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5 Skills + Ultimate is not enough

  • Felarrond
    Felarrond
    ✭✭✭
    I'm fine with 10 potential skills, I wouldn't MIND seeing a 6th hotkeyable skill, but meh, I like the combat so far once the wrinkles are ironed out and the bugs exterminated.
  • liquid_wolf
    liquid_wolf
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    Wykkid's Outfitter lets me swap easily between skill sets.

    5 Skills is more than enough for me... I've figured out which skills work best together, and with the second weapon at 15 I've got more than enough to engage nearly anything without problem.

    Wykkid's Outfitter allows me to swap from Tank/Melee to Healer/Caster with very little downtime. Armor/Items/Skills easily swap out now.
    Edited by liquid_wolf on April 2, 2014 4:56PM
  • sflanagan21ub17_ESO
    I'm going to have to agree with most everyone on needing more hot bar slots. This recent trend of us PC players making sacrifices for the console gamers is starting to bug me.

    I'd personally like to see 7 or 8 hotbar slots in addition to the quick slot and a couple of ultimate slots. It would definitely make things a little easier.
  • RighteousDevil
    it is already a difficult enough choice choosing what skills I want within the weapons and class skills section. It will be tricky to ever find space for the world or guild skills such as mage light with this strict of a skill set.

    I'm pretty sure that would be the point behind the "5+1". It makes it tough to make a selection. Forces you to think what direction you want for the build, what single Ultimate accents the build and vice versa.

    As for the extra Guild/World slot idea, I think that completely defeats the purpose of the system put into place by the developers. You might as well ask for an extra slot each for wep/armor/class skills too.

    I am very adament about the thought that, if you feel you are lacking in something, grab a friend! And to be honest, I think that is the driving force behind the current setup. Limit what players can do in an effort to get them to play together. Find your soul(less)mate and have at it.


  • neidzwiedzub17_ESO
    neidzwiedzub17_ESO
    ✭✭✭
    Brynnza wrote: »
    More abilities means less like TES and more like a generic MMO. Personally I would have preferred a Q-Quickslot style equip for your 2 hands and no hotkey skills.

    The majority of players want and enjoy this game for its distance from the "1000 hotkeys" MMO's, the last thing we want is to change it to be as such.

    Besides, you have dual load outs, 10 Skills and 2 Ultimates, make use of them.

    TES Skyrim only had 2 abilities i believe, one for each hand and you had to swap out as situations changed.
    Edited by neidzwiedzub17_ESO on April 2, 2014 5:07PM
    I walk alone,
    If our paths converge
    We may share the road
    When our paths diverge
    I walk alone.
  • liquid_wolf
    liquid_wolf
    ✭✭✭✭
    It would definitely make things a little easier.

    9e7e9dea082b041d688e0bd10e2cc0ec984947d11aab246df8cf1be99c09c58e.jpg

    If you mean setting up multiple bars to swap BETWEEN or out of... like armor sets you can just quick-put-on... I agree.

    Wykkid's addon appears to be doing that for me... though.
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/65069/wykkyd-s-addons-upcoming-features#latest

    I really don't need more than two bars at any one time. There doesn't seem to be any situation in game that I would actively need four bars of skills for, or quick-slot items.

    Maybe if I got another 10 vanity pets. Maybe.
    Edited by liquid_wolf on April 2, 2014 5:19PM
  • theshark666
    I fully agree with the need for more hot bar slots, with current build i am working with i don't feel or see a need to flip between two builds at present but even if i were to a 5 +1 bar limits what i want up there i would love to see 7+1 or and 8+1 hot bar myself
  • riccifacce
    I noticed a lot of people saying "six" would be better than "five."

    That's a slippery slope, guys. "Seven" would be better than "six..."
    And so on.

    I really like the 5+1 system. At first, I hated it because I remembered playing a couple of other MMOs (I haven't been huge on MMOs. I'm here for TES. lol), but I remember that with too many skills, everything became less challenging. "Oh, I like this skill. I'll put it on hotkey 2, bar 3." And sure, I'd use it when it was useful, and I sort of felt like a badass switching between things all the time, but this is so much more challenging, and thus more fun, for builds.
  • waziban
    waziban
    I like the amount of spells. It really makes you think of which spells you need before going into a situation. By 50, you should have enough spells to switch in & out of your two weapons for dungeons, pvp, pve.
  • thorntk421
    thorntk421
    ✭✭✭
    I personally would love to see 6 slots per bar plus ultimate but, 5 is fine. Having a limited skill set to chose from during battle causes you to actually have to use strategy and tactics in a fight. Having every skill available at any time and just hitting x button in y situation like most mmo's is "dumbing down" if you ask me.
  • Mordite
    Mordite
    ✭✭
    Personally I would like to see ONE more box on the ability bar, but one that does not have a button. For those toggled stances.

    Sorcerer pet, Bound Armor, that Templar Health regen stance, etc... The ones you click on and leave active. A slot where, if it's slotted, it's running. Change it out with the skills window like normal but no key binds to it.

    Basically it'd be "You get one stance free, if you want more you sacrifice buttons."
  • Imryll
    Imryll
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    It's definitely a system with a steeper learning curve than one in which you have constant access to all of your abilities. And hard decisions are hard which can be uncomfortable. You really have to think about how your abilities work together, know your vulnerabilities, and plan how you'll compensate for them. It's much more interesting though than executing the correct rotation (having assigned the correct talents) for your class and spec.
  • darkweed1977
    darkweed1977
    Soul Shriven
    I can't see that lesser skills make the choice more tactical, as with any other mmo you will start to see the same skills being used for each class depending on the role they are playing, if they go for melee or ranged. The rest of the skills will not be used because if you are choosing one odd skill, you will sacrifice the "perfect" build.
    Even in a game like WOW where you have tons of skills, you only see a few who really customizes their skill tree to be completely different from the more or less standard build.

    Having only 5+1 limits the odd skills being used in a given situation and you will soon start to expect max two ways that you will encounter another class, with the odd 1/1000 once in a while that have one different skill put in.

    Also limiting the skills to only 5+1 makes it a lot more tedious when levelling and switching between solo and group. Maybe you will not even have the required skills to be effective in a group or for any odd event.

    Having more skills with the current stam/mag management will not make people faceroling, if anything it will even make it harder with the decisions which skills and spells to use at any given point.

    So I must say that I am also more in for 2-3 more skills on the hotbar, so you will be able to have that one or two odd spells that will make it more versatile and fun. And as someone else said, having an extra button dedicated for summons/buffs will also make the existing classes that have these abilities more versatile and more group oriented than they are now.
  • cubansyrusb16_ESO
    cubansyrusb16_ESO
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    Am I the only Dragon knight that is running around with 3 skills and an ultimate at level 30 XD

    Dont need more atm basic attack > thrust > right click shield slap in the face > laugh next enemy please
    Edited by cubansyrusb16_ESO on April 2, 2014 9:34PM
  • alexdamm89
    We will most likely never get any more skill slots, since the consoles controller only has a limited amount of buttons compared to a keyboard.
  • Cogo
    Cogo
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    There is no need for more "active" skills, but I would like to see more skills to choose from. Game kick butt as it is though but I hope with patching/expansions, more skills will be implemented!
    Oghur Hatemachine, Guild leader of The Nephilim - EU Megaserver
    Orc Weapon Specialist and Warchief of the Ebonheart Pact - Trueflame Cyrodiil War Campaign
    Guildsite: The Nephilim

    "I don't agree with what you are saying, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it"
    -Voltaire

    "My build? Improvise, overcome and adapt!"
  • Contrabardus
    Contrabardus
    ✭✭
    Honestly, I think there should be two more slots, but that they should be limited to situational type abilities, like Magelight, Invisibility, or other buffs.

    Or one slot with a system that works similar to the consumable [Q] button. A wheel that pops up that can be slotted with two to four non damage dealing abilities that can easily be switched out of combat and with some risk during combat. Possibly even disabling switching the function during combat for easier balancing.

    I like the limitations on the amount of damage dealing skills available and I don't want a 10 or more slot action bar that can be slotted full of attacks, I can play FF XIV if I want to do that. However, I also think that another specialized slot similar to the Ultimate button or consumables button would improve the game, particularly for groups and PvP.

    Before someone is a wiseass about my 10 slots comment, I mean 10+ slots as in on screen at once using all the 1-= keys up with a single bar.
    Edited by Contrabardus on April 2, 2014 11:03PM
  • Asyrin
    Asyrin
    I like the 5+1 x 2. In WoW I had characters with 70+ keybinds. 5+1 is perfect. This game is about resource management.

    Your slotted skills are a resource.
  • cliveklgb14_ESO
    cliveklgb14_ESO
    ✭✭✭
    Dragunzar wrote: »
    I agree, we need some more slots. I've been playing DDO a lot and im used to having around 25+ different spells and abilities hotkeyed to prepare me for any situation.

    This game isn't DDO, or WOW, or SWTOR where everyone ability under the sun is available to your character at all times.

    You have to be more thoughtful on what you have, and adjust between fights.

    Why do people always want to make games all the same?

  • cliveklgb14_ESO
    cliveklgb14_ESO
    ✭✭✭
    I do not want a screen full of spells. I am asking for 8 per weapon not 50....

    That is still a huge change not only to class balance in PvP, but PvE encounters also. Besides portability of the game to consoles which is a huge part of the ES market.
    I want to make it clear that I am not asking for 30 skills all over my screen at all.

    And I want to be clear, it doesn't matter how many you want or don't want, the game is fine as is. The extra skills are not needed.
  • cliveklgb14_ESO
    cliveklgb14_ESO
    ✭✭✭
    I hate the skill limitation

    Then this game might not be the one for you, because I doubt this will ever change.

  • DanielMaxwell
    DanielMaxwell
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    Due to the restricted hot bar size you do not have many choices when in combat if you are part of a group , you can only perform the role you have the skills slotted for for so if your a DPS you can not replace a Healer that goes down or a Tank that goes down .This means that you might have the ability to be a tank but in the middle of a fight you can not be a backup for the groups tank because you do not have the ability to slot your needed DPS skills and a few tanking skills to be a temporary tank while the tank is ressurected . This is a serious short fall in a game where any class can learn to be a tank , healer or a DPS . Players need enough hot bar slots to be fexible while playing so they can react to things as they happen . The current hotbar setup is at best problematic and at worst gamebreaking for a MMO.


    edits for typos (yes that darn beast mauls me often)
    Edited by DanielMaxwell on April 3, 2014 1:33AM
  • Ciovala
    Ciovala
    ✭✭✭
    I like it now that I've had time to get used to it. However, a way to save various skill load outs and then swap them out of combat would be nice.
    Looking for a mature and helpful social guild - play PvE, PvP, and like crafting.
  • Ciovala
    Ciovala
    ✭✭✭
    Due to the restricted hot bar size you do not many choices when in combat if your part of a group , you can only perform the role you have the skills slotted for for so if your a DPS you can not replace a Healer that goes down or a Tank that goes down .This means that you might have the ability to be a tank but in the middle of a fight you can not be a backup for the groups tank because you do not have the ability to slot your needed DPS skills and a few tanking skills to be a temporary tank while the tank is ressurected . This is a serious short fall in a game where any class can learn to be a tank , healer or a DPS . Players need enough hot bar slots to be fexible while playing so they can react to things as they happen . The current hotbar setup is at best problematic and at worst gamebreaking for a MMO.

    Why can't you just keep some of those skills on your second weapon and swap I'd needed?
    Looking for a mature and helpful social guild - play PvE, PvP, and like crafting.
  • SuperScrubby
    SuperScrubby
    ✭✭✭
    Honestly it's kind of a pain especially if your 2nd weapon swap is that of a ranged fashion if you're melee dps. I find it more annoying than anything else. I can play with a 5+1 set up and it doesn't ruin the game for me by any means, but every time that I outfit for a specific occasion and something else comes up I have to then swap to another one. It's especially painful in pvp. Once I get home I'll install that mod that allows me to swap quicker but I feel like having a 6+1 setup would be the sweet spot. But then again someone can say 7+1 but forget them since this is the internet my opinion has to be the only one that matters. AMIRITE?
  • DanielMaxwell
    DanielMaxwell
    ✭✭✭
    Ciovala wrote: »

    Why can't you just keep some of those skills on your second weapon and swap I'd needed?


    Takes approx 2 seconds for the following to occur
    You see the tank/healer go down
    you hit your weapon swap button
    you target mob or player and press button for skill (taunt or healing)

    in that time the group has wiped

    I like the idea of limited hotbar buttons but the number of 5 plus the ultimate is to few as it restricts player flexibility in groups . the developers went to small , but that is better then going to large since it is "easier" to increase the number of hotbar buttons then it is to decrease the number . Easier meaning players do not feel like they are being nerfed by having buttons (options) removed.
    Edited by DanielMaxwell on April 3, 2014 1:30AM
  • Shaun98ca2
    Shaun98ca2
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Due to the restricted hot bar size you do not have many choices when in combat if you are part of a group , you can only perform the role you have the skills slotted for for so if your a DPS you can not replace a Healer that goes down or a Tank that goes down .This means that you might have the ability to be a tank but in the middle of a fight you can not be a backup for the groups tank because you do not have the ability to slot your needed DPS skills and a few tanking skills to be a temporary tank while the tank is ressurected . This is a serious short fall in a game where any class can learn to be a tank , healer or a DPS . Players need enough hot bar slots to be fexible while playing so they can react to things as they happen . The current hotbar setup is at best problematic and at worst gamebreaking for a MMO.


    edits for typos (yes that darn beast mauls me often)
    Umm a lot of you still aren't getting it. And WONT.
    5+1 is your Role. Your second hotbar/weapon swap is HOW you fill a second role.
    5+1 abilities is MORE than enough. You need to look at EACH ability slot as a "different situation" for your role.
    SO for DPS
    1.Opener(2 second cast)
    2.Instand DPS
    3. DOT (or something else ish)
    4. Open
    5. Open
    You can make a strong DPS build with 2-3 abilities.

    The system is as flexible as you allow it. You can be DPS or Support or Healer or Tank on 1..........1 Hotbar.

    The 2nd one is for a different role.
  • DanielMaxwell
    DanielMaxwell
    ✭✭✭

    Shaun98ca2 wrote: »
    Due to the restricted hot bar size you do not have many choices when in combat if you are part of a group , you can only perform the role you have the skills slotted for for so if your a DPS you can not replace a Healer that goes down or a Tank that goes down .This means that you might have the ability to be a tank but in the middle of a fight you can not be a backup for the groups tank because you do not have the ability to slot your needed DPS skills and a few tanking skills to be a temporary tank while the tank is ressurected . This is a serious short fall in a game where any class can learn to be a tank , healer or a DPS . Players need enough hot bar slots to be fexible while playing so they can react to things as they happen . The current hotbar setup is at best problematic and at worst gamebreaking for a MMO.


    edits for typos (yes that darn beast mauls me often)
    Umm a lot of you still aren't getting it. And WONT.
    5+1 is your Role. Your second hotbar/weapon swap is HOW you fill a second role.
    5+1 abilities is MORE than enough. You need to look at EACH ability slot as a "different situation" for your role.
    SO for DPS
    1.Opener(2 second cast)
    2.Instand DPS
    3. DOT (or something else ish)
    4. Open
    5. Open
    You can make a strong DPS build with 2-3 abilities.

    The system is as flexible as you allow it. You can be DPS or Support or Healer or Tank on 1..........1 Hotbar.

    The 2nd one is for a different role.

    read the bolded section

    Takes approx 2 seconds for the following to occur
    You see the tank/healer go down
    you hit your weapon swap button
    you target mob or player and press button for skill (taunt or healing)

    in that time the group has wiped


    I like the idea of limited hotbar buttons but the number of 5 plus the ultimate is to few as it restricts player flexibility in groups . the developers went to small , but that is better then going to large since it is "easier" to increase the number of hotbar buttons then it is to decrease the number . Easier meaning players do not feel like they are being nerfed by having buttons (options) removed.

  • Shaun98ca2
    Shaun98ca2
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    Yes the 2 second delay DOES suck and can cause a wipe when trying to swap to your other role but people are already abusing the system to make their current roles strong by gaining MORE abilities slots than their roles need.

    Also 5 IS the perfect # due to the fact that 3 is currently the perfect number for ANY given role. For my DPS example you have 3 DPS slotted abilities. The same can be said for a Healer you need 3 slotted abilities.

    If we add exactly 1 more ability slot NOW I can make a strong DPS and strong Healer on the same hotbar.

    5 is the perfect number. Plus an Ultimate.
    The game has been entirely designed in a VERY particular way to get the most out of your selected abilities since 90% of all abilities are spamable just some have a cast time which makes it a good opener for dps.
  • Kemono
    Kemono
    ✭✭✭
    Why do people always want to make games all the same?
    Cos we like things we allready know?
    You are wrong -this system is not even close to "innovative" or "new"

    Its not even all that bad (i would only like second ultimate slot, and 3 consumables slot -you have a 30 sec timer after using one anyway)


    Lets talk a bit about TSW (Secret World)
    In there -you have a skill bar with 6 slots and passive skill bar with 6 slots.
    And quite similiar like in ESO -you are using 2 weapon at once (one weapon per bar)

    BUT in TSW you dont have second skill bar- you need to menage in your first and only bar. Even worse - every weapon have 54! skills to choose from -so you are filling your 6 active slots from selection of ~108 skills.
    Pasives are even worse cos you are filling them from entire wheel (you are not locked with passives to your curent weapon selection)

    Skill wheell (and a builder), and thats not even all skills cos there is a second wheel for Auxiliary Weapon (from DLC content)
    http://www.drakkashi.com/secretworld/
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