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Wow costume dyes require crown store or ESO plus ?
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Transairion✭✭✭✭✭No we don't. We are just sick of people complaining that subs get perks that they don't when it is there own fault for not subbing. I mean come on its 50 cents a day. How can people not afford that and if the truly can't afford it then they should not be spending their time on a video game
No need to sugar coat it, a lot of subs are just themselves entitled and think because they pay nobody should ever get a "handout": even if other people also pay! But bring on the age-old "you must be too poor to sub so stop whining", prices differ wildly around the world so what's cheap as chips for you is an actual investment for someone else.
And truth be told? Some of us just don't sub because we know when ESO closes (because MMO's don't last forever, sorry to say) we won't be down hundreds/thousands of dollars like subs will.
Getting pretty sick of developers for subscription-optional games trying to cram as much base-game features as possible under the sub banner though. That just makes me not play, it doesn't suddenly make me want to pay more and sub.4 -
mike_de✭✭✭EstelioVeleth wrote: »Thank you @Clarkieson you were putting far better than I ever could.
I agree completely, it is our fault. Zos sees that we keep on supporting them and not only, thanking them for broken or expensive content that should have been there by default so obviously this will never change. Thank you community, you guys are absolutely awesome. I really wonder how those players that dont visit the forums feel about everything that ZOS is doing. Yes ZOS, there are other people that play your games not just these ones that write on the forum.
And a side note, stop comparing real life things with a game. Yes in real life you buy a piece of clothing and you can dye it how you want by buying the dye. But this is not real life, its a game, where you pay the same amount of money for a hairstyle (soon) or an npc that you do for another FULL GAME.
I personally call this behavior greedy. It's worse than selling "horse armor". And remember the fact, that Only 2-4% of all people ever voice their opinion in a forum. But each voice speaks for many others. Regardless of the opinion somebody has about something.
And yes, the current state of this inferior software product is the fault of the people, still pumping money into it. The developers don't need to change anything, because gamers nowadays are used to eat ***, and even thank the offenders for it.
Their faulty speed hack detection suspends even legal players now.
... Their ONLY fault was, that they were so unwise to play on a crowded, laggy region of the game ....
And instead of fixing 2 year old bugs, they port them to the console, too. Pure genius. Now they do the same as WB did in Batman Origins ... they only pump out more DLC, instead of fixing the laggy engine with the framedrops, possible caused by memory leaks.
And .... it works, thanks to the new generation of [snip] gamers. Numbed by DLC, early fraudcess, DLC hell and other modern gaming abominations like selling full games in slices. I personal think ... or hope, that we aren't far away from a massive gaming industry crash. The moment even the last casual gamer understands, that he gets permanently screwed by these companies.
[minor edit for profanity]Edited by ZOS_CoriJ on June 25, 2016 5:07PM1 -
SwaminoNowlino✭✭✭✭✭@Niastissa I do have a point. My point is read up on sunk cost. Prior decisions and money spent should have no bearing on future investment decisions as they would prevent you from making beneficial choices. If you chose to purchase DLCs in the past, knowing what you did, then that's on you. If ESO+ is now a better value to you, because they added costume dying which is pay2win, then the obvious choice is to sub.
Applying your argument to real life would be like saying airplane baggage fees are unethical. At one point airlines didn't charge baggage fees, the tickets were just more expensive. Then they moved to a new model.Xbox NA : CP 160 StamPlar, MagNB, MagSorc, StamSorc, StamDK, StamNB, Level 10 MagDK & MagPlar, StamWarden, MagWarden
"We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome." - The Balance Lord Wrobel
- And now it sure does, better learn how to bash folks!
I get by with a little help from logic.2 -
FLuFFyxMuFFiN✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »Oh wow how rude of us, to think cosmetic things are a must have in a role playing game!
What is rude is to believe that everything must be free
Because buying once as a perk from the crown store means its free?
No wait I forgot that you subs think its only your money that counts.
No we don't. We are just sick of people complaining that subs get perks that they don't when it is there own fault for not subbing. I mean come on its 50 cents a day. How can people not afford that and if the truly can't afford it then they should not be spending their time on a video game.
Dude, all your DLCs get unlocked automatically, you get 1000 or 1500 crowns every month that you can use later on to buy the dlcs permanently or something else, plus crafting bags, and a 10% experience gain on top, you guys also got loyalty mounts etc... HOW IS THAT NOTHING? Is it really us non subs that have to "get off our high horses" or is it you?
Sometimes its not even about the money, maybe people buy more crowns than you pay per year for a sub, the whole thing is just to show that yes in the end it is unfair how we are treated as if we dont help the game when maybe we do more than you. And please dont start again with "subs are more loyal because you always pay" no, its not a contract you can stop your sub at any time just like we can stop buying crowns at any time. Zos CLEARLY said that they are interested in the people that want to play for like 3 weeks etc not actually giving a damn about hardcore players, so how do you feel for supporting a company that told you in the face they dont give a damn about you?
I pay the sub and pay another $40 per paycheck on crowns so that's about $100 a month I am spending on this game. I could say the same about non subs that they think subs don't buy extra crowns and only use the 1500 they are given every month.1 -
CherryCake✭✭✭✭✭
✭EstelioVeleth wrote: »Thank you @Clarkieson you were putting far better than I ever could.
I agree completely, it is our fault. Zos sees that we keep on supporting them and not only, thanking them for broken or expensive content that should have been there by default so obviously this will never change. Thank you community, you guys are absolutely awesome. I really wonder how those players that dont visit the forums feel about everything that ZOS is doing. Yes ZOS, there are other people that play your games not just these ones that write on the forum.
And a side note, stop comparing real life things with a game. Yes in real life you buy a piece of clothing and you can dye it how you want by buying the dye. But this is not real life, its a game, where you pay the same amount of money for a hairstyle (soon) or an npc that you do for another FULL GAME.
I personally call this behavior greedy. It's worse than selling "horse armor". And remember the fact, that Only 2-4% of all people ever voice their opinion in a forum. But each voice speaks for many others. Regardless of the opinion somebody has about something.
And yes, the current state of this inferior software product is the fault of the people, still pumping money into it. The developers don't need to change anything, because gamers nowadays are used to eat ***, and even thank the offenders for it.
Their faulty speed hack detection suspends even legal players now. ... Their ONLY fault was, that they were so unwise to play on a crowded, laggy region of the game ....
And instead of fixing 2 year old bugs, they port them on the console, too. Pure genius. Now they do the same as WB did in Batman Origins ... they only pump out more DLC, instead of fixing the laggy engine with the framedrops, possible caused by memory leaks.
And .... it works, thanks to the new generation of *** eating gamers. Numbed by DLC, early fraudcess, DLC hell and other modern gaming abominations like selling full games in slices. I personal think ... or hope, that we aren't far away from a massive gaming industry crash. The moment even the last casual gamer understands, that he gets permanently screwed by these companies.
You dont even know how much I hope for the same as you!I like sweetrolls and I cannot lie0 -
Alurria✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lol...yes I did. Did you not read I don't think I need school especially since I attended my 40th high school reunion not long ago. I think you may need to slow down and quit skimming while reading. At this point I feel like you may bust a vein raging. So I will leave you alone with your thoughts...0 -
Niastissa✭✭✭SwaminoNowlino wrote: »@Niastissa I do have a point. My point is read up on sunk cost. Prior decisions and money spent should have no bearing on future investment decisions as they would prevent you from making beneficial choices. If you chose to purchase DLCs in the past, knowing what you did, then that's on you. If ESO+ is now a better value to you, because they added costume dying which is pay2win, then the obvious choice is to sub.
Applying your argument to real life would be like saying airplane baggage fees are unethical. At one point airlines didn't charge baggage fees, the tickets were just more expensive. Then they moved to a new model.
I know what sunk cost is. My response to you was no *** that is why I'm upset.That is exactly what it is because they lied and said the sales of DLC content would be on par with the subscription. This was not the case and in fact a lie, i.e. unethical.
your example doesn't apply. Past flights on a air liner are not the same thing as buying DLC for a game. Past flights are not an investment in a airline. Hence a baggage fee now isn't unethical because you flew with them before. Apples and oranges.Edited by Niastissa on June 25, 2016 2:53PM1 -
CherryCake✭✭✭✭✭
✭FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »Oh wow how rude of us, to think cosmetic things are a must have in a role playing game!
What is rude is to believe that everything must be free
Because buying once as a perk from the crown store means its free?
No wait I forgot that you subs think its only your money that counts.
No we don't. We are just sick of people complaining that subs get perks that they don't when it is there own fault for not subbing. I mean come on its 50 cents a day. How can people not afford that and if the truly can't afford it then they should not be spending their time on a video game.
Dude, all your DLCs get unlocked automatically, you get 1000 or 1500 crowns every month that you can use later on to buy the dlcs permanently or something else, plus crafting bags, and a 10% experience gain on top, you guys also got loyalty mounts etc... HOW IS THAT NOTHING? Is it really us non subs that have to "get off our high horses" or is it you?
Sometimes its not even about the money, maybe people buy more crowns than you pay per year for a sub, the whole thing is just to show that yes in the end it is unfair how we are treated as if we dont help the game when maybe we do more than you. And please dont start again with "subs are more loyal because you always pay" no, its not a contract you can stop your sub at any time just like we can stop buying crowns at any time. Zos CLEARLY said that they are interested in the people that want to play for like 3 weeks etc not actually giving a damn about hardcore players, so how do you feel for supporting a company that told you in the face they dont give a damn about you?
I pay the sub and pay another $40 per paycheck on crowns so that's about $100 a month I am spending on this game. I could say the same about non subs that they think subs don't buy extra crowns and only use the 1500 they are given every month.
Yes but you must understand that also not every sub does that. So if you or me buy a s.hitton of crowns doesnt mean that everybody does it. And you also ignored completely all my other points.Edited by CherryCake on June 25, 2016 2:52PMI like sweetrolls and I cannot lie0 -
Mureel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »Oh wow how rude of us, to think cosmetic things are a must have in a role playing game!
What is rude is to believe that everything must be free
Because buying once as a perk from the crown store means its free?
No wait I forgot that you subs think its only your money that counts.
No we don't. We are just sick of people complaining that subs get perks that they don't when it is there own fault for not subbing. I mean come on its 50 cents a day. How can people not afford that and if the truly can't afford it then they should not be spending their time on a video game.
Dude, all your DLCs get unlocked automatically, you get 1000 or 1500 crowns every month that you can use later on to buy the dlcs permanently or something else, plus crafting bags, and a 10% experience gain on top, you guys also got loyalty mounts etc... HOW IS THAT NOTHING? Is it really us non subs that have to "get off our high horses" or is it you?
Sometimes its not even about the money, maybe people buy more crowns than you pay per year for a sub, the whole thing is just to show that yes in the end it is unfair how we are treated as if we dont help the game when maybe we do more than you. And please dont start again with "subs are more loyal because you always pay" no, its not a contract you can stop your sub at any time just like we can stop buying crowns at any time. Zos CLEARLY said that they are interested in the people that want to play for like 3 weeks etc not actually giving a damn about hardcore players, so how do you feel for supporting a company that told you in the face they dont give a damn about you?
So Then Sub. Problem solved. I've already posted the math on the cost of ALL DLCS vs subscription and subscribers DO pay substantially more. Period.
Choose to try and get a better deal by buying DLC and there you go.
Also, I'd bet anything that if people bought as many crowns as they say they do when finding a reason to complain, then ZOS wouldn't be making such things to make subs so enticing.
They would have put more in the Crown store.
Their financial people want the subs for a reason.2 -
Kalifas✭✭✭
1.That's an option and the only option if this game was sub only(it is going there)but wouldn't fix the problem because if you unsubscribe you lose features.Towerdragon wrote: »Towerdragon wrote: »
Dear mr. White knightTowerdragon wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Towerdragon wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Solid_Metal wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »
how the hell you are screwed?, care to elaborate?
Sure, I'll elaborate. I'm screwed because I invested dollars and crowns into buying DLC that are effectively WORTHLESS if I end up having to subscribe every month anyway in order to experience the whole game. The crafting bag is a gigantic "F U" to everyone who got conned into purchasing the DLC... this costume dye thing is just adding insult to injury.
I could say the exact same thing about my Sub if i drop my sub I lose access to all content (so that makes my sub worthless?) i dont understand your gripe sorry.
Your subscription is just a rental, but I purchased DLC with the idea that I OWNED them. Now ZOS is twisting my arm to try to make me pay RENT on something I already OWN. You don't see the problem with that?
Did you read the ToS? You bought a license to use the content. And ZOS controls the content. From the ToS:
By creating an Account, You agree that You do not own the Account, any user names created on the Account, any Content stored or associated with an Account (such as digital and/or virtual assets, achievements, virtual currency, and other Downloadable Content), or related data associated with the Account. ...
You agree that You have no ownership right or title in or to any such Downloadable Content, including, but not limited to, the virtual goods appearing or originating in the Services (such as a Game) or any other attributes associated with any Account or Services. ZeniMax does not recognize any purported transfers of virtual property executed outside of the Game, or the purported sale, gift or trade in the "real world" of anything that appears or originates in a Service or a Game. Accordingly, You may not sell, and You may not assist others in selling, Service(s) or in-Game items for real currency, or exchange those items for value outside of the Services. Evidence of any attempt to redeem Downloadable Content for a purported exchange, sale, gift or trade in the "real world" will result in the immediate suspension or termination of Your Account.
3. Limited License to Use
Subject to the terms in these Terms of Service and Your compliance with all of the terms and conditions in these Terms of Service, ZeniMax grants to You, for Your personal and private use only, a non-exclusive, revocable, nontransferable license to use Services (including any Content which is made available by ZeniMax (including but not limited to Game Mods that You download from a ZeniMax website) as a part of a Service and then solely in connection with such Service) as set forth in these Terms of Service.
Fromt he EULA:
Ownership of the Game.
ZeniMax and its licensors are and will continue to be the owner of all right, title, and interest in and to the Game and the Service, including without limitation all intellectual property rights and moral rights in and to the Game and all copies thereof (including without limitation any titles, software programs and code, Game related themes, characters, character names, character likenesses, stories, dialog, catch phrases, locations, concepts, artwork, character inventories, structural, landscape and other designs in the Game, animations, sounds, musical compositions and recordings, audio-visual effects, storylines, methods of operation, and any related documentation). The Game is protected by the copyright laws of the United States, international treaties and conventions, and other laws. The Game may contain materials licensed by third parties, and the licensors of those materials may enforce their rights in the event of any violation of this Agreement. This paragraph will survive the termination of this Agreement. You acknowledge and agree that you have no interest, monetary or otherwise, in any feature or content contained in the Game. As further described in the ZeniMax Terms of Service, but subject to the Statutory Obligations (as defined in Section 1 of the ZeniMax Terms of Service), ZeniMax may change, modify, suspend, or discontinue any aspect of the Game at any time and ZeniMax may also impose limits on certain features or restrict your access to parts or all of the Game without notice or liability.
these people will not listen to reason
What do you mean these people?
Owning a perpetual license is the same thing as buying a single player game. So yes we are justified in being upset after buying a perpetual license for content we are being strong armed into paying for a rental license to access the same content.
A few months ago you people where the ones clamoring about how awesome the buy to play model was.
No original thought just think how the company tells you to think.
What he means by that is this kind of practise should never be encouraged by us (players).
If we accept this then be prepared for more $$$ to come with an increase in price.
There is nothing wrong with a subscription based game - what is wrong is a free to play game - because it is long term more expensive and less enjoyable than a subscription game - IMO. You cannot expect a good service, if you are not willing to pay for it, simple as that. All what seems to be free, has somewhere something what will bother you until you finally pay - and often more than you would have had to pay in a subscription game.
But this is a B2P game!. I don't mind these kind of things to be there for a F2P game.
Just look at barbershop! We have to purchase real money to get those changes.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/274575/no-barber-shop-confirmed#latest
Well of course - they put in effort and that costed money to create these features - why do you expect them to do that for free. If you have to do over-time for your boss, do you expect him to pay you for this extra effort or are you saying, well, you paid me already, all fine, so I work this over-time for free for you. - You don't, and why do you expect ZOS to do over-time for free just because you paid for the game already.Towerdragon wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Towerdragon wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »Solid_Metal wrote: »Emma_Overload wrote: »
how the hell you are screwed?, care to elaborate?
Sure, I'll elaborate. I'm screwed because I invested dollars and crowns into buying DLC that are effectively WORTHLESS if I end up having to subscribe every month anyway in order to experience the whole game. The crafting bag is a gigantic "F U" to everyone who got conned into purchasing the DLC... this costume dye thing is just adding insult to injury.
I could say the exact same thing about my Sub if i drop my sub I lose access to all content (so that makes my sub worthless?) i dont understand your gripe sorry.
Your subscription is just a rental, but I purchased DLC with the idea that I OWNED them. Now ZOS is twisting my arm to try to make me pay RENT on something I already OWN. You don't see the problem with that?
Did you read the ToS? You bought a license to use the content. And ZOS controls the content. From the ToS:
By creating an Account, You agree that You do not own the Account, any user names created on the Account, any Content stored or associated with an Account (such as digital and/or virtual assets, achievements, virtual currency, and other Downloadable Content), or related data associated with the Account. ...
You agree that You have no ownership right or title in or to any such Downloadable Content, including, but not limited to, the virtual goods appearing or originating in the Services (such as a Game) or any other attributes associated with any Account or Services. ZeniMax does not recognize any purported transfers of virtual property executed outside of the Game, or the purported sale, gift or trade in the "real world" of anything that appears or originates in a Service or a Game. Accordingly, You may not sell, and You may not assist others in selling, Service(s) or in-Game items for real currency, or exchange those items for value outside of the Services. Evidence of any attempt to redeem Downloadable Content for a purported exchange, sale, gift or trade in the "real world" will result in the immediate suspension or termination of Your Account.
3. Limited License to Use
Subject to the terms in these Terms of Service and Your compliance with all of the terms and conditions in these Terms of Service, ZeniMax grants to You, for Your personal and private use only, a non-exclusive, revocable, nontransferable license to use Services (including any Content which is made available by ZeniMax (including but not limited to Game Mods that You download from a ZeniMax website) as a part of a Service and then solely in connection with such Service) as set forth in these Terms of Service.
Fromt he EULA:
Ownership of the Game.
ZeniMax and its licensors are and will continue to be the owner of all right, title, and interest in and to the Game and the Service, including without limitation all intellectual property rights and moral rights in and to the Game and all copies thereof (including without limitation any titles, software programs and code, Game related themes, characters, character names, character likenesses, stories, dialog, catch phrases, locations, concepts, artwork, character inventories, structural, landscape and other designs in the Game, animations, sounds, musical compositions and recordings, audio-visual effects, storylines, methods of operation, and any related documentation). The Game is protected by the copyright laws of the United States, international treaties and conventions, and other laws. The Game may contain materials licensed by third parties, and the licensors of those materials may enforce their rights in the event of any violation of this Agreement. This paragraph will survive the termination of this Agreement. You acknowledge and agree that you have no interest, monetary or otherwise, in any feature or content contained in the Game. As further described in the ZeniMax Terms of Service, but subject to the Statutory Obligations (as defined in Section 1 of the ZeniMax Terms of Service), ZeniMax may change, modify, suspend, or discontinue any aspect of the Game at any time and ZeniMax may also impose limits on certain features or restrict your access to parts or all of the Game without notice or liability.
these people will not listen to reason
What do you mean these people?
Owning a perpetual license is the same thing as buying a single player game. So yes we are justified in being upset after buying a perpetual license for content we are being strong armed into paying for a rental license to access the same content.
A few months ago you people where the ones clamoring about how awesome the buy to play model was.
No original thought just think how the company tells you to think.
What he means by that is this kind of practise should never be encouraged by us (players).
If we accept this then be prepared for more $$$ to come with an increase in price.
There is nothing wrong with a subscription based game - what is wrong is a free to play game - because it is long term more expensive and less enjoyable than a subscription game - IMO. You cannot expect a good service, if you are not willing to pay for it, simple as that. All what seems to be free, has somewhere something what will bother you until you finally pay - and often more than you would have had to pay in a subscription game.
But this is a B2P game!. I don't mind these kind of things to be there for a F2P game.
Just look at barbershop! We have to purchase real money to get those changes.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/274575/no-barber-shop-confirmed#latest
Well of course - they put in effort and that costed money to create these features - why do you expect them to do that for free. If you have to do over-time for your boss, do you expect him to pay you for this extra effort or are you saying, well, you paid me already, all fine, so I work this over-time for free for you. - You don't, and why do you expect ZOS to do over-time for free just because you paid for the game already.
I hate it when people apologize for companies. Are you so indoctrinated that you no longer have compassion towards people who got ripped off?
Just because you didn't get cheated doesn't mean what ZOS did was ethical.
I bought DLCs as well and was not subscribed until ZOS announced crafting bags as a subscription only perk and said, there will be more useful perks in future - and I immediately subscribed, I did not wait for the crafting bag, I made a leap of faith, no longer buying any more DLCs but trusted into that ZOS will get this right - you had the same chance, didn't you?
As a matter of fact no I didn't. When I was buying all the DLC on Wednesday of this week and dropping over a hundred dollars on this game the DLC section failed to mention that they are not feature complete.
The only place this is mentioned in the store is in the ESO + section. But why on earth would I go in there after I just got done buying all the DLC?
Yet some kid paying $15 is worth more then someone willing to spend more then just their allowance once a month and gets the royal treatment.
Whatever. I get it. I subscribed and won't be buying anymore crowns. Congratulations ZOS you lost yourself way more money then $77 over the course of six months. Plus thanks for the free crowns. I won't be wasting them on buying the DLC like the other person mentioned. That is beyond dumb especially doing it knowingly. Spending twice for the same content.
Calling people dumb is not constructive people can play however they want buying DLC or subbing and getting a monthly crown allotment and all future DLC released in the future as long as they keep the sub. If they can keep the quarterly release schedule then I'm going to be very happy.
Reading comprehension is not your strong point. I didn't call anyone dumb. I called the idea of paying for content twice dumb. Not the person.
Infinite crafting space is a minor convenience? No, minor would be 10 extra inventory spaces.
No next update after the upcoming one:NateAssassin wrote: »Subscribing to dye a costume, is this some sort of joke lol, what's next? Subs can only dye weapons?- Subscribers get their CP cap raised to 1002 with infinite enlightenment.
- Subscribers get 3 saved sets of champion points to swap between and no cost for re-doing Champion points.
- DLC buyers have to buy theirs at a rate of 1 crown for CP and capped at 990 CP with limited enlightment.
- DLC buyers can buy one saved set and a free one time champion point reset. Once used they need to repurchase it in crown store.
I always find it incredible how people make a massive leap from minor convenience/cosmetic perks to major P2W perks - but there is always hyperbole when something doesn't suit someones stand point!
Infinite Dying without losing dyes or having to buy over and over on the crown store is a minor convenience? No, minor would be 10 extra dye slots.
You're not getting the gist. The major inconvenience is crown buyers have to buy stuff on a micro level repeatedly. When Buy to play should be pay it once and you get the full feature until the servers close down.
Money is money. I think it's great subscribers help ZoS earn money. But so do DLC/Crown Store buyers. These are major features and should be purchasable in the crown store as a full blown DLC for 20-40 bucks, a convenience pack.
Gonna be hard to call yourself a fair hybrid model or pull in people who don't normally do mmos. When more and more keeps getting locked behind the monthly subscription. Subscription perks should be minor perks above purchasing the features not get exclusivity or be major perks.
ESO plus members complained that the sub was not worth it for minor progression bonus ZoS listened and have started giving ESO plus members what the asked for. Life is not fair and I have said it before investors dont really care able someone who randomly puts cash down in the store the sub is a much more concrete proof that the game is healthy. If you don't like it you have three options.
1. Sub to the game and get the bonuses
2. Play the game without the perks (something ESO plus members have done for 2 years)
3. Stop playing the game
These are all very simple choices. ZoS want people to sub that's the catch.
2.That's an option. You did it for two years, non ESO members will do it for all time.
3.That's an option, but if every non ESO member did that then the game goes back in the poopers like it did originally.
The most successful sub mmo right now is FFXIV. People don't sub to it because of the optional cash shop or perks. They sub to it because you have to sub to play at all and they have a very fluid and stable service, and tons of content, something ESO doesn't have.An Avid fan of Elder Scrolls Online. Check out my Concepts Repository!0 -
Mureel✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭arkansas_ESO wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »I already pay for the costumes, so why should I have to pay extra to customize them?
You don't have to as a subscriber - that is all what I can say to it.
If I subscribed, I'd be paying extra to customize the costumes that I already bought. Granted, there's other benefits for subbing, but, still, I'm paying extra to customize the stuff that I've already bought. It's just too much in my opinion.
no, i am not paying anything extra - I had to pay subscription before there was the option to dye costumes and I will have not a dime more when it will arrive - so it does not cost me anything extra - same price, but an extra feature more.
You made the decision to buy a non-dyable costume, and that is what you got, and what I got as well. Now there is a new feature, which is limited and costs extra for those non-subscribed, but is free for those who are subscribers - given that we have to pay as well, if we would want the stamp for a given color set, where we might not have the color for already.
So if you look at it like that, you got something extra for free as well - namely the option to dye a so far undyable costume. That feature does not come for free, but the option comes for free. I mean, it could be worse for you, it could be an ESO+ exclusive like the crafting bag, but it is not.
I guess we've got two different ways at looking at it then. To me, saying "Hey, you can now dye that costume you bought a few months back for just $15 a month!" is like saying "Hey, you remember that car you bought a while back? For just $15 a month, you can adjust the seats and the mirrors!" The dying system has been in the game before ESO+ was even an option, it's just that they've now extended it to costumes.
Invalid. It is actually like saying: Remember that car you bought awhile back? I'll rent you some fancy rims, some in-car storage areas and let you repaint it as often as you like for $15 a month.1 -
FLuFFyxMuFFiN✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »Oh wow how rude of us, to think cosmetic things are a must have in a role playing game!
What is rude is to believe that everything must be free
Because buying once as a perk from the crown store means its free?
No wait I forgot that you subs think its only your money that counts.
No we don't. We are just sick of people complaining that subs get perks that they don't when it is there own fault for not subbing. I mean come on its 50 cents a day. How can people not afford that and if the truly can't afford it then they should not be spending their time on a video game.
Dude, all your DLCs get unlocked automatically, you get 1000 or 1500 crowns every month that you can use later on to buy the dlcs permanently or something else, plus crafting bags, and a 10% experience gain on top, you guys also got loyalty mounts etc... HOW IS THAT NOTHING? Is it really us non subs that have to "get off our high horses" or is it you?
Sometimes its not even about the money, maybe people buy more crowns than you pay per year for a sub, the whole thing is just to show that yes in the end it is unfair how we are treated as if we dont help the game when maybe we do more than you. And please dont start again with "subs are more loyal because you always pay" no, its not a contract you can stop your sub at any time just like we can stop buying crowns at any time. Zos CLEARLY said that they are interested in the people that want to play for like 3 weeks etc not actually giving a damn about hardcore players, so how do you feel for supporting a company that told you in the face they dont give a damn about you?
I pay the sub and pay another $40 per paycheck on crowns so that's about $100 a month I am spending on this game. I could say the same about non subs that they think subs don't buy extra crowns and only use the 1500 they are given every month.
Yes but you must understand that also not every sub does that. So if you or me buy a s.hitton of crowns doesnt mean that everybody does it. And you also ignored completely all my other points.
When did I say subs get nothing though? Also subs don't get loyalty mounts. That was a loyalty program when subbing was mandatory. I am not saying non subs don't help the gamer or their money doesn't count but a steady flow of $15 a month looks better than someone maybe buying a crown pack here and there.0 -
SwaminoNowlino✭✭✭✭✭SwaminoNowlino wrote: »@Niastissa I do have a point. My point is read up on sunk cost. Prior decisions and money spent should have no bearing on future investment decisions as they would prevent you from making beneficial choices. If you chose to purchase DLCs in the past, knowing what you did, then that's on you. If ESO+ is now a better value to you, because they added costume dying which is pay2win, then the obvious choice is to sub.
Applying your argument to real life would be like saying airplane baggage fees are unethical. At one point airlines didn't charge baggage fees, the tickets were just more expensive. Then they moved to a new model.
I know what sunk cost is. My response to you was no *** that is why I'm upset.That is exactly what it is because they lied and said the sales of DLC content would be on par with the subscription. This was not the case and in fact a lie, i.e. unethical.
your example doesn't apply. Past flights on a air liner are not the same thing as buying DLC for a game. Past flights are not an investment in a airline.
Okie dokie. Appears you are approaching this from a balanced and rational mindset. Will simply bid you a good day.
For everyone else, this is such an incredibly minor thing to be upset about. By the logic some are applying there should be absolutely no benefit to subbing and people should just do it out of kindness. This game got along just fine for years without crafting bags or costume dying. I cancelled my sub over performance issues and bad customer service, and was able to play just fine without the crafting bag. It didn't keep me from questing or crafting gear or anything. You'll be fine without it.Xbox NA : CP 160 StamPlar, MagNB, MagSorc, StamSorc, StamDK, StamNB, Level 10 MagDK & MagPlar, StamWarden, MagWarden
"We want firing off Dark Exchange in the middle of combat to feel awesome." - The Balance Lord Wrobel
- And now it sure does, better learn how to bash folks!
I get by with a little help from logic.2 -
Transairion✭✭✭✭✭For everyone else, this is such an incredibly minor thing to be upset about. By the logic some are applying there should be absolutely no benefit to subbing and people should just do it out of kindness. This game got along just fine for years without crafting bags or costume dying. I cancelled my sub over performance issues and bad customer service, and was able to play just fine without the crafting bag. It didn't keep me from questing or crafting gear or anything. You'll be fine without it.
Oh, to be sure. But since it's such a minor (if beloved) QoL feature it's really hard to rationalize why it has to be a sub only feature outside company greed to charge more $.
You sure as heck can bet it'd be a base game feature, no sub required if the Crown Store Dye Stamps weren't going to be a thing. It's pretty much an excuse to sell dyes for $ in a game where dyes are already free.1 -
Easily_Lost✭✭✭✭✭This is for subbers and non-subbers alike. If you think the game is sooooo bad why are you here? It must not be that terrible, but if it is then I suggest you leave and go find a game that gives you everything for free.
Just my 2 cents worth.
And just to let you know I started ESO+ about 6 months ago to support the game.PC - NA - AD
started April 2015
PVE & Solo only
Meet the LOST family: CP 1250+
Easily Lost Crafter - lvl 50 - Sorcerer Orc ( knows all traits and most styles )
Easily Lost-W - lvl 50 - Warden Imperial
Forever Lost - lvl 50 Sorcerer
CROWN CRATES: It doesn't affect gameplay, it's not mandatory, it's cosmetic only. If it helps to support the game and ZOS, I support it! Say YES to crown crates.0 -
CherryCake✭✭✭✭✭
✭FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »FLuFFyxMuFFiN wrote: »EstelioVeleth wrote: »Oh wow how rude of us, to think cosmetic things are a must have in a role playing game!
What is rude is to believe that everything must be free
Because buying once as a perk from the crown store means its free?
No wait I forgot that you subs think its only your money that counts.
No we don't. We are just sick of people complaining that subs get perks that they don't when it is there own fault for not subbing. I mean come on its 50 cents a day. How can people not afford that and if the truly can't afford it then they should not be spending their time on a video game.
Dude, all your DLCs get unlocked automatically, you get 1000 or 1500 crowns every month that you can use later on to buy the dlcs permanently or something else, plus crafting bags, and a 10% experience gain on top, you guys also got loyalty mounts etc... HOW IS THAT NOTHING? Is it really us non subs that have to "get off our high horses" or is it you?
Sometimes its not even about the money, maybe people buy more crowns than you pay per year for a sub, the whole thing is just to show that yes in the end it is unfair how we are treated as if we dont help the game when maybe we do more than you. And please dont start again with "subs are more loyal because you always pay" no, its not a contract you can stop your sub at any time just like we can stop buying crowns at any time. Zos CLEARLY said that they are interested in the people that want to play for like 3 weeks etc not actually giving a damn about hardcore players, so how do you feel for supporting a company that told you in the face they dont give a damn about you?
I pay the sub and pay another $40 per paycheck on crowns so that's about $100 a month I am spending on this game. I could say the same about non subs that they think subs don't buy extra crowns and only use the 1500 they are given every month.
Yes but you must understand that also not every sub does that. So if you or me buy a s.hitton of crowns doesnt mean that everybody does it. And you also ignored completely all my other points.
When did I say subs get nothing though? Also subs don't get loyalty mounts. That was a loyalty program when subbing was mandatory. I am not saying non subs don't help the gamer or their money doesn't count but a steady flow of $15 a month looks better than someone maybe buying a crown pack here and there.
Ok maybe english mistake, when I say you I dont refer to you personally, I refer to the thousands of complaints from people all over the forum saying ESO+ memebers have no perks.
And we both know the other thing is not true. You can also buy packs of a 6 month sub which is 77 from what Ive seen from you guys and non subs can also buy the same amount at once, or in two payments, just as subs can decide not to sub anymore (you also see those threads once in a while) just like crown buyers decide not to buy crowns so what is the big point in the end? No your money is not more valuable than ours.I like sweetrolls and I cannot lie0 -
ZOS_CoriJ✭✭✭✭✭I apologize for the wait in responding to this thread. It has been a very busy morning:
While the intention of this topic is sound we feel that the subject has run its course. This topic has generated some very aggressive back and forth, and we feel it's best to let it rest.
Fortunately this topic is still alive and well in other threads. However, for future posts please be sure to be civil toward other opinions. We understand that when subs come into a discussion people have very strong opinions about it but this shouldn't include attacking and condescension toward opposing views.
Thanks for your patience in the wait.The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
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