Official Feedback Thread for Nightblades

Khamira

Some quick feedback from this one:

Breathing flames deals, well, Fire Damage.
Electrocuting things, well, Shock Damage.
If you freeze your oponent, well, that's Frost Damage.
When you use some mystical mumbo jumbo that kills, that's, well, ummm..... Magic?

The same goes to other type of damage when they got separated.

So, if you poison your target, its Poison (derp.), sneezing on someone gives him healing debuff and overall illnes.
When you JUST stab things?
Well, that's Physical Damage.

And there goes my feedback based on above logic.

If some ability is Magicka based, and deals some weird damage that comes from some weird source, this ability deals just Magic Damage.

But.

When the same applies to Stamina abilities, and ability is clearly non-elemental, non-poisonous and it's not sneezing on someone - damage should be Physical.

That's why Killers Blade and other Stamina based class skills should deal Physical Damage.

And about ultimates that are used by both types of DD and deal only Magic damage.

Game should check if someones Stam/Mag and/or Weapon/Spell Damage is higher and change accordingly. Unless ability deals clearly some kind of elemental or other type of damage.

Because putting poison or disease somewhere without any explanation is just stupid.

Helluin

Khamira wrote: »

And about ultimates that are used by both types of DD and deal only Magic damage.

Game should check if someones Stam/Mag and/or Weapon/Spell Damage is higher and change accordingly. Unless ability deals clearly some kind of elemental or other type of damage.

Because putting poison or disease somewhere without any explanation is just stupid.

This would be the best solution atm.
Otherwise to add a star in Champion System just for Ultimates can be another option.

Tavore1138

Kalebron wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

We Stamina users wont be going back to E.S.O., Elder Staves Online ever again ZOS, maybe some people like you are on console and missed the 1st year and a half on PC but I was there and we will not go back to having Magicka Builds be almost unstoppable, so realize that this is not just about yourself, look at the bigger picture.

Why are you trolling the forums if you quit the game? I honestly don't understand why people think they can dictate the type of content released by a provider. They make a game, you play it. If you don't like it, pick up and move on...

Yeah but if you keep encouraging people to leave... well... there's a word for people that play with themselves...

Don't need the negativity in the forums because it will prevent others from wanting to play an already awesome game. I know it is laggy from time to time but I have played many MMO's and this is by far the best and the only one that I have seen with transparency and willingness to accept ideas from it's fan base. And also, there is a word for people who are not nice...

Indeed shame on me for criticising people like you who tell other players to leave - don't know what I was thinking about.

Kayrne

Helluin wrote: »

Khamira wrote: »

And about ultimates that are used by both types of DD and deal only Magic damage.

Game should check if someones Stam/Mag and/or Weapon/Spell Damage is higher and change accordingly. Unless ability deals clearly some kind of elemental or other type of damage.

Because putting poison or disease somewhere without any explanation is just stupid.

This would be the best solution atm.
Otherwise to add a star in Champion System just for Ultimates can be another option.

Another good idea ... Yeah but i think wrobel will say somethin like: " Eh the Stamina nightblade works just fine ..." i am really pissed that ZOS didnt give feedback yet in this thread.

Derra

olsborg wrote: »

Helluin wrote: »

Lifecode666 wrote: »

As mentioned by others.
Killers blade should deal physical damage.
Staminamorph.

This for sure but the issue is also with:
- Power Extraction (magic damage - stamina morph)
- Assassin's Will (magic damage)
- Ultimates (magic damage)
- Skills and Ultimates of Fighters Guild (physical + magic damage)

The changement to CP should address this as well otherwise changing the kind of damage skills and Ultimates would be more complicated, creating then an issue for magicka builds.

Yip. This obviously wasnt an issue pre CP system, but now it very much is an issue, wich the devs should adress asap imo.

Could be quite easily fixed by making elemental expert buff all magica based dmg and mighty buff als stamina based dmg. That way ultimates which scale of your higher resources anyway would always benefit from the dmg CP you´ve invested in.

Essiaga

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

if im understanding this correctly:

it means that i will have zero stamina regen while im in sneak?

allright, so if i go into sneak to move around and place myself behind some one for a sneak attack, by the time i get to the right position to do the attack i will probably be completely out of stamina?

Also:
if i try to stay in sneak and move around i will never at any time gain or recover ANY stamina, untill i completely STAND UP and leave sneak to regain stamina?

Also:
if i try to travel in sneak in cryodiil as i have since beta 2013, i will only be able to go a few feet and then have to again STAND UP and leave sneak every few seconds in order to continue traveling?

That's just bad for all classes and builds. I'm not a fan of hiding in plain sight but if no one can sneak then there's no tactics but to zerg and zerg hard. Whats the point of vamp speed sneak then? Its bad enough magicka builds don't have the stam to sneak as it is. They also break stealth to buff up. This will slow the game down in some ways and speed it up in others.

Why does ZOS hit things with a bat, stab it, then shoot it, then run it over with a car, then a truck, then a tank, then shot it with the tank, then drop a bomb on it from a jet, then nuke it?

Cloak nerf to save the DOTs etc. was ok.
Magelight ... a bit OP (and hopefully rolled back a bit before it goes Live).
No regen in sneak? ... this is the overkill and reaches far beyond the NB class.

Shame on you ZOS. Maybe no regen in perma-Cloak but sneak? Who asked for this?

bowmanz607

Essiaga wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

if im understanding this correctly:

it means that i will have zero stamina regen while im in sneak?

allright, so if i go into sneak to move around and place myself behind some one for a sneak attack, by the time i get to the right position to do the attack i will probably be completely out of stamina?

Also:
if i try to stay in sneak and move around i will never at any time gain or recover ANY stamina, untill i completely STAND UP and leave sneak to regain stamina?

Also:
if i try to travel in sneak in cryodiil as i have since beta 2013, i will only be able to go a few feet and then have to again STAND UP and leave sneak every few seconds in order to continue traveling?

That's just bad for all classes and builds. I'm not a fan of hiding in plain sight but if no one can sneak then there's no tactics but to zerg and zerg hard. Whats the point of vamp speed sneak then? Its bad enough magicka builds don't have the stam to sneak as it is. They also break stealth to buff up. This will slow the game down in some ways and speed it up in others.

Why does ZOS hit things with a bat, stab it, then shoot it, then run it over with a car, then a truck, then a tank, then shot it with the tank, then drop a bomb on it from a jet, then nuke it?

Cloak nerf to save the DOTs etc. was ok.
Magelight ... a bit OP (and hopefully rolled back a bit before it goes Live).
No regen in sneak? ... this is the overkill and reaches far beyond the NB class.

Shame on you ZOS. Maybe no regen in perma-Cloak but sneak? Who asked for this?

Sneaking didn't used to regeneration stamina. In fact, on live if you don't have enough sneak r3duction/Stam recovery you still won't regeneration stamina. This really is not that big of an issue. Between ledger main reduce cost and champ tree reduce cost you can get the sneak cost extremely low. 8t really is not a game changer like people think.

Also, the vamp sneak passive is even more valuabke. Fast sneak in general is more valuable. You will still lose the same amount of stamina no matter how fast you are. You don't lose more stamina because you move quicker. Having faster sneak speed means that this nerd will effect you less then a player who does not have increased sneak speed.

Basically, they made it so people had to spec into sneak in order to do better at it.

CtrlAltDlt

Teleport strike needs a minimum range.

Kalebron

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

We Stamina users wont be going back to E.S.O., Elder Staves Online ever again ZOS, maybe some people like you are on console and missed the 1st year and a half on PC but I was there and we will not go back to having Magicka Builds be almost unstoppable, so realize that this is not just about yourself, look at the bigger picture.

Why are you trolling the forums if you quit the game? I honestly don't understand why people think they can dictate the type of content released by a provider. They make a game, you play it. If you don't like it, pick up and move on...

Yeah but if you keep encouraging people to leave... well... there's a word for people that play with themselves...

Don't need the negativity in the forums because it will prevent others from wanting to play an already awesome game. I know it is laggy from time to time but I have played many MMO's and this is by far the best and the only one that I have seen with transparency and willingness to accept ideas from it's fan base. And also, there is a word for people who are not nice...

Indeed shame on me for criticising people like you who tell other players to leave - don't know what I was thinking about.

It's criticizing not "criticising"

Xeniph

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Essiaga wrote: »

dwemer_paleologist wrote: »

if im understanding this correctly:

it means that i will have zero stamina regen while im in sneak?

allright, so if i go into sneak to move around and place myself behind some one for a sneak attack, by the time i get to the right position to do the attack i will probably be completely out of stamina?

Also:
if i try to stay in sneak and move around i will never at any time gain or recover ANY stamina, untill i completely STAND UP and leave sneak to regain stamina?

Also:
if i try to travel in sneak in cryodiil as i have since beta 2013, i will only be able to go a few feet and then have to again STAND UP and leave sneak every few seconds in order to continue traveling?

That's just bad for all classes and builds. I'm not a fan of hiding in plain sight but if no one can sneak then there's no tactics but to zerg and zerg hard. Whats the point of vamp speed sneak then? Its bad enough magicka builds don't have the stam to sneak as it is. They also break stealth to buff up. This will slow the game down in some ways and speed it up in others.

Why does ZOS hit things with a bat, stab it, then shoot it, then run it over with a car, then a truck, then a tank, then shot it with the tank, then drop a bomb on it from a jet, then nuke it?

Cloak nerf to save the DOTs etc. was ok.
Magelight ... a bit OP (and hopefully rolled back a bit before it goes Live).
No regen in sneak? ... this is the overkill and reaches far beyond the NB class.

Shame on you ZOS. Maybe no regen in perma-Cloak but sneak? Who asked for this?

Sneaking didn't used to regeneration stamina. In fact, on live if you don't have enough sneak r3duction/Stam recovery you still won't regeneration stamina. This really is not that big of an issue. Between ledger main reduce cost and champ tree reduce cost you can get the sneak cost extremely low. 8t really is not a game changer like people think.

Also, the vamp sneak passive is even more valuabke. Fast sneak in general is more valuable. You will still lose the same amount of stamina no matter how fast you are. You don't lose more stamina because you move quicker. Having faster sneak speed means that this nerd will effect you less then a player who does not have increased sneak speed.

Basically, they made it so people had to spec into sneak in order to do better at it.

I consider losing 810 regen while moving in stealth a rather large change. At least that's what mine sits at on live atm, while moving.

Sure, it's not the end of the world, but I would most certainly consider it an ant-convienient quality of life change. However I am not sure it was intended to be honest, as there are still some things wonky with the interaction of regen/cp/drinks and Willows Path.

We will have to see.

nordickittyhawk

Still no reply from zos!? @ZOS_GinaBruno
Come on gina tell the devs to actually listen to Nbs for once in there life.

Xeniph

nordickittyhawk wrote: »

Still no reply from zos!? @ZOS_GinaBruno
Come on gina tell the devs to actually listen to Nbs for once in there life.

I'm eagerly awaiting that documentation @ZOS_GinaBruno said was coming in the next couple of days, 2 days ago.

A lot of the stealth changes aren't too bad taken by themselves, but if you look at then as a whole it's pretty terrible.

1) Dark Cloak lost it's cleanse- Making getting away as a stam blade nearly impossible, since if you DO manage to get into stealth, you are just poped out. Mageblades can spam cloak so has little impact on the play style, they rarely use stealth anyway.

2) Magelight has no CD or diminishing returns- This one is bad for both playstyles and tied with the above, pretty much ensures any brain dead player can lock even the best out of Cloak/stealth.

3) No regen while moving in stealth- This one really is only targeted at the stamblade or any class using stealth, if it's intentional.

Now if you look at these from the perspective of each spec, Stamblade will suffer, by far, the most. Running efficient purge may be an option, but I'll have to check the cost since the increase. It used to cost as much as a cloak.

However if things don't change dramatically, I see alot of folks playing other classes or shifting specs to ranged/magicka. And I don't know about y'all, but I am fed up with the "balance" patches constantly and wildly, shifting the games gameplay mechanics, promoting FoTM.

Note* In the interest of clarity:

* Cloak= Invisibility
* Stealth= Crouch

Tavore1138

Kalebron wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

We Stamina users wont be going back to E.S.O., Elder Staves Online ever again ZOS, maybe some people like you are on console and missed the 1st year and a half on PC but I was there and we will not go back to having Magicka Builds be almost unstoppable, so realize that this is not just about yourself, look at the bigger picture.

Why are you trolling the forums if you quit the game? I honestly don't understand why people think they can dictate the type of content released by a provider. They make a game, you play it. If you don't like it, pick up and move on...

Yeah but if you keep encouraging people to leave... well... there's a word for people that play with themselves...

Don't need the negativity in the forums because it will prevent others from wanting to play an already awesome game. I know it is laggy from time to time but I have played many MMO's and this is by far the best and the only one that I have seen with transparency and willingness to accept ideas from it's fan base. And also, there is a word for people who are not nice...

Indeed shame on me for criticising people like you who tell other players to leave - don't know what I was thinking about.

It's criticizing not "criticising"

Actually both are valid. I suspect -ising would be favoured by the Brits and -izing by pretty much the rest of the world... but both versions tend to be listed in dictionaries and both are in common usage so either works. Ask an etymologist and they'd probably define precisely which words should have which, and I don't know which this falls under, but as long as millions of people use each spelling you'll probably have to live with it.

And lets not even start on centre vs. center or colour vs. color.

Kalebron

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Kalebron wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

We Stamina users wont be going back to E.S.O., Elder Staves Online ever again ZOS, maybe some people like you are on console and missed the 1st year and a half on PC but I was there and we will not go back to having Magicka Builds be almost unstoppable, so realize that this is not just about yourself, look at the bigger picture.

Why are you trolling the forums if you quit the game? I honestly don't understand why people think they can dictate the type of content released by a provider. They make a game, you play it. If you don't like it, pick up and move on...

Yeah but if you keep encouraging people to leave... well... there's a word for people that play with themselves...

Don't need the negativity in the forums because it will prevent others from wanting to play an already awesome game. I know it is laggy from time to time but I have played many MMO's and this is by far the best and the only one that I have seen with transparency and willingness to accept ideas from it's fan base. And also, there is a word for people who are not nice...

Indeed shame on me for criticising people like you who tell other players to leave - don't know what I was thinking about.

It's criticizing not "criticising"

Actually both are valid. I suspect -ising would be favoured by the Brits and -izing by pretty much the rest of the world... but both versions tend to be listed in dictionaries and both are in common usage so either works. Ask an etymologist and they'd probably define precisely which words should have which, and I don't know which this falls under, but as long as millions of people use each spelling you'll probably have to live with it.

And lets not even start on centre vs. center or colour vs. color.

Awesomeness, thanks for the correction. I love learning new things.

Khaos_Bane

@ZOS_GinaBruno the nerf to funnel health is uncalled for, it's nowhere near as powerful as BoL and it shouldn't be treated as such.

Kalebron

Therium104 wrote: »

Sav72 wrote: »

I wonder what the hell the NB Dev(s) was thinking?

Does he or she even like NBs, to allow this abuse, did he or she even defend the NB class, from this insanity?

"Nightblade is a Class in Elder Scrolls Online. Nightblades are adventurers and opportunists with a gift for getting in and out of trouble. Relying variously on stealth, blades and speed, they thrive on conflict and misfortune trusting to their luck and cunning to survive. Nightblades can specialize on three distinctive class skills. The player is free to focus on one line or distribute points across many, allowing for deep build customization"

http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Nightblade


If your goal is to make players quit or stop playing NB's, your doing a great job.

Some advice, NB are not the problem, a NB does not run into a group and kills 3 to 4 players, unharmed and bolts away.....

The description does not say the truth: "Easy mode class designed to kill other players with no skill by spamming a few abilities and kill them before able to react. NB is a master of no skill combat"

Reality differs greatly from the description.

I think I beg to differ on this because I get caught up all the time by skilled others who can easily locate me and kill me because I am typically squishy as a magicka nightblade. I know at times it feels like others have it easy, but in reality if I hit a target and they do not die, then I have two options. One is the stay and fight and two is the take flight and hope they are not skilled at finding my cloaking butt. I am still trying to master the nightblade stealth. It seems like my cloak never works the way that it works for others in the game. I am not sure why, and maybe it has to do with skill or being a stamina nightblade. I imagine I would have more ability to survive as a stamina build, but I enjoy my mnb for pve purposes too much. I think all classes have each posed a problem for me depending the person behind the toon. Roll a NB and you will see it has it's own set of ups and downs, but you will really enjoy playing it. My favorite thing to do with a NB is sneaking in and out of dungeons undetected. And I agree, surviving a group of 3-4 people is hard to do for a NB. As far as spamming things to kill another player, I am guilty. I spam my funnel health and sometimes I am able to take down poorly geared individuals. Funnel health is the bread and butter to my build so why wouldn't I spam it. I actually am more of a distance fighter and people will usually always find me in the background hitting the zerg in front of me. I also have a sorc, but I can never remember where I put different skills because I play it less and I suck at playing my Sorc. LOL.

Kalebron

Khaos_Bane wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno the nerf to funnel health is uncalled for, it's nowhere near as powerful as BoL and it shouldn't be treated as such.

I think they should increase the healing effect from it instead of reducing the number of people it affects. But, I don't really care if they reduce my number of people I heal. I will probably just switch to swallow soul instead which I have been considering anyway. I would like to actually have a viable self heal for more survivability or be able to heal whitegold tower with my nightblade, but I am not sure this will ever be possible. Either way, I still love my NB.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

My feedback on changes to Catalyst passive.

Lava_Croft

People complaining about no Stamina regeneration while moving in Stealth really should stop depending on clearly broken mechanics.

CP5

Lava_Croft wrote: »

People complaining about no Stamina regeneration while moving in Stealth really should stop depending on clearly broken mechanics.

When did that become a thing? Can't say I remember it happening before 1.6 at all.

Also Xeniph, a few things

"1) Dark Cloak lost it's cleanse- Making getting away as a stam blade nearly impossible, since if you DO manage to get into stealth, you are just poped out. Mageblades can spam cloak so has little impact on the play style, they rarely use stealth anyway.

2) Magelight has no CD or diminishing returns- This one is bad for both playstyles and tied with the above, pretty much ensures any brain dead player can lock even the best out of Cloak/stealth.

3) No regen while moving in stealth- This one really is only targeted at the stamblade or any class using stealth, if it's intentional."

1) if it weren't for this change dots would still be a complete joke in game. Having a class that can so easily ignore a rather large source of damage was not balanced. Shields can be dot'ed now, purge cost more, so now dots are something everyone has to worry about.

2) Cloak didn't have a cd or diminishing returns, why should an 8m-12m short duration buff? I enjoy magelight as a toggle as it is now since I don't need to micromanage such a frequently recast buff. Also, if a brain dead player can lock down 'even the best' I would have to question that 'best's skill. You have plenty of snares, speed buffs, teleports, and when combined with cover and los should be able to get out of the way.

3) On one of my characters I can very easily get stamina regen while sneaking without the use of a drink. If my addons are right it is about 17 stamina twice a second. The whole point of stealth being as strong as it is (being hidden, the damage buff+stun) is offset by both the speed and resource cost. Think of it as blocking, as an active action that requires resources to use. With those perhaps the nb heavy meta will shift, but those who weren't relying on the meta playing in their favor will adapt.

revonine

Therium104 wrote: »

The description does not say the truth: "Easy mode class designed to kill other players with no skill by spamming a few abilities and kill them before able to react. NB is a master of no skill combat"

I really dunno what ESO Therium is playing but every class wins by "spamming a few skills". Also it's more than NB's that can drop you before you can react.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

revonine wrote: »

Therium104 wrote: »

The description does not say the truth: "Easy mode class designed to kill other players with no skill by spamming a few abilities and kill them before able to react. NB is a master of no skill combat"

I really dunno what ESO Therium is playing but every class wins by "spamming a few skills". Also it's more than NB's that can drop you before you can react.

@Therium104 is trolling I believe. Keeps popping up in threads, usually about NBs, with half-assed and uninformed remarks that always go against what people are discussing and provide no reasoning.

Xeniph

CP5 wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

People complaining about no Stamina regeneration while moving in Stealth really should stop depending on clearly broken mechanics.

When did that become a thing? Can't say I remember it happening before 1.6 at all.

Also Xeniph, a few things

"1) Dark Cloak lost it's cleanse- Making getting away as a stam blade nearly impossible, since if you DO manage to get into stealth, you are just poped out. Mageblades can spam cloak so has little impact on the play style, they rarely use stealth anyway.

2) Magelight has no CD or diminishing returns- This one is bad for both playstyles and tied with the above, pretty much ensures any brain dead player can lock even the best out of Cloak/stealth.

3) No regen while moving in stealth- This one really is only targeted at the stamblade or any class using stealth, if it's intentional."

1) if it weren't for this change dots would still be a complete joke in game. Having a class that can so easily ignore a rather large source of damage was not balanced. Shields can be dot'ed now, purge cost more, so now dots are something everyone has to worry about.

2) Cloak didn't have a cd or diminishing returns, why should an 8m-12m short duration buff? I enjoy magelight as a toggle as it is now since I don't need to micromanage such a frequently recast buff. Also, if a brain dead player can lock down 'even the best' I would have to question that 'best's skill. You have plenty of snares, speed buffs, teleports, and when combined with cover and los should be able to get out of the way.

3) On one of my characters I can very easily get stamina regen while sneaking without the use of a drink. If my addons are right it is about 17 stamina twice a second. The whole point of stealth being as strong as it is (being hidden, the damage buff+stun) is offset by both the speed and resource cost. Think of it as blocking, as an active action that requires resources to use. With those perhaps the nb heavy meta will shift, but those who weren't relying on the meta playing in their favor will adapt.

1) While I can agree that cloak needed something. Dots were useless for more reasons than Cloak. There are many examples of counters and whatnot. However this does not actually address the majority of complaints from Cloak. The magicka NB and his infinite cloak.

Also, I was simply speaking of being able to get into stealth. For example killing the target that applies the dots does not wipe them. This will make it much more difficult to return to stealth for any stam spec, while basically overlooking magicka NB. Who rarely utilize stealth, opting to stay invisible (No dots will tick on either morph). Pretty big buff for them.

2) Again I suppose I should have been more clear. The detect on Magelight is fine with me the way it is. The lockout on the other hand needs DR or break free immunity. As it is right now, you can literally keep anyone locked out with a simple gap closer and magelight. And yes, that includes using shades, fear, stuns, speed. Maybe I know the NB too well and am better than most at sticking to one, but I highly doubt it. It really wasn't very challenging.

3) I know how sneak works, both pre-1.6 and after. However for a year it was, no regen in sneak and moving, and for another it was regen while moving. Like I said, we got NO word if it was intended or not. I even reported it numerous times myself.

So my point here is, after getting used to it with regen, it is a pretty hefty nerf. No matter how you look at it. And due to the situation, we don't know if it was an intended change or a bug fix.

CP5

Xeniph wrote: »

CP5 wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

People complaining about no Stamina regeneration while moving in Stealth really should stop depending on clearly broken mechanics.

When did that become a thing? Can't say I remember it happening before 1.6 at all.

Also Xeniph, a few things

"1) Dark Cloak lost it's cleanse- Making getting away as a stam blade nearly impossible, since if you DO manage to get into stealth, you are just poped out. Mageblades can spam cloak so has little impact on the play style, they rarely use stealth anyway.

2) Magelight has no CD or diminishing returns- This one is bad for both playstyles and tied with the above, pretty much ensures any brain dead player can lock even the best out of Cloak/stealth.

3) No regen while moving in stealth- This one really is only targeted at the stamblade or any class using stealth, if it's intentional."

1) if it weren't for this change dots would still be a complete joke in game. Having a class that can so easily ignore a rather large source of damage was not balanced. Shields can be dot'ed now, purge cost more, so now dots are something everyone has to worry about.

2) Cloak didn't have a cd or diminishing returns, why should an 8m-12m short duration buff? I enjoy magelight as a toggle as it is now since I don't need to micromanage such a frequently recast buff. Also, if a brain dead player can lock down 'even the best' I would have to question that 'best's skill. You have plenty of snares, speed buffs, teleports, and when combined with cover and los should be able to get out of the way.

3) On one of my characters I can very easily get stamina regen while sneaking without the use of a drink. If my addons are right it is about 17 stamina twice a second. The whole point of stealth being as strong as it is (being hidden, the damage buff+stun) is offset by both the speed and resource cost. Think of it as blocking, as an active action that requires resources to use. With those perhaps the nb heavy meta will shift, but those who weren't relying on the meta playing in their favor will adapt.

1) While I can agree that cloak needed something. Dots were useless for more reasons than Cloak. There are many examples of counters and whatnot. However this does not actually address the majority of complaints from Cloak. The magicka NB and his infinite cloak.

Also, I was simply speaking of being able to get into stealth. For example killing the target that applies the dots does not wipe them. This will make it much more difficult to return to stealth for any stam spec, while basically overlooking magicka NB. Who rarely utilize stealth, opting to stay invisible (No dots will tick on either morph). Pretty big buff for them.

2) Again I suppose I should have been more clear. The detect on Magelight is fine with me the way it is. The lockout on the other hand needs DR or break free immunity. As it is right now, you can literally keep anyone locked out with a simple gap closer and magelight. And yes, that includes using shades, fear, stuns, speed. Maybe I know the NB too well and am better than most at sticking to one, but I highly doubt it. It really wasn't very challenging.

3) I know how sneak works, both pre-1.6 and after. However for a year it was, no regen in sneak and moving, and for another it was regen while moving. Like I said, we got NO word if it was intended or not. I even reported it numerous times myself.

So my point here is, after getting used to it with regen, it is a pretty hefty nerf. No matter how you look at it. And due to the situation, we don't know if it was an intended change or a bug fix.

Lets just hope any changes zos makes between now and march don't lead to another few months of an irritating meta.

NoS_smoke

kaithuzar wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Aedaryl wrote: »

People don't realize, and zenimax too.

There is two way of NB.

Stamina NB :

Ranged : Can one shot with camo and snipe.

Melee : Can one shot with insane burst + camo too.

Magicka NB :

Ranged : can do good damage with a destro staff but are weak.

Melee : it's the weakest playstyle. Less burst than Stamina, can't one shot, more weak.

NB magicka melee was hard to play and was balanced.

The nerf of cloak by the cloak itself and the buff of magelight mean a NB magicka melee extremly hard to play.


PEOPLE CRY ON NB

But they don't understand it's Stamina NB.

All the bads things about NB come from Stam NB : One shot, Ambush, SA, ect. But people never thought about Magicka Melee NB. Use this PTS for try one, and come back say NB (inclued magicka NB nerf) was needed.


Really, ALL NB are not Overpowered because ALL NB are not Stam NB.

Cloak is the only way to survive for a magicka NB.

We don't have huge armor like stam, we can't roll dodge/block like stam.

I can say that : There is no chance, with a magicka NB to kill a magicka sorcerer, unless if the magicka sorcerer is a real noob.

Please. My magicka melee nightblade can do way more burst damage than my camo stamblade. In AOE!!

Proxy det + dawnbreaker + sap = instakill on multiple people
Bats works good to and ticks for 3.5k+ crits. Sap also crits for 4k+.
And every skill of them is AoE and undodgeable.

Vampire stamina nightblades mostly die in one dawnbreaker + sap.

You always complain about how weak mana melee are, they are not. :P

But now we're all screwed, stamina nbs even more than magicka ones *

PLEASEEEE....
Dawnbreaker is an ult... & ult's scale off of max stats, 2nd'ly there aren't any great stam ult's so yea this needs to be addressed

Proxy - damage was nerfed & depending on how many people you hit then it may do squat.

Sap is decent but you will find yourself running out of magicka if you sap too hard & the heal was nerfed a couple patches ago.

They BUFFED POTATO TORNADO (while decreasing the range slightly, nbd)

Ultimate does scale off of max stats you are right....but then it is buffed another 25 percent by the cp tree. No stamina player is going to put those cp in to buff magical dmg...but all magical players will have 100 in there. So basically all magical players will have a dawnbreaker that hits 25 percent harder. Then they can put points into dots as well as magical has many. Same with bats, same with soul strike. There is only 1 physical dmg ultimate in the game and it belongs to Dragon knights. Not sure how ESO has gotten away with this for so long but it has become more apparent this patch wen they decided to give magicka a duel category that buffs all of there dmg in 1 cp stat. Its pretty crazy and if left unchanged will have a huge influence on ultimates, which can be real tide turners in battles and duels. Its kind of like saying that stamina does not need any influence in CP tree to there ultimates. Again, no stamina player has the cps at 501 to invest into element and magicka dmg. Its insane. Frsutrating to think about honestly.

Lifecode666

@Wrobel @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_KaiSchober @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_BrianWheeler Please listen.


All magical players will have 100 points in elemental expert now. ults that do magic damage hits 25 percent harder and ofc all other magica based damage.

All magica players will now have 100 points in cp tree that reduce physical damage.

Proxi det and mage/inner light.x2 keena and alchemist. kaboom

Stamina users are left out.

No regen while moving in stealth????????
As a stamina Nightblade I use cloak as escape and as a defensive skill. This is everything we have.

Evasion and blur do not stack and they need tweaking
If cloak is going to stay this way look into Evasion and blur and it's morphs. they can be buffed or changed.
....Or increase cloak 2-3 seconds
Make killer's blade stamina based and make it do physical damage.
Infact since magical players will have 100 points in elemental expert now and ults that do magic damage hits 25 percent harder, stamina should have the same option.
A way to morph ults do physical damage so we can have 100 points in Mighty that do the same.

maybe there is something I missed but I wanna play stamina.

I can easy change my stam nightblade into a magica nightblade and be OP. Just check out deltia's video from PTS as a qucik example, but I don't want to run with a stick.

Lava_Croft

Lifecode666 wrote: »

No regen while moving in stealth????????
As a stamina Nightblade I use cloak as escape and as a defensive skill. This is everything we have.

You will regenerate Stamina just fine while moving in Shadow Cloak and if you don't Sneak.
Stamina regeneration while Sneaking clearly a broken mechanic that you should not depend on and most certainly it's not 'everything you have'.

Too many Nightblade scrubs these days.

Xeniph

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Lifecode666 wrote: »

No regen while moving in stealth????????
As a stamina Nightblade I use cloak as escape and as a defensive skill. This is everything we have.

You will regenerate Stamina just fine while moving in Shadow Cloak and if you don't Sneak.
Stamina regeneration while Sneaking clearly a broken mechanic that you should not depend on and most certainly it's not 'everything you have'.

Too many Nightblade scrubs these days.

While I can appreciate your opinion, you in fact have no clue whether this was intended or not.

Regenerating stamina while moving in stealth changed to doing so a year after release. It has been what we currently see for the same amount of time.

Now when the change happened there were actually quite a few threads asking if it was intended or not, with zero response. In fact I myself have reported it many times, just looking for clarification. However only the devs know if this behavior was intended or not.

Regardless, it has been this way for just as long as it wasn't. Making the current situation an actual nerf, without documentation or an explanation. Now complaining that something was nerfed is perfectly reasonable, especially if you have no idea whether is was a fix, or an intended change. Communication goes a long way here.

So no, it is not clearly a broken mechanic. That may be your opinion, which you have every right to have, but the fact is you don't know. Nor is it imbalanced or op, in regards to broken. It's a simple quality of life change or the reversal of, for the stealth play style. So of coarse we will all adjust if we have to. But I think the point here is communication and documentation of changes, intended or not has to be improved.

Now, if looking for clarification and or complaining about something being taken away with no documentation and generally trying to have a constructive discussion while trying to defend ones class or play style is considered being a scrub. Sign me the hell up.

Master_Kas

Lifecode666 wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno, Please listen.

All magical players will have 100 points in elemental expert now. ults that do magic damage hits 25 percent harder and ofc all other magica based damage.

All magica players will now have 100 points in cp tree that reduce physical damage.

Proxi det and mage/inner light.x2 keena and alchemist. kaboom

Stamina users are left out.

No regen while moving in stealth????????
As a stamina Nightblade I use cloak as escape and as a defensive skill. This is everything we have.

Evasion and blur do not stack and they need tweaking
If cloak is going to stay this way look into Evasion and blur and it's morphs. they can be buffed or changed.
....Or increase cloak 2-3 seconds
Make killer's blade stamina based and make it do physical damage.
Infact since magical players will have 100 points in elemental expert now and ults that do magic damage hits 25 percent harder, stamina should have the same option.
A way to morph ults do physical damage so we can have 100 points in Mighty that do the same.

maybe there is something I missed but I wanna play stamina.

I can easy change my stam nightblade into a magica nightblade and be OP. Just check out deltia's video from PTS as a qucik example, but I don't want to run with a stick.

The part about making killers blade a stamina morph. Do you think it will help stamina nb who already has aviable executes will win so much from it? Executioner and even steel tornado is superior to killers blade..

Xeniph

Master_Kas wrote: »

Lifecode666 wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno, Please listen.

All magical players will have 100 points in elemental expert now. ults that do magic damage hits 25 percent harder and ofc all other magica based damage.

All magica players will now have 100 points in cp tree that reduce physical damage.

Proxi det and mage/inner light.x2 keena and alchemist. kaboom

Stamina users are left out.

No regen while moving in stealth????????
As a stamina Nightblade I use cloak as escape and as a defensive skill. This is everything we have.

Evasion and blur do not stack and they need tweaking
If cloak is going to stay this way look into Evasion and blur and it's morphs. they can be buffed or changed.
....Or increase cloak 2-3 seconds
Make killer's blade stamina based and make it do physical damage.
Infact since magical players will have 100 points in elemental expert now and ults that do magic damage hits 25 percent harder, stamina should have the same option.
A way to morph ults do physical damage so we can have 100 points in Mighty that do the same.

maybe there is something I missed but I wanna play stamina.

I can easy change my stam nightblade into a magica nightblade and be OP. Just check out deltia's video from PTS as a qucik example, but I don't want to run with a stick.

The part about making killers blade a stamina morph. Do you think it will help stamina nb who already has aviable executes will win so much from it? Executioner and even steel tornado is superior to killers blade..

It wouldn't be so mush as a "buff" as it would be a lateral improvement. It would benefit bow and DW builds and be an attractive alternative to Executioner. It would also help improve pve dps during the execute phase by 25% for DW. So the request has merit.

However I think the point here is, it opens more choices. That's always a good thing.