Morrowind...and ESO+

zaria · February 2017

Iselin wrote: »

Martan wrote: »

I don't see the problem here. World of Warcraft among other MMORPG's requires you to purchase all new expansions along with paying a non-mandatory monthly fee.

What's the difference between an "expansion" and a DLC zone like Orsinium which also included, if you recall, a unique to MMOs solo raid.

This is about as much quest content as Orsinium (maybe even less) a core, much talked about game feature they could have released as part of any update, Battlegrounds, a "new" old class from beta and a raid.

Please explain to me why this deserves the label "expansion" and $40 more.

Fair point, I however except this to have far more core content than Orsinium else it would be an disappointment..
Buying it for crones would be an option,

Redman9169 · February 2017

Ladies and gentlemen

When you buy ESO + you do not own any content you are just renting the content, when become a non ESO + you will lose all DLC packs unless they have been paid for in game.

You can not rent expansions So this means as an ESO + member you will have to buy the expansion like everybody else except you will still get extras for being a paid member, also all future DLC you will continue to get free Renting.

sadownik · February 2017

Redman9169 wrote: »

Ladies and gentlemen

When you buy ESO + you do not own any content you are just renting the content, when become a non ESO + you will lose all DLC packs unless they have been paid for in game.

You can not rent expansions So this means as an ESO + member you will have to buy the expansion like everybody else except you will still get extras for being a paid member, also all future DLC you will continue to get free Renting.

What are you babling about now? How it would be different?

robwolf666 · February 2017

I haven't had time to read through yet, so sorry if this been addressed and/or answered before, but...

I just saw Morrowind on my XB, and it looks like they expect you to buy the game again in order to actually be able to go there, is this accurate, or will it be made available as a purchasable DLC for those who already have ESO?

The latter I don't mind if the price is reasonable, but there's no way in hell I'm buying the entire thing again just to play it.

Kendo12 · February 2017

probablyafk wrote: »

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

Exactly what WoW added in its last xpac. But okay. Sure. The sky is falling.

You're patently and observably incorrect. Go have a look at the announcement page for the last expansion and you'll see the difference in feature announcement.
New class (we get that!)

Refresh of existing abilities for all existing classes.

New abilities for all classes including level cap which leads to new ways of playing all existing classes

Feature: Artifact weapons - for each class again

Feature: Class Halls - heaps of quests and whole new types of gameplay

Many, many, refinements of existing features including wide spread transmog, profession and social updates.

A new CONTINENT consisting of five entire new zones (we get one)

9 new dungeons + 1 revamped

2 new raids (we get one)

New difficulty levels for existing content in response to player feedback.

New PVP progression system (we get that!)

Story progression for the whole world, including major changes to the existing zones to fit in the move (right now we only know of 30 hours of story in one new zone)

I suppose it did cost $10 more though? I guess that's a point to you...

Seriously. I'm not saying it's not good to have some new content but why would anyone here settle for what we're currently being offered compared to what we see in other games? We are their potential customers, we should be asking for more. For what's fair in the market.

Have to quote this, can't believe some people are comparing this dlc to a WoW xpac

Pops_ND_Irish · February 2017

You can just get the upgrade if you already have ESO

DreadKnight · February 2017

I don't mind paying for the expansion and ESO+.

I just want them to FIX THE DAMN BUGS AND LAG ON CONSOLE.

Pops_ND_Irish · February 2017

Same here !

Pops_ND_Irish · February 2017

They should go back to WoW if its that good !

Aliniel · February 2017

Jesus Christ... No wonder the world is in the state it is. People are being lied to, manipulated and they like it enough to not only agree but also defend the the ones who are lying to them.

Bethesda makes AMAZING games. There's no denying that. But they or ZOS are MONEY HUNGRY. This is the last drop in the already full glass. This game has so much potential but the people behind it are ruining it. I must say, you have become worse than Ubisoft, ZOS. Well done.

BalticBlues · February 2017

The Morrowind downloadable content is not a DLC (downloadable content)?
So ESO+ is not giving you a DLC in summer?

This is what you could do:
1. STOP subbing.
2. BUY Morrowind with the money saved from subbing.
3. SAVE even more money by enjoying ESO without a sub.

Just be logical. Use your money to buy what is important for you.
So far ESO+ was important for DLC. If there is no DLC in summer,
stop subbing old, unimportant DLC and then buy the important expansion.

Later, you still can sub again once new, important DLC will arrive.

AdamBourke · February 2017

sadownik wrote: »

60-80 $ for 300 + h of content = 40-80 $ for 30 h content. Got it, indeed no real argument here.

The problem with this argument is that the base game was actually undervalued. Consider offline games at the same price point - and many of them are considerably smaller. In fact... many of them are around the size of this DLC. (There are exceptions, Skyrim, Witcher 3, etc).

But of course - no-one would have paid something like $150-$200 for base ESO - so they had no choice but to retail it at market price.

I don't have a problem with the price of the DLC. (But I do have a problem with the subscription thing).

esotoon · February 2017

AdamBourke wrote: »

The problem with this argument is that the base game was actually undervalued. Consider offline games at the same price point - and many of them are considerably smaller. In fact... many of them are around the size of this DLC. (There are exceptions, Skyrim, Witcher 3, etc).

But of course - no-one would have paid something like $150-$200 for base ESO - so they had no choice but to retail it at market price.

Don't forget you had to subscribe at launch. So in reality, in order to get that full 300+ hours content, most people would not only have to buy the base game but then continue paying a subscription fee for a few months.

craftycarper73 · February 2017

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

jluchau wrote: »

@ZOS_GinaBruno do you know, will there be a crown store option to buy Morrowind?

No - Morrowind can only be purchased digitally or through a retailer. As it's not a DLC game pack but an entirely new Chapter, it will not be in the Crown Store.

when did activision takeover?? very destiny-esque what you have done to day one players and subbers here.

Kneighbors · February 2017

How can you unsub when your crafting bag is stuffed with hundred thousands of items? Do you realise you will have to sell or delete everything you collected?

Cool it, as already been said 40$ is nothing for having fun today, and ZOS company is not the worst investment.

Just relax and enjoy, get used to paying fanboys

ZOS_JohanaB · February 2017

Several Comments have been removed rude bait and rude comments. If while in this post you encounter bait please do not respond. Instead just report the comment and leave it for us to handle. No good comes from responding to bait.

BalticBlues · February 2017

Kneighbors wrote: »

How can you unsub when your crafting bag is stuffed with hundred thousands of items?
Do you realise you will have to sell or delete everything you collected?

You DO NOT LOSE the stuff in your crafting bag by stopping your sub. You still will have access to all your crafting bag items. You only will not be able to stuff more "hundred thousands of items" you obviously do not need into it...

Mr_Apollo · February 2017

BalticBlues wrote: »

The Morrowind downloadable content is not a DLC (downloadable content)?
So ESO+ is not giving you a DLC in summer?

This is what you could do:
1. STOP subbing.
2. BUY Morrowind with the money saved from subbing.
3. SAVE even more money by enjoying ESO without a sub.

Just be logical. Use your money to buy what is important for you.
So far ESO+ was important for DLC. If there is no DLC in summer,
stop subbing old, unimportant DLC and then buy the important expansion.

Later, you still can sub again once new, important DLC will arrive.

We are not complaining for the bloody price, we are complaining because we were lied to, we signed a contract to get all additional content for free for as long as we are subbed. Morrowind be it an expansion or not, its STILL additional content, no matter how you look at it. And Morrowind is a DLC, for an expansion pack and DLC are both additional contents to a game (And yes, its downloadable, theres a physical version of it but its still downloadable)

Surak73 · February 2017

Well, I have deactivated my monthly subscription just here and now. I used to pay 13 x 12 = 156 euros a year to Zenimax, that is the price of more than two new complete games; and in the last year, all I got were two microscopic new areas, two dungeons and a trial.

Now that they have finally made a decent dlc, they said it is not a dlc but an expansion (LOL...) and I have to pay for it. OK, I will pay for it, but they can forget my 156 subscription euros.

vamp_emily · February 2017

vamp_emily wrote: »

Merenwen_812 wrote: »

Hoping someone can answer this..
I have ESO+

I want to buy the physical collectors edition (for the statue of course), will I be able to upgrade my current ESO+ with this physical purchase or must I also buy the $40 upgrade on top of the $100 physical copy?

I'm sure someone answered this ( so many posts I haven't read ).

You will not need to pay for the upgrade and physical copy. Unless you have multiple accounts like I do

Sorry I was wrong

After going home and looking at it a little closer, I came to the conclusion that you will have to purchase the upgrade for your existing account. Even if you buy the physical collector's edition.

I was thinking the 5 different editions would be available on the elder scrolls online store, but only the upgrade versions are.

Elsonso · February 2017

probablyafk wrote: »

What we're getting:
A new zone. That's incredibly uncomparable with a standard expansion in WoW. If you sold this to the WoW audience as an expansion they would laugh in your face. Lets be honest - a new zone, no matter how big, could be DLC. I think it's entirely reasonable to have expected a campaign from an expansion. For this price it seems we should be adding something as big as that. A single zone? pfft.

A new class. This is great and it is something most people wanted, nice work!

Some battleground tilesets and some other PvP stuff. I can't comment, not my thing.

A single trial. This is ok but very much within the realms of the expected rather than super exciting. No one is jumping up and screaming about this anywhere on the forums I've seen. It's like, cool, a single additional thing to do at end game. From that point of view it's a big let down.

I think that one problem people have is that they are stuck on the idea that this is a DLC. By that, I mean DLC in the sense that we get a new zone, a few delves, maybe a dungeon, a trial, and that it is just Orsinium on steriods. I got the impression that this is something more elaborate than just a DLC.

I could be wrong. It could all be Marketing Smoke and Mirrors. Bethesda gives what they feel is a fair deal, but as I learned with the Fallout Season Pass, this does not exactly translate into a deal for everyone. Not all of the information is in, and we may not get a clear picture until release (PTS or Live).

probablyafk wrote: »

We're not getting:
Changes to existing classes. Unlike other game expansions there's no intent here to change the existing ESO - although one suspects there'll be some small things done. But this new content is very isolated from the rest of the game. There is nothing new for my existing characters here. After I've rolled the Warden, leveled them (presumably in the new zone, so doubling up content), then what?

Changes to existing zones. We defeated the big bad guy and so we'd hope the world would change and could let us move on to bigger and better things. But again, this expac is isolated from the main story, or it continues it into it's own lands without no impact on the rest of the game.

New Features. Because of the DLC/ESO+ relationship it seems the developers are unable to roll features into the new expansion. So there's no equivilent of the flying mount, or special ways to interact with existing content. There's nothing that adds shine to what we've already been doing. I would hope they'd just roll this stuff out anyway, give it to existing subscribers, and make the game better while they're adding the expac. Housing is an example of the compromise we end up with - it's delivered to the main game users to appese ESO+ subscribers but it also represents a half-solution. If the expansion had features it bought to the main game as well as it's own little island I think it'd bring more people back, more people in, and add to those who buy the expac.

I am fairly sure that there will be changes to existing classes, whether or not the person buys Morrowind. I expect that this will be a source of great angst in the coming months as people who don't like those changes say that they didn't buy Morrowind, so they don't want the change.

I don't expect the world to change, but I suppose they could be making a few global world changes to bring it "up to date". I don't like it when they do this, and I like it when they do this. As an existing player, it is nice that the world changes. For new players, it is terribly annoying. Overall, I hope they do not make any sweeping changes to the rest of the world, if any.

I somewhat expect them to merge the base game and early DLC, through Hist, rendering those DLC purchases and Gold Edition unnecessary. They will eventually roll Gold and Hist into the base game, no need for ESO Plus or discrete DLC purchases to get that content. It might happen at a Chapter boundary, so that when purchasing a new Chapter, you get any DLC you do not already own. It looks like Morrowind does not include Gold, but that is indeterminate, right now. It might be happening with Morrowind.

Mr_Apollo wrote: »

Is it just me that ZOS became a bit lazy? We were promised 4 DLCs per year and all future content for FREE for all ESO+ subscribers

I am subscribing to ESO Plus because the game is currently worth it. I expect quarterly updates, not quarterly DLC. I don't care if that update is a DLC, a free base game update, or some paid content. It is more important to me that they are constantly updating the game than constantly providing me with specific types of content.

I am not so unreasonable as to think that, by paying for ESO Plus, I will never have to pay for content again, that everything will be free. Until 1/31, I was a bit worried that this is what they were going to do. I don't want them to move further away from the buy-the-game plus subscription model. It was actually nice to see them double down on buying the game. Applause! Now stop doing stupid stuff in the Crown Store.

negbert wrote: »

If Morrowind was a dlc then I would get locked out from my Warden characters if my sub lapsed. That just wouldn't work.

If Vvardenfell was a DLC, the Warden class would definitely be base game.

Phatmattfu · February 2017

BalticBlues wrote: »

The Morrowind downloadable content is not a DLC (downloadable content)?
So ESO+ is not giving you a DLC in summer?

This is what you could do:
1. STOP subbing.
2. BUY Morrowind with the money saved from subbing.
3. SAVE even more money by enjoying ESO without a sub.

Just be logical. Use your money to buy what is important for you.
So far ESO+ was important for DLC. If there is no DLC in summer,
stop subbing old, unimportant DLC and then buy the important expansion.

Later, you still can sub again once new, important DLC will arrive.

This.

RebornV3x · February 2017

Easy guys just stop paying for an eso+ sub for 3-4 months save the day and then buy the Morrowind Expansion.

corrosivechains · February 2017

Darkstorne wrote: »

SunfireKnight86 wrote: »

Exactly what WoW added in its last xpac. But okay. Sure. The sky is falling.

Come on, don't pretend this is as big as WoW's expansions. There's a damn good reason it was never going to be as big as WoW's expansions are, but pretending it is doesn't look good for you. Legion had 5 new zones, and three raids (though staggered release dates for them for progression purposes).

and 10 dungeons

probablyafk · February 2017

lordrichter wrote: »

I could be wrong. It could all be Marketing Smoke and Mirrors. Bethesda gives what they feel is a fair deal, but as I learned with the Fallout Season Pass, this does not exactly translate into a deal for everyone. Not all of the information is in, and we may not get a clear picture until release (PTS or Live).

I can respect your well thought out reply here and, honestly, I hope you're right because I do like the game and when I go look at some of the screenshots and think about heading back to Morrowind I do get excited.

And I agree, I think this will be significantly bigger than your average DLC. But I find it really hard to imagine ZOS were just were not organised enough in time to announce all the cool things they have planned which provide the amount of content one would expect for a $40+ expansion pack in an AAA MMO.

Your note about chapters is something I find interesting and really it goes to the heart of why there's such backlash on the forums about this today: Having F2P + Subscription models implies a certain type of promise you're making to your players based on their support. The language used in the advertising even encourages that impresion.

But if you want subscribers, who are already giving you money for content, to shell out even more cash then you are going to have to provide very competitive incentives compared to the rest of the market. What we know so far, even with your positive take on things, doesn't come even close to a WoW expac - as a single example.

I've mentioned this elsewhere but the gamble ZOS is making here is probably bigger than it seems to most people now, even with all this turmoil. There is a precedent being set. ESO is now a game with f2p, subscription and an expansion cycle. After this expansion there will, by necessity, be another.

If the expansion isn't amazing then the only think keeping people subscribing is crafting bag because they know you'll just make them pay for the good stuff anyway. I think the outcome of that will be strongly felt in server populations.

So, back to your comment, something like chapter based payment is interesting. It could combine subscription and expansion. But first we have to survive this upcoming potential debacle.

Tandor · February 2017

So people are complaining that all additional downloadable content is supposed to be free to subscribers and paid for by non-subscribers, while Morrowind is going to be paid for by everyone including subscribers. So where were all the complainers when the One Tamriel/Dueling downloadable content was given free to everyone including non-subscribers, or when it was announced that the Homestead downloadable content would be given free to everyone including non-subscribers?

I guess people only complain when a change means they have to spend money, not when a change means they get something for free!

corrosivechains · February 2017

This is what you guys who are defending this on semantics sound like. Exactly this:

https://youtu.be/6TLo4Z_LWu4

Fallen_Ray · February 2017

Very dirty bold move indeed. It does make sense considering most players stock up on crowns during sales, and most have over 5000 crowns saved up. Making this content purchasable though crowns wouldn't guarantee them the sudden cash influx a separate sale would.

Just wait for a Black Friday sale friends, discounts on content like this one does reach up to 85% off in such sales. To me it's not a must at this point considering there are far better games out there and more to come.

"Patience is a virtue" that's why "Good things come for those who wait"

rollover · February 2017

Since ZOS has taken this new content outside ESO plus I will use my subscription money to instead purchase this "expansion" when available. I have no problem paying for new content and want to support the development of the game.

I do not appreciate the trend ZOS is showing lately of price gouging for new content, the overpriced elk, now bundling together things I don't want with things I do and calling it an "expansion" instead of releasing them as DLCs. If I want a new class, charge me for that. The "new" class and PvP options have nothing to do with Morrowind except that they are finally delivering them concurrently with the new zone(s).

I think it is shady that they want to double-dip on subscribers and expect us to continue our on-going financial support of game development. Pick one model and stick to it, if it is expansions--so be it. But don't offer future content as part of an optional subscription then put content behind a paywall because you bundle it and call it an 'expansion'.

lardvader · February 2017

mb10 wrote: »

lmao why do ESO+ members who pay a few bucks a month think they're entitled to the world?

Get in line and pay the $40 for the expansion

As a subscriber I 100% agree with this

I only have ESO+ for the crafting bag and IMO is all we need. I couldn't care less how I pay for the new content - I have bought every dlc regardless of my sub and the crowns I've used have probably been bought outside the membership.

I honestly thought there would be more excitement and a positive wibe here today but I guess we're *** up as a community. First thing I'm gonna quit is the forum long before I stop enjoying this game.

People have been crying for new content, trial, class and battleground - ZoS answer and it just creates a *** storm....

Gina must hate her job sometimes and I can't blame her for that.....

In fact I honestly hope they change the + model so you only get the bag and extra xp. All extra content have to be payed for (with money) like other mmo's.