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ESO has a terrible first impression to new comer
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Slick_007✭✭✭✭✭
✭Not everybody has to like this game. If ESO is not your type of game there is no amount of guidance that will change it. And not everybody likes MMOs to begin with.
The game shows you where the skills are and how to use them. If you still resort to spamming light attacks then you're simply not trying.
i thought about this light attack thing today. its due to dolmens. newbies get told repeatedly that they should just dolmen bot.
but you wont learn how to play? and the dolmen botter response is but they already know
no, no they dont know how to play their class. if they did, they wouldnt be asking about the dolmens in the first place. they'd be there, or be elsewhere already.
so the biggest issue is people who cant play teaching the noobs to repeat light attack over and over at a dolmen and thats how the game works. and then these same people complain when those noobs get in a group and light attack.
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Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭"please@Wrobel @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert Please do something about this. Teaching new players isn't a hard work. On the other hand, first impression is so important, and you're failing this aspect big time.
Are you serious?
"do something, people refuse their abilities"
When people expect Skyrim online and don't get it, it's their own problem.
When people get an ability bar with useful skills to be filled and rather do light attacks only, like in skyrim, it's also their problem.
What do you expect ZOS to do? To make a red blinking System message on the screen, after 10 consecutive light attacks, which says "Please use an ability"
If people just used some of their braincells, they would come to the conclusion themselves, that the left mouse button isn't the whole combat system.
The issue is either their ignorance, or that they expected something else
In my opinion Skyrim blows, so I'm glad ESO is very different to it
This is what I call a "comfort zone". When people tries something new, they don't usually have the mind set for new stuffs. They'll be playing new games within their comfort zone. And of course, for those players, their comfort zones are other TES games, such as Skyrim. If you want to grow your business, and want to do something new, you should better be prepare to have some kind of way to break people's comfort zone. It's called marketing 101. If you can make the game, you can at least explain your game.0 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭FloppyTouch wrote: »Never played an MMORPG that explained anything at all I don't know where this is coming from. At the start they might show you what skill points are or ur first abilities but that about it.
Could you imagine how long the the beginning would be if they had to explain everything about gear dps healing tanking. I would quit so fast out of boredom.
Like 5 to 10 minutes? There're guides on Youtube for those.
Also, ZOS don't need to explain everything, that would leave nothing to be desired. But at least explain the core gameplay mechanic and what new comers should be excited about.1 -
Huyen✭✭✭✭✭
✭Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »If you think ESO has it bad, you should see SWTOR. Funnily enough, even with the bad reviews, SWTOR is arguably at its peak right now.
I don't see how you can conclude that going from over 400 Servers at launch (200+ in both the US and Europe) to just 17 servers now, the majority of which are only Lightly Populated, and constant calls on the Forums for MORE Server Mergers, as being "arguably at its peak". There's no argument to be had - it ISN'T anywhere close to its peak.
SWTOR is in decline, another patch of no better quality than the last two and it will be in free fall.
The new lead Producer has failed to capitalise on the good-will he was given by the player-base for replacing the bumbling idiot Ben Irving, and rather that reversing the worst of Irving's choices on game direction is intent on seeing them through to their logical conclusion - which almost everyone except Bioware understands is the closing of the servers.
If Keith had delivered even 30% of the vision he was promoting in his introductory post as SWTOR Lead Producer he may have managed to turn this ice-berg destined ship around, but in reality he hasn't even managed 10%.
All The Best
Any MMO is in decline right now, as the focus has changed from providing a good game to making as much money as possible in a short amount of time without any regard to the players. And it gets punished pretty hard atm. Upside of ESO is that you dont have to sub like most other mmo's have. And the ones that are free are 100% pay-to-win, wich isnt what people want either.Huyen Shadowpaw, dedicated nightblade tank - PS4 (Retired)
Huyen Swiftpaw, nightblade dps - PC EU (Retired)
Huyen Lightpaw, templar healer - PC EU (Retired)
Huyen Swiftpaw, necromancer dps - PC EU (Retired)
Huyen Swiftpaw, dragonknight (no defined role yet)
"Failure is only the opportunity to begin again. Only this time, more wisely" - Uncle Iroh1 -
Gandrhulf_Harbard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Any MMO is in decline right now, as the focus has changed from providing a good game to making as much money as possible in a short amount of time without any regard to the players. And it gets punished pretty hard atm. Upside of ESO is that you dont have to sub like most other mmo's have. And the ones that are free are 100% pay-to-win, wich isnt what people want either.
I agree with this 100%.
Both SWTOR and ESO suffer greatly in terms of player retention and satisfaction in having far too much development emphasis and resources spent on their respective Gambling Stores and no where near enough emphasis on solid, interesting, well executed content.
Now in both ESO and SWTOR I enjoy both Housing and Crafting a lot, and so playing ESO without a Sub is pretty much a non-starter for me. So I am currently subbed. I was subbed in SWTOR too, as I am a firm believer that if I want and expect that "solid, interesting and well executed content" then it has to be paid for somehow.
On the flip side I will never buy a Gambling Crate in this game of SWTOR. Bought a few in SWTOR in the early days, learned my lesson about playing rigged games of chance.
Both ESO and SWTOR could make a LOT more money out of me if they would just put things on the store for sale at reasonable prices. Last time I played ESO I had no issue with buying 20k Crowns to get something I really wanted - I was messing about a lot with Housing. But I'll not spend a single Crown (not even the free ones from my Sub) on a gambling crate chance to get nothing I want.
I'm here in ESO right now because I enjoy the game-world and gameplay of ESO more than I do Star Wars; that will likely change at some point - usually around Xmas, I'm of that generation where Xmas means Star Wars - and I'll head back to SWTOR for a month or two, and then cycle back here.
A regular progressive content release in either game would likely see mu sub for a year though. SWTOR tried it with KOTFE/ET but the gameplay was so awful and the story so full of holes I'd rather east my own shoes than play through it again.
All The Best
Those memories come back to haunt me, they haunt me like a curse.
Is a dream a lie if it don't come true, or is it something worse.0 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.2 -
IwakuraLain42✭✭✭✭✭Yes the did and still does a terrible job at explaining itself in the game, even with new tutorial. If you want to an example of a good tutorial play ff14 for some time. This is a mmo with the same complexity as TESO and it explains every little detail while playing the game.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.
If you would bother to read it explains synergies, and everything about combat as well, it is pretty clear you do not like the game and no matter how much you are shown the instructions you will still complain.Edited by Jade1986 on September 17, 2017 11:16AM4 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭IwakuraLain42 wrote: »Yes the did and still does a terrible job at explaining itself in the game, even with new tutorial. If you want to an example of a good tutorial play ff14 for some time. This is a mmo with the same complexity as TESO and it explains every little detail while playing the game.
I played ff14, the whole beginner area. And what you are saying is just not true. Bad ZoS for expecting people to read.1 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.
If you would bother to read it explains synergies, and everything about combat as well, it is pretty clear you do not like the game and no matter how much you are shown the instructions you will still complain. Gj.
What are you even talking about at this point? I have 8 toons with over 3000 hours of gaming. I'm making this thread so that ESO can have a much more friendly and overall better experience for new comers. What you're trying to do is just blindly defending ZOS for their mistake, and preventing the game from its full potential. Good job.0 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.
If you would bother to read it explains synergies, and everything about combat as well, it is pretty clear you do not like the game and no matter how much you are shown the instructions you will still complain. Gj.
What are you even talking about at this point? I have 8 toons with over 3000 hours of gaming. I'm making this thread so that ESO can have a much more friendly and overall better experience for new comersIwakuraLain42 wrote: »Yes the did and still does a terrible job at explaining itself in the game, even with new tutorial. If you want to an example of a good tutorial play ff14 for some time. This is a mmo with the same complexity as TESO and it explains every little detail while playing the game.
I played ff14, the whole beginner area. And what you are saying is just not true. Bad ZoS for expecting people to read.
What to read? There's nothing useful to read. There's only a bunch of useless texts explaining things that anyone who plays MMORPG should have known.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.
If you would bother to read it explains synergies, and everything about combat as well, it is pretty clear you do not like the game and no matter how much you are shown the instructions you will still complain. Gj.
What are you even talking about at this point? I have 8 toons with over 3000 hours of gaming. I'm making this thread so that ESO can have a much more friendly and overall better experience for new comers. What you're trying to do is just blindly defending ZOS for their mistake, and preventing the game from its full potential. Good job.
Your original complaint was how ZoS does a bad job at explaining basic combat mechanics, the availablity of pvp, etc. I showed you they didn't. Then you complain about non mmo players not knowing basic mmo mechanics, so I showed you how they explain that too, then you say those are basic mmo mechanics and everyone should know them. You also complained that the beginning was too boring, and i explained how it used to be more difficult / fun (imo) and everyone complained, the very player you are trying to defend atm, complained about the more engaging beginning. Get out of here, you are complaining for the sake of complaining now. ZoS has listened to the "new" player base for a while now. I have been saying since the get go we need a animation cancelling tutorial, but really, that is it. If I see something that really is a problem, like the ever lasting bugs for certain classes, or the bad framerate issue, or the horrible servers, I will be the first to criticize, but what you are describing is not a problem.Edited by Jade1986 on September 17, 2017 11:21AM8 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle?
Animation cancelling is ESO's best selling point ? Are you for real ? Animation canceling is an advanced technique, not even intended by design, that's only relevant for say 1% of the population (and 1% or even less of the content).
The "just like all other MMORPGs" part is also irrelevant. The issue here is the retention of players who are completely new to MMOs, new to group play, and/or expecting Skyrim-online.
Also, ESO is NOT designed as a competitive game. Therefore the tutorials are meant to explain the combat systems, different types of skills, zones, delves and enemies. They are not supposed to teach anyone how to "git gud" because you don't have to "be gud" to play ESO and complete the quests. It would scare the hell out of most new players.9 -
SwimsWithMemes✭✭✭✭This game has a very trash new player start. There is nothing reasonably challenging for experienced players to attempt until level 10 (PvP) and they are gimped there until they unlock the 2nd weapon bar.
Co-op questing is ridiculously garbage. There is no way to tell if the quest you are on has been shared successfully, and a bunch of quests are actually detrimental trying to do with friends. (In particular the "gather 10 relics" type of quest), where sometimes you share an objective count, and other times you do not. In game puzzles are also poorly designed, some of them open a door for both players if completed, other times each player has to do it.2 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭strebor2095 wrote: »This game has a very trash new player start. There is nothing reasonably challenging for experienced players to attempt until level 10 (PvP) and they are gimped there until they unlock the 2nd weapon bar.
Co-op questing is ridiculously garbage. There is no way to tell if the quest you are on has been shared successfully, and a bunch of quests are actually detrimental trying to do with friends. (In particular the "gather 10 relics" type of quest), where sometimes you share an objective count, and other times you do not. In game puzzles are also poorly designed, some of them open a door for both players if completed, other times each player has to do it.
Again the beginning being too easy is a result of skyrim esque players complaining about the beginning areas being too hard at launch. The other things you said are legitimate grievances that have not been addressed since the get go.3 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle?
Animation cancelling is ESO's best selling point ? Are you for real ? Animation canceling is an advanced technique, not even intended by design, that's only relevant for say 1% of the population (and 1% or even less of the content).
The "just like all other MMORPGs" part is also irrelevant. The issue here is the retention of players who are completely new to MMOs, new to group play, and/or expecting Skyrim-online.
Also, ESO is NOT designed as a competitive game. Therefore the tutorials are meant to explain the combat systems, different types of skills, zones, delves and enemies. They are not supposed to teach anyone how to "git gud" because you don't have to "be gud" to play ESO and complete the quests. It would scare the hell out of most new players.
Actually animation canceling is intended. Please do some research first.
Also, if you don't explain about your unique features, then why the hell should people buy ESO in the first place?
If you just want dungeons, World PvP and small scale PvP, just go play GW2. And it's free.
But if you want to play a game with high ceiling skills gameplay, vast about of gears and diversity@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.
If you would bother to read it explains synergies, and everything about combat as well, it is pretty clear you do not like the game and no matter how much you are shown the instructions you will still complain. Gj.
What are you even talking about at this point? I have 8 toons with over 3000 hours of gaming. I'm making this thread so that ESO can have a much more friendly and overall better experience for new comers. What you're trying to do is just blindly defending ZOS for their mistake, and preventing the game from its full potential. Good job.
Your original complaint was how ZoS does a bad job at explaining basic combat mechanics, the availablity of pvp, etc. I showed you they didn't. Then you complain about non mmo players not knowing basic mmo mechanics, so I showed you how they explain that too, then you say those are basic mmo mechanics and everyone should know them. You also complained that the beginning was too boring, and i explained how it used to be more difficult / fun (imo) and everyone complained, the very player you are trying to defend atm, complained about the more engaging beginning. Get out of here, you are complaining for the sake of complaining now. ZoS has listened to the "new" player base for a while now. I have been saying since the get go we need a animation cancelling tutorial, but really, that is it. If I see something that really is a problem, like the ever lasting bugs for certain classes, or the bad framerate issue, or the horrible servers, I will be the first to criticize, but what you are describing is not a problem.
And your "explanation" shows nothing, since there're nothing valuable to be show to begin with. What you shown is the basic of the basics that everyone would know. I'll not get out of here just because of a blind man tell me to. Sure, the game has tons of problems, but obviously, I don't need to say anything about them anymore, since there're nothing left for me to say. What I want to say though, is what people are misunderstood.
People like yourself see the game as a veteran, someone who has already been in the game for so long, it has become your 2nd life. I'm making this thread base on new comers perspective, from people online, and friends offline that have tried and failed to understand the game. I'm making this thread in order for ZOS to see how they can improve upon themselves. If my point reach ZOS, new comers will have a much better experience than ever.
On the other hand, your argument will resolve into nothing. ZOS won't appreciate you for defending their mistake, new comers will still have a lackcluster opening hours. No body wins.
So seriously, what are you trying to archive? You can't show me anything new, or teach me anything, since I've already know and read everything ingame before making this thread. Just stop. Please. You're preventing the game from evolve to its full potential, and it hurts everyone. It hurts new comers, me, ZOS, and even yourself. So stop.0 -
Gandrhulf_Harbard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Actually animation canceling is intended. Please do some research first.
No.
It was not intended, it was not designed in from the get go.
It was however "accepted" by ZOS because despite initially trying they could not find a way to prevent it, and they conceded it made for a more interesting combat dynamic.
All The BestEdited by Gandrhulf_Harbard on September 17, 2017 11:59AMThose memories come back to haunt me, they haunt me like a curse.
Is a dream a lie if it don't come true, or is it something worse.11 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Actually animation canceling is intended. Please do some research first.
Nope, it isn't intended. It's accepted/tolerated/turned into a feature.
You do the research.you don't explain about your unique features, then why the hell should people buy ESO in the first place?.../...What you shown is the basic of the basics that everyone would know.
You pretend to put yourself in the shoes of a completely new player, yet you assume these new players already know everything about MMOs.
ESO isn't your typical MMO, and people join the game for many different reasons, of which I suspect the MMO keyword is of minor importance. People join because beautiful, because medieval fantasy, because play how you want, because Elder Scrolls and because Skyrim. They know nothing about MMOs and don't care much about combat. They're shy about guilds and multiplayer and they're scared of anything competitive.
There's A LOT ESO has to offer that isn't combat related at all, nor MMO related.
You are completely mislead when you think you understand new players.
Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on September 17, 2017 12:00PM8 -
Tabbycat✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I knew there were tutorial hints but I didn't even know the help section was that in depth.
Learn something new everyday.Founder and Co-GM of The Psijic Order Guild (NA)
0.016%3 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Actually animation canceling is intended. Please do some research first.
Nope, it isn't intended. It's accepted/tolerated/turned into a feature.
You do the research.you don't explain about your unique features, then why the hell should people buy ESO in the first place?.../...What you shown is the basic of the basics that everyone would know.
You pretend to put yourself in the shoes of a completely new player, yet you assume these new players already know everything about MMOs.
ESO isn't your typical MMO, and people join the game for many different reasons, of which I suspect the MMO keyword is of minor importance. People join because beautiful, because medieval fantasy, because play how you want, because Elder Scrolls and because Skyrim. They know nothing about MMOs and don't care much about combat. They're shy about guilds and multiplayer and they're scared of anything competitive.
There's A LOT ESO has to offer that isn't combat related at all, nor MMO related.
You are completely mislead when you think you understand new players.
Or I can just ask new players about their knowledge about mmorpg.
Here's what they say: "Dungeons, Raid, PvP, WvW, loot grind".
Basically they describe WOW, GW2, and yes, ESO. I have a new players guide guild, I know what I'm talking about.
About the animation canceling, it's unsure, some say 1 way, some say another I can't be sure about its origin, but what I know is that It is now a feature of the game, and it's a damn good feature that needs more praise.0 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭Gandrhulf_Harbard wrote: »Actually animation canceling is intended. Please do some research first.
No.
It was not intended, it was not designed in from the get go.
It was however "accepted" by ZOS because despite initially trying they could not find a way to prevent it, and they conceded it made for a more interesting combat dynamic.
All The Best
Well thank god they didn't changed it. It's a good feature0 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Or I can just ask new players about their knowledge about mmorpg.
Here's what they say: "Dungeons, Raid, PvP, WvW, loot grind".
Basically they describe WOW, GW2, and yes, ESO. I have a new players guide guild, I know what I'm talking about.
You are biased.
You don't ask "new players", you ask "new players who have joined your new players' guild". A new player who straight up joins a guild is a new player who's familiar with MMOs.
A new player that isn't familiar with MMOs and comes from TES/Skyrim games will NOT join any guild until much, much later in the game, either because of need or because of curiosity.
2 -
Pr0Skygon✭✭✭✭✭anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Or I can just ask new players about their knowledge about mmorpg.
Here's what they say: "Dungeons, Raid, PvP, WvW, loot grind".
Basically they describe WOW, GW2, and yes, ESO. I have a new players guide guild, I know what I'm talking about.
You are biased.
You don't ask "new players", you ask "new players who have joined your new players' guild". A new player who straight up joins a guild is a new player who's familiar with MMOs.
A new player that isn't familiar with MMOs and comes from TES/Skyrim games will NOT join any guild until much, much later in the game, either because of need or because of curiosity.
I think you're missing the point.
If the players that are familiar with MMOs, and even those guys are confused by the ESO, then you know something is wrong.
As for player who has never played MMOs, then I know a few friend of mine, which I invited to play, including my brother, who's sitting next to me right now. And you know what he said? "I have no idea why you love this game, there're no goal to archive, mediocre story, boring combat. Overall worse than Skyrim."
Also, I might find me on Steam review of ESO, where I ask tons of question from new players, before decide to make this thread.0 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I knew there were tutorial hints but I didn't even know the help section was that in depth.
Learn something new everyday.
it used to be pretty bare bones to be fair. It is very well thought out now. I was a huge vocal critic of how it used to be.anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle?
Animation cancelling is ESO's best selling point ? Are you for real ? Animation canceling is an advanced technique, not even intended by design, that's only relevant for say 1% of the population (and 1% or even less of the content).
The "just like all other MMORPGs" part is also irrelevant. The issue here is the retention of players who are completely new to MMOs, new to group play, and/or expecting Skyrim-online.
Also, ESO is NOT designed as a competitive game. Therefore the tutorials are meant to explain the combat systems, different types of skills, zones, delves and enemies. They are not supposed to teach anyone how to "git gud" because you don't have to "be gud" to play ESO and complete the quests. It would scare the hell out of most new players.
Actually animation canceling is intended. Please do some research first.
Also, if you don't explain about your unique features, then why the hell should people buy ESO in the first place?
If you just want dungeons, World PvP and small scale PvP, just go play GW2. And it's free.
But if you want to play a game with high ceiling skills gameplay, vast about of gears and diversity@laced So basically if all MMORPG are boring at first, then no MMORPG should improve upon that disadvantage? Really? This is why American still can't have a woman president. "Since it has always been like that, why should we be better?" It's called "evolve", and that's how we should always thrive forward.
Did you really compare the systematic oppression of women in the United states to a video game strategy which is tried and true? The beginnings of mmos are always boring because they are supposed to be super easy to let gamers get the hang of the game. If they make it super intricate and complex people would complain about that. And honestly, if you look at the beginning now vs the beginning when the game first came out, it is EONS more interesting. Hell, they even changed the dialogue options and some of the cinematics.
I stopped reading at the part "The beginning of MMOs are always boring". That's anti - consumer at best, and lazy at worst. If you're in this kind of industry, where imagination and innovative take the lead, this kind of thinking is unacceptable.
Wanna hear a story about innovation? Most RPG games in late 2000s tried to be as friendly and easy for new players as much as they can. Then came Dark Souls, and now we have 3 Dark Souls, 1 Bloodborne, a samurai Dark Souls called Nioh, a Sci fi called The Surge and an upcoming vampire Dark Souls called Code Veil. So please never say "The beginning of MMOs are always boring" ever again. It's not wrong, for now, but this is pure anti - innovative, and I despite it.
Dark souls is not an mmo, by any measure. It is a coop game. And people would flee in droves if any mmo was that difficult at first. There is a difference between difficult, and masochistic. That is what dark souls is for. Again, this is not an coop single player game, it is a mmorpg. Also, you clearly were not here at launch, when overland mobs were much much more difficult, and people were complain en masse about how difficult the beginning of the game was. So clearly, the majority did not want that. I wouldnt mind having more difficult beginnings, but this is a generational problem. And if you stop reading just because you dont agree with something - that - is the problem now adays with everything.
I think missing the point. I've never said that Dark Souls is an mmo, not by a long shot. What i'm saying is never ever put a whole genre of games into a stereotype. Such as "mmos will always be boring at first". Or "Shooter games are only for hardcore" (ahem, Overwatch). Or "Early access games are all cheap and lazily made" (ahem, PUBG). Or even "Stealth game will never catch on and become a thing" (said Konami executives, when Kojima told them about Metal Gear Solid).
Again, the beginning of ESO, at launch, was more difficult, so much so people were dying constantly from overland mobs of 3-4. People complained, -alot-, and it was changed at some point.
As for your comment about a "lacking" explanation of combat, please try again.
Literally the only thing missing is an explanation of animation cancelling, which I have said we need for a long time, but a simple " how did x player kill me so fast " communication to other players would get an explanation quickly.
You're missing the point, again. I've never said anything about ESO's difficulty for new comers, I'm merely talking about ZOS and how they poorly explain their own game.
Also, are you kidding me with those feeds? "Well we have dungeons, mini dungeons, ultimate skills and weapon/armor enchant, just like all others mmorpg". Really? That's it? Just those basics? Not animation canceling, your game's best selling point? Not even skills rotation and combos, those of which gives PvE and PvP the meter to measure how good you are? Or even how gears are categorized into different sets, and those sets will determine your playstyle? Or even how to farm those sets, where to farm those sets. They don't even explain how Major and Minor buffs with the same name cannot be stack upon each other with the same type of Major or Minor. Stop trying to defend ZOS from their poor job, please. Accept the fact that new comers are in blind, and force ZOS to do a better job explaining their own game. You're not helping the game by defending it, but hurting it by being so full of forgiveness.
If you would bother to read it explains synergies, and everything about combat as well, it is pretty clear you do not like the game and no matter how much you are shown the instructions you will still complain. Gj.
What are you even talking about at this point? I have 8 toons with over 3000 hours of gaming. I'm making this thread so that ESO can have a much more friendly and overall better experience for new comers. What you're trying to do is just blindly defending ZOS for their mistake, and preventing the game from its full potential. Good job.
Your original complaint was how ZoS does a bad job at explaining basic combat mechanics, the availablity of pvp, etc. I showed you they didn't. Then you complain about non mmo players not knowing basic mmo mechanics, so I showed you how they explain that too, then you say those are basic mmo mechanics and everyone should know them. You also complained that the beginning was too boring, and i explained how it used to be more difficult / fun (imo) and everyone complained, the very player you are trying to defend atm, complained about the more engaging beginning. Get out of here, you are complaining for the sake of complaining now. ZoS has listened to the "new" player base for a while now. I have been saying since the get go we need a animation cancelling tutorial, but really, that is it. If I see something that really is a problem, like the ever lasting bugs for certain classes, or the bad framerate issue, or the horrible servers, I will be the first to criticize, but what you are describing is not a problem.
And your "explanation" shows nothing, since there're nothing valuable to be show to begin with. What you shown is the basic of the basics that everyone would know. I'll not get out of here just because of a blind man tell me to. Sure, the game has tons of problems, but obviously, I don't need to say anything about them anymore, since there're nothing left for me to say. What I want to say though, is what people are misunderstood.
People like yourself see the game as a veteran, someone who has already been in the game for so long, it has become your 2nd life. I'm making this thread base on new comers perspective, from people online, and friends offline that have tried and failed to understand the game. I'm making this thread in order for ZOS to see how they can improve upon themselves. If my point reach ZOS, new comers will have a much better experience than ever.
On the other hand, your argument will resolve into nothing. ZOS won't appreciate you for defending their mistake, new comers will still have a lackcluster opening hours. No body wins.
So seriously, what are you trying to archive? You can't show me anything new, or teach me anything, since I've already know and read everything ingame before making this thread. Just stop. Please. You're preventing the game from evolve to its full potential, and it hurts everyone. It hurts new comers, me, ZOS, and even yourself. So stop.
2nd life? Are you kidding me? I took a 1 year break and a half a year break from this game because I wasnt happy with it, then recently I came back and am much more pleased with it now adays.I am cp 283, which is far from being a huge veteran player. I have never done hardmode dungeons, or trials because I never got any characters geared enough to do so. My life revolves around my transition, exercise, outdoor sports, and music. This is a fun little hobby of mine. I have literally debunked all your complaints through screen shots, and then every time you find something else to call the whambulance about. Good grief.3 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I think the only thing ZOS have to provide in a tutorial is a simple guide to the basics so as to enable you to get started, and the present tutorial does a decent job in that respect.
The things the OP is complaining about would overload any tutorial and don't relate to the main leveling content. He's talking primarily about group content in dungeons etc, and that's something that groups themselves should assist newcomers with. Sadly, judging by the past threads on this forum, the game is full of elite MMO "veterans" whose only approach to someone struggling in a group is to kick him from the group.
ZOS can only do so much to prepare the new player for what's ahead of him, other players have to do their bit too whether it's in a group, in a guild, in chat, or here on the forums.
Where I do agree with the OP is that ESO is more prone to these problems than most other MMORPGs because by its every nature it attracts players new to MMOs and whose only previous experience is the single-player TES series or similar single -player CRPGs. That simply means there's a greater onus on all of us to help them rather than humiliate them.3 -
Jade1986✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I think the only thing ZOS have to provide in a tutorial is a simple guide to the basics so as to enable you to get started, and the present tutorial does a decent job in that respect.
The things the OP is complaining about would overload any tutorial and don't relate to the main leveling content. He's talking primarily about group content in dungeons etc, and that's something that groups themselves should assist newcomers with. Sadly, judging by the past threads on this forum, the game is full of elite MMO "veterans" whose only approach to someone struggling in a group is to kick him from the group.
ZOS can only do so much to prepare the new player for what's ahead of him, other players have to do their bit too whether it's in a group, in a guild, in chat, or here on the forums.
Where I do agree with the OP is that ESO is more prone to these problems than most other MMORPGs because by its every nature it attracts players new to MMOs and whose only previous experience is the single-player TES series or similar single -player CRPGs. That simply means there's a greater onus on all of us to help them rather than humiliate them.
I agree with that, but the in game help menu explains all of it pretty in depth.2 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If the players that are familiar with MMOs, and even those guys are confused by the ESO, then you know something is wrong.
Well, we disagree.
I would say that if the guys familiar to MMOs are confused by ESO, it means that those guys are too close-minded. ESO isn't "your typical MMO" and they should not expect to find their classical MMO stuff in ESO. Just like the Skyrim crowd should be more open minded and not expect ESO to be 100% "Skyrim2" .As for player who has never played MMOs, then I know a few friend of mine, which I invited to play, including my brother, who's sitting next to me right now. And you know what he said? "I have no idea why you love this game, there're no goal to archive, mediocre story, boring combat. Overall worse than Skyrim."
Apparently your brother already didn't enjoy Skyrim, and he doesn't mention art, landscape, world, lore and exploration. So yeah, no wonder he's not thrilled. ESO is simply not a game for him - you can't please everyone and you don't have to.Also, I might find me on Steam review of ESO, where I ask tons of question from new players, before decide to make this thread.
In my opinion the typical ESO-new-player doesn't read nor write stuff on Steam, has never heard of Angry Joe and doesn't even come onto this forum.
7 -
Slack✭✭✭✭✭"please@Wrobel @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert Please do something about this. Teaching new players isn't a hard work. On the other hand, first impression is so important, and you're failing this aspect big time.
Are you serious?
"do something, people refuse their abilities"
When people expect Skyrim online and don't get it, it's their own problem.
When people get an ability bar with useful skills to be filled and rather do light attacks only, like in skyrim, it's also their problem.
What do you expect ZOS to do? To make a red blinking System message on the screen, after 10 consecutive light attacks, which says "Please use an ability"
If people just used some of their braincells, they would come to the conclusion themselves, that the left mouse button isn't the whole combat system.
The issue is either their ignorance, or that they expected something else
In my opinion Skyrim blows, so I'm glad ESO is very different to it
This is what I call a "comfort zone". When people tries something new, they don't usually have the mind set for new stuffs. They'll be playing new games within their comfort zone. And of course, for those players, their comfort zones are other TES games, such as Skyrim. If you want to grow your business, and want to do something new, you should better be prepare to have some kind of way to break people's comfort zone. It's called marketing 101. If you can make the game, you can at least explain your game.
I think you have already seen the Screenshots of the help-site. It is well explained.
I believe in common sense, when people don't have it or cannot use, on somethign rather trivial like 5 ability slots, then I can't help them and don't even want to.
And if this game doesn't fit into their "comfort zone" then they got to search for something else.
Can't satisfy everyoneEdited by Slack on September 17, 2017 12:49PMPC EU
Betty Breeze - Magwarden
Hunts S'hitblades - Stamplar
Aschavi - Magplar3 -
joaaocaampos✭✭✭✭✭Do those feeds tell you that you can animation cancel? Do those feeds tell you that you should not spam 1 skill only as a dps in dungeons? Do those feeds tell you what the hell does a tank do in dungeon?
@Pr0Skygon
"Animation cancel"
Zenimax hates it! Zenimax will not teach something that was not to happen.
"1 skill spam"
Does Zenimax really have to teach people to use the 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 keys?
"tank"
First, you say it's tedious for beginners to enter a dungeon. Then you want Zenimax to teach you how to be a tank, being a beginner? Tank and healer is not for beginners. How to become a tank or healer? Being a DPS, watching what the tanks and healers do. World of Warcraft was my first MMORPG. And that's how I learned how to play as Tank, DPS and Healer.
However, I agree that ESO is not friendly to noobs. I don't think that's a problem. There are so many MMOs that deliver everything chewed.These are MMOs that I stopped playing just because they made it easier.0
