So, You have no reason to buy Imperial City if you dont like PVP. Period.

Avenias

Saturn wrote: »

Well it's not 100% PvP nor 100% PvE. If you want more PvE content the Imperial City will give it to you through the two new Dungeons (The Imperial Prison and The White-Gold Tower) and the questline inside the City. I do have a few friends that would never set their feet in Cyrodiil to just fight other players, but promise of new gear and unexplored content will bring people who don't like PvP to the Imperial City. No doubt about it.

Wrong, its 100% pvp. The dungeons are just for *** and giggles. The only way to get the TV gear is through pvp.

Maulkin

I just read the whole thread and had a real giggle with all these PvErs who are up in arms about being (oh the irony) starved of new content and get nothing. Despite the fact there's PvE dungeons bundled in with the first and only PvP update for a year and a half

Don't worry @ZOS_BrianWheeler, I know huge amount of PvPers who (despite being a little peeved at having effectively paid for this via a years sub and are now having to fork out... again) are more than excited about the first PvP update of ESO and will happily pay for it. They will make it the commercial success that you need it to be

New item sets. New PvP areas. New death penalty, risk/reward system and currency rolled in one (TV stones). Necessary bug fixes and balance changes.Ultimately a new meta.

My excitement level has gone up to 11. I can't wait to try all the new stuff out and create new v16 builds

Weberda

Avenias wrote: »

Saturn wrote: »

Well it's not 100% PvP nor 100% PvE. If you want more PvE content the Imperial City will give it to you through the two new Dungeons (The Imperial Prison and The White-Gold Tower) and the questline inside the City. I do have a few friends that would never set their feet in Cyrodiil to just fight other players, but promise of new gear and unexplored content will bring people who don't like PvP to the Imperial City. No doubt about it.

Wrong, its 100% pvp. The dungeons are just for *** and giggles. The only way to get the TV gear is through pvp.

TV stones drop from NPC mobs. most of us consider that PvE, not PvP.

Farorin

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

I just read the whole thread and had a real giggle with all these PvErs who are up in arms about being (oh the irony) starved of new content and get nothing. Despite the fact there's PvE dungeons bundled in with the first and only PvP update for a year and a half

Don't worry @ZOS_BrianWheeler, I know huge amount of PvPers who (despite being a little peeved at having effectively paid for this via a years sub and are now having to fork out... again) are more than excited about the first PvP update of ESO and will happily pay for it. They will make it the commercial success that you need it to be

New item sets. New PvP areas. New death penalty, risk/reward system and currency rolled in one (TV stones). Necessary bug fixes and balance changes.Ultimately a new meta.

My excitement level has gone up to 11. I can't wait to try all the new stuff out and create new v16 builds

I am also very excited I have almost 8k crowns because I haven't spent them on almost anything because there has been nothing worth spending them on. I will most certainly be spending them on this DLC though.

Avenias

Weberda wrote: »

Avenias wrote: »

Saturn wrote: »

Well it's not 100% PvP nor 100% PvE. If you want more PvE content the Imperial City will give it to you through the two new Dungeons (The Imperial Prison and The White-Gold Tower) and the questline inside the City. I do have a few friends that would never set their feet in Cyrodiil to just fight other players, but promise of new gear and unexplored content will bring people who don't like PvP to the Imperial City. No doubt about it.

Wrong, its 100% pvp. The dungeons are just for *** and giggles. The only way to get the TV gear is through pvp.

TV stones drop from NPC mobs. most of us consider that PvE, not PvP.

Which is in a tight pvp zone, and you expect other players to do what exactly? Dance with you?

Weberda

Avenias wrote: »

Weberda wrote: »

Avenias wrote: »

Saturn wrote: »

Well it's not 100% PvP nor 100% PvE. If you want more PvE content the Imperial City will give it to you through the two new Dungeons (The Imperial Prison and The White-Gold Tower) and the questline inside the City. I do have a few friends that would never set their feet in Cyrodiil to just fight other players, but promise of new gear and unexplored content will bring people who don't like PvP to the Imperial City. No doubt about it.

Wrong, its 100% pvp. The dungeons are just for *** and giggles. The only way to get the TV gear is through pvp.

TV stones drop from NPC mobs. most of us consider that PvE, not PvP.

Which is in a tight pvp zone, and you expect other players to do what exactly? Dance with you?

No, I expect the other players will mostly be of my faction since the IC is going to cause further entrenchment of the buff servers. Whether I go in solo or with a guild group players from other factions will not be one of my fears.

Avenias

Weberda wrote: »

Avenias wrote: »

Weberda wrote: »

Avenias wrote: »

Saturn wrote: »

Well it's not 100% PvP nor 100% PvE. If you want more PvE content the Imperial City will give it to you through the two new Dungeons (The Imperial Prison and The White-Gold Tower) and the questline inside the City. I do have a few friends that would never set their feet in Cyrodiil to just fight other players, but promise of new gear and unexplored content will bring people who don't like PvP to the Imperial City. No doubt about it.

Wrong, its 100% pvp. The dungeons are just for *** and giggles. The only way to get the TV gear is through pvp.

TV stones drop from NPC mobs. most of us consider that PvE, not PvP.

Which is in a tight pvp zone, and you expect other players to do what exactly? Dance with you?

No, I expect the other players will mostly be of my faction since the IC is going to cause further entrenchment of the buff servers. Whether I go in solo or with a guild group players from other factions will not be one of my fears.

To assume IC will be like what pvp is now is hilarious. IC will be the complete opposite of what pvp is now because now there is an incentive of actually killing another player.

Sykis

I personally think there are too many predisposed ideas of how this will turn out. It is easy to assume that the PVEers are going to be nothing more then cannon fodder but again IC will be within a faction war zone and the TV stones go to the killing blow. So assuming PVPers will hold up inside for the sole purpose of destroying PVEers is a little narrow minded. Those same PVPers will have to contend with the same issues any solo or group of people will have to deal with. Meaning they will have other players and npcs that will be taking them on. The new area has not even gone public yet and the information released is at best vaguely summarized with a lot of the details withheld. I for one can't wait to test the new DLC and if it is something I don't like then I will not play it. I love freedom and plan to use my freedom of choice to determine my fate in ESO.

Pallmor

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit or OP skill, right?).

Avenias

Pallmor wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit of OP skill, right?).

Just give it a month or 2, u'll see exactly that. The losses need to pile up first. Once it gets to the point where people starts saying that they could have made their entire set using the lost stones, and when the vast majority of stones are compiled among only the top tier players, thats when you will start seeing IC die off.

Lunerdog

Pallmor wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit or OP skill, right?).

I too was thinking that the amount of cries and demands from pvp'rs for nerfs to numerous skills and classes will go through the roof.

Methinks sympathy for their plight may be in short supply

hiyde

Samadhi wrote: »

Things become much more clear in this light.

The issue is not that PvE players are being "forced" into PvP content.
The issue is that Solo PvE players feel "forced" into Group PvE content.

Can totally respect that Solo PvE players feel they have no home outside of the 15+ original storyline zones. All PvE content since launch, aside from the Justice System (where the PvP content was removed making it pure Solo PvE), has been group PvE content.
None of the PvE content that is being enhanced for Imperial City is favourable to Solo PvE players who adamantly dislike PvP. This makes perfect sense why ZOS should change a good PvP system.

No wait, that is actually a different concern for ZOS to handle than nerfing creative and interesting PvP mechanics.
PvE players being dissatisfied with PvE systems constitutes a very real concern -- Tel Var stones are not a PvE system though, they are a PvP system.

The issue, for me at least, is that for the first time in nearly a decade of playing MMO's, as a primarily solo/PvE player, I cannot craft *any* on-level gear without engaging in PvP, Group PvE or buying mats from the auction house.

I have no problem with doing group PvE content for the best PvE gear.
I have no problem with PvP if I want the best PvP gear.
I DO have a problem with not being able to solo harvest mats to make *any* on-level gear for myself.
It's the bartering or raiding for base mats that I find disappointing.

Let me say that it's about time PvP players got additional content. It's about time the center of the PvP map got filled in for you. PvP players have endured (and continue to endure) serious challenges and I commend those that have stuck through it.

Lootable Stones:

I'm not a strong PvPer and this is a complete turn-off for me, but it doesn't mean I want to take the new system away from others. I would prefer, though, that whatever is lootable is directly tied to PvP items and not be the primary way a solo player (or PvE group player for that matter) has to obtain their end-game mats/gear. (Nor do I think it's fair that a PvP player would have to PvE raid to get the best PvP gear)

Let's also acknowledge the fact that for 6 VR levels now, 3 level cap raises (and over a year?), solo PvE players will be grinding their way to endgame in the same zones. Talk about burnout.

I'm an ESO+ member with 2 accounts. I'm going to get access to this content. The game is absolutely worth the $30/month I spend. If I weren't a subscriber, I'd have a hard time justifying this purchase to myself, for the type of player that I am.

And that's a shame, because I believe, with some simple tweaks, they could broaden the appeal of this DLC.
For instance: create a meaningful pathway, outside of kiosks, for solo players to accumulate *base mats* to craft *base gear*. Something more than 5 mats a day from a hireling.

Solo PvE dailies in a non-pvp instance, for example. (Perhaps a few solo Dungeons?). For those that played LOTRO, remember the daily crafting instances that had a good (but not crazy) amount of resources you could get each day? Clone a few delves, fill them with V16 mobs that drop gear to decon, and you have a solo pathway to craft basic end-game gear. Limit them to once a day and toss in a daily quest or two with base mats (not stones) as a reward.

Drama Drama Drama:

I know that I'm shouting into the wind on an internet forum, but the constant reaction (from both sides) of assuming the worst intent of each other, passive-aggressive posts directed at anyone at ZoS who takes time to provide an answer, and overall rudeness to each other does nothing to help this game improve.

A little maturity and consideration for other's likes / point of view would go a long way.

Pangnirtung

I have a hunch that for all the moaning from both sides that until the IC has been on the PTS for a month no one and that menas not even ZOS knows how it will flesh out when it goes live.

This is a hilarious thread. Inflammatory and sensational. PVE'ers are crying and whining? Huh?

Hard core PVPers seem worried about the griefers and gankers.

I don't like PVP. It's not for me but I appreciate that there are those that do and more power to them. If the IC is all about PVP great. I would like some of that love but I can dabble in the IC or I can wait for Orsinium.

Rather than try and predict these worst case scenarios maybe the most productive thing is to wait until we actually get to see how it works before we suggest and condemn. That goes for both sides not just us "whiney, crybaby" PVEers.

marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO

Ok so....here are the people that so far will purchase or get this DLC


1. Current players with subs (included) Note: PVP players
2. Unsubbed players with 10000000 crowns: Note: PVP players
3. New players who will get ganked in IMP city by Vr16 players: who will have to purchase the DLC with crowns

Is this DLC suppose to generate money or just keep players happy?
because this business design does not look very smart.

marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO

Pallmor wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit or OP skill, right?).

I agree....it's going to be interesting reading the forums when this is released....probably better than playing the game...
can't wait.

Ysne58

DDuke wrote: »

Ysne58 wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

Good thing you are not trying to market your product for mass consumption. At the end of the day it is all about the cash flow and if catering to the 10% hardcore pvpers doesn't produce the sales then the focus will shift and changes will be made.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/196972/do-you-plan-on-getting-the-imperial-city-dlc/p1

With 6.6% margin of error & 99% confidence, 51% of the population will buy this DLC.

I don't know where you get your 10% from.

It's easier to lie with statistics than to tell the truth. There is absolutely no way a poll from a forum like this can reach the level of scientific validity.

Actually there is, I suggest you study margin of error and how it functions.

If you feel the poll is rigged or biased, I would like you to present proof of that.
Good luck, considering the person who made that poll even voted "no" on it.

...

This is not a random sample you are polling from. Nor do you have a large enough sample to work with.

The biggest problem with your analysis, is you don't know how large the population of ESO players is. For that reason alone, your analysis fails.

I don't know how many people who no longer subscribe are going to choose not to purchase that content. I do know some of them are not going to purchase.

I also don't know how many of the people who still subscribe will play, nor do I know how many will decide this poor decision on the part of ZOS to encourage poor behavior will be the last straw. It's going to be interesting to find out. However, your poll is no more accurate than anything a "psychic" would predict.

DDuke

Ysne58 wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

Ysne58 wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

NobleNerd wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

Good thing you are not trying to market your product for mass consumption. At the end of the day it is all about the cash flow and if catering to the 10% hardcore pvpers doesn't produce the sales then the focus will shift and changes will be made.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/196972/do-you-plan-on-getting-the-imperial-city-dlc/p1

With 6.6% margin of error & 99% confidence, 51% of the population will buy this DLC.

I don't know where you get your 10% from.

It's easier to lie with statistics than to tell the truth. There is absolutely no way a poll from a forum like this can reach the level of scientific validity.

Actually there is, I suggest you study margin of error and how it functions.

If you feel the poll is rigged or biased, I would like you to present proof of that.
Good luck, considering the person who made that poll even voted "no" on it.

...

The biggest problem with your analysis, is you don't know how large the population of ESO players is. For that reason alone, your analysis fails.

I don't know how many people who no longer subscribe are going to choose not to purchase that content. I do know some of them are not going to purchase.

I also don't know how many of the people who still subscribe will play, nor do I know how many will decide this poor decision on the part of ZOS to encourage poor behavior will be the last straw. It's going to be interesting to find out. However, your poll is no more accurate than anything a "psychic" would predict.

Sigh...

You don't need to know the total population to determine public opinion. That's kind of the point of margin of error.
Again, I advise you to read how science works in this instance rather than coming up with your own conclusions.

But lets assume this game had 10 million players (more than generous). With that number, we can still set the margin of error to 6.5%.

Here, have a calculator: http://www.polarismr.com/polaris-help-center/stat-calc-margin-of-error


Next time before commenting & making a fool of yourself, study how things work in the real world.

Rinmaethodain

marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit or OP skill, right?).

I agree....it's going to be interesting reading the forums when this is released....probably better than playing the game...
can't wait.

I can see the nerffest coming. Ill laugh out loud about every pvper who will even squeak that some ability needs to be nerfed.

EQBallzz

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

There you have it, from the Horse's mouth.

If you don't do PVP, then you have no reason to buy Imperial City. It's not for you. period.

there is no point in continuing to complain about the Tel Var Stones. It's not designed for you, so you have no reason to bother with it. Just save your money for Orsinium, and let the PVPers have their expansion.

I feel sorry for the Ganker tryhards who thought they were going to get some easy Carebear prey, but this Expansion is for PVPers, and no PVE Carebear should spend money on it, per ZOS. time to git gud scrubs. have fun getting stomped by real PVPers.

The fact something was supposed to be designed to be meant only for PVP players doesnt mean execution of such plan is faulty and lacks sense.

Imperial city meant for PVP player? Why PVE content then? Why IC only VR16 gear?
If all that PVP players love to do is killing other players why IC have PVE content:
- dungeons
- crafting stations
- mobs

Why does ZOS LURE PVE players into the supposed to be "IC meant for PVP players" zone with PVE content and then declare "IC is for PVP players, you no like it you wait for other DLC"?

That makes no sense. Unless the whole reason for that is to lure PVE players into IC, shut their mouth from ANY SINGLE Complain about broken mechanics of harassment and griefing (stealing TV stones, camping spots and preveinting access to paid content) by simply stating "IC is for pvp player" and all of that just to provide a cannon fodder to so called PVP players who seek challenge and in fact want to leech on other work.

I have about 65 active players in my guild. I was on TS yesterday not even one of them plans on buying IC. Even the people who enjoy pvp are turned off by the player loot mechanic. The place will be deserted in less than a month I bet.

That just means more stones for the people who do enter the Imperial City.

Nope that means you will be sitting there with your gank squad and have noone to kill and unless you start doing PVE no stones.

As a Nightblade, patience is one of my virtues. Eventually, there will be a tender, gankable man or mer passing by.

You are assuming that these tender (?), gankable men or mer had the opportunity to do anything that netted TV stones before you or someone else found them. It won't take long for people to stop going in there when their stuff is promptly removed which will create a system of too many vultures..too little carrion. I only wish IC had a spectator mode so I could watch the vultures fighting over the scraps and eventually each other. If you think easy PvE marks will stick around for continual PvP abuse I think you don't know PvE players very well.

The really funny thing will be the crying from the PvP players (that aren't as good as they thought they were) who end up playing the role of these "tender (?), gankable men and mer" for the actual PvP players who have 800 CP and mad skills. I can see the wave of posts exclaiming, "XXX skill/class is OP!!!1 pls nerf it! because I keep dying!!" posts that will be flooding the forums. I guess we get to see the real whiners then.

EQBallzz

GaldorP wrote: »

You get two new PvE group dungeons. And you might still give the IC districts and the sewers a chance. Try them. Maybe they won't be as horrible as you thought they would be, and maybe you'll even find some fun and excitement there as someone who normally hates PvP (who would hate PvP in general though? Most card games, board games, or sports are PvP, too)

I think if players were going up against other reluctant, equally novice type players for the occasional pvp bout while exploring/working on quests/collecting stones that would be one thing but we all know how this is really going to go. PvE players with little to no experience, few/no PvP abilities unlocked, no PvP specific gear and few CP will be absolutely demolished by experienced, well geared players who know all the "tricks" to PvP and have huge CP advantages. It won't be pretty.

And for all those who had serious concerns about the CS creating inequities in PvP that would create an insurmountable gap between players with huge CP and those without this update is the culmination of those fears realized. Do people really think novice or inexperienced players going up against one or more seasoned PvP players with hundreds and hundreds of CP will really end well? Even for players wanting this type of "content" if they are not geared out with the best gear and sporting lots of CP they will be at a huge disadvantage.

Pallmor

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Saying that the expansion, which has PvE content embedded in it is somehow 'not for PvE'ers' is utter idiocy.

The PvE MAJORITY have waited a very long time for new content, and have been fed a line? Is that what you are claiming?

If, as seems readily apparent, this dlc is the stomping ground of no-lifers and FOTM cookie cutters and every else is a walking victim, then this game is going to die, and deservedly so.

I for one don't believe for one minute that the 'chests' with unlootable TV Stones will be equivalent to what is available to a camping NB in just a tiny fraction of the time invested.

The PvP'ers who think this scenario is 'wonderful' need to wake up and smell the coffee. PvP is horribly unbalanced. It isn't going to be balanced by the dlc. The PvE builds necessary to take down the harder bosses in IC will be borderline useless against the NB posse at the bottlenecks on the way out. So, should your assumptions about what Zenimax are doing are correct, PvE will wither - as Orsinium isn't going to be out for a LONG time.

And as PvE withers, so goes revenue, and you'll be left with piles of stones you can't sell 'cos the only people on the market will be the other no-lifers.

Congrats, you'll finally have the selfish little game you deserve, so you can locust onto the next one and crash and burn that one with your endless whining for PvP-centricity.

MaximusDargus wrote: »

marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit or OP skill, right?).

I agree....it's going to be interesting reading the forums when this is released....probably better than playing the game...
can't wait.

I can see the nerffest coming. Ill laugh out loud about every pvper who will even squeak that some ability needs to be nerfed.

The problem is that PvP nerfs often harm the PvE community too. PvP players crying like little girls about players "perma-blocking" in Cyrodil is about to make it a LOT harder to tank effectively in PvE (and tanking in this game was already difficult to begin with, with such poor taunts).

Avenias

EQBallzz wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

MaximusDargus wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

ZOS_RichLambert wrote: »

I've seen this mentioned a few times in various threads now, so i'll clarify some here. Imperial City is meant for the PVP player - it's their turn for some love. If you love PVE and are clamoring for more of that type of content, the Orsinium DLC will be exactly what you want.

There you have it, from the Horse's mouth.

If you don't do PVP, then you have no reason to buy Imperial City. It's not for you. period.

there is no point in continuing to complain about the Tel Var Stones. It's not designed for you, so you have no reason to bother with it. Just save your money for Orsinium, and let the PVPers have their expansion.

I feel sorry for the Ganker tryhards who thought they were going to get some easy Carebear prey, but this Expansion is for PVPers, and no PVE Carebear should spend money on it, per ZOS. time to git gud scrubs. have fun getting stomped by real PVPers.

The fact something was supposed to be designed to be meant only for PVP players doesnt mean execution of such plan is faulty and lacks sense.

Imperial city meant for PVP player? Why PVE content then? Why IC only VR16 gear?
If all that PVP players love to do is killing other players why IC have PVE content:
- dungeons
- crafting stations
- mobs

Why does ZOS LURE PVE players into the supposed to be "IC meant for PVP players" zone with PVE content and then declare "IC is for PVP players, you no like it you wait for other DLC"?

That makes no sense. Unless the whole reason for that is to lure PVE players into IC, shut their mouth from ANY SINGLE Complain about broken mechanics of harassment and griefing (stealing TV stones, camping spots and preveinting access to paid content) by simply stating "IC is for pvp player" and all of that just to provide a cannon fodder to so called PVP players who seek challenge and in fact want to leech on other work.

I have about 65 active players in my guild. I was on TS yesterday not even one of them plans on buying IC. Even the people who enjoy pvp are turned off by the player loot mechanic. The place will be deserted in less than a month I bet.

That just means more stones for the people who do enter the Imperial City.

Nope that means you will be sitting there with your gank squad and have noone to kill and unless you start doing PVE no stones.

As a Nightblade, patience is one of my virtues. Eventually, there will be a tender, gankable man or mer passing by.

You are assuming that these tender (?), gankable men or mer had the opportunity to do anything that netted TV stones before you or someone else found them. It won't take long for people to stop going in there when their stuff is promptly removed which will create a system of too many vultures..too little carrion. I only wish IC had a spectator mode so I could watch the vultures fighting over the scraps and eventually each other. If you think easy PvE marks will stick around for continual PvP abuse I think you don't know PvE players very well.

The really funny thing will be the crying from the PvP players (that aren't as good as they thought they were) who end up playing the role of these "tender (?), gankable men and mer" for the actual PvP players who have 800 CP and mad skills. I can see the wave of posts exclaiming, "XXX skill/class is OP!!!1 pls nerf it! because I keep dying!!" posts that will be flooding the forums. I guess we get to see the real whiners then.

Of course pvp players are going to get smashed eventually. The pool of people farming IC will keep diminishing as they become the btm of the food chain. Dont forget that, the only purpose of a weaker player in IC is to be a food source for top rank players. Top rank players are going to farm the living hell out of majority of the population who enters till they have had their fill, and there is not a dam thing you can do about it. Also considering the amount of stone you are going to need to buy your set, its going to be a nice long farm of weaker players. So if your not part of the elite group, its best to stay away or not even bother buying IC.

After top tier players are done farming, the power gap between them and the vast majority of the remaining players will be even bigger, making weaker players becoming an even easier source of food.

Jimbob6

Wolfshead wrote: »

I still think is a shame that 1st go out and write so it sound that IC was for both PvP and PvE and when true come out it was big PvP patch why not go out say for start instead everyone have been wait for IC for on quakecon last year IC sound the is was both for PvP and PvE but fact is if i want to go in to IC and do content i got super gank by everyone just incase i get those stone well work plan.

Saying it is FOR both PvP and PvE crouds is different than saying it INCLUDES both PvP and PvE. Theoretically, those statements should mean the same thing, but due to the snobby and separatist attitude of PvE players, they refuse to play alongside PvPers.

As a PvPer, I like PvE mixed in with my PvP, so I'm happy with it. Seeing as this is not catered to exclusionary PvEers like you, why do you care if my PvP has some PvE in it?

I wouldn't be upset if the next PvE update had some PvP in it. In fact I would be thrilled with it.

Adrastes

Only groups and PVP?. No thanks for me then. I hope likeminded people take a look what this expansion is before using any money on it. For PVP only people, have fun. i hope next PVE expansion comes really soon. i don't think i will be playing much till that.

Hope499

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

PvE-centric players form the significant majority of the paying playerbase.

Saying that the expansion, which has PvE content embedded in it is somehow 'not for PvE'ers' is utter idiocy.

The PvE MAJORITY have waited a very long time for new content, and have been fed a line? Is that what you are claiming?

If, as seems readily apparent, this dlc is the stomping ground of no-lifers and FOTM cookie cutters and every else is a walking victim, then this game is going to die, and deservedly so.

.

You sound like such an entitled cry baby....

My God man...grow a pair. I am so happy this DLC is making people like you upset...words cannot describe.

I truly hope you buy this DLC, just so I can steal your stones (sounds like you are in dire need of 2 stones in particular though...).

Samadhi

helediron wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

.

angel59 wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Tel Var stones are a PvP system. If you do not want to engage in PvP over stones, do not enter the map where stones are the primary impetus for combat.

No, Tel Var stones are in a PVP area, they are not a PVP system. If this was truly a PVP system, then AP should be the loot-able currency in IC (however, not outside of IC in Cyrodiil so PVP can collect them without fear of losing them). That would be a real risk/reward for PVP'ers. Why add a new currency to buy items that may be of interest to PVE when there is already a currency that can be used? It seems to me that ZOS, regardless of what they may say, intended to invite PVE into the city by offering something that can only be obtained in IC. We don't even know what all the new sets are (unless I missed the list and details) and they may be very useful for PVE. I wont believe this is only PVP until I see that the sets in IC are only useful in IC.

Tel Var stones function differently from AP, and there is a clear reason not to simply continue using AP.

Some of us already have hundreds of thousands to millions of AP points saved up.

ZOS most likely does not want players buying complete sets on day 1 of the new system.

I would be fine with using AP for the new sets instead of stones, and then just having the system be one where dying to other players subtracted a % of my total AP pool.
That would also mean I would be rich as hell as soon as the DLC launches because I could get my new gear and sell a ton of gears to other players.

What Tel Var does for PvP is provide a meaningful risk/reward system to the PvP zone.
A PvE player would be worth 50 stones or less if a PvP player killed them.
A PvP player who has spent the past hours killing other players could be worth several thousand stones if another PvP player killed them.
In contrast the current AP system rewards the same amount of AP for ganking a Quester in a town as it does for killing a rank 40+ experienced PvPer.

PvE mob drops are simply a distribution system that does not allow for the abuse via farming and hoarding that AP has already facillitated.

The entire system surrounding Tel Var stones can function in its entirety if nobody who dislikes PvP ever enters into Imperial City.

If anyone wants Tel Var gear specifically that strongly, he or she can PvP for them like anyone else, or buy them in a guild trader.

So there would be no harm to PvP if TV stones drop also in IC dungeons. ZOS put major PvE content to PvP DLC. There is nothing in the TV stones that needs them to be locked only into PvP. In fact TV stones are the token system very much waited in PvE to replace pure RNG drops.

ZOS could also make a new token system for the new PvE dungeons to give the new PvE gears instead of dropping them.
No one is asking for that idea here though; everyone just wants to make the system worth less for PvP players.

Having PvE dungeons be the source of a risk/reward PvP currency makes no sense though, and harms the engineered scarcity ZOS has devised for stones.

helediron wrote: »

MsPtibiscuit wrote: »

helediron wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

.

angel59 wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Tel Var stones are a PvP system. If you do not want to engage in PvP over stones, do not enter the map where stones are the primary impetus for combat.

No, Tel Var stones are in a PVP area, they are not a PVP system. If this was truly a PVP system, then AP should be the loot-able currency in IC (however, not outside of IC in Cyrodiil so PVP can collect them without fear of losing them). That would be a real risk/reward for PVP'ers. Why add a new currency to buy items that may be of interest to PVE when there is already a currency that can be used? It seems to me that ZOS, regardless of what they may say, intended to invite PVE into the city by offering something that can only be obtained in IC. We don't even know what all the new sets are (unless I missed the list and details) and they may be very useful for PVE. I wont believe this is only PVP until I see that the sets in IC are only useful in IC.

Tel Var stones function differently from AP, and there is a clear reason not to simply continue using AP.

Some of us already have hundreds of thousands to millions of AP points saved up.

ZOS most likely does not want players buying complete sets on day 1 of the new system.

I would be fine with using AP for the new sets instead of stones, and then just having the system be one where dying to other players subtracted a % of my total AP pool.
That would also mean I would be rich as hell as soon as the DLC launches because I could get my new gear and sell a ton of gears to other players.

What Tel Var does for PvP is provide a meaningful risk/reward system to the PvP zone.
A PvE player would be worth 50 stones or less if a PvP player killed them.
A PvP player who has spent the past hours killing other players could be worth several thousand stones if another PvP player killed them.
In contrast the current AP system rewards the same amount of AP for ganking a Quester in a town as it does for killing a rank 40+ experienced PvPer.

PvE mob drops are simply a distribution system that does not allow for the abuse via farming and hoarding that AP has already facillitated.

The entire system surrounding Tel Var stones can function in its entirety if nobody who dislikes PvP ever enters into Imperial City.

If anyone wants Tel Var gear specifically that strongly, he or she can PvP for them like anyone else, or buy them in a guild trader.

So there would be no harm to PvP if TV stones drop also in IC dungeons. ZOS put major PvE content to PvP DLC. There is nothing in the TV stones that needs them to be locked only into PvP. In fact TV stones are the token system very much waited in PvE to replace pure RNG drops.

If you loot TV stones in dungeons, it would destroy the "Risk vs Reward" system since you would be able to safely farm TV stones (this would definitely turn the open part of IC into a ghost-town).
If you reduce the number of TV stones gained in dungeons, the idea would arguable.

So you actually need the PvE players there. This is the dilemma PvP players need to sort out by themselves. Do they want risk&reward game exactly they want in ghost town, or with PvE players but compromised to cater PvE needs.

Incorrect. We would "need the PvE players there" because there would no longer be any reward associated with the risk in the system.
As soon as the reward dropped off, the associated risk would drop off, and Imperial City would provide nothing new in the way of PvP systems.
Your suggestion is what would turn it into a ghost town to begin with.
So long as the system is not changed in the way you mentioned, the system functions in its entirety without the participation of anyone who does not like PvP,

There would be no reason to buy Imperial City and venture beyond Cyrodiil.

Samadhi

Syntse wrote: »

helediron wrote: »

MsPtibiscuit wrote: »

helediron wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

.

angel59 wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Tel Var stones are a PvP system. If you do not want to engage in PvP over stones, do not enter the map where stones are the primary impetus for combat.

No, Tel Var stones are in a PVP area, they are not a PVP system. If this was truly a PVP system, then AP should be the loot-able currency in IC (however, not outside of IC in Cyrodiil so PVP can collect them without fear of losing them). That would be a real risk/reward for PVP'ers. Why add a new currency to buy items that may be of interest to PVE when there is already a currency that can be used? It seems to me that ZOS, regardless of what they may say, intended to invite PVE into the city by offering something that can only be obtained in IC. We don't even know what all the new sets are (unless I missed the list and details) and they may be very useful for PVE. I wont believe this is only PVP until I see that the sets in IC are only useful in IC.

Tel Var stones function differently from AP, and there is a clear reason not to simply continue using AP.

Some of us already have hundreds of thousands to millions of AP points saved up.

ZOS most likely does not want players buying complete sets on day 1 of the new system.

I would be fine with using AP for the new sets instead of stones, and then just having the system be one where dying to other players subtracted a % of my total AP pool.
That would also mean I would be rich as hell as soon as the DLC launches because I could get my new gear and sell a ton of gears to other players.

What Tel Var does for PvP is provide a meaningful risk/reward system to the PvP zone.
A PvE player would be worth 50 stones or less if a PvP player killed them.
A PvP player who has spent the past hours killing other players could be worth several thousand stones if another PvP player killed them.
In contrast the current AP system rewards the same amount of AP for ganking a Quester in a town as it does for killing a rank 40+ experienced PvPer.

PvE mob drops are simply a distribution system that does not allow for the abuse via farming and hoarding that AP has already facillitated.

The entire system surrounding Tel Var stones can function in its entirety if nobody who dislikes PvP ever enters into Imperial City.

If anyone wants Tel Var gear specifically that strongly, he or she can PvP for them like anyone else, or buy them in a guild trader.

So there would be no harm to PvP if TV stones drop also in IC dungeons. ZOS put major PvE content to PvP DLC. There is nothing in the TV stones that needs them to be locked only into PvP. In fact TV stones are the token system very much waited in PvE to replace pure RNG drops.

If you loot TV stones in dungeons, it would destroy the "Risk vs Reward" system since you would be able to safely farm TV stones (this would definitely turn the open part of IC into a ghost-town).
If you reduce the number of TV stones gained in dungeons, the idea would arguable.

So you actually need the PvE players there. This is the dilemma PvP players need to sort out by themselves. Do they want risk&reward game exactly they want in ghost town, or with PvE players but compromised to cater PvE needs.

I have to agree with helediron here. Think the guy somehow talked himself to a corner here. "If TV stones would be in the dungeons IC would be ghost town" What? the PvP players would be in the dungeons instead of IC, collecting the stones, enjoying their risk&reward?

So what you are saying if there would be possibility for players that would not like to participate to PvP get stones by other means nobody would go to IC to collect them? Where did the PvP players go that wanted the risk&reward type of play? Or has it always been that PvE scrubs comes to take the risk and PvP Pros collect the rewards?

The PvP players would be in Cyrodiil and the PvE players would be in the dungeons.
There would be no more reward associated with the risk, because the PvP gears would be cheap and freely available to PvP players without having to even enter Imperial City to engage in PvP -- they would be flooding the guild traders.
Save money and stick to Cyrodiil at that point.

Since there would be no reward, there would also be no real risk.
Dropping stones to another player would be trivial because the gear would have no real value anyway.
Since the system would provide nothing in terms of new gameplay, it would provide no incentive to buy the DLC.

Samadhi

hiyde wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Things become much more clear in this light.

The issue is not that PvE players are being "forced" into PvP content.
The issue is that Solo PvE players feel "forced" into Group PvE content.

Can totally respect that Solo PvE players feel they have no home outside of the 15+ original storyline zones. All PvE content since launch, aside from the Justice System (where the PvP content was removed making it pure Solo PvE), has been group PvE content.
None of the PvE content that is being enhanced for Imperial City is favourable to Solo PvE players who adamantly dislike PvP. This makes perfect sense why ZOS should change a good PvP system.

No wait, that is actually a different concern for ZOS to handle than nerfing creative and interesting PvP mechanics.
PvE players being dissatisfied with PvE systems constitutes a very real concern -- Tel Var stones are not a PvE system though, they are a PvP system.

The issue, for me at least, is that for the first time in nearly a decade of playing MMO's, as a primarily solo/PvE player, I cannot craft *any* on-level gear without engaging in PvP, Group PvE or buying mats from the auction house.

I have no problem with doing group PvE content for the best PvE gear.
I have no problem with PvP if I want the best PvP gear.
I DO have a problem with not being able to solo harvest mats to make *any* on-level gear for myself.
It's the bartering or raiding for base mats that I find disappointing.

Let me say that it's about time PvP players got additional content. It's about time the center of the PvP map got filled in for you. PvP players have endured (and continue to endure) serious challenges and I commend those that have stuck through it.

Lootable Stones:

I'm not a strong PvPer and this is a complete turn-off for me, but it doesn't mean I want to take the new system away from others. I would prefer, though, that whatever is lootable is directly tied to PvP items and not be the primary way a solo player (or PvE group player for that matter) has to obtain their end-game mats/gear. (Nor do I think it's fair that a PvP player would have to PvE raid to get the best PvP gear)
...
A little maturity and consideration for other's likes / point of view would go a long way.

Can totally agree that ZOS needs to provide more Solo PvE content.
There are people who are saying "I don't like PvP, I only like PvE" and ZOS is telling them "here, go do some Group PvE content."

Using the lack of Solo PvE as a justification to nerf a PvP system shows a lack of consideration for the likes and point of view of PvP players who have been waiting for ages for new PvP content though.

The thing you may have to come to terms with is that Tel Var Stones are not going to be an adequate source of crafting mats for anyone regardless of skill at PvP.

Not aware of any PvP player who uses his or her AP to buy PvP gear sets to deconstruct for materials.
If anything, they sell the sets for gold and use that gold to buy materials.

The system obstructing you from gaining crafting materials easily is the system that gives reliance on Group PvE.
The PvP system (Tel Var Stones) is not what is interfering with your progress.

marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO

Great Job in creating this community divided environment ZOS of PVE Vs PVP I just started playing the game since Beta
and truly this is just down right pathetic

Khaos_Bane

Lunerdog wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Its crazy how some of you are still crying like pre-pubescent girls over these stones.

Either grow a pair, and come on in and join us in IC, or honestly, just stfu with the crying....we dont want to hear it anymore, you sound pathetic.

The irony of posts like these is that I suspect that, when IC is actually released, it's going to be the PvPers who are on this forum crying the loudest. Right now you're all celebrating because, in your head, you're going to be the awesome ganker who gets all the stones. But when you all actually get in there and start getting ganked yourselves, I bet you'll be the first ones to run to the forums crying and demanding nerfs (because the guy who killed you MUST have been using a exploit or OP skill, right?).

I too was thinking that the amount of cries and demands from pvp'rs for nerfs to numerous skills and classes will go through the roof.

Methinks sympathy for their plight may be in short supply

Yes, PvP players are some of the most vocal people in any MMO forums. It's unfortunate that every MMO I have played often breaks their game due to balancing classes in PvP, due to PvP'r whine.

Anyway, overall, I'm not really looking forward to this DLC. I am going to get it and PvP from time to time, but wonder what I going to do having to grind my characters to v16 in the same old zones. UHG.

The worst part of this DLC is not ficing the Champion System and increasing vet levels which nearly everyone hates.

I'm just not a big PvP'r because it just always seems to be a bunch of immature kids playing that type of game and it's annoying. I don't want to deny PvP content from people who like it though. One thing I do not like is when they mix PvP and PvE content so you are in PvP when doing PvE content. That's when it gets annoying, I want to PvP when I am in the mood and want to PvE when I am in the mood.