SilverBride wrote: »If that's the case, and as a requested feature by the community over the years, this really is a good thing. Endgame/combat PvE and PvP server performance above all imo.
It has been requested by some, not by the community, and it was not requested as a means to fix performance. If the only way they can fix performance is to completely wipe out 8 years of history and drive a large portion of the playerbase away, then they may as well just hang it up now.
skyrimfantasy wrote: »silvereyes wrote: »From what I've seen on the rest of PTS, quests are generally supposed to be tracked at the individual character level still. If this is not the case for some quests, please file a bug report.RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »Some repeatable content is lost. It's hard for me to test this properly without my EU chars on the PTS, but...
Some collection quests are tracked by Achievement dialogues, e.g. Relics of Summerset. It looks like these are not repeatable now. I just tested this by getting the Monochrome Paintbrush ticked off on one character, logged in on another character and found that it was no longer there for them to pick up.
Has anyone seen what happens to the adoring fan and Choixth? Are they only going to appear for the first character now (or never again in my case)?
I can confirm that the Solitude Musical Instruments quest is no longer tracked on multiple characters. If you already did this quest on one character, then the museum will already be filled with instruments on another.
This essentially means you can only earn ONE music box from this quest per account.
This also means you can only get one factotum training dummy from CWC. Museum quests should have been treated like the PD group events and be per character.
alberichtano wrote: »I think account wide achievements are for server resources. I need to read the comments to see if anyone else is thinks the same.
My feedback is that I don't like it. I like developing my individual characters. I like getting achievements on each of the characters. I like achievement pop-ups.Sometimes when I don't know what to do, I look at the achievements and figure out something for that particular character. :thumbsdown:
I think you are correct, that it is a matter of saving resources in game. But I am no programmer, so I may be wrong.
If that's the case, and as a requested feature by the community over the years, this really is a good thing. Endgame/combat PvE and PvP server performance above all imo. It's a MMOrpg first.
alberichtano wrote: »I think account wide achievements are for server resources. I need to read the comments to see if anyone else is thinks the same.
My feedback is that I don't like it. I like developing my individual characters. I like getting achievements on each of the characters. I like achievement pop-ups.Sometimes when I don't know what to do, I look at the achievements and figure out something for that particular character. :thumbsdown:
I think you are correct, that it is a matter of saving resources in game. But I am no programmer, so I may be wrong.
ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »Wolfpaw wrote:I
Worse, one characters achievements are overwriting another, creating immense pressure to choose which character they'll log into first after the update...or none at all.
"We are the Borg. Your Achievements and experiences will be assimiliated." :-/
SilverBride wrote: »
alberichtano wrote: »[
Good thing I collected as many as I could earlier... :-O
alberichtano wrote: »I think account wide achievements are for server resources. I need to read the comments to see if anyone else is thinks the same.
My feedback is that I don't like it. I like developing my individual characters. I like getting achievements on each of the characters. I like achievement pop-ups.Sometimes when I don't know what to do, I look at the achievements and figure out something for that particular character. :thumbsdown:
I think you are correct, that it is a matter of saving resources in game. But I am no programmer, so I may be wrong.
The reason I think it's not the case here is because ZOS has made sure to let us know when they are doing things to "improve performance," no matter how small. They were sure to let us know when a rarely used weapon glyph was going to be reworked from checking a list of NPC types into something that has to constantly calculate three resources.... as a "performance improvement." Did we see any performance improvement? I'll let you answer that for yourselves. But if AWA was going to reduce server load in any way, they would have made sure we knew about it, not just mentioned in passing as an "oh, by the way" in a live stream.
Somehow I fail to see the logic in fixing what's not broken while ancient bugs wait patiently for some attention.
I would miss my beloved zone quests on my new alts so I for one do not support the concept of account-wide zone completion.
SilverBride wrote: »If that's the case, and as a requested feature by the community over the years, this really is a good thing. Endgame/combat PvE and PvP server performance above all imo.
It has been requested by some, not by the community, and it was not requested as a means to fix performance. If the only way they can fix performance is to completely wipe out 8 years of history and drive a large portion of the playerbase away, then they may as well just hang it up now.
Those some are part of the community, it's obvious not every player. Please try not to be argumentative over ever little word when someone has a different opinion.
This thread is not just for complaints...
aura_36ub17_ESO wrote: »Having a completionist and somewhat addictive personality I am stoked about this I have a ton of chars and the impulse to complete achieves on all of them has been somewhat detracting for me I have two chars well into 30k achieves and tons over 10k I dont care about losing the progress on the alts honestly. this change will further progress my main and save me from myself and let see sunshine sometimes. I think this is a positive change for a lot of people . you can still do all the achieves and replay all the same quests for the tenth time if you want to without being compelled by the dopamine dropping achieve ding.
now make Alliance war rank account wide and make any pvp done on any char feed the center pool so im not stuck playing a toon from years ago just to make Grand Overlord on my account it is aweful playing alts when trying to get this achieve and gets me stuck on one char for pvp. Grand Overlord is a massive time sink that a lot of chars wont see in 5 years of playing and possibly never if they play multiple toons. yes some with 40+ hours a week for many months can do it in less but lets be real.
alberichtano wrote: »I think account wide achievements are for server resources. I need to read the comments to see if anyone else is thinks the same.
My feedback is that I don't like it. I like developing my individual characters. I like getting achievements on each of the characters. I like achievement pop-ups.Sometimes when I don't know what to do, I look at the achievements and figure out something for that particular character. :thumbsdown:
I think you are correct, that it is a matter of saving resources in game. But I am no programmer, so I may be wrong.
alberichtano wrote: »BlackArgonian wrote: »This change is one of the best ones in years, newer players will actually be able to fill out that achievement book realistically now and won't look at it like a lost cause. And with the hybridisation changes we are getting as well, this game is feeling more like and Elder Scrolls game than ever.
The main thing I think this improves is getting rid of players who sell achievements, farm runs, trifectas, even emperor is sold by endgame communities. They could carry people for free out of the kindness of their heart, but where is the profit in that?
I do want spellcrafting, but I love card games. I honestly wanted a multiplayer minigame system for a long time, so I'm glad the team delivered. Playing against my wife with some stakes will be fun
Why would this stop achievement selling? If anything, it will make them demand even more gold, as it will now only be done once per account, rather than once per character.
nightstrike wrote: »Please do not roll this out as currently designed. Send it back to the drawing board and account for the fact that there are people, myself included, who do not want this feature at all.
Perhaps try monetizing it like with skill points. Charge crowns to insta-get the achievements.
wolfie1.0. wrote: »alberichtano wrote: »I think account wide achievements are for server resources. I need to read the comments to see if anyone else is thinks the same.
My feedback is that I don't like it. I like developing my individual characters. I like getting achievements on each of the characters. I like achievement pop-ups.Sometimes when I don't know what to do, I look at the achievements and figure out something for that particular character. :thumbsdown:
I think you are correct, that it is a matter of saving resources in game. But I am no programmer, so I may be wrong.
There are a lot other things they could do to preserve server resources that wouldn't be account wide achievements. Ones that would have less of an impact. Especially since not everything is moving over. If they wanted to save space they could get rid of items that don't make sense anymore like petty repair boxes or do a mat consolidation project, or a set reduction project, or a recipe reduction project, or simply block addons. Or any of many other options. They could even pull a final fantasy and block new account creation for a time.
silvereyes wrote: »Gina's exact wording again:Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Hi All,
For those asking about the Q&A, we are currently working on it. We will let you know when it is ready. Again, as many of you have noted, this is a lengthy thread with a lot of feedback, so it will take time to parse through and answer questions accordingly. But as stated before, we are not only working on the Q&A, but this thread has been shared with the teams working on the Account-Wide Achievements and they are going through it as well.
Lastly, I do want to remind everyone of community guidelines. We understand this is a hot-button thread, so please keep them in mind as we don't want anyone to cross a line when we are all trying to make sure the community has the space to share their feedback. Thanks, all.
@ZOS_Kevin Thanks for the reply. With regard to the first paragraph, if the company acknowledges the length of the thread, the amount of feedback, and the time it will take to parse through and answer questions accordingly, as well as sharing all that with the teams involved, would that not suggest the wisdom of pulling this system change from the impending Update and returning with it later in the year when you have all had an opportunity to take the necessary time to do it justice and hold onto the chunk of the playerbase that is so adamantly opposed to the changes that currently the company shows no sign of moving on?
This system change is unique among major changes in all the MMORPGs I've been playing since 1998 in that it introduces a change that appeals to some and not to others but is being implemented in a way that unites both sets of players against it. Again, surely the 1,100+ comments deserve a more meaningful response by now than "thanks but we're still working on a Q&A and we don't have anything else to say at this time except to remind you of the forum rules". Surely your beta and launch players along with all those who've entered Tamriel since then are entitled to expect a bit more consideration than that?
It doesnt unite both side against it, lots of poeple still want it as long as some bugs like the bard college are fixed, i even know a few who woulnt mind it to lauch as it is(those few dont like questing thats why)
It unites most of us in its present form. You are making an assumption as to whether something constitutes a bug or is working as intended, and it is the failure of today's patch notes to even address that point that is likely to make us even more united. I totally get that the community is more or less evenly divided on the principle of account-wide achievements, but the way they were implemented initially on the PTS with no adjustments, fixes, or even mentions, in the two subsequent patches has been roundly criticised by those who support the principle every bit as much as by those opposed to it.
Earlier today around when the patch note where posted, gina did post in the bug report thread stating that bugs outlied in that thread where going to be fixed in the remaining pts patch meaning that at some of the problem spoken about here are indeed bugs.
But i do agree i should have been in the known issue part of the patch note
Edit misremembered the post being in this thread
That would also mean that they plan on pushing this awful change out to live.
The writing is on the wall.Emphasis mine.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Thanks for the reports here, everyone. Just wanted to let you know we have been keeping an eye on this thread and are still working on getting some of the things called out from this thread fixed in future PTS patches.
At the time she wrote that, here were the bug reports remaining from that thread that had not been fixed yet:
- Earned by tooltips going to the wrong characters.
- Unrepeatable museum quests
- Precursor quest not requiring collecting all the parts
- Account-wide achievements in the category "Character"
- Delves auto-completing
- World bosses auto-completing
- World events (dolmens, gysers, etc.) auto-completing
- Undaunted reputation for dailies not increasing
- Delve boss cooldown timers resetting when the delve is discovered
- Melina Cassel not offering quest for the Markarth Friend In Deed achievement.
- Two NPCs overlapping on a throne in Elsweyr
- Vampire / Werewolf skill unlocks unpurchaseable in the Crown Store
- Some strangeness with map completion inside vs. outside of zone, although this may be an issue with addons
- NPC not appearing in Orsinium quest, A Question of Succession. This may be a rare bug on live, since I was able to just log off and back in to reset the NPC.
That's a pretty big list, and the vast majority of the bugs in the list are directly AwA related, so I agree that AwA is probably getting released in some form. How many of the bugs get fixed, and which ones are working as intended, if any, will determine to a large degree how awful this update is when it makes it to live.
I also thought Gina's vague wording was kind of odd, like she's under some embargo from giving a definitive answer on which bugs are being worked on. Blink twice if you are being held hostage, Gina!
I feel really bad for her and Kevin, having to read through so many repeat complaints without being able to put them to rest.
alberichtano wrote: »silvereyes wrote: »Gina's exact wording again:Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Hi All,
For those asking about the Q&A, we are currently working on it. We will let you know when it is ready. Again, as many of you have noted, this is a lengthy thread with a lot of feedback, so it will take time to parse through and answer questions accordingly. But as stated before, we are not only working on the Q&A, but this thread has been shared with the teams working on the Account-Wide Achievements and they are going through it as well.
Lastly, I do want to remind everyone of community guidelines. We understand this is a hot-button thread, so please keep them in mind as we don't want anyone to cross a line when we are all trying to make sure the community has the space to share their feedback. Thanks, all.
@ZOS_Kevin Thanks for the reply. With regard to the first paragraph, if the company acknowledges the length of the thread, the amount of feedback, and the time it will take to parse through and answer questions accordingly, as well as sharing all that with the teams involved, would that not suggest the wisdom of pulling this system change from the impending Update and returning with it later in the year when you have all had an opportunity to take the necessary time to do it justice and hold onto the chunk of the playerbase that is so adamantly opposed to the changes that currently the company shows no sign of moving on?
This system change is unique among major changes in all the MMORPGs I've been playing since 1998 in that it introduces a change that appeals to some and not to others but is being implemented in a way that unites both sets of players against it. Again, surely the 1,100+ comments deserve a more meaningful response by now than "thanks but we're still working on a Q&A and we don't have anything else to say at this time except to remind you of the forum rules". Surely your beta and launch players along with all those who've entered Tamriel since then are entitled to expect a bit more consideration than that?
It doesnt unite both side against it, lots of poeple still want it as long as some bugs like the bard college are fixed, i even know a few who woulnt mind it to lauch as it is(those few dont like questing thats why)
It unites most of us in its present form. You are making an assumption as to whether something constitutes a bug or is working as intended, and it is the failure of today's patch notes to even address that point that is likely to make us even more united. I totally get that the community is more or less evenly divided on the principle of account-wide achievements, but the way they were implemented initially on the PTS with no adjustments, fixes, or even mentions, in the two subsequent patches has been roundly criticised by those who support the principle every bit as much as by those opposed to it.
Earlier today around when the patch note where posted, gina did post in the bug report thread stating that bugs outlied in that thread where going to be fixed in the remaining pts patch meaning that at some of the problem spoken about here are indeed bugs.
But i do agree i should have been in the known issue part of the patch note
Edit misremembered the post being in this thread
That would also mean that they plan on pushing this awful change out to live.
The writing is on the wall.Emphasis mine.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Thanks for the reports here, everyone. Just wanted to let you know we have been keeping an eye on this thread and are still working on getting some of the things called out from this thread fixed in future PTS patches.
At the time she wrote that, here were the bug reports remaining from that thread that had not been fixed yet:
- Earned by tooltips going to the wrong characters.
- Unrepeatable museum quests
- Precursor quest not requiring collecting all the parts
- Account-wide achievements in the category "Character"
- Delves auto-completing
- World bosses auto-completing
- World events (dolmens, gysers, etc.) auto-completing
- Undaunted reputation for dailies not increasing
- Delve boss cooldown timers resetting when the delve is discovered
- Melina Cassel not offering quest for the Markarth Friend In Deed achievement.
- Two NPCs overlapping on a throne in Elsweyr
- Vampire / Werewolf skill unlocks unpurchaseable in the Crown Store
- Some strangeness with map completion inside vs. outside of zone, although this may be an issue with addons
- NPC not appearing in Orsinium quest, A Question of Succession. This may be a rare bug on live, since I was able to just log off and back in to reset the NPC.
That's a pretty big list, and the vast majority of the bugs in the list are directly AwA related, so I agree that AwA is probably getting released in some form. How many of the bugs get fixed, and which ones are working as intended, if any, will determine to a large degree how awful this update is when it makes it to live.
I also thought Gina's vague wording was kind of odd, like she's under some embargo from giving a definitive answer on which bugs are being worked on. Blink twice if you are being held hostage, Gina!
I feel really bad for her and Kevin, having to read through so many repeat complaints without being able to put them to rest.
I wonder which one they will fix...
Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »nightstrike wrote: »Please do not roll this out as currently designed. Send it back to the drawing board and account for the fact that there are people, myself included, who do not want this feature at all.
Perhaps try monetizing it like with skill points. Charge crowns to insta-get the achievements.
Now nobody will want it
What about the reverse pay to keep it character bound? Less fun, yeah thats what i taught
alberichtano wrote: »silvereyes wrote: »Gina's exact wording again:Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Hi All,
For those asking about the Q&A, we are currently working on it. We will let you know when it is ready. Again, as many of you have noted, this is a lengthy thread with a lot of feedback, so it will take time to parse through and answer questions accordingly. But as stated before, we are not only working on the Q&A, but this thread has been shared with the teams working on the Account-Wide Achievements and they are going through it as well.
Lastly, I do want to remind everyone of community guidelines. We understand this is a hot-button thread, so please keep them in mind as we don't want anyone to cross a line when we are all trying to make sure the community has the space to share their feedback. Thanks, all.
@ZOS_Kevin Thanks for the reply. With regard to the first paragraph, if the company acknowledges the length of the thread, the amount of feedback, and the time it will take to parse through and answer questions accordingly, as well as sharing all that with the teams involved, would that not suggest the wisdom of pulling this system change from the impending Update and returning with it later in the year when you have all had an opportunity to take the necessary time to do it justice and hold onto the chunk of the playerbase that is so adamantly opposed to the changes that currently the company shows no sign of moving on?
This system change is unique among major changes in all the MMORPGs I've been playing since 1998 in that it introduces a change that appeals to some and not to others but is being implemented in a way that unites both sets of players against it. Again, surely the 1,100+ comments deserve a more meaningful response by now than "thanks but we're still working on a Q&A and we don't have anything else to say at this time except to remind you of the forum rules". Surely your beta and launch players along with all those who've entered Tamriel since then are entitled to expect a bit more consideration than that?
It doesnt unite both side against it, lots of poeple still want it as long as some bugs like the bard college are fixed, i even know a few who woulnt mind it to lauch as it is(those few dont like questing thats why)
It unites most of us in its present form. You are making an assumption as to whether something constitutes a bug or is working as intended, and it is the failure of today's patch notes to even address that point that is likely to make us even more united. I totally get that the community is more or less evenly divided on the principle of account-wide achievements, but the way they were implemented initially on the PTS with no adjustments, fixes, or even mentions, in the two subsequent patches has been roundly criticised by those who support the principle every bit as much as by those opposed to it.
Earlier today around when the patch note where posted, gina did post in the bug report thread stating that bugs outlied in that thread where going to be fixed in the remaining pts patch meaning that at some of the problem spoken about here are indeed bugs.
But i do agree i should have been in the known issue part of the patch note
Edit misremembered the post being in this thread
That would also mean that they plan on pushing this awful change out to live.
The writing is on the wall.Emphasis mine.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Thanks for the reports here, everyone. Just wanted to let you know we have been keeping an eye on this thread and are still working on getting some of the things called out from this thread fixed in future PTS patches.
At the time she wrote that, here were the bug reports remaining from that thread that had not been fixed yet:
- Earned by tooltips going to the wrong characters.
- Unrepeatable museum quests
- Precursor quest not requiring collecting all the parts
- Account-wide achievements in the category "Character"
- Delves auto-completing
- World bosses auto-completing
- World events (dolmens, gysers, etc.) auto-completing
- Undaunted reputation for dailies not increasing
- Delve boss cooldown timers resetting when the delve is discovered
- Melina Cassel not offering quest for the Markarth Friend In Deed achievement.
- Two NPCs overlapping on a throne in Elsweyr
- Vampire / Werewolf skill unlocks unpurchaseable in the Crown Store
- Some strangeness with map completion inside vs. outside of zone, although this may be an issue with addons
- NPC not appearing in Orsinium quest, A Question of Succession. This may be a rare bug on live, since I was able to just log off and back in to reset the NPC.
That's a pretty big list, and the vast majority of the bugs in the list are directly AwA related, so I agree that AwA is probably getting released in some form. How many of the bugs get fixed, and which ones are working as intended, if any, will determine to a large degree how awful this update is when it makes it to live.
I also thought Gina's vague wording was kind of odd, like she's under some embargo from giving a definitive answer on which bugs are being worked on. Blink twice if you are being held hostage, Gina!
I feel really bad for her and Kevin, having to read through so many repeat complaints without being able to put them to rest.
I wonder which one they will fix...
So far, none of them. Still the same mess they rolled out almost three weeks ago.
Lots of people seem to be dissatisfied with the account wide achievements, but overall this is a massive QoL feature that will benefit not only the great majority of people playing the game but will also remove a barrier some people have in playing different characters.
It benefits some of the community. It ruins it for the rest of us.
Pushing this change forward for the former, without any regard for the latter, will absolutely backfire.
nightstrike wrote: »Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »nightstrike wrote: »Please do not roll this out as currently designed. Send it back to the drawing board and account for the fact that there are people, myself included, who do not want this feature at all.
Perhaps try monetizing it like with skill points. Charge crowns to insta-get the achievements.
Now nobody will want it
What about the reverse pay to keep it character bound? Less fun, yeah thats what i taught
Paying for an existing feature we already have doesn't make much sense. Paying for a new feature is a well worn path. And it matches nicely with how skills for crowns are already implemented.
In any case, please don't roll this out until it's in a state that doesn't cause so much upheaval.
It’s not just quests and map completion though is it… it’s the RPG stuff like thief / dark brotherhood achievements.. hit lists, murder sprees, various DLC museum collection / exploration pieces, havocrels, portals… fishing… the NPCs you interact with, the different things they say depending on what your character has done.. the immersion. The original exploration achievements that kept us all starting new characters, to do it over again x years later.
This is content we have paid for you are removing!
Stop trying to convert this (soon to be ex) beautiful RPG into some dumb console trophy rush to the end game fest!
I really just don't get it!!
Some pointless ZOS admin will probably edit this… perhaps instead you could try reading the feedback instead and maybe respond? You know like you have promised?
So angry
There is a chance here to rework the AwA to suit (nearly) all players, rather than hamfistedly force down a simple, rough and divisive solution on all.
Either way, bad for Zathras!
You do realize your definition of QoL and the way you play the game aren't the "correct" ones, right? Just because you don't see something as a QoL change doesn't make it so, and just because you like to manually replay content doesn't make it the only way to enjoy the game. You act like people who want this are maliciously out to get you and destroy how you play without giving any thought to how others might enjoy the game. Especially given how most people don't actually want this in its current form and would prefer it be delayed until a system that works better for everyone can be implemented instead.SilverBride wrote: »Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »ArchangelIsraphel wrote: »For new and old posters to the thread who are excited about AWA, but are upset and think we are trying to prevent it's implementation...
I am trying to prevent its implementation because it will completely destroy the way I have enjoyed playing this game for many years. I love this game and sincerely hope they pull this mess until they can find a much less disruptive way to implement it.
And that why some are againt you, sure you have your reason but so does people who want it to go trough. You actively try to stop the Qol they have been asking for years
All AWA does for a player is help them skip actually playing the game. That's not quality of life and it has very detrimental effects for those of us who enjoy playing each character as individuals.
There is a chance here to rework the AwA to suit (nearly) all players, rather than hamfistedly force down a simple, rough and divisive solution on all.
Either way, bad for Zathras!
The thing that would be good for Zathras, is to fix the communication problem.
After @ZOS_GinaBruno wrote this on the Forums:
"We've had some initial conversations amongst our team to discuss ways to improve communication across the board and some different things we could try...rest assured we are actively looking at ways to improve."
^ That is very recent history. 3 weeks ago. So..why has the ball dropped again, on such an important issue? As @ZOS_Kevin called it, "a hot button issue", as this thread (as of writing this) has 1.5K replies and 37.3K views.
Just a quick comment. People, or at least a couple people, are waiting around for the holy Q&A to come down from the mountain. What ZOS should be doing is posting questions and answers in here, seeing if people think that the question has been answered, tune answer as necessary. Then, after PTS and before release, collect all the questions and updated answers and publish them as a single document. More work, and we would be at 37k replies, but I think better results.
More work, and we would be at 37k replies, but I think better results.