JustAGoodPlayer wrote: »

In a lot of games there are classes who can remove all enemy buffs or good effects.

It is good counter for builds that have to much buffs. Some builds can do not have buffs or it is easy for them to bring them back.

But such skills in such games have about 15-30 seconds calldown and remove not 1 but some number or all buffs.

But, those games are designed, from the start, around that. This game was not, and this set is just kind of dumped in after 7 years. And it really doesn't fit here. Especially with the costs associated with maintaining buffs. Buff skills are expensive, compared to the methods of debuffing an enemy. So this set will always advantage the wearer. Unless the opponent is running Oakensoul, or severely nerfing their damage and survivability by running 2 or 5 piece permanent buff sets, in which case, Oaken is going to be better.

Here are some sets that nocturnal's ploy is going to completely gimp or gut if it goes live:

Sea serpent's coil - You don't get full uptime on major berserk and major courage, it only gives buff timers that are refreshed every time the condition is met meaning they can steal these buffs from you.

Daedric trickery

Clever alchemist - clever users already have to limit their potion usage to 1 bar and this will just allow people to snatch their potion buffs and make it so they can only get them back in another 45 seconds

Olorime

Gossamer - Rip to gossamer healers, your healer build is now going to be gutted because the major evasion is just going to get yoinked away

Gryphon's ferocity - It's possible to regain gryphon buffs easily so it won't be completely gutted but still a nerf to this set nonetheless

Magma incarnate

Grace of gloom

This set is strong enough to ruin multiple 5 pieces and a mythic item. That is beyond ridiculous.

That's just to name a few. The only certainty you get is with sets like Chudan, rattlecage, dreugh king slayer, slimecraw, and oakensoul. Do people want to be limited to using sets like this? At that point we might as well just all main ravenwatch lmao

JustAGoodPlayer wrote: »

The idea to punish HOTs and BUFFs is not bad.

You can remove all dots, so remove all hots and buffs is not bad thing.

But remove 1 buff in 2 seconds - is a little strange.

Will it remove last, first buff or random by the way ?

I'd be more ok if it was a hot remover specifically. A random buff removed is what gets problematic

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

To add onto what I said before. Sets like this can basically dictate what you're going to be forced to wear in PVP. People are gonna have to be forced to run chudan, rattlecage or oakensoul on almost every build just to not be stripped away of any feasible damage in PvP.

People love to scream build diversity but sets like this just make it impossible to play around with sets because now your entire playstyle is gonna be limited or gutted.

Spell power potion users are now losing access to their sorcery because of it. Clever alchemist users are now going to be severely hindered because their potions are already linked to 1 bar as is and now they're potion buffs are going to be severely limited even more. Daedric trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this, making trickery effectively useless when getting outnumbered by people using this set.

So on and so forth, sets like this COMPLETELY ruin the flow of combat and severely guts usage of so many sets. It's effectively stronger than a 5 piece and I don't see why it would not completely destroy PVP if it goes live in current iteration

Sets always dictate what you're going to be wearing in PvP. That's how metas work. Bomb sets came out and PvP meta became 30k health minimum. "Sets interact with each other and change what is good" is in no way unique to New Noc, and isn't new to the game or pvp scene. There is a truncated list in my earlier post that covers like..."Most sets that exist" for stuff that survives Nocturnals Purge.

Clever Alch's biggest pop was for the WD buff. Most of the time you're running tris or immov on the set up, which means you're losing the regens and thats about it.

"Daedric Trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this" - the argument here being that one person wearing one set trumps multiple people wearing this particular set? Because thats what this sounds like. "If 1 DT user wants DT and 5 Nocturnals Users dont, the DT user should be allowed to have DT". That doesn't seem like a weird argument to you?

"Severely guts usage of so many sets" - like, which? Because almost every one of these types of posts boil down to "what if a bunch of people are all on you spamming this" and then like...I don't know many, you're 1vX and a bunch of people are on you. You probably *should* have a hard time. At least they're not running something that actually kills you I guess?

And in 1v1, if someone is reliably proccing this every 2s....what are you dying to? A guy weaving Puncture or LMNO Breach every other skill? With 500dmg basic attacks in between? You think *anyone* is dying to that? And if there's one guy doing that while 5 more beat on you...again, you're against a group that has at least some level of a plan. Why *should* you get out of that easily? Why shouldn't you *probably* die there? Nobody can ever answer that question. I know ESO *has had* the performance that one person can kill eight if you LoS and dodge and heal and buff enough - so much so that dedicated solo players don't even bat an eye when 6 people roll up to the rss, they just walk up the tower and go to work - but that doesn't seem strange to you? Or like...I don't know. Bad? Does it not make sense that six people attacking one person on multiple fronts *should* be drastically favored?

I don't get it.

FrankonPC wrote: »

you can have these benefits by having dmg and high hitting combinations. you dont have to remove buffs to make outnumbered fights difficult. they're already difficult. there's already debuffs that exist in the game that counteract buffs. major and minor fracture for resolve, cost increase poisons and other sets for recoveries, etc. this STACKS on those things.

if you disagree that it's broken, that's fine. think of it like this...is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight? if the counter to this set is to never be in an outnumbered fight...is that good for the game to have everyone stack tighter than they are now?

outnumbered fights are already difficult because it's fighting more dmg, more ultimates, more healing, etc. they dont also need a set that makes you naked for free(imo.

Except solo and smallscalers get by specifically by knowing the ins and outs and simply not getting hit, and when the damage is high enough (i.e. oakensoul) tend to get really mad about it.

Not gonna say it isn't difficult to 1vX. I never managed to do it consistently. Will say for it being *very* difficult there sure are or were plenty of people that do it regularly.

There are already debuffs - and ways around debuffs. There are already buffs - previous to Nocturnals there was no way around those. Now there is.

"Is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight"

is it fun/engaging gameplay to watch one player ignore six of you because their buffed stats allow them to do so? If it isn't engaging to watch six people take all your buffs off by being dedicated to doing so, it definitely is even less engaging to watch one player that never runs out of stam endlessly LoS and self-heal until their ultibomb is ready. For a lot of players the solution to a large amount of smallerscale PvP is and has been, literally, "don't". Don't see how that's engaging, and since this is a step towards mitigating that...

Oh my god you're not naked for free, you're losing 2 buffs every once in awhile because someone dedicated an entire set to doing so. According to you debuffs are already the functional buff cancellers, and there's a set that does this AoE just for existing every 10s. In any case you're not in an open field surrounded (in which case you should probably die no matter what), they're not even going to reliably nail it every 2s because between dodge roll and los they're just straight up not going to hit you every 2s. Even then there's plenty of buffs that can't be purged from static sources, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre Unique, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre actually just straight up invisible stat increases, plenty of buffs (at least minor ones) you get for free just for playing your character on like, half of the classes...

I dunno man, I dunno what you want. 1v1 the set isn't even good, and if someone is specializing as an Xv1 utility spec that's...probably a good thing.

Zski wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

To add onto what I said before. Sets like this can basically dictate what you're going to be forced to wear in PVP. People are gonna have to be forced to run chudan, rattlecage or oakensoul on almost every build just to not be stripped away of any feasible damage in PvP.

People love to scream build diversity but sets like this just make it impossible to play around with sets because now your entire playstyle is gonna be limited or gutted.

Spell power potion users are now losing access to their sorcery because of it. Clever alchemist users are now going to be severely hindered because their potions are already linked to 1 bar as is and now they're potion buffs are going to be severely limited even more. Daedric trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this, making trickery effectively useless when getting outnumbered by people using this set.

So on and so forth, sets like this COMPLETELY ruin the flow of combat and severely guts usage of so many sets. It's effectively stronger than a 5 piece and I don't see why it would not completely destroy PVP if it goes live in current iteration

Sets always dictate what you're going to be wearing in PvP. That's how metas work. Bomb sets came out and PvP meta became 30k health minimum. "Sets interact with each other and change what is good" is in no way unique to New Noc, and isn't new to the game or pvp scene. There is a truncated list in my earlier post that covers like..."Most sets that exist" for stuff that survives Nocturnals Purge.

Clever Alch's biggest pop was for the WD buff. Most of the time you're running tris or immov on the set up, which means you're losing the regens and thats about it.

"Daedric Trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this" - the argument here being that one person wearing one set trumps multiple people wearing this particular set? Because thats what this sounds like. "If 1 DT user wants DT and 5 Nocturnals Users dont, the DT user should be allowed to have DT". That doesn't seem like a weird argument to you?

"Severely guts usage of so many sets" - like, which? Because almost every one of these types of posts boil down to "what if a bunch of people are all on you spamming this" and then like...I don't know many, you're 1vX and a bunch of people are on you. You probably *should* have a hard time. At least they're not running something that actually kills you I guess?

And in 1v1, if someone is reliably proccing this every 2s....what are you dying to? A guy weaving Puncture or LMNO Breach every other skill? With 500dmg basic attacks in between? You think *anyone* is dying to that? And if there's one guy doing that while 5 more beat on you...again, you're against a group that has at least some level of a plan. Why *should* you get out of that easily? Why shouldn't you *probably* die there? Nobody can ever answer that question. I know ESO *has had* the performance that one person can kill eight if you LoS and dodge and heal and buff enough - so much so that dedicated solo players don't even bat an eye when 6 people roll up to the rss, they just walk up the tower and go to work - but that doesn't seem strange to you? Or like...I don't know. Bad? Does it not make sense that six people attacking one person on multiple fronts *should* be drastically favored?

I don't get it.

FrankonPC wrote: »

you can have these benefits by having dmg and high hitting combinations. you dont have to remove buffs to make outnumbered fights difficult. they're already difficult. there's already debuffs that exist in the game that counteract buffs. major and minor fracture for resolve, cost increase poisons and other sets for recoveries, etc. this STACKS on those things.

if you disagree that it's broken, that's fine. think of it like this...is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight? if the counter to this set is to never be in an outnumbered fight...is that good for the game to have everyone stack tighter than they are now?

outnumbered fights are already difficult because it's fighting more dmg, more ultimates, more healing, etc. they dont also need a set that makes you naked for free(imo.

Except solo and smallscalers get by specifically by knowing the ins and outs and simply not getting hit, and when the damage is high enough (i.e. oakensoul) tend to get really mad about it.

Not gonna say it isn't difficult to 1vX. I never managed to do it consistently. Will say for it being *very* difficult there sure are or were plenty of people that do it regularly.

There are already debuffs - and ways around debuffs. There are already buffs - previous to Nocturnals there was no way around those. Now there is.

"Is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight"

is it fun/engaging gameplay to watch one player ignore six of you because their buffed stats allow them to do so? If it isn't engaging to watch six people take all your buffs off by being dedicated to doing so, it definitely is even less engaging to watch one player that never runs out of stam endlessly LoS and self-heal until their ultibomb is ready. For a lot of players the solution to a large amount of smallerscale PvP is and has been, literally, "don't". Don't see how that's engaging, and since this is a step towards mitigating that...

Oh my god you're not naked for free, you're losing 2 buffs every once in awhile because someone dedicated an entire set to doing so. According to you debuffs are already the functional buff cancellers, and there's a set that does this AoE just for existing every 10s. In any case you're not in an open field surrounded (in which case you should probably die no matter what), they're not even going to reliably nail it every 2s because between dodge roll and los they're just straight up not going to hit you every 2s. Even then there's plenty of buffs that can't be purged from static sources, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre Unique, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre actually just straight up invisible stat increases, plenty of buffs (at least minor ones) you get for free just for playing your character on like, half of the classes...

I dunno man, I dunno what you want. 1v1 the set isn't even good, and if someone is specializing as an Xv1 utility spec that's...probably a good thing.

I think you are overlooking a fundamental aspect of the set, and buffs/debuffs in general.

Most buffs and debuffs are counters to one another. So, for example, lets look at Major Breach and Major Resolve.

Direct counters to one another. So a player who has Major Resolve active gets hit by a skill like Weakness to Elements with Major Breach. The result is net zero. The player applying Breach removes the benefits of Major resolve, and that is it.

Now, take this set. The same scenario, the player applying Weakness, is now removing Resolve from the other player entirely. So not only are they removing the buff, their Major Breach is doing it's full debuff on the opponent too. So, for just these two interactions of Buff/Debuff, it practically doubles the effect of Major Breach on the target. Alongside forcing the opponent to waste resources reapplying the buff. And then, in a few more seconds, or in using another skill that has a minor debuff or major debuff, they are removing it again or removing other buffs. All of which are net gains for the wearer of the set, compared to the net zero return without it.

Zski wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

To add onto what I said before. Sets like this can basically dictate what you're going to be forced to wear in PVP. People are gonna have to be forced to run chudan, rattlecage or oakensoul on almost every build just to not be stripped away of any feasible damage in PvP.

People love to scream build diversity but sets like this just make it impossible to play around with sets because now your entire playstyle is gonna be limited or gutted.

Spell power potion users are now losing access to their sorcery because of it. Clever alchemist users are now going to be severely hindered because their potions are already linked to 1 bar as is and now they're potion buffs are going to be severely limited even more. Daedric trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this, making trickery effectively useless when getting outnumbered by people using this set.

So on and so forth, sets like this COMPLETELY ruin the flow of combat and severely guts usage of so many sets. It's effectively stronger than a 5 piece and I don't see why it would not completely destroy PVP if it goes live in current iteration

Sets always dictate what you're going to be wearing in PvP. That's how metas work. Bomb sets came out and PvP meta became 30k health minimum. "Sets interact with each other and change what is good" is in no way unique to New Noc, and isn't new to the game or pvp scene. There is a truncated list in my earlier post that covers like..."Most sets that exist" for stuff that survives Nocturnals Purge.

Clever Alch's biggest pop was for the WD buff. Most of the time you're running tris or immov on the set up, which means you're losing the regens and thats about it.

"Daedric Trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this" - the argument here being that one person wearing one set trumps multiple people wearing this particular set? Because thats what this sounds like. "If 1 DT user wants DT and 5 Nocturnals Users dont, the DT user should be allowed to have DT". That doesn't seem like a weird argument to you?

"Severely guts usage of so many sets" - like, which? Because almost every one of these types of posts boil down to "what if a bunch of people are all on you spamming this" and then like...I don't know many, you're 1vX and a bunch of people are on you. You probably *should* have a hard time. At least they're not running something that actually kills you I guess?

And in 1v1, if someone is reliably proccing this every 2s....what are you dying to? A guy weaving Puncture or LMNO Breach every other skill? With 500dmg basic attacks in between? You think *anyone* is dying to that? And if there's one guy doing that while 5 more beat on you...again, you're against a group that has at least some level of a plan. Why *should* you get out of that easily? Why shouldn't you *probably* die there? Nobody can ever answer that question. I know ESO *has had* the performance that one person can kill eight if you LoS and dodge and heal and buff enough - so much so that dedicated solo players don't even bat an eye when 6 people roll up to the rss, they just walk up the tower and go to work - but that doesn't seem strange to you? Or like...I don't know. Bad? Does it not make sense that six people attacking one person on multiple fronts *should* be drastically favored?

I don't get it.

FrankonPC wrote: »

you can have these benefits by having dmg and high hitting combinations. you dont have to remove buffs to make outnumbered fights difficult. they're already difficult. there's already debuffs that exist in the game that counteract buffs. major and minor fracture for resolve, cost increase poisons and other sets for recoveries, etc. this STACKS on those things.

if you disagree that it's broken, that's fine. think of it like this...is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight? if the counter to this set is to never be in an outnumbered fight...is that good for the game to have everyone stack tighter than they are now?

outnumbered fights are already difficult because it's fighting more dmg, more ultimates, more healing, etc. they dont also need a set that makes you naked for free(imo.

Except solo and smallscalers get by specifically by knowing the ins and outs and simply not getting hit, and when the damage is high enough (i.e. oakensoul) tend to get really mad about it.

Not gonna say it isn't difficult to 1vX. I never managed to do it consistently. Will say for it being *very* difficult there sure are or were plenty of people that do it regularly.

There are already debuffs - and ways around debuffs. There are already buffs - previous to Nocturnals there was no way around those. Now there is.

"Is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight"

is it fun/engaging gameplay to watch one player ignore six of you because their buffed stats allow them to do so? If it isn't engaging to watch six people take all your buffs off by being dedicated to doing so, it definitely is even less engaging to watch one player that never runs out of stam endlessly LoS and self-heal until their ultibomb is ready. For a lot of players the solution to a large amount of smallerscale PvP is and has been, literally, "don't". Don't see how that's engaging, and since this is a step towards mitigating that...

Oh my god you're not naked for free, you're losing 2 buffs every once in awhile because someone dedicated an entire set to doing so. According to you debuffs are already the functional buff cancellers, and there's a set that does this AoE just for existing every 10s. In any case you're not in an open field surrounded (in which case you should probably die no matter what), they're not even going to reliably nail it every 2s because between dodge roll and los they're just straight up not going to hit you every 2s. Even then there's plenty of buffs that can't be purged from static sources, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre Unique, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre actually just straight up invisible stat increases, plenty of buffs (at least minor ones) you get for free just for playing your character on like, half of the classes...

I dunno man, I dunno what you want. 1v1 the set isn't even good, and if someone is specializing as an Xv1 utility spec that's...probably a good thing.

"1 v 1 the set isn't good"

this is not true at all. not allowing your opponent to ever have major resolve is the equivalent of having a set better than 5 pc stuhn with almost 100% uptime. they try to buff? eliminate it. this is the best dmg 5 pc in the game for that reason alone.

it also eliminates potion buffs, which is a 30% buff to all 3 stats. this is better than any set option in the game. these are two buffs that you eliminate for free every 2 seconds.

"you're losing buffs every once in a while" - the set has a 2 second cooldown. you lose everything every time you try with a free skill.

"good players know the ins and outs of the game" - yes they do. what's stopping anyone else from doing this? perhaps they also know how broken this is and how it can be abused as well. this isn't about being able to 1 v x easier, this is breaking mechanics of the game. you already have buffs and debuffs in the game that help and hinder your opponents...now you're stacking this. if you can't debuff an enemy because they're "good" and a set now allows you to do that...perhaps, just perhaps that set is broken because it's bypassing actual game mechanics.

if you can't kill one person with 6 people that's a you problem. l2p

Players in the community need to stop thinking that sets can all of a sudden help them even the playing field. good players can run these sets as well, to a much better effect than inexperienced players and abuse it more. maybe this patch instead of trying to have crutches make it to live so "inexperienced players can compete", we come to the realization that every single time this has happened it's abused by the best players and the community comes to the forums to get that set nerfed anyways. it happened with oakensoul, with sloads, with viper/tremor/blackrose...it happened this upcoming patch with plaguebreak and dark convergence and it will happen with this set.

Zski wrote: »

xDeusEJRx wrote: »

To add onto what I said before. Sets like this can basically dictate what you're going to be forced to wear in PVP. People are gonna have to be forced to run chudan, rattlecage or oakensoul on almost every build just to not be stripped away of any feasible damage in PvP.

People love to scream build diversity but sets like this just make it impossible to play around with sets because now your entire playstyle is gonna be limited or gutted.

Spell power potion users are now losing access to their sorcery because of it. Clever alchemist users are now going to be severely hindered because their potions are already linked to 1 bar as is and now they're potion buffs are going to be severely limited even more. Daedric trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this, making trickery effectively useless when getting outnumbered by people using this set.

So on and so forth, sets like this COMPLETELY ruin the flow of combat and severely guts usage of so many sets. It's effectively stronger than a 5 piece and I don't see why it would not completely destroy PVP if it goes live in current iteration

Sets always dictate what you're going to be wearing in PvP. That's how metas work. Bomb sets came out and PvP meta became 30k health minimum. "Sets interact with each other and change what is good" is in no way unique to New Noc, and isn't new to the game or pvp scene. There is a truncated list in my earlier post that covers like..."Most sets that exist" for stuff that survives Nocturnals Purge.

Clever Alch's biggest pop was for the WD buff. Most of the time you're running tris or immov on the set up, which means you're losing the regens and thats about it.

"Daedric Trickery can basically be entirely dispelled by people if they fight multiple people using this" - the argument here being that one person wearing one set trumps multiple people wearing this particular set? Because thats what this sounds like. "If 1 DT user wants DT and 5 Nocturnals Users dont, the DT user should be allowed to have DT". That doesn't seem like a weird argument to you?

"Severely guts usage of so many sets" - like, which? Because almost every one of these types of posts boil down to "what if a bunch of people are all on you spamming this" and then like...I don't know many, you're 1vX and a bunch of people are on you. You probably *should* have a hard time. At least they're not running something that actually kills you I guess?

And in 1v1, if someone is reliably proccing this every 2s....what are you dying to? A guy weaving Puncture or LMNO Breach every other skill? With 500dmg basic attacks in between? You think *anyone* is dying to that? And if there's one guy doing that while 5 more beat on you...again, you're against a group that has at least some level of a plan. Why *should* you get out of that easily? Why shouldn't you *probably* die there? Nobody can ever answer that question. I know ESO *has had* the performance that one person can kill eight if you LoS and dodge and heal and buff enough - so much so that dedicated solo players don't even bat an eye when 6 people roll up to the rss, they just walk up the tower and go to work - but that doesn't seem strange to you? Or like...I don't know. Bad? Does it not make sense that six people attacking one person on multiple fronts *should* be drastically favored?

I don't get it.

FrankonPC wrote: »

you can have these benefits by having dmg and high hitting combinations. you dont have to remove buffs to make outnumbered fights difficult. they're already difficult. there's already debuffs that exist in the game that counteract buffs. major and minor fracture for resolve, cost increase poisons and other sets for recoveries, etc. this STACKS on those things.

if you disagree that it's broken, that's fine. think of it like this...is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight? if the counter to this set is to never be in an outnumbered fight...is that good for the game to have everyone stack tighter than they are now?

outnumbered fights are already difficult because it's fighting more dmg, more ultimates, more healing, etc. they dont also need a set that makes you naked for free(imo.

Except solo and smallscalers get by specifically by knowing the ins and outs and simply not getting hit, and when the damage is high enough (i.e. oakensoul) tend to get really mad about it.

Not gonna say it isn't difficult to 1vX. I never managed to do it consistently. Will say for it being *very* difficult there sure are or were plenty of people that do it regularly.

There are already debuffs - and ways around debuffs. There are already buffs - previous to Nocturnals there was no way around those. Now there is.

"Is it fun/engaging gameplay to lose all of your buffs in any outnumbered fight"

is it fun/engaging gameplay to watch one player ignore six of you because their buffed stats allow them to do so? If it isn't engaging to watch six people take all your buffs off by being dedicated to doing so, it definitely is even less engaging to watch one player that never runs out of stam endlessly LoS and self-heal until their ultibomb is ready. For a lot of players the solution to a large amount of smallerscale PvP is and has been, literally, "don't". Don't see how that's engaging, and since this is a step towards mitigating that...

Oh my god you're not naked for free, you're losing 2 buffs every once in awhile because someone dedicated an entire set to doing so. According to you debuffs are already the functional buff cancellers, and there's a set that does this AoE just for existing every 10s. In any case you're not in an open field surrounded (in which case you should probably die no matter what), they're not even going to reliably nail it every 2s because between dodge roll and los they're just straight up not going to hit you every 2s. Even then there's plenty of buffs that can't be purged from static sources, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre Unique, plenty of buffs that cant be purged because theyre actually just straight up invisible stat increases, plenty of buffs (at least minor ones) you get for free just for playing your character on like, half of the classes...

I dunno man, I dunno what you want. 1v1 the set isn't even good, and if someone is specializing as an Xv1 utility spec that's...probably a good thing.

I got to be honest. I didn't read half of what you were saying but based on what I did read . . .

The set currently has a 2 seconds cooldown. You won't need 5 Nocturnal users to counter 1 DT user. You just need 1/4th of a Nocturnal user to counter DT lol and thats not even including minor buffs.

EDITED* I read more of what you said and there is so much factually incorrect statements.

FrankonPC wrote: »

i remember when 13k pen on stuhn was too much on the pts...

That reminds me, remember when they tried adding a single target silence/negate effect to Incap Strike? Players correctly identified numerous reasons why that was a terrible idea, and the devs wisely reverted it. This set is similarly debilitating in a similarly unfun way, basically singling out a random individual and telling them they're not allowed to fight back. I think much like Negate, a telegraphed stationary AoE dispel effect would be fine, but not something that sticks to one person.

Wolfpaw wrote: »

Surprised this type of play isn't coming with a new skill line, maybe down the road.

I just designed an ultimate for that skill line, hire me ZOS!

"JUST DIE ALREADY TOWER ******" (Actual skill name)

Target: 50m (Weve "crunched the numbers" and found this number optimal)

Cost: 110 ultimate (This skill needs to be cheap. how else are new players going to compete with 8 year veterans?)

Description: Remove all buffs and positive effects from target, stun and silence target for up to 5 seconds depending on their K/D ratio over the last hour. A ratio better than 1.0 will cause maximum silence and stun. This ability does not grant CC immunity and is unblockable and undodgeable. (We are reworking our PvP standards. Numbers should always win. We will be going further this route next update so stay tuned😉)

(this is the unmorphed skill at rank 1 🤡)

Zski wrote: »

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

if you can't kill one person with 6 people that's a you problem. l2p

Players in the community need to stop thinking that sets can all of a sudden help them even the playing field. good players can run these sets as well, to a much better effect than inexperienced players and abuse it more. maybe this patch instead of trying to have crutches make it to live so "inexperienced players can compete", we come to the realization that every single time this has happened it's abused by the best players and the community comes to the forums to get that set nerfed anyways. it happened with oakensoul, with sloads, with viper/tremor/blackrose...it happened this upcoming patch with plaguebreak and dark convergence and it will happen with this set.

I mean I'm not the one dying to a guy using every other GCD to Puncture me instead of using a real skill, assuming they're even in range/los/not cc'd/capable of hitting me with the double debuff at all. Not sure that l2p is aimed the right way there, champ.

Also the defacto meta sets that penetrate Cyro tend to be creator derived, but the ones that really take hold everywhere are proactively powerful. People like big numbers and killing blows, zerg surfers included.

Of course not, you're the guy that's admittedly said they can't 6 v 1 someone because of major buffs. You're dying for other reasons.

You're attempting to defend this set with terrible arguments like "occasional buff drop" and "pierce armor range".
Bringing up the range of Pierce armor and ignoring the free cast of ele drain is just a strawman, but you already know that.

If you don't see how a 5900 armor reduction is valuable for burst and will turn into big numbers, on top of all of the other removals it gives every 2 seconds you can't be helped. I think you do though, which is why youre attempting to defend the indefensible. As I said before it's one of the best dmg sets in the game for that reason alone. You will get big dmg numbers with this set, your opponents will lose 30% sustain with potions, any set with a buff will be removed, etc. Yeah, sounds like an awful set that I definitely won't run and abuse if it goes live.