To people who enjoy speedrunning...

Kalgert · April 2018

Get your own group together, if you want to skip most of the dungeon, while being rude enough to leave other people in the dust.

Lately I've been encountering more and more groups that has that one or two players who just rush ahead of everyone (Even the tank, because let's be honest, normal dungeons are that wee-easy), and then have the nerve to have a passive-aggressive attitude towards anyone who tells them "'Oy, stop running ahead of the rest of the group"

One occurence had people literary running past everything. Past mobs and kept running even when they aggroed them. It made me start asking myself why even bother being in the dungeon, if everyone's just gonna run ahead of everything. One run left me somewhat amused, just for how *** up it was, in seeing one tank being so eager to speedrun, that he was shouting frantic nonsense like "wtf why can't I go forward???" because he couldn't get to the last boss in Elden Hollow 1.

What's funny is that these rushers are all around the 600 to 720 in CP, which I understand, you're all high level players and you have people follow you and fawn over you and your high CP level. Well, let me just say I'm not feeling prepared to roll around over you just because of your high CP, and if I am a tank, it would be in your best interest to follow Me

Oh well. I can always let these people be stuck in a snag and have them wait for a tank to bail them through a tough encounter, while I can leave and find a new group in a matter of moments.

But tell me, ladies and gentlemen. How can I deal with this little dillema?

boombazookajd · April 2018

Well here's the other side of the coin:

Those 600+ players have run that dungeon about a billion times. I used to hate this too but I now understand why. For one, they try to do "big pulls" yanking most of the bad guys to an area and then melting them down with AOE's. Most 720's can solo a normal dungeon so honestly, you're getting a free run and a free key, or a free/quick jubilee box

Frankly when you get those kind of people, you can either run after them (you'll need to heal through some things; which in all honesty your healer might not be in position to do as you get stretched out or quit.If you're the tank, frankly, you probably aren't pulling enough CC, chains and such. OR you just don't know how to do a big pull that higher level players like, to melt down the bad guys as fast as possible.

For instance, in Banished Cells 1, that group of trash before the final boss, they should be pulled/chained into the hallway and turned into one massive group so the DD's can melt them down. SOOO many players don't do this and it drives me nuts because you are left fighting onesies and twosies.

I do want to add: I understand your frustration, I've been there. Also note that the jubilee event has been going on for quite some time now and I am willing to wager some folks are a bit burnt out with being 720 and having 3 group members that are sub lv. 50.

I'm almost 400 and it's happened enough to me where players want to take their time in a simple dungeon like Banished, Spindleclutch, Wayrest, or Elden Hollow.

Aurielle · April 2018

... it’s called mob clustering. It’s much more efficient (esp. in normal dungeons) to grab large bunches of mobs and aoe them down. There’s ZERO need to fight trash mobs one group at a time.

Tasear · April 2018

It's easier to do bigger pulls to balance out low dps if other dps can burn it.

For healer... just let them die if they left you.

madchuska83 · April 2018

I speed run on my MagSorc for my random normal daily. Just do it for quick xp before vet pledges. However, I don't run passed mobs leaving them for the others to deal with. I melt mobs and leave them a nice clear path to stroll along to the next boss, wait at boss so they get drops, melt boss, rinse, and repeat. If someone says they have the quest I'm happy to wait, otherwise it's a straight burn.

Dragath · April 2018

well, normal dungeons are so easy that you can solo them.
there is no need for a tank or healer. pugging those dungeons is often just a way to do them a little bit faster then if you would be alone.
the thing about the dungeon finder is that everyone can join, whatever his/her intentions are.
if you have a specific intention doing a dungeon (like the way you want to play it) and you don't want to encounter players that want to do the dungeon in a different way, i would advise you to not use the dungeon finder.

Apache_Kid · April 2018

Grouping of mobs is a common tactic. It makes the dungeon go quicker. Keep in mind that many players have ran all these dungeons 1001 times, yet whether it's for gear, A pledge, or undaunted xp on an alt, the game keeps making us re-run that content.

I like speedy people in my group, it saves me time, the one resource I am limited on. I would think others would appreciate being Speed-ran through dungeons.

See, the activity finder is a grab bag, if you get a group that isn't behaving as you please, you're really not allowed to complain about it. I get so mad when I get slow no-dps people in the finder, but I keep that ish internal because I know I deserve whatever I get in that group finder. Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to go slow just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed.

boombazookajd · April 2018

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to go slow and waste time just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed.

it's nice in cool in that shade I bet. haha!

VaranisArano · April 2018

There's how I handle as a tank: "If you aggro it first, you can tank it until I get there. And I'm not sprinting."

On my healer its "You'd better not blame me if you die before I get there."

Now, for mob clustering, I only do that if the group can handle it and I usually know that after the first mob or two. If we've got a squishy DPS or the healer is slacking, I don't pull bigger mob clusters than the group can handle. If we're all blowing through the mobs like tissue paper, I'll pull bigger clusters no problem.

sylviermoone · April 2018

I clicked because I thought the thread was for people who enjoyed spreadsheeting.

On topic: There are no adoring fans in this game; nobody is getting followed or fawned over because of their CP level.

Perhaps the reason you've been seeing people lately want to speed through dungeons is because of the Anniversary Event. They want to finish their pledges and move along to the next set of daily quests for more boxes as quickly as they possibly can.

If you do not wish to speed through a dungeon, you could always take your own advice and form a group of your own. That way, your desire to take your time in the dungeon doesn't hold up other people who just want to get the pledge done.

If you're running normal dungeons, there's really no need for any role outside of DPS, because, like you said, they are easy-peasy. Who does mechanics in normal dungeons anyway?

Apache_Kid · April 2018

boombazookajd wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to go slow and waste time just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed.

it's nice in cool in that shade I bet. haha!

Yeah I'm gonna change that. Sounds way too snarky. Thanks for pointing that out

boombazookajd · April 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

There's how I handle as a tank: "If you aggro it first, you can tank it until I get there. And I'm not sprinting."

On my healer its "You'd better not blame me if you die before I get there."

Now, for mob clustering, I only do that if the group can handle it and I usually know that after the first mob or two. If we've got a squishy DPS or the healer is slacking, I don't pull bigger mob clusters than the group can handle. If we're all blowing through the mobs like tissue paper, I'll pull bigger clusters no problem.

@VaranisArano and in all fairness, that line of thinking is rare. Glad you play that way though.

VaranisArano · April 2018

sylviermoone wrote: »

If you're running normal dungeons, there's really no need for any role outside of DPS, because, like you said, they are easy-peasy. Who does mechanics in normal dungeons anyway?

Groups who can't burn the Planar Inhibitor...

Yeah, there are still a lot of newbies in normal dungeons who benefit from having mechanics explained (especially on II dungeons) and from having a tank who will at minimum hold aggro and a healer who can heal.

Kalgert · April 2018

I think I will avoid making mention of any "Technical Jargon" that people are talking about, with their mob clustering and whatnot, but there is something I'd like to single out:

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to go slow just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed.

You realize I can turn this around on to you and say "Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to blitz through as fast as possible through a dungeon just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed."

sylviermoone wrote: »

If you're running normal dungeons, there's really no need for any role outside of DPS, because, like you said, they are easy-peasy. Who does mechanics in normal dungeons anyway?

Well, for one, I am doing the dungeons with my girlfriend, and since she's fairly new, it would only be natural to stay by her and kill everything in our way (That is also what the dungeon's all about, no?), and seeing someone pretty much undermine the whole dungeon run kinda makes it... You know, a waste of time doing the dungeon.

Also, mechanics in normal dungeons are still kind of important, believe it or not. At least for the Content-Pack dungeons. I cannot tell how many hairs on my head have been Dante'fied because the DPS don't think it's important to interrupt the shadows in Cradle of Shadows, or how standing behind a pillar is overrated in the first encounter of the Scalecaller dungeon.

Dragath · April 2018

Kalgert wrote: »

You realize I can turn this around on to you and say "Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to blitz through as fast as possible through a dungeon just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed."

you can, but the issue here is, that you are the one complaining about the "speedrunners".
they are not complaining about you.
so if they have no issue with you being slow but you have an issue with them being fast, then you are the person who should consider doing it another way. that is, if it bothers you that much.

munster1404 · April 2018

VaranisArano wrote: »

There's how I handle as a tank: "If you aggro it first, you can tank it until I get there. And I'm not sprinting."

On my healer its "You'd better not blame me if you die before I get there."

Now, for mob clustering, I only do that if the group can handle it and I usually know that after the first mob or two. If we've got a squishy DPS or the healer is slacking, I don't pull bigger mob clusters than the group can handle. If we're all blowing through the mobs like tissue paper, I'll pull bigger clusters no problem.

I always ask whether they wish to skip. I preferred not to actually. But will defer to the majority.

boombazookajd · April 2018

Kalgert wrote: »

Well, for one, I am doing the dungeons with my girlfriend, and since she's fairly new, it would only be natural to stay by her and kill everything in our way (That is also what the dungeon's all about, no?), and seeing someone pretty much undermine the whole dungeon run kinda makes it... You know, a waste of time doing the dungeon.

Also, mechanics in normal dungeons are still kind of important, believe it or not. At least for the Content-Pack dungeons. I cannot tell how many hairs on my head have been Dante'fied because the DPS don't think it's important to interrupt the shadows in Cradle of Shadows, or how standing behind a pillar is overrated in the first encounter of the Scalecaller dungeon.

You're exactly the kind of player I don't want to be with- someone playing with their significant other. In my experience, those kind of players are the one's who A. don't pay attention to group chat B. don't pay attention to the group C. aren't in group voice.

Those aren't the mechanics we are speaking of. Even on normal, Scalecaller is still easy compared to the Vet. Hell, I've noticed most players don't even know to break free from the final boss in Direfrost.

You came in with an issue and many of us explained why the speed running happens. It's a fact of life, and frankly, is only indicative of an experienced player. I'm not asking you to kowtow to a CP 720, but when they do 95% of the work to clear the dungeon and all you have to do is follow, even if you die (which is kinda like a free ticket as you can't be hit and can run through any mobs still alive).

I don't know your level, nor your experience in the game but if you've been around long enough you learn the dungeons and when you get two DD's who pull 10k dps combined, a tank with no taunts, or a healer that can't heal well, you learn to take care of yourself AND kill things.

So thats why you see 600's+ speed running, they don't have time for a dps that spams light attacks, a healer with no shards, or a tank with no CC ability. They want the key, the clear, and at the moment, the box, so they can move on to the next task.

Drdeath20 · April 2018

Its a platforming game, people want to get through objectives as fast as possible. Its by design.

Guarlet · April 2018

Dragath wrote: »

Kalgert wrote: »

You realize I can turn this around on to you and say "Next time, maybe try finding a group of people who want to blitz through as fast as possible through a dungeon just like you, that way you'll never be disappointed."

you can, but the issue here is, that you are the one complaining about the "speedrunners".
they are not complaining about you.
so if they have no issue with you being slow but you have an issue with them being fast, then you are the person who should consider doing it another way. that is, if it bothers you that much.

This.

At the OP: You do what the majority of the group wants, or you form your own group if you want to do it a certain way (I am quite sure there are other people out there who also may want to run dungeons more slowly). That's just common courtesy. The universe doesn't revolve around you, oddly enough.

Aurielle · April 2018

boombazookajd wrote: »

Kalgert wrote: »

Well, for one, I am doing the dungeons with my girlfriend, and since she's fairly new, it would only be natural to stay by her and kill everything in our way (That is also what the dungeon's all about, no?), and seeing someone pretty much undermine the whole dungeon run kinda makes it... You know, a waste of time doing the dungeon.

Also, mechanics in normal dungeons are still kind of important, believe it or not. At least for the Content-Pack dungeons. I cannot tell how many hairs on my head have been Dante'fied because the DPS don't think it's important to interrupt the shadows in Cradle of Shadows, or how standing behind a pillar is overrated in the first encounter of the Scalecaller dungeon.

You're exactly the kind of player I don't want to be with- someone playing with their significant other. In my experience, those kind of players are the one's who A. don't pay attention to group chat B. don't pay attention to the group C. aren't in group voice.

Those aren't the mechanics we are speaking of. Even on normal, Scalecaller is still easy compared to the Vet. Hell, I've noticed most players don't even know to break free from the final boss in Direfrost.

You came in with an issue and many of us explained why the speed running happens. It's a fact of life, and frankly, is only indicative of an experienced player. I'm not asking you to kowtow to a CP 720, but when they do 95% of the work to clear the dungeon and all you have to do is follow, even if you die (which is kinda like a free ticket as you can't be hit and can run through any mobs still alive).

I don't know your level, nor your experience in the game but if you've been around long enough you learn the dungeons and when you get two DD's who pull 10k dps combined, a tank with no taunts, or a healer that can't heal well, you learn to take care of yourself AND kill things.

So thats why you see 600's+ speed running, they don't have time for a dps that spams light attacks, a healer with no shards, or a tank with no CC ability. They want the key, the clear, and at the moment, the box, so they can move on to the next task.

Precisely. I’m only doing normals during this event for the boxes (and I do normals for the random XP bonus, though since I’ve hit 720, I’m less inclined to do so). I do not need a tank or a healer to do a normal dungeon. If low levels have the situational awareness to stay out of red circles, they do not need a tank or healer either; I do enough DPS to keep the vast majority of the trash attacking me. If said low-levels stop to attack small groups of mobs instead of following me (which I specifically ASK people to do at the beginning of a dungeon), then yeah, they’ll die to the groups of mobs that they’re attacking with their 5k DPS.

I don’t want people to “fawn” over me for being level-capped; I just want to get that freaking chance at a Worm Cult motif at more than a glacial pace:

IndianaGeoff · April 2018

It is not significantly slowing anyone down to pause 5 or 10 seconds ahead of a pull or fight to let everyone collect and stage for the fight.

5 secs is not ruining anyone's day.

IndianaGeoff · April 2018

It is not significantly slowing anyone down to pause 5 or 10 seconds ahead of a pull or fight to let everyone collect and stage for the fight.

5 secs is not ruining anyone's day.

Aurielle · April 2018

IndianaGeoff wrote: »

It is not significantly slowing anyone down to pause 5 or 10 seconds ahead of a pull or fight to let everyone collect and stage for the fight.

5 secs is not ruining anyone's day.

It all adds up. Why kill trash groups one at a time when you can kill multiple groups in the same amount of time it would take to kill a single group? There are no AOE caps, so it simply makes sense to kill multiple groups of trash in one go. Spindleclutch 1, for instance, can be completed in under five minutes with zero deaths if you pull big groups of trash and AOE them down.

Chicharron · April 2018

Time to time i see one of those.

If someone needs the quest and they do not want to wait, before the final boss we kick him out.

It's very funny to see how they get angry, it never fails.

DaveMoeDee · April 2018

I feel the opposite way. I just go with the flow, but I love when I get matched with a speedrunner if I'm doing the random dungeon for the XP. I barely have time to run dungeons most days.

Aurielle · April 2018

Chicharron wrote: »

Time to time i see one of those.

If someone needs the quest and they do not want to wait, before the final boss we kick him out.

It's very funny to see how they get angry, it never fails.

The onus is on the person doing the quest to say they’re doing the quest. If they are, I always wait and let them get their skill point.

Apache_Kid · April 2018

Chicharron wrote: »

Time to time i see one of those.

If someone needs the quest and they do not want to wait, before the final boss we kick him out.

It's very funny to see how they get angry, it never fails.

That makes you just as bad as the person rushing ahead. Worse actually. People can do the quest dialouge while others push ahead and kill the trash mobs. Nice on you to waste the time of others for a few laughs though.

Gaggin · April 2018

Complaining about people playing the game well? I bet you never even thank people for the carry.

IndianaGeoff · April 2018

Aurielle wrote: »

IndianaGeoff wrote: »

It is not significantly slowing anyone down to pause 5 or 10 seconds ahead of a pull or fight to let everyone collect and stage for the fight.

5 secs is not ruining anyone's day.

It all adds up. Why kill trash groups one at a time when you can kill multiple groups in the same amount of time it would take to kill a single group? There are no AOE caps, so it simply makes sense to kill multiple groups of trash in one go. Spindleclutch 1, for instance, can be completed in under five minutes with zero deaths if you pull big groups of trash and AOE them down.

Then take 5 secs, tell people what you are doing and give them time to keep up with you. An extra minute in the dungeon is killing no one.

Kalgert · April 2018

Gaggin wrote: »

Complaining about people playing the game well? I bet you never even thank people for the carry.

I have no words to express how stupid this sounds.

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Chicharron wrote: »

Time to time i see one of those.

If someone needs the quest and they do not want to wait, before the final boss we kick him out.

It's very funny to see how they get angry, it never fails.

That makes you just as bad as the person rushing ahead. Worse actually. People can do the quest dialouge while others push ahead and kill the trash mobs. Nice on you to waste the time of others for a few laughs though.

I think those people deserve to be booted out, actually.

Jolipinator · April 2018

If you can complete dungeons on your own, then play on your own.

If you are in a rush because of real world events, then exit the game.

If you can't play a video game without trying to force others to play your way, then seek help.