Update 13 - Sneak peak notes

TequilaFire

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Dev wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Dev wrote: »

SnubbS wrote: »

I honestly want to know what you even do in ESO if you aren't PVPing. Unless you're a part of a raid group that's competing for top 5 scores -- I honestly don't get it. Even though the PvP in this game is a laggy, terrible broken mess -- I can't even think of something else to do when I play it.

The other 95% of the game content, and i am being generous giving pvp 5%.

As always you give no data to back up your numbers claim and obviously since you don't PvP you have never seen how many actually do play.

The lead developers do PvP so I am glad you will be disappointed as there will be no PvP removal.

What's with the Dev handle anyway? Hope it is short for Devon as not impressed you try to act like a developer.

An ignorant response at best.... considering i was specifically asked what I did in the game and not about the populations.
Fact is there are what 5 zones per alliance, so 15 zones there, plus coldharbor and the 3 expansion zones, for a total of 19 zones and that is assuming i didnt forget any, versus two zones... factor in all the quests in cyrodil as that is PVE content in a pvp zone, the reality is maybe 2% of the content in the entire game if even that is pvp.

I love how the pvp players want to try and act like i never entered the zone... did it ever occur to you that most of my animosity towards pvp is because how bad it was implemented? My chars are in AD, and every time i entered cyrodil, it is always a mess. Red and blue own 80% of the map, AD is barely holding onto any of the map, and there is some type of moronic obsession with sej bridge... FFS the entire AD could be on the bridge and they would still lose it... complete and utter garbage. I loved the AD story line, but seriously they cant get it together for more then 2 minutes in cyrodil... Now i am sure there are some organized people who run something, but the 20 or so times i was there, i didnt see it.

The fact i love is how most of the pvp players want to say that they wanted to pvp the 'Elder Scrolls' way, but have completely overlooked that Elder Scrolls meant play as you want, aka no classes to balance. The entire game would have been much better without classes... The point is that it is not 'PVPing in an elder scrolls game' as much as it is 'pvping in a typical & broken rpg format with an elder scrolls theme'. Any and all games that try to mix the PVE trinity and pvp are doomed to suck.

This is made very apparent in ESO since there is such a divide in builds for pvp vs PVE. A LA Mag sorc doesnt work very well in pvp does it, nor would a HA Mag sorc work at all in PVE, especially with all the meta FoTM crap. They have forced the decision to either be a pvp or PVE build with the restrictions to change attributes, CP, and skills. You cant just swap to whatever content you want when it costs over 25k per swap to do it right... its not worth it nor is it fun.

The point you brought up about the developers playing pvp: The biggest reason eso is failing is that those developers are too worried about buffing and protecting their enjoyment to maintain this as a good game. A lot of PVE players are sick and tired of the lazy development practices and are not going to tolerate the 'more of the same' forever. So if they want to focus on what they enjoy in a game as opposed to producing a product that entices customers to stay, based on demographics and 'where the money comes from', then they deserve to be replaced.

Bottom line is that we shouldn't be paying so that the developers can have fun after work. Their job is to keep us, the customers happy after the customers have finished their day job. The sooner ZOS realizes this, the less they will have a need for crown store/cash grabbing crates and could actually provide some decent end game content.

As for my name, seriously is the best you can do is make fun of my name.... what is this, grade school?

Wall of text, got under your skin huh?

Sorry bud a lot of us paid for a game with both PvE and PvP in it and our money is just as good as yours, in other words
PvP players are customers just the same as you. (If you even play this game at all.)
You have a hate and fixation on getting rid of PvP a mode lot of us enjoy that seems to border on sickness.
Don't like it don't play it if you are so afraid of interacting with real players.

One more thing, developers are human beings and passionate gamers as well otherwise they would not be game developers in the first place. Who are you to tell them what to do after work.

Bottom line is PvP is in the game whether you like it or not.

@TequilaFire

That does not mean it needs to monopolize balance, dev time, and everything else. Taking a hatchet to everything to appease one audience that only 20% of the game is built for, is madness.

And sorry to say, if you wanted a PVP experience, far better games than this one would suit.

Well first I am for balancing PvP and PvE separately as that would only improve PvP and take away this crutch where certain PvE players want to lay personal blame and insults on PvP players.

It would also make it easier for everyone to understand why something was being nerfed/balanced in each mode instead of this mistaken idea it was done solely for PvP sake. Don't you think the lead PvE devs would fight back if that was the case?

And by no means is it evident that ESO/TU developers have spent anywhere near the time on PvP as they have on PvE.

This game had/has some of the best large scale PvP when it is working right and is a lot of fun even though frustrating at times as anyone who has played it for as long as some of us have will tell you.

I have had more long term friends in guilds in PvP than I ever had in ESO PvE as we tend to be a tighter group fighting fo a campaign rather than leaderboard position or time. That said I have also enjoyed playing PvE casually since beta.

Doctordarkspawn

TequilaFire wrote: »

Doctordarkspawn wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Dev wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Dev wrote: »

SnubbS wrote: »

I honestly want to know what you even do in ESO if you aren't PVPing. Unless you're a part of a raid group that's competing for top 5 scores -- I honestly don't get it. Even though the PvP in this game is a laggy, terrible broken mess -- I can't even think of something else to do when I play it.

The other 95% of the game content, and i am being generous giving pvp 5%.

As always you give no data to back up your numbers claim and obviously since you don't PvP you have never seen how many actually do play.

The lead developers do PvP so I am glad you will be disappointed as there will be no PvP removal.

What's with the Dev handle anyway? Hope it is short for Devon as not impressed you try to act like a developer.

An ignorant response at best.... considering i was specifically asked what I did in the game and not about the populations.
Fact is there are what 5 zones per alliance, so 15 zones there, plus coldharbor and the 3 expansion zones, for a total of 19 zones and that is assuming i didnt forget any, versus two zones... factor in all the quests in cyrodil as that is PVE content in a pvp zone, the reality is maybe 2% of the content in the entire game if even that is pvp.

I love how the pvp players want to try and act like i never entered the zone... did it ever occur to you that most of my animosity towards pvp is because how bad it was implemented? My chars are in AD, and every time i entered cyrodil, it is always a mess. Red and blue own 80% of the map, AD is barely holding onto any of the map, and there is some type of moronic obsession with sej bridge... FFS the entire AD could be on the bridge and they would still lose it... complete and utter garbage. I loved the AD story line, but seriously they cant get it together for more then 2 minutes in cyrodil... Now i am sure there are some organized people who run something, but the 20 or so times i was there, i didnt see it.

The fact i love is how most of the pvp players want to say that they wanted to pvp the 'Elder Scrolls' way, but have completely overlooked that Elder Scrolls meant play as you want, aka no classes to balance. The entire game would have been much better without classes... The point is that it is not 'PVPing in an elder scrolls game' as much as it is 'pvping in a typical & broken rpg format with an elder scrolls theme'. Any and all games that try to mix the PVE trinity and pvp are doomed to suck.

This is made very apparent in ESO since there is such a divide in builds for pvp vs PVE. A LA Mag sorc doesnt work very well in pvp does it, nor would a HA Mag sorc work at all in PVE, especially with all the meta FoTM crap. They have forced the decision to either be a pvp or PVE build with the restrictions to change attributes, CP, and skills. You cant just swap to whatever content you want when it costs over 25k per swap to do it right... its not worth it nor is it fun.

The point you brought up about the developers playing pvp: The biggest reason eso is failing is that those developers are too worried about buffing and protecting their enjoyment to maintain this as a good game. A lot of PVE players are sick and tired of the lazy development practices and are not going to tolerate the 'more of the same' forever. So if they want to focus on what they enjoy in a game as opposed to producing a product that entices customers to stay, based on demographics and 'where the money comes from', then they deserve to be replaced.

Bottom line is that we shouldn't be paying so that the developers can have fun after work. Their job is to keep us, the customers happy after the customers have finished their day job. The sooner ZOS realizes this, the less they will have a need for crown store/cash grabbing crates and could actually provide some decent end game content.

As for my name, seriously is the best you can do is make fun of my name.... what is this, grade school?

Wall of text, got under your skin huh?

Sorry bud a lot of us paid for a game with both PvE and PvP in it and our money is just as good as yours, in other words
PvP players are customers just the same as you. (If you even play this game at all.)
You have a hate and fixation on getting rid of PvP a mode lot of us enjoy that seems to border on sickness.
Don't like it don't play it if you are so afraid of interacting with real players.

One more thing, developers are human beings and passionate gamers as well otherwise they would not be game developers in the first place. Who are you to tell them what to do after work.

Bottom line is PvP is in the game whether you like it or not.

@TequilaFire

That does not mean it needs to monopolize balance, dev time, and everything else. Taking a hatchet to everything to appease one audience that only 20% of the game is built for, is madness.

And sorry to say, if you wanted a PVP experience, far better games than this one would suit.

Well first I am for balancing PvP and PvE separately as that would only improve PvP and take away this crutch where certain PvE players want to lay personal blame and insults on PvP players.

It would also make it easier for everyone to understand why something was being nerfed/balanced in each mode instead of this mistaken idea it was done solely for PvP sake. Don't you think the lead PvE devs would fight back if that was the case?

And by no means is it evident that ESO/TU developers have spent anywhere near the time on PvP as they have on PvE.

This game had/has some of the best large scale PvP when it is working right and is a lot of fun even though frustrating at times as anyone who has played it for as long as some of us have will tell you.

I have had more long term friends in guilds in PvP than I ever had in ESO PvE as we tend to be a tighter group fighting fo a campaign rather than leaderboard position or time. That said I have also enjoyed playing PvE casually since beta.

There's a reason I dont think the PVE devs would fight back.

Simply put: Left hand dont tell the right hand what it's doing. ESO has all the signs of mismanagement and disconnect. This is one of those times, blanket calls probably made from on high without any consulting the devs or the players.

As for personal insult and blame, be real. PVP players can and have been howling for balance changes souly for PVP's benefit for ages, on many more games than this. It's an ignorant claim to say it's a 'crutch', it's truth. If I tried, I could likely go and pick out examples of it on this forum and others, but that'd also be naming an shaming, and too much time. I urge you to search, you'll find it in abundance.

As for the rest I generally agree. I'd love for this game to be balanced seperately. For Cyro to have a PVE campaign and for PVP to be free of the scourge that is PVE influence.

Kalante

crit nerf LOL! those 3k viper stings sure are going to make a difference compared to the 5k ones.. Did yall forget you can stack procs huuuuuuuuh???!! All people asked was to make proc sets like tremor scale, viper, and widowmaker to be changed and also nerf templar healing and destro ultimate.

Bam_Bam

beeyoodaful changes. i don't give a rats [snip] about PvE and its nice to see some sweet PvP-centric changes for once.

[Edit to remove profanity]

LegacyDM

nosourcenopath wrote: »

If you are worried about the hours and hours you spent playing the same rote dungeon boss mechanics to get some specific piece of gear that would magically make you a great player, next time try spending those hours and hours actually learning how to play with your class and weapon abilities in a useful, interesting and skillful way.

Shhhhh. I know who you are...

Sandman929

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

We chose this direction as we like the concept of these sets and still want them to be interesting and viable

The most disappointing part; seeing in writing that the people at ZOS like the idea of RNG doing their killing for them.

The_Last_Titan

Did some numbers using the stamsorc numbers provided, on average each 5 piece of kragh, viper, red mountain added 6.886340251461842% total dps before crit was removed, and 4.00563252784832% after, by subtracting each of the proc sets dps from the overall numbers then dividing the number left by the procs damage and dividing 100% by that number, then divided by 3. 6.88% damage does not seem overly powerful. I don't have the numbers tested but i would think 5 piece hundings would add around that same amount to single target, not even mentioning the boost aoe damage from 4+ enemies.
the burst might be a problem, but im hoping there are other solutions being worked on like cutting all cooldowns in half plus the damage in half, ones like widow would be made into a dot because of it mechanics, and ones with short cool downs like poisonous serpent would have the % chance of activating doubled instead.

Nocturnalan

Sheezabeast wrote: »

buh-bye crit heals from Chokethorn and Troll-King

Got rid of my Chokethorn already, went to 5xSPC and crafted 5XJulianos with a Kena Monster helm for the extra spell and weapon damage. Seems like a safe viable healer set.

Paneross

I thought Troll King was Health Recovery buff, a set number which can't crit.