Cheating and Exploits

Cazzy

Hey guys, I'm putting together a video series of exploiters in PvP. I have quite a collection already but want to offer the opportunity for others. If you have a video or screenshot you want to show PM me!

Exploiters beware...

clayandaudrey_ESO

Cazzy wrote: »

Hey guys, I'm putting together a video series of exploiters in PvP. I have quite a collection already but want to offer the opportunity for others. If you have a video or screenshot you want to show PM me!

Exploiters beware...

Completely awesome.

Cazzy

Also!:

I have created a Facebook group where we chat openly about exploiters, the repercussions, share screenshots and cheer one another up should we become frustrated or defeated

https://www.facebook.com/groups/PvPExploiters/

Surak73

Cazzy wrote: »

Hey guys, I'm putting together a video series of exploiters in PvP. I have quite a collection already but want to offer the opportunity for others. If you have a video or screenshot you want to show PM me!

Exploiters beware...

Good job!

NobleNerd

Cazzy wrote: »

Also!:

I have created a Facebook group where we chat openly about exploiters, the repercussions, share screenshots and cheer one another up should we become frustrated or defeated

https://www.facebook.com/groups/PvPExploiters/

Nice to see at least someone attempting to do something about it. We can't even get ZOS into this thread on a regular basis.

Roechacca

Cazzy wrote: »

Also!:

I have created a Facebook group where we chat openly about exploiters, the repercussions, share screenshots and cheer one another up should we become frustrated or defeated

https://www.facebook.com/groups/PvPExploiters/

This should be entertaining. Subscribed.

bryanhaas

I had a question regarding Sanctum and was directed here by a mod who has not answered my questions.

Here is my original post:

I would like someone from ZOS to respond:

Is running Sanctum with a level 45 as intended or is this considered an exploit? Also is this going to be patched or left like it is?

I just want some clarification one way or the other, if you intend to ban people doing the whole level 45 thing then maybe you should let us know it is not allowed.


So just trying to get some clarification that is not in the form of a ban.

Got my answer but did modify the title to be more descriptive.

Thanks to everyone for your answers.
Edited by bryanhaas on August 3, 2016 12:58PM

bryanhaas

Here is the Response I got:

Some Mod wrote:

As you may have noticed we have decided to close this thread.

Discussion of cheats and exploits are typically against our community guidelines.

Currently we have an official thread for the discussion of various in game exploits.

Please use this channel to continue your conversations regarding the issue.

So the person told me I can come here and discuss this further, I sent the mod a message but they chose not to respond. I just don't get why it is so difficult to just come out and say yes this is an exploit stop doing it or we could give a rat's arse but please don't go around telling people how to do this, I would willingly comply.

Dubhliam

@bryanhaas if you run normal trials, any level should be eligible to join.
Veteran versions should have only lvl 50+ players.

Qbiken

bryanhaas wrote: »

I had a question regarding Sanctum and was directed here by a mod who has not answered my questions.

Here is my original post:

I would like someone from ZOS to respond:

Is running Sanctum with a level 45 as intended or is this considered an exploit? Also is this going to be patched or left like it is?

I just want some clarification one way or the other, if you intend to ban people doing the whole level 45 thing then maybe you should let us know it is not allowed.


So just trying to get some clarification that is not in the form of a ban.

Got my answer but did modify the title to be more descriptive.

Thanks to everyone for your answers.
Edited by bryanhaas on August 3, 2016 12:58PM

Personally I´m not considering it as an exploit. If I´m correct those runs doesn´t count towards the leaderboards, and therefore does no harm. People downscale in order to get the gear they want not a big deal in my opinion to be honest.

Blo0dstorm

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

Wasalda

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

mook-eb16_ESO

I've read in another thread that basically ZOS reserves the right to instantly ban with out prior notice. Personally, I think banning a player who hasnt modified the client directly or indirectly or obtained significant benefit shouldn't instantly receive perma band without the right to apeal. Hacking a client or using cheat engine should be and instant ban however. Using a broken mechanic shoudl be a warning first off as the dev team have failed implement the game correctly and it maybe possible to do this inadvertently trigger these bugs. It would be good if zos sent out in game commination's to players via in game or external mail to update everybody and reiterate these facts instead of assuming that everyone reads the forums. I've spoken to people I've seen exploiting bugs in game mechanics and some of them don't appear to know that they are not valid mechanics as some of these bugs have been around a very long time and haven't been fixed. We would all rather see fixes than player bans for these problems I think.

Ackwalan

Wasalda wrote: »

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

You mean, a person claimed he was banned for leaping up a bridge. Since ZOS doesn't talk about it, that person can make any claim they want.

Blo0dstorm

Wasalda wrote: »

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

I thought a keep couldn't completely turn color when someone was hiding in but remained 'lit', with a little flame on the map.
Thx for the answer.

bryanhaas

Qbiken wrote: »

bryanhaas wrote: »

I had a question regarding Sanctum and was directed here by a mod who has not answered my questions.

Here is my original post:

I would like someone from ZOS to respond:

Is running Sanctum with a level 45 as intended or is this considered an exploit? Also is this going to be patched or left like it is?

I just want some clarification one way or the other, if you intend to ban people doing the whole level 45 thing then maybe you should let us know it is not allowed.


So just trying to get some clarification that is not in the form of a ban.

Got my answer but did modify the title to be more descriptive.

Thanks to everyone for your answers.
Edited by bryanhaas on August 3, 2016 12:58PM

Personally I´m not considering it as an exploit. If I´m correct those runs doesn´t count towards the leaderboards, and therefore does no harm. People downscale in order to get the gear they want not a big deal in my opinion to be honest.

That's what I was figuring and yeah since no vet not on the leaderboards. Just kinda *** they they close the thread insinuate exploiting / cheating but won't give a clear answer. It's like how can you follow the rules if they won't even clarify the rules. Whatever I'm never getting an official response so I'll just assume like everyone else does that it is all okie dokie.

Pomaikai

[Snip] is back on and cheating like there's no tomorrow on Trueflame. When you accepted his "apology" and "promise" not to cheat anymore, did anyone think to maybe follow up and check on him afterwards?

Really?


[Edit to remove naming and shaming]

Lyrander

vamp_emily wrote: »

I was grinding in coldharbor last week and seen a cheater ( or at least I thought he was cheating ).

I was grinding zombies and was following 2 other people around. I noticed one of them was acting kind of strange. They would move into the group of zombies and just stand there, and never fought.

Then I noticed that when the other guy would move then the other person would move. If he moved forward, the other would move forward. If he moved backwards, the other would move backwards.

Then I asked in zone chat, "are you cheating and using a bot?" Then I noticed the player who I thought was cheating started fighting. That lasted just a few minutes and then the character went back to following the other person and just standing in the middle of the zombies doing nothing.

Then an hour later the same guy had 2 other characters following him. I remember watching him a few times turning around to look at the other characters to make sure they were all moving on the same path.

you need to record something like this!
remember next time

AshTal

One of the issues I have with exploiters is I am never sure if they are cheating or just exploiting bad game mechanics. Like when someone can do 35K damage in 3 seconds in PvP by spamming a single attack. Is the game just that broken that they can do this or have they found an exploit? When one person out damages 5 people while healing everything they kick out is this cheating or has he just found a super build?

Also even when its a known bug it appears that cheaters get a 12 hour suspension after 3 months of ruining other peoples fun, so whats the point?

Dubhliam

AshTal wrote: »

One of the issues I have with exploiters is I am never sure if they are cheating or just exploiting bad game mechanics. Like when someone can do 35K damage in 3 seconds in PvP by spamming a single attack. Is the game just that broken that they can do this or have they found an exploit? When one person out damages 5 people while healing everything they kick out is this cheating or has he just found a super build?

Also even when its a known bug it appears that cheaters get a 12 hour suspension after 3 months of ruining other peoples fun, so whats the point?

First, let me break down the numbers you show here:
35k damage in 3 seconds is around 11.5k DPS. Even when we take into account the 50% damage reduction, that would be equivalent to 23k DPS in PvE.
23k DPS is nothing to be amazed with.

Next, I see people play the game for months and even years and still not know how to properly build their characters.
They simply make something out of whatever they have easily available, and if they think that works, they stick with it for the next year.
Even if that build sucks bigtime.
Honestly, I have gone into WGT today with a guy that actively plays ESO for at least one year, has over 501 CPs. Most of the time he spends in Cyrodiil.
I don't expect people to know the mechanics or have super DPS, but this guy could barely kill Lightning Aspect after 10 seconds, not evading lightning, but spamming Vigor to counter the DoT, and when he finally kills the Aspect, he is now out of stamina and continues to light attack Kena, although she is in her bubble.

I can imagine that once word got out people are using cheats, that this person was pointing fingers at anyone who killed him in Cyrodiil, while in fact, he is just a poor player.
And he's not alone, there are tons of players of that skill and mindset in ESO.

Yes, this could also be boiled down to one of ZOS' faults for giving the players so much freedom in building their characters, making the disparity from good to bad builds/players gigantic.
But I don't see anything they can do about that in Cyrodiil.
The only thing they could do, is increase the difficulty of the solo world content, so that people would e forced to learn and improve.

Then, and only then, when the players in ESO have somewhat similar knowledge of the game combat system and mechanics, can a person point a finger and say: "This guy is most definitely a cheater".

My guess is that ZOS is in a big of a mess right now with cheat prevention because they are overflowed with player reports of other players that are playing genuinely without cheating.
Serves them right for nerfing everything to kindergarten difficulty and thinking this would not have long term consequences.

Freymaker

AshTal wrote: »

One of the issues I have with exploiters is I am never sure if they are cheating or just exploiting bad game mechanics. Like when someone can do 35K damage in 3 seconds in PvP by spamming a single attack. Is the game just that broken that they can do this or have they found an exploit? When one person out damages 5 people while healing everything they kick out is this cheating or has he just found a super build?

You know I've been following this thread since I first posted and I agree with AshTal, I'm never sure if the people around me are cheating or just better equipped and more experienced but I shouldn't have to wonder if they're cheating because there should be no possibility of cheating. As I mentioned, dying in Cyrodiil is no big thing but it's annoying if it's because of cheating and not prowess. Frankly, it's why I prefer solo and Pve over Pvp where what the other guy does doesn't matter to me cause NPCs can't cheat. Since I've pretty much exhausted all solo adventuring (sure there are a few quests I could still do and there are the repeatables) I'm glad NMS realeases Friday (finally) so I can abandon all of this.

Pomaikai

That player named after the country which started WW2 is back on and cheating like there's no tomorrow on Trueflame. When you accepted his "apology" and "promise" not to cheat anymore, did anyone think to maybe follow up and check on him afterwards?

Really?

Is THAT better?

Now, why haven't y'all been keeping tabs on the banned people whom you inappropriately let back in after they pinky promised that they wouldn't cheat again? If you're going to go against all good and common sense as an MMO game developer and let cheaters back into your game, then the LEAST you can do is assign them a Parole Officer to keep an eye on their subsequent game play to ensure that they haven't returned to their cheating ways.

NobleNerd

Ackwalan wrote: »

Wasalda wrote: »

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

You mean, a person claimed he was banned for leaping up a bridge. Since ZOS doesn't talk about it, that person can make any claim they want.

I can understand ZOS not talking about it in detail publicly, but what is causing a lot of frustration is .... they don't even give clear reasons to the person(s) they are banning! This is why people are making assumptions or educated guesses as to why they were banned. This is horrible Customer Service, but many of us already knew ZOS has horrible CS.

NobleNerd

Pomaikai wrote: »

That player named after the country which started WW2 is back on and cheating like there's no tomorrow on Trueflame. When you accepted his "apology" and "promise" not to cheat anymore, did anyone think to maybe follow up and check on him afterwards?

Really?

Is THAT better?

Now, why haven't y'all been keeping tabs on the banned people whom you inappropriately let back in after they pinky promised that they wouldn't cheat again? If you're going to go against all good and common sense as an MMO game developer and let cheaters back into your game, then the LEAST you can do is assign them a Parole Officer to keep an eye on their subsequent game play to ensure that they haven't returned to their cheating ways.

ROFL!

This whole naming and shaming policy is a bunch of monkey poo! Like the person who is cheating and exploiting the hell out of your game cares if he /she is mentioned in the forums, especially since it appears that ZOS doesn't care to enforce these vague rules we are suppose to follow.

Ackwalan

NobleNerd wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Wasalda wrote: »

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

You mean, a person claimed he was banned for leaping up a bridge. Since ZOS doesn't talk about it, that person can make any claim they want.

I can understand ZOS not talking about it in detail publicly, but what is causing a lot of frustration is .... they don't even give clear reasons to the person(s) they are banning! This is why people are making assumptions or educated guesses as to why they were banned. This is horrible Customer Service, but many of us already knew ZOS has horrible CS.

They know why they were banned. They are just playing the sympathy card in hopes to get people on their side.

DeadDealer

Ackwalan wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Wasalda wrote: »

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

You mean, a person claimed he was banned for leaping up a bridge. Since ZOS doesn't talk about it, that person can make any claim they want.

I can understand ZOS not talking about it in detail publicly, but what is causing a lot of frustration is .... they don't even give clear reasons to the person(s) they are banning! This is why people are making assumptions or educated guesses as to why they were banned. This is horrible Customer Service, but many of us already knew ZOS has horrible CS.

They know why they were banned. They are just playing the sympathy card in hopes to get people on their side.

no
always there was innocent people who dont know why they was banned
and they will not figure out this no matter if they will be unbanned or not

Cazzy

DeadDealer wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

Wasalda wrote: »

Blo0dstorm wrote: »

Just wondering:
I was in a keep, not even under attack (check mini-map)

..........

tbh someone could just hide in the keep before it turned to another colour...


I have one question for Zenimax: When exactly does gap closing count as exploit? I saw a person go banned because leaping up Sejanus bridge where i ask myself why does a player get a ban because of a buggy game mechanic? Do i have to think 10 times about what i do now all the time for not getting banned? If I see a person in WW who is on a stone and i jump him do i get a ban for that? Yesterday there was a broken Keep wall and one guy wanted to charge someone and charged through the open breach without even knowing, that this is possible would he also get a ban?

Thx for answers

You mean, a person claimed he was banned for leaping up a bridge. Since ZOS doesn't talk about it, that person can make any claim they want.

I can understand ZOS not talking about it in detail publicly, but what is causing a lot of frustration is .... they don't even give clear reasons to the person(s) they are banning! This is why people are making assumptions or educated guesses as to why they were banned. This is horrible Customer Service, but many of us already knew ZOS has horrible CS.

They know why they were banned. They are just playing the sympathy card in hopes to get people on their side.

no
always there was innocent people who dont know why they was banned
and they will not figure out this no matter if they will be unbanned or not

I have to be honest, your reactions on the forum has caused me quite a bit of concern. You've very vocal and quick to get threads closed on the main page and tend to be passionate about not banning people.

I'm not accusing or nor do I mean offense (I like your contributions!) but do you understand how it appears?

Wreuntzylla

Dubhliam wrote: »

AshTal wrote: »

One of the issues I have with exploiters is I am never sure if they are cheating or just exploiting bad game mechanics. Like when someone can do 35K damage in 3 seconds in PvP by spamming a single attack. Is the game just that broken that they can do this or have they found an exploit? When one person out damages 5 people while healing everything they kick out is this cheating or has he just found a super build?

Also even when its a known bug it appears that cheaters get a 12 hour suspension after 3 months of ruining other peoples fun, so whats the point?

First, let me break down the numbers you show here:
35k damage in 3 seconds is around 11.5k DPS. Even when we take into account the 50% damage reduction, that would be equivalent to 23k DPS in PvE.
23k DPS is nothing to be amazed with.

Next, I see people play the game for months and even years and still not know how to properly build their characters.
They simply make something out of whatever they have easily available, and if they think that works, they stick with it for the next year.
Even if that build sucks bigtime.
Honestly, I have gone into WGT today with a guy that actively plays ESO for at least one year, has over 501 CPs. Most of the time he spends in Cyrodiil.
I don't expect people to know the mechanics or have super DPS, but this guy could barely kill Lightning Aspect after 10 seconds, not evading lightning, but spamming Vigor to counter the DoT, and when he finally kills the Aspect, he is now out of stamina and continues to light attack Kena, although she is in her bubble.

I can imagine that once word got out people are using cheats, that this person was pointing fingers at anyone who killed him in Cyrodiil, while in fact, he is just a poor player.
And he's not alone, there are tons of players of that skill and mindset in ESO.

Yes, this could also be boiled down to one of ZOS' faults for giving the players so much freedom in building their characters, making the disparity from good to bad builds/players gigantic.
But I don't see anything they can do about that in Cyrodiil.
The only thing they could do, is increase the difficulty of the solo world content, so that people would e forced to learn and improve.

Then, and only then, when the players in ESO have somewhat similar knowledge of the game combat system and mechanics, can a person point a finger and say: "This guy is most definitely a cheater".

My guess is that ZOS is in a big of a mess right now with cheat prevention because they are overflowed with player reports of other players that are playing genuinely without cheating.
Serves them right for nerfing everything to kindergarten difficulty and thinking this would not have long term consequences.

Or maybe it was because a former player dropped the dime on the so called "great" players and exposed how they were doing it by going out into Cyrodiil and showing the world? I'm going to go with that explanation myself...

Also, it's not unusual for a PvPer, even a great one, to suck at PvE. PvP is about burst and durability, PvE is about DPS and stayoing out of stupid. PvPers will often use full impen or sturdy, while PvErs will use divines and/or infused. Some players don't have the time to grind gear sets for both.

As reflected in Cyrodiil zone chat, it's much more likely that a PvEer reports a player than a PvPer.

xeroflare357

id say permaban all cheaters as they will find ways to get around gettin caught , warnings will only enable them to find teh ways to not get caught .

Xvorg

Bethesda games had a discount last weekend on Steam due to the Quakecon. Perfect time for testing Skyrim.

Sorry guys... but I'm sick of Zenimax Online policies and management within this game.