Callous2208 wrote: »And on a side note, with this system you're not competing with Joe non crafter who spends all day farming high tier mats to sell back to you the crafter at astronomical prices, beating you to every node. This system is solid.
MSchroeder wrote: »We introduced scaled crafting resource nodes with the intent of making sure anyone could find useful crafting materials when they went to a scaled zone, such as Orsinium or Hew’s Bane.
However, since then, we’ve been monitoring feedback on scaled resources, and we’re actually looking at changing them slightly in the future. Currently, scaled nodes are based solely on your crafting passives; in the future, we’re looking at changing them to be split between your crafting passives, or your character level. We’re hoping that this helps both those characters who are leveling up naturally, and high-level characters who never craft, while still making sure that everyone can find the materials they need for both “the best you can craft” and “the best you can wear”. This seems a good opportunity to open up discussion of this potential change, and see what you all think of it.
Please remember that this is only something we’re considering right now; this is not a set-in-stone plan.
To provide an example of how this would work, let me introduce four characters.
Alice has never crafted a day in her life, but has reached VR 16.
Bob is a crafting alt – he’s got Metalworking maxed out, but isn’t even high-enough level to weapon swap.
Charlie is hardcore. Not only is he VR 16, but he’s also got all of his crafting passives purchased.
Deborah is still leveling up, both in combat and in crafting. She’s just unlocked Rank 6 of Metalworking (meaning that she can now craft Calcinium equipment), but hasn’t quite made it to VR 1 yet (so she’s only able to wear gear made from Ebony).
The four adventurers crest a hill, and see two ore nodes. The one on the left is based on crafting passives, while the one on the right is based on character level.
Alice sees an Iron node on the left, and a Rubedite node on the right.
Bob sees a Rubedite node on the left, and an Iron node on the right.
Charlie sees both nodes as Rubedite.
Deborah sees a Calcinium node on the left, and an Ebony node on the right. If she were to get to VR 1 and return (and her friends hadn’t mined those resource nodes), she’d see two Calcinium nodes instead.
Once the nodes have been mined, when they respawn, they’ll randomly be selected to either base themselves off of crafting passives, or off of character level.
Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
MSchroeder wrote: »
Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
murtrem_ESO wrote: »Did everyone forget how ungodly easy it is to level crafts (maybe not enchanting) to 50? My first character had lvl 50 smith, woodworking, and tailoring loooong before he was level 50. At v16 having never crafted anything.. u can start to decon the drops u get from (insert activity here) and level the craft up absurdely fast. And then its what? 10 skill points? Tada! Now u can harvest the nodes you want. Its not like you need to spend another year researching traits.
MSchroeder wrote: »Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
NeillMcAttack wrote: »NeillMcAttack wrote: »I'm honestly goin to have a brain aneurysm reading through all the narrow minded comments here. My patience on the subject is wearing very thin.
...snip...
First, there had to be some scaling. Without it, we would have bots fresh from prison back here farming. So, ZOS had to pick some scaling. The option to have best mats in area, where you can arrive at any level must not happen.
Scaling to character level would have failed badly because many do have dedicated crafters at low levels. It is way more effort to level up from thirties to vr15, than vr16 learning crafts. So, option where the area scales only to character level is not happening. It simply would favor normal players over crafters in farming, which is essential part of crafting.
Having said that, ZOS could add secondary scaling to character level. Nodes would scale to crafting skill or character level, whichever is higher. That would not hurt anybody. It would be simple to implement and solves issue with vr16 "can't craft" toons.
And having said that, it takes about a week for vr16 to level up the crafts by deconstructing high level loot. The deconstructing itself takes an hour. The scaling to craft skills is just a minor obstacle to adapt to. E.g.is not true. I've leveled many alts to max crafts. It's easy.Spearshard wrote: »you waste absurd amounts of time and gold relevelling crafting.
I think vast majority of vr16 players already have craftings maxed and they just assigned the skill points. over 90% or my clients don't request improving. That means they can do it themselves, and must have developed their crafting skill to at least close to max.
The only statement you have made in this that holds weight is the fact that scaling to either char level or crafting level hurts nobody. Besides that, your statements are all untrue.
The amount of mats it would take for a straight out the gate character to reach max level in all crafts is INSANE. That is the truth. And that is assuming you are boosting it with a friend which takes two people and doubles the actual game time required. Assuming you are solely actually farming and deconstructing the dropped loot. It would would take far more than a week. Maybe with 24 hour hard farming on a character with 200 inventory space... maybe! Then you have the required 35ish skill points required. If it was a V16 char (which is only a small part of the argument as chars of all levels should have access to the mats of his/her level) it might move slightly quicker as all or most of the found loot would give the maximum allowed inspiration gain on deconstruction.
But this is all irrelevant because nobody needs two chars that can craft max level gear. It's not the intended design. And if it is, it is nothing more than pointless padding "gameplay".
Also, the dedicated low level crafter argument is nonsense. Because again, you are claiming that in order for me to be able to effeciently farm the mats needed to progress my alt, I should be required to NOT PLAY THAT CHARACTER, which is the reason for this entire discussion. I want to play and progress my alts the same way I always did. How can you not see that?
I think this is good improvement.MSchroeder wrote: »We introduced scaled crafting resource nodes with the intent of making sure anyone could find useful crafting materials when they went to a scaled zone, such as Orsinium or Hew’s Bane.
However, since then, we’ve been monitoring feedback on scaled resources, and we’re actually looking at changing them slightly in the future. Currently, scaled nodes are based solely on your crafting passives; in the future, we’re looking at changing them to be split between your crafting passives, or your character level. We’re hoping that this helps both those characters who are leveling up naturally, and high-level characters who never craft, while still making sure that everyone can find the materials they need for both “the best you can craft” and “the best you can wear”. This seems a good opportunity to open up discussion of this potential change, and see what you all think of it.
...snnip...
Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
Callous2208 wrote: »with this system you're not competing with Joe non crafter who spends all day farming high tier mats to sell back to you the crafter at astronomical prices, beating you to every node. This system is solid.
Callous2208 wrote: »I feel your line about the economy is most likely the real hangup here. You're upset that you can't easily skim through the new zones on your non crafting main, scooping up mats to plop down on the trader. Otherwise you would see this to be a non issue and invest the points, or collect on your crafting alt.
Callous2208 wrote: »Last time I checked, I wasn't a mat farmer looking to screw people over as you so eloquently suggested.
Callous2208 wrote: »Last time I checked, I wasn't a mat farmer looking to screw people over as you so eloquently suggested.
It was not meant as an insult. If that is what got you riled up, I apologize.
It would be in the best interest of a mat farmer to have as high a price as possible. If I was a mat farmer, that is what I would want. Just like it would be in the best interest as a crafter to want to pay as little as possible for mats.
The prices for VR15/16 mats are too high right now, so that is why I am saying I am over-paying for them.
MSchroeder wrote: »We introduced scaled crafting resource nodes with the intent of making sure anyone could find useful crafting materials when they went to a scaled zone, such as Orsinium or Hew’s Bane.
However, since then, we’ve been monitoring feedback on scaled resources, and we’re actually looking at changing them slightly in the future. Currently, scaled nodes are based solely on your crafting passives; in the future, we’re looking at changing them to be split between your crafting passives, or your character level. We’re hoping that this helps both those characters who are leveling up naturally, and high-level characters who never craft, while still making sure that everyone can find the materials they need for both “the best you can craft” and “the best you can wear”. This seems a good opportunity to open up discussion of this potential change, and see what you all think of it.
Please remember that this is only something we’re considering right now; this is not a set-in-stone plan.
To provide an example of how this would work, let me introduce four characters.
Alice has never crafted a day in her life, but has reached VR 16.
Bob is a crafting alt – he’s got Metalworking maxed out, but isn’t even high-enough level to weapon swap.
Charlie is hardcore. Not only is he VR 16, but he’s also got all of his crafting passives purchased.
Deborah is still leveling up, both in combat and in crafting. She’s just unlocked Rank 6 of Metalworking (meaning that she can now craft Calcinium equipment), but hasn’t quite made it to VR 1 yet (so she’s only able to wear gear made from Ebony).
The four adventurers crest a hill, and see two ore nodes. The one on the left is based on crafting passives, while the one on the right is based on character level.
Alice sees an Iron node on the left, and a Rubedite node on the right.
Bob sees a Rubedite node on the left, and an Iron node on the right.
Charlie sees both nodes as Rubedite.
Deborah sees a Calcinium node on the left, and an Ebony node on the right. If she were to get to VR 1 and return (and her friends hadn’t mined those resource nodes), she’d see two Calcinium nodes instead.
Once the nodes have been mined, when they respawn, they’ll randomly be selected to either base themselves off of crafting passives, or off of character level.
Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
MSchroeder wrote: »We introduced scaled crafting resource nodes with the intent of making sure anyone could find useful crafting materials when they went to a scaled zone, such as Orsinium or Hew’s Bane.
However, since then, we’ve been monitoring feedback on scaled resources, and we’re actually looking at changing them slightly in the future. Currently, scaled nodes are based solely on your crafting passives; in the future, we’re looking at changing them to be split between your crafting passives, or your character level. We’re hoping that this helps both those characters who are leveling up naturally, and high-level characters who never craft, while still making sure that everyone can find the materials they need for both “the best you can craft” and “the best you can wear”. This seems a good opportunity to open up discussion of this potential change, and see what you all think of it.
Please remember that this is only something we’re considering right now; this is not a set-in-stone plan.
To provide an example of how this would work, let me introduce four characters.
Alice has never crafted a day in her life, but has reached VR 16.
Bob is a crafting alt – he’s got Metalworking maxed out, but isn’t even high-enough level to weapon swap.
Charlie is hardcore. Not only is he VR 16, but he’s also got all of his crafting passives purchased.
Deborah is still leveling up, both in combat and in crafting. She’s just unlocked Rank 6 of Metalworking (meaning that she can now craft Calcinium equipment), but hasn’t quite made it to VR 1 yet (so she’s only able to wear gear made from Ebony).
The four adventurers crest a hill, and see two ore nodes. The one on the left is based on crafting passives, while the one on the right is based on character level.
Alice sees an Iron node on the left, and a Rubedite node on the right.
Bob sees a Rubedite node on the left, and an Iron node on the right.
Charlie sees both nodes as Rubedite.
Deborah sees a Calcinium node on the left, and an Ebony node on the right. If she were to get to VR 1 and return (and her friends hadn’t mined those resource nodes), she’d see two Calcinium nodes instead.
Once the nodes have been mined, when they respawn, they’ll randomly be selected to either base themselves off of crafting passives, or off of character level.
Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
MSchroeder wrote: »
Once the nodes have been mined, when they respawn, they’ll randomly be selected to either base themselves off of crafting passives, or off of character level.
Let us know what you think of this proposed change! We’re hoping to use the PTS of a major Update to test this, too, so you’ll have a chance to sound off then as well.
Callous2208 wrote: »NeillMcAttack wrote: »@Callous2208
Please point out my contradiction! Whilst i point out what your obvious agenda all along. And it was as I pointed out before, 'elitism' or a greater sense of entitlement because your char is a crafter . You just didn't want those that didn't craft to have the same access to top level mats as yourself.Callous2208 wrote: »with this system you're not competing with Joe non crafter who spends all day farming high tier mats to sell back to you the crafter at astronomical prices, beating you to every node. This system is solid.Callous2208 wrote: »I feel your line about the economy is most likely the real hangup here. You're upset that you can't easily skim through the new zones on your non crafting main, scooping up mats to plop down on the trader. Otherwise you would see this to be a non issue and invest the points, or collect on your crafting alt.
This was never even a concern of mine in the slightest, and if i was someone who enjoyed running around collecting mats to sell why would it even matter what kind of character i did it on!?
Fair enough, you got me. I'm one of those elitist jerks that thinks crafting, and by extension mastering it and using those skill points, should definitely mean something. What a quaint and terribly elitist notion. I should be ashamed. Now I'll sit all giddy with anticipation while you tell me why a crafter SHOULD, have to compete with a non crafter for mats.
NeillMcAttack wrote: »Callous2208 wrote: »NeillMcAttack wrote: »@Callous2208
Please point out my contradiction! Whilst i point out what your obvious agenda all along. And it was as I pointed out before, 'elitism' or a greater sense of entitlement because your char is a crafter . You just didn't want those that didn't craft to have the same access to top level mats as yourself.Callous2208 wrote: »with this system you're not competing with Joe non crafter who spends all day farming high tier mats to sell back to you the crafter at astronomical prices, beating you to every node. This system is solid.Callous2208 wrote: »I feel your line about the economy is most likely the real hangup here. You're upset that you can't easily skim through the new zones on your non crafting main, scooping up mats to plop down on the trader. Otherwise you would see this to be a non issue and invest the points, or collect on your crafting alt.
This was never even a concern of mine in the slightest, and if i was someone who enjoyed running around collecting mats to sell why would it even matter what kind of character i did it on!?
Fair enough, you got me. I'm one of those elitist jerks that thinks crafting, and by extension mastering it and using those skill points, should definitely mean something. What a quaint and terribly elitist notion. I should be ashamed. Now I'll sit all giddy with anticipation while you tell me why a crafter SHOULD, have to compete with a non crafter for mats.
Well, you see, that is a silly question as I'm sure you are aware or else I am genuinely worried for you. I'll do my best to explain it to you why but then I am done with you as I am painfully aware of how wasted the argument is going to be on you.
Why is crafting an option and not a necessity? Because some people find it fun and others do not. Some people have more time to play than others. But both should have a means of progressing through the content right!? Now, you may feel that non-crafters should rely on crafters to not only craft the gear, but supply the material also!!? But this could never work. Everyone would become a crafter, and those left would just simply quit the game. They wouldn't be able to compete, they would be a hindrance in dungeons, canon fodder in PvP, etc.
If by some miracle players that stayed still didn't craft, then imagine the burden and pressure they are putting on crafters to make them competitive. It's not enough that they have to actually take the time to craft it. But farm the mats too!! So what would be the going rate of a gold, vet 16, Armor master set? So you see, Joe non-crafter HAS to have the ability to do the leg work required to reach end-game, otherwise crafting is a necessity.
Perhaps you feel crafting SHOULD be a necessity. Then crafting has no value as everyone is crafting gear for themselves. It might surprise you also, but a LOT of players wouldn't like it and so wouldn't find the game fun.
But anyway, the reason it was a silly question. Because you DO have a greater access to materials as a crafter. Refinement chance, Writs, and Surveys......
NeillMcAttack wrote: »The choice to scale them off crafting level over character level makes no sense considering that the entire base game was scaled to zone level to coincide with character level.
Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »My question is why even introduce a battle leveled zone to begin with.