Cloak Needs A Nerf
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Joy_Division✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭nordickittyhawk wrote: »@ZOS_GinaBruno
If you actually do that you will 100% ruin this class for me! STOP LISTENING TO THESE PEOPLE ZENIMAX!!. the skill is buggy as it it... -.- how about nerfing shields then.... Sick of pvp babies crying cause they suck..
The OP is one of the best players in the game.4 -
Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, thanks for all your feedback. We are looking at several options to limit the number of times Shadow Cloak can be cast in a row. However, unlike Bolt Escape, there are multiple ways of countering Shadow Cloak so we want to be very careful with any change we ultimately make. One of the possibilities we're exploring is reducing your Magicka regeneration while Shadow Cloak is active.
Any change we make will be in a future update, though we don't have a solid time frame at this time.
@ZOS_GinaBruno To make ANY change to a skill that STILL does not work correctly after a year that diminishes it's effectiveness in anyway is simply, stupid. If a change does come to pass the man or woman that came up with it should be fired and the Nightblade class needs to be removed and replaced because that's how useless it'll be without being able to spam cloak.
As for the people complaining.
THERE ARE 48 SKILLS IN GAME THAT CAN COUNTER CLOAK WITH ONE BUTTON PRESS AND HALF OF THEM COST LESS THAN CLOAK DOES WITH FULL REDUCTION, TWO, ARE TOGGLES.
This is skills alone, not even counting sets or detect potions. ANYONE. Who thinks Cloak needs a nerf, is a god be damned idiot. I'm sorry.Edited by Yonkit on September 21, 2015 8:11PMHas an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.12 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
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I have and it´s not even worth one ability slot on your bar against a nightblade that knows how to play his class outside of stealth ganks.
One of my characters runs radiant on both bars (tank) and I find myself always wanting to drop both of them off for other skills, you know, have a different setup, build diversity. But then there are those days, when the bad nightblades come out, and they cloak and cloak but don't even try to evade me, and I just keep slamming their heads into the ground. But a good nightblade doesn't get caught by those kind of things.1 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
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As someone on the first page said: "Detect Potions, Radiant Magelight, Any form of AoE, Caltrops, Revealing Flare, Piercing Mark"
And to add on to that, any snare. Like Encase for Sorcs, while it doesn't bring NB's out of stealth, it stops them from going anywhere, they dodge roll, you encase again. But, the most prominant and easiest solution (imo) are detect pots.
If you have a NB on NA server, I'd be more than happy to show you that it's possible to stop a NB getting away with cloak, without detect pots.
Sadly i don´t but if you want to try i can show you on the EU server how to get away as a nightblade against someone not using detect potions in about 15 seconds max. I guess you´ve never fought NBs with purge have you?
Radiant magelight and Flare are both lackluster single purpose skills. Magica AOEs are limited to 6m (most of them).`If i had access to a magica version of caltrops or steeltornado i would not have posted a single time in this topic.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
SleepyTroll✭✭✭✭✭
✭Maybe this is why games have cool down systems. idk may
One of my characters runs radiant on both bars (tank) and I find myself always wanting to drop both of them off for other skills, you know, have a different setup, build diversity. But then there are those days, when the bad nightblades come out, and they cloak and cloak but don't even try to evade me, and I just keep slamming their heads into the ground. But a good nightblade doesn't get caught by those kind of things.
So you want to nerf the bad NB's?
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Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SleepyTroll wrote: »Maybe this is why games have cool down systems. idk may
So you want to nerf the bad NB's?
Actually what he´s saying is radiant magelight is only good against bad nightblades making it a vaible counter for that scenario but is not worth a slot against a good one - but a bad nightblade without radiant magelight slotted can be a pain too.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
RunAway✭✭✭
Sadly i don´t but if you want to try i can show you on the EU server how to get away as a nightblade against someone not using detect potions in about 15 seconds max. I guess you´ve never fought NBs with purge have you?
Radiant magelight and Flare are both lackluster single purpose skills. Magica AOEs are limited to 6m (most of them).`If i had access to a magica version of caltrops or steeltornado i would not have posted a single time in this topic.
I don't play on EU, so it seems like this is going to be a case of agreeing to disagree, which is fine.
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Preyfar✭✭✭✭✭
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As a Nightblade, and as a person who relies on Shadow Cloak... the counter to it was Detection Potions. However, Detection Potions were ridiculously nerfed to the point of not even being useful while stealing got a buff. You guys went a bit too far in both directions, removing the balance. Just revert the Detection Potions back to how they were and it should be a done deal.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone, thanks for all your feedback. We are looking at several options to limit the number of times Shadow Cloak can be cast in a row. However, unlike Bolt Escape, there are multiple ways of countering Shadow Cloak so we want to be very careful with any change we ultimately make. One of the possibilities we're exploring is reducing your Magicka regeneration while Shadow Cloak is active.
Any change we make will be in a future update, though we don't have a solid time frame at this time.Edited by Preyfar on September 21, 2015 8:14PM1 -
vamp_emily✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The only game I like playing is getting destroyed by nerfing!
Thanks guys!
If you want a friend, get a dog.
AW Rank: Grand Warlord 1 ( level 49)3 -
Hydrocodone✭✭✭Oh so it'll be another 6 months until this gets sorted out like the sharpened bug/exploit? By then there will only be NBs in PvP so don't bother.
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Celas_Dranacea✭✭✭✭✭I'm a nb - if a skilled player who knows how to counter me I will have a very hard time staying alive.
I agree with the comment that someone said that half the problem is some folks wanting one build that can counter every other build in the game.
I'm I'm facing a skilled sorcerer, I need to swap from my main DW setup so that I can slot defensive stance to give myself a fighting chance (I don't use shield breaker out of respect). Most ppl know how to counter this, just like a skilled nb facing someone who counters cloak, but at least I'm throwing a curve ball at them.
Likewise if I'm facing a skilled stamina Templar or DK I will at least slot shadows to help drain there stamina - this is a small counter that isn't always effective.
Ultimately, these two quick examples are just showing that as a nb I sometimes have to slot different abilities than my usual one to counter other class characteristics that can be viewed as OP.
ESO is awesome in that it is sort of like Rock Paper Scissors, in that if you know your way around the skill trees you can counter many different strategies.A Bosmer Nightblade Werewolf4 -
Baronh2o✭✭✭people are buttmad that those NBs are escaping.
Agree. You didn't really see the volume of these types of threads in rapid succession until Imperial City hit...OH NOES MY TELVAR STONES DISSAPPEARED!"Not all who wander are lost." - Tolkien1 -
SleepyTroll✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oh I found something else you can work on ZOS, the broken skill trap in the fighters guild line
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Darlgon✭✭✭✭✭
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@ZOS_GinaBruno To make ANY change to a skill that STILL does not work correctly after a year that diminishes it's effectiveness in anyway is simply, stupid. If a change does come to pass the man or woman that came up with it should be fired and the Nightblade class needs to be removed and replaced because that's how useless it'll be without being able to spam cloak.
As for the people complaining.
THERE ARE 48 SKILLS IN GAME THAT CAN COUNTER CLOAK WITH ONE BUTTON PRESS AND HALF OF THEM COST LESS THAN CLOAK DOES WITH FULL REDUCTION, TWO, ARE TOGGLES.
This is skills alone, not even counting sets or detect potions. ANYONE. Who thinks Cloak needs a nerf, is a god be damned idiot. I'm sorry.
If any of these are on your list of 48 skills take them off:
Cinderstorm
Deep Breath
Talons
None of these take a NB out of cloak since the patch last week. Have not tested today.Power level to CP160 in a week:
Where is the end game? You just played it.
Why don't I have 300+ skill points? Because you skipped content along the way.
Where is new content? Sigh.0 -
CP5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭SleepyTroll wrote: »Maybe this is why games have cool down systems. idk may
So you want to nerf the bad NB's?
I'm saying, there will always be those who don't see the utility their class offers and cling to only a few skills and fight tooth and nail for them to never be changed. There are also some players who generally utilize several skills combined but whatever skill is seen most is the one that people remember. Relying on a crutch to support you at all times when that skill was not designed to be used purely by itself is not going to turn out well.0 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
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It's useful against more than just nightblades. I suggest you actually read the spell description.
I have and it´s not even worth one ability slot on your bar against a nightblade that knows how to play his class outside of stealth ganks.
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Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Fortunately I can´t cast more than three cloaks anyway..
It will hit magicka nbs surely hard tho and I´ll just wait until something similar happens to shields and heals (BoL).
I mean if no other defense ability is spammable, why should shields and heals be an exception.
Just a matter of time until people QQ about the next thing.
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Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -10 -
eventide03b14a_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
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People always do this till their class/playstyle is on the chopping block. After what they did to BE I can't help but get a little giddy at the mere mention of non sorc nerfs.Fortunately I can´t cast more than three cloaks anyway..
It will hit magicka nbs surely hard tho and I´ll just wait until something similar happens to shields and heals (BoL).
I mean if no other defense ability is spammable, why should shields and heals be an exception.
Just a matter of time until people QQ about the next thing.
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Yonkit✭✭✭✭✭
If any of these are on your list of 48 skills take them off:
Cinderstorm
Deep Breath
Talons
None of these take a NB out of cloak since the patch last week. Have not tested today.
They were not, the only two toggles on the list were radiant and inferno from the DKs, inferno will chase NBs with it's DoT like cloak isn't even there, and it pulls them out for a split second.Has an Alter Ego in the form of a very large quadrupedal black & white Bear.1 -
RingobloodtheOld✭✭✭
I play a Sorc and I can safely say that shadow cloak does NOT need a nerf. There are detect pots, binds and DoT's that all solve the problem. The actual problem is the people, like the OP, who want 1 build that counters everything in the game. If you continually go around nerfing everything, you'll eventually ruin the game. As you said, there are already ways to counter shadow cloak, if people prefer to use health/Stamina/Magicka pots, that's their decision and they sacrifice a way to detect cloaked NB's, or stealthed enemies...
Straight to the Point, I like it, and i agree, coming from a NB since launch, you listen to the cry babies, nerf everything, you going to kill the game. Its not our fault ppl dont know how to play there toons or class to counter other classes in the gme, they just want the devs to do it all for them to make the game a causal cakewalk like WoW, for dumb down kids.
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Ringobloodtheold (Dummer) Nightblade3 -
mcurley✭✭✭@ZOS_GinaBruno Please leave any nerf bat you guys take to this spell exclusive to play in the IC.For the Covenant!Svvord - magicka NBLavv - magicka DKPovver - stamina NBPsylint - stamina NBYelruc - magicka Sorc1
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Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
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Do want to point out shadow barrier procs on all shadow skill use, not just exiting stealth/cloak.
Yup, this is why my magicka pool is almost exclusively used on Mass Hysteria.
Sorcs had to learn to play without permabolt and they do just fine.
Nightblades are just going to learn the same. If your only hit is to your regen this is a hell of a lot less than the bolt escape nerf. I've seen too many Magicka NBs play cat an mouse with and slowly whittle down players who can't kill them in the space of a detect pot or sit in the middle of a caltrop field. I don't support nerfing any class ability, I'd much rather see Detection pots restored back to their former duration to ensure that a PvP item is able to counter a PvP tactic without requiring a nerf that impacts PvE (like bolt escape screwed over PvE sorcs).Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
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Garion✭✭✭✭✭
✭Maybe ZOS should remove their ridiculous nerf to streak and start looking at core game issues rather than nerfing individual skills.
In the current game yes, cloak does need a nerf and following the BE nerf and introduction of shield breaker set it's only good for balance if this happens. Ultimately though I think it's just another case of nerfing the latest subject of QQ rather than examining the wider issues around soft caps and how easy it is to achieve infinite regen.
With that said, I can't help but say I get a kind of perverse pleasure out of hearing a nerf is inc... Perhaps all of those NBs shouldn't have been so vocal about streak. Now that had been nerfed hard the attention is on them, and most of them won't like it Edited by Garion on September 21, 2015 9:09PMLastobeth - VR16 Sorc - PvP Rank 41 (AD)
Lastoblyat - VR16 Templar - PvP Rank 14 (AD)
Ninja Pete - VR16 NB - PvP Rank 10 (AD)
Labo the Banana Slayer - VR14 Sorc - PvP Rank 12 (EP)
Member of Banana Squad | Officer of Arena5 -
Darlgon✭✭✭✭✭
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They were not, the only two toggles on the list were radiant and inferno from the DKs, inferno will chase NBs with it's DoT like cloak isn't even there, and it pulls them out for a split second.
Toggles? All three are ACTIVE AoE Damage abilities, that no longer pull out of stealth, not toggles
Power level to CP160 in a week:
Where is the end game? You just played it.
Why don't I have 300+ skill points? Because you skipped content along the way.
Where is new content? Sigh.0 -
killingspreeb16_ESO✭✭✭✭Fortunately I can´t cast more than three cloaks anyway..
It will hit magicka nbs surely hard tho and I´ll just wait until something similar happens to shields and heals (BoL).
I mean if no other defense ability is spammable, why should shields and heals be an exception.
Just a matter of time until people QQ about the next thing.
Next penality is for shield!1 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
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@ZOS_GinaBruno To make ANY change to a skill that STILL does not work correctly after a year that diminishes it's effectiveness in anyway is simply, stupid. If a change does come to pass the man or woman that came up with it should be fired and the Nightblade class needs to be removed and replaced because that's how useless it'll be without being able to spam cloak.
As for the people complaining.
THERE ARE 48 SKILLS IN GAME THAT CAN COUNTER CLOAK WITH ONE BUTTON PRESS AND HALF OF THEM COST LESS THAN CLOAK DOES WITH FULL REDUCTION, TWO, ARE TOGGLES.
This is skills alone, not even counting sets or detect potions. ANYONE. Who thinks Cloak needs a nerf, is a god be damned idiot. I'm sorry.
I'm sorry but when you say about NBs "that's how useless it'll be without being able to spam cloak." it really really reflects very badly on you. If you are telling me that you need to be able to travel the length and breadth of Cyrodiil cloaked to be any effective as a NB, then really I'm lost for words.
Up until 1.6 cloak was not only was far, far more buggy than now but it was nowhere near spammable. Yet NBs did absolutely fine regardless. You don't need to have a spammable cloak and that's from someone who plays Sorc and supported the cost increase on Bolt Escape.
If they bring it down to a more reasonable number of uses it'll still an extremely effective skill like it was before. I understand you are frustrated now, I was too intially when I found out all the BE nerfs, but eventually you see it's reasonable.Edited by Maulkin on September 21, 2015 9:05PMEU | PC | AD1 -
Gerardopg✭✭✭the really problem is they over nerf, so they nerf evertything now they have to nerf cloak to balance but they gonna I've nerf cloack and then they gonna have to nerf something else, as a sorcerer I really think cloak need a nerf, but they should just balance the game not keep needing everything0
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Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Maybe ZOS should remove their ridiculous nerf to streak and start looking at core game issues rather than berfing individual skills.
In the current game yes, cloak does need a nerf and following the BE nerf and introduction of shield breaker set it's only good for balance if this happens. Ultimately though I think it's just another case of nerfing the latest subject of QQ rather than examining the wider issues around soft caps and how easy it is to achieve infinite regen.
Could not agree more, but I have little hope of them reverting to pre-Champion System resource management.EU | PC | AD4 -
CtrlAltDlt✭✭✭The thing that needs most nerfing is the damn champion point system. It's the source of a lot of imbalances.PC NA - jeazzy
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nordickittyhawk✭✭✭✭✭mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »
Could not agree more, but I have little hope of them reverting to pre-Champion System resource management.
Oh look... sorcs complaing QQ dont see that every day on the forums. if we get cloak nerf i wanna see there shields nerfed!1
This discussion has been closed.