PTS Update 16 - Feedback Thread for Item Sets & Asylum Weapons

Gnortranermara · September 2017

Dymence wrote: »

They are still the strongest for PVE. Being able to put a damage enchant (e.g. shock, fire) actually makes them stronger than before.

Wrong. The damage enchant can be placed on a normal set item and on special weapons, making it irrelevant to comparing the two. The relevant difference for this comparison is that a regular set items can offer a universal, general stat buff while the special weapon now offers only a specific buff to one skill. On most of the special weapons, the modest buffs to a single skill cannot possibly outperform the 4/5 set piece bonuses of standard item set weapons. In order to make the special weapons better, they need to keep their general stat buff intact.

Jeckll · September 2017

-edit-

Derra · September 2017

Brrrofski wrote: »

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Derra wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

ssewallb14_ESO wrote: »

The destro seems extremely OP in PvP

You're getting:
8% more damage

reduce target damage by %15

A flame DoT

All with near 100% uptime, from a 1 piece set. This is more than you get from a lot of full 5 piece sets.

Something like 100% chance to apply 1 of the 3 effects every 4/5 seconds would be a lot more balanced.

What he said. Period.

Any decent build already has 100% uptime on maim and 50+% uptime on concussed.

With an imperfect asylum weapon you have ~70% uptime on maim, burning and concussed at the cost of a) a 5p bonus or b) 2p undaunted bonus
With a perfect asylum weapon i managed roughly 90% uptime (but not many players will be able to get them in the first place - i do take issue in locking gear that is relevant for pvp behind 12 man vet pve content).
You trade burning and minimally higher concussed uptime to a 5p setbonus or undaunted.

Master bow, asylum 2h, master daggers and maelstrom 1h shield all offer equally compelling choices compared to the asylum destro.
Stop acting like the builds would not get the statuseffects right now.

A sorc is not getting 100% uptime on maim. Most don't use wizards, even if they do, it's not 100%. Same with concussed. Mostly they use fire staff. Only lightning damage if mages wrath and the one part of crushing shock. Streak too now and then.

wizard is a 15s debuff. it´s very much 100% uptime when the enemy should have the intention to attack and kill you and it´s on every attacker.
Shadowrend is ~90% on its target.

Staff attacks don´t procc elemental effects at all. Only the enchantment does.

I get between 30 and 90% uptime on concussed currently depending on the build i´m using. It´s always a flame staff used.

Edit: I´m posting these numbers because i review all of my pvp fights with combatmetrics. I can actually see how much uptime of specific debuffs/buffs i had in pvp encounters.
Posting out of a gutfeeling won´t help make a point.

Cage_Lizardman · September 2017

code65536 wrote: »

Yet another garbage restoration staff. I can guarantee you that no healer worth their salt will use the Asylum restoration staff.

True. How about halving the cost of purge for HoF? Displaying a large red warning sign whenever the tank is low on stamina? Bouncing people out of red circles on crits? Letting me resurrect 3 people simultaneously to make vet dlc dungeons a lot more puggable...

Or how about a variable damage bonus, if the ally is dealing less than 15k dps it gives them a bonus large enough to get up to that, but does very little above that?

wesmont65 · September 2017

StopDropAndBear wrote: »

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StopDropAndBear wrote: »

Mad Tinkerer's Set:
the AI on this proc pet is....bad. It seems like over half the time it just..misses the enemy, or rolls to where it used to be. And that's not even factoring in the times it spawns and then dies without even moving. It's the same issue that Flame Blossom has.
I used it against the Training Dummy and it missed. It missed the stationary training dummy. Just rolled right on past it.

Here I go again on my own..goin down the only road I've ever known..
https://gfycat.com/gifs/detail/RingedElectricGelada

What an awesome song, David Coverdale rules!!

SodanTok · September 2017

Ok after some experimenting with asylum bow:

You have to slot it (instead of lets say pen or wd bonus from one piece of monster mask)
You get around 16% more damage (after acid spray DoT ends) with acid+snipe combo over snipe+snipe combo
You perform this combo ~0.571s (if you cast acid spray after snipe, but before it lands -> hard from short range and no light attack between) or 0.171s (if you cast it before snipe, no light attack used between for consistency) faster than snipe+snipe combo
You spend 575 more stamina (12% increase over snipe+snipe)
You have to perform this combo from maximum range of 20m. Losing around 4% damage from long shot passive
You literally have to use the acid spray morph, because the damage is not even worth it with bombard

So If I put it all together. If I slot one velidreth piece with 129 damage and use snipe+snipe combo from same range as acid spray. I just saved 575 stamina, lost 0.1-0.5s of time, did 13% less damage from one two-skill combo, increased my dmg with all skills, did not spend any time farming trial, got morph choice (if I want bombard) and got skill slot on frontbar (if I dont need my AoE skill for boss fight)
Thats for PVE.

In PVP. I get not just damage, but also better heals because I have velidreth. I dont have to use 20m range skill to boost my 40m range skill. I saved precious stamina. I did not spend stamina and time to boost just one telegraphed attack so someone can use just one dodge to negate it all. I saved morph choice, because bombard is much better in PVP. I saved skill slot, because I am not idiot and I would never ever slot arrow spray or its morphs (including mentioned bombard) in PVP ever. I also did not have to go to trial as PVP player to get it.

But I am definitely glad this is what asylum bow became. Better for it to be bad, than actually fix the obvious problems with scatter shot, arrow spray or snipe. So I can complain about these skills without hearing "just do trial and get this weapon"

//edit:
Forgot to mention, that 13% increase of damage of acid+snipe over snipe+snipe put this somewhere around 2% DPS increase. While increasing resource drain forcing you to do heavy attacks that are DPS loss alone, but with this setup they will even eat to how many these combos you can actually perform.
While getting just 129 WD is on my build (=used my stats) from one piece of velidreth is 2.6%DPS increase.

For the record, using bow as frontbar weapon is 20% - 30% DPS loss over DW/Bow. So even if we removed all advantages of not using this bow. The DPS increase is joke.

//EDIT2
Proposed changes that could actually if not make it useful, made any sense, while keeping in the spirit of making one of the last 4 skills buffed or activator for buff

After casting scattershot, snipe procs like frags (no cast time or more damage or both)
After casting scattershot, ultimate deals X more damage
After casting arrow spray, ultimate shoots at all targets affected
After casting arrow spray, enemies are more vulnerable to bow skills
Arrow Spray or Scattershot deal increased damage at execute range
Arrow Spray now applies buff on caster, shooting X times at targets in cone for Y damage (like deadly cloak)
My imagination is weak, so literally anything that buffs ultimate

What I do not propose even if it makes sense and is very needed, because these changes need to actually happen to base skills down the road (read: never, but I will continue to remind it until I get bored and start playing another game):

Long range scatter shot
Snipe without cast time or snipe as channeling attack that shoots several arrows (ranged flurry)

DDuke · September 2017

SodanTok wrote: »

Ok after some experimenting with asylum bow:
You perform this combo ~0.571s (if you cast acid spray after snipe, but before it lands -> hard from short range and no light attack between)

That's the trick, and might just make it worth it for PvP "gank builds".

I got 20k crits on a heavy armor wearing player with 7 impen without even wearing all the gear I wanted for that build due to PTS limitations, I'll test again once there's EU copies (could also get 5% more direct dmg from CPs, which is probably the way to go).

Assuming they finally get rid of Miat's, I'll definitely try it out in PvP. "Shotgun build", that's what I'm gonna call it for obvious reasons ^^

SodanTok · September 2017

DDuke wrote: »

show previous quotes

SodanTok wrote: »

Ok after some experimenting with asylum bow:
You perform this combo ~0.571s (if you cast acid spray after snipe, but before it lands -> hard from short range and no light attack between)

That's the trick, and might just make it worth it for PvP "gank builds".

I got 20k crits on a heavy armor wearing player with 7 impen without even wearing all the gear I wanted for that build due to PTS limitations, I'll test again once there's EU copies (could also get 5% more direct dmg from CPs, which is probably the way to go).

Assuming they finally get rid of Miat's, I'll definitely try it out in PvP. "Shotgun build", that's what I'm gonna call it for obvious reasons ^^

Yeah, the only way to get something out of the bonus damage without losing s***load of other things for only the price of skill slot is to shoot snipe from ~20m range without target being aware and then shooting him with bombard just before it lands. Tho you will waste the guaranteed crit of cloak on the bombard so the crit wont even be consistent.

But then you can also get sorc. Apply curse, fury, shoot buffed frag and use your undodgeable and unblockable stun just before it hits for still pretty big damage from twice the range, while not being useless in all other parts of the combat.

Also dont assume they somehow finally get rid of Miat, when they are literally avoiding even discussion about it and it has been ongoing for at least a year.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO · September 2017

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

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Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Master weapon 1h/sword got descent enchantment buff for heals and physical/spell resistance, this is strong for PVE!

Asylum Weapon 1h/sword restore Magicka, good for PVP and PVE, its weak enchantment comparing Master

Malestorm 1h/sword requires you to perform heavy attack to restore 2k Mag and Stam?

this seems disappointment comparing above two as heavy attack restores lot of resources already and this is not really adding value, this does not fit in PVP or PVE!

Have you ever tanked in this game? Tanking is basically resource management, the extra healing and resists you get are worth nothing in a group environment where you have a healer and you don't need the extra resists, I have tanked all but vhof with around 30k spell and 27K physical resits. Your opinionion on the way these might be used is likely reverse of what will happen, in PvP you need the extra resist and you need to be able to heal and damage at the same time, something the master s/b do.

Healing becomes half in PVP, it does not matter its PVP or PVE.

It is no doubt strong in PVP, i may have missed adding PVP.

Enchantment is pretty descent, resistance is still needed in PVE. You can tank at 27K, most players prefer around 30k in PVE.

What are you on about man? You first say you say master is strong, I say the mealstorm is better for pve and you just ignore that? Then you go on saying that you can tank is less ressits the I said, well duh, then what is the the value that the master s/b brings compared to the vMA s/b?

What are you about on dude?

I am not in for long debates, you are just dragging in/out.

My whole point was,

Maelstrom 1h/shield enchantment is not worth dropping monster set items and useless in PVE as DK and Warden can get resources back from various ways.

Resources have never been an issue in good groups so VMA 1h/shield is dead choice or will have rarely any use!

This enchantment need buff to be competitive

Lol you say you are not in for long debates but I read "don't challenge what I say or I will get easily irritated"

I think you are wrong. They only thing a tank has to worry about is resources. We are only comparing the master and the vMA s/b, so don't bring monster sets and other things into it, that is a whole new discussion.

I ask again, have you even tanked in this game? Please answer this question.

Qbiken · September 2017

The Asylum shields looks very promising for people who like to block a lot.......Same thing goes for the rework of the maelstrom sword. Boi that resourcemanagement. Happy I didn´t deconstructed mine now.

Zer0oo · September 2017

Why are all support weapons s&b/restro staff still extrem selfish? They do Not offer any kind of group support or synergy. It would be better if they would work like the master restro and actually help your group.
(BTW pls fix the master restro to not restore stam to the closes 6 ppl to you instead of the 6 ppl you healed)

Some suggestions:

msa restro restores magica to all player who are get hit with rapid regen instead of only the caster
Master sword also heals one close player
Asylum s&b restores magica to all player in 7m of the tank
MSA S&B restores also mag&stam to the closest player to the tank
Asylum Restro reduces the cost of the next spell of all player that get hit with blessing of protection

Also maybe still give the master/msa/Asylum weapons an additional 1piece with magica/stam or weapon/spell damage since they should be special and still good even if you don't use the special 1 piece bonus, that would also help with them in pvp .

Malamar1229 · September 2017

Does anyone know if the new crafted set that gives 400 spell dmg to class abilities buffs the damage of the storm atronach?

dpencil1 · September 2017

The visual effect on Force Shock using the Asylum Destro staff is AMAZING!!!

Dymence · September 2017

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Dymence wrote: »

They are still the strongest for PVE. Being able to put a damage enchant (e.g. shock, fire) actually makes them stronger than before.

Wrong. The damage enchant can be placed on a normal set item and on special weapons, making it irrelevant to comparing the two. The relevant difference for this comparison is that a regular set items can offer a universal, general stat buff while the special weapon now offers only a specific buff to one skill. On most of the special weapons, the modest buffs to a single skill cannot possibly outperform the 4/5 set piece bonuses of standard item set weapons. In order to make the special weapons better, they need to keep their general stat buff intact.

And yet this 'modest' skill buff will always win out against an extra 5 piece.

There's a reason why everyone runs them. And it's not the stat buff. These weapons are on the backbar 90% of the time.

Let that sink in.

Tyrion87 · September 2017

Apart from a combat-related discussion here...

I was almost sure that the new Asylum staves will look like this in one of the promo pics:

And I was excited because on the above pic it looks amazing!

But I just watched a video showing the Asylum staves and their look was different and rather disappointing...

Thus, anybody knows what is the style of that staff showed on the above pic? Is it already in game or maybe will come in the CWC DLC? If so, as craftable or drop?

Lord_Eomer · September 2017

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Master weapon 1h/sword got descent enchantment buff for heals and physical/spell resistance, this is strong for PVE!

Asylum Weapon 1h/sword restore Magicka, good for PVP and PVE, its weak enchantment comparing Master

Malestorm 1h/sword requires you to perform heavy attack to restore 2k Mag and Stam?

this seems disappointment comparing above two as heavy attack restores lot of resources already and this is not really adding value, this does not fit in PVP or PVE!

Have you ever tanked in this game? Tanking is basically resource management, the extra healing and resists you get are worth nothing in a group environment where you have a healer and you don't need the extra resists, I have tanked all but vhof with around 30k spell and 27K physical resits. Your opinionion on the way these might be used is likely reverse of what will happen, in PvP you need the extra resist and you need to be able to heal and damage at the same time, something the master s/b do.

Healing becomes half in PVP, it does not matter its PVP or PVE.

It is no doubt strong in PVP, i may have missed adding PVP.

Enchantment is pretty descent, resistance is still needed in PVE. You can tank at 27K, most players prefer around 30k in PVE.

What are you on about man? You first say you say master is strong, I say the mealstorm is better for pve and you just ignore that? Then you go on saying that you can tank is less ressits the I said, well duh, then what is the the value that the master s/b brings compared to the vMA s/b?

What are you about on dude?

I am not in for long debates, you are just dragging in/out.

My whole point was,

Maelstrom 1h/shield enchantment is not worth dropping monster set items and useless in PVE as DK and Warden can get resources back from various ways.

Resources have never been an issue in good groups so VMA 1h/shield is dead choice or will have rarely any use!

This enchantment need buff to be competitive

Lol you say you are not in for long debates but I read "don't challenge what I say or I will get easily irritated"

I think you are wrong. They only thing a tank has to worry about is resources. We are only comparing the master and the vMA s/b, so don't bring monster sets and other things into it, that is a whole new discussion.

I ask again, have you even tanked in this game? Please answer this question.

Again you are wrong,

You can not ignore the benifit of other items i.e. monster helm

In PVP you can sinply go with Master Sword and Board with Agility set but using VMA sword and board is a waste.

Have you ever tank?

I do not like to further reply you as you are adding no constructive value!

Inig0 · September 2017

Did you find that the Master and Maelstrom weapons were correctly changed from an enchantment to an item set? Did you get your additional free shield?
Im am thrilled with this change it thoroughly helped balance the various weapon options that is available. Yes i did.

Were you able to clearly tell the difference between the Asylum and Perfect Asylum weapons?
Yes it was very simple. HOWEVER. The difference between the two types should be much greater.

What did you think about the new crafted item sets? Were you able to successfully craft them?
They all look pretty interesting they seem to intentionally appealing to both spec mag and stam which is great.

What did you think about the new dropped item sets from Clockwork City?
They are pretty underwhelming and should do more damage!

Were you able to find/learn the new motifs? If so, did you like their appearance?
no

the appearance looked great though!!

Did you receive any rewards from the new Dailies?
Nope

Do you have any other general feedback?

PLEASE @ZOS_GinaBruno Suggest a change to how the aslyum weapons drop. The fact that you can get them on normal is a slap in the face to the endgame community and it just promotes casual play with no incentive to get into at the very least vet version to get VET REWARDS. Asylum weapons are very powerful and should be earned in VETERAN CONTENT. The same way maelstrom weapons are earned in veteran content. Please reconsider this aspect of their drop chance.

code65536 · September 2017

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

show previous quotes

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Lord_Dexter wrote: »

Master weapon 1h/sword got descent enchantment buff for heals and physical/spell resistance, this is strong for PVE!

Asylum Weapon 1h/sword restore Magicka, good for PVP and PVE, its weak enchantment comparing Master

Malestorm 1h/sword requires you to perform heavy attack to restore 2k Mag and Stam?

this seems disappointment comparing above two as heavy attack restores lot of resources already and this is not really adding value, this does not fit in PVP or PVE!

Have you ever tanked in this game? Tanking is basically resource management, the extra healing and resists you get are worth nothing in a group environment where you have a healer and you don't need the extra resists, I have tanked all but vhof with around 30k spell and 27K physical resits. Your opinionion on the way these might be used is likely reverse of what will happen, in PvP you need the extra resist and you need to be able to heal and damage at the same time, something the master s/b do.

Healing becomes half in PVP, it does not matter its PVP or PVE.

It is no doubt strong in PVP, i may have missed adding PVP.

Enchantment is pretty descent, resistance is still needed in PVE. You can tank at 27K, most players prefer around 30k in PVE.

What are you on about man? You first say you say master is strong, I say the mealstorm is better for pve and you just ignore that? Then you go on saying that you can tank is less ressits the I said, well duh, then what is the the value that the master s/b brings compared to the vMA s/b?

What are you about on dude?

I am not in for long debates, you are just dragging in/out.

My whole point was,

Maelstrom 1h/shield enchantment is not worth dropping monster set items and useless in PVE as DK and Warden can get resources back from various ways.

Resources have never been an issue in good groups so VMA 1h/shield is dead choice or will have rarely any use!

This enchantment need buff to be competitive

Lol you say you are not in for long debates but I read "don't challenge what I say or I will get easily irritated"

I think you are wrong. They only thing a tank has to worry about is resources. We are only comparing the master and the vMA s/b, so don't bring monster sets and other things into it, that is a whole new discussion.

I ask again, have you even tanked in this game? Please answer this question.

Endgame tanking in this game isn't resource management or resistance or self-healing. It's about group support. Master 1HS heals too little (esp. when vHoF bosses hit for like 15K+ through block) and takes up two slots. Maelstrom 1HS is still utter trash. Asylum 1HS is useful for exactly one scenario in this game: Rakkhat MT.

ZOS has no clue what the support roles actually do in trials and continue to create tank/healing sets that are worthless. Maelstrom Resto, Asylum Resto, Inventor's Guard, Automated Defense, Master/Maelstrom/Asylum 1HS... all trash sets that nobody would ever use (except maybe Asylum for a MT on Rakkhat).

Ragnaroek93 · September 2017

First of all, thanks a lot for letting imperfect weapons drop from normal mode (still think something similar to vdsa would be good, not sure about vma because it's solo content and therefore much easier to complete than difficult group content).

My feedback to some of the weapons so far (speaking out of PvP view):

vDSA dual wield: Increasing the tick by 1500 is way over the top, that's a ridiculous amount, I've got hit by 3k tick crits on PTS from rendering slashes (don't forget that these 1500 go right through all your armor because it's considered as a bleed).

Asylum Destrostaff: This weapon gets a lot of hate at the moment but it's too early to judge about it in my opinion. People forget that sorcs already have access to these effects. Also sorcs don't have access to a restoration staff with a good skill synergy (it would be different if there would be a resto staff which boosts healing ward - once we get new weapons I can already say that skills like healing ward, uppercut etc can easily make up for balance problems as well).

Asylum Bow: This weapon is gimmick and looks interesting actually (I thought it will be completely garbage in the beginning). Not sure yet what to think about it.

Asylum Dual Wield: Seems pretty good actually (for PvE mostly).

Asylum 2h: Seems to be also quite good.

Asylum Restostaff: Probably not gonna be used much simply because the skill it buffs is unpopular.

Asylum SnB: Don't know if it's worth it, even if you use this skill since you give up 5-5-2 set combination.

After all I think that these weapons are good. It definitely boosts setups which use staffs, bows and 2h weapons since they have much harder time to achieve a setcombination of 2 monstersets and 2 5p sets like sword and board and dual wield builds can easily achieve and are dominating in the current meta (well dual wield isn't unless you run bleedbuilds but SnB is so incredible strong - speaking out of pvp view).

Inig0 wrote: »

PLEASE @ZOS_GinaBruno Suggest a change to how the aslyum weapons drop. The fact that you can get them on normal is a slap in the face to the endgame community and it just promotes casual play with no incentive to get into at the very least vet version to get VET REWARDS. Asylum weapons are very powerful and should be earned in VETERAN CONTENT. The same way maelstrom weapons are earned in veteran content. Please reconsider this aspect of their drop chance.

Alright, PvE progress players shall rule the world. Let us please drop best in slot PvE gear from PvP then, because PvP players also need to play PvE for best in slot PvP gear

Lets also ignore that ESO isn't about gear progression at all.
This is not vMSA which is solo content, you need a PvE guild (most likely) to farm 12 people vet trial content. What do you think will people who are interested in these weapons do? I'll tell you, they will get into a PvE guild and farm brutally difficult PvE content which they don't want to play and they will quit the guild once they got their stuff. Locking powercreep gear behind a niche playstyle (and yes, I consider PvE group progress gaming as niche playstyle - not saying that it's a bad thing tho) is such a bad idea.

Gan Xing · September 2017

Can we talk about the Asylum 2H???? DK running 2h will spam that like no tomorrow, gain ulti like nobody's business and then ult...

Kanar · September 2017

Dymence wrote: »

show previous quotes

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

Dymence wrote: »

They are still the strongest for PVE. Being able to put a damage enchant (e.g. shock, fire) actually makes them stronger than before.

Wrong. The damage enchant can be placed on a normal set item and on special weapons, making it irrelevant to comparing the two. The relevant difference for this comparison is that a regular set items can offer a universal, general stat buff while the special weapon now offers only a specific buff to one skill. On most of the special weapons, the modest buffs to a single skill cannot possibly outperform the 4/5 set piece bonuses of standard item set weapons. In order to make the special weapons better, they need to keep their general stat buff intact.

And yet this 'modest' skill buff will always win out against an extra 5 piece.

There's a reason why everyone runs them. And it's not the stat buff. These weapons are on the backbar 90% of the time.

Let that sink in.

So in your world the only vMA weapons are bow and destro? The proposed nerf just puts DW, 2h, restro VMA weapons even further behind because their effect wasn't so powerful and so the added WD was needed to sweeten the deal.

And you're wrong about this change being a buff. Guess what? Infused will no longer buff the VMA effect (hail damage or wall bonus), and doubly the weapon damage is gone so that's not being buffed. Infused will be the worst trait if you actually use the maelstrom ability. Better off with precise or nirn to buff maelstrom effect, but then no infused damage glyph. Further, by your own acknowledgement the VMA weap is on back bar and so a damage glyph will not be triggered so often.

"Stronger than before." haha. Sure. Look at the big picture not just the glyph vs WD debate.

bebynnag · September 2017

can someone let me know when people from the PTS actually start providing feedback so i can read their opinions/comments/observations! thank you in advance

Surak73 · September 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

[*] I can see why you made "imperfect" weapons available because of the uproar of those people who never got their vMA weapons, but the difference between the normal version and the "perfect" version is laughably small. People who do these trial on sleepwalk mode are getting weapons that are virtually identical to "reward" sets.
[/list]

This. At the moment, the difference between perfect and imperfect is roughly a 10%. It's like giving, with Normal MA, a maelstrom staff with +170 spell damage (well, now no more, but just for explaining...) and 1200 additional damage with blockade (instead of +189 and +1341).

Brrrofski · September 2017

Derra wrote: »

show previous quotes

Brrrofski wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

olsborg wrote: »

ssewallb14_ESO wrote: »

The destro seems extremely OP in PvP

You're getting:
8% more damage

reduce target damage by %15

A flame DoT

All with near 100% uptime, from a 1 piece set. This is more than you get from a lot of full 5 piece sets.

Something like 100% chance to apply 1 of the 3 effects every 4/5 seconds would be a lot more balanced.

What he said. Period.

Any decent build already has 100% uptime on maim and 50+% uptime on concussed.

With an imperfect asylum weapon you have ~70% uptime on maim, burning and concussed at the cost of a) a 5p bonus or b) 2p undaunted bonus
With a perfect asylum weapon i managed roughly 90% uptime (but not many players will be able to get them in the first place - i do take issue in locking gear that is relevant for pvp behind 12 man vet pve content).
You trade burning and minimally higher concussed uptime to a 5p setbonus or undaunted.

Master bow, asylum 2h, master daggers and maelstrom 1h shield all offer equally compelling choices compared to the asylum destro.
Stop acting like the builds would not get the statuseffects right now.

A sorc is not getting 100% uptime on maim. Most don't use wizards, even if they do, it's not 100%. Same with concussed. Mostly they use fire staff. Only lightning damage if mages wrath and the one part of crushing shock. Streak too now and then.

wizard is a 15s debuff. it´s very much 100% uptime when the enemy should have the intention to attack and kill you and it´s on every attacker.
Shadowrend is ~90% on its target.

Staff attacks don´t procc elemental effects at all. Only the enchantment does.

I get between 30 and 90% uptime on concussed currently depending on the build i´m using. It´s always a flame staff used.

Edit: I´m posting these numbers because i review all of my pvp fights with combatmetrics. I can actually see how much uptime of specific debuffs/buffs i had in pvp encounters.
Posting out of a gutfeeling won´t help make a point.

So to achieve that uptime on maim, you are using 9 pieces of armor. Now you can use 1. See the point people are making? I run wizards on my templar, definitely not 100% uptime.

And frankly, I don't know why a sorc is running wizards. Shields make you tanky enough not to need it. There's a lot of better options. 2 sustain sets and damage glyphs is just way better.

Dymence · September 2017

Kanar wrote: »

show previous quotes

Dymence wrote: »

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

Dymence wrote: »

They are still the strongest for PVE. Being able to put a damage enchant (e.g. shock, fire) actually makes them stronger than before.

Wrong. The damage enchant can be placed on a normal set item and on special weapons, making it irrelevant to comparing the two. The relevant difference for this comparison is that a regular set items can offer a universal, general stat buff while the special weapon now offers only a specific buff to one skill. On most of the special weapons, the modest buffs to a single skill cannot possibly outperform the 4/5 set piece bonuses of standard item set weapons. In order to make the special weapons better, they need to keep their general stat buff intact.

And yet this 'modest' skill buff will always win out against an extra 5 piece.

There's a reason why everyone runs them. And it's not the stat buff. These weapons are on the backbar 90% of the time.

Let that sink in.

So in your world the only vMA weapons are bow and destro? The proposed nerf just puts DW, 2h, restro VMA weapons even further behind because their effect wasn't so powerful and so the added WD was needed to sweeten the deal.

And you're wrong about this change being a buff. Guess what? Infused will no longer buff the VMA effect (hail damage or wall bonus), and doubly the weapon damage is gone so that's not being buffed. Infused will be the worst trait if you actually use the maelstrom ability. Better off with precise or nirn to buff maelstrom effect, but then no infused damage glyph. Further, by your own acknowledgement the VMA weap is on back bar and so a damage glyph will not be triggered so often.

"Stronger than before." haha. Sure. Look at the big picture not just the glyph vs WD debate.

The bow is getting a slight nerf through infused not affecting it anymore, but stamina is getting more buffs this patch anyways with Master and Asylum dual wield.

A vMA staff will be buffed as a damage enchant will proc at least twice when you swap to backbar to refresh dots, which outweighs 189 spell damage that generally isn't active by far.

Most of the other weapons just aren't gonna see any use because they're not good by design. Having a stat on it wouldn't change that.

code65536 · September 2017

As a compromise for people worried about the small difference between perfect and imperfect...

Why not make the special effect the same between perfect and imperfect and add the 1p stat bonus (but reduce it somewhat--129 SD instead of 189 SD, for example) to the perfect version? Gives imperfect and perfect a greater distinction and lets people have 1p weapons with passive stat bonuses.

SodanTok · September 2017

code65536 wrote: »

As a compromise for people worried about the small difference between perfect and imperfect...

Why not make the special effect the same between perfect and imperfect and add the 1p stat bonus (but reduce it somewhat--129 SD instead of 189 SD, for example) to the perfect version? Gives imperfect and perfect a greater distinction and lets people have 1p weapons with passive stat bonuses.

Thats not compromise. PVP players farmed VMA for these stats. Try to tell them now the weapon they have are useless and they have to farm pve hard mode veteran trial...

Masel · September 2017

dpencil1 wrote: »

The visual effect on Force Shock using the Asylum Destro staff is AMAZING!!!

It really is! Looks awesome.

Masel · September 2017

Dymence wrote: »

show previous quotes

Kanar wrote: »

Dymence wrote: »

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

Dymence wrote: »

They are still the strongest for PVE. Being able to put a damage enchant (e.g. shock, fire) actually makes them stronger than before.

Wrong. The damage enchant can be placed on a normal set item and on special weapons, making it irrelevant to comparing the two. The relevant difference for this comparison is that a regular set items can offer a universal, general stat buff while the special weapon now offers only a specific buff to one skill. On most of the special weapons, the modest buffs to a single skill cannot possibly outperform the 4/5 set piece bonuses of standard item set weapons. In order to make the special weapons better, they need to keep their general stat buff intact.

And yet this 'modest' skill buff will always win out against an extra 5 piece.

There's a reason why everyone runs them. And it's not the stat buff. These weapons are on the backbar 90% of the time.

Let that sink in.

So in your world the only vMA weapons are bow and destro? The proposed nerf just puts DW, 2h, restro VMA weapons even further behind because their effect wasn't so powerful and so the added WD was needed to sweeten the deal.

And you're wrong about this change being a buff. Guess what? Infused will no longer buff the VMA effect (hail damage or wall bonus), and doubly the weapon damage is gone so that's not being buffed. Infused will be the worst trait if you actually use the maelstrom ability. Better off with precise or nirn to buff maelstrom effect, but then no infused damage glyph. Further, by your own acknowledgement the VMA weap is on back bar and so a damage glyph will not be triggered so often.

"Stronger than before." haha. Sure. Look at the big picture not just the glyph vs WD debate.

The bow is getting a slight nerf through infused not affecting it anymore, but stamina is getting more buffs this patch anyways with Master and Asylum dual wield.

A vMA staff will be buffed as a damage enchant will proc at least twice when you swap to backbar to refresh dots, which outweighs 189 spell damage that generally isn't active by far.

Most of the other weapons just aren't gonna see any use because they're not good by design. Having a stat on it wouldn't change that.

Master Dual wield+2 5p Sets is worse than Support set + Velidreth + Automaton for example.... I tested it a lot last night and today, and i was always behind the old 5+5+Monster Set Builds.

Murador178 · September 2017

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

First of all, thanks a lot for letting imperfect weapons drop from normal mode (still think something similar to vdsa would be good, not sure about vma because it's solo content and therefore much easier to complete than difficult group content).

My feedback to some of the weapons so far (speaking out of PvP view):

vDSA dual wield: Increasing the tick by 1500 is way over the top, that's a ridiculous amount, I've got hit by 3k tick crits on PTS from rendering slashes (don't forget that these 1500 go right through all your armor because it's considered as a bleed).

Asylum Destrostaff: This weapon gets a lot of hate at the moment but it's too early to judge about it in my opinion. People forget that sorcs already have access to these effects. Also sorcs don't have access to a restoration staff with a good skill synergy (it would be different if there would be a resto staff which boosts healing ward - once we get new weapons I can already say that skills like healing ward, uppercut etc can easily make up for balance problems as well).

Asylum Bow: This weapon is gimmick and looks interesting actually (I thought it will be completely garbage in the beginning). Not sure yet what to think about it.

Asylum Dual Wield: Seems pretty good actually (for PvE mostly).

Asylum 2h: Seems to be also quite good.

Asylum Restostaff: Probably not gonna be used much simply because the skill it buffs is unpopular.

Asylum SnB: Don't know if it's worth it, even if you use this skill since you give up 5-5-2 set combination.

After all I think that these weapons are good. It definitely boosts setups which use staffs, bows and 2h weapons since they have much harder time to achieve a setcombination of 2 monstersets and 2 5p sets like sword and board and dual wield builds can easily achieve and are dominating in the current meta (well dual wield isn't unless you run bleedbuilds but SnB is so incredible strong - speaking out of pvp view).

show previous quotes

Inig0 wrote: »

PLEASE @ZOS_GinaBruno Suggest a change to how the aslyum weapons drop. The fact that you can get them on normal is a slap in the face to the endgame community and it just promotes casual play with no incentive to get into at the very least vet version to get VET REWARDS. Asylum weapons are very powerful and should be earned in VETERAN CONTENT. The same way maelstrom weapons are earned in veteran content. Please reconsider this aspect of their drop chance.

Alright, PvE progress players shall rule the world. Let us please drop best in slot PvE gear from PvP then, because PvP players also need to play PvE for best in slot PvP gear Lets also ignore that ESO isn't about gear progression at all.
This is not vMSA which is solo content, you need a PvE guild (most likely) to farm 12 people vet trial content. What do you think will people who are interested in these weapons do? I'll tell you, they will get into a PvE guild and farm brutally difficult PvE content which they don't want to play and they will quit the guild once they got their stuff. Locking powercreep gear behind a niche playstyle (and yes, I consider PvE group progress gaming as niche playstyle - not saying that it's a bad thing tho) is such a bad idea.

We could make a weekly 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, 4v4, battleground modes elmenintation tournament. Winner gets a random weapon drop thats by FAR best in slot in PvE. I will cry than if there i an easier way to get the weaons for PvE players!!!

For the more casual player base at AR rank 50 u get a random drop of ONE weapon - so nobody says it cant be grinded.