ARE U HAPPY NOW ZOS IS DOING SOMETHING***Interview With Miat*** Lets Talk Add Ons, Cheating and Q/A

Majeure

Master Merchant and Tamriel Trade Centre are clearly cheating by giving the player an unfair advantage over the market, an advantage that the common player who is not using said addons does not have! I don't care if said addons are supported by ZOS' addon API, they are cheats to me, because honor!

VexingArcanist

Majeure wrote: »

Master Merchant and Tamriel Trade Centre are clearly cheating by giving the player an unfair advantage over the market, an advantage that the common player who is not using said addons does not have! I don't care if said addons are supported by ZOS' addon API, they are cheats to me, because honor!

Uh...TTC is available on the internet, it's own website, doesn't even require an "addon"....

This just in: Using a search engine is cheating. Looking words up in a dictionary is cheating. Driving a car is cheating.

Bax

VexingArcanist wrote: »

Majeure wrote: »

Master Merchant and Tamriel Trade Centre are clearly cheating by giving the player an unfair advantage over the market, an advantage that the common player who is not using said addons does not have! I don't care if said addons are supported by ZOS' addon API, they are cheats to me, because honor!

Uh...TTC is available on the internet, it's own website, doesn't even require an "addon"....

This just in: Using a search engine is cheating. Looking words up in a dictionary is cheating. Driving a car is cheating.

Look at such a huge catch on so obvious bait. I mean it even had a troll face included. Could it be more obvious?

Biro123

Sharee wrote: »

Vivecc wrote: »

Its only legit if its in the game. If it comes from outside - its a cheat.
Not everyone will use it, not everyone will know it, not everyone wants it. Simple.
Pls fix this loophole

Yea i have to agree. Its like someone pulls out a second queen piece in the middle of a chess match, puts it on the board, and calls it an addon.

Then you look up the tournament rules and find out that this is indeed allowed. But nobody told you before the match started.

That's some f'ed up tournament rules, ye? But do this in an MMO, and everyone's fine with it.

Strange world we live in.

And next match you have, you pull out your own queen - cos you know its allowed.
Next tournament, everyone is doing it, so nobody is disadvantaged - apart from maybe one or two who decide that they don't like that rule and won't use it - because 'Honour' and then accuse everybody else of cheating...

It stays 'allowed' until those in charge of the tournament decide to change the rules. Then it becomes cheating. So at the moment in ESO it is NOT cheating until Zos decides that it is (next update, I think).

Sharee

Biro123 wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Vivecc wrote: »

Its only legit if its in the game. If it comes from outside - its a cheat.
Not everyone will use it, not everyone will know it, not everyone wants it. Simple.
Pls fix this loophole

Yea i have to agree. Its like someone pulls out a second queen piece in the middle of a chess match, puts it on the board, and calls it an addon.

Then you look up the tournament rules and find out that this is indeed allowed. But nobody told you before the match started.

That's some f'ed up tournament rules, ye? But do this in an MMO, and everyone's fine with it.

Strange world we live in.

And next match you have, you pull out your own queen - cos you know its allowed.

It that particular example i made? Sure. But that is only because it is really hard to miss an extra enemy queen on the board.

An addon? You could play for years wondering why the eff everyone seems to have sixth sense dodging your attacks and never figure it out if you don't frequent these forums.

LordSemaj

Feanor wrote: »

"buuhh its an add on". It doesnt matter. If a game has add ons and allows you too see through walls is that still not a wall hack?

It seems that way to you because you probably don’t understand the technical background. Any addon that only uses the API calls the developers themselves made public can by definition not be cheating. To save myself a lengthy explanation I forward you to @InvitationNotFound instead. Just search for his posts on the matter let yourself be enlightened.

It seems that way to you because you probably don't understand the legal background of the ToS and EULA. Players regularly exploit functioning game mechanics operating precisely as intended in such a way that can by definition be called cheating. Those players suffer bans nonetheless. Found a dialogue option that awards XP every time you click it but can be cancelled out and done again repeatedly? That's how it was designed to work but it's still cheating. Many actions that are viewed as cheating aren't agreed upon by all as such until after the legal battle, when it becomes obvious that it was cheating all along and attempted to abuse a technicality in the law. Yet the law cannot be interpreted the way a layman sees it and what you find to be perfectly acceptable and within the legal grounds may in fact not be the interpretation the judge uses. "Oh this addon uses the API and lets me fly. It's perfectly legal!" <_< Yeah, try convincing any dev not to ban you for that. People have been banned just for finding GM Island in games even though they reached it without any addons, hacks, or cheating despite the fact that it's not prohibited to do so in the terms. It all falls under the extremely BROAD definition of glitching and exploiting which is intentionally broad because it can cover just about anything the judge sees fit to include. Even the legal systems in reality have such safety nets to catch unanticipated crimes without the technicality that they were doing nothing wrong. You're using your own definition of cheating and applying your own logic regarding legality which doesn't apply to all situations.

InvitationNotFound

LordSemaj wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

"buuhh its an add on". It doesnt matter. If a game has add ons and allows you too see through walls is that still not a wall hack?

It seems that way to you because you probably don’t understand the technical background. Any addon that only uses the API calls the developers themselves made public can by definition not be cheating. To save myself a lengthy explanation I forward you to @InvitationNotFound instead. Just search for his posts on the matter let yourself be enlightened.

It seems that way to you because you probably don't understand the legal background of the ToS and EULA. Players regularly exploit functioning game mechanics operating precisely as intended in such a way that can by definition be called cheating. Those players suffer bans nonetheless. Found a dialogue option that awards XP every time you click it but can be cancelled out and done again repeatedly? That's how it was designed to work but it's still cheating. Many actions that are viewed as cheating aren't agreed upon by all as such until after the legal battle, when it becomes obvious that it was cheating all along and attempted to abuse a technicality in the law. Yet the law cannot be interpreted the way a layman sees it and what you find to be perfectly acceptable and within the legal grounds may in fact not be the interpretation the judge uses. "Oh this addon uses the API and lets me fly. It's perfectly legal!" <_< Yeah, try convincing any dev not to ban you for that. People have been banned just for finding GM Island in games even though they reached it without any addons, hacks, or cheating despite the fact that it's not prohibited to do so in the terms. It all falls under the extremely BROAD definition of glitching and exploiting which is intentionally broad because it can cover just about anything the judge sees fit to include. Even the legal systems in reality have such safety nets to catch unanticipated crimes without the technicality that they were doing nothing wrong. You're using your own definition of cheating and applying your own logic regarding legality which doesn't apply to all situations.

I doubt you have read my posts. And you simply can't compare it with what you are comparing. But i just got home from work and i'm tired, so I won't repeat myself...

AGGROxander_Hamilton

I heard we can still detect snipe and no longer be trolled by fake snipe casts. Is this still confirmed to be true?

Sharee

AGGROxander_Hamilton wrote: »

I heard we can still detect snipe and no longer be trolled by fake snipe casts. Is this still confirmed to be true?

Snipe makes a sound while in flight (always did) so yes you can detect it, assuming the flight path is long enough. And since the sound only comes from a real snipe, you cannot be trolled by it either.

JonnytheKing

Vivecc wrote: »

Without watching the video, or reading thru all of the pages here, i just want to state my opinion if using Miat´s is "cheating" or not.

I bought the game, and i have full access to all dlc/ chapters. I expect to encounter (especially in PvP) no other player that has an active or passive advantage over me by the use of a ( de facto) 3rd party addon. This features are not part of the game, so its ( in my opinion ) cheating.

I use myself addons, for some personal improvements of gameplay, but none of those have active or passive effects that influence other players gameplay, nor give they any advantage to me to be " better" against npc´s or players inside or outside of PvP areas.

Its only legit if its in the game. If it comes from outside - its a cheat.
Not everyone will use it, not everyone will know it, not everyone wants it. Simple.
Pls fix this loophole

so you are calling for the ban if all addons , that all i got for this

JonnytheKing

SJD_Phoenix wrote: »

Sorry but am I the only one that instantly thought this had zero credibility due to the completely pathetic attempt at English in the title.

I haven’t watched the video, assuming it’s not his first language.

lol cool bro , nice story.

JonnytheKing

Sharee wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

I don't like Miat's addon. Not because I think it's cheating but because I believe it gives the player using it an advantage over one that isn't using it. I don't believe 3rd party addons/programs should give players advantages (especially in PvP).

"cheat
tʃiːt/Submit
verb
gerund or present participle: cheating

1. act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage.
"she always cheats at cards"

2. avoid (something undesirable) by luck or skill.
"she cheated death in a spectacular crash"
synonyms: avoid, escape, evade, elude, steer clear of, dodge, duck, miss, sidestep, bypass, skirt, shun, eschew;"

Yes, yes it really is cheating. You are acting dishonestly and/or unfairly by using 3rd party tools too "outplay" your opponent when your opponent isnt using it and or is not aware of its existence.

I have to play the devil's advocate here and oppose you.

Cheating here also implies breaking of the rules of the game. Otherwise your definition of cheating is too broad.

"Act dishonestly or unfairly to gain an advantage" could also be applied to, say, attacking a lone player with 3 of your friends. A 4 vs 1 certainly isn't fair, and you are doing it to gain an advantage. Yet nobody would call that cheating.

No, the players using Miat are technically not cheating if addons are allowed. Cheesing the system, perhaps. But the blame for that has to be put where it belongs - ZOS, for making rules that allow this.

WOW well *** said, this sums it all up. well said mate

jssriot

Let's say, in theory...

ZOS says X add-on isn't cheating, but then players use X add-on as a backdoor to do some blatant cheating. What then?

In theory, of course, because NO ONE playing ESO would EVER do that...especially with Miat's...

StaticWave

LordSemaj wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Funny thing is a lot of these “Miat’s a cheat” complainers also happen to be bowtards, gankblades, or zerglings. The truth is, if there weren’t such cowards that utilize those playstyles, this addon wouldn’t even be that big of an issue, since it only gives you information about ranged attacks and gap closers, not melee ones. There are more useful things Miat can offer, such as visual alert of keeps and resources nearby, numbers of friendly and enemy players around you, etc. Perhaps, if these complainers actually step outside of their comfort zone and learn to pvp, they’ll know that miat’s contribution to winning a fight is barely noticable. Any good dueler or 1vXer will have already achieved a state of awareness and game sense that they can comfortably anticipate an enemy’s moves. Blaming an addon for your lack of success in PvP is a cop out.

Miat user detected. Assures us that the addon isn't responsible yet strangely refuses to stop using it. Blames everyone else for sucking while insisting on stacking advantages in his favor. Total cop out.

Actually, I don't use Miats. It's been 3 months since I deleted Miats for better pc performance, and I have literally noticed 0 difference in skill level in open world. So yea, players that blame miats for their lack of success should honestly learn to play.

StaticWave

Jade1986 wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Funny thing is a lot of these “Miat’s a cheat” complainers also happen to be bowtards, gankblades, or zerglings. The truth is, if there weren’t such cowards that utilize those playstyles, this addon wouldn’t even be that big of an issue, since it only gives you information about ranged attacks and gap closers, not melee ones. There are more useful things Miat can offer, such as visual alert of keeps and resources nearby, numbers of friendly and enemy players around you, etc. Perhaps, if these complainers actually step outside of their comfort zone and learn to pvp, they’ll know that miat’s contribution to winning a fight is barely noticable. Any good dueler or 1vXer will have already achieved a state of awareness and game sense that they can comfortably anticipate an enemy’s moves. Blaming an addon for your lack of success in PvP is a cop out.

I could argue that cowards hide behind heavy armor and run meta builds.

I run medium armor. But I agree heavy armor users are cowards

StaticWave

Simply put, Miats only detect a handful of skills, mostly ranged. Guess what it's aimed for? That's right, bowtards that spam snipe, magnbs that spam flame clench and perma-cloak, dizzy swing spammer, spear spamming magplar, and most importantly, all the zerglings that hide behind their 20 man group and spam 1 skill as they chase down 1 person. Any good player will do just fine without Miats. Let me repeat it clearly, ANY GOOD PLAYER WILL DO JUST FINE WITHOUT MIATS. Maybe, just maybe, if you actually looked at how this game promotes a coward playstyle, you would understand why some people defend Miats. I don't use Miats anymore, and not because I think it's a cheat. I stopped using Miats for 2 reasons:
1/ Better fps.
2/ To prove that good players will perform at the same level with or without Miats.

And I was right. I 1vXed just as much as I did with Miats, because I've learned the skills needed to succeed in that playstyle. Players who complain about Miats are most of the time mediocre. Blaming an addon for your lack of pvp skills is a copout, and that is why you will never improve at the game. Sometimes I miss having that visual alert whenever a resource or a keep is UA though. It's really useful.

Ackwalan

StaticWave wrote: »

Simply put, Miats only detect a handful of skills, mostly ranged. Guess what it's aimed for? That's right, bowtards that spam snipe, magnbs that spam flame clench and perma-cloak, dizzy swing spammer, spear spamming magplar, and most importantly, all the zerglings that hide behind their 20 man group and spam 1 skill as they chase down 1 person. Any good player will do just fine without Miats. Let me repeat it clearly, ANY GOOD PLAYER WILL DO JUST FINE WITHOUT MIATS. Maybe, just maybe, if you actually looked at how this game promotes a coward playstyle, you would understand why some people defend Miats. I don't use Miats anymore, and not because I think it's a cheat. I stopped using Miats for 2 reasons:
1/ Better fps.
2/ To prove that good players will perform at the same level with or without Miats.

And I was right. I 1vXed just as much as I did with Miats, because I've learned the skills needed to succeed in that playstyle. Players who complain about Miats are most of the time mediocre. Blaming an addon for your lack of pvp skills is a copout, and that is why you will never improve at the game. Sometimes I miss having that visual alert whenever a resource or a keep is UA though. It's really useful.

You sound worried. Why worry about something that won't affect your gameplay. Unless?

StaticWave

dsalter wrote: »

also they need to fix "animation cancelling"

No they don't. Animation canceling exists in any game, and is not considered cheating. It doesn't take much time to learn how to animation cancel either.

StaticWave

Ackwalan wrote: »

StaticWave wrote: »

Simply put, Miats only detect a handful of skills, mostly ranged. Guess what it's aimed for? That's right, bowtards that spam snipe, magnbs that spam flame clench and perma-cloak, dizzy swing spammer, spear spamming magplar, and most importantly, all the zerglings that hide behind their 20 man group and spam 1 skill as they chase down 1 person. Any good player will do just fine without Miats. Let me repeat it clearly, ANY GOOD PLAYER WILL DO JUST FINE WITHOUT MIATS. Maybe, just maybe, if you actually looked at how this game promotes a coward playstyle, you would understand why some people defend Miats. I don't use Miats anymore, and not because I think it's a cheat. I stopped using Miats for 2 reasons:
1/ Better fps.
2/ To prove that good players will perform at the same level with or without Miats.

And I was right. I 1vXed just as much as I did with Miats, because I've learned the skills needed to succeed in that playstyle. Players who complain about Miats are most of the time mediocre. Blaming an addon for your lack of pvp skills is a copout, and that is why you will never improve at the game. Sometimes I miss having that visual alert whenever a resource or a keep is UA though. It's really useful.

You sound worried. Why worry about something that won't affect your gameplay. Unless?

Not worried. Just annoyed at these complainers

JonnytheKing

oh this brings back memories lol

Haquor

Page 17 was my last visited in this thread. 560 new comments!

Best necro NA

Dusk_Coven

.

JonnytheKing

Haquor wrote: »

Page 17 was my last visited in this thread. 560 new comments!

Best necro NA

there would have been so many more , soooo many comments got deleted

Dr_Ganknstein

Why I chose to transfer to console. Yeah the fps on pc is better but you dont have to worry about the cheat or "addon" game.

JonnytheKing

Icky wrote: »

Why I chose to transfer to console. Yeah the fps on pc is better but you dont have to worry about the cheat or "addon" game.

this wasnt cheating , and addons are amazing

MyPrist

When DK skills will work ?

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

I do not care about anything else.

But just interesting will it be fixed someday.

4+ month , skill is buged with lightning staff, now with restoration + lightning staff.

You say that you fixed it in patch notes !!!

1/3 years DK play with skills that DO not WORK !!!

Zero add !!! You fix with duals and bug with restoration staff. What will be next ?

I am so desopointed and pls stop ignore me already !!! Pls say some thing to me, ZOS !

JonnytheKing

MyPrist wrote: »

When DK skills will work ?

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

I do not care about anything else.

But just interesting will it be fixed someday.

4+ month , skill is buged with lightning staff, now with restoration + lightning staff.

You say that you fixed it in patch notes !!!

1/3 years DK play with skills that DO not WORK !!!

Zero add !!! You fix with duals and bug with restoration staff. What will be next ?

I am so desopointed and pls stop ignore me already !!! Pls say some thing to me, ZOS !

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

what d o u mean

MyPrist

JonnytheKing wrote: »

MyPrist wrote: »

When DK skills will work ?

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

I do not care about anything else.

But just interesting will it be fixed someday.

4+ month , skill is buged with lightning staff, now with restoration + lightning staff.

You say that you fixed it in patch notes !!!

1/3 years DK play with skills that DO not WORK !!!

Zero add !!! You fix with duals and bug with restoration staff. What will be next ?

I am so desopointed and pls stop ignore me already !!! Pls say some thing to me, ZOS !

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

what d o u mean

I mean that it is bufed like skill gives nothing to heavy attack. Only major sorcery work, but moltan armaments buff on heavy attack do not add anything to restoration staff heavy attack. Just test it !!! Use major sorcery than attack, buff moltan armaments and attack with restoration stuff.

The same dps !!!

MyPrist

JonnytheKing wrote: »

MyPrist wrote: »

When DK skills will work ?

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

I do not care about anything else.

But just interesting will it be fixed someday.

4+ month , skill is buged with lightning staff, now with restoration + lightning staff.

You say that you fixed it in patch notes !!!

1/3 years DK play with skills that DO not WORK !!!

Zero add !!! You fix with duals and bug with restoration staff. What will be next ?

I am so desopointed and pls stop ignore me already !!! Pls say some thing to me, ZOS !

0% add on restoration staff from Moltan armaments, that must give 50%.

what d o u mean

I am so mad already, becouse it is 4 month bugs in skill, now ZOS say that it was fixed !!!

It was not !!!

And they ignore me

VaranisArano