What's the state of Pvp in your opinion?

ChildOfLight

Playing Eso for 1 year, usually watching top Pvpers'streaming, but never approched PvP myself.
I was thinking something like: "I want to get a good build in order to compete on equal term with those bad bruhs" . Well, this can be questionable, to be honest, but the fact is that I played pve for about all the time since the beginning and I enjoyed that.

Yesterday I decided to give a try to it with my full build Magika Sorc (5 julianos gold, 2 Nerien, 3 willpower) and I found it NOT FUNNY.
Yes I may be not good at the game and this would end up in bad results in pvp, but I would like to underline some points that are not l2p issue related, in my opinion.
How can I play on the same terms against stamina characters if they can dodge roll 16 times, CC break 12 times and still spam Vigor 5 times while animation cancelling at me Swallow sould, Terror, dawnbreaker and executioner. Approximating for excess I can dodge roll and cc break 1 time.

After some of this kind of experiences, I decided I was doing something wrong. Maybe I should get the distance and throw my rotation from far away, maybe from behind some ally guys.
The exact same guy of the previous example, switching bar, started spamming Snipe from a distance none of my skills cant compare.

So, my question is: what's the point of playing a magika sorc if stamina based characters prevale in every aspect?
More damage, better resource managing, same or better skills from the distance . In which aspect a magicka sorc really shines over stam characters?

Of course, these are only impressions from my point of view. What frustrates me is that after enjoying so much the storyline and the pve in general, I cant do the same with PvP cause of its (apparently) unbalance. And all the time spent in the PvE suddendly appears senseless.

I would appreciate your points of view, over, eventually, some build suggestions.

Tryxus

PvP: Proc Vs Player

White wabbit

Tryxus wrote: »

PvP: Proc Vs Player

No get it right ! Proc's vs Player ( Zerg)

hrothbern

ChildOfLight wrote: »

Playing Eso for 1 year, usually watching top Pvpers'streaming, but never approched PvP myself.
I was thinking something like: "I want to get a good build in order to compete on equal term with those bad bruhs" . Well, this can be questionable, to be honest, but the fact is that I played pve for about all the time since the beginning and I enjoyed that.

Yesterday I decided to give a try to it with my full build Magika Sorc (5 julianos gold, 2 Nerien, 3 willpower) and I found it NOT FUNNY.
Yes I may be not good at the game and this would end up in bad results in pvp, but I would like to underline some points that are not l2p issue related, in my opinion.
How can I play on the same terms against stamina characters if they can dodge roll 16 times, CC break 12 times and still spam Vigor 5 times while animation cancelling at me Swallow sould, Terror, dawnbreaker and executioner. Approximating for excess I can dodge roll and cc break 1 time.

After some of this kind of experiences, I decided I was doing something wrong. Maybe I should get the distance and throw my rotation from far away, maybe from behind some ally guys.
The exact same guy of the previous example, switching bar, started spamming Snipe from a distance none of my skills cant compare.

So, my question is: what's the point of playing a magika sorc if stamina based characters prevale in every aspect?
More damage, better resource managing, same or better skills from the distance . In which aspect a magicka sorc really shines over stam characters?

Of course, these are only impressions from my point of view. What frustrates me is that after enjoying so much the storyline and the pve in general, I cant do the same with PvP cause of its (apparently) unbalance. And all the time spent in the PvE suddendly appears senseless.

I would appreciate your points of view, over, eventually, some build suggestions.

If you are new to PVP...

start like an ordinary Joe

Don't look too much to Hollywood stars on stream
Don't try to kill that one person that is better

Just start learning
going through all different kind of situations that you see other people doing around you
and watch around you to your fellow Aliance players

And if you die to often/fast... slot some more defensive stuf

And Nerienth will do you no good in PVP

Tryxus

ChildOfLight wrote: »

Yesterday I decided to give a try to it with my full build Magika Sorc (5 julianos gold, 2 Nerien, 3 willpower) and I found it NOT FUNNY.

Julianos really isn't a good set for PvP, due to the fact that most ppl prefer to use Impenetrable gear which counters the Spell Crit bonuses Julianos gives. I would personally go for more sustain, like Lich or Seducer, and mix that with a strong set like Necropotence

For a Sorc, Illambris is definitely the best monster helm out there. Nerien'eth is kinda bad in PvP since most ppl will just dodge roll out of the crystals the moment they see the red circle underneath them. Other good monster sets are Valkyn Skoria or Infernal Guardian.

geonsocal

magsorc is fun (love the fireworks display they put out)...plus, maybe the most challenging class at the moment to play in cyro - maybe not the best character to start out pvping with...much safer to go with a heavy armor stamplar or dk if unfamiliar with pvp...

Taylor_MB

I don't know any rotation that can break a sorcs shield at range. Shield up and drop deadric mines until you become more comfortable with PvP. It's a VERY steep learning, we were all face rolled for a long time before we improved.

Julianos

PVP is dead huge imbalance lag stupid items that procs and kills people stupid AC mechanics for exploit you can gear up like a tank and burst like a best DPS in this game. Its not PVP its ZvP = ZOS versus Players. Because they control those items and release them without testing any crap and then some smartass people starting to exploit ZOS' amateur job then they call it meta
but if there is a meta in a game that means there is a certain class or setup is OVER POWER to the others which can be called IMBALANCE. But people are like sheeps they just follow what is so called META actually what is OP.

WillhelmBlack

Even impenetrable traits won't save you. Reroll stamina get a 2h and S&B viper weapons and jewellery, tremorscale and a set of black rose. You will at least have a chance then.

Julianos

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Even impenetrable traits won't save you. Reroll stamina get a 2h and S&B viper weapons and jewellery, tremorscale and a set of black rose. You will at least have a chance then.

this^

psychotic13

Magsorcs are great in PvP, and have great survivability too. Are you using shields? PvP also takes a lot of practice to get good.

DKsUnite

i logged on to play pvp for the first time in OT. Every death recap was the same, proc sets, NBs, healing debuffs and the same skills used by everyone. It took an hour before i logged off.

ChildOfLight

psychotic13 wrote: »

Magsorcs are great in PvP, and have great survivability too. Are you using shields? PvP also takes a lot of practice to get good.

Actually my two bar are:

Main bar - prismatic flame staff precise with cloudy damage health poison 9 (I am not able to end the Malestrom arena yet)

Crystal fragment
Crushing shock
Flame clench
mages' wrath
Lightining Flood
Energy overload

Second bar - Resto staff

Restraining prison
Healing ward
Hardened ward
Streak
Daedric Minefield
Suppression field

Tryxus wrote: »

ChildOfLight wrote: »

Yesterday I decided to give a try to it with my full build Magika Sorc (5 julianos gold, 2 Nerien, 3 willpower) and I found it NOT FUNNY.

Julianos really isn't a good set for PvP, due to the fact that most ppl prefer to use Impenetrable gear which counters the Spell Crit bonuses Julianos gives. I would personally go for more sustain, like Lich or Seducer, and mix that with a strong set like Necropotence

For a Sorc, Illambris is definitely the best monster helm out there. Nerien'eth is kinda bad in PvP since most ppl will just dodge roll out of the crystals the moment they see the red circle underneath them. Other good monster sets are Valkyn Skoria or Infernal Guardian.

I will definetevely look for Ilambris set but I am not sure of switching Julianos for Seducer or Lich since my already low damage would fall to peak. I have not many problems with mana sustain since I am using magicka recover drinks.
My stats are:

Max magicka 33k spell damage: 1778
Health 11.7 k Spell crit: 44.2
Stamina 9.5 k Magika recover: 2594 (buffed)

ChildOfLight

WillhelmBlack wrote: »

Even impenetrable traits won't save you. Reroll stamina get a 2h and S&B viper weapons and jewellery, tremorscale and a set of black rose. You will at least have a chance then.

This was my first thought too, sadly.

psychotic13

You're set up is completely wrong for PvP that's why you're are finding it difficult.

You don't need abilities like lightning flood, they are to easy to move out of for players they're not as stupid as mobs and will just stand in there taking damage.

Nerien'eth and the mentioned Ilambris are good for sorcs yes, but only in PvE for PvP as a sorc you want to be using infernal guardian or Molag Kena.

Use food, your health is really low so you'll get killed so quickly you won't even have time to react. (Or even use the Halloween recipe to give health Magicka and Magicka recovery)

Your damage is also very low, most people's are double that. Are you using spell damage enchants on your Jewelery? Do you have a gold weapon?

There are a lot of things to take into account here.

Also, put hardened Ward on the front bar, you'll stay alive a lot more often, and also use the other damage shield 'annulement' in the Light Armor skills on the back bar. This is were the sorcs survivability comes from, shields. Speaking of shields make sure you have champion points into bastion to make them bigger. (shields also scale from max Magicka, so the higher your Magicka the bigger your shields, the more damage you can take)

That should give you a start, any questions just ask

Vythri

With 11k HP, I can one-shot you all day. That hp needs to be at least doubled to even have a chance to stay alive.

Alucardo

Rohamad_Ali

Honestly I don't know how I win sometimes . Keeping distance is important and the rest is probably waiting for them to make a mistake .

Tryxus

Alucardo wrote: »

That first hint should be changed to: "When faced with multiple Radiant Destruction spammers, try just giving up since the odds are definitely not in your favor."

failkiwib16_ESO

Truth is pvp is more balanced now than ever in the game, and it's still a mess.

You can still have tons of fun joining your friends, or random pugs who want extra help in their team regardless of how good or bad your build & gear is for pvp, and just do lowscale pvp for fun ...if you wish to earn AP and become the next emperor, then you should reconsider build & gear and listen to the folks in the posts above mine.

I pvp so rarely, that I can't be bothered to gear up for it. I just rush in with healing gear as a DD and I have tons of fun, either alone or I team up with randoms or friends that I meet there. The most fun I've had in pvp was with a lowbie group of level 17-20 players, where I was the only one with CP and we fought an emperor from opposite faction.

Sometimes we won, sometimes the emperor wiped us all - we had so much fun regardless, and I handed out grand soul gems to my group mates, as some of them didn't have those Not everyone you meet in pvp are fully pvp geared, it's very chaotic.

THEDKEXPERIENCE

Take about 1000 points of magic regen and turn it into more magic or spell power. Get your health to 20k in Cyrodiil at least. I wear Julianos and I'm at 46k magic, 3k spell power while in battle, and under 1000 regen. Just heavy attack with a resto staff to get back magic at range. Doing any or all of these things will help you immensely. Also immovable pots.

Remember ... PVP IS HARD.

You cannot expect to just walk on in and dominate ... or just be average. Some people have 1000 hours of a head start. You have to be ready for anything at a moments notice. Find some safety in numbers. Start small. Have fun. You'll figure it out eventually.

ZOS_DaryaK

We removed a few posts that were not contributing to this discussion in a meaningful way.

WalksonGraves

PVP is that nuisance grind to get rank 6 for stam builds. 90% of pvp skill is being in a horde, 10% lag.

Ch4mpTW

To answer your question OP, I feel that the current state of PvP is very bad and unbalanced. It's become a state of "Proc Vs. Proc", and essentially people using their sets to do the majority of the damage for them (e.g. Viper, Tremorscale, etc.). Throw that in with the fact that the majority of players who PvP are stamina and not magicka, and you have an unbalanced recipe for complaints and frustration.

Pheefs

Meh.
PvP is meh, in my opinion.

I still scout & siege a bit, but that's all.


& now with OT, I'm expecting to do it even less.

Panth141

Rant/essay:

For the past couple of years I've enjoyed PvP more than any other content - the need for you to compete using your own skill had made it the real 'end game' for me. Sure, I ran dungeons and farmed what needed farming in PvE, but it was all focused on improving PvP play.

Over the past month - and even more so over the last week - I've become incredibly disaffected with PvP. There has always been a 'meta', but you've also always been able to combat it in some way. You could always get through it and have some success with enjoyable, skill-based builds. Even when your class/build was in a bad place, if you knew it well then you could make it work - and make it work well. When Malubeth was broken, you could stack debuffs and time your burst cleverly. When shuffle/major mending stamDKs/Templars were an issue, you could avoid their LoS traps and exploit their mis-timed heals. When (and still..) Templars stack jesus beams on you, you can interrupt their channel and watch as they struggle to remember what their other buttons do. Now? Now you're fighting against players with incredible defence from HA, incredible sustain from HA, and frankly obscene burst from proc sets. What is the counter to that? Don't hit them so their Wrath/Constitution passives don't activate? Don't get hit so that their procs don't work?

After 1T dropped on PS4, I hopped on my trusty PvP mDK. Sure, open world he can falter a bit, but he takes pride in 1v1 combat - he uses HA (not BR) but loses out on damage and (some) sustain from doing so. I hopped into a few duels - killed a few sorcs, had a few long - but successful - fights against tankier builds. Then in comes a CP ~300 stamina NB. Black rose, Viper, Velidreth. By no means a 'unique' build. As a HA mDK, my burst is somewhat lackluster - this is my problem - had it been a bit higher I could've gotten through his heals. But every 4-9 seconds, without fail, in comes the viper + veli proc. Being tanky and with good dueling heals from Embers, I could make it through - and I did so for the first 10-15 combos - I just couldn't punch through his damned resistances. Eventually he gets a lucky proc and I drop after about 20 minutes. Feeling a bit disheartened I took a break for the night.

Next evening- someone has obviously stalked Fengrush/Sypher's channel and farmed throughout the night. Sword & Board stamDK. I've seen those videos too, so I had no doubts what I was going up against. Sure enough, procing all over the place - eventual death recap - Tremorscale, Viper, Dawnbreaker (with a little reverb bash thrown in). As there was no Widowmaker, I can only assume that Black Rose was thrown in there. I'm not sure which is better.

So to answer your question, OP - after a few more nights and many more similar duels, plus a fair amount of time in Cyrodiil, I respecced my mDK for PvE. This meta is horrible and those who don't conform to it - excluding those very skilled players - are absolutely gimping themselves beyond measure. Pretty soon I expect that those who refuse to use these builds will vacate Cyrodiil, and everyone else will switch to them. To those people, I say enjoy the proc race - I truly hope that you manage to get your procs off slightly before the other guy does.

Doctordarkspawn

It's horrible. Then again, it was allways going to be.

When you are ballancing for both PVE and PVP it'll allways suck. I dont think the proc sets are the problem. I think it's ZOS's absolute refusal to seperate the two. The disabling of proc sets in PVP area's would be fine, maybe even just localized to helm sets, but again, the problem is twofold. One. They wont seperate them. Two. PVP needs to have a dominant strategy. If you give people enough variables and no turning point, no fulcrum, people will battle...forever. Because no one has a clear advantage that breaks the deadlock. Proc sets have become the deadlock-breaker, and people will whine about it continously, even as it's needed for PVP to function.

You cannot complain about the duels that last 15 minutes then complain when they add a way to end them. Be carefull what you wish for.

zyk

failkiwib16_ESO wrote: »

Truth is pvp is more balanced now than ever in the game, and it's still a mess.

I disagree completely. Stam has been buffed (ults, abilities, sets) and Magicka nerfed (single target proxy det, shields) since 2.3..

Stam was given an advantage in 1.6, but it was somewhat balanced by some of the factors listed above. IMO, 1.6 through 2.2 was the best balanced ESO PVP has been.

sirston

the fact that people can spam arrow ablitys and my reflect cant block them.....

Lord_Hev

Yeah..... 33k magic is not going to cut it. You need to run CP 150 purple food and get your sustain from somewhere else. Your small magic pool severely nerfs your damage on top of giving you weak shields that any light attack will break.

Elong

There's a lot wrong with pvp, but this discussion from a 1st time player with those stats isn't going to bring any balance to the force.