Area-of-Effect Abilities - Maximum Target Cap Clarification

Tanthul

I will only quote the relevant parts:

RivenVII wrote: »

Also, when the game is being played like there is no AoE cap and several majorly impactful abilities had no AoE cap, then PvP is fine. Now that ZOS has come out and stated there was an AoE cap (Tanthul, I call BS that your guild "knew" other than anything that was specified in the tooltip), the gameplay will change drastically.

You can call BS all you like. But some of us actually analyze our battles.
http://www.curse.com/teso-addons/teso/combat-log-statistics

If you actually used the above addon and checked what was going on in your battles you would see how many people are getting hit by any particular skill. Combat Log addons are not just for looking how "huge" your damage numbers, or what's your "optimal rotation" as you probably think. They are foremost a tool for analyzing any encounter and see what went on and how mechanics work under the hood. So feel free to call BS or whatever while I say you should spend more time analyzing your fights and game mechanics.
Granted the addon does not let you see anything other than your skill effects and other's skill effects on you (due to API restrictions), it is still an invaluable tool in figuring out actual mechanics. A lot of the tooltips in the game are wrong, a lot of the numbers are also wrong. Testing skills and number crunching is the only way to know.
Contrary to how most people play, we at Dark Moon value strategy, tactics and careful analysis of any given situation. We don't zerg and we like beating zerg mentality players all day long. What we like even more is fighting against intelligent opponents and that's why we're glad for some very cool DC players on Scourge with whom we have no problem debating strategies and tactics with as we love a good opponent. You are playing on a zerg vs zerg campaign so I do understand where you're coming from, to a degree.

You all assume that "siege can conquer all", when you are terribly wrong. Siege is slow firing and displays a circle long before it hits. No organized force is going to stand in slow-firing, slow-reloading siege fire. They are going to stay on the move and wreck anything that doesn't have equal or greater numbers than they do.

Not all siege weapons are slow firing or slow reloading and the first part also depends on proximity as well. Fire Ballistas, fire very fast and reload fast as well. They are the weapon of choice against stacked players. Voice coordinated and timed firing by as many as 3 players can make the fire impossible to avoid. You should start using and exploring siege engines and their related strengths/weaknesses and tactics.

That's what the changes to these abilities and the admission of an AoE cap has done. It has completely warped the way that this game will be played and I am sorely disappointed that they would take this route rather than performing actual balancing on the abilities that were wreaking the most havoc.

Like I said. I would seriously love to see people trying to blob. Our kill counters will go on fire.

Why trivialize PvP even more and effectively lower the skillcap? AoE caps are notorious for this. As a first time development team for an MMO, I can't imagine you didn't learn from other titles and what they did right and wrong.

How does forcing you to use actual strategy instead of trying to kill sub-par players with PBAOE lowers the skillcap is beyond me.

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

rendolpheb16_ESO

ESO was potentially a AvA niche for me, for the next upcoming years. But since I know your real intention and don't give a sh*t about what people are saying (90% poll that doesn't want AoE cap) you let some bitter taste in your game.

For thoses who claim that AoE cap target isn't a problem, you just prove to me that you are a noob. Max target on AoE imply that the biggest number will get the advantages. Not by the fact that they are more, but the fact that AoE have a cap. If you don't believe me do the maths ...

For now we didn't see really stack zerging, but just wait and see. An intelligent raid leader will stack his large raid, so all AoE will be mitigate by the mass. The BURST from AoE effects will be attenuated and you've got GW2 (with trinity).

KerinKor

rendolpheb16_ESO wrote: »

ESO was potentially a AvA niche for me, for the next upcoming years. But since I know your real intention and don't give a sh*t about what people are saying (90% poll that doesn't want AoE cap) you let some bitter taste in your game.

As someone pointed out, any poll on here is based on a self-selecting population and any year 1 stats student learns a self-selecting population is statistically invalid from the outset.

It's also a Very Good Thing MMOs aren't designed by the players, because God knows nothing would ever be agreed and the only thing most PVPers are interested in are easy wins and big damage nmbers.

A game is designed by a handful of people with a vision, and while they may tweak and twiddle based on observed FACTS, thankfully few changes are made as a result of endless PVPer QQing: sadly a few changes are made as a result of that, in the end they get reversed usually.

As a player you have the right to comment, as the designer ZOS have the right to ignore you if your view doesn't aline with their vision: and no, you don't have a right to know why.

I've seen some fatuous PVP QQ over the years on various game forums, but this thread probably takes the prize for the most fatuous due to the number who are suggesting people only bought it for capless AOE: LMAO, what a stupid idea.

xt5jcb16_ESO

KerinKor wrote: »

rendolpheb16_ESO wrote: »

I've seen some fatuous PVP QQ over the years on various game forums, but this thread probably takes the prize for the most fatuous due to the number who are suggesting people only bought it for capless AOE: LMAO, what a stupid idea.

Every DAoC Pvp player bought it for exactly that reason.

KerinKor

xt5jcb16_ESO wrote: »

KerinKor wrote: »

rendolpheb16_ESO wrote: »

I've seen some fatuous PVP QQ over the years on various game forums, but this thread probably takes the prize for the most fatuous due to the number who are suggesting people only bought it for capless AOE: LMAO, what a stupid idea.

Every DAoC Pvp player bought it for exactly that reason.

Sad.

NordJitsu

Meh. If I understand the math of this correctly, it means that you will never be able to beat a group more than 6 times your size.

If you have one player AoE bombing, he can hit 6 enemies. If you have 2 players AoE bombing, they can hit 12. If you have 12 players AoE bombing, they can hit 72 enemies.

Seems fairly reasonable to me.

As long as they fix Dark Talons to bring it in line with the rest of these abilities (glad to hear that was an accident) then I'm okay with this.

Lorelei

NordJitsu wrote: »

Meh. If I understand the math of this correctly, it means that you will never be able to beat a group more than 6 times your size.

If you have one player AoE bombing, he can hit 6 enemies. If you have 2 players AoE bombing, they can hit 12. If you have 12 players AoE bombing, they can hit 72 enemies.

Seems fairly reasonable to me.

As long as they fix Dark Talons to bring it in line with the rest of these abilities (glad to hear that was an accident) then I'm okay with this.

Of course that's reasonable... how dare you bring reason into this discussion? I want to run around as a single player and be able to blow up HUNDREDS of players to make my d*ck feel bigger. I need to feel like I'm skilled. Why do you think I spend 18 hours a day online? It's to blow up all the skilless noobs running around Cyrodiil.

Capping AoE at six might mean I actually have to use more than 2 abilities and group with a couple other players to accomplish something.

Obviously I'm being sarcastic. This seems like a lot of QQ over nothing. Should two players actually be able to take out 50? It's not realistic. I've been in Cyrodiil and most people already zerg so what's going to change?

Larira

NordJitsu wrote: »

Meh. If I understand the math of this correctly, it means that you will never be able to beat a group more than 6 times your size.

If you have one player AoE bombing, he can hit 6 enemies. If you have 2 players AoE bombing, they can hit 12. If you have 12 players AoE bombing, they can hit 72 enemies.

Seems fairly reasonable to me.

It's not true because you need ressources like magicka/stamina to kill other players. And you will run out of this ressources with this cap bevore a significant number of enemies will go down. I guess, the ratio is ~1:2 and not 1:6.

Greetings

valkaneer2b14_ESO

Tanthul wrote: »

Siege equipment can hit everything and target all areas if you know how/where to place them properly and which ones to use. Exception to this is highly elevated terrains but this only affects keep sieges. Learn how to use each different piece of siege equipment, use strategy, protect siege users if out in the open, use siege shield, etc etc. This is not only about character vs character. It's about strategy and tactics first of all. Run in the middle of a zerg to spam aoe hopping to kill every bad player that decides to not get outside your PBAOE range and snipe you to death is not something anyone should depend on. And since I see comments about DAoC, it was bad there as well. AOE mezz anyone? Uncapped AOE is a bad idea unless it has serious drawbacks. And siege engines is just that, uncapped AOE for loss of mobility. There must always be scissors for the paper, paper for the rock, rock for the scissors.

Who ever thinks they can blob up because of AOE max target limits you're absolutely wrong. You will be oneshot by emperors or 2-3 organized players using focused timed siege fire. We are doing it currently..imagine the amount of dead bodies if people decide to blob lol. This is how it's supposed to be. Stop crying about everything please and if you think you can blob now, go ahead please.. as long as you're not fighting for my alliance

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

Strangly I dont remember how well seige equipment works inside of buildings or hallways.

Only way to stop a Zerg Style PvP with AOE caps is really to remove AOE healing, and add / Target

Zargorius

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Tanthul wrote: »

Siege equipment can hit everything and target all areas if you know how/where to place them properly and which ones to use. Exception to this is highly elevated terrains but this only affects keep sieges. Learn how to use each different piece of siege equipment, use strategy, protect siege users if out in the open, use siege shield, etc etc. This is not only about character vs character. It's about strategy and tactics first of all. Run in the middle of a zerg to spam aoe hopping to kill every bad player that decides to not get outside your PBAOE range and snipe you to death is not something anyone should depend on. And since I see comments about DAoC, it was bad there as well. AOE mezz anyone? Uncapped AOE is a bad idea unless it has serious drawbacks. And siege engines is just that, uncapped AOE for loss of mobility. There must always be scissors for the paper, paper for the rock, rock for the scissors.

Who ever thinks they can blob up because of AOE max target limits you're absolutely wrong. You will be oneshot by emperors or 2-3 organized players using focused timed siege fire. We are doing it currently..imagine the amount of dead bodies if people decide to blob lol. This is how it's supposed to be. Stop crying about everything please and if you think you can blob now, go ahead please.. as long as you're not fighting for my alliance

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

Strangly I dont remember how well seige equipment works inside of buildings or hallways.

Only way to stop a Zerg Style PvP with AOE caps is really to remove AOE healing, and a / Target

Scourge on EU is completely empty and AD dominated, last time I checked. Just sayin'.

nicefrog

Yeah but without AoE caps it turns into a game of spamming AoEs on groups, whether they be heals or nukes, and that isn't fun, trust me, I've been there.

I swear, never design a game solely around pvp players, they will leave at the slightest hint of change.

nicefrog

NordJitsu wrote: »

Meh. If I understand the math of this correctly, it means that you will never be able to beat a group more than 6 times your size.

If you have one player AoE bombing, he can hit 6 enemies. If you have 2 players AoE bombing, they can hit 12. If you have 12 players AoE bombing, they can hit 72 enemies.

Seems fairly reasonable to me.

As long as they fix Dark Talons to bring it in line with the rest of these abilities (glad to hear that was an accident) then I'm okay with this.

You probably could kill an opposing group more than 6 times your size if your strategy wasn't 'AoE bombing' on sight.

Lorelei

Larira wrote: »

NordJitsu wrote: »

Meh. If I understand the math of this correctly, it means that you will never be able to beat a group more than 6 times your size.

If you have one player AoE bombing, he can hit 6 enemies. If you have 2 players AoE bombing, they can hit 12. If you have 12 players AoE bombing, they can hit 72 enemies.

Seems fairly reasonable to me.

It's not true because you need ressources like magicka/stamina to kill other players. And you will run out of this ressources with this cap bevore a significant number of enemies will go down. I guess, the ratio is ~1:2 and not 1:6.

Greetings

No. What you need is coordination and smaller groups will work just fine. If you run into the middle of 20 people expecting to spam 2 buttons and blow everyone up but run out of magicka and get killed, then you get exactly what you deserve. Those are just people trying to farm AP and now it's being taken away... hence, the QQ.

NordJitsu

@Larira‌

Nah. I've personally successfully fought 4 v 1 and 6 v1.

6v1 was on a keep wall while defending. I sneaked up on a guy, feed on him, knocked him down. His 5 buddies jump on me so I kited them around using Elemental Ring and Critical Surge, slowly whittiling them down while keeping myself up. A weapon swap for a few Mages Fury's and it was done.

Just a few days ago I did a 4v1 in Valastrus. 4 AD charged me while I was doing dailies and were dumb enough to group right up on me. Crit Surge plus Elemental Ring and I didn't even have to swap for Fury.

If I'd had one of my guildies with me and in TeamSpeak, I'd not be surprised to do a 2 v 10.

Point is, organization still matters. Small groups can still take out larger groups. There's just a limit.

I personally would prefer no AoE caps as well though. Not saying I don't. I just don't view this as the end of the world.

Nefar

arapas wrote: »

Its time to look for another game, zos made a good game and dont know why. They are just walking to the wrong direction.

Camelot Unchained is the hope for pvp!

Btw, my 3 month sub is already canceled.

Mark Jacobs is at the head for Camelot unchained... I would not set your hopes too high.

prana33b14_ESO

Haha, the strawmanning continues. AP farmers are the culprits now. It's not that people are worried about core game mechanics. It's the people farming AP!

prana33b14_ESO

NordJitsu wrote: »

Meh. If I understand the math of this correctly, it means that you will never be able to beat a group more than 6 times your size.

If you have one player AoE bombing, he can hit 6 enemies. If you have 2 players AoE bombing, they can hit 12. If you have 12 players AoE bombing, they can hit 72 enemies.

Seems fairly reasonable to me.

As long as they fix Dark Talons to bring it in line with the rest of these abilities (glad to hear that was an accident) then I'm okay with this.

Sure. You might hit 6 one time and a different 6 the next time though since it's RANDOM. So instead of placing all your aoe consecutively on 6 people and actually doing enough damage to kill them before you get blown up by the blob, you take a chunk of their health and then your next aoes take a bit of some other random 6 players' health. Now their healer doesn't need to worry about people getting really low health because the aoe is dissipated amongst the blob and no one dies, or at the very least a few deaths occur before blob runs over smaller blob.

valkaneer2b14_ESO

Zargorius wrote: »

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Tanthul wrote: »

Siege equipment can hit everything and target all areas if you know how/where to place them properly and which ones to use. Exception to this is highly elevated terrains but this only affects keep sieges. Learn how to use each different piece of siege equipment, use strategy, protect siege users if out in the open, use siege shield, etc etc. This is not only about character vs character. It's about strategy and tactics first of all. Run in the middle of a zerg to spam aoe hopping to kill every bad player that decides to not get outside your PBAOE range and snipe you to death is not something anyone should depend on. And since I see comments about DAoC, it was bad there as well. AOE mezz anyone? Uncapped AOE is a bad idea unless it has serious drawbacks. And siege engines is just that, uncapped AOE for loss of mobility. There must always be scissors for the paper, paper for the rock, rock for the scissors.

Who ever thinks they can blob up because of AOE max target limits you're absolutely wrong. You will be oneshot by emperors or 2-3 organized players using focused timed siege fire. We are doing it currently..imagine the amount of dead bodies if people decide to blob lol. This is how it's supposed to be. Stop crying about everything please and if you think you can blob now, go ahead please.. as long as you're not fighting for my alliance

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

Strangly I dont remember how well seige equipment works inside of buildings or hallways.

Only way to stop a Zerg Style PvP with AOE caps is really to remove AOE healing, and a / Target

Scourge on EU is completely empty and AD dominated, last time I checked. Just sayin'.

What does that have to do with anything?

Zargorius

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Zargorius wrote: »

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Tanthul wrote: »

Siege equipment can hit everything and target all areas if you know how/where to place them properly and which ones to use. Exception to this is highly elevated terrains but this only affects keep sieges. Learn how to use each different piece of siege equipment, use strategy, protect siege users if out in the open, use siege shield, etc etc. This is not only about character vs character. It's about strategy and tactics first of all. Run in the middle of a zerg to spam aoe hopping to kill every bad player that decides to not get outside your PBAOE range and snipe you to death is not something anyone should depend on. And since I see comments about DAoC, it was bad there as well. AOE mezz anyone? Uncapped AOE is a bad idea unless it has serious drawbacks. And siege engines is just that, uncapped AOE for loss of mobility. There must always be scissors for the paper, paper for the rock, rock for the scissors.

Who ever thinks they can blob up because of AOE max target limits you're absolutely wrong. You will be oneshot by emperors or 2-3 organized players using focused timed siege fire. We are doing it currently..imagine the amount of dead bodies if people decide to blob lol. This is how it's supposed to be. Stop crying about everything please and if you think you can blob now, go ahead please.. as long as you're not fighting for my alliance

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

Strangly I dont remember how well seige equipment works inside of buildings or hallways.

Only way to stop a Zerg Style PvP with AOE caps is really to remove AOE healing, and a / Target

Scourge on EU is completely empty and AD dominated, last time I checked. Just sayin'.

What does that have to do with anything?

It has to do with people's credibility.

Kiash

And the same mistake GW2 made is being made all over again. Companies really never learn, do they? As if we needed another reason to empty out more campaigns.

Really disheartening knowing so many of the people that bought the game and the fans that supported it are being turned on now by something that is clearly a poor design philosophy that caused GW2 to be nothing but zerg vs zerg and karma trains.

This has been done, and failed, before Zenimax. I can't believe this is even a thought in someone's mind that ever played DAoC and saw how well their system worked that rewarded strategy and thought over sheer number advantages.

Tanthul

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Strangly I dont remember how well seige equipment works inside of buildings or hallways.

Only way to stop a Zerg Style PvP with AOE caps is really to remove AOE healing, and add / Target

Actually siege equipment works wonders inside buildings and hallways if you know what you're doing. Oil works wonders on any tight space and fire ballistas set up on the second flag in case of frontal breach or on the side in case of postern. Try it. We have pulled countless 3-6 vs 30+ successful defenses with clever combination of oil and fire ballistas. And don't forget that skills never hit above 6 targets other than the broken ones. So unless you were using the broken ones only, player aoe was not doing much for you in confined spaces anyhow.

And to set the perspective right in regards to a comment about Scourge population above: Scourge is not empty, it is just not the zergfest of AB etc. Also while it is currently AD dominated it is not because of zerging or numbers. We were outnumbered and pushed back really hard by a full on zerging Pact up from headstart up until about 2 weeks ago when with clever strategy and tactics we managed to claim the map with numbers going in the lines of 30 vs 100 (at any given time). This caused several Pacters to jump ship to another campaign as they were getting hammered by an opponent they outnumbered by far (tripple+ numbers at any time). AD's domination of the map on Scourge is exactly the proof that we know how to fight against the zerg and we do it really good. We still don't have huge numbers. Currently apart from arranged events there are an average of 20-25 players operating at any given time on AD side. The DC side initially had no numbers at all and since the Pacters decided to jump ship action went low for a while. DC is building up currently and we have regular action. In coordination with them we're holding events now with large amount of players (100+) that are not fought in zerg style. The Pact side rarely fights anymore.
This is the history and current situation of EU Scourge. We invite any guild or players that hate zerging mentality and like strategy/tactics to join us on Scourge as allies or enemies. The environment is good, not many elitists or abusive people around (if you are in any of these two categories, don't bother--you'll find few friends here). If interested to join us as allies you can always message @Tanthul or @Sanrek (the Emperor) so we can coordinate with your guild:) As far we know the DC side is getting reinforcements as well. We would love reinforcements on the Pact side as well!

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

rhubbert_ESO

I love hearing people throw out terms accusing ZOS of committing fraudulent business tactics... the ignorance is overwhelming

rendolpheb16_ESO

KerinKor wrote: »

rendolpheb16_ESO wrote: »

ESO was potentially a AvA niche for me, for the next upcoming years. But since I know your real intention and don't give a sh*t about what people are saying (90% poll that doesn't want AoE cap) you let some bitter taste in your game.

As someone pointed out, any poll on here is based on a self-selecting population and any year 1 stats student learns a self-selecting population is statistically invalid from the outset.

It's also a Very Good Thing MMOs aren't designed by the players, because God knows nothing would ever be agreed and the only thing most PVPers are interested in are easy wins and big damage nmbers.

A game is designed by a handful of people with a vision, and while they may tweak and twiddle based on observed FACTS, thankfully few changes are made as a result of endless PVPer QQing: sadly a few changes are made as a result of that, in the end they get reversed usually.

As a player you have the right to comment, as the designer ZOS have the right to ignore you if your view doesn't aline with their vision: and no, you don't have a right to know why.

I've seen some fatuous PVP QQ over the years on various game forums, but this thread probably takes the prize for the most fatuous due to the number who are suggesting people only bought it for capless AOE: LMAO, what a stupid idea.

You don't need a MBA to understand that a lot of people doesn't want AoE cap.

Devs aren't god, and they make mistakes. To keep an AoE cap is a big mistake.

This isn't fatuous PvP QQ, it's serious business. If you can't see further then just and AoE cap, for sure you won't understand the meaning of it. If you didn't experienced the stack zerg in GW2, for sure you won't understand the meaning of it. In your case, lack of knowledge and experience in RvR is the cause of your ignorance about how bad a AoE cap is bad for this game.

Removing the AoE cap give the opportunities to new strategies and combat mechanic.

Let's take the example of the most primitive type of AvA players, the zerger. This kind of species have the strange behaviour to stack with other kind of species. No matter how big is their number, they will accept their brothers and sisters. Once they reach a comfortable numbers, they swarm the AvA for defenceless preys. As they see a group of 12 heroes on the horizon, they start to charge mindlessly into them. The 12 spartans get the high ground and organized the most perfect AoE bomb of all time and the zerg is annihilated. This was possible of specific conditions like good positioning of the Spartans, the ultimate skill available and the timing. This heroic event wouldn't happen if an AoE cap would be keeped, because the stacked zerg would have mitigated the AoE damage through it's mass and the glorious Spartans should have been forgotten forever ...

With an AoE cap, the zerg wouldn't be scare of small group, because they know that the mass will protect them. Without the AoE cap, the zerger will need to evolve and start thinking that they aren't untouchable in the mass.

Now you have your answer. That's the reason why a lot of people are pissed off about AoE cap. This is only a small fraction of AoE cap consequences.

valkaneer2b14_ESO

Zargorius wrote: »

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Zargorius wrote: »

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

Tanthul wrote: »

Siege equipment can hit everything and target all areas if you know how/where to place them properly and which ones to use. Exception to this is highly elevated terrains but this only affects keep sieges. Learn how to use each different piece of siege equipment, use strategy, protect siege users if out in the open, use siege shield, etc etc. This is not only about character vs character. It's about strategy and tactics first of all. Run in the middle of a zerg to spam aoe hopping to kill every bad player that decides to not get outside your PBAOE range and snipe you to death is not something anyone should depend on. And since I see comments about DAoC, it was bad there as well. AOE mezz anyone? Uncapped AOE is a bad idea unless it has serious drawbacks. And siege engines is just that, uncapped AOE for loss of mobility. There must always be scissors for the paper, paper for the rock, rock for the scissors.

Who ever thinks they can blob up because of AOE max target limits you're absolutely wrong. You will be oneshot by emperors or 2-3 organized players using focused timed siege fire. We are doing it currently..imagine the amount of dead bodies if people decide to blob lol. This is how it's supposed to be. Stop crying about everything please and if you think you can blob now, go ahead please.. as long as you're not fighting for my alliance

Beshaba Tanthul, Leader of the Dark Moon PVP guild (EU Scourge AD)
Author of "Cyrodiil Alert" addon.

Strangly I dont remember how well seige equipment works inside of buildings or hallways.

Only way to stop a Zerg Style PvP with AOE caps is really to remove AOE healing, and a / Target

Scourge on EU is completely empty and AD dominated, last time I checked. Just sayin'.

What does that have to do with anything?

It has to do with people's credibility.

So I comment about siege equipment and what will have to be done to stop Zerging AFTER the patch. And the responses to that " Is about what is going on now before the patch" without a AOE caps. How does that have anything to do with credibility.

I Love how people say "Well there are no Zergs now and We here caps So that proves we're right", but they ignore the Ultimates that don't have caps still right now that stops Zerqs

Lava_Croft

rhubbert_ESO wrote: »

I love hearing people throw out terms accusing ZOS of committing fraudulent business tactics... the ignorance is overwhelming

In general the amount of pure vitriol in this thread is saddening. As if Zenimax Online Studios is an enemy of ESO that has to be fought off by a small group of Protectors of ESO.

It's poisonous.

Pixelex

And why does Encase AOE sometimes only affect for example 2 of 4 or 2 of 5 enemys? When the maximum is 6?!?

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/comment/742642

valkaneer2b14_ESO

Lava_Croft wrote: »

rhubbert_ESO wrote: »

I love hearing people throw out terms accusing ZOS of committing fraudulent business tactics... the ignorance is overwhelming

In general the amount of pure vitriol in this thread is saddening. As if Zenimax Online Studios is an enemy of ESO that has to be fought off by a small group of Protectors of ESO.

It's poisonous.

As if the fan boy club that believes ZOS can do no wrong is not just as poisonous

Gunsang

So let me get this straight by putting this into a herp-a-derp perspective.

One guy is pouring a constant stream of oil past this door--and these people want only 6 or so harmed out of the 40 people who were stupid enough to play shower-time fun-time?

What am I missing!?

Okay... lets pretend for a moment it's not for siege.

40 people run up to a guy spewing fire from every orifice of his body, and only half a dozen get hurt?

You shouldn't credit people for being stupid. That just encourages more stupid.

Lava_Croft

valkaneer2b14_ESO wrote: »

As if the fan boy club that believes ZOS can do no wrong is not just as poisonous

Yet this thread contains not a single statement that could be classified as fanboy-ish with regard to ZOS, yet the overwhelming foulness from some of the people against an AoE cap is pretty obvious.

There is nothing wrong with statements against an AoE cap or for an AoE cap, but the statements in favor or at least not negative towards an AoE cap mostly lack the foul taste that a lot of statements against the AoE cap seem to have. That was the point my post about it being poisonous. It's not really related to being a ZOS fanboy or not. I'm fairly sure there are quite a few people who don't want an AoE cap, yet could be classified as being ZOS fanboys, and vice versa.

valkaneer2b14_ESO

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