No to VR16

Paske

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

V15 players will need somewhere to go to get their xp. Where exactly will that be?

Crown Store XP potions.

All The Best

Welcome to B2P reality


We are not selling P2W. We are selling convenience.

Sub system is out the window.
Creating new content cost money and time - lots of it.
They have no revenue stream except Crown store. Selling boxes is one trick pony.

Guess this is future of ESO.
New armor sets with new VR ranks and bank it all on XP potions.

You got what you wanted F2P crowd.

Cernow

phairdon wrote: »

parpin wrote: »

so far 4 pages long thread and 90% of people who posted here are against the vr16..if i was developer i would probably think about the whole vr thing..we will see how big this thread will get and how many more are against it.

Question is: what percentage of the player base are we? Whether for or against the change. Do our comments really have that much of an impact of decisions made?

It's worth posting opinions here, for and against, but don't expect them to have much impact[.

They will have made an internal cost-benefit analysis that will be driving this. For example, the benefit of keeping players noses to the grindstone with increased sales of xp boosters versus the cost of customers who decide enough is enough and walk away.

Ultimately the only power any of us has is to vote with our feet - to suck it up and continue to play, or find something else to do with our time (and perhaps money).

UrQuan

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:
In the ESO Live did they or did they not say that the long term plan is still to remove vet ranks, and what they're doing with them in the meantime is just the interim state? If so, what are you claiming they lied about? We may disagree that increasing the VR cap to 16 makes sense to do when the plan is still to remove vet ranks entirely (I know I'm having trouble seeing any sense in doing that), but where exactly is the lie?

Gandrhulf_Harbard

Sharee wrote: »

You can have a proper business plan, you can have confidence, competence and a truckload of passion, and you still won't be able to guarantee that what you planned half a year ago will be possible today.

Very true.

But if your customer see you making genuine efforts towards keeping that promise they are likely to be more forgiving if other factors conspire to make you fail.

Do we have any evidence of this in the last year?

All The Best

lathbury

woah can someone calmly explain why they dislike vet ranks

wraith808

MissBizz wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

MissBizz wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

Thalmont wrote: »

arena25 wrote: »

Ok, what happened? What's with this whole "Veteran Rank 16" craze about? Did QuakeCon already occur or did I just fall asleep?

With how this thread is proceeding you'd have thought you awoke in hell.
Seriously though I'm new to ESO being on Console and all, but I'm VR1 and don't see much issue. I wasn't there for the great 12 month content drought many talk about but you weathered through that so honestly how is 2 VR all that bad?

It's more the point that the last thing we heard from ZOS a few months back was that they were planning on literally phasing out the VR. Now we hear they are increasing the VR cap. Just another lie. Another betrayal...

Well, in ESO live they did say it's a LONG term goal.. so they still want to..

@MissBizz So continue to build upon a flawed, extremely unpopular concept only to remove it years down the road? Which is a direct waste of development dollars. Sorry, I don't buy that.

Well, @nastuug I'm not going to argue you. I definitely didn't say I thought it was smart lol. It does seem super weird to add more when it's said they want to get rid of them.

They realize they need to add content. I think everyone does. But new content without advancement is also self-defeating. And taking the VRs out is a big deal. So... this.

Ackwalan

lathbury wrote: »

woah can someone calmly explain why they dislike vet ranks

An increase in VR without new content. The game was made to be VR10, and game content can you that far. Now there will be 6 levels added with no content added.

Tors

@Acrolas

"Dev 2: SIXTY NINE SIXTY NINE SIXTY NINE"

Your addition to this post made the entire page worth reading on it own.

Thanks

Rylana

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

coryevans_3b14_ESO

lathbury wrote: »

woah can someone calmly explain why they dislike vet ranks

It comes down to people wanting to get to max level faster (put in the simplest of terms).

I could care less. Almost 100 days played on my 4 toons and I just hit v14 on my main the other day. That was the first time I've had a max lvl toon. Didn't make it to v10 before they bumped it to v12. Didn't make it to v12 before they bumped it to v14.

I stop to smell the roses though. I've always taken my time in this game and don't feel the need to grind out levels.

But that's the way I play. I wont presume to tell others to do it my way.

UrQuan

Ackwalan wrote: »

lathbury wrote: »

woah can someone calmly explain why they dislike vet ranks

An increase in VR without new content. The game was made to be VR10, and game content can you that far. Now there will be 6 levels added with no content added.

But every single increase in the cap has come with new content (whether that new content was sufficient to get you from the old cap to the new cap is a separate issue), and it's evident that this one will as well. It's obvious that this increase in the cap will come with the new zones.

Sharee

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

Straightforward would be "we are not removing veteran ranks", but they said no such thing...

coryevans_3b14_ESO

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

That's not a lie since they never said when they were doing it. Parsing words a bit but factually accurate.

Skwor

LMAO I tried and tired to tell posters levels will not go away, whether VR or some other form stop expecting otherwise, well here we are.

I for one am excited about VR16, i think it is a wonderful direction for the game. kudos ZEN!

UrQuan

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

So are you saying that on 2 July 2015 they didn't also say that they're still going to be removing vet ranks eventually? I'm genuinely asking. Did they or did they not say that the removal of vet ranks is still the long-term plan? If they did, then you're, frankly, lying about what ZOS "lied" about. If they didn't, then you may have a point.

Sharee

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Now, if they had said: We are removing VR eventually, but in the meantime we may need to add a level or two.

You may have a point about them not lying.

Ehm... that's kinda what they did say?

coryevans_3b14_ESO

Skwor wrote: »

LMAO I tried and tired to tell posters levels will not go away, whether VR or some other form stop expecting otherwise, well here we are.

I for one am excited about VR16, i think it is a wonderful direction for the game. kudos ZEN!

I'm happy about all the ideas. But right now that's all they are. I'll believe it when I see it.

Remember how many things they've said for the last year. And then remember how many have happened up to this point.

Rylana

Sharee wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

Straightforward would be "we are not removing veteran ranks", but they said no such thing...

Never heard of a bait and switch have you

Example

Youre paying 10 dollars a month now for service X

Company tells you, the service will be free soon

Company tells you a year later the cost is now 15 dollars a month, but it will be free soon

Now tell me again how your logic plays out as that original statement being anything but a lie

pmn100b16_ESO

posted June 20th:

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

No, didn't get quality content when I paid a subscription and have no intention of buying anything in future cause we all know it'll just be a new zone with solo quests, v16 grind, and a group dungeon dropping new gear. I see nothing original coming to this game.

we did all know right?

/yawn

Rylana

UrQuan wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

So are you saying that on 2 July 2015 they didn't also say that they're still going to be removing vet ranks eventually? I'm genuinely asking. Did they or did they not say that the removal of vet ranks is still the long-term plan? If they did, then you're, frankly, lying about what ZOS "lied" about. If they didn't, then you may have a point.

Except for a year after their first statement they have not done so.

They have not removed vet ranks, have added more. Until they remove vet ranks, period, the statement is a lie.

J2JMC

Shadesofkin wrote: »

I agree with the reasoning they used when they explained that they would have to expand Veteran Ranks for the time being.

You should change your name to shadesofskin

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Not after they've been saying for the past 3 months they are planning to remove them.

Over on Reddit they pretty strongly said that VR Xp requirement would be reduced to around 400k - 500k per vet ranks.

A 15% reduction takes it to 850k; but they're adding two new VRs.

So the actual reduction in overall grind XP is just 2.9%.

Rather than the approx 50% reduction they were talking about.

We are being taken for fools.

All The Best

From what I saw on the video quests were getting a 50% xp buff and Public dungeons were getting a 100% xp buff.

In terms of total xp being reduced they only mentioned a 15% xp reduction. I'll take your word on the math and assume because of the extra levels it equates to only a 2.9% xp reduction.

With that in mind, it still has to be significantly faster to level up with the quest and mob buffs they are putting out no?

Not arguing whether increasing level without content is ok, just talking solely about leveling speed.

Mitchblue

One last time..

WHY ADD LEVELS IF YOUR INTENT IS TO REMOVE THEM AT A LATER TIME??

That makes 0 sense. And no new content so you're grinding the same mobs you were grinding before..

UrQuan

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

So are you saying that on 2 July 2015 they didn't also say that they're still going to be removing vet ranks eventually? I'm genuinely asking. Did they or did they not say that the removal of vet ranks is still the long-term plan? If they did, then you're, frankly, lying about what ZOS "lied" about. If they didn't, then you may have a point.

Except for a year after their first statement they have not done so.

They have not removed vet ranks, have added more. Until they remove vet ranks, period, the statement is a lie.

Oh, I guess I missed the part where they actually gave us a time frame for when VR would be removed. Can you please point me to it?

Rylana

Mitchblue wrote: »

One last time..

WHY ADD LEVELS IF YOUR INTENT IS TO REMOVE THEM AT A LATER TIME??

That makes 0 sense. And no new content so you're grinding the same mobs you were grinding before..

Because what all of the fanboys in the thread wont admit, is that zos has no intent of removing vet ranks, they are kicking the can down the road hoping we will forget they ever said that.

meanwhile in a crown store near you, XP potions.

UrQuan

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Now, if they had said: We are removing VR eventually, but in the meantime we may need to add a level or two.

You may have a point about them not lying.

Ehm... that's kinda what they did say?

Today, maybe.

Oh, they did say what you just claimed they didn't say? Hmm, interesting. What does that make you?

Sharee

Rylana wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

Straightforward would be "we are not removing veteran ranks", but they said no such thing...

Never heard of a bait and switch have you

Example

Youre paying 10 dollars a month now for service X

Company tells you, the service will be free soon

Company tells you a year later the cost is now 15 dollars a month, but it will be free soon

Now tell me again how your logic plays out as that original statement being anything but a lie

Unless they factually state that veteran ranks are NOT being removed, you cannot accuse them of lying. (and even then it would be debatable, because a statement of intent and a promise are two different things)

As for your 'bait and switch' examples: Yes, they have changed their mind in the past. Does that mean they will again? Maybe. Should we start bashing them over it already, just because they might?
Please.

Appren

Seriously? *** this. So much for planning on removing VR levels. Nono, just add a couple levels so that everyone has to remake all their gear for no real reason.

Rune_Relic

Chufu wrote: »

I don't understand Eric Wrobel when he talked. What was the exactly reason for VR 16? Can somebody who understands Eric better explain that to me again?

Reading between the lines.... Imperial City
Just like craglorn went from V12 to V14 even though vet system was going.

Rylana

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

Now, if they had said: We are removing VR eventually, but in the meantime we may need to add a level or two.

You may have a point about them not lying.

Ehm... that's kinda what they did say?

Today, maybe.

Oh, they did say what you just claimed they didn't say? Hmm, interesting. What does that make you?

Doesnt matter if they said it or not. They said flat out a year ago they were removing vet ranks, period.

Now a year later, they still havent done so, but are instead raising the level cap again, and again restating they will remove them

Stop playing forum chess here and realize you sound like an ass defending zos on soundbite and technicality and dont realize that every time they do anything EXCEPT completely remove vet ranks, they are fulfilling a lie.

Are you done shill?

Mitchblue

Sharee wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

OK, @Gandrhulf_Harbard and @Rev Rielle since you're two of the people who are most vocally saying "ZOS lied" in this thread, I'm calling you guys out on it:

I never said ZOZ lied.

I said the correct solution to lying was NOT don't say anything, but to tell the truth.

But I do think they lied.

If I tell you I intend not to rob you, then rob you, but then explain I meant I won't rob you six months from now did I lie?

All The Best

That's nothing at like what happened. So what is the lie that you think ZOS has told? Spell it out for me, because I'm not seeing anything but conspiracy theories coming from you...

"We are removing veteran ranks" - September 2014

"Veteran Rank 16 next update" - July 2015

Pretty straightforward, would you like another?

Straightforward would be "we are not removing veteran ranks", but they said no such thing...

Never heard of a bait and switch have you

Example

Youre paying 10 dollars a month now for service X

Company tells you, the service will be free soon

Company tells you a year later the cost is now 15 dollars a month, but it will be free soon

Now tell me again how your logic plays out as that original statement being anything but a lie

Unless they factually state that veteran ranks are NOT being removed, you cannot accuse them of lying. (and even then it would be debatable, because a statement of intent and a promise are two different things)

As for your 'bait and switch' examples: Yes, they have changed their mind in the past. Does that mean they will again? Maybe. Should we start bashing them over it already, just because they might?
Please.

YEP.