks anyway. And everyone and their mother has a crafter that can make the most popular crafted sets in exchange for the mats.

Master writs? It's already a better deal to sell any you don't already have the style or traits required for (and sometimes even then given the gold cost to craft the highest value ones)

How exactly does this equate to winning when crafting has no real prestige anymore?

jedtb16_ESO

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

and this is the pay to win point of view

no it isn't.....

what do you win?

there is no title.

Sigma957

Who effin cares about research scrolls, I did master crafting the hard way on 2 toons and took up so much time. It's not like the research scrolls will allow you to craft maelstrom/masters weapons etc.

clocksstoppe

The ingame version of this is you pay a crafter to make you your gear.

WakeYourGhost

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

and this is the pay to win point of view

no it isn't.....

what do you win?

there is no title.

You win being a 9-trait crafter faster?

anitajoneb17_ESO

- Craftable in this context equals to "obtainable ingame". Those scrolls are, technically, obtainable ingame (by buying 15 of them you get your 15 days less on your research).
- You can still finish your researches without using any scrolls. It's not P2W, just a time saver.
- Not sure why anyone wants to research quickly that badly. The game is full of 9-trait-characters now who can craft anything for you (just ask nicely and provide mats).

DieAlteHexe

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

and this is the pay to win point of view

It's just a crafting passive on steroids. There's really no "win" involved.

WakeYourGhost

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

- Craftable in this context equals to "obtainable ingame". Those scrolls are, technically, obtainable ingame (by buying 15 of them you get your 15 days less on your research).
- You can still finish your researches without using any scrolls. It's not P2W, just a time saver.
- Not sure why anyone wants to research quickly that badly. The game is full of 9-trait-characters now who can craft anything for you (just ask nicely and provide mats).

But 15 scrolls takes 30 days to use ;.;

Other time-based systems in other games tend to have a premium-currency option to skip long waits. This actually isn't out of place.

anitajoneb17_ESO

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

But 15 scrolls takes 30 days to use ;.;

Sorry I forgot about that.

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

Other time-based systems in other games tend to have a premium-currency option to skip long waits. This actually isn't out of place.

Not sure what you mean by that. ESO+ members already research 10% quicker (from the top of my head). And there are passives in the crafting trees for that purpose too. Is it what you mean ?

Narvuntien

Don't want them... don't buy them.

In game stores are excellent ways to solve the gamers paradox.

Gamers paradox: When you are young (or unemployed) you have lots of time to play games but no money to buy games... then you get a job and you have plenty of money but no time to play games.

So players with money and no time can subsidises players with lots of time and no money and everyone benefits from having people to play with.

Game time saving products in store are an excellent way to use an in game store... for example having the merchant and banker.

There is a danger of course, pay to win occurs when game time becomes devalued, such that buying things is simply better than bothering to play the game. At which point no one plays (only buys) and the games population collapses.

We have not reached that stage we are fine.

Coatmagic

Heh, yeah sure, ZoS will add these to Rolis for 10k vouchers XD

like they did with the xp pots: here you can craft em, good luck finding the mats!

[Snip].

[Edited to remove bashing/profanity-masking]

WakeYourGhost

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

But 15 scrolls takes 30 days to use ;.;

Sorry I forgot about that.

WakeYourGhost wrote: »

Other time-based systems in other games tend to have a premium-currency option to skip long waits. This actually isn't out of place.

Not sure what you mean by that. ESO+ members already research 10% quicker (from the top of my head). And there are passives in the crafting trees for that purpose too. Is it what you mean ?

I'm meaning that a 15 day scroll in the Crown Store for Premium Currency isn't really that bad a thing - And other games have similar features to skip long waits.

ClockworkCityBugs

i dont care if they will cost 5k vouchers
everyone will be happy with ingame version

redspecter23

For $50 a pop, I hope some guy buys 100 of them. ZOS needs to fill the money pool so they can swim in it up to their shoulders. No sane person will actually buy these things so they essentially don't exist for most people.

Merlin13KAGL

If you're able to obtain master writs, odds are you wouldn't need these anyway.

Ticked because you can't resell them for absurd amounts?

VaranisArano

Its less Pay-To-Win and more Pay-For-Convenience.

I don't actually win anything by having maxed-out research because I could always pay some other crafter to make the very same gear that I can now make myself. Its just more convenient.

That being said, I can get the same result of maxed out research for free by exercising some patience.

Merlin13KAGL

VaranisArano wrote: »

Its less Pay-To-Win and more Pay-For-Convenience.

I don't actually win anything by having maxed-out research because I could always pay some other crafter to make the very same gear that I can now make myself. Its just more convenient.

That being said, I can get the same result of maxed out research for free by exercising some patience.

Wouldn't it be "Have patience, you must?"
*Checks star wars forum for verification*

Anotherone773

ClockworkCityBugs wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

objectively saying, isn't Crown Store supposed to make one skip time or look better? i don't see the problem

and this is the pay to win point of view

No... no its not. You obviously dont understand what pay to win means and thus want to use it to apply to anything you dont like. Pay 2 win is:

* when you can buy potions, armor, weapons, etc that are better than what is available in game for premium currency
* something that gives you an advantage over non wallet warriors in end game content.
* access to vital content such as a skill line, that is required for end game content. This would be like having to pay for undaunted skill line.

15 day research scrolls give no advantage in endgame content over someone who can only use 1 day. Research is not a must have for endgame content, nor does having it give you an advantage over another player that you could not otherwise acquire.