Nightblade Still Over Performing

Toc de Malsvi · March 2019

@John_Falstaff
First off that parse from that video is an outlier and if you looked at the crit you would see that. They had 100% critical strikes for 4 different skills in the parse: SubAssault, Poison Injection, Guardians Savagery and Guardians Swipe. Despite a 78% crit rating.

Of the 12 damaging abilities shown in the parse 6 were below their crit rating by an average of 5.8%. While 5 were above at an average of 18.2% above their crit rating. Taking out Relequin because it cannot crit they have ~93% of their total damage which can crit. They effectively parsed with 90% crit on the top 12 damage sources which accounted for 85% of the remaining 93% without relequin, this is despite having only 78% crit rating, which places that as an outlier.

That isn't to say Bow/Bow couldn't get respectable numbers in trial groups. They could only it largely wasn't being attempted until someone wanted to test Shadow Silk and put up a ridiculous parse. Without looking at what a NB would do with Bow/Bow in a similar setup the point is moot.

As far as the DK v NB comparison, you have no room to talk with such a poor comparison. You considered one attack with mitigation versus 5 seconds of healing. The problem is more than one attack can come in one second, much less five seconds, while you cannot give yourself another vigor for those same five seconds. You also by only looking at the mitigation completely negated and ignored the offensive benefit of mitigation.

Lets consider a DK vs NB, give the DK Vigor, Spiked Armor(either morph), and some form of Major Fracture(Noxious or Puncture). This gives the DK Major Fracture, Major Ward Resolve, Heal over time for 5 seconds, and damage source.

The NB by comparison only needs Surprise attack and Vigor to have the same buffs, with a much higher damage source. That means the POOR NB has an extra slot to try and make up for the DK's 12% healing boost from Spiked Armor. The NB doesn't need to stay engaged for Major Resolve because they can Cloak to get both Major Resolve and completely disappear for 100% mitigation to a variety of attacks, or Major Resolve a second heal and Minor Protection. Those are only two possible options for the POOR NB to make up the gap of 12% healing.

JobooAGS · March 2019

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

@John_Falstaff
First off that parse from that video is an outlier and if you looked at the crit you would see that. They had 100% critical strikes for 4 different skills in the parse: SubAssault, Poison Injection, Guardians Savagery and Guardians Swipe. Despite a 78% crit rating.

Of the 12 damaging abilities shown in the parse 6 were below their crit rating by an average of 5.8%. While 5 were above at an average of 18.2% above their crit rating. Taking out Relequin because it cannot crit they have ~93% of their total damage which can crit. They effectively parsed with 90% crit on the top 12 damage sources which accounted for 85% of the remaining 93% without relequin, this is despite having only 78% crit rating, which places that as an outlier.

That isn't to say Bow/Bow couldn't get respectable numbers in trial groups. They could only it largely wasn't being attempted until someone wanted to test Shadow Silk and put up a ridiculous parse. Without looking at what a NB would do with Bow/Bow in a similar setup the point is moot.

As far as the DK v NB comparison, you have no room to talk with such a poor comparison. You considered one attack with mitigation versus 5 seconds of healing. The problem is more than one attack can come in one second, much less five seconds, while you cannot give yourself another vigor for those same five seconds. You also by only looking at the mitigation completely negated and ignored the offensive benefit of mitigation.

Lets consider a DK vs NB, give the DK Vigor, Spiked Armor(either morph), and some form of Major Fracture(Noxious or Puncture). This gives the DK Major Fracture, Major Ward Resolve, Heal over time for 5 seconds, and damage source.

The NB by comparison only needs Surprise attack and Vigor to have the same buffs, with a much higher damage source. That means the POOR NB has an extra slot to try and make up for the DK's 12% healing boost from Spiked Armor. The NB doesn't need to stay engaged for Major Resolve because they can Cloak to get both Major Resolve and completely disappear for 100% mitigation to a variety of attacks, or Major Resolve a second heal and Minor Protection. Those are only two possible options for the POOR NB to make up the gap of 12% healing.

This was a parse without war machine/master archeitect as well, so the 91k would overall still be more than feasible

Kidgangster101 · March 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi , that was an example for those who still believe only stamblade can hit 75-80k raid-buffed.

Oh, and the latest in is 91.1k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4gYR-Af_z4

Remove damage from Trapping Webs synergy, and it's still 77.6k, and that's a bow/bow build. And if that's not enough to society of flat earth in this thread...

Melee stamden, 76k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tM7hv7uWeo

Still not enough? Stamplar, 73.2k, and that's on console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaRZvktxuG4

I'm not sure what the discussion is even about. After Murkmire people did their evaluations, stamdens and stamplars perform on par with stamblade.

I'm also not sure what kind of point people make of Major Resolve / Ward attached to Surprise Attack. Want to make a mental experiment? Take DK for example. Let's forget that SA needs a target for protection to be active (good luck finding a target to activate those buffs, I suppose, when you're spammed with Clench, Haunting Curse and whatnot). Actually, let's ignore that Hardened Armor even gives you those buffs; suppose NB has Resolve / Ward and DK doesn't. Now imagine that you're sitting at 10k health and you're hit for 5k damage before mitigation, then hit Vigor for 5k healing. Now stamblade with more mitigation ends up with 10k - (5k - 8% resolve / ward) + 5k = 10.4k health. DK sits at 10k - 5k + (5k + 12% Burning Heart passive) = 10.6k health. And that's assuming that DK isn't getting Resolve / Ward from hardened armor - which they do. As long as you have incoming healing (and you do, right?), 12% of it outweighs 8% mitigation, and surprise, DK has both, and without actually needing to do damage to activate them.

Basically, this thread is a parade of rusty superstitions. And people spend their time on a witch hunt instead of asking ZOS to do something with the sorry state of stamsorcs and stamDKs.

And @Iskiab , I think even combat log won't help. ^^ Sometimes people just can't let go of outdated notions.

Lol you guys are arguing over parse damage you have to understand people want NB nerfed because what they do in pvp if.

Surprise attack gets guaranteed crit because of stealth, guaranteed stun because of stealth, the highest damage instant spamable in the game according to tooltips, you gain major resolve/ward for doing 7-12k damage to an enemy. What other class can do all that with 1 move? You want another guaranteed crit cloak and press it again then cloak and hit your finisher. Yep you can do all that easy against a human player. If your gaink failed btw you can cloak rally vigor and try again back at full health maybe this time you can stealth and hit them with a ultimate out of stealth that hits for insane damage and adds defile so they can't heal and you can murder them that way lol.

The dummy you parse on won't tell you it's cheap in pvp because it has 3-6million health where as the normal pvper has 18-25k hp........ Stop comparing DPS numbers from pve content to pvp. There is more to pvp that is needed that just raw damage so again nightblades should lose a bit up front buffs and gain more survivability for pvp purposes.

Toc de Malsvi · March 2019

Its more significant than I even pointed out. That 91k parse had 5 different skills with average hits for over 30k damage. These large hits benefit the most from higher than normal critical hits as they add more damage with each critical hit.

Average hit by ability:
Lethal Arrow 53k
SubAssault 46k
Guardians Savagery 55k
Crushing Swipe 39k
Black Widow 33k

Critical hits by ability:
Lethal Arrow 76%
SubAssault 100%
Guardians Savagery 100%
Crushing Swipe 100%
Black Widow 67%

Iskiab · March 2019

You’re right. A NB can use an ultimate, then hit an ability, then cloak, then hit another ability, then cloak, then hit another ability. Then if it doesn’t work, they can cloak spam to run away.

I’m sure it works great on someone who’s out of stamina or afk, or people without immovability pots, where the NB has a high magicka pool and regen so they can do all this, and crazy high stamina and weapon damage so they have good damage too.

Usually you can tell who creates whine threads because it’s their counter:
- snares are melee
- Immobilizations are werewolves
- Snipes are wardens and ball groups who just spam aoe damage and healing abilities so can’t handle ST burst

Who fears stamblades? Low CP players so they take lots of damage or wardens? This one I’m not sure about. Is it a CP pvp thing? I NB heal in non-CP so don’t have an issue with them.

John_Falstaff · March 2019

@Kidgangster101 , try telling it to those who say NB is overperforming in PvE and claim NBs are far ahead of all other classes, maybe?

As for other arguments, I can just shrug. I hear that song all the time about all classes. "A-a-a-ah, shields are OP!" "A-a-a-ah, nerf wings!" If you look into how many times NB can cast cloak, how easy it is to pull out of clock and how easy it is to simply evade incap, bow proc and/or ambush (the most telegraphed stuff in the game, especially after recent nerfs), then it becomes clear that it's on you. Don't be a sitting duck. I've no issues with any of that on my DK. If anything, I have more troubles from AoE roots, snares and bleeds.

@Toc de Malsvi , well, if talk's about the published parses, and in the context of discussion, the other side of the comparison isn't much difficult - say, Hodor publishes 80k stamblade parse on Zhaj'hassa, and then it turns out that Killer's Blade had 92% crit rate, SA 94% and so on. Yes, 91k is inflated by lucky crits, but so are many other parses.

olsborg · March 2019

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

Lucky28 · March 2019

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi , that was an example for those who still believe only stamblade can hit 75-80k raid-buffed.

Oh, and the latest in is 91.1k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4gYR-Af_z4

Remove damage from Trapping Webs synergy, and it's still 77.6k, and that's a bow/bow build. And if that's not enough to society of flat earth in this thread...

Melee stamden, 76k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tM7hv7uWeo

Still not enough? Stamplar, 73.2k, and that's on console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaRZvktxuG4

I'm not sure what the discussion is even about. After Murkmire people did their evaluations, stamdens and stamplars perform on par with stamblade.

I'm also not sure what kind of point people make of Major Resolve / Ward attached to Surprise Attack. Want to make a mental experiment? Take DK for example. Let's forget that SA needs a target for protection to be active (good luck finding a target to activate those buffs, I suppose, when you're spammed with Clench, Haunting Curse and whatnot). Actually, let's ignore that Hardened Armor even gives you those buffs; suppose NB has Resolve / Ward and DK doesn't. Now imagine that you're sitting at 10k health and you're hit for 5k damage before mitigation, then hit Vigor for 5k healing. Now stamblade with more mitigation ends up with 10k - (5k - 8% resolve / ward) + 5k = 10.4k health. DK sits at 10k - 5k + (5k + 12% Burning Heart passive) = 10.6k health. And that's assuming that DK isn't getting Resolve / Ward from hardened armor - which they do. As long as you have incoming healing (and you do, right?), 12% of it outweighs 8% mitigation, and surprise, DK has both, and without actually needing to do damage to activate them.

Basically, this thread is a parade of rusty superstitions. And people spend their time on a witch hunt instead of asking ZOS to do something with the sorry state of stamsorcs and stamDKs.

And @Iskiab , I think even combat log won't help. ^^ Sometimes people just can't let go of outdated notions.

Lol you guys are arguing over parse damage you have to understand people want NB nerfed because what they do in pvp if.

Surprise attack gets guaranteed crit because of stealth, guaranteed stun because of stealth, the highest damage instant spamable in the game according to tooltips, you gain major resolve/ward for doing 7-12k damage to an enemy. What other class can do all that with 1 move? You want another guaranteed crit cloak and press it again then cloak and hit your finisher. Yep you can do all that easy against a human player. If your gaink failed btw you can cloak rally vigor and try again back at full health maybe this time you can stealth and hit them with a ultimate out of stealth that hits for insane damage and adds defile so they can't heal and you can murder them that way lol.

The dummy you parse on won't tell you it's cheap in pvp because it has 3-6million health where as the normal pvper has 18-25k hp........ Stop comparing DPS numbers from pve content to pvp. There is more to pvp that is needed that just raw damage so again nightblades should lose a bit up front buffs and gain more survivability for pvp purposes.

Oww so they kill you in PvP. that's so terrible, all that hard work you just lost.... oh wait, you didn't lose anything. res up and try again.

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

No, it's Cloak with Snare immunity that's really good not just cloak itself. The problem with wanting cloak nerfed is that only stamNB has access to that form of snare immunity magblade does not magblade also doesn't have *** all for self heals anymore so magblade sincerely needs Cloak, it's pretty much impossible to play magblade without cloak and not be a worthless *** since Murkmire.

TequilaFire · March 2019

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

It is statements like these that try to bias people against something and are not true.
Cloak costs magicka and like other skills is limited by that resource.
You also can't use it in an AoE or if stealth detection is being used so much for anytime anywhere.

Haashhtaag · March 2019

TequilaFire wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

It is statements like these that try to bias people against something and are not true.
Cloak costs magicka and like other skills is limited by that resource.
You also can't use it in an AoE or if stealth detection is being used so much for anytime anywhere.

You don’t hear stamsorcs complaining that they can’t streak away with limited magicka source and cost stacking added.

Imo cloak should work the same way as streak with cost. It should also not allow HoTs since DoTs are suppressed.

Ragnarock41 · March 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi , that was an example for those who still believe only stamblade can hit 75-80k raid-buffed.

Oh, and the latest in is 91.1k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4gYR-Af_z4

Remove damage from Trapping Webs synergy, and it's still 77.6k, and that's a bow/bow build. And if that's not enough to society of flat earth in this thread...

Melee stamden, 76k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tM7hv7uWeo

Still not enough? Stamplar, 73.2k, and that's on console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaRZvktxuG4

I'm not sure what the discussion is even about. After Murkmire people did their evaluations, stamdens and stamplars perform on par with stamblade.

I'm also not sure what kind of point people make of Major Resolve / Ward attached to Surprise Attack. Want to make a mental experiment? Take DK for example. Let's forget that SA needs a target for protection to be active (good luck finding a target to activate those buffs, I suppose, when you're spammed with Clench, Haunting Curse and whatnot). Actually, let's ignore that Hardened Armor even gives you those buffs; suppose NB has Resolve / Ward and DK doesn't. Now imagine that you're sitting at 10k health and you're hit for 5k damage before mitigation, then hit Vigor for 5k healing. Now stamblade with more mitigation ends up with 10k - (5k - 8% resolve / ward) + 5k = 10.4k health. DK sits at 10k - 5k + (5k + 12% Burning Heart passive) = 10.6k health. And that's assuming that DK isn't getting Resolve / Ward from hardened armor - which they do. As long as you have incoming healing (and you do, right?), 12% of it outweighs 8% mitigation, and surprise, DK has both, and without actually needing to do damage to activate them.

Basically, this thread is a parade of rusty superstitions. And people spend their time on a witch hunt instead of asking ZOS to do something with the sorry state of stamsorcs and stamDKs.

And @Iskiab , I think even combat log won't help. ^^ Sometimes people just can't let go of outdated notions.

So you take burning heart into your account but you don't take the extra resistances for damage taken and you don't even take into account that Dk needs to slot spikes or dragon blood to have the %12 healing received.

Basically, your post is a parade of rusty superstitions. In actual combat stamblade in PvE will have major resistances somewhat active and sDK will lack both the healing received and the resistances. I was talking about mainly PvP but just so you know, even in vMA Dks don't really slot spikes. Its a waste of a slot.

John_Falstaff · March 2019

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

...well not counting that fact that it costs 3.78k magicka (on a stamina character, just for the record) for 3 seconds of cloak and you can cast it two or three times at most, and it takes 14 seconds of base recovery to gain enough magicka for the next, but aside from that, of course limitless.

Not that I'm surprised. People forget about same stuff when they suggest to nerf my wings - because, allegedly, I can spam them endlessly on stamDK. (Same applies to any other class people happen to be killed by, because of course it's unfair that they got killed and not the other way around.)

@Ragnarock41 , let's not try to pull a fast one about PvE combat. Everyone and their dog will have those buffs there from your warden main or off healer, and if you need them specifically, you will slot spiked / hardened just like I do - thankfully, unlike stamblades, sDKs have an extra back bar flex spot; on NB you don't have that luxury, you have to slot (and keep up) Leeching Strikes there. I do that where it's due and so can you, and that way I don't have to hit something every several seconds to have 8% mitigation and 12% extra healing while I'm doing mechanics or kiting something.

TequilaFire · March 2019

Haashhtaag wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

It is statements like these that try to bias people against something and are not true.
Cloak costs magicka and like other skills is limited by that resource.
You also can't use it in an AoE or if stealth detection is being used so much for anytime anywhere.

You don’t hear stamsorcs complaining that they can’t streak away with limited magicka source and cost stacking added.

Imo cloak should work the same way as streak with cost. It should also not allow HoTs since DoTs are suppressed.

LMAO, sorcs complain about everything.

Kidgangster101 · March 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Kidgangster101 , try telling it to those who say NB is overperforming in PvE and claim NBs are far ahead of all other classes, maybe?

As for other arguments, I can just shrug. I hear that song all the time about all classes. "A-a-a-ah, shields are OP!" "A-a-a-ah, nerf wings!" If you look into how many times NB can cast cloak, how easy it is to pull out of clock and how easy it is to simply evade incap, bow proc and/or ambush (the most telegraphed stuff in the game, especially after recent nerfs), then it becomes clear that it's on you. Don't be a sitting duck. I've no issues with any of that on my DK. If anything, I have more troubles from AoE roots, snares and bleeds.

@Toc de Malsvi , well, if talk's about the published parses, and in the context of discussion, the other side of the comparison isn't much difficult - say, Hodor publishes 80k stamblade parse on Zhaj'hassa, and then it turns out that Killer's Blade had 92% crit rate, SA 94% and so on. Yes, 91k is inflated by lucky crits, but so are many other parses.

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

Kidgangster101 · March 2019

Lucky28 wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Toc de Malsvi , that was an example for those who still believe only stamblade can hit 75-80k raid-buffed.

Oh, and the latest in is 91.1k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4gYR-Af_z4

Remove damage from Trapping Webs synergy, and it's still 77.6k, and that's a bow/bow build. And if that's not enough to society of flat earth in this thread...

Melee stamden, 76k: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tM7hv7uWeo

Still not enough? Stamplar, 73.2k, and that's on console: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaRZvktxuG4

I'm not sure what the discussion is even about. After Murkmire people did their evaluations, stamdens and stamplars perform on par with stamblade.

I'm also not sure what kind of point people make of Major Resolve / Ward attached to Surprise Attack. Want to make a mental experiment? Take DK for example. Let's forget that SA needs a target for protection to be active (good luck finding a target to activate those buffs, I suppose, when you're spammed with Clench, Haunting Curse and whatnot). Actually, let's ignore that Hardened Armor even gives you those buffs; suppose NB has Resolve / Ward and DK doesn't. Now imagine that you're sitting at 10k health and you're hit for 5k damage before mitigation, then hit Vigor for 5k healing. Now stamblade with more mitigation ends up with 10k - (5k - 8% resolve / ward) + 5k = 10.4k health. DK sits at 10k - 5k + (5k + 12% Burning Heart passive) = 10.6k health. And that's assuming that DK isn't getting Resolve / Ward from hardened armor - which they do. As long as you have incoming healing (and you do, right?), 12% of it outweighs 8% mitigation, and surprise, DK has both, and without actually needing to do damage to activate them.

Basically, this thread is a parade of rusty superstitions. And people spend their time on a witch hunt instead of asking ZOS to do something with the sorry state of stamsorcs and stamDKs.

And @Iskiab , I think even combat log won't help. ^^ Sometimes people just can't let go of outdated notions.

Lol you guys are arguing over parse damage you have to understand people want NB nerfed because what they do in pvp if.

Surprise attack gets guaranteed crit because of stealth, guaranteed stun because of stealth, the highest damage instant spamable in the game according to tooltips, you gain major resolve/ward for doing 7-12k damage to an enemy. What other class can do all that with 1 move? You want another guaranteed crit cloak and press it again then cloak and hit your finisher. Yep you can do all that easy against a human player. If your gaink failed btw you can cloak rally vigor and try again back at full health maybe this time you can stealth and hit them with a ultimate out of stealth that hits for insane damage and adds defile so they can't heal and you can murder them that way lol.

The dummy you parse on won't tell you it's cheap in pvp because it has 3-6million health where as the normal pvper has 18-25k hp........ Stop comparing DPS numbers from pve content to pvp. There is more to pvp that is needed that just raw damage so again nightblades should lose a bit up front buffs and gain more survivability for pvp purposes.

Oww so they kill you in PvP. that's so terrible, all that hard work you just lost.... oh wait, you didn't lose anything. res up and try again.

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

No, it's Cloak with Snare immunity that's really good not just cloak itself. The problem with wanting cloak nerfed is that only stamNB has access to that form of snare immunity magblade does not magblade also doesn't have *** all for self heals anymore so magblade sincerely needs Cloak, it's pretty much impossible to play magblade without cloak and not be a worthless *** since Murkmire.

Lol I play a stamblade from time to time and I'm telling you as a player of all classes that cloak gives a huge unfair advantage from the start there is so much burst damage sometimes even before a person can react to the gank. Yes it is a game and if you die you die, but if that's the case why don't we make it so 3 light attacks is an instant win and you can pat yourself on the back? Lol

Nbs again should lose up front damage and gain survivability. Stamblade has crazy burst but outside cloak not much in their class line. Magblades is missing a lot and they could actually use more survivability as all their good moves auto lose to a dk and lost all their good healing. It's a thing called balance which templar has the best tbh. It can tank, be good at magic and be good at stamina. Every class should follow that path so we have diversity when playing.

There's a reason 50% of the BG population is night blades that doesn't show they are over performing at all? Lol

Haashhtaag · March 2019

TequilaFire wrote: »

Haashhtaag wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

It is statements like these that try to bias people against something and are not true.
Cloak costs magicka and like other skills is limited by that resource.
You also can't use it in an AoE or if stealth detection is being used so much for anytime anywhere.

You don’t hear stamsorcs complaining that they can’t streak away with limited magicka source and cost stacking added.

Imo cloak should work the same way as streak with cost. It should also not allow HoTs since DoTs are suppressed.

LMAO, sorcs complain about everything.

All you pulled from that was sorcs when I specifically mention stamsorcs. Truthfully stamsorcs should have the most to complain about in this game.

John_Falstaff · March 2019

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

I sort of expected that it will end in 'wings are OP' sort of jab. ESO forums. They never disappoint. ^^

And I can same the same about you - you must've fought a lot of potatoes who couldn't avoid your Incap or were too squishy to survive it. And I do have an idea about how many times sNB can use cloak, I do have one too (even though I main sDK), thankyouverymuch. ^^ Worst (or maybe best) stamblades I met were not cloaking sort, they were heavy armor bleed builds.

And Battlegrounds, nightblades, overperforming? Seriously, now? ^^ NBs are bad in BGs just as they're good for stomping potatoes in open world. It's interesting how I keep hearing the same about other classes - regularly, someone comes up to claim that 50% of BGs are: DKs, petsorcs, werewolves, frost wardens...

As for losing upfront burst, it's hard even to comment on that. You can't even move damage anywhere else in NB toolkit, it's all direct damage and every NB in-class skill makes potatoes in this thread scream bloody murder.

Fusharji_Seht · March 2019

Only people who complain about NB are coming from a PVP perspective, as (mostly) no one gives a hoot about 1-2k dps difference in PVE. All classes perform almost exactly the same in terms of numbers on raid-buffed parses.

Really, it's the scrubs in PVP who probably get Vietnam ambush flashbacks every time an NB bursts out of cloak to gank them.

They're not about to remove cloak from NB. It's a core class mechanic. Quit asking. Can't wait for this thread to finally die.

Kidgangster101 · March 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

I sort of expected that it will end in 'wings are OP' sort of jab. ESO forums. They never disappoint. ^^

And I can same the same about you - you must've fought a lot of potatoes who couldn't avoid your Incap or were too squishy to survive it. And I do have an idea about how many times sNB can use cloak, I do have one too (even though I main sDK), thankyouverymuch. ^^ Worst (or maybe best) stamblades I met were not cloaking sort, they were heavy armor bleed builds.

And Battlegrounds, nightblades, overperforming? Seriously, now? ^^ NBs are bad in BGs just as they're good for stomping potatoes in open world. It's interesting how I keep hearing the same about other classes - regularly, someone comes up to claim that 50% of BGs are: DKs, petsorcs, werewolves, frost wardens...

As for losing upfront burst, it's hard even to comment on that. You can't even move damage anywhere else in NB toolkit, it's all direct damage and every NB in-class skill makes potatoes in this thread scream bloody murder.

Lol I never said wings are op just stated that you can take away snipe nice for trying to put words in my mouth there but 😂

As far as a heavy armor bleed NB I have never even heard of one of those so they must not be that popular. Of course you are coming back with the "heavy armor meta thing" where all their sustain is trash.

I like how everyone thinks that if they got a bit more survivability rather than so much up front damage it would be a problem. The people that want NB to stay gankblades are usually the ones that really don't enjoy pvp and just like to merk people without fighting. You can say all you want about good players not dying to night blades but I've seen a lot of people die that are all good at pvp. Say what you want but the fact remains that every class has had it's "core mechanic" for pvp hit to the point they change and adapt except NB. So your telling me if they gave NB more survivability that it wouldn't adapt and work with a new "core mechanic"? Idk I find that hard to believe.

TequilaFire · March 2019

Haashhtaag wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

Haashhtaag wrote: »

TequilaFire wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

I just find cloak a bit too good, since you can use it anytime, anywhere and basicly limitless.

It is statements like these that try to bias people against something and are not true.
Cloak costs magicka and like other skills is limited by that resource.
You also can't use it in an AoE or if stealth detection is being used so much for anytime anywhere.

You don’t hear stamsorcs complaining that they can’t streak away with limited magicka source and cost stacking added.

Imo cloak should work the same way as streak with cost. It should also not allow HoTs since DoTs are suppressed.

LMAO, sorcs complain about everything.

All you pulled from that was sorcs when I specifically mention stamsorcs. Truthfully stamsorcs should have the most to complain about in this game.

Oh , BS my stamsorc with hurricane and dark exchange played brawler like my stamblade kicks butt.

John_Falstaff · March 2019

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

I sort of expected that it will end in 'wings are OP' sort of jab. ESO forums. They never disappoint. ^^

And I can same the same about you - you must've fought a lot of potatoes who couldn't avoid your Incap or were too squishy to survive it. And I do have an idea about how many times sNB can use cloak, I do have one too (even though I main sDK), thankyouverymuch. ^^ Worst (or maybe best) stamblades I met were not cloaking sort, they were heavy armor bleed builds.

And Battlegrounds, nightblades, overperforming? Seriously, now? ^^ NBs are bad in BGs just as they're good for stomping potatoes in open world. It's interesting how I keep hearing the same about other classes - regularly, someone comes up to claim that 50% of BGs are: DKs, petsorcs, werewolves, frost wardens...

As for losing upfront burst, it's hard even to comment on that. You can't even move damage anywhere else in NB toolkit, it's all direct damage and every NB in-class skill makes potatoes in this thread scream bloody murder.

Lol I never said wings are op just stated that you can take away snipe nice for trying to put words in my mouth there but 😂

As far as a heavy armor bleed NB I have never even heard of one of those so they must not be that popular. Of course you are coming back with the "heavy armor meta thing" where all their sustain is trash.

I like how everyone thinks that if they got a bit more survivability rather than so much up front damage it would be a problem. The people that want NB to stay gankblades are usually the ones that really don't enjoy pvp and just like to merk people without fighting. You can say all you want about good players not dying to night blades but I've seen a lot of people die that are all good at pvp. Say what you want but the fact remains that every class has had it's "core mechanic" for pvp hit to the point they change and adapt except NB. So your telling me if they gave NB more survivability that it wouldn't adapt and work with a new "core mechanic"? Idk I find that hard to believe.

Mmhm, so you never heard of them means they don't exist, and 50% of BGs are nightblades... and 53% of statistics is false... You know that anecdotal evidence thing? You're trying to bring it here.

And of course it'd be a problem. But apparently PvP people can't get into their head that there's biggest part of the game they don't actually play, and where damage is actually balanced between three classes right now and they selfishly want to nerf because evil ninja kills them left and right out of stealth and they refuse to get better. You can't move NB's upfront damage away anywhere, because it's all they have, you can look at typical PvE skill bars. Every in-class skill is direct damage, and every single one the nerf-callers from this thread are moaning about. Read above: people want to take away: incap, bow proc, SA... but fact is, it's all that there is. No in-class stamina DoTs (and you can't move damage to out-of-class skills because it won't be NB balancing), and if you'll create new morphs (not going to happen), then you'll just take away class identity and turn NBs into copy of lackluster dragonknights. But people don't actually like to think, so they come up with knee-jerk 'nerf that!' reaction without considering the consequences. No wonder ZOS hardly ever listens to people on forums.

Kidgangster101 · March 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

I sort of expected that it will end in 'wings are OP' sort of jab. ESO forums. They never disappoint. ^^

And I can same the same about you - you must've fought a lot of potatoes who couldn't avoid your Incap or were too squishy to survive it. And I do have an idea about how many times sNB can use cloak, I do have one too (even though I main sDK), thankyouverymuch. ^^ Worst (or maybe best) stamblades I met were not cloaking sort, they were heavy armor bleed builds.

And Battlegrounds, nightblades, overperforming? Seriously, now? ^^ NBs are bad in BGs just as they're good for stomping potatoes in open world. It's interesting how I keep hearing the same about other classes - regularly, someone comes up to claim that 50% of BGs are: DKs, petsorcs, werewolves, frost wardens...

As for losing upfront burst, it's hard even to comment on that. You can't even move damage anywhere else in NB toolkit, it's all direct damage and every NB in-class skill makes potatoes in this thread scream bloody murder.

Lol I never said wings are op just stated that you can take away snipe nice for trying to put words in my mouth there but 😂

As far as a heavy armor bleed NB I have never even heard of one of those so they must not be that popular. Of course you are coming back with the "heavy armor meta thing" where all their sustain is trash.

I like how everyone thinks that if they got a bit more survivability rather than so much up front damage it would be a problem. The people that want NB to stay gankblades are usually the ones that really don't enjoy pvp and just like to merk people without fighting. You can say all you want about good players not dying to night blades but I've seen a lot of people die that are all good at pvp. Say what you want but the fact remains that every class has had it's "core mechanic" for pvp hit to the point they change and adapt except NB. So your telling me if they gave NB more survivability that it wouldn't adapt and work with a new "core mechanic"? Idk I find that hard to believe.

Mmhm, so you never heard of them means they don't exist, and 50% of BGs are nightblades... and 53% of statistics is false... You know that anecdotal evidence thing? You're trying to bring it here.

And of course it'd be a problem. But apparently PvP people can't get into their head that there's biggest part of the game they don't actually play, and where damage is actually balanced between three classes right now and they selfishly want to nerf because evil ninja kills them left and right out of stealth and they refuse to get better. You can't move NB's upfront damage away anywhere, because it's all they have, you can look at typical PvE skill bars. Every in-class skill is direct damage, and every single one the nerf-callers from this thread are moaning about. Read above: people want to take away: incap, bow proc, SA... but fact is, it's all that there is. No in-class stamina DoTs (and you can't move damage to out-of-class skills because it won't be NB balancing), and if you'll create new morphs (not going to happen), then you'll just take away class identity and turn NBs into copy of lackluster dragonknights. But people don't actually like to think, so they come up with knee-jerk 'nerf that!' reaction without considering the consequences. No wonder ZOS hardly ever listens to people on forums.

Lol I play both pve and pvp so I know how both are. You are telling me that nbs can't adapt to a change?

Ihere is many things they could do to make it balanced for both sides. First They could remove major fracture. If you are in a group many people apply major fracture so you don't need it on that skill. Or they could re work the passive that gives them a defense buff Everytime they use it. So in 1 skill you can set enemy off balance out of stealth, major fracture, and raise your defense while doing damage........ What other move in the game is an instant cast that has 3 effects built around using it plus does damage?

All of those buffs it receives at the start of the fight is what makes it powerful in pvp and those same buffs don't do too much on your damage tbh it would only hurt someone trying to solo but then again like I said re work them to gain a new survivability move. You think I'm a NB hater and all I keep saying is restructure the moves so it keeps a purpose but looses some up front benefits but gains them in other ways.

And for the love of God on the magic side make them have a few good moves not reflectable lol. The magic side needs a buff in pvp after their healing side got gutted.

John_Falstaff · March 2019

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

I sort of expected that it will end in 'wings are OP' sort of jab. ESO forums. They never disappoint. ^^

And I can same the same about you - you must've fought a lot of potatoes who couldn't avoid your Incap or were too squishy to survive it. And I do have an idea about how many times sNB can use cloak, I do have one too (even though I main sDK), thankyouverymuch. ^^ Worst (or maybe best) stamblades I met were not cloaking sort, they were heavy armor bleed builds.

And Battlegrounds, nightblades, overperforming? Seriously, now? ^^ NBs are bad in BGs just as they're good for stomping potatoes in open world. It's interesting how I keep hearing the same about other classes - regularly, someone comes up to claim that 50% of BGs are: DKs, petsorcs, werewolves, frost wardens...

As for losing upfront burst, it's hard even to comment on that. You can't even move damage anywhere else in NB toolkit, it's all direct damage and every NB in-class skill makes potatoes in this thread scream bloody murder.

Lol I never said wings are op just stated that you can take away snipe nice for trying to put words in my mouth there but 😂

As far as a heavy armor bleed NB I have never even heard of one of those so they must not be that popular. Of course you are coming back with the "heavy armor meta thing" where all their sustain is trash.

I like how everyone thinks that if they got a bit more survivability rather than so much up front damage it would be a problem. The people that want NB to stay gankblades are usually the ones that really don't enjoy pvp and just like to merk people without fighting. You can say all you want about good players not dying to night blades but I've seen a lot of people die that are all good at pvp. Say what you want but the fact remains that every class has had it's "core mechanic" for pvp hit to the point they change and adapt except NB. So your telling me if they gave NB more survivability that it wouldn't adapt and work with a new "core mechanic"? Idk I find that hard to believe.

Mmhm, so you never heard of them means they don't exist, and 50% of BGs are nightblades... and 53% of statistics is false... You know that anecdotal evidence thing? You're trying to bring it here.

And of course it'd be a problem. But apparently PvP people can't get into their head that there's biggest part of the game they don't actually play, and where damage is actually balanced between three classes right now and they selfishly want to nerf because evil ninja kills them left and right out of stealth and they refuse to get better. You can't move NB's upfront damage away anywhere, because it's all they have, you can look at typical PvE skill bars. Every in-class skill is direct damage, and every single one the nerf-callers from this thread are moaning about. Read above: people want to take away: incap, bow proc, SA... but fact is, it's all that there is. No in-class stamina DoTs (and you can't move damage to out-of-class skills because it won't be NB balancing), and if you'll create new morphs (not going to happen), then you'll just take away class identity and turn NBs into copy of lackluster dragonknights. But people don't actually like to think, so they come up with knee-jerk 'nerf that!' reaction without considering the consequences. No wonder ZOS hardly ever listens to people on forums.

Lol I play both pve and pvp so I know how both are. You are telling me that nbs can't adapt to a change?

Ihere is many things they could do to make it balanced for both sides. First They could remove major fracture. If you are in a group many people apply major fracture so you don't need it on that skill. Or they could re work the passive that gives them a defense buff Everytime they use it. So in 1 skill you can set enemy off balance out of stealth, major fracture, and raise your defense while doing damage........ What other move in the game is an instant cast that has 3 effects built around using it plus does damage?

All of those buffs it receives at the start of the fight is what makes it powerful in pvp and those same buffs don't do too much on your damage tbh it would only hurt someone trying to solo but then again like I said re work them to gain a new survivability move. You think I'm a NB hater and all I keep saying is restructure the moves so it keeps a purpose but looses some up front benefits but gains them in other ways.

And for the love of God on the magic side make them have a few good moves not reflectable lol. The magic side needs a buff in pvp after their healing side got gutted.

No, I'm telling that you can't adapt to change. You just want to nerf everything that you can't build against. Remove Major Fracture? Sure, but let's not discriminate here, let's also strip AoE Fracture from wardens and DKs. Oh, want remove defense buffs from SA? Sure, but then you see, NBs have to slot and keep up separate skill for sustain, where, say, DKs get sustain from just using ultimate - clearly overloaded design here, so either remove Battle Roar, or build Leeching Strikes functions straight into Surprise Attack, shall we? Because on DK, I don't have to slot a special skill and weave LAs simply to sustain myself, so again, let's not discriminate here; I just hit ultimate and get ultimate itself and three resources back, isn't that an overloaded skill - damage, sustain and emergency burst heal in one go. It's also the reason why I can slot Hardened on DK, but I don't have free skill slot on NB.

And no, you're not an NB hater. Just another someone who feels entitled to judge game balance without knowing anything about the game. And yes, you have counterplay against wings on magblades too (yes, I also have a magblade), you just have to put some effort into it instead of going to forums and complaining that you can't kill some stuff easily.

Kidgangster101 · March 2019

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

John_Falstaff wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

As a dk you have an easier time against a NB of course you take away snipe with your wings so they have trouble killing you from far but a good NB can still melt a dk up close. Incap strike from stealth to start the fight who cares if you have immovable pots that move nerfs your heals for a very cheap ultimate cost and they run armor penetration so it cuts you done you must run across those bad nbs. And you can actually cloak more than you would think lol. I do it all the time when I play my stamblade there's a reason when I'm in BG that I go 11+ kills and have very little deaths.

I sort of expected that it will end in 'wings are OP' sort of jab. ESO forums. They never disappoint. ^^

And I can same the same about you - you must've fought a lot of potatoes who couldn't avoid your Incap or were too squishy to survive it. And I do have an idea about how many times sNB can use cloak, I do have one too (even though I main sDK), thankyouverymuch. ^^ Worst (or maybe best) stamblades I met were not cloaking sort, they were heavy armor bleed builds.

And Battlegrounds, nightblades, overperforming? Seriously, now? ^^ NBs are bad in BGs just as they're good for stomping potatoes in open world. It's interesting how I keep hearing the same about other classes - regularly, someone comes up to claim that 50% of BGs are: DKs, petsorcs, werewolves, frost wardens...

As for losing upfront burst, it's hard even to comment on that. You can't even move damage anywhere else in NB toolkit, it's all direct damage and every NB in-class skill makes potatoes in this thread scream bloody murder.

Lol I never said wings are op just stated that you can take away snipe nice for trying to put words in my mouth there but 😂

As far as a heavy armor bleed NB I have never even heard of one of those so they must not be that popular. Of course you are coming back with the "heavy armor meta thing" where all their sustain is trash.

I like how everyone thinks that if they got a bit more survivability rather than so much up front damage it would be a problem. The people that want NB to stay gankblades are usually the ones that really don't enjoy pvp and just like to merk people without fighting. You can say all you want about good players not dying to night blades but I've seen a lot of people die that are all good at pvp. Say what you want but the fact remains that every class has had it's "core mechanic" for pvp hit to the point they change and adapt except NB. So your telling me if they gave NB more survivability that it wouldn't adapt and work with a new "core mechanic"? Idk I find that hard to believe.

Mmhm, so you never heard of them means they don't exist, and 50% of BGs are nightblades... and 53% of statistics is false... You know that anecdotal evidence thing? You're trying to bring it here.

And of course it'd be a problem. But apparently PvP people can't get into their head that there's biggest part of the game they don't actually play, and where damage is actually balanced between three classes right now and they selfishly want to nerf because evil ninja kills them left and right out of stealth and they refuse to get better. You can't move NB's upfront damage away anywhere, because it's all they have, you can look at typical PvE skill bars. Every in-class skill is direct damage, and every single one the nerf-callers from this thread are moaning about. Read above: people want to take away: incap, bow proc, SA... but fact is, it's all that there is. No in-class stamina DoTs (and you can't move damage to out-of-class skills because it won't be NB balancing), and if you'll create new morphs (not going to happen), then you'll just take away class identity and turn NBs into copy of lackluster dragonknights. But people don't actually like to think, so they come up with knee-jerk 'nerf that!' reaction without considering the consequences. No wonder ZOS hardly ever listens to people on forums.

Lol I play both pve and pvp so I know how both are. You are telling me that nbs can't adapt to a change?

Ihere is many things they could do to make it balanced for both sides. First They could remove major fracture. If you are in a group many people apply major fracture so you don't need it on that skill. Or they could re work the passive that gives them a defense buff Everytime they use it. So in 1 skill you can set enemy off balance out of stealth, major fracture, and raise your defense while doing damage........ What other move in the game is an instant cast that has 3 effects built around using it plus does damage?

All of those buffs it receives at the start of the fight is what makes it powerful in pvp and those same buffs don't do too much on your damage tbh it would only hurt someone trying to solo but then again like I said re work them to gain a new survivability move. You think I'm a NB hater and all I keep saying is restructure the moves so it keeps a purpose but looses some up front benefits but gains them in other ways.

And for the love of God on the magic side make them have a few good moves not reflectable lol. The magic side needs a buff in pvp after their healing side got gutted.

No, I'm telling that you can't adapt to change. You just want to nerf everything that you can't build against. Remove Major Fracture? Sure, but let's not discriminate here, let's also strip AoE Fracture from wardens and DKs. Oh, want remove defense buffs from SA? Sure, but then you see, NBs have to slot and keep up separate skill for sustain, where, say, DKs get sustain from just using ultimate - clearly overloaded design here, so either remove Battle Roar, or build Leeching Strikes functions straight into Surprise Attack, shall we? Because on DK, I don't have to slot a special skill and weave LAs simply to sustain myself, so again, let's not discriminate here; I just hit ultimate and get ultimate itself and three resources back, isn't that an overloaded skill - damage, sustain and emergency burst heal in one go. It's also the reason why I can slot Hardened on DK, but I don't have free skill slot on NB.

And no, you're not an NB hater. Just another someone who feels entitled to judge game balance without knowing anything about the game. And yes, you have counterplay against wings on magblades too (yes, I also have a magblade), you just have to put some effort into it instead of going to forums and complaining that you can't kill some stuff easily.

Lol bro did you just compare your spammable move on NB to a passive ability from dk that revolves around ultimate? Pause please and take that in..... Your SPAMABLE MOVE got compared to an ultimate here............ And I don't know balance of this game? Lololol

A mageblade can kill a dk but here's the thing most of your moves are reflectable by one move and I stated that isn't right.

And I can kill NB because I build a toon around them. But take that in you have to build a toon for pvp to stop a NB. Tell me another class that you need to build around to compete? Because if NB were not around I don't have to wear specific gear to survive an opening burst.

And lastly I will ask again. What SPAMMABLE move is there that offers a stun, major fracture, major resolve, major ward, and high damaging all in one move slot? You can equip 9 other moves where a lot of classes need 3 moves to get what you get in 1 skill lol you honestly can't see it? Or are you just one of those forumblades that run around here?

I have said numerous times alter their starting burst but give them more survivability through other moves and it is balanced. I'm not sitting here saying strip your class but I'm saying you should have to do more to gain all those buffs as other classes need to slot more moves to gain the same.

Iskiab · March 2019

I agree nightblades are a weak pvp class right now, they’re only really good at healing from what I can see.

I’ve also never heard of a magblade beating a DK in a duel, ever.

Granted I’m not very good on my Stamblade. All I do is try and kill steal so I can get my daily done.

I think there are a lot of nightblades out there because people like being able to cloak to escape. Unfortunately it doesn’t work if someone uses a counter.

I’m also a pvp healer so might have a different perspective. Any glass canon build doesn’t work when there’s a healer around so my experience might be different. Basicly if they can’t kill me then they can’t kill anyone, and are free AP or kills in a death match.

John_Falstaff · March 2019

@Kidgangster101 , you know, you've just admitted that you don't know how balancing is done in ESO. Yes, imagine that, different classes aren't obliged to have identical copies of each other's abilities, they all have own ways of doing things, and you seem to fail to understand it. DKs don't have spammable at all, but they have an ultra-cheap DoT that hurts like spammable on initial hit and they have double root + snare in one ability. NBs have more densely packed abilities, but their sustain function is carried away into a separate ability they have to slot and use, while DK sustain is automatic on ultimate use - and you keep ignoring that extra slot spent. Remove starting burst? Let's look at NB skill bar: execute, buff + bow proc, spammable, sustain buff... and that's it, the rest are weapon abilities; and all three damaging abilities are instant damage, they all contribute to burst and people whine about them all. You simply don't have in-class DoTs, you can't move burst elsewhere. NB abilities are so densely packed because they have to use more of them to do the job - separate execute, separate spammable (my DK Claw doubles down as one), separate sustain skill (on DK, I just use ultimate, and it also doubles down as a burst heal), and so on. But it seems that it's too difficult a concept to grasp, and you keep clamoring about moving upfront burst elsewhere without actually thinking that there's nowhere to move it without nerfing NB damage in PvE.

In other words, you're just clueless about how different classes offset each other. With that, I'm done explaining obvious things.

Wolfahm · March 2019

This post is so full of baseless salt its glorious.

hakan · March 2019

in the end, Zos does whatever they want.

Lots of threads of "nerf this" and most of them not nerfed. Lots of "please change this back" and most of them didnt reverted back.

juhislihis19 · March 2019

Main sDK here. Love playing stamina DK, but the incredible lack of burst damage has opted me to try out stamblade.

First of all, as a sDK I've never had problems killing Nightblades. I slot detect potions and after they get exposed, 90% of them are like deer in headlights. They really don't know what to do next! The best Nightblades I've encountered scarcely used cloak, if at all. Same way the best Sorcs I've met never stacked shields.

I'm almost finished with my sNB build, 2H+DW. I did a tankier build, but still I've come up with:
- huge burst damage and sustain
- the best buffs and debuffs (Defile, Ward/Resolve, Fracture, Berserk, Endurance)
- great mobility and survability (+30k resistances)
- no burst heal but Vigor ticks 1700 per second in PVP

Slotted skills were quite easy to pick. The last spot is just between Hunter/Leeching/Channeled Acceleration.

In duels, DK's are the hardest as they are so tanky. I noticed this when I was playing sDK, but the DK playing style is sooo boring. In order to win, a DK literally just have to outsurvive the other rather than kill him, which makes dueling boring. I have more fun with stamBlade burst. I use cloak for the crit but I don't gank.

In BG's I see a lot of bow cloakers who snipe, poison injects and cloaks away. They always get the highest stats in BG's but coward away if you play them face to face. I think this is a problem with cloak. With Shackle and the mag rec passive you can get quite formidable magicka recovery and use cloak so often.

IMO the biggest problems (PVP-wise) with NB's, is the bugged desync Snipe/Incap combo which sometimes just insta kills you. The problem isn't the combo itself, but the unability to break away from the CC they cause. This has happened to me few times.

I would rather not nerf Blades but buff other classes which are lagging behind. Also buffing ie. the Expert Hunter skill so it could actually work detecting cloaking enemies and make people want to slot it. IMO slotting a skill for the purpose of countering cloakers would do just nice.

vamp_emily · March 2019

I took a quick glance at the BG leaderboard and 3 of the top 4 leaders were wardens. I"m really thinking wardens are doing the damage and NBs are just stealing the kill and getting called OP.