There CANNOT be access gates to the Imperial City paid DLC

Saturn

mislucb16_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

but again when Imperial City launches, it will not have Keep Gated access to start.

This is a bad decision. The purpose of Cyrodiil is to fight to gain control over the IC. Fighting to keep the IC access would give a real reason to fight for our keeps !!!

I disagree. I think people should be able to enter the Imperial City and all the campaigns that are (and probably still will be) completely owned by one faction should never be allowed to have the monopoly on it. I play on the NA Daggerfall side and I tell you, it is so rare we even have our own keeps in a campaign that gated access to the Imperial City would mean DC players would not be able to enter, giving EP or AD free reign to grind the *** out of bosses, etc. to get Tel Var stones uncontested.

The beauty of the Imperial City on the PTS are the 3-way fights, the terror of being ganked with thousands of stones on your person and the excitement of killing players with that many stones.

If you gate access to the Imperial City I can promise you it will turn into a PvE zone for the ruling faction(s).

SeptimusDova

Nebthet78 "It is this type of PvP and poor sportsmanship from members going onto the other alliance and spying for them and being jerks that ends up turning a lot of players off of PVP and it actually has turned a lot of players off of it. I wish there was a mechanism that would only allow an even number of players from each faction onto a server so that one alliance can not be overwhelmed like this from another. Then the battles actually come down to skill and not numbers."

Actually this drives revenue from the game. "Those who act without honor Never had any to begin with". Constantine Porphyrogenitus VII 905-959 A.D

SOLUTION: Bind accounts to the campaigns. Wont stop the two account holders but it will make it costly.

AhPook_Is_Here

Nebthet78 wrote: »

Darlgon wrote: »

My apologies beforehand, but, I have to correct this misinformation.

My (I am not GM, or even an officer, but just a plebe) EP guilld, and ONLY my EP guild moved, un-announced to other EP, to Thornblade (NA) two nights ago, because it had been the "yellow" buff server and we had broken every buff server except that one. The yellow emp had been emp for 16 days from what I hear..

It was the "red" EP buff server when we started, so hard to break as EP. Once we started breaking Haderus, AS, and Chill as buff servers, other factions began to actively fight there. Reds moved off Thornblade to get better fighting. Also, some, apparently, in other factions re-rolled to EP during the time we started actively doing this. Now, apparently they have re-rolled to DC.

We run as a 24-man raid, sometimes with a few outliers, but normally with under 20. Our guild leader actually said in TS that he prefers to handicap the group outside the main raid, having them work elsewhere. We are just organized, with usually good raid leaders and pretty much required TS. I was leveling my AD alt during the time when you describe. In zone chat, I see something like, "Attention AD citizens, your BUFF server is being over-run by a Red zerg. Please do what you can to protect it." It provided a good laugh, as we had 12 players on at the time, including me on my AD. (Middle of the NA day, so not so many NA players on and the Aussies asleep.)

Rylana wrote: »

Rylana confirmed for being 29 people all by myself

We literally took over thornblade with 12 GoS members

Hardmode: I could name them if you like? =D

Guys, it might have been 12 people for each of your guilds, but it was much more than 12 Red players on the field at that time. I have screenshots to prove that from Tuesday night which shows a swarm of 15+ players just outside a keep door killing everyone.

At just one keep, while another was being hit at the same time, there were at least 13 Reds outside killing the few AD trying to take back, while a bunch more stayed inside the keep (we had a player hiding in there reporting).
There were at least 10 different guild names on those red keeps from last night. It also doesn't help when you have Guild of Shadows mates logged in on your enemies side bragging over zone chat that "this server will be liberated of the buffs you get" is just poor sportsmanship.

This was night time this was all happening. usually between 6pm-3am, but it has been happening since last Thursday. But yeah I asked a few of the other pvp guilds guilds and even asked another player who was broadcasting live on Twitch about what was going on, and he stated that he received notice that the guilds are organizing to take over all campaign maps for the reds before IC release.

You could definitely tell you all were using Teamspeak and were organized. I couldn't participate in those fights because as soon as I get around 10 other players my game stops responding so I am insta-dead because no matter what I press I go from full health to nothing in less than a second and just stand there like a buffoon, especially with any sorcerer using the lightning armor, for some reason that causes a lot of lag for my PC.


It is this type of PvP and poor sportsmanship from members going onto the other alliance and spying for them and being jerks that ends up turning a lot of players off of PVP and it actually has turned a lot of players off of it. I wish there was a mechanism that would only allow an even number of players from each faction onto a server so that one alliance can not be overwhelmed like this from another. Then the battles actually come down to skill and not numbers.

These type of zerg groups is not what people wanted to be dealing with in IC and is what players were hoping to avoid by having the keep rules stay in place. Players wanted more 1v1-4v4 PvP, not 2v15 which is what IC is going to become.

At this point, I feel i feel ZOS changed the rules to get as many people to buy the game before they change the rules back. Then you can't get refunds.

Well there are a lot of nasty people who play this game, MMOs don't exactly attract the most social people.

wraith808

mislucb16_ESO wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler :

Could you please remove on PTS from Cyrodiil map the 6 keep rule please ?

Looks like we have some geniuses taking keeps, preventing players to go in IC and test stuff.

Thanks.

That's part of the testing, and what is supposed to be tested. And the reason that the rules for live were changed- people weren't testing the rules. They're doing what they're supposed to be doing.

Stikato

Way to completely give up on compelling game design in order to placate a few whiners. Who probably would have immediately understood how much better the original intent was once they experienced it.

This is a total slap in the face to every member of the PC community that has supported this game though all of the BS. We have all waited as patiently as possible for the Imperial City. From the beginning it has been stated that access to this content would be a reward for successful PvP. Now it is obvious that it is intended to replace Cyrodiil.

This is the absolute single worst news I have read about this game other than B2P launch. The idea of fighting--FIGHTING--to access special content in the most iconic environment in the entire Elder Scrolls Franchise has a been a light at the end of the tunnel that has kept us going.

Now all we have to do is open a door to get it.

To the naysayers: not everything good is just handed to you. Your v14 character is not special because you got it on character creation. Your legendary armor is not special because it dropped off a common mob. Your 50 enchanting skill is not special because it started that way. They are special because you earned them.

Furthermore, the idea of creating a special "bonus" room that could:

Have earned access
Be hidden in once access was lost
Be cleared of enemy players, who would be unable to immediately return

IS GONE.

Welcome to the NGE version 2015. That will be 2500 crowns please.

/DISGUST

Hektik_V

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

Hey gang!

When Imperial City launches it will be open access to all Alliances in all Campaigns to all those who purchase the DLC or are ESO+ members. After the dust settles we'll be looking at Campaign population and feedback about the new rulesets also going out with the Imperial City update (that apply regardless of getting the DLC or not).

Based on those factors, we may or may not open\convert a Campaign to gated access to Imperial City, but again when Imperial City launches, it will not have Keep Gated access to start.

This is such horrible news. There is literally no point in controlling your home keeps anymore other than the home keep bonus, which no one cares about, since no one cares about score, since rewards are garbage (wall repair kits seriously?)

There needs to be some sort of objectives in Cyrodiil, without the home keep access restriction or former emp passives what other objectives do we have to do in Cyrodiil?

Zavus

keeps will be useless GG

SeptimusDova

then dont play

Stikato

SeptimusDova wrote: »

then dont play

Nobody will play in Cyrodiil. That is the point.

SeptimusDova

In that you are wrong.

Sharee

SeptimusDova wrote: »

In that you are wrong.

People generally go after the biggest carrot. Cyrodiil gives alliance points. Imperial city gives alliance points and tel-var stones. Not to mention the action in the districts is so instant it puts the forward camps era to shame.

For the first few months at least, cyrodiil will be dead except for the occassional bored PvDoor guild painting the whole map in their color.

SeptimusDova

both have caps both will have latency. the one that is worse on latency will not get played as much. I know many who PVP who have no desire for IC. I speak with them I interact with them and I help them. Some are not even in my guild. Common Sense apparently is so rare it ought to be a superpower.

Not directed at you sharee but the sky is falling types.

BRogueNZ

.

Zavus wrote: »

keeps will be useless GG

Not everyone is going to bother with IC and the 'old' goals still remain AP/Rewards/Winning the campaign.

They haven't been replaced.

If anything it make performance more tolerable in cryodil.. who knows.

Sharee

SeptimusDova wrote: »

both have caps both will have latency. the one that is worse on latency will not get played as much. I know many who PVP who have no desire for IC. I speak with them I interact with them and I help them. Some are not even in my guild. Common Sense apparently is so rare it ought to be a superpower.

Not directed at you sharee but the sky is falling types.

On the topic of latency - it seems to be much better. I was fighting in some pretty messy 3-faction skirmishes in the memorial district and not once did i notice the usual lag (as in, press bolt escape button - nothing happens) despite the constant fireworks, both from players and the mobs mixed in everywhere.

SeptimusDova

Sharee It seems that way now but the PTS is not an exact copy of the live server. Nor does it have the full population of their respective servers/megaservers EU/NA. The best projection one can approximate for that performance is live right now when the zergballers are hopped up on energy drinks skittles and 420/vodka/rum/cat food. Each day including the ones where I was given a time out. I have monitored Azuras Star campaign I screenshot and saved all of my solar winds, nessus, Cactii data pertaining to the latency. Yesterday and the day before were rather weird. lets call them day one and day two
Day one
Red capped
Blue capped
Yellow 2 bars. No battles at all and latency was 400-4900 where was the action to cause that? underground? Everyone commented on it.

Day two all factions capped. Latency was just as bad and people couldn't even operate siege equipment. I would cast a heal and no sh** three seconds later it would fire off. I launched a TC and I rubber band all over the place.

This is what is going to happen in the IC on live this is what cannot be ignored. Gated or not gated HOPE IS NOT A METHOD . You cannot HOPE a server fix. No more than I could HOPE an OC768 FAA fiber line to splice itself.

Sharee

SeptimusDova wrote: »

Sharee It seems that way now but the PTS is not an exact copy of the live server. Nor does it have the full population of their respective servers/megaservers EU/NA.

Yep, that's certainly true.

On the other hand, playing in cyrodiil for as long as i did, i kind of developed a sixth sense about lag. I see what is happening around me, and i think to myself, "lag incoming in 3..2..1..".

In IC, i expect the lag and it never comes.

SeptimusDova

It will my friend it will . Its like a sweeper you cannot see it just yet but you know it's there.

Sharee

SeptimusDova wrote: »

It will my friend it will . Its like a sweeper you cannot see it just yet but you know it's there.

Call me optimistic but I think they fixed it. Not just because of their AOE changes, but also because every district and every sewer section is a separate zone. So fighting in one won't affect the lag in others. That is, IIRC, 16 zones the population cap will be spread over. Plus the original cyrodiil of course.

SeptimusDova

and that is where we shall have to input this classic line for we are nearing the end of one episode 1.6 and soon to start 1.7

... To Be Continued...

Stikato

BRogueNZ wrote: »

.

Zavus wrote: »

keeps will be useless GG

Not everyone is going to bother with IC and the 'old' goals still remain AP/Rewards/Winning the campaign.

They haven't been replaced.

If anything it make performance more tolerable in cryodil.. who knows.

I understand your point, I don't wish to be argumentative. I would in fact love to be convinced that Cyrodiil is going to be populated.

But, if Cyrodiil = AP + Rewards of the Worthy + Winning Campaign (financial reward)

And IC = AP + TV stones + financial reward + v15 crafting materials

Even if you say the end of campaign reward is equal to the financial reward of IC, which it isn't, but just for the sake of discussion..

Then the AP is the same. The financial rewards are the "same".

Then Cyro vs IC -> (Cyro) Rewards of the Worthy vs. (IC) TV stones & v15 crafting mats.

Now, I do believe that people go to Cyro (and IC) to fight other players, and gain some progress (money, xp, AP). In either case you will be able to fight other players. IC just happens to be a brand spanking new piece of content. My observation is, the majority of people--that PvP at all--are going to want to be in Imperial City, the majority of the time. It's simple. New content vs. Old. Better rewards vs. Lesser rewards.

Therefore, while it may seem fun to have everyone in IC on the PTS, when the majority of the entire game population moves there, it will not be as enjoyable. Or special. I have looked for fights on the PTS in Cyrodiil. There is nobody to fight. The only battles I have really seen? Fought over keeps to determine IC access...

I say this with the sincere hope that I will be terribly wrong. But I think that Cyrodiil performance will improve: not many people will be there.

BRogueNZ

Stikato wrote: »

BRogueNZ wrote: »

.

Zavus wrote: »

keeps will be useless GG

Not everyone is going to bother with IC and the 'old' goals still remain AP/Rewards/Winning the campaign.

They haven't been replaced.

If anything it make performance more tolerable in cryodil.. who knows.

I understand your point, I don't wish to be argumentative. I would in fact love to be convinced that Cyrodiil is going to be populated.

But, if Cyrodiil = AP + Rewards of the Worthy + Winning Campaign (financial reward)

And IC = AP + TV stones + financial reward + v15 crafting materials

Even if you say the end of campaign reward is equal to the financial reward of IC, which it isn't, but just for the sake of discussion..

Then the AP is the same. The financial rewards are the "same".

Then Cyro vs IC -> (Cyro) Rewards of the Worthy vs. (IC) TV stones & v15 crafting mats.

Now, I do believe that people go to Cyro (and IC) to fight other players, and gain some progress (money, xp, AP). In either case you will be able to fight other players. IC just happens to be a brand spanking new piece of content. My observation is, the majority of people--that PvP at all--are going to want to be in Imperial City, the majority of the time. It's simple. New content vs. Old. Better rewards vs. Lesser rewards.

Therefore, while it may seem fun to have everyone in IC on the PTS, when the majority of the entire game population moves there, it will not be as enjoyable. Or special. I have looked for fights on the PTS in Cyrodiil. There is nobody to fight. The only battles I have really seen? Fought over keeps to determine IC access...

I say this with the sincere hope that I will be terribly wrong. But I think that Cyrodiil performance will improve: not many people will be there.

Fair points.


First I think population imbalances, cross faction characters and the like will make fighting for access just a waste of time and on the other hand, if access is for all it be as you suggest, normal pvp will go by the way simply because there is no need to bother.

All in all I think its just to be damn mess one way or the other

SeptimusDova

BrogueNZ yes its barf in one hand and poo in the other and you gotta sneeze!

olemanwinter

Stikato wrote: »

Way to completely give up on compelling game design in order to placate a few whiners.

Leandor

What I have seen from my brief stints on the PTS, Cyrodiil will still bring a better rate for AP than IC, mainly because of the additional bonuses (Kill quests, Ticks). Now, I have not been with the usual group since most prefer to not gain stuff on PTS just to lose it again and having to regain it on live, but I think that it will still play out like this.

From my point of view, it would be a less controversial mechanic to improve the use of AP beyond the recall stones in order to give an incentive to play Cyrodiil proper. Access limitations may work out, but I think the idea to implement them after the initial rush on IC has tapered down a bit is a workable compromise.

kevlarto_ESO

I am not sure the extreme in either direction is a good thing, Cyrodiil proper will be a ghost town no need to take keeps, AP/TV farmers will all be in the IC doing the same thing they do now sucking the fun out of everything with their group of what ever is broken game mechanic exploiter groups, of course it might run people back out of IC who knows at this point. Maybe they should have put the home keep access on one live campaign like the 30 day and 24/7 on the rest to kind of gage it.

Owning your home keeps for entry have been in place on the pts were there any battles for home keeps on the pts ? if not maybe that had something to do with the decision.

I guess we will wait and see what happens, I still think after a time IC could become a ghost town as people return to Cyrodiil proper then again maybe not, I got a bad feeling about this, will be fun for a short while I am sure.

Enodoc

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Owning your home keeps for entry have been in place on the pts were there any battles for home keeps on the pts ? if not maybe that had something to do with the decision.

Not really, as the population in Cyrodiil hasn't been high enough. For most of the time, nobody had touched the keeps at all; for the last couple of days, DC owned Brindle so AD couldn't get in, but it seems AD pop isn't high enough for them to get it back.

Leandor

Enodoc wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Owning your home keeps for entry have been in place on the pts were there any battles for home keeps on the pts ? if not maybe that had something to do with the decision.

Not really, as the population in Cyrodiil hasn't been high enough. For most of the time, nobody had touched the keeps at all; for the last couple of days, DC owned Brindle so AD couldn't get in, but it seems AD pop isn't high enough for them to get it back.

Which is no wonder, what with having the AD templates being broken for half the test period...

Anyways, apart from griefers, no one on PTS does have an interest in "testing" the old content, so why would there be fights for access, respectively to deny access. Totally wrong environment to test access rules.

wraith808

Leandor wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Owning your home keeps for entry have been in place on the pts were there any battles for home keeps on the pts ? if not maybe that had something to do with the decision.

Not really, as the population in Cyrodiil hasn't been high enough. For most of the time, nobody had touched the keeps at all; for the last couple of days, DC owned Brindle so AD couldn't get in, but it seems AD pop isn't high enough for them to get it back.

Which is no wonder, what with having the AD templates being broken for half the test period...

Anyways, apart from griefers, no one on PTS does have an interest in "testing" the old content, so why would there be fights for access, respectively to deny access. Totally wrong environment to test access rules.

What would be the right environment to test access rules?

Leandor

wraith808 wrote: »

Leandor wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

Owning your home keeps for entry have been in place on the pts were there any battles for home keeps on the pts ? if not maybe that had something to do with the decision.

Not really, as the population in Cyrodiil hasn't been high enough. For most of the time, nobody had touched the keeps at all; for the last couple of days, DC owned Brindle so AD couldn't get in, but it seems AD pop isn't high enough for them to get it back.

Which is no wonder, what with having the AD templates being broken for half the test period...

Anyways, apart from griefers, no one on PTS does have an interest in "testing" the old content, so why would there be fights for access, respectively to deny access. Totally wrong environment to test access rules.

What would be the right environment to test access rules?

In my view: live servers. Only there you see the dynamics. And incidentally, that is exactly what they intend to do.

Start out with free access, let everyone sate his/her initial curiosity about IC and let them freely find the 4-player dungeon entrances. After a couple of weeks, implement different rulesets for access on two campaigns, retaining the others at free access. Again hand a free campaign change to everyone to give the players a choice.

Check what is happening in IC for the next couple weeks. Make a decision afterwards. If any kind of ruleset results in creation of a buff server, immediately change the ruleset.

SeptimusDova

and reap in the Benjamin with no reprisals or refunds slick.

time to blow this joint with guild to follow

Ciao