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"Racial passives are fine already! Don't need to touch them" - Says every altmer/dunmer

Benemime
Benemime
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How many meta race players have you heard saying this?

My solution:

Remove the current racial passives entirely. The only racial passive we should have is the inherent racial passive, like the 1% AP bonus gain from breton, 1% gold bonus gain from imperials, and so on, because passives creates an imbalance, a go-to race, lack of freedom. Statiscally, high elves outnumbers every other race. I'm imperial sorc, my passives tells me that I had a heavy training as a warrior. Well, I haven't. I'm a mage, I didn't train to be a warrior.

Instead of the current passives, we should have a tab called "Specialization", between skill and champion tree tab, where we set our specialization and chose what we would like to raise: max magicka or max stamina for base energy resource (pick one), pick one defensive passive (max hp, spell/physical resistance, crit resist?, healing received, and so on), 1 recovery passive (like, magicka recovery, health recovery, decreased cost of stamina or magicka ability passive, and so on), offensive passive (spell/physical dmg, spell/physical crit, spell/phys. penetration, healing done), always picking one from each.

This covers everything, free us from bouding to races that we don't like, and actually would release us to be 100% better.

2nd solution idea that is out there: Birthsigns instead of racial passives.
  • Facefister
    Facefister
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    No
  • Froil
    Froil
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    Not a bad idea honestly...
    "Best" healer PC/NA
  • Benemime
    Benemime
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    Facefister wrote: »
    No

    meta being meta
  • Tyrobag
    Tyrobag
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    I think you mean "says everyone but nords" nords are the only ones that have sucky passives for any build.
  • ezio45
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    no dont remove racial passives just buff woodelf and nord

    sincerely - 6/8 altmers
  • Thestephenmcraeub17_ESO
    It would definitely add to the "play how you want" ethos of the game, so I support it. Good idea OP
  • MagicalLija
    MagicalLija
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    Tyrobag wrote: »
    I think you mean "says everyone but nords" nords are the only ones that have sucky passives for any build.

    I really want to make a Nordic character like my first character in skyrim, when i found out they sucked to tank in ESO i was quite upset. Its just , redguard for stam, dunmer/altmer for magicka, argonian for tank
  • Kuramas9tails
    Kuramas9tails
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    I always stand behind a thread that talks about a better customization between races and builds.
      Your friendly neighborhood crazy cat lady of ESO
      New PSN name: SundariTheLast. Proud seller in RedEye Empire, PURPLE GANG and Backalley Trading.
      AD High Elf Mageblade DPS (General)(Former Empress) -- Stormproof/VMOL, VHOF, VDSA completion
      AD Khajiit Mageblade DPS -- Flawless Conquerer
      FOR THE QUEEN!
      PS4/NA
    • Jolipinator
      Jolipinator
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      lore
      PS5 EU.
    • FrancisCrawford
      FrancisCrawford
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      lore

      I'm all for the idea.

      To make it work with lore, there could be a quest to change your "effective race" to whatever your target is, roughly akin to the vampire/werewolf bite mechanic.

      Of course, it probably wouldn't involve an actual bite, unless you wanted to become an honorary Bosmer.

      Edited by FrancisCrawford on July 12, 2018 8:36PM
    • SydneyGrey
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      lore
      What about the lore? The main character of the Mage's Guild quest-line is a Nord mage. When you finish the Mage's Guild quest-line, you see representations from literally every race in Eyevea afterward, including an Orc mage who summons flesh atronachs, and Redguards.
      Changing racial passives won't affect YOUR game in any way if you don't want it to.
    • rexagamemnon
      rexagamemnon
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      When i first saw the headline i was thinking “dumb idea” but after reading the whole post, i actually think its a great idea. I doubt ZO$ would ever go through with it though. The imperials are my favorite race but i use all magika abilities with the exception of 1.
    • Joy_Division
      Joy_Division
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      No thanks.

      I want my choices to matter.

      The issue is a lack of balance. Some races are good and some are not.
    • Peekachu99
      Peekachu99
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      Tyrobag wrote: »
      I think you mean "says everyone but nords" nords are the only ones that have sucky passives for any build.

      Nord tanks work just fine.
    • Inarre
      Inarre
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      No. Just continue making your altmers.
    • tinythinker
      tinythinker
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      Benemime wrote: »
      Remove the current racial passives entirely. The only racial passive we should have is the inherent racial passive, like the 1% AP bonus gain from breton, 1% gold bonus gain from imperials, and so on, because passives creates an imbalance, a go-to race, lack of freedom.

      Instead of the current passives, we should have a tab called "Specialization", between skill and champion tree tab, where we set our specialization and chose what we would like to raise: max magicka or max stamina for base energy resource (pick one), pick one defensive passive (max hp, spell/physical resistance, crit resist?, healing received, and so on), 1 recovery passive (like, magicka recovery, health recovery, decreased cost of stamina or magicka ability passive, and so on), offensive passive (spell/physical dmg, spell/physical crit, spell/phys. penetration, healing done), always picking one from each.
      Those are just redundant with the Championship System. It would be better (if the current system is scrapped) to make racial passives something that isn't just Champion System redux. And that system already lets us say "our toon spent a lot of time getting good at X" for customization, so why repeat it in another tab?

      Here is an example of another type of system: pick from options that conform to racial lore similar to what you refer to as the "inherent passives". So for Argonian the swim speed and potion passive would still be options. Other options would be like that. Maybe a 10% chance to go invisible for 12 second when crouching (or maybe when they go below 20% health, or what not) with a one minute cool-down. That would be tied to their expertise in guerilla warfare as another (new) example.

      For Altmer, you could still have a lore-friendly damage passive: "Causing elemental damage has an 8% chance to increase your spellpower by 10% for 4 seconds." <--please note, people who bother to read, these numbers are made up for example purposes and may be crazy high or low.

      That may seem like another way to give the similar benefits another way, EXCEPT...

      There would be a point system. So you get 10 points. Passive A costs 1 point. Passive B costs 3. Passive C costs 5.

      You would pick and choose how to spend, and the few options that are directly about combat would be very pricey.

      (An alternative or addition to the points spent system is boon and bane. So if you add a lot of buffs, you need to balance it with a certain number of penalties or vulnerabilities.)

      Thus the devs hold true to lore while adding interesting choices for character customization.


      Edited by tinythinker on July 12, 2018 9:21PM
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    • themaddaedra
      themaddaedra
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      That's a disgusting way of homogenizing the game, and killing TES lore. Big no.

      Every race has it's own, i have 8 characters and they are divided into 6 races. All comfy and good.

      If you want to feel like a mage, then be a mage. I mean you can't make your own choice then complain that it doesn't fit well, because it's completely on your hands to not choose what fits well.


      PC|EU
    • Colecovision
      Colecovision
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      I want my choices to matter.

      Currently you make a choice and then they change the rules. So your choice wasn't meaningful. What mattered is if you got lucky or not to have the changes go right for your main. Imagine playing chess and someone decides to change what the pieces can do in the middle of the game.

      The rules must be in place when a choice is made to claim that it mattered. I didn't choose crit bonus and health regen with these rules. I didn't choose stam only races with these rules either.

      They need to rebalance all racials every patch or offer a more standardized lore friendly set of options that can change when the rules do. Since they aren't going to rebalce every single race every patch, they need to create a fair flexible system.

      I say this because I also want my choices to matter.
    • Sigtric
      Sigtric
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      One time long ago I proposed a similar idea. I think it's a good thing. Meta can still happen and you could do it with whatever race you choose.

      Stormproof: Vibeke - 50 EP mDragonknight | Savi Dreloth - 50 EP Magsorc | Sadi Dreloth - 50 EP Magblade | Sigtric Stormaxe - 50 EP Stamsorc | Valora Dreloth - 50 EP Magplar | Sigtric the Unbearable 50 EP Stam Warden
      Scrub: Chews-on-Beavers - 50 EP DK Tank | Vera the Wild - 50 EP magicka Warden | Sigtric the Axe - 50 EP Dragonknight Crafter | Sigtric the Blade - 50 EP Lost Nightblade | Sigtric the Savage - 50 EP magicka Templar | Vibeka Shadowblade - 50 Ep Stealthy Ganky Nightblade |

      Show Me Your Dunmer
      [/center]
    • TequilaFire
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      My Breton says leave my passives alone!

      Seriously, if we had a smorgasbord of passives to choose from there would still be meta as most would pick the best passives for their role.
      Edited by TequilaFire on July 12, 2018 9:25PM
    • mr_wazzabi
      mr_wazzabi
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      Benemime wrote: »
      How many meta race players have you heard saying this?

      My solution:

      Remove the current racial passives entirely. The only racial passive we should have is the inherent racial passive, like the 1% AP bonus gain from breton, 1% gold bonus gain from imperials, and so on, because passives creates an imbalance, a go-to race, lack of freedom. Statiscally, high elves outnumbers every other race. I'm imperial sorc, my passives tells me that I had a heavy training as a warrior. Well, I haven't. I'm a mage, I didn't train to be a warrior.

      Instead of the current passives, we should have a tab called "Specialization", between skill and champion tree tab, where we set our specialization and chose what we would like to raise: max magicka or max stamina for base energy resource (pick one), pick one defensive passive (max hp, spell/physical resistance, crit resist?, healing received, and so on), 1 recovery passive (like, magicka recovery, health recovery, decreased cost of stamina or magicka ability passive, and so on), offensive passive (spell/physical dmg, spell/physical crit, spell/phys. penetration, healing done), always picking one from each.

      This covers everything, free us from bouding to races that we don't like, and actually would release us to be 100% better.

      2nd solution idea that is out there: Birthsigns instead of racial passives.

      I second this. With no racial passives that directly affect combat, all races will be equally viable for all builds.

      Throughout the Elder Scrolls series and ESO, you come across npc's of races that would never do well for their roles. You have Altmer 2H and DW warriors, khajiit, Nord and Redguard mages etc. Shalidor, the friggin founder of the friggin Mages Guild is a NORD! Queen Ayrenn is an Altmer warrior who uses a sword, not magic. The same can be said about High King Emeric, a Bretton.

      As it stands now, the players don't have the option to play as character such as these MAIN characters in the game, due to the mismatch of racial passives vs stamin/magicka roles. Unless of course they want to get kicked out of raid groups etc.

      That is called balance.
      Edited by mr_wazzabi on July 12, 2018 9:29PM
      Bosmer Stamina NB
      Altmer Magicka TEMP
      Dunmer DK both stam/mag (depends what I feel like)
      Altmer Magicka NB
      Breton Magicka Sorc
      Redguard Stam Sorc
      Max CP
    • DenMoria
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      Wasn't Shalidor a Nord? I wonder if he had any use for his racial passives.
    • Pink_Violinz
      Pink_Violinz
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      Seeing as every single Elder Scrolls game thus far has had racial passives, I doubt they'd just scrap them.
    • Strider__Roshin
      Strider__Roshin
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      Most racial passives are pretty solid honestly. Argonians are the only ones I would nerf.

      I would get rid of the magicka cost reduction of the Breton, and swap it for increased magic damage by 5%.

      I would give Nords a passive similar to Constitution where they get stamina and magicka back when taking damage.

      That's honestly all that I would change.

      Edit: forgot to specify Argonian Nerf.
      I would get rid of healing received entirely, increase max magicka to 6% and make it so their potion passive would only affect magicka and stamina. Their resource management would remain the same, their efficiency as a healer would actually improve, but their survivability would decrease which is too strong considering their other racial passives.
      Edited by Strider__Roshin on July 12, 2018 9:39PM
    • rexagamemnon
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      Also it could work lore wise as well, as the two different ethnic groups of imperials. Of the two ethnic groups on tends to lean towards martial prowress and the other tends to practice more magical arts
      Edited by rexagamemnon on July 12, 2018 9:36PM
    • Pink_Violinz
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      As someone who mains a Breton and a Bosmer, racials are much better than they were in the past. Yes, some like Nords, Imperials, and maybe Bretons need a buff, but we're doing much better than we were in the past.
    • max_only
      max_only
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      SydneyGrey wrote: »
      lore
      What about the lore? The main character of the Mage's Guild quest-line is a Nord mage. When you finish the Mage's Guild quest-line, you see representations from literally every race in Eyevea afterward, including an Orc mage who summons flesh atronachs, and Redguards.
      Changing racial passives won't affect YOUR game in any way if you don't want it to.

      Thank you.


      Also while we are here I’m going to put on the table a Bosmer racial passive to cannibalize humanoid bodies to regain hp (have an x pop up on viable corpses) and if you do this in view of guards/snitches you incur a bounty.
      #FiteForYourRite Bosmer = Stealth
      #OppositeResourceSiphoningAttacks
      || CP 1000+ || PC/NA || GUILDS: LWH; IA; CH; XA
      ""All gods' creatures (you lot) are equal when covered in A1 sauce"" -- Old Bosmeri Wisdom
    • PlagueSD
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      My Breton says leave my passives alone!

      Seriously, if we had a smorgasbord of passives to choose from there would still be meta as most would pick the best passives for their role.

      And leave my Argonian swim speed passive alone :)

      I have to agree. If we let everyone choose their racials, everyone would be the same and the only thing race would do is determine what your character would look like.

      If I was able to pick my 4 racial passives, I'd definitely be OP - especially on a Stam character.

      Stam character: (total: +40% health recovery, 10% stamina recovery, 6% Max health, 16% Max stamina)
      Nimble - Increases your Health Recovery by 20% and Stamina Recovery by 10%.
      Conditioning - Increases Max Stamina by 10%
      Brawny - Increases Max Health and Max Stamina by 6%
      Stalwart - Increases Max Stamina by 6% and Health Recovery by 20%.


      Magicka character: (total: +25% max magicka, max stamina 6%, 9% magicka recovery, +4% flame/frost/shock damage)
      Gift of Magnus - Increases Max Magicka by 10%
      Spellcharge - Increased Magicka Recovery by 9%
      Elemental Talent - Increases your Flame, Frost and Shock Damage by 4%.
      Dynamic - Increases Max Magicka and Max Stamina by 6%.
    • D0PAMINE
      D0PAMINE
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      I like this, it could be worked into the build helper
      Edited by D0PAMINE on July 12, 2018 9:54PM
    • mr_wazzabi
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      DenMoria wrote: »
      Wasn't Shalidor a Nord? I wonder if he had any use for his racial passives.

      Yup. And no, his racial passives don't help him at all. Just frost resist. He founded the Mages Guild for God's sake.
      Edited by mr_wazzabi on July 12, 2018 9:56PM
      Bosmer Stamina NB
      Altmer Magicka TEMP
      Dunmer DK both stam/mag (depends what I feel like)
      Altmer Magicka NB
      Breton Magicka Sorc
      Redguard Stam Sorc
      Max CP
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