Shor PC/NA "Official" Discussion

Miriel

Rickter wrote: »

Ive made that exact argument of "exercising personal responsibility to ensure a healthy campaign" and have been told many times you cant tell people how they should play.

but i digress.

Its true, people will do what people do, still dosent change the fact that as it is, we do have lost and is loosing players... And we that care is the only ones that can try act in some kind of agreement... Then there will allways be those that will insist to shoot them self in the foot with a bow and arrow

Phreeki

Miriel wrote: »

Hey Guys, i dont often say anything on the forums, but considering the shape pvp is in i thought id give it a go... so here goes !

Most of you know me as Willow, i play one faction only, and use no addons etc, just a plain basic ESO, mostly couse i beleave that if you are going to pvp, we need to play the same game, with same basic stuffs... Addons and quick slotted buttons is just "handicap"

As you all know, we are down to three servers, and we can barely keep one of them full, we lost alot of players, and as it is Vivec and Sotha, is cp or no cp, wich leaves shor as the only server that can be left for pug and new players to learn the "skill" at, some of you would argue that what we have the low level server for, but we actually have people that want to give pvp a try at max level, or very late in their eso experience...

For us that been around know that picking up the "skills" and git good, takes time, and new players wich we very much need, are not going to do that as pugs and getting destroyed in Vivec by zerg balls... wich again points things back to Shor, and i doubt any of us that been here since alfa, need anything or need to win... i think most of us can agree that we need more players, and allow players a place where they can learn...

We can point fingers, but all sides have done some noughty stuff, so what are YOU going to do about it ?... Lets keep off the tri keeps, stop with the gate camping, and most off all, dont take a organiced raid a roll the map, you guys know who you are, you belong in Vivec, leave Shor to the pugs, and the smale scale, and most of all give them a chanse to learn... Invite them if you can, give them a helpfull comment... Making people feel part of something and giveing them a hand, is far more likely to make people stay then tea bagging people after you rolled over them...

Best wishes to you all from a mostly anoying Willow de Gwenyth

This person once told me to "take my zerg to Vivec" .......there were 5 of us..........I am not sure you know what a "zerg" is

Adenoma

I think any argument has been more tactical than strategic regarding style of play.

Miriel

Phreeki wrote: »

Miriel wrote: »

Hey Guys, i dont often say anything on the forums, but considering the shape pvp is in i thought id give it a go... so here goes !

Most of you know me as Willow, i play one faction only, and use no addons etc, just a plain basic ESO, mostly couse i beleave that if you are going to pvp, we need to play the same game, with same basic stuffs... Addons and quick slotted buttons is just "handicap"

As you all know, we are down to three servers, and we can barely keep one of them full, we lost alot of players, and as it is Vivec and Sotha, is cp or no cp, wich leaves shor as the only server that can be left for pug and new players to learn the "skill" at, some of you would argue that what we have the low level server for, but we actually have people that want to give pvp a try at max level, or very late in their eso experience...

For us that been around know that picking up the "skills" and git good, takes time, and new players wich we very much need, are not going to do that as pugs and getting destroyed in Vivec by zerg balls... wich again points things back to Shor, and i doubt any of us that been here since alfa, need anything or need to win... i think most of us can agree that we need more players, and allow players a place where they can learn...

We can point fingers, but all sides have done some noughty stuff, so what are YOU going to do about it ?... Lets keep off the tri keeps, stop with the gate camping, and most off all, dont take a organiced raid a roll the map, you guys know who you are, you belong in Vivec, leave Shor to the pugs, and the smale scale, and most of all give them a chanse to learn... Invite them if you can, give them a helpfull comment... Making people feel part of something and giveing them a hand, is far more likely to make people stay then tea bagging people after you rolled over them...

Best wishes to you all from a mostly anoying Willow de Gwenyth

This person once told me to "take my zerg to Vivec" .......there were 5 of us..........I am not sure you know what a "zerg" is

Not sure in what situation i yelled at you, i can get kinda emo, seeing things in regards to new players, and i do see alot of stuff, considering how sneaky i am, i watch alot of the time when i dont help... So if id make a educated guess, you were in one of those small groups off skilled players, you played in shor with the intent to get some easy AP, and that is definatly something you can do, and nothing wrong with, but in doing so perhaps not tea bag, or wipe new players over and over, you could try give them a hand or two you know... Im not saying you did this, but when i do yell at people its very likely someone did something noughty in the first place...

My point is, do play in shor, but i have a feeling you figure out who is and isnt a geat player fairly fast, why not hold back alittle, and alow the new players to atleast try and learn ?!? thanks

technohic

My first hate whispers happened this weekend for me zerging. Had just been up on top of the mile gate between Nickel and Roe, fighting a group that was up there. This was on Vivec and I jump around from where there was action and get into it zerg surfing, or I let the enemy go by and try to pick people off in the back and there was 2 opposing zergs going back and forth in this area. Actually didnt get into the fight at the top when I got there as it was over by the time I got up but to me, I am looking at it as the fight is on the gate and I go down the scaffolding to see one enemy guy still taking 3 blues. I cloaked and incapped as soon as I got down, and the guys shields must have just been ready to go down or just went down as he dropped from full to execute range right then and there., and was dead before he could get up.

I thought nothing of it and went on to the fight which was now at Roe and then the whispers started. I get it in a way, as I have been the one guy getting ran over, but the placement there to not expect that was unfortunate.

Still, I overall was pretty happy with myself to be honest. There was 4 total of us on the guy and I made a good enough impression to have been noticed. I know I don't notice many players other than when they really mess me up.

Point being is, you never will get everyone on board because you never will please everyone. Some simple things like not camping tri-keeps when there are no scrolls should be easy enough but peoples expectations for a fair fight get to be a little far fetched. I mean if you are "small manning" and go to resources at tri keeps and risk cutting off travel to the big fights, you better expect a zerg. If you get between large groups are going back and forth, no one is going to wait for you to 1v1 people 1 at a time. At the same time; if you run all over the map with a raid on an underpopulated server, don't complain when there is no action any more. People are responsible for their own experience even if they do not understand the repercussions of their actions.

King_Thelon

technohic wrote: »

People are responsible for their own experience even if they do not understand the repercussions of their actions.

Not the least bit ironic coming from a self-admitted, Xv1 nightblade.

BaylorCorvette

I run with a large group on Mondays and we start out in Shor but the last couple of weeks we've been switching to Vivec around 9-9:30 pm cst due to lack of DC or EP population during those times in Shor. LoM used to be more consistent in Shor and put up fantastic fights that were really fun between the two groups, but I think Vivec is their home campaign and only come here when there are wait times for Vivec. These last couple of weeks that we've gone into Vivec have been an absolute nightmare. I don't know what has happened to the server, but back in 2017 when Vivec was my home campaign, it wasn't nearly as bad as it is now. Sometimes I cannot even bar swap, and then of course HUGE lag time between when you use an ability and when it actually goes off. When I first loaded into Vivec last night, I ported from our gate to Brindle and sat at a three minute load screen and then short period later ported from Brindle to Nik and sat at a 2-3 minute load screen.

What ZoS really needs to do is bring the server pop on Vivec down a little bit and help equal out campaigns. I agree that Shor is usually only really competitive in small to medium (6-10 people) groups, and anything much larger than that may run the map. It's unfortunate but when the other CP campaign option is Vivec, it makes it extremely difficult to want to play there. I've resorted to playing a lot more of BGs lately, which are fun but I really prefer the open world aspect of Cyrodiil. I poked my head in Sotha the other day and the AD population over there seems even more dominant than Shor, so here I am.

technohic

King_Thelon wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

People are responsible for their own experience even if they do not understand the repercussions of their actions.

Not the least bit ironic coming from a self-admitted, Xv1 nightblade.

I fight where theres a fight. Get plenty of my share of being Xv1ed down. NB, Templar, or Sorc.

Valen_Byte

where is my eye roll emote....

You so called small man groups never miss an opportunity to xv1. I dont blame you. But, I dont know why you ever gripe about it happening to you. I have never fought a small group that just let me kill them one by one. They may start as a 1v1 then if you start to win the others will hop in and take you out. Rightly so. But dont act like you small man groups wont totally destroy the solo player if given the chance. Thats just silly.

Miriel

Valen_Byte wrote: »

where is my eye roll emote....

You so called small man groups never miss an opportunity to xv1. I dont blame you. But, I dont know why you ever gripe about it happening to you. I have never fought a small group that just let me kill them one by one. They may start as a 1v1 then if you start to win the others will hop in and take you out. Rightly so. But dont act like you small man groups wont totally destroy the solo player if given the chance. Thats just silly.

Under normal circumstances i wouldent care, but we are bleeding players, and you know that new players need to git good somewhere, they dont get skill be being zerg rolled, or teabagged and destroyed, or seeing a full raid flip the map, that makes them leave...

New players dont have the options as we had... As i am being a anoying sneak, i have stayed my attakcs alot of late, giving people a chanse to fight it out, espechially if their "newer" sure i meddle if i see older players pick on new...

Is the ap so much wourth to you as a old player that you need to farm newbies ?, do you need the campaig awards so much ?... i mean if you really want a fight why not pick on the more experienced ?

And of course we are all free to play as we like, but at what expense ?

Valen_Byte

As far as new players are concerned I couldn't agree more. But I also dont think that shor or vivec is where they should be learning how to pvp.

I ran a guild for new players in Blackwater Blade (now Kyne) for 2 years and that was the purpose of our guild, to teach them the skills they need to be successful in the vet camps. New players should be encouraged to go back, roll a new toon if they only have one and start there. They will get no leeway in the vet camps.

I was just talking about the non-new, small groups that roam around looking for "good fights" They xv1 me every time I see them. Thats fine, I chose to engage them in the first place so I dont expect them to not focus me lol. As for AP, I dont really care about it. I have so much I wouldn't know what to do with it. Just like every other old player. I just like to play, I dont care how many kills I get or how many times I die. Admittedly, it does bother me when I get xv1'd and then bagged lol but thats just part of vet camps. Comes with the territory.

Edit to say:
@technohic I dont see anything wrong with what you did at the ash gate. Dude was tanking 3 players, it was obvious to you that it would require a little more to end it and thats what you did. A zerg, is taking more players than necessary to complete an objective. The objective of taking that guy out obviously required 4 instead of three so therefore he was not zerged. He should be proud of himself instead of being salty to the guy that tipped the scales. Just my thought on that.

Valen_Byte

..oops

Miriel

Valen_Byte wrote: »

As far as new players are concerned I couldn't agree more. But I also dont think that shor or vivec is where they should be learning how to pvp.

I ran a guild for new players in Blackwater Blade (now Kyne) for 2 years and that was the purpose of our guild, to teach them the skills they need to be successful in the vet camps. New players should be encouraged to go back, roll a new toon if they only have one and start there. They will get no leeway in the vet camps.

I was just talking about the non-new, small groups that roam around looking for "good fights" They xv1 me every time I see them. Thats fine, I chose to engage them in the first place so I dont expect them to not focus me lol. As for AP, I dont really care about it. I have so much I wouldn't know what to do with it. Just like every other old player. I just like to play, I dont care how many kills I get or how many times I die. Admittedly, it does bother me when I get xv1'd and then bagged lol but thats just part of vet camps. Comes with the territory.

Edit to say:
@technohic I dont see anything wrong with what you did at the ash gate. Dude was tanking 3 players, it was obvious to you that it would require a little more to end it and thats what you did. A zerg, is taking more players than necessary to complete an objective. The objective of taking that guy out obviously required 4 instead of three so therefore he was not zerged. He should be proud of himself instead of being salty to the guy that tipped the scales. Just my thought on that.

Fair enough, and yes BvB/Kyne is there for those that want to start over, but considering how much players we lost, and we still cant fill up vivec or sotha... wich points things back to shor, some want to start to learn pvp late and not reroll, if we can help them in Shor, then i atleast think, thats what we should do...

And to be honest Shor when there is smale scale, can be amacing, skills work, and very little lag, you cant really ask for better circumstances for people to learn... All i think is just that some off us hold back alittle... if not, lets agree to disagree :hug:

Valen_Byte

I dont disagree. But I have little to no faith in the vet pvp community to care about anything but AP lol.

As far as server performance, Bwb/KY has always had the BEST performance even when all three factions get pop locked ther is no lag at all. Its a much more forgiving environment for new players to learn, with the groups, the lack of lag and the overall battle scaling of the characters. That doesnt mean that new players should not receive help in shor or vivec, just that they will have a much harder time finding it. Vet players are a bit stuck up, esp. the small scale leet players and guilds that wont even communicate in zone chat to the lowly plebs : ( Tis a sad thing.

Best thing you could do, if you want to help the new players, is start a group or guild aimed at new players wanting to learn. Advertise your group or guild in zone chat as such. Thats what I did when I started mine, and it turned ad from the worst faction (at the time) to the best (for a time). You may find that your compassion for the newbs will bring you more enjoyment than anything else. Just my thoughts, but Im just a fat lizurd, what do I know. : ))

Miriel

Valen_Byte wrote: »

I dont disagree. But I have little to no faith in the vet pvp community to care about anything but AP lol.

As far as server performance, Bwb/KY has always had the BEST performance even when all three factions get pop locked ther is no lag at all. Its a much more forgiving environment for new players to learn, with the groups, the lack of lag and the overall battle scaling of the characters. That doesnt mean that new players should not receive help in shor or vivec, just that they will have a much harder time finding it. Vet players are a bit stuck up, esp. the small scale leet players and guilds that wont even communicate in zone chat to the lowly plebs : ( Tis a sad thing.

Best thing you could do, if you want to help the new players, is start a group or guild aimed at new players wanting to learn. Advertise your group or guild in zone chat as such. Thats what I did when I started mine, and it turned ad from the worst faction (at the time) to the best (for a time). You may find that your compassion for the newbs will bring you more enjoyment than anything else. Just my thoughts, but Im just a fat lizurd, what do I know. : ))

I do try to help in zone chat... on occasion i run groups, there is others that pick people up... and i agree with you, we cant but act by example, or ask that people try lead by example as well... If you, and i, an serveral others try, thats a start

Rickter

Valen_Byte wrote: »

A zerg, is taking more players than necessary to complete an objective.

Did. . . did you just use my definition for zerging?

Kartalin

I thought the colloquial definition of a zerg is have more people in group than are in your own.

DeadlyRecluse

Valen_Byte wrote: »

But I have little to no faith in the vet pvp community

This is perpetually true and relevant sentiment.

Valen_Byte wrote: »

But I have little to no faith in the community

Valen_Byte wrote: »

But I have little to no faith in pvp

This variants are also accurate.

Valen_Byte

Rickter wrote: »

Valen_Byte wrote: »

A zerg, is taking more players than necessary to complete an objective.

Did. . . did you just use my definition for zerging?

No, comment #6 and I posted the same definition a couple of years prior. Not going to look any further back to prove it. : ))

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/393515/you-might-be-a-zergling-if/p1

Valen_Byte

Ok I lied, Comment #50

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/327426/what-do-you-count-as-a-zerg#latest

Adenoma

#allcredittovalen, #onetruesheriff, #intellectualproperty

anadandy

Against my better judgement, I gave Shor another try last night. Less than 10 minutes in I was reminded why I left. Map totally one color with only enough items left to the other alliances to serve as lures for *** like myself to get farmed by players so buffed by bonuses they might as well be demi-gods. [disclaimer: I know it's only a certain segment of the alliance, not all]

Sure, the other two alliances will pop on for a few hours, make a good run - heck maybe even make emp - and pat themselves on the back about how they're making a difference. Then they log and it's all for nothing, it goes back to the same ***show.

Honestly, if we're still pretending that Shor is a healthy, viable campaign or that it can ever go back to the state it was late summer/fall 2017 - we're deluding ourselves. Who's to blame? I don't know - I'm not a big name player and the only thing I'm the sheriff of is my couch. Neglect of PVP by the devs is certainly a factor, but I'm sure that's not the only one.

Posting this was also against my better judgement, and now I owe my gaming partner a beer because I promised him I'd stay off the forums after my AW experience.

technohic

anadandy wrote: »

Against my better judgement, I gave Shor another try last night. Less than 10 minutes in I was reminded why I left. Map totally one color with only enough items left to the other alliances to serve as lures for *** like myself to get farmed by players so buffed by bonuses they might as well be demi-gods. [disclaimer: I know it's only a certain segment of the alliance, not all]

Sure, the other two alliances will pop on for a few hours, make a good run - heck maybe even make emp - and pat themselves on the back about how they're making a difference. Then they log and it's all for nothing, it goes back to the same ***show.

Honestly, if we're still pretending that Shor is a healthy, viable campaign or that it can ever go back to the state it was late summer/fall 2017 - we're deluding ourselves. Who's to blame? I don't know - I'm not a big name player and the only thing I'm the sheriff of is my couch. Neglect of PVP by the devs is certainly a factor, but I'm sure that's not the only one.

Posting this was also against my better judgement, and now I owe my gaming partner a beer because I promised him I'd stay off the forums after my AW experience.

I had a different experience but took away the same on Sunday night. Vivec was so bad for lag, abilities would fire off seconds after pressing the button and swapping weapons to where you couldnt play. Shor actually had 2 bars across the board, but once there, not much was lit or getting lit. Hit a resource alone, 5 or 6 enemies show up, 10 friendlies show up. Silence again for several minutes, then see the enemy light up one of our resources, go there, see 7 friendlies on 4 enemies so I guess this is the small scale that had been around, but its over in a minute then takes 10 minutes to get anything again. Maybe thats what people liked before but there is not a lot of action. Suppose its better than coming in to an all yellow map with trikeeps being farmed.

I have had a good time coming in Friday nights with a guild I am in. One of few times I am grouped. At that time, Shore is a mini Vivec with a little less lage yet still lag. Might have about a 2-3 hour window where each faction might make a push.

Rickter

I dont think anyone is pretending Shor is a healthy campaign. I think others saw to that a long time ago.

If i could pinpoint an exact time Shor was dealt a killing blow, I'd say it was when Krotha pushed his twitch partnership and for 5 weeks, DC rolled the map. Then he left but the AD that formed to meet that competition stayed and did bad things to Shor's corpse.

Vapirko

technohic wrote: »

My first hate whispers happened this weekend for me zerging. Had just been up on top of the mile gate between Nickel and Roe, fighting a group that was up there. This was on Vivec and I jump around from where there was action and get into it zerg surfing, or I let the enemy go by and try to pick people off in the back and there was 2 opposing zergs going back and forth in this area. Actually didnt get into the fight at the top when I got there as it was over by the time I got up but to me, I am looking at it as the fight is on the gate and I go down the scaffolding to see one enemy guy still taking 3 blues. I cloaked and incapped as soon as I got down, and the guys shields must have just been ready to go down or just went down as he dropped from full to execute range right then and there., and was dead before he could get up.

I thought nothing of it and went on to the fight which was now at Roe and then the whispers started. I get it in a way, as I have been the one guy getting ran over, but the placement there to not expect that was unfortunate.

Still, I overall was pretty happy with myself to be honest. There was 4 total of us on the guy and I made a good enough impression to have been noticed. I know I don't notice many players other than when they really mess me up.

Point being is, you never will get everyone on board because you never will please everyone. Some simple things like not camping tri-keeps when there are no scrolls should be easy enough but peoples expectations for a fair fight get to be a little far fetched. I mean if you are "small manning" and go to resources at tri keeps and risk cutting off travel to the big fights, you better expect a zerg. If you get between large groups are going back and forth, no one is going to wait for you to 1v1 people 1 at a time. At the same time; if you run all over the map with a raid on an underpopulated server, don't complain when there is no action any more. People are responsible for their own experience even if they do not understand the repercussions of their actions.

Everyone zergs, I’ve seen so many 1

Rickter wrote: »

I dont think anyone is pretending Shor is a healthy campaign. I think others saw to that a long time ago.

If i could pinpoint an exact time Shor was dealt a killing blow, I'd say it was when Krotha pushed his twitch partnership and for 5 weeks, DC rolled the map. Then he left but the AD that formed to meet that competition stayed and did bad things to Shor's corpse.

anyway, Midyear Mayhem was announced so Shor will be more alive than ever and who knows, maybe some of those guilds/players will decide to stay:

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26121

Are we pretending midyear mayhem is going to be playable?

Rickter

Vapirko wrote: »

Are we pretending midyear mayhem is going to be playable?

yeah actually that was an article from last year. so. . false alarm. my bad, i edited my post

casparian

Vapirko wrote: »

Are we pretending midyear mayhem is going to be playable?

When/if it happens I'm not sure I'll venture out of IC the entire time. IC is the only place guaranteed to have decent performance (except BGs, but ewww), and these will be the only 2 weeks out of the year when IC guaranteed to have consistently decent PVP. Plus nothing is more fun than killing nightblades who think Cloak will save them.

anadandy

technohic wrote: »

I had a different experience but took away the same on Sunday night. Vivec was so bad for lag, abilities would fire off seconds after pressing the button and swapping weapons to where you couldnt play.

Yeah, that's why I came back. Vivec was horrible - it was button mash and pray something would happen. It's what makes the state of Shor so frustrating, especially when remembering what it was.

Joshlenoir

LoDG_Kawi wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Rickter wrote: »

DC has been benefitting from low pop bonus lately with the new score evaluation periods and i couldnt be more happier.

Aside from a squad of 11 PUGs or so herded by the current #1, Requiem are the only other DC on the server and were getting 14k keep ticks and 3.4k resource ticks. 18k defense ticks.

We’ll log in around 8pm and have some pretty amazing fights - 5v6 was yhe most recent back and forth with the AD emp and i guess his squad. In discord we literally compared it to the old days of Shor when we were all there was and the smaller population.

Post dlc/chapter release is best pvp. Enjoyed this last week. Probably will be back to the shenanigans next week now that everyone has time stop, accelerate and mending....

Also been seeing a lot of Sload’s. The Sloadageddon has begun!!!!

I’m definitly coming back to open world this weekend. Fury and 7ths on the stam warden with stam jewelry now so strong v pugs.

Shhhhhhhhh been running that set on my stam warden, transmuted rings to robust

Your Stam Warden..
Lol

Kartalin

casparian wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

Are we pretending midyear mayhem is going to be playable?

When/if it happens I'm not sure I'll venture out of IC the entire time. IC is the only place guaranteed to have decent performance (except BGs, but ewww), and these will be the only 2 weeks out of the year when IC guaranteed to have consistently decent PVP. Plus nothing is more fun than killing nightblades who think Cloak will save them.

Also there’s no siege in IC or BGs.