Minalan wrote: »

MyrddinEmrys wrote: »

Ill post my various thoughts as I have time but for the moment I would like to make known that I am very dissapointed that the stun was not re-added to Crystal Frags. Perhaps some people did not understand it in PvE, but the stun was as useful as the main damage for me.

If you wont add the stun back to CFrags, please at least give it Knockback.

I’ll settle for getting 10% damage back...the stun would be nice though.

'

I'd prefer the 10%. A stunless frag actually promotes more skillful magsorc play in PvP which is a good thing. It also keeps the potatoes out which means less people dying to "OP" Mage Wrath which translates to less "Nerf Sorc" threads.

If anything they should just make the skill have a proc chance as the base and make 1 stun on proc and the other deal more damage.

Personally I'd like to see the skill affected by weapon choice. Melee weapons stun, Ranged weapons increase damage by 10% (for a total of 20%)

Minalan wrote: »

I’m overall happy with the changes. Blocking costs. AOE caps. Reduced damage on gap closers. It’s about time. Genius in fact, and I sincerely thank you for listening to the community.

1. Bad show on the new melee range instant gank proc set. It’s like we didn’t learn anything from Selene, Viper, and Velidreth. Are the same design people working on this? If there was turnover in the group, please explain the history, why all proc damage is unable to crit, and why most of it was converted to damage over time.

2. Please rethink interrupt immunity. Cut the interrupted skill forced cool down to 1-1.5 seconds and remove all interrupt immunity. The immunity will make some skills such as dark deal/dark conversion completely broken. The whole downside/balance to those abilities is that you have to be smart about if/when you use it. You have to CC the other guy, or LOS, or play smart. Breaking a stun shouldn’t let my Sorc dark deal himself to full resources right in your face.

That goes for any channel spell. You can’t expect to cast channel heals right in the face of the enemy. The seven second immunity also makes spells like crushing shock pointless. Why bother taking that morph when the enemy can just break free and cast whatever they want?

3. Please work closely with the MagDK community on fixing the five power lash thing. We all know it’s ridiculously broken, but there are wiser heads that actually play the class who know how to fix it.

Definitely agree they should rethink interrupt immunity. I understand the need to make channeled skills viable but this is just a cop out. I also don't think an interrupt should stun. Interrupting an opponent, weaving and than stunning again is skilled gameplay that is rewarded. Removing this tactic dumbs down combat.

Alternatives I'd suggest:

-Native damage reduction while channeling to reduce punishment (meh)
-grant interrupt immunity for only 1 cast (less meh)
-give all channels the C-Frag treatment (an option, not one I'd want)

-Create conditions where player decision grants an uninterruptible cast e.x. Gain interrupt Immunity after using a CC-->this would balance channels in the same way C-frag is balanced: it's extremely telegraphed, placing the onus on the defender to react to the channel defensively (i.e. reactive counter-play as opposed to proactive-counterplay, the latter of which is currently too punishing for the caster)

Hollery wrote: »

From what I've gathered, DK is broken in PvP (which is not at all where it needed help, like at all), and for PvE it got the shaft.

WTF... I just can't even...

For the first time in a while. PvE changes broke PvP.

It did need some tune ups in PvP. But not really this. Whip is strong on live still, probably the best spammable for smart use, (not bird spam style) and the stun added is nice and quite a fair addition after foss changes. But power lash spam that stacks heals and is undodgable isn't a great way to balance, or help with the sustain issue,

As for PvE. Yep, shafted to oblivion.

BohnT wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

1. I hope to see nerf to Immovable pots - with current new CC mechanic - it means 15 sec immunity to any cast-time/channeled skills. That's terrible. It will only make bad channels as bad as they are but strong channels into OP one.

2. Eclipse should stop granting CC immunity of expire - as originally intended to punish aggressive opponent, but with changes to cc immunity it becoming more and more like - allow enemy to simply waste 5 sec timer to reapply all of his buffs and as result grant cc immunity for it and in addition make all his channels/cast-time abilities uninterruptable.
Eclipse becoming a skill that favour enemy instead of being threat. And cc immunity after expire allow such inconsistence as being CCed while having cc immunity:


3. Nerfs to wardens where? Increase cost of shimmering shield or whatever change it to minor heroism. Otherwise it unclear why wardens has ability that shut down range opponents and has major buff addicted to it while dragonknights has range ability that also shut down range opponents but has 1 minor buff addicted to it. Incosnistence.

Don't forget the 400 magicka cost of shimmering shield, reflects being the weakest range counters while absorbs are the best.
They simply fail to see how op warden and especially stamwarden are.

I think the interrupt immunity should be unthetered from CC immunity and be a whole new status. When you're interrupted, you should gain a 5 second window of immunity to interrupts (aside from already covered exceptions like ressurrection). That way coupled with the 3 second cooldown you will have a 2 second window to squeeze the skill you really need to cast.

And about wardens, I think the magicka recovery should be moved to the morph that returns an ice attack back and change major heroism to minor on shimmering.

EDIT: And does shalk have a telegraph in PvP? Maybe adding one 1.5 second before of it exploding under you could help with the stam wardens, so they need to CC you before you take the shalks.

dirtykdx wrote: »

Bowser wrote: »

Very disappointed that my block cost will be almost quadrupled through the formula change.

If my math is correct, with 4 sturdy, 3 block cost reduction, 75 cp into block cost, and absorb magic on the bar, I go from 202 to 421.

2160
x (1 - 16% ) // sturdy
x (1 - 24% ) // cp
x (1 - 36% ) // fortress
x (1 - 8%) // asorb magic
- 609 block cost reduction
= 202
** this might be 250, I don't recall if the 8% skill cost is taken after the 609 flat reduction currently, 202 sounds on the low side though

1730
-609 = 1121 // new base with cost reduction removed
x (1 - 16% ) // sturdy
x (1 - 24% ) // cp
x (1 - 36% ) // fortress
x (1 - 8% ) //absorb magic
= 421

In other words...ewwwwww

Yes Deffensive posture comes off last. This is the math

Old
Base 2160
32% 8 Sturdy = 1468.4
25% CP = 1101.6
36% S&B/Frsot Passive = 705.02
-609 Jewelry = 96.024
8% Defensive Posture = 88 (Absolute lowest)

New
Base 1730
-609 Jewelry = 1121
32% 8 Sturdy = 762.28
25% CP = 571.71
36% S&B/Frost Passive = 365.8944
8% Defensive Posture = 336.622848 (Absolute lowest)

4 times as much.
Morrowind change was Block cost calculations changed to 0.25 sec down from 0.5 (twice as much)
Morrowind changed Tank meta from 7 Infused and Reinforced Shield -> 8 Sturdy

ZOS the block changes are unacceptable.

There is a fundamental recurring issue that you seem to only care about PVP instead of PVE.

If you are going to continue to screw over the PVE players for the sake of PVP then you need to have different servers for PVE and PVP, or have the Battle Spirit make these sweeping changes. Stop penalizing the people who hate and never will play PVP for the sake of a very few who do.

Seriously we have had enough of this.

Split the servers or fix it with battle spirit but STOP changing PVE just to shut up the PVP players.

Alcast wrote: »

PvE
I still heavily dislike the Heavy Attack Meta in PvE, especially for Stamina Setups. Light Attack rotations used to be so engaging and made the combat fast, now we have a slow heavy attack meta which is quite frankly boring. And we can not really use Light Attack Rotations because you loose too much damage compared to Heavy Attack builds.

If they were to revert the Morrowind sustain changes this would be fixed. This is a good opportunity for ZOS to fix that mistake. Though I do not know if they will take said opportunity.

Will crushing shock get another secondary effect since now interrupting will already in the same result .

Crushing shock:
Enemies hit while casting are interrupted, set off balance and stunned for 3 seconds.

New interrupt mechanic:
When a cast time or channeled ability is interrupted, you will be staggered, stunned, and set Off Balance. After the stun ends, you gain crowd control immunity.


Also did the combat team actually think about how off-balance changes are affecting pvp?(Not only mag dks will have fun with this change) As far as i can see there is no off-balance immunity for players which will cause extrem high off-balance uptime on a lot of builds since nothing will consume it. It means 10% more damage (at least for all stam builds), 70% heavy attack damage buff, more resources on heavy attacks and a cc on heavy attacks.

BohnT wrote: »

DoonerSeraph wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

1. I hope to see nerf to Immovable pots - with current new CC mechanic - it means 15 sec immunity to any cast-time/channeled skills. That's terrible. It will only make bad channels as bad as they are but strong channels into OP one.

2. Eclipse should stop granting CC immunity of expire - as originally intended to punish aggressive opponent, but with changes to cc immunity it becoming more and more like - allow enemy to simply waste 5 sec timer to reapply all of his buffs and as result grant cc immunity for it and in addition make all his channels/cast-time abilities uninterruptable.
Eclipse becoming a skill that favour enemy instead of being threat. And cc immunity after expire allow such inconsistence as being CCed while having cc immunity:


3. Nerfs to wardens where? Increase cost of shimmering shield or whatever change it to minor heroism. Otherwise it unclear why wardens has ability that shut down range opponents and has major buff addicted to it while dragonknights has range ability that also shut down range opponents but has 1 minor buff addicted to it. Incosnistence.

Don't forget the 400 magicka cost of shimmering shield, reflects being the weakest range counters while absorbs are the best.
They simply fail to see how op warden and especially stamwarden are.

I think the interrupt immunity should be unthetered from CC immunity and be a whole new status. When you're interrupted, you should gain a 5 second window of immunity to interrupts (aside from already covered exceptions like ressurrection). That way coupled with the 3 second cooldown you will have a 2 second window to squeeze the skill you really need to cast.

And about wardens, I think the magicka recovery should be moved to the morph that returns an ice attack back and change major heroism to minor on shimmering.

EDIT: And does shalk have a telegraph in PvP? Maybe adding one 1.5 second before of it exploding under you could help with the stam wardens, so they need to CC you before you take the shalks.

Shalks ignore block and dodge, they have a 3 seconds delay. The nice thing about delayed abilities (which the warden can use 2) is that you can let them blow up in one gcd to burst enemies instantly.
Yes the interrupt immunity should be separated from cc immunity although i think 1 successful cast of the ability should remove the immunity as skills like dark deal are way too strong and need to be interrupteable all the time or most of time.

The changea to shimmering shields sounds good but i think warden needs more changes to got on the same level as the other classes

I think that 1 free cast if skills like Dark Deal (in 2s is the most you can do, one cast), is not that unbalanced.

The telegraph would help at highlighting the weak point of a delayed skill, it can be completely avoided if your opponent sees it coming. A 1.5 or even 2s window would be enough for people to roll dodge behins the warden and avoidung the Shalks and maybe even DBoS.

Ffastyl wrote: »

The change to block cost is a great one. It balances in the way ESO needs: reducing the stat gap (the difference between the two extremes of a stat). The change buffs the common build while nerfing the extreme. I can only hope you find more solutions with such effects for the other aspects of combat.

So your idea of great is to have everyone be the same... Please gawd don't tell me this is ZOS goal. Extremes are a good thing, both builds that can hold a Keep / Resource againts 10 while reinforcements come and glass cannons that can take a Keep / Resource againts 10 via tactics. Things need to be balance to need all types not just a lot of one type.

During the summer double AP event I was in a fight defending a Keep with 3 walls down. About 20 of us at each of the opening and 40 enimies out in the field at each opening, all 3 alliances present. 3 or 4 of us tanks standing in the opening with healers and DDs taking cover behind us or walls. Fight was 40 + minutes of the most fun I've ever had in Cryodiil. All because the tanks had the openings filled with CC, the healers there to keep them up and the DDs there to keep the brave at bay. This was possible because double AP had all the PvE builds out doing what they do best just against Players.
Not heavy armor Stam.
Tanks with full complement of crowd control rather than ignore them cause the only skill they have is not dieing builds.,
Healers built to keep 12 alive through Warriors Star Fall rather than built to keep 1 alive through Eye of the Storm.

On my mDK vampire i generally farm world bosses, delves and public dungeons. I often solo the brood queen and abandoned farm world bosses.

I was soloing both on PTS and was able to get powered lash to proc up to 11 times in a row against both, all the while dodging attacks and trying to maintain wall of elements.

on live i am good to get 5 in a row if lag does not creep in.

Regeneration and sustaining mana are still low.

Regards,

Bashev wrote: »

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

Since AOE caps are removed on PTS I think ZOS should make a stress - test for Cyrodill - What will happen when a lot of people (like 50) start to fight and all will run some AOEs (Eye of the Storm, Caltrops etc.)
What will happen if there will be multiple AOEs in one spot and there will be like 50 targets all getting hit by all those AOEs.

Keep in mind - not so long ago (like 3 days ) EU Cyrodill PvP server crashed because there was a giant fight between all 3 factions... And keep in mind - currently it was with AOE caps...
So i think since this is a "test" server - this should be on a check-list.

Removal of AoE caps will increase the performance. Right now more than 50 people take damage. The damage is just reduced. Furthermore more calculations are needed because server should calculate the position of the players and distribute the damage for those who are closer to be more. Now it will be simple. If you are in you take the full damage.

The server wasnt responsive in the past because we had fight on flags 30 players stacked spamming AoEs. Healing is smart, damage is not. These people cannot kill each other and they just lag the server.

TL, DR I expect that the removal of the AoE caps will improve the sever calculations.

agree -> https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/224997/myth-aoe-cap/p1

rafaelcsmaia wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

MyrddinEmrys wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

PvE
I still heavily dislike the Heavy Attack Meta in PvE, especially for Stamina Setups. Light Attack rotations used to be so engaging and made the combat fast, now we have a slow heavy attack meta which is quite frankly boring. And we can not really use Light Attack Rotations because you loose too much damage compared to Heavy Attack builds.

If they were to revert the Morrowind sustain changes this would be fixed. This is a good opportunity for ZOS to fix that mistake. Though I do not know if they will take said opportunity.

the sustain changes were needed, i don't like them, they made stamdk in pvp weak, they made cost poisons even stronger and Xv1 got easier than it ever was but for PvE the changes were needed.
I skipped 80% of all boss mechanics in vet dungeons and in raids just because damage was so insane and never ever did i run out of resources in pvp. The fights there were so Long that fighting against one good enemy would never end.


I don't have a perfect idea how to give us sustain back but on the other Hand keeping dps and survivability in check.
Maybe @Alcast thought about somethings to achieve this as his insight on PvE is much higher than mine.

Revert the damn sustain changes and buff enemy resistances on trials, something close to the cap so you cant ever penetrate it to 0 (Which imo is kinda absurd in a boss fight). Sustain would come back along with fast paced combat but dps would be mitigated.

Wouldn't help with PvP balance making pvp again who gets bored first loses the fight because if you didn't want to die you it you could survive as long as you want.

I simply don't see any change that could bring back the old PvE pace while keeping pvp balanced or vice versa