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• [COMPLETE] PC/Mac: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 15, 4:00AM EDT (8:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
· Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for patch maintenance – September 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)
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The PTS is now offline for the patch 11.2.0 maintenance and is currently unavailable.
A vast majority of players are asking to remove cast times
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sweatapodimas✭✭✭After all the complaints about how cast times have been a horrible change to the game when will ZOS revert ultimate cast times? Soul siphon is literally unusable for what it was meant to be. Incap gets dodged all the time or the server doesn't allow it to be casted. All has been f***d for the past three months.
Agreed, Deathstroke hardly hits unless the other person is in battle with others. Makes the point of solo play useless for magblades especially."Jazz isn't dead, it just smells funny" - Frank Zappa0 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
This is not wisdom because it is not possible to circumvent the GCD like that. This argument is tinfoil hat nonsense that displays a profound lack of understanding of game mechanics. Cast times are indefensible dead weight that serve only to make combat unresponsive and inconsistent. If you somehow enjoy this, you're in luck, because there's still plenty of lag that isn't artificially simulated by the worst combat change in this game's entire history.
Nah Glivoth enjoys cast times because he plays sorc which isn't affected.
Eventhough, if cast times are OK, why sorcs don't use something like, inevitable detonation insetad of rune? Or Crystal Blast instead of frags?Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique1 -
Expert✭✭✭✭This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants1 -
Gilvoth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants
we have already proven several times in this thread that only a small group wants the cast times removed.
not the vast majority, as is being claimed.
in addition to that, what happens in the development team is not based on a democracy point of view, yes they use and do things based on our feedback and popular opinion, but it is based on the desires and creation development ideas of the develop team, and they do a Great Job at making a Great game here in eso. if they follow the direction of the few it will ruin the game for the rest of us. they removed the cast times for a excellent reason and i hope it stays that way.Edited by Gilvoth on February 5, 2020 11:50PM0 -
Artorias24✭✭✭✭✭
✭This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants
we have already proven several times in this thread that only a small group wants the cast times removed.
not the vast majority, as is being claimed.
in addition to that, what happens in the development team is not based on a democracy point of view, yes they use and do things based on our feedback and popular opinion, but it is based on the desires and creation development ideas of the develop team, and they do a Great Job at making a Great game here in eso. if they follow the direction of the few it will ruin the game for the rest of us. they removed the cast times for a excellent reason and i hope it stays that way.
I dont see ANY proof that its only a smal Group that are against those cast times.
Its a fact that 95% of all the Feedback from multiple sources are indeed negative about this change. Where are all the other that like cast times? I dont see them.8 -
There always seems to be a back and forth between community, class reps, and the devs, with certain expectations. Yet results are often nil or WAY later down the road...and even then aren't quite what was requested. Regardless of the rep program it seems there is a communication breakdown. It would be helpful maybe if they provided a livestream during one of their sessions. How they respond to player feedback. How they react to PTS testing. And finally how they outsource the work. We would at least then get a realtime observation of how large their group is, how they operate and their direction each update. Hearing it during a souped up CON event isn't nearly the same as an unpolished daily drag into the office after 3 cups of coffee and rolling their sleeves up to work. We are afterall a type of investor given how much time and money we all put into this game for years so being privy to an example of their daily pace might aleviate unrealistic expectations and perhaps even foster a sense of gratitude for what they accomplish given how small their group is (maybe).0 -
Kadoin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
This is not wisdom because it is not possible to circumvent the GCD like that. This argument is tinfoil hat nonsense that displays a profound lack of understanding of game mechanics. Cast times are indefensible dead weight that serve only to make combat unresponsive and inconsistent. If you somehow enjoy this, you're in luck, because there's still plenty of lag that isn't artificially simulated by the worst combat change in this game's entire history.
Nah Glivoth enjoys cast times because he plays sorc which isn't affected.
Eventhough, if cast times are OK, why sorcs don't use something like, inevitable detonation insetad of rune? Or Crystal Blast instead of frags?
My sorc uses blast to blast a group of people that don't know no better...well, and others when a certain tactic works
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Koensol✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Please tell me you're kidding? You don't realize being unable to barswap/dodgeroll/blockcancel ultimates makes them incredibly clunky to use? The length of the cast time aside, it happens a ton where you use your ult then want to quickly barswap (because this game is fast paced) and in the proces cancel your ult and you die. Not to mention you are spouting misinformation. You cannot cast 2 skills in 1 second. Only with delayed damage abilities like POTL and Shalks is it possible to hit 2 at same time. Otherwise you have a 1 sec gcd preventing the casting of more than one skill per second."cast times" on ultimate are right.. You shouldnt be able to fire 2skills + 2 light attacks and ultimate in one second.. I dont get what bothers you on "cast times".. Its only about 400ms?
[Snip]
[Edited for rude comment]Edited by ZOS_Volpe on February 12, 2020 9:24PM7 -
SenpaiNFT✭✭✭✭+1 for removal of cast times. Never should be been implemented in the first place, absolutely one of the worst things ZOS has ever done.10
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holden_caulfield✭✭✭Everyone has the right to propose a change to the game. Just he/she must understand that has no data other than the experience of his little network of players.
That said these forums are a constant fight in which everybody try to outsmart other players 'pro domo sua'.
But this time I have to say I agree with the OP.
As a warden healer in BG casting my little Forrest takes forever. In such scenario (aoe heals in a very fluid dynamic) is almost useless. By the time my ulti fires my teammates are elsewhere (is it a word?)Edited by holden_caulfield on February 7, 2020 10:53AM0 -
holden_caulfield✭✭✭And I want to add that reactive gameplay works only if everybody is a low pinger.
I can try to min max my heals in BG but if I dont choose a very very defensive spec (having always a ping over 150) by the time I react I am ashesEdited by holden_caulfield on February 7, 2020 1:49PM0 -
FrankonPC✭✭✭✭✭This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants
we have already proven several times in this thread that only a small group wants the cast times removed.
not the vast majority, as is being claimed.
in addition to that, what happens in the development team is not based on a democracy point of view, yes they use and do things based on our feedback and popular opinion, but it is based on the desires and creation development ideas of the develop team, and they do a Great Job at making a Great game here in eso. if they follow the direction of the few it will ruin the game for the rest of us. they removed the cast times for a excellent reason and i hope it stays that way.
You haven't though. Every survey, poll, post etc has had an overwhelming number of people against cast times.
Zos JUST did a quick revert for the community due to it's nerf on Iceheart...WHICH IS GREAT. Now do the exact same thing for cast times on ultimates.4 -
Anhedonie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Cast times don't belong in fast paced games. Might as well make every skill have a cast time.Profanity filter is a crime against the freedom of speech. Also gags.4 -
Mayrael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants
we have already proven several times in this thread that only a small group wants the cast times removed.
not the vast majority, as is being claimed.
in addition to that, what happens in the development team is not based on a democracy point of view, yes they use and do things based on our feedback and popular opinion, but it is based on the desires and creation development ideas of the develop team, and they do a Great Job at making a Great game here in eso. if they follow the direction of the few it will ruin the game for the rest of us. they removed the cast times for a excellent reason and i hope it stays that way.
Lol... You have proven nothing, you just throw some statements without any background. Show me at least one big poll where people was "pro cast times". Cast times are terrible, its the worst of many possible solutions to the "problem" it should have solve. Cast time are unfair, and need to be removed.
I would preffer to have 0,5s delay of damage than 0,3 cast time. @ZOS_RobGarrett @ZOS_BrianWheeler, please listen to your gang
Say no to Toxic Casuals!
I am doing my best, but I am not a native speaker, sorry.
"Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver&Gold as a "you think you do but you don't"-tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game." - @AlexanderDeLarge3 -
eso_lags✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Every update they keep trying to hammer the nails deeper and deeper into the coffin of solo/small scale pvp. And every update players keep pushing on and finding ways to keep playing the way that we love. But one day its not going to be enough, one day they are truly going to get what they want and kill small scale. While I haven't been on the PTS yet, if its as bad as people are saying then this might be it.
Its death by a thousand cuts. Nerfs to other things that always end up hurting small scale players either as a whole, or on a certain class. Nerfs to certain potions, such as immovs. Blanket nerfs to speed. Cast times on ultimates, to name a few. There are so many over the years that I could list. Plus the overall decline of performance over the last 3+ years, thats a massive problem for small scale. But this might be the worst.
Making combat more clunky will hurt small scale/solo the most, but it will 1000% hurt this game over all. No one wants to have slow clunky fights. When anyone has ever asked me why I still play this game, as a solo pvp player, I answer because the combat is the best out of any mmo I've ever played, and theres nothing else like it. I really hope they dont destroy the best thing this game has, but i guess ill have to hop on the PTS and see for myself. Hopefully its not as bad as people are saying.3 -
darthgummibear_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »John_Falstaff wrote: »And I'm not even mentioning that it harms such thing as swap-cancelling that used to greatly add to fluidity of rotations.
I've actually had a lot of broken rotations since this change because of swapping too fast and the ultimate never going off.
The very definition of l2p right there....
Considering this wasn't an issue before they added cast times...0 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Just wonder for how many patches we should be "enjoying" this feature before zos actually admit that it was a bad decision which didn't accomplished anything but made things clunkier.4 -
Anhedonie✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭colossalvoids wrote: »Just wonder for how many patches we should be "enjoying" this feature before zos actually admit that it was a bad decision which didn't accomplished anything but made things clunkier.
I mean templar's Healing Ritual had cast time for what, 3 years or so? I wouldn't expect any changes any time soon.Profanity filter is a crime against the freedom of speech. Also gags.0 -
ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »John_Falstaff wrote: »And I'm not even mentioning that it harms such thing as swap-cancelling that used to greatly add to fluidity of rotations.
I've actually had a lot of broken rotations since this change because of swapping too fast and the ultimate never going off.
The very definition of l2p right there....
Considering this wasn't an issue before they added cast times...
But it is now and you need to "l2p" with the new change. Btw, not even that new. It's been 3 months, get over it. Adapt, overcome. L2p. Not that hard... Only one ultimate I use didn't get a cast time applied to it, and I still use all the same ultimates today to about the same degree of effectiveness. Just adapt and move on. This is getting old and annoying already.2 -
Qbiken✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »John_Falstaff wrote: »And I'm not even mentioning that it harms such thing as swap-cancelling that used to greatly add to fluidity of rotations.
I've actually had a lot of broken rotations since this change because of swapping too fast and the ultimate never going off.
The very definition of l2p right there....
Considering this wasn't an issue before they added cast times...
But it is now and you need to "l2p" with the new change. Btw, not even that new. It's been 3 months, get over it. Adapt, overcome. L2p. Not that hard... Only one ultimate I use didn't get a cast time applied to it, and I still use all the same ultimates today to about the same degree of effectiveness. Just adapt and move on. This is getting old and annoying already.
Players had 6 years to adapt to certain skills and ultimates not having cast times, but apparently 6 years weren´t enough. I doubt most players haven´t adapted to the changes, but why does that mean you can´t continue to show your dislike for such horrible changes? That´s pretty much what the forums are for, giving feedback, regardless of it being positive or negative.
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ZonasArch✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »John_Falstaff wrote: »And I'm not even mentioning that it harms such thing as swap-cancelling that used to greatly add to fluidity of rotations.
I've actually had a lot of broken rotations since this change because of swapping too fast and the ultimate never going off.
The very definition of l2p right there....
Considering this wasn't an issue before they added cast times...
But it is now and you need to "l2p" with the new change. Btw, not even that new. It's been 3 months, get over it. Adapt, overcome. L2p. Not that hard... Only one ultimate I use didn't get a cast time applied to it, and I still use all the same ultimates today to about the same degree of effectiveness. Just adapt and move on. This is getting old and annoying already.
Players had 6 years to adapt to certain skills and ultimates not having cast times, but apparently 6 years weren´t enough. I doubt most players haven´t adapted to the changes, but why does that mean you can´t continue to show your dislike for such horrible changes? That´s pretty much what the forums are for, giving feedback, regardless of it being positive or negative.
And by all means, keep giving feedback, I do it too, but to say it ruined game play, or the ultimates, or your builds...? Hyperbolic talking is BS talking, wouldn't you agree?
And if you do, go back to reading the title of the post... "Vast majority", without actual statistical proof so far, is hyperbolic talk. Doesn't help the case...
The only way this will help is if, by accident, this is factually correct. The devs know the numbers and if people are that dissatisfied, and avoiding those ultimates, they'll roll back.
I can promise you one thing though... Whatever number of people you see complaining about any issue, whether from your average try hard guilds, from the forums, from Reddit... Those numbers are a true joke compared to the amount of people actually playing the game.
Pulling a poll with hundreds or even a few thousands on the forums is still irrelevant because the casual player doesn't engage like we do. People don't even know PTS exist, and don't ever read patch notes. They don't notice these changes. And that's the people spending the most money on the game by means of simply being the larger group. The people that care about having fun, and not about min/max or what have you.
ZOS doesn't hide, never did, their casual friendly approach. They know their audience better than we can ever hope for, and they will adjust if necessary. They won't lose money over being thick skulled about combat changes. They have shown us before.Edited by ZonasArch on February 10, 2020 9:57AM4 -
John_Falstaff✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@ZonasArch , that's such a huge fallacy. There's no point about appealing to majority of players in general, because majority is busy furnishing their houses or spamming snipe in normal dungeons. This forum collected people who, a) play on decent level, b) cares enough about the game not to swallow whatever they're being fed. Well, apparently with some exceptions who came around to exercise "don't rock the boat" stance. So if it annoys you to hear how people stand against the trend of lowering the quality of the game - well, use your own advice and move on, nobody forces you to read this topic.6 -
holden_caulfield✭✭✭darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »darthgummibear_ESO wrote: »John_Falstaff wrote: »And I'm not even mentioning that it harms such thing as swap-cancelling that used to greatly add to fluidity of rotations.
I've actually had a lot of broken rotations since this change because of swapping too fast and the ultimate never going off.
The very definition of l2p right there....
Considering this wasn't an issue before they added cast times...
But it is now and you need to "l2p" with the new change. Btw, not even that new. It's been 3 months, get over it. Adapt, overcome. L2p. Not that hard... Only one ultimate I use didn't get a cast time applied to it, and I still use all the same ultimates today to about the same degree of effectiveness. Just adapt and move on. This is getting old and annoying already.
Players had 6 years to adapt to certain skills and ultimates not having cast times, but apparently 6 years weren´t enough. I doubt most players haven´t adapted to the changes, but why does that mean you can´t continue to show your dislike for such horrible changes? That´s pretty much what the forums are for, giving feedback, regardless of it being positive or negative.
And by all means, keep giving feedback, I do it too, but to say it ruined game play, or the ultimates, or your builds...? Hyperbolic talking is BS talking, wouldn't you agree?
And if you do, go back to reading the title of the post... "Vast majority", without actual statistical proof so far, is hyperbolic talk. Doesn't help the case...
The only way this will help is if, by accident, this is factually correct. The devs know the numbers and if people are that dissatisfied, and avoiding those ultimates, tkhey'll roll back.
I can promise you one thing though... Whatever number of people you see complaining about any issue, whether from your average try hard guilds, from the forums, from Reddit... Those numbers are a true joke compared to the amount of people actually playing the game.
Pulling a poll with hundreds or even a few thousands on the forums is still irrelevant because the casual player doesn't engage like we do. People don't even know PTS exist, and don't ever read patch notes. They don't notice these changes. And that's the people spending the most money on the game by means of simply being the larger group. The people that care about having fun, and not about min/max or what have you.
ZOS doesn't hide, never did, their casual friendly approach. They know their audience better than we can ever hope for, and they will adjust if necessary. They won't lose money over being thick skulled about combat changes. They have shown us before.
As a "sometime High pinger" cast times make me curse some time.
But as I had already stated ad nauseam we are a subgroup of a subgroup of a subgroup.
And every thinking being here should know that only One entity knows everything about this game.
And yes it is ZOS.
Why is it so hard to accept the fact that you or me have an opinion that in the Grand scheme of all things ESO means what? 1/1000000 or less of the whole ecosystem
Your BG rating or trial score mean nothing. DEAL WITH IT
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Mettaricana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭So did they get rid of cast times or keep them the end of this thread sounds like yes but i cant find anything in notes...?0 -
Expert✭✭✭✭This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants
we have already proven several times in this thread that only a small group wants the cast times removed.
not the vast majority, as is being claimed.
in addition to that, what happens in the development team is not based on a democracy point of view, yes they use and do things based on our feedback and popular opinion, but it is based on the desires and creation development ideas of the develop team, and they do a Great Job at making a Great game here in eso. if they follow the direction of the few it will ruin the game for the rest of us. they removed the cast times for a excellent reason and i hope it stays that way.
If what you're saying is true, why is the 3 of the polls for Cast times been in favor by a large margin for removing cast times?
We're talking like... 80% want it removed, and 20% dont. There's no middle ground, I don't even see what you're getting at. I'm sure there's significantly more proof against you than you saying we're the "small group" based on the polls and popularity of MULTIPLE threads. There's a reason this thread is still alive, and it's just too unfortunate ZOS can't be open to comment on this matter.2 -
Parasaurolophus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The opinion of the "vast majority of people" is enough for me because of which I can no longer be at least a bit effective in PvP on my stam nb. Somewhere the "overwhelming majority" was when the werewolves in the torug destroyed the BG for several months. Where is most now where the wardens can kill entire packs in one combo? Where is the majority when the dragon knights abuse the broken crowd control via Dragon Leap now? Where? Why didn’t I see on the forum a single topic related to this? The reason why ZoS introduced the cast time for ults is very simple - they are too strong and should remain so, but this does not mean that they should leave a chance to your opponent.
Perhaps the casting time can be reduced fo 300-400 ms, yes ... But not the last thing to remove.Edited by Parasaurolophus on February 11, 2020 2:20PMPC/EU1 -
x48rph✭✭✭✭✭
✭Artorias24 wrote: »This community speaks loud and clear, and zos won't take notice because.... They don't do what the community wants
we have already proven several times in this thread that only a small group wants the cast times removed.
not the vast majority, as is being claimed.
in addition to that, what happens in the development team is not based on a democracy point of view, yes they use and do things based on our feedback and popular opinion, but it is based on the desires and creation development ideas of the develop team, and they do a Great Job at making a Great game here in eso. if they follow the direction of the few it will ruin the game for the rest of us. they removed the cast times for a excellent reason and i hope it stays that way.
I dont see ANY proof that its only a smal Group that are against those cast times.
Its a fact that 95% of all the Feedback from multiple sources are indeed negative about this change. Where are all the other that like cast times? I dont see them.
I'm fine with the cast times0 -
x48rph✭✭✭✭✭
✭Oh and by the way, as with most things it's a proven fact that people are much more likely to take the time to chime in or otherwise be more vocal on something when they don't like it then people are when they do. Not saying there are indeed more people who like it than don't, just saying that basing it off of people speaking up about it isn't an accurate measurement.0 -
ElvenVeil✭✭✭@ZonasArch So your argument is that people on the forum is in no way representative of the people playing the game ? I personally don't see anything suggesting that it is a certain type of player that comes to forum, especially not considering how much everyone disagrees here in general. So ofc the poll matters as probably a good sample of what people who care about the game, actually thinks.
secondly, saying that the vast majority don't mind cast times because casuals don't care seems a bit like a hollow argument to me. Would it be better to say that the vast majority who invest time beyond ' super casual ' player dislikes cast times? And if we go by the idea that the very casuals don't care, then I assume they also don't mind if cast times were gone - in which case they hardly work as a group speaking against cast times.Edited by ElvenVeil on February 11, 2020 2:35PM3 -
FrankonPC✭✭✭✭✭"Vast majority", without actual statistical proof so far, is hyperbolic talk. Doesn't help the case...
I mean, I'm not sure how many times people in this thread have to keep posting proof for you, but here we go:
Obviously 1 thousand people surveyed isn't a "vast majority", but when you start taking into account consistent unpopularity of cast times in every survey posted on youtube, the forums etc... you can come to the conclusion with a pretty high confidence that cast times are, in fact, overwhelmingly unpopular.
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