Update 13 - Sneak peak notes

stevepdodson_ESO888

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

ChandraNalaar wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

ginoboehm wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert do you use impen in pvp? why did you nerf proc sets in pve to the ground and only marginally made them weaker on pvp?

Yep I use impen - even with 7 impen, crits still hurt. On the PVE side, It's about a 7-8% nerf to sustain from my internal testing. (using Viper, Red Mountain and Kra on my stam sorc) I wouldn't call that nerfed into the ground.

Have you tested these changes on magicka toons yet? @ZOS_RichLambert From the tooltips it seems like magicka toons using Grothdarr or Ilambris are going to have a harder time sustaining their damage in trials. How do you think this will affect raid groups in vMOL, and are you trying to remove burn strats?

If the crit damage from those sets was so important perhaps Grothdarr and Ilambris were over performing?

if this is the case then perhaps sets should have been looked at individually rather than a blanket nerf
e.g. lower damage, lower proc chance, increase cooldown times, etc.

peeps in PvP will still stack 3 proc sets and nothing will change there...as they can no longer crit then just pump more into flat damage so that when the sets go off they will just hit harder...boom... dead again and problem still not solved

FloppyTouch

Tyrion87 wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert

Explain to us, why do such proc sets like Iceheart or Winterborn deserve such a nerf? They are already underwhelming in terms of dmg but still quite viable for some easier group content. With your changes these sets will be complete garbage and will be viable only for solo questing (that can be done naked tbh). Did you even think about those sets while nerfing them or did you only have viper/selene etc. in mind when doing this?

And how do you know they are not going to buff the base damage of these sets? In fact how do you know anything at all base off a sneak peak? Chill fam the sky is not falling

AzraelKrieg

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Tyrion87 wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert

Explain to us, why do such proc sets like Iceheart or Winterborn deserve such a nerf? They are already underwhelming in terms of dmg but still quite viable for some easier group content. With your changes these sets will be complete garbage and will be viable only for solo questing (that can be done naked tbh). Did you even think about those sets while nerfing them or did you only have viper/selene etc. in mind when doing this?

And how do you know they are not going to buff the base damage of these sets? In fact how do you know anything at all base off a sneak peak? Chill fam the sky is not falling

This. What we've been given is only a small portion of the notes. Usually poor Gina has to write up 50 pages of the damn things. There could be a lot of other changes to sets to bring their base values up to deal with the crit changes.

leepalmer95

stevepdodson_ESO888 wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

ChandraNalaar wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

ginoboehm wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert do you use impen in pvp? why did you nerf proc sets in pve to the ground and only marginally made them weaker on pvp?

Yep I use impen - even with 7 impen, crits still hurt. On the PVE side, It's about a 7-8% nerf to sustain from my internal testing. (using Viper, Red Mountain and Kra on my stam sorc) I wouldn't call that nerfed into the ground.

Have you tested these changes on magicka toons yet? @ZOS_RichLambert From the tooltips it seems like magicka toons using Grothdarr or Ilambris are going to have a harder time sustaining their damage in trials. How do you think this will affect raid groups in vMOL, and are you trying to remove burn strats?

If the crit damage from those sets was so important perhaps Grothdarr and Ilambris were over performing?

if this is the case then perhaps sets should have been looked at individually rather than a blanket nerf
e.g. lower damage, lower proc chance, increase cooldown times, etc.

peeps in PvP will still stack 3 proc sets and nothing will change there...as they can no longer crit then just pump more into flat damage so that when the sets go off they will just hit harder...boom... dead again and problem still not solved

Maybe but the loss of crits will hurt proc sets, you won't be seeing 4-6k viper proc's anymore or 8-11k veli/selen proc's either.

Reykice

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Reykice wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Reykice wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

ginoboehm wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert do you use impen in pvp? why did you nerf proc sets in pve to the ground and only marginally made them weaker on pvp?

Yep I use impen - even with 7 impen, crits still hurt. On the PVE side, It's about a 7-8% nerf to sustain from my internal testing. (using Viper, Red Mountain and Kra on my stam sorc) I wouldn't call that nerfed into the ground.

So your justification is come on guys take the hit its not that bad?

How about you make the effect only apply in PvP or would that imply you actually work on the game not just the Crown Store?

His justification is he's a dev. He decideds what need balancing and what doesn't.

Proc sets needed balancing in pvp, zos decided that some procs sets were over performing in pve as well, so yes you'll lose a few % of pve damage.

Some people need to accept this wasn't intended to be just a pvp nerf and the pve nerf was intended because zos decided it was needed.

They are pretty much pissing most of their client... i for one intend to vote with my wallet like i did so far when i did not like it.

ESO is my most played game and yet i spend the least money on it, keep sub on that is about it...

I have a feeling many do the same or less and it shows as updates have been a lot slower, content a lot less and so on. You can`t just keep pissing your clients off and hope to make money especially when there was no need to and you could make it a PVP only change.

How do you know there pissing off most of their client? Because a select few on a forum which doesn't account for 99.9% of the playerbase are complaining?

That these people haven't even tested the changes yet? There just assuming this and that without knowing the full update notes. Even then people are still going to use monster sets in pvp and pve as the damage for a 2 piece in irreplaceable.

Because no player likes nerfs... especially for no other reason than "we nerfed you in PvE because we nerfed PvP... again. Sorry. Again. Please buy more Crowns so we can deliver quality stuff!"

Besides, maaaany told them to stop adding proc sets as they are bad for PvP... did they listen? Well now a bit but the solution will just get them more hate.

Kobiwan_shinobi

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

Kobiwan_shinobi wrote: »

Lol ZOS simply can not win.

90% of PvE player on forums post IC patch cried that the game was too easy. That they can burn all content without breaking a sweat. That they needed a 'difficulty' setting.

Now let's look at the forum today...

'Not being able to crit a proc is unacceptable. This will surely destroy PvE bla.. bla ......bla'.

As a PvE & PvP player, I think this change is great; Not amazing, but it will do for now. It will lower burst potential in PvP and lower DPS on PvE. Both of which needed to happen. This game has slowly moved away from 'skill' and gone down the route of ease. I am hoping this next update will bring skill back into the equation.

My personal preference would be to completely remove 5pc proc sets from PvP & PvE. I think monster sets are okay, but damage should be decreased by 50% in PvP with no crit.

One problem with proc sets is that people are using them as part of their rotation; Building a character around a proc set(s), rather than adding it to your char to give you a slight boost in potential. Some proc sets can hit harder than ultimates in this game and is one of the main reasons 'balance' is difficult.

If you feel like this change is going to seriously affect you in PvE then maybe you need to git good with your rotations. Idk, maybe start playing content without any proc sets to improve your skill level.

Here's the thing.

It wasn't OP in PVE. It didn't need nerfed.

And telling people to git gud is an excuse for jumping on a bandwagon. The game was designed around the proc sets being used as DPS. ZOS keeps puting these building blocks there for us to use, then suddenly making them disappear.

Git gud at arguement and understanding of basic design.

But... Is is OP in PvE, hence the nerf. It's obviously a L2P issues if you can't clear content without it. People were destroying content before proc sets and if you can't then you need abut more practice...

Riga_Mortis

Will the no crit affect sets like Burning Spellweave? As in when the set procs from flame ability and grants me spell power, will I not crit at all for those 8 seconds the buff is active?

eagles9595b16_ESO

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Reykice wrote: »

Valve wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

Proc sets

The fact you think any crafted 2 piece set is going to be anywhere near comparable to the extra dps a 2 piece monster helm has even with the crit nerf says it all. Even with the nerf nothing is going to come close.

People will still run undaunted, for keys, for fun?, For achievements and undaunted exp.

The non crit monster set nerf will not affect tanks or healers in any way...

The nerf will only be a small dps loss overall. The world isn't going to end, all content isn't suddenly going to be impossible either. All thats going to change is that someone builds will be less effective and complete OP aoe monsters thanks to sets like ilambris and grothdarr. Every has done content before proc sets dealt as much damage as they did, they'll continue to do them.

How do you know that crafted set will not be as good or even better than any monster set ?
TBS set with another crit or penetration/crit set may do the job.
Not going to lie, I'm not good at math but I know 2 players with web sites that will for sure do the math for people like me and I'll see what they may conclude.

Running undaunted for Key ? well we'll see how many dungeon are worth running them for the helmet or keys.
Archievements ? lol I've never run anything for the archievement..it's just a bonus not something that help you in PVE.
Undaunted exp ? well just run the quest that the NPC gives you and you'll be fine.

Healer and tank : I have 1 tank and 2 healers, they help me to find group faster and have keys and monster helmet in Vet pledge dungeons. If I stop running undaunted pledges..and others like me do the same, well you're right it'll not impact anything.

I've never said that contents will be impossible to do... but tell me who will do Direfrost in vet or hard mode after the nerf ?
Basically the fight last too long.. she'll overheal your dps most of the time.. not even mentioning that in this combat most do it with 3 dps and 1 heal overwise you can forget to kill her.
What about all those bosses which are a dps race ? hu ? cradle of shadow, White Gold Tower, ICP etc. woot it'll be big fun to run all theses dungeon in normal mode only !

" Every has done content before proc sets dealt as much damage as they did, they'll continue to do them."
Are you sure, ZOS changed all bosses health etc.. world boss are now with +1 million health.
So you think that all ZOS changes were not related to the fact that monster set or overland set could help people to compensate the buff on bosses ?

Anyway, we'll see how many monster set or overland set are worth farming after the patch.
As I said, I hope that ZOS will compensate the proc crit nerf by adding more raw damages or reduce the cooldown (or whatever) on monster set.

DPShiro

Dazza1968 wrote: »

Will the no crit affect sets like Burning Spellweave? As in when the set procs from flame ability and grants me spell power, will I not crit at all for those 8 seconds the buff is active?

No, that's a fixed bonus so it won't be affected.
For example it gives you 600 Spell damage when procced, it can't crit and give you more so it should be unaffected.

AzraelKrieg

Dazza1968 wrote: »

Will the no crit affect sets like Burning Spellweave? As in when the set procs from flame ability and grants me spell power, will I not crit at all for those 8 seconds the buff is active?

No. That's not the case. Your skills will still crit as per usual, just sets that deal damage or heal from a proc such as Malubeth, Tremorscale or Valkyn Skoria won't crit.

Flameheart

Sigtric wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

OrphanHelgen wrote: »

Is this affecting the procs of enchants as well, as maelstrom bow the bonus dmg tics or just a simple poison dmg enchant?

Nifty2g wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Nifty2g wrote: »

We are going to be making some changes to these sets to balance out their burst potential. When the update hits, any set that has a damage or heal proc component to it will no longer crit in PVE or PVP. We chose this direction as we like the concept of these sets and still want them to be interesting and viable, we just wanted to tone down their overall burst potential. (sustain is slightly reduced, while burst potential is significantly reduced)

I feel this is another "one step forward, two steps back" type of deal. While I agree it is good for PVP I feel as if this is impacting PVE in ways it shouldn't. And honestly, I don't think removing the crit component is going to fix the issue for PVP, but it sure is going to fix and break a lot of the PVE gameplay.

PVE is in a great place right now, crit matters a lot, why remove one of the core things that make up PVE gameplay? Instead of just making use of that battle spirit passive to balance things within Cyrodill. This just further proves you can't balance a game for PVE and PVP espeically this far into the game and the changes being added.

On the PVE side, It's about a 7-8% nerf to sustain from

That's per person, imagine a 7% nerf for all 8 DPS in your raid -- that is quite large.

All in all I think this change is barely going to change anything in Cyrodill like it's meant to but its going to be pretty awful in PVE, and I think you guys should look for different ways to balance it. And keep Cyrodill balance out of PVE. We should have moved away from this in 2015.

(Why not make it so they can't crit on players only???)

It's 7-8% overall dps loss using 3 sets. On an actual end game trial build with 1 proc set, it'll be like 3% dmg loss overall, plus the cp cap may increase so the actual dps loss shouldn't be noticeable.

Where are you getting the numbers from, Grothdarr is doing upwards of 10% of your DPS, while the average PVE player runs around with 65-75% crit chance (more with raid buffs)

Not to mention minor force AND major force is not going to work on these sets anymore this is upwards of a 6% damage nerf per player from using these sets.

I think a lot of people are missing the point on how awful a decision this is when its completely changing PVE more than PVP.

Lambert posted a parse with Kraugh, Red Mountain, Viper. 78% crit, nearly 100% uptime on minor force and 30% uptime on warhorn.



As I stated to another poster, perhaps Grothdarr and Ilambris were over performing?

Grothdarr and Ilambris are strong but they don't need this much of a nerf, infact none of the undaunted sets needs this much of a nerf. Are you forgetting the patch they buffed them because they were too weak. Now they will all be useless.

That screenshot does not include Major Force uptime or Shadow Mundus Stone.

I do not think this was a smart decision because for 1) This wont fix PVP unless there is an ICD 2) It *** PVE over pretty largely when you take into consideration of all the other monster sets that are not as good.

Welcome back Molag Kena meta, I did not miss you.


You're also not helping by missing the point and saying it needed a nerf, do you honestly think it needed this much of a nerf for PVE? Ripping core mechanics out of sets and applying that into PVE. Cmon, we're better than that as a community to let this big of a change impact the content this much.
Balance the sets properly instead of half assing them with a PVP change to make them useless. Go over them and reduce their damage, then handle the PVP situation as well.

How is removing crit off of the proc damage messing with the core mechanic? That (insert set here) set is going to still be doing it's tooltip damage. It's not affecting crit off of anything that actually matters (your skills).

Monster sets will still be viable providing their auxiliary set buffs and DPS.

Proc sets are a crutch to begin with.

Nope, there will be a 2 x 5-set meta + 1 vMSA meta or 1 x Monster set for stat increase. Maybe just Molag Kena will survive (and I hate it to be a slave to that ressource stressing proc). My farmed monster sets (even twice for fitting to BSW and TBS), my mats to make them legendary and my time I invested for that -> for nothing.

The posted Combat Metrix screen shot has a 30% warhorn uptime (Major Force) and sets like Grothdarr, Ilambris etc. already lose over 50% of its dps and they rely on crit and crit damage enchancers. They will be futile.

nordsavage

Koensol wrote: »

Sad to see all the knee-jerk overreaction from the PvE crowd. Just because you didn't ask for a nerf of proc sets in PvE, DOESN'T mean ZOS automatically agrees with you. This always amazes me about the forums. Do you really think they don't know PvE and PvP can be balanced seperately? They obviously did this for a reason.

A little less damage doesn't hurt too much imo. A group with all dps in full proc sets will completely anihilate PvE content. This change will not suddenly make them hit like wet noodles. Everyone will have forgotten about this nerf after 1 week. You will see.

For now, let's just be happy ZOS listened to our feedback and came up with a sneak peak.

Here is the deal. Some of us have been on this game for so long we can tell off hand how things will be effected. A little less damage makes or breaks elite content runs. Go do some research on crit: CP, class and racial passives, abilities and buffs to see that it is not just a little bit of damage but actually significant amounts. If you think this will cool after a week you were not here for the stamina changes to blocking.

This also means having to carry lesser plays even more.

soll

That's some total crap update for PVE. Make your mind, ZOS

Glamdring

I hope they fix nb cloak aswell so i can slot this signature class skill again. So much broken *** pull u out of cloak which makes it totally useless at endgame pvp

leepalmer95

nordsavage wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Sad to see all the knee-jerk overreaction from the PvE crowd. Just because you didn't ask for a nerf of proc sets in PvE, DOESN'T mean ZOS automatically agrees with you. This always amazes me about the forums. Do you really think they don't know PvE and PvP can be balanced seperately? They obviously did this for a reason.

A little less damage doesn't hurt too much imo. A group with all dps in full proc sets will completely anihilate PvE content. This change will not suddenly make them hit like wet noodles. Everyone will have forgotten about this nerf after 1 week. You will see.

For now, let's just be happy ZOS listened to our feedback and came up with a sneak peak.

Here is the deal. Some of us have been on this game for so long we can tell off hand how things will be effected. A little less damage makes or breaks elite content runs. Go do some research on crit: CP, class and racial passives, abilities and buffs to see that it is not just a little bit of damage but actually significant amounts. If you think this will cool after a week you were not here for the stamina changes to blocking.

This also means having to carry lesser plays even more.

You've seen the dps comparison posted by lambert right?

Using a triple proc build with warhorn uptime and major force uptime he lost 7.3% dps.

7.3% on a full proc build, how much do you think people will lose of proper end game builds with 1 proc set?

Flameheart

Xsorus wrote: »

I love that people think that Non Critting Proc sets won't make them usable in PVE anymore lol

The reason for this might be, that you do not understand PvE game mechanics.

Koensol

nordsavage wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Sad to see all the knee-jerk overreaction from the PvE crowd. Just because you didn't ask for a nerf of proc sets in PvE, DOESN'T mean ZOS automatically agrees with you. This always amazes me about the forums. Do you really think they don't know PvE and PvP can be balanced seperately? They obviously did this for a reason.

A little less damage doesn't hurt too much imo. A group with all dps in full proc sets will completely anihilate PvE content. This change will not suddenly make them hit like wet noodles. Everyone will have forgotten about this nerf after 1 week. You will see.

For now, let's just be happy ZOS listened to our feedback and came up with a sneak peak.

Here is the deal. Some of us have been on this game for so long we can tell off hand how things will be effected. A little less damage makes or breaks elite content runs. Go do some research on crit: CP, class and racial passives, abilities and buffs to see that it is not just a little bit of damage but actually significant amounts. If you think this will cool after a week you were not here for the stamina changes to blocking.

This also means having to carry lesser plays even more.

My point is that people hate change. The funny thing is, you never hear new people cry about things such as no stamina regen on block. Because that is just the way the game was when they started playing. People just cannot always handle change. This whole thing will eventually blow over. Adapt and overcome is what wins the race in the end. Maybe ZOS will adjust some of the mobs strength in trial to compensate for it if it does indeed turn out to be too much of a nerf. Or they could buff other things to compensate. Maybe just wait what "other changes to balance" will be included in the next update. This was just a sneak peak anyway.

teladoy

They've could at least say something about stamina and magicka, and what are more or less the Plans to balance them... I'm not saying they have to be specifics, but at least some information.

reiverx

I'm beginning to think this change is going to be a drop in the ocean compared to what's coming in the so-called balance patch.

pattyLtd

how will this effect sets like scatching mage will our skills not crit for duration the 5th bonus is active or is this not a proc set?

If it is i hope they know what they are doing because this will most likely lead to a whole sh1tload of unexpected results again for us to deal with for the rest of the year.

HakaiDo

PvP right now is an absolute sht show and proc sets are a very very big cause of this problem.

However, removing the ability for sets to crit is not the solution.

The real problem is the raw damage numbers are way over the top. Compare them to old real proc sets like Sycarra's Scale. 5% Chance! to deal 7.5k Damage over time!
Now we have Viper wich is guaranteed damage!! There isn't even a chance this thing will not fire. Same *** with Widowmaker. On top of ridiculous meta-poisons that increase your Magicka cost by 60% you get 7.7k damage. It's not damage over time, either, it's direct *** damage.

Now tell me, how in the world does removing crit from proc sets solves anything.

I take 5k damage from Viper, 6k crit. Yeah, better remove crit because that is the *** problem. Good job, you should get a raise.

Enslaved

Tumorscale on my stam DK will still work just fine, with its perma snaring. Maybe will change viper for something sexier, 7th legion or senche, idk. Will keep Vicecannon, since its healing is usefull no matter what.

MrCray78

@ZOS_RichLambert Hello,sorry but with procs change you save pvp and kill pve because no way people use a grothdarr for 2800 damage tic or a Llambris for 1100×2 tic because now Monster Set is the BIS Items and there is no way people make undaunted if there is no loot interesting in the end.

Return to 2 Kena,5 TBS or 5 TA and 4 Moondancer
Or 5 TBs or TA and 5 MoonDancer + 1 Kena

ku5h

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

ku5h wrote: »

When you think about it. Any 1 single proc set is not OP, but multiple proc sets are. They go and nerf all proc sets across the board making them less viable. Now running 1 proc set wont be viable any more, but stacking multiple procs will be only way to go about it. So in retrospect, what they wanted to prevent they just made only way to go, stack multiple proc sets or dont use them at all. Just give us GCD on procs................................................................pleeeeeeeease.

Actually no.

The percentage nerf you receive is much larger the more proc sets you run.

Just looking at the stamina proc sets Lambert used in his parse it appears it would be a 2-3% loss per proc set used. Using 3 proc sets netted a 7.3% loss, using only Kraughs would have been a 2% loss.

It is worse stacking proc sets which is kind of exactly what they intended.

I was talking about PvP! 1 proc set in PvP wont give you enought burst any more to be viable, but stacking 2-3 will still get the job done.

quake89

leepalmer95 wrote: »

nordsavage wrote: »

Koensol wrote: »

Sad to see all the knee-jerk overreaction from the PvE crowd. Just because you didn't ask for a nerf of proc sets in PvE, DOESN'T mean ZOS automatically agrees with you. This always amazes me about the forums. Do you really think they don't know PvE and PvP can be balanced seperately? They obviously did this for a reason.

A little less damage doesn't hurt too much imo. A group with all dps in full proc sets will completely anihilate PvE content. This change will not suddenly make them hit like wet noodles. Everyone will have forgotten about this nerf after 1 week. You will see.

For now, let's just be happy ZOS listened to our feedback and came up with a sneak peak.

Here is the deal. Some of us have been on this game for so long we can tell off hand how things will be effected. A little less damage makes or breaks elite content runs. Go do some research on crit: CP, class and racial passives, abilities and buffs to see that it is not just a little bit of damage but actually significant amounts. If you think this will cool after a week you were not here for the stamina changes to blocking.

This also means having to carry lesser plays even more.

You've seen the dps comparison posted by lambert right?

Using a triple proc build with warhorn uptime and major force uptime he lost 7.3% dps.

7.3% on a full proc build, how much do you think people will lose of proper end game builds with 1 proc set?

He lost 7.3% dps on a 30 - 35% warhorn up time rather than a full 90 - 100% now I'm not saying that end game pve players are going to experience ground breaking dps losses without pts testing we can really say how or what the performance of sets are going to be.

What I will say is that they completely missed what the community was calling for and that's adding a global cool down. Again this is fine if they wanted to adjust over performing sets Individually but what they chose to do was provide a quick fix band aid.

There were a few certain sets that were over performing and they gutted already under performing sets so unless they are buffing those we still have the imbalance between proc sets.

Until full patch notes are released its hard to have an informed opinion but I am concerned that they haven't taken the time to individually adjust over performing sets but chose the ah will shove a quick band aid over everything and call it OK approach.

Ragnaroek93

The proc set change is a good thing in my opinion. Problem with a global cooldown would be, that viper tanks would still be incredible strong and could replace Selene or Tremo with something that makes them even more tanky (hello troll king) and go for more dmg from other sources. Problem with dots from procs would be, that it would only help builds with high shields or spammable burst heal, medium armor builds would still suffer a lot from the pressure.
To all people who say that this won't change anything: I'm sure it will, even with a lot of impen crit is incredible strong and people won't die without any crits in a burst combo.

Next things that should get nerfed: Ganks, Destro Ult and vit pots.

Kas

Really love the bug fixes.
However, while I don't think the balance changes are bad, I think they don't really have the effect that's needed:

1) poisons really favor the side with larger numbers and resoruce cost poisons overperform in duels. it's nice to fix some psn abuse while ganking but I don't think it's the major issue here.

2) aoe caps are FAR less relevant since VD etc have been introduced (thankfully! nice work there). on top of it, soo many skills have had their radiuzs reduced (talons -> batswarm -> impulse -> steel tornado). thus, relaxing the caps mostly affects the only skill that's still huge: destro ult. I don't think this particular one needed a buff in any way...

3) proc sets are so strong because of their balance around cooldowns over their chance to hit. the chances are FAR to high and significantly favor a pvp playstlye (selfheal, selfbuff, dodge, move, kite all that has top be mixed up with attacking) on top of that, huge bursts are incredibly strong, this part of their strenght in pvp has been mentioned many times, already. sure, the nerf is welcome but I especially w.r.t impen and transmutation, it is a nerf that affects PvE MORE than PvP - and that's entirely the wrong way round...

Getsome122

Thanks for letting us know you guys have ONCE AGAIN bowed down to the crying masses and are taking another step forward to completely ruining the game.
Well played zeni well played. How about we just remove all the sets completely, take away weps and we all fight with our fists... oh wait people will still cry when they lose a fight then as well. Pathetic.

These update notes get more depressing every time I read them. Oh but we are getting housing, wonder how much *** that will break that you'll never fix

ManDraKE

Getsome122 wrote: »

Thanks for letting us know you guys have ONCE AGAIN bowed down to the crying masses and are taking another step forward to completely ruining the game.
Well played zeni well played. How about we just remove all the sets completely, take away weps and we all fight with our fists... oh wait people will still cry when they lose a fight then as well. Pathetic.

These update notes get more depressing every time I read them. Oh but we are getting housing, wonder how much *** that will break that you'll never fix

explain me how nerfing a few sets "ruins the game"? LOL, stop overreacting dude

Flameheart

Sigtric wrote: »

nordsavage wrote: »

Proc sets not criting in PvE is stupid, beyond stupid. What the hell am I supposed to do with builds like my stamplars that relies on Selenes and Alkosh with Leviathan. You just wrecked my ***. Alkosh is a crit and proc damage set all in one do you see how backwards your decisions are? ZOS you guys keep making more and more bad decisions. Your inability to separate PvP problems from PvE continues to diminish the game.

Precise, Thief and Shadow mundus, CP passives, Undaunted helms sets, 5 piece sets with procs, Sets with crit in them all going down the drain. The undaunted sets alone are 1/3 -1/4 of our setups.

This should have been a battle spirit nerf to base damage of proc sets to PvP ONLY. I bet this is them taking the easiest/laziest way to reduce these sets. More PvP garbage being taken out on PvE.

Time to go back to stacking weapon/spell power.

stacking weapon and spell power should be the way to go

if you are broken because gear proc'd damage doesn't crit anymore: LOL

Nothing ever said this was meant to fix PVP either. Proc is out of control in PVE too but it's not mentioned much because it's not killing other players.

I vote this for BoM (B.u.l.l.s.h.i.t. of the Month).