Imperial City feedback and suggestions

Ashamray

@ZOS_GinaBruno
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom
Hello, I'm Boadrig and I have been playing ICity since its release. I want to say that Imperial City is the greatest DLC, but I'm afraid it will die when Battlegrounds come in ESO: Morrowind. So, my thoughts.

General adjustments

Fast travel to the City

• According to lore, Imperial City was cut during the Planemeld and even after its end Daedra holds the capital under control. There are no wayshrines and bridges, but in order to improve popularity, caravans (or squads) can be introduced near the Main Gates of High Rock, Morrowind and Elsweyr. This would work similar to Wrothgar or Craglorn caravans.
• As long as Imperial City isn’t considered to be a part of “competitive” PvP, all DLC can be separated from Cyrodiil. Entering into Sewers as it is now should inform you that you’re going to leave Cyrodiil

.
AP gain

• All bosses (4 types of them: standing bosses in Sewers, patrolling Xivkyns, Patroling Horros and quest bosses) in IC should give the Blessing of War buff like each delve boss in upper Cyrodiil does.

Dailys and Sewers

• I suggest to create a new motif, pages of which can be obtained as a reward for Imperial City daily quests and after killing Molag Bal’s Simulacrum during Barathrum Centrata Event.
  Two new daily quests can be found at Alliance bases. These quests send you to the Sewers: one suggests a reward for murdering one the the standing sewer boss. Another, given by Father Ignatius or sister J’Reeza (or Arkey priest), send you to consecrate corpses left in Sewers to prevent Daedric blasphemy.
• Sewers should receive their own Flagpoints (with sneaky npc Nightblades guarding them!). Each part of Sewers have 3 Points of control. Owing 2 of 3 allows Alliance members to resurrect at the Main Alliance Flagpoint. It won’t be easy to capture all Flags immediately or to save them quickly (remember Patrolling Xivkyns!). Tripple Flag control increases Tel Var gain by 33% (as it is now in upper City), works only for Sewers.

Upper City

• If all 6 Flags in the City are painted in one color, somewhere in the Districts a Patrolling Horror restores HP (or even resurrects after just being killed!) and receives significant buff. Since now it contains some specific loot (doesn’t contain motif pages though). Of course, this event could be abused, but I personally don’t think it’s bad. It’s all about game, right? In order to reduce abusive part, cooldown could be implemented.

Wish list

• Oblivion pockets! Somewhere in the City and Sewers rifts into Coldharbor pockets are opened by Daedra. You must rush into it, kill all summoners and rush out immediately… or rift will close and waves of Oblivion capture your soul! Aaaaand of course, all Alliances can make PvP in these pockets. As a main music theme I suggest Molag Bal’s AHAHAHAHAHAHA laugh.

• White-Gold Tower and Imperial City Prison copies for pvp!

UPD

Interactive environment

• Doors usable in combat leading into hideaway. Hideaway isn't a sanctuary zone but allows only few playes per faction at the same time. System of them!
• Traps. Weakened beam at the second floor is a perfect tool to drop on heads.
• Hiding spots like baskets in Thief Guild DLC made in Imperial style. Beware! Some wardrobes could contain a daedric portal with bunch of scamps.
• Daedric Titans floating in the sky above the City begin their hunt! Leave the streets when you see a winged shadow coming!

Enodoc

Very nice ideas! Capture points in the Sewers are something I've wanted for a long time, as well as more flags per District above as well. You may like this thread too: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en-GB/discussion/265284/kenas-take-on-imperial-city-pvp-objectives-a-guide-for-zos-with-pitchurs-3

Ashamray

Enodoc wrote: »

Very nice ideas! Capture points in the Sewers are something I've wanted for a long time, as well as more flags per District above as well. You may like this thread too: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en-GB/discussion/265284/kenas-take-on-imperial-city-pvp-objectives-a-guide-for-zos-with-pitchurs-3

liked. Hope Zos will pay attention.

Rickter

Im all for this idea. PvE elements always draw PvP. always

PvEers want the PvE objective. PvPers want easy kills. PvPers know other PvPers want easy kills and will "defend" - all out war. mission accomplished

The_Duke

To be honest the only thing they should do is remove the flag from the arena to allow respawns at the towers like it used to be. It was the best PvP and its a ghost town now.

NightbladeMechanics

The_Duke wrote: »

To be honest the only thing they should do is remove the flag from the arena to allow respawns at the towers like it used to be. It was the best PvP and its a ghost town now.

Memorial, Arena, and Arboretum districts have all had phases where dozens of people would fight there each night over no objectives except continuous back and forth slaughter.

~~

To the OP, also this https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/265284/kenas-take-on-imperial-city-pvp-objectives-a-guide-for-zos-with-pitchurs-3/p1

I want to see more objectives and coninuous combat all over IC. I like the idea of special loot from bosses that encourages gathering to defend them, and I like caravans to fast travel to IC. I do think you can/should have more that 3 sewer flagpoints.

However I don't like the idea of severing IC from the campaign, which I think was implied. It's supposed to be the center of the Alliance Wat, the jewel that all the factions fight over. Plus it would encourage a lot of PvP groups to venture down there if IC is relevant to score, emperorship, etc.

Imagine if you needed all Cyrodiil keeps and IC districts to crown emp. Suddenly it's difficult to obtain and requires coordination to seize again, and night capping on dead campaigns becomes preventable by one determined IC-goer. Not saying that's a perfect idea, but it's one way some sort of relevance to the above ground campaign could help breathe life into IC.

Ashamray

The_Duke wrote: »

To be honest the only thing they should do is remove the flag from the arena to allow respawns at the towers like it used to be. It was the best PvP and its a ghost town now.

When there were no flags, all conflicts used to be in Arboretum, Temple and sometimes Arena (EU PC). Other districts were empty enough. Now fights are more spread, and this is good.
IC dying not because of that change... Cyrodiil population is fading too. Remember usual 100+ queue in Thornblade? Now only a special event could beat those numbers! Tel Var bags with flowers, golden jewelry - the latest update - didn't revive City. Zos need something more to do.

Ashamray

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

However I don't like the idea of severing IC from the campaign, which I think was implied. It's supposed to be the center of the Alliance Wat, the jewel that all the factions fight over. Plus it would encourage a lot of PvP groups to venture down there if IC is relevant to score, emperorship, etc.

Imagine if you needed all Cyrodiil keeps and IC districts to crown emp. Suddenly it's difficult to obtain and requires coordination to seize again, and night capping on dead campaigns becomes preventable by one determined IC-goer. Not saying that's a perfect idea, but it's one way some sort of relevance to the above ground campaign could help breathe life into IC.

I'm still thinking about separating IC from Cyro. You absolutely right that heart of Empire is a precious prize in this Alliance War, but ingame mechanics deny it. Moreover, I got messages from time to time that I waste player's slot, queueing to play in City. Those ragewhispers made me think that separating is a good idea, but honestly I'd prefer to stay in Cyrodiil.

The_Duke

Ashamray wrote: »

The_Duke wrote: »

To be honest the only thing they should do is remove the flag from the arena to allow respawns at the towers like it used to be. It was the best PvP and its a ghost town now.

When there were no flags, all conflicts used to be in Arboretum, Temple and sometimes Arena (EU PC). Other districts were empty enough. Now fights are more spread, and this is good.
IC dying not because of that change... Cyrodiil population is fading too. Remember usual 100+ queue in Thornblade? Now only a special event could beat those numbers! Tel Var bags with flowers, golden jewelry - the latest update - didn't revive City. Zos need something more to do.

Im PS4 NA so Im not familiar with how PC EU operated. In PS4 NA the arena district was always a war. I never said its dying but I do think that the numbers would increase (PS4 NA) if respawns went back to normal.

Enodoc

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

However I don't like the idea of severing IC from the campaign, which I think was implied. It's supposed to be the center of the Alliance Wat, the jewel that all the factions fight over. Plus it would encourage a lot of PvP groups to venture down there if IC is relevant to score, emperorship, etc.

IC is pretty much separate from the rest of the campaign anyway. Nothing you do in one affects the other, except for the leaderboards, and the pop cap.

The_Duke wrote: »

Im PS4 NA so Im not familiar with how PC EU operated. In PS4 NA the arena district was always a war. I never said its dying but I do think that the numbers would increase (PS4 NA) if respawns went back to normal.

If every district had at least three flags, and you only had to control one to enable respawns, that would improve the situation.

NightbladeMechanics

Ashamray wrote: »

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

However I don't like the idea of severing IC from the campaign, which I think was implied. It's supposed to be the center of the Alliance Wat, the jewel that all the factions fight over. Plus it would encourage a lot of PvP groups to venture down there if IC is relevant to score, emperorship, etc.

Imagine if you needed all Cyrodiil keeps and IC districts to crown emp. Suddenly it's difficult to obtain and requires coordination to seize again, and night capping on dead campaigns becomes preventable by one determined IC-goer. Not saying that's a perfect idea, but it's one way some sort of relevance to the above ground campaign could help breathe life into IC.

I'm still thinking about separating IC from Cyro. You absolutely right that heart of Empire is a precious prize in this Alliance War, but ingame mechanics deny it. Moreover, I got messages from time to time that I waste player's slot, queueing to play in City. Those ragewhispers made me think that separating is a good idea, but honestly I'd prefer to stay in Cyrodiil.

My response to this is to put those people on ignore and suggest mechanics to facilitate it.

With declines in the PvP population, we need to create more robust PvP mechanics that bind the community together and get people moving around. I fear that severing IC from Cyrodiil and making it its own campaign would shift some people to playing only in the IC campaign and never setting foot in Cyrodiil, thus further emptying Cyrodiil.

Ashamray

Make Kena and Warden have to relocate to some other obscure zone and retire those dungeons in favor of player vs player havoc.

@TheBonesXXX
New nice idea has been suggested, but I'm sure it can be just a copied dungeon made for pvp only. Daedra were defeated by players some time ago (quests with Lyranth and Moth Priest), and now players, who infiltrated sewers and districts, are trying to take control over prison and Tower.

Ashamray

More to create:

Interactive environment

• Doors usable in combat leading into hideaway (barricaded chambers in the buildings). Hideaway isn't a sanctuary zone but allows only few playes per faction at the same time. System of them!
• Traps. Weakened beam at the second floor is a perfect tool to drop on heads.
• Hiding spots like baskets in Thief Guild DLC made in Imperial style. Beware! Some wardrobes could contain a daedric portal with bunch of scamps.
• Daedric Titans floating in the sky above the City begin their hunt! Leave the streets when you see a winged shadow coming!

Aelakhaii_De_Mythos

Nice ideas - IC is an awesome place, really, but it needs some love.

Having a campaign solely for IC would be a nice start, there are actually quite a few players who would be very interested in this.

geonsocal

Aelakhaii_De_Mythos wrote: »

Having a campaign solely for IC would be a nice start, there are actually quite a few players who would be very interested in this.

sign me up

Qbiken

I say yes to the most stuff aside from the flags in the sewers. Flagguards are the worst move ZOS ever made.

Ashamray

Qbiken wrote: »

I say yes to the most stuff aside from the flags in the sewers. Flagguards are the worst move ZOS ever made.

Because Eclipse?

Enodoc

Qbiken wrote: »

I say yes to the most stuff aside from the flags in the sewers. Flagguards are the worst move ZOS ever made.

There can still be flags in the sewers, ZOS just need to add a different type of guard. The detection range of the guards in the Districts is too large anyway.

Drummerx04

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

The_Duke wrote: »

To be honest the only thing they should do is remove the flag from the arena to allow respawns at the towers like it used to be. It was the best PvP and its a ghost town now.

Memorial, Arena, and Arboretum districts have all had phases where dozens of people would fight there each night over no objectives except continuous back and forth slaughter.

[...]

I participated in a couple of those enormous endless pvp slugfests.

One of my favorites was in the Arboretum district during that period when the mobs were respawning in seconds. 20+ AD, 20+ DC, and 20+ EP were spawning at their bases instantly - which are all right next to each other - and duking it on top hundreds of daedra, daedroth, and district boss corpses. I think I must have spent around 4 hours there and wracked up something like 250 KBs and 20k tel var with no end in sight on the battle.

It was epic AF

I took a few screenshots to highlight some of the chaos when there was a few breaks in the combat. Looking at them now makes me realize just how long ago that was, lol





I'd love to see IC be awesome again.

Qbiken

Ashamray wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

I say yes to the most stuff aside from the flags in the sewers. Flagguards are the worst move ZOS ever made.

Because Eclipse?

* Detection range: Way to big, need to go to the opposite side of the district if I don´t want to get detected.
* Guards >>>> District bosses (no joke.....ok a small joke but still)

Guards and flags was a bad move. It was a move to bring more ppl to IC, but once again it´s a dead DLC so obviously flags wasn´t the right move.

Ashamray

Qbiken wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

I say yes to the most stuff aside from the flags in the sewers. Flagguards are the worst move ZOS ever made.

Because Eclipse?

* Detection range: Way to big, need to go to the opposite side of the district if I don´t want to get detected.
* Guards >>>> District bosses (no joke.....ok a small joke but still)

Guards and flags was a bad move. It was a move to bring more ppl to IC, but once again it´s a dead DLC so obviously flags wasn´t the right move.

I don't think it was bad decision. With flags we have:
- 33% TV inscrease > attract people
- flags are indicators of activity - you can go where fire is
- a bit more AP (IC is poor in this)

Although I like 33% increase, I think it causes zergs. Nowadays when an average size group of farmers appears in IC, they usually consume all districts, and people of other alliances begin to leave. I saw it many times.

Enodoc

Ashamray wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

I say yes to the most stuff aside from the flags in the sewers. Flagguards are the worst move ZOS ever made.

Because Eclipse?

* Detection range: Way to big, need to go to the opposite side of the district if I don´t want to get detected.
* Guards >>>> District bosses (no joke.....ok a small joke but still)

Guards and flags was a bad move. It was a move to bring more ppl to IC, but once again it´s a dead DLC so obviously flags wasn´t the right move.

I don't think it was bad decision. With flags we have:
- 33% TV inscrease > attract people
- flags are indicators of activity - you can go where fire is
- a bit more AP (IC is poor in this)

Although I like 33% increase, I think it causes zergs. Nowadays when an average size group of farmers appears in IC, they usually consume all districts, and people of other alliances begin to leave. I saw it many times.

I was about to say that the zerg mentality and the quick-flip issue could be alleviated by having more flags per district (at least 3 total), but I see I said that already when the thread was first created!

daniel.13b16_ESO

I agree. IC needs some love. I had such a great time with PVP and it really could be the answer for people complaining about zergs in Cyrodil. There just needs to be more to do, more objectives. I don't think adding loot will be answer, because it is only a short term solution. We need proper mechanics to keep it interesting. Adding the prison and the tower would definitely help. Maybe opening up the rest of the 'island', breaking some walls down? It definitely needs a lot of work but it really could be equal to Cyrpdil and I think it is worth if for ZOW to invest some resources into it.

Ashamray

UPD


Now I believe IC should be separate. Cyrodiil queueing doesn't attract. Running from far keeps doesn't attract. We already have leaderboard for BG - purchaseable chapter - maybe we should get Imperial leaderboard for the City? This definitely brings more life to empty streets.

Qbiken

Ashamray wrote: »

UPD


Now I believe IC should be separate. Cyrodiil queueing doesn't attract. Running from far keeps doesn't attract. We already have leaderboard for BG - purchaseable chapter - maybe we should get Imperial leaderboard for the City? This definitely brings more life to empty streets.

I still a little unsure if this would make more people go to IC. At most it takes 5-10 minutes to ride to IC if you don´t own any keep close to the entrance. The time it takes to get there isn´t the issue. People gladly sit in a 40 minute que to get into Vivec. The motivation to go there is the issue, not the way to get there (not saying it would make things easier, but I think you´ll get my point;) )

As I wrote earlier in this thread, I wouldn't like flag-guards in the sewers. The small amount of space down there doesn´t feel very suitable for multiple guards. Up in the districts there´re more space.

Otherwise I like your ideas

Would also like to add my own suggestion(s):
- Make it possible to buy gold-tempers for Telvar. And no, I don´t think it would break the market. People still sell reagents even tho satchels were added to IC vendor a while ago. It will lower the price, and that´s a good thing.

Ashamray

Qbiken wrote: »

Ashamray wrote: »

UPD


Now I believe IC should be separate. Cyrodiil queueing doesn't attract. Running from far keeps doesn't attract. We already have leaderboard for BG - purchaseable chapter - maybe we should get Imperial leaderboard for the City? This definitely brings more life to empty streets.

I still a little unsure if this would make more people go to IC. At most it takes 5-10 minutes to ride to IC if you don´t own any keep close to the entrance. The time it takes to get there isn´t the issue. People gladly sit in a 40 minute que to get into Vivec. The motivation to go there is the issue, not the way to get there (not saying it would make things easier, but I think you´ll get my point;) )

As I wrote earlier in this thread, I wouldn't like flag-guards in the sewers. The small amount of space down there doesn´t feel very suitable for multiple guards. Up in the districts there´re more space.

Otherwise I like your ideas

Would also like to add my own suggestion(s):
- Make it possible to buy gold-tempers for Telvar. And no, I don´t think it would break the market. People still sell reagents even tho satchels were added to IC vendor a while ago. It will lower the price, and that´s a good thing.

You spend 10-30 minutes to start your game. I can't waste my time tbh, this is unacceptable for me. When I'm at ~40th position and the City is painted in one color without any burning flags for several minutes, I simply don't go there. Waste of time in most cases.
People actually receive their PvP when they wait for Vivec. In IC you sometimes don't. Leaderboard is a huge catalysator of interest, competitions always attract people.

What concerns sewer flags - I suggested ZOS-style mechanic Sewers need something, anything!

Ragnarock41

One thing I would like to remind is, reverting the nerf black rose got before morrowind.
The morrowind nerfs to constution indirectly nerfed this set to the point even in 7 heavy Its not viable anymore.
Back in the day lots of people would come to IC just to farm this set,obviously I don't want to be the one and only set again, but
a permablock nerf is planned, which was the reason this set got nerfed in the first place.

After the planned permablock nerfs, All the reasons black rose got nerfed will be gone, so please ZOS, don't forget to fix the damage caused by that balance attempts.

Ashamray

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

One thing I would like to remind is, reverting the nerf black rose got before morrowind.
The morrowind nerfs to constution indirectly nerfed this set to the point even in 7 heavy Its not viable anymore.
Back in the day lots of people would come to IC just to farm this set,obviously I don't want to be the one and only set again, but
a permablock nerf is planned, which was the reason this set got nerfed in the first place.

After the planned permablock nerfs, All the reasons black rose got nerfed will be gone, so please ZOS, don't forget to fix the damage caused by that balance attempts.

All Tel Var sets besides Physique deserve an overhaul.

Ragnarock41

Ashamray wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

One thing I would like to remind is, reverting the nerf black rose got before morrowind.
The morrowind nerfs to constution indirectly nerfed this set to the point even in 7 heavy Its not viable anymore.
Back in the day lots of people would come to IC just to farm this set,obviously I don't want to be the one and only set again, but
a permablock nerf is planned, which was the reason this set got nerfed in the first place.

After the planned permablock nerfs, All the reasons black rose got nerfed will be gone, so please ZOS, don't forget to fix the damage caused by that balance attempts.

All Tel Var sets besides Physique deserve an overhaul.

I agree. most of them are outdated now.
but I especially feel bad for black rose, zos didn't treat it like the way they treated proc sets.
It just feels wrong.

I guess they could rework most of those sets to fit the new PvP meta better.
especially now that we need good medium armor sets for PvP, shieldbreaker and powerfull assault could see a rework.

tinythinker

Redirected here from another thread regarding the sewers:

tinythinker wrote: »

I don't mind mixing PvE and PvP but there have to be trade-offs. The sewers were made for ganking because the devs thought people would want to do lots of hunting. But hunters tend to want to hunt prey, not other hunters. And there isn't much to lure in prey. That's what it all comes down to in the end.

- If it is an item that is BoE prey will purchase it.
- If it is an item that is BoP prey will get friends or a paid escort until they get what they want then won't return.
- If it is an item that is BoP but that must be reacquired regularly prey will periodically return.
- If it a fun/rewarding experience prey will find ways to regularly visit

The last two types of lures are the only ones worth discussing if you want a sustainable boost to the sewer population. If you can combine the last two the sewers will thrive.

The question is what you can offer prey to make the risk worth the reward. I am awful at 1v1 let alone 1v3 or 1v4. I am prey. I avoid the sewers. It's hard to think of something good enough to get me to go.

Another things is giant blobs. Putting in suitable rewards to sustain a population of prey will likely lead to blob groups, which will draw bombers, which could destabilize the population again.

A mechanic that rewards groups of 6-8 players being spread out over solo hunters or giant blobs would be best. So, only one group can get a reward if found, and only 6-8 players in a group would receive it. Now you have small groups spreading out to search the sewers. Some solo and duo hunters will still stalk prey but there would always be a risk of another small group or two coming around the corner and knocking them out while they are ganking.

So, basically, if you want a sunstainable boost for the sewers try designing something like this:
- add a hunt for something that only one group at a time can claim that spawns randomly in locations all over the sewers
- make it so that only 6 or 7 or 8 players in a group will receive the item (buff, whatever) when found and claimed
- make the experience of finding the mcguffin itself fun and cool (like clues about how to track it)
- make the reward that drops something people will want to come back for regularly

Other successful options/configurations are possible of course but as prey this is something that might get me to buy in.

Eddyble

As mainly a PvE player, lately playing more Pvp, I have ventured into the sewers on occasion as well as during the event time periods. And agree that it is an under utilized area that has potential. But how to get more people in there and enjoy it is a good question. For myself...

1) possibly standardize currency, maybe switch it to AP? it is a PvP zone after all, might bring in more people from overland as well as PvE since they wont have to worry about stones being halved...which brings me to #2.
2) if currency is to remain, I think PvE people don't want to go in there, not because of fear of death, but that all their time spent there could go to waste with a few deaths. If one could keep what they earned that might be an incentive.
3) allow vendors wares to be sold for all currencies. TV, AP, Gold...helps the game with currency sink and gives all players more options. If the golden vendor can do AP and Gold, maybe the sewer vendor (at least for gold jewelry) should do the same?

Just some thoughts. I like the atmosphere of the sewer, and how it keeps me on the edge of my seat not knowing who or what is around the corner but, yes, I do need more reason to be there.