PTS Patch Notes v2.7.4

STEVIL

@Grumble_and_Grunt
"IF people are really that fickle to shout equality for people stock piling and being mindful of updates and investing their efforts in game to be rewarded over some non crafter who wants to be on an equal footing without any effort at all, then I am baffled by the point of doing anything in this game remotely challenging and rewarding when people feel so strongly entitled"

The establihed crafter will have a great many advantages in Homestead over non- crafters, just like a well conditioned, well trained, properly hydrated and experienced runner with good custom shoes would have over a rookie in a marathon.

But all those "investments" that the experienced runner has made should not and do not (outside of the "must have rewards others dont to compete" mmo world ) let them start from a line ahead of the rookie and have a shorter road to the finish line.

Grumble_and_Grunt

STEVIL wrote: »

@Grumble_and_Grunt
"IF people are really that fickle to shout equality for people stock piling and being mindful of updates and investing their efforts in game to be rewarded over some non crafter who wants to be on an equal footing without any effort at all, then I am baffled by the point of doing anything in this game remotely challenging and rewarding when people feel so strongly entitled"

The establihed crafter will have a great many advantages in Homestead over non- crafters, just like a well conditioned, well trained, properly hydrated and experienced runner with good custom shoes would have over a rookie in a marathon.

But all those "investments" that the experienced runner has made should not and do not (outside of the "must have rewards others dont to compete" mmo world ) let them start from a line ahead of the rookie and have a shorter road to the finish line.

@STEVIL I would agree to this point if there was an advantage to be had, besides early gold making potential, which ZOS can rectify just so easily by making pre Homestead Surveys redundant.

There is no advantage to be had over others for instanced cosmetic content, just as there is no finish line, it's creative content.

Witar

Liam12548 wrote: »

magblades got some great buffs

Like 30% inreased cost on main spammable and shade that pulls you out of stealth and insta agro mobs on cast? Seriously?

STEVIL

Grumble_and_Grunt wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

@Grumble_and_Grunt
"IF people are really that fickle to shout equality for people stock piling and being mindful of updates and investing their efforts in game to be rewarded over some non crafter who wants to be on an equal footing without any effort at all, then I am baffled by the point of doing anything in this game remotely challenging and rewarding when people feel so strongly entitled"

The establihed crafter will have a great many advantages in Homestead over non- crafters, just like a well conditioned, well trained, properly hydrated and experienced runner with good custom shoes would have over a rookie in a marathon.

But all those "investments" that the experienced runner has made should not and do not (outside of the "must have rewards others dont to compete" mmo world ) let them start from a line ahead of the rookie and have a shorter road to the finish line.

@STEVIL I would agree to this point if there was an advantage to be had, besides early gold making potential, which ZOS can rectify just so easily by making pre Homestead Surveys redundant.

There is no advantage to be had over others for instanced cosmetic content, just as there is no finish line, it's creative content.

making pre-homesetad surveys separate from post-homestead surveys - doubling my count of surveys slots used just so i get a little or a lot ahead of others... no thanks.

NOTE: Are you working on the notion that the only way zos can control the rate of drop and get it to "not too much grind levels" is by including surveys in the mix or that they can not raise the node gain rates for furnish-stuff when they remove surveys if they wish?

See, the basic underlying flaw in your logic is that whether or not they make surveys a part of the furn-stuff grind or not, they can set the rate-of-gain to whatever they want.

So there is absolutely no tie between "it happens in surveys" and "rate of grind" - its just "how much grind they choose" which means the only gain coming from "surveys included" would be the very "start further ahead" edge for day o9ne if surveys were included.

that is why i think not allowing my over 300 surveys in stock to be used to get a leg up on others is a good idea. i will already have a sizeable advantage over most with the number of master crafters.

You may feel you need the head-start but hey, thats cool.

ixie

STEVIL wrote: »

Grumble_and_Grunt wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

@Grumble_and_Grunt
"IF people are really that fickle to shout equality for people stock piling and being mindful of updates and investing their efforts in game to be rewarded over some non crafter who wants to be on an equal footing without any effort at all, then I am baffled by the point of doing anything in this game remotely challenging and rewarding when people feel so strongly entitled"

The establihed crafter will have a great many advantages in Homestead over non- crafters, just like a well conditioned, well trained, properly hydrated and experienced runner with good custom shoes would have over a rookie in a marathon.

But all those "investments" that the experienced runner has made should not and do not (outside of the "must have rewards others dont to compete" mmo world ) let them start from a line ahead of the rookie and have a shorter road to the finish line.

@STEVIL I would agree to this point if there was an advantage to be had, besides early gold making potential, which ZOS can rectify just so easily by making pre Homestead Surveys redundant.

There is no advantage to be had over others for instanced cosmetic content, just as there is no finish line, it's creative content.

making pre-homesetad surveys separate from post-homestead surveys - doubling my count of surveys slots used just so i get a little or a lot ahead of others... no thanks.

NOTE: Are you working on the notion that the only way zos can control the rate of drop and get it to "not too much grind levels" is by including surveys in the mix or that they can not raise the node gain rates for furnish-stuff when they remove surveys if they wish?

See, the basic underlying flaw in your logic is that whether or not they make surveys a part of the furn-stuff grind or not, they can set the rate-of-gain to whatever they want.

So there is absolutely no tie between "it happens in surveys" and "rate of grind" - its just "how much grind they choose" which means the only gain coming from "surveys included" would be the very "start further ahead" edge for day o9ne if surveys were included.

that is why i think not allowing my over 300 surveys in stock to be used to get a leg up on others is a good idea. i will already have a sizeable advantage over most with the number of master crafters.

You may feel you need the head-start but hey, thats cool.

The thing that I find odd about their decision to remove furnishing mats from surveys is the inconsistency, when you gather mats normally you have a chance to obtain the furnishing mats, why make it different when gathering from surveys? This will likely cause some to think the surveys are bugged, leading to frustration and to bug reporting, which could all be avoided if they kept things simple and consistent.

Sugaroverdose

Horowonnoe wrote: »

Mac PTS still broken. Crashes on launch. : (

ESO on PS4 Pro with 4k output is broken since november 20(console release), crashes every 5 minutes, then got graphics downgrade and broken second time with "HDR" patch making everything dark and they didn't comment on it even once, good luck at waiting for reliable support from ZoS

ADarklore

So I'm curious, this update change to Backlash, does this mostly impact PvP and not so much PvE?

From the notes, "Hitting the maximum damage limit against another player now requires a significant amount of uninhibited damage from the Templar, and enemies will have more counterplay in reducing Backlash’s burst damage if they actively mitigate or avoid damage. "

Does this mean that in solo PvE it will still hit high damage against NPC enemies?

STEVIL

ADarklore wrote: »

So I'm curious, this update change to Backlash, does this mostly impact PvP and not so much PvE?

From the notes, "Hitting the maximum damage limit against another player now requires a significant amount of uninhibited damage from the Templar, and enemies will have more counterplay in reducing Backlash’s burst damage if they actively mitigate or avoid damage. "

Does this mean that in solo PvE it will still hit high damage against NPC enemies?

No.

ADarklore

STEVIL wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

So I'm curious, this update change to Backlash, does this mostly impact PvP and not so much PvE?

From the notes, "Hitting the maximum damage limit against another player now requires a significant amount of uninhibited damage from the Templar, and enemies will have more counterplay in reducing Backlash’s burst damage if they actively mitigate or avoid damage. "

Does this mean that in solo PvE it will still hit high damage against NPC enemies?

No.

And why exactly is that, a one word response really isn't all that helpful. They seem to make it sound like the ability does different things depending on whether it's against another player or NPC. Further, someone else posted that you can still hit high damage with it 1v1. So which is it? I mean, is it a skill even worth slotting against say, Open World bosses?!?

Grumble_and_Grunt

tribbsb16_ESO wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Grumble_and_Grunt wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

@Grumble_and_Grunt
"IF people are really that fickle to shout equality for people stock piling and being mindful of updates and investing their efforts in game to be rewarded over some non crafter who wants to be on an equal footing without any effort at all, then I am baffled by the point of doing anything in this game remotely challenging and rewarding when people feel so strongly entitled"

The establihed crafter will have a great many advantages in Homestead over non- crafters, just like a well conditioned, well trained, properly hydrated and experienced runner with good custom shoes would have over a rookie in a marathon.

But all those "investments" that the experienced runner has made should not and do not (outside of the "must have rewards others dont to compete" mmo world ) let them start from a line ahead of the rookie and have a shorter road to the finish line.

@STEVIL I would agree to this point if there was an advantage to be had, besides early gold making potential, which ZOS can rectify just so easily by making pre Homestead Surveys redundant.

There is no advantage to be had over others for instanced cosmetic content, just as there is no finish line, it's creative content.

making pre-homesetad surveys separate from post-homestead surveys - doubling my count of surveys slots used just so i get a little or a lot ahead of others... no thanks.

NOTE: Are you working on the notion that the only way zos can control the rate of drop and get it to "not too much grind levels" is by including surveys in the mix or that they can not raise the node gain rates for furnish-stuff when they remove surveys if they wish?

See, the basic underlying flaw in your logic is that whether or not they make surveys a part of the furn-stuff grind or not, they can set the rate-of-gain to whatever they want.

So there is absolutely no tie between "it happens in surveys" and "rate of grind" - its just "how much grind they choose" which means the only gain coming from "surveys included" would be the very "start further ahead" edge for day o9ne if surveys were included.

that is why i think not allowing my over 300 surveys in stock to be used to get a leg up on others is a good idea. i will already have a sizeable advantage over most with the number of master crafters.

You may feel you need the head-start but hey, thats cool.

The thing that I find odd about their decision to remove furnishing mats from surveys is the inconsistency, when you gather mats normally you have a chance to obtain the furnishing mats, why make it different when gathering from surveys? This will likely cause some to think the surveys are bugged, leading to frustration and to bug reporting, which could all be avoided if they kept things simple and consistent.

@STEVIL I was writing a counter argument to your last reply, but then I started reading your arguments/responses to others and just thought na I'll leave it. Surveys were bugged, ZOS didn't fix them, now changed them, if actually read my posts would see I didn't suggest surveys are the only way, it is mere frustration that instead of fixing them and keeping crafting rewarding and entwined with housing they band aid 'fixed' it aka swept it under the rug. Just read everyones thread properly and then please reply so people are not obliged to regurgitate their replies to you from earlier comments. It's a pretty overwhelming majority who are upset with the last minute survey change...

STEVIL

ADarklore wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

So I'm curious, this update change to Backlash, does this mostly impact PvP and not so much PvE?

From the notes, "Hitting the maximum damage limit against another player now requires a significant amount of uninhibited damage from the Templar, and enemies will have more counterplay in reducing Backlash’s burst damage if they actively mitigate or avoid damage. "

Does this mean that in solo PvE it will still hit high damage against NPC enemies?

No.

And why exactly is that, a one word response really isn't all that helpful. They seem to make it sound like the ability does different things depending on whether it's against another player or NPC. Further, someone else posted that you can still hit high damage with it 1v1. So which is it? I mean, is it a skill even worth slotting against say, Open World bosses?!?

No it does the exact same thing. However the targets will behave differently and that affects the outtcome. Pc affected by backlash is more likely to dodge or block reducing damage in. So hitting that max dam in the time allotted is much harder esp solo. The notes explain reasoning and goals behind changes not provide new mechanics.

Banetek

have you fixed that the FRED FLINTSTONE block feet of what should be something that flows with the rest of the character model? Or are we stuck with a horrible graphic?

Woolenthreads

I'm disappointed that it was assumed that the players would know that you intended to block furniture material drops from survey nodes. The one paragraph in these notes is the first mention of it they I can find in any of the PTS 2.7 Notes. I think that this is a poorly considered decision on the part of the developers.

Paraflex

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Sugaroverdose

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

STEVIL

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

Sugaroverdose

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

OMA

@ZOS_GinaBruno

Body and Facial Markings purchased from the crown store are removed when changing zones using the wayshrine, after relogging, after every play session, and after /reloadui.


I think it's a bug!

STEVIL

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

no i am pretty sure that is far from my point.

matter of fact - since i think i didn't say one thing about "doing things right" or friends or family or idiots. So it looks like much of your reply seems to be drawing on some other post?


i was merely pointing out there is a huge difference between posting on forums about game design and actually doing game design that goes into production for a living.

Some, it seems kind of seem to miss or misunderstand that difference.

Not all of course, but some clearly do.

Lady_Rosabella

@ZOS_GinaBruno "Removed two furnishings that appeared visually similar to Provisioning Stations, but were not actually Provisioning Stations."

If you're talking about the clay (brick oven looking) fire that was originally in my furnished Hunding's Palatial house, WHY????

Anyone with any sense could walk up to it and see the prompt to extinguish it should know it is not a Provisioning Station. That was one of the things that looked like it belong in my house and yet you replace it with a round stone fire pit that just looks stupid in the kitchen area?? And ever time I load into my house the loading screen still shows the original one in there making me want it even more.

If I'm gonna spend that much real life money to buy crowns to purchase that house furnished I should get what was originally put in there when I bought the house on the PTS.

MLGProPlayer

Aristodeme Blood Feast wrote: »

About writs and maps not droping mats for homestead - good choice ZOS. This makes equal chances for all players and stabilizes market. We wil not see in 1 hour full guild store of mats just because someone farmed writs whole year and overpricing. Pricing will go of course at first high for mats, but not overpriced. Considering alot recipes to collect - we have time guys, no need to collect all 1st day right?

How does this make any sense? More supply results in a LOWER price, not a higher one.

I'm not a crafter (I can't even complete basic writs), but I still want crafters to flood the market with these mats because it will lower the price for me, a buyer.

notimetocare

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

So we have all been grinding surveys for nothing?

Surveys still give what they always did

Sugaroverdose

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

no i am pretty sure that is far from my point.

matter of fact - since i think i didn't say one thing about "doing things right" or friends or family or idiots. So it looks like much of your reply seems to be drawing on some other post?


i was merely pointing out there is a huge difference between posting on forums about game design and actually doing game design that goes into production for a living.

Some, it seems kind of seem to miss or misunderstand that difference.

Not all of course, but some clearly do.

There's no difference do you write mechanics on forums or inside corp chat/wiki/issue tracker/whatever. And if you are watch for "job done" you'll see that ZoS doesn't even try to fix issue without ruining mechanics punishing everyone who does somehow related to it.

Also if you didn't code ever it doesn't means that this thing is also "rocket science" and not available to people who tried to give ZoS creativity boost.

PS: ZoS doesn't even have regression tests for most game functionality and bugs which reappear once per two-three patches, which also describes how professional they are

LegacyDM

Strife dev comments? Anything?

STEVIL

Lady_Rosabella wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno "Removed two furnishings that appeared visually similar to Provisioning Stations, but were not actually Provisioning Stations."

If you're talking about the clay (brick oven looking) fire that was originally in my furnished Hunding's Palatial house, WHY????

Anyone with any sense could walk up to it and see the prompt to extinguish it should know it is not a Provisioning Station. That was one of the things that looked like it belong in my house and yet you replace it with a round stone fire pit that just looks stupid in the kitchen area?? And ever time I load into my house the loading screen still shows the original one in there making me want it even more.

If I'm gonna spend that much real life money to buy crowns to purchase that house furnished I should get what was originally put in there when I bought the house on the PTS.

just an observation that if one believes what appears in test *should* absolutely be what comes in the initial release, one should look up the meaning of the word "test".

STEVIL

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

no i am pretty sure that is far from my point.

matter of fact - since i think i didn't say one thing about "doing things right" or friends or family or idiots. So it looks like much of your reply seems to be drawing on some other post?


i was merely pointing out there is a huge difference between posting on forums about game design and actually doing game design that goes into production for a living.

Some, it seems kind of seem to miss or misunderstand that difference.

Not all of course, but some clearly do.

There's no difference do you write mechanics on forums or inside corp chat/wiki/issue tracker/whatever. And if you are watch for "job done" you'll see that ZoS doesn't even try to fix issue without ruining mechanics punishing everyone who does somehow related to it.

Also if you didn't code ever it doesn't means that this thing is also "rocket science" and not available to people who tried to give ZoS creativity boost.

PS: ZoS doesn't even have regression tests for most game functionality and bugs which reappear once per two-three patches, which also describes how professional they are

if you really believe the bolded, we will have to just agree to disagree because you and i are from different multiverses.

As for ZoS not fixing things, there is ample evidence they do - just not everything all at once and not everything the way some people like.

For example - recently one survey type gave furnishing mats in test while the others didn't. They fixed that outlier by removing the furnishing mat drop from that type of survey as we head into live. Fixed the difference and now some folks wanted it to go the other way and they don't like the fix, while others do.

Grumble_and_Grunt

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

no i am pretty sure that is far from my point.

matter of fact - since i think i didn't say one thing about "doing things right" or friends or family or idiots. So it looks like much of your reply seems to be drawing on some other post?


i was merely pointing out there is a huge difference between posting on forums about game design and actually doing game design that goes into production for a living.

Some, it seems kind of seem to miss or misunderstand that difference.

Not all of course, but some clearly do.

There's no difference do you write mechanics on forums or inside corp chat/wiki/issue tracker/whatever. And if you are watch for "job done" you'll see that ZoS doesn't even try to fix issue without ruining mechanics punishing everyone who does somehow related to it.

Also if you didn't code ever it doesn't means that this thing is also "rocket science" and not available to people who tried to give ZoS creativity boost.

PS: ZoS doesn't even have regression tests for most game functionality and bugs which reappear once per two-three patches, which also describes how professional they are

if you really believe the bolded, we will have to just agree to disagree because you and i are from different multiverses.

As for ZoS not fixing things, there is ample evidence they do - just not everything all at once and not everything the way some people like.

For example - recently one survey type gave furnishing mats in test while the others didn't. They fixed that outlier by removing the furnishing mat drop from that type of survey as we head into live. Fixed the difference and now some folks wanted it to go the other way and they don't like the fix, while others do.

Except it wasn't listed as a fix was it? They just changed it instead, as noted in the notes you can see below. If it was a bug it would have been *Fixed not **Updated.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom It is clear that the change/ non fix to crafting surveys is one of the most spoken about topics as of latest PTS patch. Any dev comment as to the decision to remove them/ not fix them or if was intended to not include the materials with the surveys as to why?

Seems very counter intuitive to the crafting writs system, especially in a patch that is trying to give crafting more value for its investment. Would be nice to hear the reasons, since to me personally it just seems like it wasn't a priority fix and with the time investment with Morrowind, just decided to take the easiest (laziest) solution.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

FIXES & IMPROVEMENTS, BASE GAME PATCH



Crafting & Economy
General

• Updated Alchemy Survey Reports to no longer provide Alchemical Resin. This brings them in line with other Survey Reports.
  

STEVIL

Grumble_and_Grunt wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

no i am pretty sure that is far from my point.

matter of fact - since i think i didn't say one thing about "doing things right" or friends or family or idiots. So it looks like much of your reply seems to be drawing on some other post?


i was merely pointing out there is a huge difference between posting on forums about game design and actually doing game design that goes into production for a living.

Some, it seems kind of seem to miss or misunderstand that difference.

Not all of course, but some clearly do.

There's no difference do you write mechanics on forums or inside corp chat/wiki/issue tracker/whatever. And if you are watch for "job done" you'll see that ZoS doesn't even try to fix issue without ruining mechanics punishing everyone who does somehow related to it.

Also if you didn't code ever it doesn't means that this thing is also "rocket science" and not available to people who tried to give ZoS creativity boost.

PS: ZoS doesn't even have regression tests for most game functionality and bugs which reappear once per two-three patches, which also describes how professional they are

if you really believe the bolded, we will have to just agree to disagree because you and i are from different multiverses.

As for ZoS not fixing things, there is ample evidence they do - just not everything all at once and not everything the way some people like.

For example - recently one survey type gave furnishing mats in test while the others didn't. They fixed that outlier by removing the furnishing mat drop from that type of survey as we head into live. Fixed the difference and now some folks wanted it to go the other way and they don't like the fix, while others do.

Except it wasn't listed as a fix was it? They just changed it instead, as noted in the notes you can see below. If it was a bug it would have been *Fixed not **Updated.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom It is clear that the change/ non fix to crafting surveys is one of the most spoken about topics as of latest PTS patch. Any dev comment as to the decision to remove them/ not fix them or if was intended to not include the materials with the surveys as to why?

Seems very counter intuitive to the crafting writs system, especially in a patch that is trying to give crafting more value for its investment. Would be nice to hear the reasons, since to me personally it just seems like it wasn't a priority fix and with the time investment with Morrowind, just decided to take the easiest (laziest) solution.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

FIXES & IMPROVEMENTS, BASE GAME PATCH



Crafting & Economy
General

• Updated Alchemy Survey Reports to no longer provide Alchemical Resin. This brings them in line with other Survey Reports.
  

i am sorry but do i have this right? You are hinging you argument on the fact that they said "this brings them in line with other Survey Reports" and did not use the exact word "fix" but instead said "updated"?

You do realize Patch notes are not a legal document run thru a set of lawyers for precise language but are generated and put out even as things change, right?

There was a mismatch between the types of surveys. They "updated" the outlier to match the rest and announced it in the section called FIXES & IMPROVEMENTS, BASE GAME PATCH.

if they had done it the other way around and added it to all of them would you still be here worrying over why the word "fix" was not used?

Whether the rate of flow of furnishings/mats/etc into the game comes from the many listed sources or fromthose plus surveys, the final rate of flow will be set by ZoS and driven by player actions. The only difference is how much of a head start do some folks get.

Clearly, some want or feel they need more of a head start.

ixie

STEVIL wrote: »

Whether the rate of flow of furnishings/mats/etc into the game comes from the many listed sources or fromthose plus surveys, the final rate of flow will be set by ZoS and driven by player actions. The only difference is how much of a head start do some folks get.

Clearly, some want or feel they need more of a head start.

I don't believe ZoS made this change because some would have a head start, people are able to save up AP and Undaunted Keys etc before updates, preparing for updates is what keeps some people playing, gives them something to work towards. I don't know their reason, maybe it was a quick decision made under pressure, there have been quite a few strange "fixes" in this patch.

Sugaroverdose

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

STEVIL wrote: »

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

Paraflex wrote: »

A large portion of the people posting act like they work at ZOS and could do a better job. The complaining on these forums is just incredible.

Get into people profiles, look for their topics created, most of people do actually try to participate and seems like that they have much more at gamedesing than some zoe employee

you are correct that it seems absolutely clear some of them perhaps many spend more time on these forums talking about game designs they never made reality than zos spending time on these forums talking about game designs they actually do work on and put into production.

its almost like zos employees are spending a lot of their time not talking on forums about game design... but doing something else.

So your point is - that they doing things right because they still wasn't fired? Sry but friendship and family tiles are also can hold asses in chairs even if these person is complete idiot and turns whole business into blackhole.

no i am pretty sure that is far from my point.

matter of fact - since i think i didn't say one thing about "doing things right" or friends or family or idiots. So it looks like much of your reply seems to be drawing on some other post?


i was merely pointing out there is a huge difference between posting on forums about game design and actually doing game design that goes into production for a living.

Some, it seems kind of seem to miss or misunderstand that difference.

Not all of course, but some clearly do.

There's no difference do you write mechanics on forums or inside corp chat/wiki/issue tracker/whatever. And if you are watch for "job done" you'll see that ZoS doesn't even try to fix issue without ruining mechanics punishing everyone who does somehow related to it.

Also if you didn't code ever it doesn't means that this thing is also "rocket science" and not available to people who tried to give ZoS creativity boost.

PS: ZoS doesn't even have regression tests for most game functionality and bugs which reappear once per two-three patches, which also describes how professional they are

if you really believe the bolded, we will have to just agree to disagree because you and i are from different multiverses.

As for ZoS not fixing things, there is ample evidence they do - just not everything all at once and not everything the way some people like.

For example - recently one survey type gave furnishing mats in test while the others didn't. They fixed that outlier by removing the furnishing mat drop from that type of survey as we head into live. Fixed the difference and now some folks wanted it to go the other way and they don't like the fix, while others do.

Yep, seems like i'm a little closer to it and related to it stuff

I don't care and don't say anything about material grind mechanics, i'm talking exclusively about class/resource pool balance and overall battle mechanics.

What do i criticise:
1. Unreasonable damage/healing output and sustain boost over and over again
2. Dummed CP system
3. Damaging sets which are get out of control
4. Bait fixes of permanent blocking/roll dodging, gap-closers, shield stacking, dynamic ultimate gain system, etc
5. Ignoring issues like proctarding(crit removed, yay), outperforming dark deal(still, they don't give a f), PS4 Pro issues(wasn't even acknowledged) for eternity from mmo perspective
6. Making single-button gameplay preferred
7. ZoS also "buffed" mDK to before DB state by nerfing most useful sets for them also nerfed AoE output in update where mDK could shine if it wouldn't be touched at all(AoE caps nerfed)