How To Get All The Kills and Zero Deaths in BG's (No skill required)

Killset · May 2017

HoloYoitsu wrote: »

SleepyTroll wrote: »

Just float around the outside of the real player and run when confronted.

I see you watched my tutorial, OP. Or perhaps you starred in it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol_Tnjv5khY

This video almost single handedly made me not want to play BG's... Hopping around in a circle, while mindlessly spamming Endless Fury, and accidentally hard casting Frags. Sad man.

Killset · May 2017

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Oh no! Endless fury is useful for the first time since release...

It's not the worst execute in bg's we must nerf it because we're still crying about mag sorc's in pvp in 2017.

LOL it's funny how I always see the same cast of characters responding to every perceived "nerf sorc thread" that comes down the pipe. Do you guys like shine a spotlight up in the sky or something? It's impressive. I laugh when I imagine Cyrus Ariya, Rinaldo, Minalan, and you glancing up at the sky then immediately firing up their iPads, phones, and PC's to defend their beloved class.

cschwingeb14_ESO · May 2017

The extra 5% execute threshold is actually very relevant in PvP. It makes kill stealing even easier, because the target has a higher chance of dying once he crosses that threshold and the execute pops.

I think ZoS needs to nerf Fury's kill stealing ability by raising the threshold at which it triggers to 25%, or even 35%. That way the target will probably survive the Fury explosion, and someone else can swoop in and get that kill credit.

Also, ravage health pots need to do more damage so that we can self execute to screw over kill stealers.

/S

GrimJaw · May 2017

Vizier wrote: »

SleepyTroll wrote: »

Just float around the outside of the real player and run when confronted.

This has always been a ridiculously over-performing spell.

Still, it is what it is regarding ranged combat players are just going to have to deal with it until scoring is changed. Should probably spread all points out among the group. Team is a team is a team. I'm actually kind of surprised they don't do that. (haven't played BG yet.)

You sir have no idea what youre talking about if youre going to say its always been a ridiculously over performing skill. Does it perform good now? Heck yeah, and it was long overdue.

Im close to 500 days playtime on my mag sorc. So i know a thing or two about mages wrath.

Malamar1229 · May 2017

When we first heard about BGs I am pretty sure I said "Hey great you guys are finally getting BGs but they better not start balancing classes around small scale Battlegrounds."

Malamar1229 · May 2017

Killset wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Oh no! Endless fury is useful for the first time since release...

It's not the worst execute in bg's we must nerf it because we're still crying about mag sorc's in pvp in 2017.

LOL it's funny how I always see the same cast of characters responding to every perceived "nerf sorc thread" that comes down the pipe. Do you guys like shine a spotlight up in the sky or something? It's impressive. I laugh when I imagine Cyrus Ariya, Rinaldo, Minalan, and you glancing up at the sky then immediately firing up their iPads, phones, and PC's to defend their beloved class.

They get a text from me

RinaldoGandolphi · May 2017

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Endless Fury doesn't always go off though, it can be buggy at times and simply not work at all....have the enemy at 20% and it never explodes(even if pre-casted 2 seconds before that), allowing the target to heal....so its not as reliable.

Prior to the scaling bug with damage % Executes, Nightblades Impale with increased range was the best execute in the game by a long shot....and after the percentage scaling is fixed it will be better then Fury.

Once damage percentage scaling executes are fixed, Impale will be the games best execute.

I have never seen Fury do that. Besides - even if that were the case - that is a bug and you are presenting it as a feature of the execute. If you think it's bugged - submit a ticket and try to get it fixed.
I also don't see how Impale can be better than Fury, but maybe @NightbladeMechanics can shed some light on this.

Bug aside, it's not. Fury has the same range, only 5% lower threshold, can be layered into global cooldowns with other abilities, has no travel time, and most importantly cannot be dodged. Impale also has an ancient bug where it sometimes just doesn't deal damage at all. I would take Fury over Impale 100%.

Rinaldo's posts in this thread show he's clearly biased toward sorcs. That's all.

Thats not true

With the 1.6 Patch they broke Mage's Fury and the execute wouldn't work 3/4th of the time which is why so many Sorc like Xevenex, Myself, and Pixy Stick and others stopped using it all together and it was broken until the Dark Brotherhood Update fixed it(Nearly 2 years)

The undodgeable claim is not entirely true...the "Mage's Fury Explosion" is NOT dodgeable IF your at 20% heath or less at the time of the cast BUT "The initial lighting bolt that does a small amount of damage and puts a debuff on you for 4 seconds" can most certainly be dodged.

Also, Impale is INSTANT(Granted Impale is reflectable), and very animation cancel friendly, Mage's Fury has a "small delay" before the lighting strike happens after casting it. (Even the undodgeable explosion has a slight delay)

To say Fury is better then Impale(When its not bugged) is not really being fair...i'd say Impale is better because 300% more of tooltip damage can end up being more then the static damage of Mage's Fury Explosion making it more likely to kill your target sometimes.

I think there may be some cases where Mage's Fury is better, but as even you pointed out, Impale has the advantage of being able to Animation Canceled, Whereas Mage's Fury has a delay before the lighting strike happens regardless...if your trying to "prime" a target by tagging them with Fury and then Curse to set up burst they can just dodge the lighting strike thus never be tagged....this can be a very big deal on a class designed to kill based on "delayed damage".

Thanks to your Nightblade guide i had a lot of fun on my Mageblade, and in my time playing Mageblade last patch i thought Impale was better then Mage's Fury....Animation Cancel casting that on someone at low health was an instant NUKE and very rarely did anyone ever survive the 1st Impale at low health, Mage's Fury often times takes more then one to finish off the same target.

Regardless, once the damage scaling % bug is fixed, Impale and Mage's Fury could be seen as being tied for the best executes in the game easily.

Waffennacht · May 2017

World of tanks does both killing blow and damage done. Damage done is worth slightly more than KB. I would hate for Sorc to have wrath be nerfed because of BGs.

They just need to adjust values to compensate those whom lose kills.

FYI other executions will be no different than any other killing ability as they are not pre emptive

NightbladeMechanics · May 2017

@RinaldoGandolphi Dark Brotherhood was a year ago. I haven't encountered Fury failing to deal damage in ages, but Impale does still fail sometimes.

We are only talking about the explosion portion being undodgeable. Fury is cast before you combo. Therefore, you can recast it and curse until you get it to land. Impale is cast after your combo, meaning if it's dodged, then your combo has failed, your ult is down, and you have to wait and try again.

And where Curse goes off as the sorc ccs his opponent with frag/streak/an ult, nightblades' Assassin's Will goes off the global cooldown after their cc....and Impale the global cooldown after that. Nightblade combos occupy more global cooldowns than sorc combos, meaning the enemy very literally has to be out of stam and unable to cc break in order for them to not have the opportunity to dodge or block Impale. Meanwhile Fury and Curse both go off instantly with sorcs' ccs. Failure to dodge or block Impale is player error by the target. Failure to dodge or block Fury is a game mechanic. In this way, Fury is foolproof and more user friendly compared to Impale.

There hasn't been a delay after casting Fury for ages. It hits the target the instant your hand twitches, much less raises into the air. People were raging about that back in.....Shadows of the Hist I think? Idk, a long time ago. It's just as friendly to animation cancels as Impale in that there is no animation or delay on either when cancelled properly, too. Roll dodge cancelling them both feels so sweet. The enemy just dies and doesn't see it coming.

Fury's damage feels lacking against tanky people, but I've never had issues executing medium or light armor targets, or heavy armor ones with mid-20k health or so. Impale is helpful against them, but I've always attributed that to nightblade's greater sustained pressure to get them to execute range in the first place.

Even considering that situation, I personally would take Fury over Impale on my nightblade any day for the sole purpose that I can layer it with my combo and never have it miss or be reflected or blocked when a panicking opponent cc breaks and goes full defense.

Glad to hear my nightblade guide helped you.

I had a silly time proccing people as a stamina lizardblade last weekend, but now I'm working on a promising melee mageblade build.

Trittium · May 2017

I would like to add to this thread the garbage that is this ability in deathmatch.

He and the other sorc just stood back while my team dominated mid, spammed this ability to the free win. I didn't get the shot of it, but they both only did under 100k damage.

If the ability is going to stay like this, then this needs to be the only map that is two teams only and not 3.

Joy_Division · May 2017

Trittium wrote: »

I would like to add to this thread the garbage that is this ability in deathmatch.

He and the other sorc just stood back while my team dominated mid, spammed this ability to the free win. I didn't get the shot of it, but they both only did under 100k damage.

If the ability is going to stay like this, then this needs to be the only map that is two teams only and not 3.

How is this garbage? It's a L2P issue.

They were outnumbered and your team and the other team decided it was better strategy to bang your heads against each other. The win was only "free" because both losing teams handed them the match on a silver platter.

This ability has been in the game since launch and nobody who ever argued this was OP was taken seriously. If anything they were laughed at. Mage''s Wrath was so underwhelming ZoS saw fit to actually buff the damage a long time ago (like when do they ever bufff rather than nerf?) and many sorcs still didn't even bother slotting it for doing challenging content like vMA.

Now all of a sudden it's OP. Gimme a break. Looks like the original developers of ESO were onto to something by not including dueling and battlegrounds because they knew people would whine about abilities that are perfectly fine in the game's main PvE and PvP content.

Minalan · May 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

Trittium wrote: »

I would like to add to this thread the garbage that is this ability in deathmatch.

He and the other sorc just stood back while my team dominated mid, spammed this ability to the free win. I didn't get the shot of it, but they both only did under 100k damage.

If the ability is going to stay like this, then this needs to be the only map that is two teams only and not 3.

How is this garbage? It's a L2P issue.

They were outnumbered and your team and the other team decided it was better strategy to bag your heads against each other. The win was only "free" because both losing teams handed them the match on a silver platter.

This ability has been in the game since launch and nobody who ever argued this was OP was taken seriously. If anything they were laughed at. Mage''s Wrath was so underwhelming ZoS saw fit to actually buff the damage a long time ago (like when do they ever bufff rather than nerf?) and many sorcs still didn't even bother slotting it for doing challenging content like vMA.

Now all of a sudden it's OP. Gimme a break. Looks like the original developers of ESO were onto to something by not including dueling and battlegrounds because they knew people would whine about abilities that are perfectly fine in the game's main PvE and PvP content.

Simple change, award the kill point to whomever did the most HEALTH damage. Execute kill-sniping problem solved, since they can never ever do more than 20%. Whomever landed most of the 80% damage gets the kill credit, the rest get a glorified assist.

Derra · May 2017

SleepyTroll wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Am i the only one massively irritated that OP literally links a skill as the definition of no skill required?

Pleb.

It's pretty simple really. You as the player using the sorc don't have to have any skill in the game( you are the pleb). You just need one magicka ability. Reading comprehension, is hard I know

That moment when someones too salty to enjoy a little sarcasm.

Still you have to have atleast one skill at in the game no?

Derra · May 2017

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

Lore_lai wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Endless Fury doesn't always go off though, it can be buggy at times and simply not work at all....have the enemy at 20% and it never explodes(even if pre-casted 2 seconds before that), allowing the target to heal....so its not as reliable.

Prior to the scaling bug with damage % Executes, Nightblades Impale with increased range was the best execute in the game by a long shot....and after the percentage scaling is fixed it will be better then Fury.

Once damage percentage scaling executes are fixed, Impale will be the games best execute.

I have never seen Fury do that. Besides - even if that were the case - that is a bug and you are presenting it as a feature of the execute. If you think it's bugged - submit a ticket and try to get it fixed.
I also don't see how Impale can be better than Fury, but maybe @NightbladeMechanics can shed some light on this.

Bug aside, it's not. Fury has the same range, only 5% lower threshold, can be layered into global cooldowns with other abilities, has no travel time, and most importantly cannot be dodged. Impale also has an ancient bug where it sometimes just doesn't deal damage at all. I would take Fury over Impale 100%.

Rinaldo's posts in this thread show he's clearly biased toward sorcs. That's all.

Thats not true

With the 1.6 Patch they broke Mage's Fury and the execute wouldn't work 3/4th of the time which is why so many Sorc like Xevenex, Myself, and Pixy Stick and others stopped using it all together and it was broken until the Dark Brotherhood Update fixed it(Nearly 2 years)

The undodgeable claim is not entirely true...the "Mage's Fury Explosion" is NOT dodgeable IF your at 20% heath or less at the time of the cast BUT "The initial lighting bolt that does a small amount of damage and puts a debuff on you for 4 seconds" can most certainly be dodged.

Also, Impale is INSTANT(Granted Impale is reflectable), and very animation cancel friendly, Mage's Fury has a "small delay" before the lighting strike happens after casting it. (Even the undodgeable explosion has a slight delay)

To say Fury is better then Impale(When its not bugged) is not really being fair...i'd say Impale is better because 300% more of tooltip damage can end up being more then the static damage of Mage's Fury Explosion making it more likely to kill your target sometimes.

I think there may be some cases where Mage's Fury is better, but as even you pointed out, Impale has the advantage of being able to Animation Canceled, Whereas Mage's Fury has a delay before the lighting strike happens regardless...if your trying to "prime" a target by tagging them with Fury and then Curse to set up burst they can just dodge the lighting strike thus never be tagged....this can be a very big deal on a class designed to kill based on "delayed damage".

Thanks to your Nightblade guide i had a lot of fun on my Mageblade, and in my time playing Mageblade last patch i thought Impale was better then Mage's Fury....Animation Cancel casting that on someone at low health was an instant NUKE and very rarely did anyone ever survive the 1st Impale at low health, Mage's Fury often times takes more then one to finish off the same target.

Regardless, once the damage scaling % bug is fixed, Impale and Mage's Fury could be seen as being tied for the best executes in the game easily.

I have to chime in here:

Fury´s explosion is instantly applied to the target. It´s not tied to the lightning direct damage part of the ability anymore (which was the reason it did not work properly prior to this and ever since the game launched).

The explosion is also NOT dodgeable. It gets applied to someone rolling and instantly triggers when they take dmg when they are at or unter 20% health (also while rolling).
i.e.: someones dodges at 19% health and they dodge you cast fury (dodged) and they take any damage => poof
The explosion debuff is NOT avoidable.

Fury is hands down the best execute in the game since cheesusbeam was nerfed the last time. It´s closely followed by NB execute though as that one is probably the best ability to animationcancel in the whole game (and deals quite a bit more dmg at a higher threshhold).

I don´t think that´s a problem however with the exception of killing blows being relevant in bgs. Killing blows should be awarded by total dmg done to the target instead - problem fixed for bgs.

aLi3nZ · May 2017

They could just make it so whoever did the most damage to the enemy before they died gets the kill, rather then basing it of who mase the killing blow. It seems people are mad about not having their score as high. Don't you all have your own execute skills you can use anyway?

Ashamray · May 2017

Derra wrote: »

I don´t think that´s a problem however with the exception of killing blows being relevant in bgs. Killing blows should be awarded by total dmg done to the target instead - problem fixed for bgs.

This. Though it can turn deathmatch into aoe spam to gain more points.

Lore_lai · May 2017

@NightbladeMechanics - thank you for your input! It pretty much matches how I feel about Fury.
Also - doesn't the Impale projectile have a travel time?

And let's not forget about Implosion. Had an interesting chat with JD about RNG procs like Implosion and Burning Light etc., in regards to their % chance and he explained to me how they work.

CyrusArya · May 2017

I don't know why people are arguing with a guy named 'sleepy troll'. Not only is it a troll, it's a low energy one. Lameee.

That being said endless fury is quite powerful in BGs, but the problem isn't with the skill but rather how scoring is appraised...if there is a problem at all. It's irrelevant anyways because BGs, just like cyrodiil, reward play time not player skill. This making the titles and leaderboards about as meaningful as grand overlord or campaign score leaders...that is to say not much at all.

Asgari · May 2017

Its a simple change needed:

KB = 1 point
Damage Done over 70% = 2 points
Healing done over 60% = 2 points
Objectives Captured / Controlled = 3 points

The point values can be inflated to account for game length, but currently too much is focused on KB and players with ranged executes who play more and win less can make it to the top of the leader boards easy.

The top of the leader boards should be based off of First the objectives, Second Damage and Healing done, Third time played and KB.

luen79rwb17_ESO · May 2017

Such a dissapointment with Battlegrounds. It's just the worst of Cyrodiil in a hole.

NightbladeMechanics · May 2017

Lore_lai wrote: »

@NightbladeMechanics - thank you for your input! It pretty much matches how I feel about Fury.
Also - doesn't the Impale projectile have a travel time?

And let's not forget about Implosion. Had an interesting chat with JD about RNG procs like Implosion and Burning Light etc., in regards to their % chance and he explained to me how they work.

I wouldn't really call it a travel time.. The animation does technically have a very short casting time, but animation cancelling Impale makes the damage register instantly. If animation cancelled properly, it's one of the cleanest abilities, with no animation or travel time whatsoever.

Yea I remember his findings on Implosion. That passive is messed up in a lot of ways.

NightbladeMechanics · May 2017

Asgari wrote: »

Its a simple change needed:
KB = 1 point

Damage Done over 70% = 2 points

Healing done over 60% = 2 points

Objectives Captured / Controlled = 3 points

The point values can be inflated to account for game length, but currently too much is focused on KB and players with ranged executes who play more and win less can make it to the top of the leader boards easy.

The top of the leader boards should be based off of First the objectives, Second Damage and Healing done, Third time played and KB.

Totally agree. The scoring needs to be adjusted to make it competitive.

But ZOS wants it based on time played, naturally.

PainfulFAFA · May 2017

Step 1: Hide in a corner
Step 2: Destro Ult
Step 3:???
Step 4: Profit

DeadlyRecluse · May 2017

As long as killing blows are the ONLY thing that matter for scoring in Deathmatch, endless fury will be a problem.

The skill itself isn't unbalanced in PvP, not enough to whine about, but it is the easiest killsteal skill in the game. KBs don't matter anywhere else, though.

Malamar1229 · May 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

Trittium wrote: »

I would like to add to this thread the garbage that is this ability in deathmatch.

He and the other sorc just stood back while my team dominated mid, spammed this ability to the free win. I didn't get the shot of it, but they both only did under 100k damage.

If the ability is going to stay like this, then this needs to be the only map that is two teams only and not 3.

How is this garbage? It's a L2P issue.

They were outnumbered and your team and the other team decided it was better strategy to bang your heads against each other. The win was only "free" because both losing teams handed them the match on a silver platter.

This ability has been in the game since launch and nobody who ever argued this was OP was taken seriously. If anything they were laughed at. Mage''s Wrath was so underwhelming ZoS saw fit to actually buff the damage a long time ago (like when do they ever bufff rather than nerf?) and many sorcs still didn't even bother slotting it for doing challenging content like vMA.

Now all of a sudden it's OP. Gimme a break. Looks like the original developers of ESO were onto to something by not including dueling and battlegrounds because they knew people would whine about abilities that are perfectly fine in the game's main PvE and PvP content.

So much Amen. As much as I love small scale PvP, I remember fearing this type of garbage a long time ago. They start balancing this crap around small scale PvP and they are going to start destroying classes and Cyrodiil.

Malamar1229 · May 2017

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

As long as killing blows are the ONLY thing that matter for scoring in Deathmatch, endless fury will be a problem.

The skill itself isn't unbalanced in PvP, not enough to whine about, but it is the easiest killsteal skill in the game. KBs don't matter anywhere else, though.

So make a post about changing the scoring system (root problem) instead of going after sorcs....again.

Malamar1229 · May 2017

lolz

Forum player logic = Battleground queues still busted, guess ZOS better nerf jesus beam again.

Trittium · May 2017

Joy_Division wrote: »

Trittium wrote: »

I would like to add to this thread the garbage that is this ability in deathmatch.

He and the other sorc just stood back while my team dominated mid, spammed this ability to the free win. I didn't get the shot of it, but they both only did under 100k damage.

If the ability is going to stay like this, then this needs to be the only map that is two teams only and not 3.

How is this garbage? It's a L2P issue.

They were outnumbered and your team and the other team decided it was better strategy to bang your heads against each other. The win was only "free" because both losing teams handed them the match on a silver platter.

This ability has been in the game since launch and nobody who ever argued this was OP was taken seriously. If anything they were laughed at. Mage''s Wrath was so underwhelming ZoS saw fit to actually buff the damage a long time ago (like when do they ever bufff rather than nerf?) and many sorcs still didn't even bother slotting it for doing challenging content like vMA.

Now all of a sudden it's OP. Gimme a break. Looks like the original developers of ESO were onto to something by not including dueling and battlegrounds because they knew people would whine about abilities that are perfectly fine in the game's main PvE and PvP content.

It's "Op" now because winning the match is actually dictated by this ability. It's a very strong execute that can be spammed at a low cost from range. The Deathmatch dictates points from kills, not damage done, so this is why it's OP and broken. In cyrodiil it doesn't matter AT ALL because you can just get a keep back. The campaign goes on for 7 day, or 30 days with tons of people doing their own thing in it. This is small group PvP, and it matters because it's very limited time, and high team game play. Don't think small group matters? Look at literally any top game on Twitch. NONE of them are zerg-based large group PvP. If that were the case, all we'd see is GW2 and ESO PvP, but they aren't interesting. Small group is what truly attracts PvPers. That's why it matters to balance it. It's also what dictates proper PvP balancing.

Also "Smashing our heads in mid", nor were they outnumbered. One person left before I took the screenshot; we were owning both teams and were getting good, hard to get kills, till those two decided to sit back, Spam Mage wrath, then streak away if they were contested. We only had 1 sorc that was stam, so chasing them wasn't really an option. So please; explain to me how we were to "Contest" this type of gameplay? We chase them all over? we lose. We ignore them we lose. Options? We try and get kills and hope that ZoS does something about this ability or the way the scoring works. Sorcs can keep execute the way it is if ZoS makes it so death match is only 2 teams, OR fix the scoring system in it. Even a 12 person free-for-all would be better.

KingJ · May 2017

aLi3nZ wrote: »

They could just make it so whoever did the most damage to the enemy before they died gets the kill, rather then basing it of who mase the killing blow. It seems people are mad about not having their score as high. Don't you all have your own execute skills you can use anyway?

Magdk do not have access to a execute.