Justice system sugestion (Addition) - Killing Other players in PVE.

RedMiniStapler

I hate PvP with passion, but I really don't give a flying rat's ass if other people play pvp, as long as it doesn't effect my game play.

I was in Cyrodiil to collect skyshards, went to a dungeon and was clearing few mobs, and while i was doing that I got killed by 2 opposite faction veteran players from behind, I didn't even see them, so i figured out what happened after i saw how I died. That was totally "fair fight", but whatever... I was in PvP zone that I voluntarily entered.

Another concern is how to get PvP flagged. So if you attack someone by accident, you'll be flagged for PvP? if that's the case, I can fight a group of mob and use AoE ability, and PvPer can just walk into my AoE attack and I'll get flagged for PvP?

About ganking and corpse camping. Some people don't think that's griefing, but I do.That's like me (a grown up) going to a play ground and beating the living crap outta 6 year old, and stomp on his ass whenever he tries to get up. It's not a fair fight at all, and unfortunately some people find it hilarious and get joy out of it.

these are few of my concern and why i don't want PvP and PvE mixed. I'm not saying it apply to all PvPers, so don't be quote me and *** about it.

For all PvPers, be a bad ass outlaw or a vicious killer, hell you can even kill your own mother in-game til kingdom come, as long as I can pass by unharmed on my mount and say "well... sucks to be her!" and go on my merry way.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

I hate PvP with passion, but I really don't give a flying rat's ass if other people play pvp, as long as it doesn't effect my game play.

I was in Cyrodiil to collect skyshards, went to a dungeon and was clearing few mobs, and while i was doing that I got killed by 2 opposite faction veteran players from behind, I didn't even see them, so i figured out what happened after i saw how I died. That was totally "fair fight", but whatever... I was in PvP zone that I voluntarily entered.

Another concern is how to get PvP flagged. So if you attack someone by accident, you'll be flagged for PvP? if that's the case, I can fight a group of mob and use AoE ability, and PvPer can just walk into my AoE attack and I'll get flagged for PvP?

About ganking and corpse camping. Some people don't think that's griefing, but I do.That's like me (a grown up) going to a play ground and beating the living crap outta 6 year old, and stomp on his ass whenever he tries to get up. It's not a fair fight at all, and unfortunately some people find it hilarious and get joy out of it.

these are few of my concern and why i don't want PvP and PvE mixed. I'm not saying it apply to all PvPers, so don't be quote me and *** about it.

For all PvPers, be a bad ass outlaw or a vicious killer, hell you can even kill your own mother in-game til kingdom come, as long as I can pass by unharmed on my mount and say "well... sucks to be her!" and go on my merry way.

You were in a warzone, if the enemy sees you, expect to be attacked and possibly die. I'm certainly not going to stop and worry about whether or not the fight is fair. Especially when everyone has their own arbitrary standards about what is fair. Some people expect you to announce your presence in some way so... I don't know, maybe they feel they are entitled to attack first or prepare or something. Some people think it's unfair if you are higher level, or if you attack them at all.

It's very unlikely criminals will be open pvp to everyone. It would suck for the criminal more than you, because everyone else wouldn't be attackable by them until said people decided they were ready to jump the criminal. And they would get the first hit in that scenario.

I'm sorry but ganking and corpse camping are not the same as beating up a small child. That is an absurd analogy. I don't agree with corpse camping (and hope it won't be possible,) but ganking is perfectly fine. Just because you don't announce your presence to the enemy or bring a few more people... that's strategy, not griefing. As a nightblade, that is the entire focus of my class.

RedMiniStapler

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

You were in a warzone, if the enemy sees you, expect to be attacked and possibly die. I'm certainly not going to stop and worry about whether or not the fight is fair. Especially when everyone has their own arbitrary standards about what is fair. Some people expect you to announce your presence in some way so... I don't know, maybe they feel they are entitled to attack first or prepare or something. Some people think it's unfair if you are higher level, or if you attack them at all.

I'm sorry but ganking and corpse camping are not the same as beating up a small child. That is an absurd analogy. I don't agree with corpse camping (and hope it won't be possible,) but ganking is perfectly fine. Just because you don't announce your presence to the enemy or bring a few more people... that's strategy, not griefing. As a nightblade, that is the entire focus of my class.

yeah, I get your point, it's clear what you think is fair and what I think is fair are totally different, I don't expect people to announce like "I AM ABOUT TO ATTACK YOU! PREPARE TO DIE!" and blow trumpet before attack me, but at least not while I'm in middle of the fight with mobs with my health down.
I figured that NB are like Rogues in wow, which use stealth mode and stun you till you die, another reason why i don't think some fights are fair, and want nothing to do with PvP.

Best solution would be zenimax opening up PvP server, so all you can have open world pvp and do whatever it is you guys do, but since I don't see that happening, I just hope that my "care bear" ass won't have my game disturbed by PvPers.

Tannakaobi

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

You were in a warzone, if the enemy sees you, expect to be attacked and possibly die. I'm certainly not going to stop and worry about whether or not the fight is fair. Especially when everyone has their own arbitrary standards about what is fair. Some people expect you to announce your presence in some way so... I don't know, maybe they feel they are entitled to attack first or prepare or something. Some people think it's unfair if you are higher level, or if you attack them at all.

Which is why it would be nice to have other forms of PVP. Such as designated area's for dueling and battlegrounds. I like The PVP in Cyrodiil, but it would be nice to have other options also.

It's very unlikely criminals will be open pvp to everyone. It would suck for the criminal more than you, because everyone else wouldn't be attackable by them until said people decided they were ready to jump the criminal. And they would get the first hit in that scenario.

This would be good though if you also added that anyone who 'joins in' that is not on 'guard' duty is also open to be attacked by anyone. Basically it would mean that the PVP would be between criminals and guards, but with the possibility of a mass brawl. I'm probably going a bit far now, but it would be really funny if when a brawl hit a capped amount of players the PVE guard basically shut it down and arrest everyone...

I'm sorry but ganking and corpse camping are not the same as beating up a small child. That is an absurd analogy. I don't agree with corpse camping (and hope it won't be possible,) but ganking is perfectly fine. Just because you don't announce your presence to the enemy or bring a few more people... that's strategy, not griefing. As a nightblade, that is the entire focus of my class.

I'm not down with corpse camping, I see it as exploitation. Ganking is fair game, but I don't do it and I look down on those that do. But ganking is different to making use of an advantage such as more people or stealth.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

You were in a warzone, if the enemy sees you, expect to be attacked and possibly die. I'm certainly not going to stop and worry about whether or not the fight is fair. Especially when everyone has their own arbitrary standards about what is fair. Some people expect you to announce your presence in some way so... I don't know, maybe they feel they are entitled to attack first or prepare or something. Some people think it's unfair if you are higher level, or if you attack them at all.

I'm sorry but ganking and corpse camping are not the same as beating up a small child. That is an absurd analogy. I don't agree with corpse camping (and hope it won't be possible,) but ganking is perfectly fine. Just because you don't announce your presence to the enemy or bring a few more people... that's strategy, not griefing. As a nightblade, that is the entire focus of my class.

yeah, I get your point, it's clear what you think is fair and what I think is fair are totally different, I don't expect people to announce like "I AM ABOUT TO ATTACK YOU! PREPARE TO DIE!" and blow trumpet before attack me, but at least not while I'm in middle of the fight with mobs with my health down.
I figured that NB are like Rogues in wow, which use stealth mode and stun you till you die, another reason why i don't think some fights are fair, and want nothing to do with PvP.

Best solution would be zenimax opening up PvP server, so all you can have open world pvp and do whatever it is you guys do, but since I don't see that happening, I just hope that my "care bear" ass won't have my game disturbed by PvPers.

But why would I wait until you are done with the mobs? No one will do that for me. I don't play fair because I don't expect others to play fair, and as such I am rarely disappointed. I find that pvp seems far less frustrating and upsetting if you don't manufacture rules that make something fair or unfair. Then you don't feel angry when someone doesn't afford you the same courtesy you afford them.

That doesn't mean you should grief or exploit, but you should always play to win, imo. (Though I certainly die plenty.)

Stun in pvp works differently to some degree. If you've stunned mobs before, you might notice that they can still attack, and you have to get that heavy hit in to knock them on their butt. Players aren't going to be as accommodating and sit still while you charge up a heavy attack, so chain stunning someone isn't going to work in the same way. Never mind the billions of ways you can get popped out of cloak. Up to and including a dot you put on another player ticking at the wrong time. It doesn't matter that you are not getting damaged, inexplicably, your dot makes you uncloak.

I feel pvp is, to a great deal, based around cc, and breaking out of cc and moving actively.

RedMiniStapler

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

But why would I wait until you are done with the mobs? No one will do that for me. I don't play fair because I don't expect others to play fair, and as such I am rarely disappointed. I find that pvp seems far less frustrating and upsetting if you don't manufacture rules that make something fair or unfair. Then you don't feel angry when someone doesn't afford you the same courtesy you afford them.

once again, goes back to point where i said what you think is fair and what i think is fair. we can keep write about this until our fingers wear out. "I" personally would never attack someone while they're in disadvantage, and you would (and so would many others). and that's why I don't like PvP and I want nothing to do with it.

Even in PvE, when i see someone getting their face pummeled by a group of mobs, I stop to help them out. I even stop for when npc is in similar situation, like those one npc against 3 npcs type of thing, I don't know, i'm just weird like that.

cracker81

Murmeltier wrote: »

cracker81 wrote: »

I put 4 major categories of players.

Wolves- pvpers that gank pve players, camp any player if possible and any way to make your life hell. Find anyway to exploit the game as well.

Wolves in sheep clothes- pve players that find ways to grief players with no consequence.

Sheep dogs- pvp/pve player that fights other pvpers, kills wolves for fun, wish to kill wolves in sheep clothes, and will help anywhere as long as there is a good fight to be had. Find little joy in killing a pve player.

Sheep's - are just regular old pve players. You could have elite sheep that raid but still same.

As an old Sheep i can`t count how often i kick some unfair Bu*** in PVP but now i know that some self declaimed "Wolves" are only "Sheeps" that used some Advantages, at the End, they die like others .

No, i was joking but to be serious, this Descriptions sounds nice but it is more a psychological Thing, like a PVP Player wants to see the Situation. It sounds like, i am the Hunter because i have the Huntergenetic and you are the Prey because you are born to do so.

The Theorie that a PVE Player cant play in PVP, isn`t right. PVP isn`t very difficult, not more then PVE. You use some other Tactics and they are learned fast. PVP Players often say that PVE Players can`t play PVP but i think it is more to anger the PVE Player.

How good a Player is, depends on his Skills and a Player who can use the right Skills in PVE, can learn to use the right Skills in PVP too. The only Difference is, in PVP you play against other Persons and not KIs but a PVE Player knows the Skills and can train them too.

Look at Youtube and you can find there a lot of Builds/Tactics and Tricks. The most PVP Players are using Tactics or Builds from other Persons, they can`t play really good

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

You were in a warzone, if the enemy sees you, expect to be attacked and possibly die. I'm certainly not going to stop and worry about whether or not the fight is fair. Especially when everyone has their own arbitrary standards about what is fair. Some people expect you to announce your presence in some way so... I don't know, maybe they feel they are entitled to attack first or prepare or something. Some people think it's unfair if you are higher level, or if you attack them at all.

I'm sorry but ganking and corpse camping are not the same as beating up a small child. That is an absurd analogy. I don't agree with corpse camping (and hope it won't be possible,) but ganking is perfectly fine. Just because you don't announce your presence to the enemy or bring a few more people... that's strategy, not griefing. As a nightblade, that is the entire focus of my class.

yeah, I get your point, it's clear what you think is fair and what I think is fair are totally different, I don't expect people to announce like "I AM ABOUT TO ATTACK YOU! PREPARE TO DIE!" and blow trumpet before attack me, but at least not while I'm in middle of the fight with mobs with my health down.
I figured that NB are like Rogues in wow, which use stealth mode and stun you till you die, another reason why i don't think some fights are fair, and want nothing to do with PvP.

Best solution would be zenimax opening up PvP server, so all you can have open world pvp and do whatever it is you guys do, but since I don't see that happening, I just hope that my "care bear" ass won't have my game disturbed by PvPers.

We do the same pve/pvp. Just adds excitement and unexpected outcomes.

nerevarine1138

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

I hate PvP with passion, but I really don't give a flying rat's ass if other people play pvp, as long as it doesn't effect my game play.

I was in Cyrodiil to collect skyshards, went to a dungeon and was clearing few mobs, and while i was doing that I got killed by 2 opposite faction veteran players from behind, I didn't even see them, so i figured out what happened after i saw how I died. That was totally "fair fight", but whatever... I was in PvP zone that I voluntarily entered.

Another concern is how to get PvP flagged. So if you attack someone by accident, you'll be flagged for PvP? if that's the case, I can fight a group of mob and use AoE ability, and PvPer can just walk into my AoE attack and I'll get flagged for PvP?

About ganking and corpse camping. Some people don't think that's griefing, but I do.That's like me (a grown up) going to a play ground and beating the living crap outta 6 year old, and stomp on his ass whenever he tries to get up. It's not a fair fight at all, and unfortunately some people find it hilarious and get joy out of it.

these are few of my concern and why i don't want PvP and PvE mixed. I'm not saying it apply to all PvPers, so don't be quote me and *** about it.

For all PvPers, be a bad ass outlaw or a vicious killer, hell you can even kill your own mother in-game til kingdom come, as long as I can pass by unharmed on my mount and say "well... sucks to be her!" and go on my merry way.

You were in a warzone, if the enemy sees you, expect to be attacked and possibly die. I'm certainly not going to stop and worry about whether or not the fight is fair. Especially when everyone has their own arbitrary standards about what is fair. Some people expect you to announce your presence in some way so... I don't know, maybe they feel they are entitled to attack first or prepare or something. Some people think it's unfair if you are higher level, or if you attack them at all.

It's very unlikely criminals will be open pvp to everyone. It would suck for the criminal more than you, because everyone else wouldn't be attackable by them until said people decided they were ready to jump the criminal. And they would get the first hit in that scenario.

I'm sorry but ganking and corpse camping are not the same as beating up a small child. That is an absurd analogy. I don't agree with corpse camping (and hope it won't be possible,) but ganking is perfectly fine. Just because you don't announce your presence to the enemy or bring a few more people... that's strategy, not griefing. As a nightblade, that is the entire focus of my class.

It's not just unlikely that criminals will be open to everyone, it's actually been confirmed to not be the case by a moderator post on these forums.

Let me repeat: no one can be accidentally flagged as a guard or criminal. It takes deliberate action on the part of all players to join the system.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

But why would I wait until you are done with the mobs? No one will do that for me. I don't play fair because I don't expect others to play fair, and as such I am rarely disappointed. I find that pvp seems far less frustrating and upsetting if you don't manufacture rules that make something fair or unfair. Then you don't feel angry when someone doesn't afford you the same courtesy you afford them.

once again, goes back to point where i said what you think is fair and what i think is fair. we can keep write about this until our fingers wear out. "I" personally would never attack someone while they're in disadvantage, and you would (and so would many others). and that's why I don't like PvP and I want nothing to do with it.

Even in PvE, when i see someone getting their face pummeled by a group of mobs, I stop to help them out. I even stop for when npc is in similar situation, like those one npc against 3 npcs type of thing, I don't know, i'm just weird like that.

Right and I will help people too. I love to help people.

But in pvp, which we've established is not for you, I'm obviously not going to help the other side.

It's not a matter of not being a helpful person or being selfish, it's a matter of survival.

Utildai

They could just put in a flag system...

Logan9a

crislevin wrote: »

ZOS is making a huge mistake in giving in to a small portion of loud complainers, and it's stupid.

QFT

(Unfortunately, catering 'down' does temporarily satisfy the larger portion of the player base. Until they leave to *** the next game out.)

RedMiniStapler

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

But in pvp, which we've established is not for you, I'm obviously not going to help the other side.

It's not a matter of not being a helpful person or being selfish, it's a matter of survival.

But I wasn't talking about being helpful in PvP, Killing someone while they're busy fighting mobs isn't matter of being helpful or not. That's just taking advantage of the situation for as you call it "survival"

Tandor

There's already a system in place for killing other players, it's called PvP and it happens in Cyrodil. Polls here consistently show that two-thirds of players don't want it extended to the open world.

If PvP'ers can't accept that, presumably because they're consistently dying to more able PvP'ers in Cyrodil and so want easier targets such as those who have no wish to fight back or who haven't been artificially buffed up to their level, then why don't they play other games more suited to their needs rather than continually flogging this particular dead horse in relation to this game? ZOS have made it clear they have no intention of implementing open world PvP, accept it or move on.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

But in pvp, which we've established is not for you, I'm obviously not going to help the other side.

It's not a matter of not being a helpful person or being selfish, it's a matter of survival.

But I wasn't talking about being helpful in PvP, Killing someone while they're busy fighting mobs isn't matter of being helpful or not. That's just taking advantage of the situation for as you call it "survival"

part of surviving IS taking advantage of a situation, otherwise all we'd be doing is 1v1 duels all day, and that's not real combat.

You use your surroundings to your advantage. If I go hide behind a hill and come around the other side to attack is that unfair?

That's the whole reason there is pve in cyrodiil to begin with, as a dynamic staging ground for pvp combat.

When I go into a dungeon I am always aware that I might be attacked, if you were not aware of this, now you know.

You don't even really get put out by dying, you just have to do some running.

I don't know what class you are but a lot of times, when I have been killed in dungeons, the enemy hangs around afterwards. I have gotten revenge more than a few times this way. And it's very satisfying.

I think some people see death as a punishment or a personal affront, but death is just part of learning, and part of the story being told. It can be just as fun as surviving.

Tandor

Utildai wrote: »

They could just put in a flag system...

That's fine, as long as the flag can't be accidentally set because a PvP'er deliberately walks into an AOE spell cast by a PvE'er in order to set his flag.

I've even found myself accidentally flagged in another mixed PvE/PvP game because I inadvertently cast a run-by heal on a player when he was fighting a faction NPC, not a neutral mob.

PvE and PvP are best kept separate, that way players of both styles get full enjoyment out of their preferred playstyle and don't interfere with each other. I'd have a lot more respect for PvP'ers if more of them recognised that and called for an open world PvP server instead of trying to force their playstyle into the environment of those who don't want it.

In contrast, PvE'ers aren't remotely looking to force their playstyle on others, in fact they'd be absolutely delighted if PvP'ers had their own open world PvP server and Cyrodil on the main server became consensual PvP. If PvP'ers called on ZOS to implement an open world PvP server I've no doubt that PvE'ers would back it 100%!

cracker81

Death in this game is a joke. It is better to die in a pvp battle than a pve. Why? You don't suffer any durability loss.

cracker81

Tandor wrote: »

There's already a system in place for killing other players, it's called PvP and it happens in Cyrodil. Polls here consistently show that two-thirds of players don't want it extended to the open world.

If PvP'ers can't accept that, presumably because they're consistently dying to more able PvP'ers in Cyrodil and so want easier targets such as those who have no wish to fight back or who haven't been artificially buffed up to their level, then why don't they play other games more suited to their needs rather than continually flogging this particular dead horse in relation to this game? ZOS have made it clear they have no intention of implementing open world PvP, accept it or move on.

It is close 2/5 of players like pvp and 1/5 is on the fence.

RedMiniStapler

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

You use your surroundings to your advantage. If I go hide behind a hill and come around the other side to attack is that unfair?

That's the whole reason there is pve in cyrodiil to begin with, as a dynamic staging ground for pvp combat.

When I go into a dungeon I am always aware that I might be attacked, if you were not aware of this, now you know.

You don't even really get put out by dying, you just have to do some running.

I don't know what class you are but a lot of times, when I have been killed in dungeons, the enemy hangs around afterwards. I have gotten revenge more than a few times this way. And it's very satisfying.

I think some people see death as a punishment or a personal affront, but death is just part of learning, and part of the story being told. It can be just as fun as surviving.

If you were to hide behind a hill and come around the other side to attack, that would be like sucker punch, but still if the other player isn't preoccupied with something and got full health and can defend against you, then it wouldn't be as unfair as mobs+less health.

I went to Cyrodiil that one time, and I haven't been there since. So I don't have to worry about getting attacked by PvPers in dungeons.

I know death is part of the game, but not when it's from players who are several levels ahead of me.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

You use your surroundings to your advantage. If I go hide behind a hill and come around the other side to attack is that unfair?

That's the whole reason there is pve in cyrodiil to begin with, as a dynamic staging ground for pvp combat.

When I go into a dungeon I am always aware that I might be attacked, if you were not aware of this, now you know.

You don't even really get put out by dying, you just have to do some running.

I don't know what class you are but a lot of times, when I have been killed in dungeons, the enemy hangs around afterwards. I have gotten revenge more than a few times this way. And it's very satisfying.

I think some people see death as a punishment or a personal affront, but death is just part of learning, and part of the story being told. It can be just as fun as surviving.

If you were to hide behind a hill and come around the other side to attack, that would be like sucker punch, but still if the other player isn't preoccupied with something and got full health and can defend against you, then it wouldn't be as unfair as mobs+less health.

I went to Cyrodiil that one time, and I haven't been there since. So I don't have to worry about getting attacked by PvPers in dungeons.

I know death is part of the game, but not when it's from players who are several levels ahead of me.

When AM I allowed to attack someone exactly? What if they are looking at their map? Should I dance in front of them so they know I'm there? What if they are riding on their horse? What if they are setting up siege equipment.

If you pvp, then yes death from players that are several level ahead of you is part of the game. You may or may not be paying attention when it happens. Taking out stragglers is extremely effective (and very fun.)

You learn nothing if people make it easy for you. If I patiently wait while someone kills a mob before I engage them, what do they learn? That people will accommodate them when they need it, and that illusion will be quickly dispelled.

Part of the challenge is -always- being on your guard. That's the point of the zone being open pvp. Even when you are fighting npcs, you should always be aware that enemy soldiers could be anywhere. If you are not, that's on you.

Making up arbitrary rules only hurts the person who makes them, because they become upset when no one else follows those rules. Everyone else is not operating under those rules, but they will definitely take advantage of someone trying to use them.

Tandor

cracker81 wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

There's already a system in place for killing other players, it's called PvP and it happens in Cyrodil. Polls here consistently show that two-thirds of players don't want it extended to the open world.

It is close 2/5 of players like pvp and 1/5 is on the fence.

I didn't refer to liking or disliking PvP, I referred to extending it to the open world. As I type this, 62% of players responding to the poll say they would not play the game if it was world PvP orientated. I don't call that close.

Apophiss

magnusnet wrote: »

If you get attacked by other players, then you can defend yourself & kill them. So what will be the limitation afterwards for those outlaws to keep killing players?

magnusnet wrote: »

Dayv wrote: »

magnusnet wrote: »

Dayv wrote: »

So it's not griefing if you interrupt peoplyou've a similar level going about their PvE gameplay? No thanks.

You respawn at the wayshrine and go take your revenge or do an other dungeon in an other area or team up with Heroes who hunt player killers. For each Player Killer you have 10 people eager to end them. I bet you're one of those players who asked for VR zones nerf.

Really, what does this give you that you can't get in Cyrodiil other than a sense that you've p***ed someone off. I'm fine with PvP but it has to be opt in.

Makes game less dull, more exiting, less Hello Kitty like? Now that VR content is a joke there won't be any more challenge in the game....

And yet another thread about "How ESO is boring and it should have PVP everywhere because that's what I want!" discussion.

(Copied from another thread, still applies here.)

Go play games that were designed around the playstyle you are demanding for ESO.

Go play:
Lineage II
Wizardry Online
Mortal Online
Perfect World
Age of Wushu/Wulin
Aion
Tera Rising
Archage
Wildstar
Path of Exile

Just to name a few.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

Apophiss wrote: »

magnusnet wrote: »

If you get attacked by other players, then you can defend yourself & kill them. So what will be the limitation afterwards for those outlaws to keep killing players?

magnusnet wrote: »

Dayv wrote: »

magnusnet wrote: »

Dayv wrote: »

So it's not griefing if you interrupt peoplyou've a similar level going about their PvE gameplay? No thanks.

You respawn at the wayshrine and go take your revenge or do an other dungeon in an other area or team up with Heroes who hunt player killers. For each Player Killer you have 10 people eager to end them. I bet you're one of those players who asked for VR zones nerf.

Really, what does this give you that you can't get in Cyrodiil other than a sense that you've p***ed someone off. I'm fine with PvP but it has to be opt in.

Makes game less dull, more exiting, less Hello Kitty like? Now that VR content is a joke there won't be any more challenge in the game....

And yet another thread about "How ESO is boring and it should have PVP everywhere because that's what I want!" discussion.

(Copied from another thread, still applies here.)

Go play games that were designed around the playstyle you are demanding for ESO.

Go play:
Lineage II
Wizardry Online
Mortal Online
Perfect World
Age of Wushu/Wulin
Aion
Tera Rising
Archage
Wildstar
Path of Exile

Just to name a few.

PVP is already in this game, opt in pvp is coming.

Go play

Gaia
Habbo Hotel
the Sims
Second Life
Hello Kitty Adventures

Just to name a few.

RedMiniStapler

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

When AM I allowed to attack someone exactly? What if they are looking at their map? Should I dance in front of them so they know I'm there? What if they are riding on their horse? What if they are setting up siege equipment.

If you pvp, then yes death from players that are several level ahead of you is part of the game. You may or may not be paying attention when it happens. Taking out stragglers is extremely effective (and very fun.)

You learn nothing if people make it easy for you. If I patiently wait while someone kills a mob before I engage them, what do they learn? That people will accommodate them when they need it, and that illusion will be quickly dispelled.

Part of the challenge is -always- being on your guard. That's the point of the zone being open pvp. Even when you are fighting npcs, you should always be aware that enemy soldiers could be anywhere. If you are not, that's on you.

Making up arbitrary rules only hurts the person who makes them, because they become upset when no one else follows those rules. Everyone else is not operating under those rules, but they will definitely take advantage of someone trying to use them.

yup, that's exactly what you should do, take off all your gears, and dance in front of the opposing players until they notice you.

Since i don't PvP, i don't agree with your point of view, and you don't agree with my point of view. but feel free to educate me more, maybe then I might understand little better.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

RedMiniStapler wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

When AM I allowed to attack someone exactly? What if they are looking at their map? Should I dance in front of them so they know I'm there? What if they are riding on their horse? What if they are setting up siege equipment.

If you pvp, then yes death from players that are several level ahead of you is part of the game. You may or may not be paying attention when it happens. Taking out stragglers is extremely effective (and very fun.)

You learn nothing if people make it easy for you. If I patiently wait while someone kills a mob before I engage them, what do they learn? That people will accommodate them when they need it, and that illusion will be quickly dispelled.

Part of the challenge is -always- being on your guard. That's the point of the zone being open pvp. Even when you are fighting npcs, you should always be aware that enemy soldiers could be anywhere. If you are not, that's on you.

Making up arbitrary rules only hurts the person who makes them, because they become upset when no one else follows those rules. Everyone else is not operating under those rules, but they will definitely take advantage of someone trying to use them.

yup, that's exactly what you should do, take off all your gears, and dance in front of the opposing players until they notice you.

Since i don't PvP, i don't agree with your point of view, and you don't agree with my point of view. but feel free to educate me more, maybe then I might understand little better.

It's really a hypothetical situation we are dealing with to begin with. I am trying to explain to you why your idea of fair isn't feasible in pvp.

As in, you will die using those rules, and no one else uses, and you will be unhappy all the time because no one is following the rules you set.

But, like I said, it is entirely hypothetical since you don't pvp. I'm just trying to enlighten you as to why those two players jumping you in a dungeon were not doing anything wrong.

Fair doesn't even enter into it. I don't think many people gauge a good fight by whether or not it is fair, or even really have an idea what that entails.

billp_ESO

A few simple rules is all that it would take:
- to be in PvP, you either have to go into a PvP zone, or flag yourself
- no flagged player can affect a non-flagged character in any way, and vice versa
- nobody can be flagged unless they do it on purpose

But the minute they force PvP onto players that don't want to PvP, is the minute the game starts dying.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

billp_ESO wrote: »

A few simple rules is all that it would take:
- to be in PvP, you either have to go into a PvP zone, or flag yourself
- no flagged player can affect a non-flagged character in any way, and vice versa
- nobody can be flagged unless they do it on purpose

But the minute they force PvP onto players that don't want to PvP, is the minute the game starts dying.

yes if they don't fulfill your needs the game will die, obv.

nerevarine1138

billp_ESO wrote: »

A few simple rules is all that it would take:
- to be in PvP, you either have to go into a PvP zone, or flag yourself
- no flagged player can affect a non-flagged character in any way, and vice versa
- nobody can be flagged unless they do it on purpose

But the minute they force PvP onto players that don't want to PvP, is the minute the game starts dying.

Strange. That's exactly what the justice system is.

billp_ESO

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

billp_ESO wrote: »

A few simple rules is all that it would take:
- to be in PvP, you either have to go into a PvP zone, or flag yourself
- no flagged player can affect a non-flagged character in any way, and vice versa
- nobody can be flagged unless they do it on purpose

But the minute they force PvP onto players that don't want to PvP, is the minute the game starts dying.

yes if they don't fulfill your needs the game will die, obv.

Yes, 2/3'rds of the votes here are NO, no PvP. If Zeni wants to *** off 2/3 of their player base, go ahead. Perhaps the game can live on 1/3 of the players. I don't think so.

billp_ESO

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

billp_ESO wrote: »

A few simple rules is all that it would take:
- to be in PvP, you either have to go into a PvP zone, or flag yourself
- no flagged player can affect a non-flagged character in any way, and vice versa
- nobody can be flagged unless they do it on purpose

But the minute they force PvP onto players that don't want to PvP, is the minute the game starts dying.

Strange. That's exactly what the justice system is.

Good. Make it completely optional, with no way to affect players who don't want to PvP, then you are fine.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO

billp_ESO wrote: »

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

billp_ESO wrote: »

A few simple rules is all that it would take:
- to be in PvP, you either have to go into a PvP zone, or flag yourself
- no flagged player can affect a non-flagged character in any way, and vice versa
- nobody can be flagged unless they do it on purpose

But the minute they force PvP onto players that don't want to PvP, is the minute the game starts dying.

yes if they don't fulfill your needs the game will die, obv.

Yes, 2/3'rds of the votes here are NO, no PvP. If Zeni wants to *** off 2/3 of their player base, go ahead. Perhaps the game can live on 1/3 of the players. I don't think so.

forums in no way represent the majority of the players.

the point is. EVERYONE always say that if whatever they don't want to happens happens the game will die. It's hollow.