How do you feel about the B2P announcement

yngvilrundeb16_ESO

I've calmed down considerably today, but you're not off the hook ZoS! If you start to introduce P2W elements to the game, for example in the crown shop, I will be on your neck 24/7, nagging until you remove it. I'll mobilize my entire guild as well. We're keeping an eye on you, don't go the SWTOR and LOTRO path please, those MMOs are ruined.

zaria

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

Slurg wrote: »

Conflicted. On one hand I fear it means return of the bots and entry of a new game population that is less civilized. A lot of good contributing community members are likely leaving over this and who will take their place?

On the other hand, it looks like I'll finally get that pet dog!

By shelling out more cash!

I think they should be giving out a whole throne room full of crowns to those of us who have funded their console and B2P development through subscriptions since the beginning, not the pittance we are getting.

Bots will not be an huge problem unless they slack down on the hunting, you still have to pay for the game.
And yes this is another stupid issue, buying the game is a mental roadblock, not the monthly fee.
On the other hand this will draw player types we don't want.

tryia3b14a_ESO

Dislike - fears of new content slowing down

I enjoy other buy to play games such as Guild Wars 2, The Secret World, and Diablo 3, but ESO has hardly made any new content in the last year. I think they added a new high level zone that some of us more casual players will never see, and some bug fixes, and that's about it.

I fear with less sub money, it will only get worse.

tryia3b14a_ESO

Dislike - fears of new content slowing down

xtago wrote: »

AH93 wrote: »

Corporate greed will always prevail. People need to learn this, they care about money, nothing else.

There's no money to be made with a F2P model in the western MMO markets there's a big reason why WoW and Eve online have always stayed as pay a sub to play.

Oh and to this, I just want to say, what data do you have to back this up?

Microtransactions are extremely popular in Western markets, besides who even cares about "western markets", a company should be concerned with "worldwide":

http://venturebeat.com/2014/01/20/10-online-pc-games-that-made-more-than-100m-in-microtransaction-sales-last-year/

I just want to point out in this link that the 213 million dollars that World of Warcraft brought in is only counting micro-transactions, not subscription fees. All they sell in their cash shop are cosmetic mounts and cosmetic pets.

Delte

Dislike - fears of new content slowing down

You all know what will happen when they can not generate enough cash from cosmetics and DLC alone right?

How would you like to buy a horse or even worse 10 apples for £5 from the cash shop to level it up.

Skyshards they half what is in the game and the rest you have to buy from the cash shop.

PvP yes this never goes well with cash shops end of discussion. They will add speed buff potions, exp buff potions, alliance point buff potions etc etc. Even the war machines like the catapult where you can buy a hardier type or better ammo with real money. The Secret World has these kinds of potions which I deem as pay to win.

Soul gems where you can only buy Grand Soul gems from the shop, or even worse they are found in lock boxes.

Why look for materials and motifs when you can buy them? LOTRO cash shop has a section where you can buy all this with real money.

Races and classes locked behind a pay wall or even weapons and armour. All free to play games do this.

B2P or F2P they are the same the only difference is the initial fee where you buy the game box. After that the mmo's are exactly the same in terms of cash shop content.

The devs said many times they will not be going free to play and they have geared up for subscription type service. This is one of the main reasons I bought the Imperial edition and played the game. If they had been honest and said they would go to a Buy to Play after a year of release I would not of bothered with the game at all. I feel lied to and cheated.

I hope this game burns in flames.

inflaburwb17_ESO

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

LOL you obviously havent played GW2 or RIFT.

I agree. Just a small example of what type of gimmicks to expect: In Rift you need to pay real cash to access the ingame auction house/tradepost.

With ESO, I knew that once my subscription was paid, I had access to everything. The in-game community was the friendliest I have come across. Even when doing Dungeon runs, folks were patient.

With the crowd that will come into the game now, expect swearing, name-calling, no patience with casual players if you end up in a group etc etc. I am bitterly, bitterly disippointed.

If you look at the nonsense Arenanet has been getting up to with GW2, with their cash store gimmicks, gem conversion fiasco, attempts at making the game a proper eSport... and how their audience have responded...

I sidder to think whats coming to ESO. From a profitable niche subscription game, we are going to a mass-market attractor of scum.

I will be cancelling my subs.

inflaburwb17_ESO

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

zaria wrote: »

adriant1978 wrote: »

Dislike especially because of the pressure the cash shop model will bring to add glitzy but lore-breaking content. There'll be pink unicorns and anime outfits before you know it.

This, and this is the nature of an cash shop, you have to add stuff lots of people want to pay for, it will be a pressure to do so even if it hurt the game long term.

The pay for dlc sounds nice but is a giant bug trap, how do you handle this in two years and 15 dlc, many late players will skip the earlier dlc and only get the latest with the current end game stuff.
Now this should work for dungeons but that about other content, think stuff like the justice system who interact with lots of the game.
How to handle just some players have that dlc?

And don't forget... ESO prided itself in not have in-game festival to accompany real world events (Xmas, Easter, Halloween), because it went 'against the lore'.

Well, since ZOS is now bending for the F2P society, lets see how long that lasts before you will be hunting for Candied Corn and Presents.

....and keys...

SantieClaws

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

Another little nasty that LOTRO had up their sleeves was the introduction of a second in game currency that could only be purchased with cash (mithril coins) (or very large amounts of the currency they gave to subscribers - turbine points). Then they gradually made many important things in game purchaseable only with this cash bought currency. So even if you subbed you still needed to stump up more cash for many things.

Edit: Was listening to Beauty of Dawn on the way to work this morning (ESO soundtrack). One line seemed to sum things up nicely. "pride fuels the deadly fire, that destroys our tower of gold". Pride and greed - boils down to the same thing really.

bellanca6561n

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

B2P/F2P is the classic distinction without a difference.

Yet with no meaningful updates and bug fixes in six weeks for versions 3, 4, and 5 indicating no dedicated Live Team, I doubt they have to resources to support PC/Mac/PS4/XB1, cash shop stock, major new content releases and such without a major increase in revenue.

So we're stuck in some meaningful sense, either way.

It won't be the same. But was "the same" sustainable or even all that good?

I felt I was reaching the end before the announcement. Many people were. Many people have.

In so many ways an online game BEGINS development AFTER its release. This is why developers and publishers need to be very, very careful about what they promise before they release their game.

And this is the true failure here. The reality is hard to argue with. The real and implied promises and assorted communication failures are the heartbreakers here.

Grapdjan

Like - all of the "likes" above

Moezilla wrote: »

Unsubbed


Zenimax,
You have 30 days.

Hilarious.

AngryNord

Disappointed, slightly, given how they've toted that "they'd rather shut the game Down than go F2P" (yes, B2P and F2P isn't the same, but the difference isn't THAT big), and that they promised us v1.6 on live in 'early January' even though they had to have known by then that B2P was coming...

S_Ravenlock

Like - all of the "likes" above

I love it! I actually only just bought the game yesterday thanks to the B2P announcement. It's a great idea and will bring many more players to the game.

Vicodine

Like - other

Ok, I`ve had a good night sleep and now see it from a different angle.

I actually am starting to like the idea - given they don't screw it up with the crown shop. The last thing I would like to see is "ads" all through the game for items from the crown shop. Even a screen that opens when you login telling you what`s new, what's discounted, what's hot would *** me off. It has no place in ESO.

But now I see it that I'll be getting something more for my subscription, you know the chance to buy a costume or a pet once in awhile, the +10% bonus I don;t give a rat's ass about but it's still nice.

So - still a same game, still will be subscribed, but will be getting something a little more for my money.

I'm not goint to say that I'm excited. I've even seen it in the face of Matt during the special "ESO LIVE" session he ain't that excited either. It ain't poker face. He seemed sad or indifferent. And saying things like "people playing now are the hardcore ...."...bla bla bla made me feel like there's not much success in ESO as of now.

Nazon_Katts

@S_Ravenlock welcome to the den, then!

Here, have a fishy stick!

gunplummer

Like - all of the "likes" above

If the cash shop is like GW2 i would be ok with it. Being able to buy additional bag & bank space or other vanity items would be nice. Also more pop in VR zones is always a plus, but i will miss the exclusiveness of a paid sub community. Even GW2 can get pretty packed and create a lot of lag issues. However, the B2P decision has made me strongly consider switching to console.

SteveCampsOut

Like - other

I like that I can now stop paying a subscription to support content I don't enjoy like Craglorn. I like that I will be able to purchase DLC like Housing when it comes out and ignore Imperial City and still keep playing the way I want to play. That's how I feel about it.

burningcrow

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

This pole shows all those people on the forums burning others for their concerns about these changes are the minority. The majority is concerned with this change and we are justified in asking our questions.

ricku1967

Like - other

i have always been against F2P and P2W formats..its never good. but, if they keep it the way they are describing it, i don't see the problem. this will be B2P, people still need to spend $60 to play it and fork over more money for DLC's. the "crown" shop will be cosmetic and the gems and potions are no better quality than what is already at venders in the game right now..nothing is P2W. The people that have been playing since day one will get something no one else will ever have plus get perks if they continue to pay that no one else will have. seems like they are trying to make everyone happy. Now, if they ever add pay gates, or make it a P2W system. then i will just move on to other games. after all, they arent forcing me to play this game. i do have a choice. just like everyone else does. if people don't trust them, or are just mad about this, then stop playing the game. it really is just that simple.

Soulshine

Dislike - other

How do I feel about the announcement? Totally non-pulsed. I am about as surprised by it as I am by traffic. Once you have been exposed to the likes of Turbine, this seems tame in comparison. I am not doing anything with my sub for the time being until I see what they actually put in the store and what happens with the content they long ago said they would deliver. If they are going to be charging for it as well as my sub, buh-bye.

SteveCampsOut

Like - other

burningcrow wrote: »

This pole shows all those people on the forums burning others for their concerns about these changes are the minority. The majority is concerned with this change and we are justified in asking our questions.

You really must be new to the interwebz! Forum polls show nothing more than a vocal minority at best! Those who are happy with the changes aren't going to stop playing and come to the forums if they're not already in the habit of doing so. Just the disgruntled rush here to complain and vote. I personally just have a forum addicted personality or I wouldn't be here. I'm actually playing the game happily on my main monitor right now.

Wifeaggro13

Dislike - fears of new content slowing down

I was fine with the B2P announcement i knew the game would eventually go freemium.

What i am not ok with is

1). The will be charging subs for content that should be recieved fro free like the guilds and skill lines. unless they intended to do a full blown expansion with a new Area's, features and class/race for 40 bucks. but charging 19.99 plus your sub for a guild a new crappy zone that is scaled . is a massive issue for me.

2). Scaled content ? really now. your gonna through generic scaled zone at me charge me my sub plus another 20 bucks for a scaled zone. that has no true end game content when i have 2 VR 14 chr's. Am currently working in the end game activites and you want to turn this into a completely different game from what i purchased? this is cheese ball . I am certin you hired EA to manage your game now . i have no problem paying for cosmetics and stuff like that . but charging me 20$ for crappy content thats the same as a newby zone only with more HP on the mobs and hit harder. ill pass.

ricku1967

Like - other

@Wifeaggro13, where does it say "Scaled content" or what you said in #1? what i heard them say is "if you are already paying a sub fee, nothing will change, you will get 10% boosts to everything, receive all future DLC's, and you will get 1,500 month crown points. you will also receive 100 crowns for every month you have subcribed in the past year. and players that have been in game from the beginning with receive something very special no one will ever get, we will announce what that is next month". i didnt see anywhere that they said anything you mentioned in #1 or #2 ..if you saw that somewhere, please provide a link

Wifeaggro13

Dislike - fears of new content slowing down

ricku1967 wrote: »

@Wifeaggro13, where does it say "Scaled content" or what you said in #1? what i heard them say is "if you are already paying a sub fee, nothing will change, you will get 10% boosts to everything, receive all future DLC's, and you will get 1,500 month crown points. you will also receive 100 crowns for every month you have subcribed in the past year. and players that have been in game from the beginning with receive something very special no one will ever get, we will announce what that is next month". i didnt see anywhere that they said anything you mentioned in #1 or #2 ..if you saw that somewhere, please provide a link

go listen to firor's speech

ricku1967

Like - other

i watched the entire twitch broadcast yesterday..and not one mention of anything you wrote. if you already are paying a sub fee and continue to do so, nothing will change. the game you are playing now will not change in the slightest. you will not be paying a sub fee and pay for DLC on top of that sub fee. DLC's will be included if you continue paying the sub fee. this is what you will get if you continue paying a sub fee "
An allotment of crowns to spend in the new in-game Crown Store based on your membership period (more below)
Access to all of ESO’s downloadable content (or DLC) game packs for the duration of your membership
A 10% bonus to XP and gold gain, crafting research, and inspiration

more at this link http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/01/21/your-guide-to-eso-plus-premium-membership

daneyulebub17_ESO

Dislike - other

My sig sums up my feelings about it.

Wifeaggro13

Dislike - fears of new content slowing down

ricku1967 wrote: »

i watched the entire twitch broadcast yesterday..and not one mention of anything you wrote. if you already are paying a sub fee and continue to do so, nothing will change. the game you are playing now will not change in the slightest. you will not be paying a sub fee and pay for DLC on top of that sub fee. DLC's will be included if you continue paying the sub fee. this is what you will get if you continue paying a sub fee "
An allotment of crowns to spend in the new in-game Crown Store based on your membership period (more below)
Access to all of ESO’s downloadable content (or DLC) game packs for the duration of your membership
A 10% bonus to XP and gold gain, crafting research, and inspiration

more at this link http://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/2015/01/21/your-guide-to-eso-plus-premium-membership

the getting DLC's with sub does change my feelings a bit i mis understood his meaning. but he clearly says all future content will scale. A lvl 1 will can do the same stuff max CHR can. My main concern is the quality of content here what is not misunderstood is him clearly saying future DLC zones would completely scale to your chr's lvl. This is not a good direction for the end game player or those that gutted the horrible experience of lvling through VR ranks to attain acess to trials and VR dungeons

AlexDougherty

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

Nazon_Katts wrote: »

@S_Ravenlock welcome to the den, then!

Here, have a fishy stick!

Um, Fishy Sticks (or Fish Fingers as we Brits call them) aren't as tempting as you think.

Now if you want to offer us Sticky Toffee Pudding and Custard (Rhubarb Crumble and Custard will do in a pinch ) then I'll be placated.

HeroOfNone

I'm lukewarm on the decision. I had a bit of back and forth in stream last night with Freyah and chat with a lot of the points made here. What it comes down to is what they execute. They can say they won't pay to win, but it is their product we're paying for, they hold the rights to change it and will do so to make a profit and keep the lights on.

I know a lot feel hurt or betrayed by this, but what ever promises you think we're made, most of them we made in our own minds based on previous failed MMOs. There was no gaurentee that there wouldn't be a change in payment structures at some point. Given the announcement of consoles coming out at the same time I feel they couldn't get around Xbox and PS4's subscription requirements, so B2P was the only economical option. They are letting us PC users know NOW since a difficult decision was made. Folks complain about transparency but if they were in negotiations with Microsoft and Sony I think it would be a poor tactic to whisper to us "hey, if they don't play ball and reduce their sub fee we mayou need to go B2P

As for those saying "We've been paying for nothing!" That's pretty self centered as well. You'very been paying retail price to experience a new game and gotten loyalty rewards, high chances at what are now rare drops, quick leveling exploits, and a lot of time and experience in a game that is now sliding back to outlet prices with additional content you requested on the way. Not saying that it's a good or bad thing, but you still have something new players won't.

Player rage aside, I feel it could be good or bad, depending on community response. Look at it this way, folks have been saying ESO would be going F2P a month after release. Some were saying it negatively and others were asking for it, so they eventually came up with this B2P model that allows for some free elements and some purchasable elements. If we want to avoid a lot of the NOs in the pole, we need to be vocal about what positive things we *** from the system and how we're willing to spend our money.

And for the majority still here, just please remember to keep some positivity in your response and to be critical, not overly demanding. If you only just complain and rant, prepare to be marginalized. Why? Because if you're just shitting over everything they do and not willing to give anything into the system, why cater to any of your demands? If you are threatening to leave or are already gone, what do you think your opinion is worth? Realize if you put something out there and others get behind it that they will listen, especially if it help them profit.

Lauradana

Dislike - all of the "dislikes" above

The wife and me both have cancelled our subs that is how much we like this ninja change that these liars have hit us with. Soon it will be pay to win no matter what they "promise" us.

Odditorium

Dislike - other

I don't like paying for bonus exp. It makes me feel cheap and dirty. So, so dirty.