Porting out of IC (Imperial City) when fighting other players needs a fix!

Major_Mangle

I feel like a lot of people are missing the point of the thread. Thank you @React in your responses for explaining the issue more clearly. Also, your suggestion about being able to queue out while in a sanctuary zone is a good solution, but as I wrote in my initial comment I also think you should be able to accept a queue if you haven´t done or taken damage from a player within a certain time frame. This allow people to get out if they´re still stuck in combat.

First of all, bringing up the issue of ganking is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand. A ganker either takes you by surprise and with enough burst damage kills you within 1-2 GCD´s, which gives you no time to abuse the queue system, or the fail the attempt to kill their target and once you know a ganker is nearby, you´ve the upper hand because you know what´s coming and can predict further attempts. So in either scenario, bringing up ganking to the discussion is irrelevant.

There seem to be a few things going on here. The OP is upset because some PVPers are using an addon to one click out of a fight they are losing. I think this is a fair point. But before blaming the ability to port out to Cryo, try it on the console with no addons.

I brought up the example with the addon to further highlight the problem. The addon(s) in this case is an issue, but the underlying mechanic I´ve problems with is that you´re allowed to bypass the entire risk/reward design of IC. And as React wrote in an earlier comment you can easily practice the sequence of what buttons to press in order to queue for a campaign, same on PC even without addons.

We should not have to use /stuck and lose half our Tel Var.

For me this is somewhat of an indication that getting out of IC through "un-intended means" is you know....not intended. Not saying it doesn´t suck when you get clipped into terrain/walls etc, but if my suggestion to be able to accept or initiate a queue if you haven´t taken damage within a certain timeframe becomes a thing, it would solve the issue you bring up as well (since you generally speaking can´t hit or get hit by things when you clip into terrain.

@CameraBeardThePirate said it quite perfect

Or, accept that you shouldn't just get to run away from a fight in an environment where fighting over a currency is the main mechanic.

And I want to clarify, escaping through proper means like invis, streaking away, stage 4 vamp sprint or whatever proper combat mechanic that´s available to you (even out tanking the enemy and wait for your group to show up and help you) is fine. But why even have consumables (sigil of imperial retreat) designed to get you to safety in IC, when you can just bypass the entire design of IC.

Shara_Wynn

Perhaps a solution would be a non-queue IC. Where one is locked into a specific IC campaign and cannot queue for any other content. The player must leave via the sewers and ZOS could incentivize this by having double telvar drops within this locked in content.

That way those who truly wish to take all the risks, will get the greater rewards while those who are visiting for some quick pvp action while they wait in a queue (or because they don't have a lot of time to play) or those who are there to obtain scripts, or event tickets, can carry on porting out of the non-locked IC areas.

Your block/heal builds wouldn't be able to port out of fights but instead would just have to make their opponent give up from the sheer boredom of not actually being able to kill them after 30 minutes of an unstoppable force verses an immovable object.

Would pvp'ers be interested in such content? No queuing for other content allowed? Must go through sewers back to base in order to leave IC, but double Telvar from all sources (including players)? Admittedly it will split the population size of players regularly in IC, so may end up making both areas feel empty.

Also the game badly needs a /stuck command. One which just moves your character a short distance away from wherever they got stuck (yet still within the same instance) as opposed to the nearest wayshrine (whereby you are removed from the instance you were in).

As a "gank doll" I would really rather keep the porting out of IC option, otherwise I and I'll wager many others, would never set foot in IC and then what would all the gankers do?

Major_Toughness

Easiest solution is when you get queued out of IC, then you lose half your Tel Var.

Same as using "Get Me Unstuck", or dying.

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

SkaraMinoc

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

I change my stance on this. Players should not be able to port out of IC to escape PvP, especially while carrying Tel Var. This circumvents risk/reward and ruins the spirit of PvPvE. There are some issues with being stuck in combat or getting stuck in walls that need to be addressed. But these should not be the reason why you're allowed to port out of IC to avoid losing your Tel Var.

darvaria

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

^ Yes.

React

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

That is how /stuck in imperial city has ALWAYS worked. It says right in the UI when you try to use it within IC, that it will count as a death and take half your telvar. It is quite obvious that you were never intended to be able to instantly port out in combat with all of your telvar, as neither /stuck nor the retreat sigils can be used in combat.

jaws343

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

I could be wrong, but I also believe that porting to a new campaign was even an option way way back when Cyrodil and IC were connected and IC recall's did not exist. So, using the queue to leave the campaign has been around longer than Zos' recall stones.

React

jaws343 wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

I could be wrong, but I also believe that porting to a new campaign was even an option way way back when Cyrodil and IC were connected and IC recall's did not exist. So, using the queue to leave the campaign has been around longer than Zos' recall stones.

Misinformation. The stones have been here since 2015.

CameraBeardThePirate

jaws343 wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

I could be wrong, but I also believe that porting to a new campaign was even an option way way back when Cyrodil and IC were connected and IC recall's did not exist. So, using the queue to leave the campaign has been around longer than Zos' recall stones.

Complete misinformation. Sigils of retreat have always been a thing, and you have never been able to queue to a different Cyrodiil instance. Back when IC was connected to Cyrodiil, it counted as a Cyrodiil instance. You could not port out by queueing to Cyrodiil.

Jaraal

Shara_Wynn wrote: »

Perhaps a solution would be a non-queue IC. Where one is locked into a specific IC campaign and cannot queue for any other content. The player must leave via the sewers and ZOS could incentivize this by having double telvar drops within this locked in content.

No, because a lot of us queue for Gray Host and play in IC while waiting for our spot to open.

Not everyone you see disappear is trying to evade you and avoid losing tel var. I'm more than happy to fight you, and if you win half my currency, so be it. I knew the rules before I entered the content, so there are no surprises. Truth be told, I've had people on the ropes before (including Imperial Physique wearers) and close to winning the fight and and been ported to Cyro right before the KB (killing blow) when it was my turn to queue in. So it cuts both ways. But I shouldn't be blocked from doing any content I choose just because I'm queued for Cyrodiil.

CameraBeardThePirate

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

/Stuck takes half your TelVar because back when IC was introduced, the only way to safely get back to your bank to deposit stones was by using a Sigil or running back via the Sewers. ZOS didn't want people bypassing that, so they made /stuck count as a death.

When they separated IC from Cyrodiil, they failed to consider the fact that it now gave players a free escape with 0 risk to Tel Var.

Orbital78

They still haven't fixed the sweepers that knock you through the floor. I'd rather they fix something that actually effects IC gameplay.

Orbital78

Major_Toughness wrote: »

Easiest solution is when you get queued out of IC, then you lose half your Tel Var.

Same as using "Get Me Unstuck", or dying.

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

Easiest solution would be to just remove loss of tel var all together. Everyone is happy then.

Personofsecrets

React wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

That is how /stuck in imperial city has ALWAYS worked. It says right in the UI when you try to use it within IC, that it will count as a death and take half your telvar. It is quite obvious that you were never intended to be able to instantly port out in combat with all of your telvar, as neither /stuck nor the retreat sigils can be used in combat.

How many years does it take for a supposedly unintended mechanic to exist before it might as well be seen as working as intended?

drkfrontiers

I like being able to port from IC to Cyro and vice versa. Sometimes I need a break and already stuck in endless queues.

Four_Fingers

Still think it is funny the gankers want us captive till they get their gank in.
Now something is fishy because you are not supposed to be able to queue if already in combat, that needs fixed as you never could before. But maybe they let that slide because of the stuck in combat bug.

jaws343

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

I could be wrong, but I also believe that porting to a new campaign was even an option way way back when Cyrodil and IC were connected and IC recall's did not exist. So, using the queue to leave the campaign has been around longer than Zos' recall stones.

Complete misinformation. Sigils of retreat have always been a thing, and you have never been able to queue to a different Cyrodiil instance. Back when IC was connected to Cyrodiil, it counted as a Cyrodiil instance. You could not port out by queueing to Cyrodiil.

I may be wrong (and being wrong isn't misinformation, I think I was confusing the keep recalls) on the sigils, but you absolutely have always been able to queue to two instances of Cyrodil at the same time and join one instance while waiting in the queue for the other. And you can still do it today.

Jaraal

Personofsecrets wrote: »

React wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

That is how /stuck in imperial city has ALWAYS worked. It says right in the UI when you try to use it within IC, that it will count as a death and take half your telvar. It is quite obvious that you were never intended to be able to instantly port out in combat with all of your telvar, as neither /stuck nor the retreat sigils can be used in combat.

How many years does it take for a supposedly unintended mechanic to exist before it might as well be seen as working as intended?

You mean like animation cancelling?

spartaxoxo

Yes, because that's what would get more people playing IC. Nerfs. /S

CameraBeardThePirate

jaws343 wrote: »

CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Major_Toughness wrote: »

You are purposefully circumventing the rules around not being able to port in combat, and losing your Tel Var by dying.

What rule? People in this thread are making it up. There's no rule against porting to Cyrodiil and the /stuck feature should NOT lose half your Tel Var. That's ridiculous. Think about it for a second. I get pushed into a wall and now I lose half my Tel Var? Absolutely not.

There are multiple reasons why porting from IC to Cyrodiil should stay as-is. I've already listed them in this thread (e.g. griefing). I'm sure ZOS knows this and that's why you're allowed to port out in the first place.

I could be wrong, but I also believe that porting to a new campaign was even an option way way back when Cyrodil and IC were connected and IC recall's did not exist. So, using the queue to leave the campaign has been around longer than Zos' recall stones.

Complete misinformation. Sigils of retreat have always been a thing, and you have never been able to queue to a different Cyrodiil instance. Back when IC was connected to Cyrodiil, it counted as a Cyrodiil instance. You could not port out by queueing to Cyrodiil.

I may be wrong (and being wrong isn't misinformation, I think I was confusing the keep recalls) on the sigils, but you absolutely have always been able to queue to two instances of Cyrodil at the same time and join one instance while waiting in the queue for the other. And you can still do it today.

Yes, you can queue for one, then join another while outside of Cyrodiil.

What you CANNOT do is start a new queue for a Cyrodiil instance while already inside Cyrodiil. When IC was a part of Cyrodiil, you could not escape IC by queueing for a different Cyrodiil campaign, because you could not and cannot start a new queue for Cyrodiil while already in a Cyrodiil campaign.

Sheezabeast

Anyone miss the old days of having to ride past Chal resources to get to the IC entrance and people who used to gank there?

Because having to port back to your closest owned fort and ride all the way back while the ganker got your AP sounds a lot like this issue, which later was fixed by adding the queue for IC.

Ingenon

Reading through this thread made me curious to see if anyone was in Imperial City on PS/NA. Since I usually never go to Imperial City unless ZOS says I have to do a daily there to get an event ticket. So I took my PvE trials build Arcanist to CP Imperial City and started the Arboretum daily quest. Much to my surprise, there were several enemy players killing most of the NPC, and then looping back to their starting point and doing it again. I went to No CP Imperial City and finished the quest without seeing other players.

Arictheana

I think a pvp-less version of IC/Cyro would be very nice xD

Shara_Wynn

Jaraal wrote: »

Shara_Wynn wrote: »

Perhaps a solution would be a non-queue IC. Where one is locked into a specific IC campaign and cannot queue for any other content. The player must leave via the sewers and ZOS could incentivize this by having double telvar drops within this locked in content.

No, because a lot of us queue for Gray Host and play in IC while waiting for our spot to open.

Not everyone you see disappear is trying to evade you and avoid losing tel var. I'm more than happy to fight you, and if you win half my currency, so be it. I knew the rules before I entered the content, so there are no surprises. Truth be told, I've had people on the ropes before (including Imperial Physique wearers) and close to winning the fight and and been ported to Cyro right before the KB (killing blow) when it was my turn to queue in. So it cuts both ways. But I shouldn't be blocked from doing any content I choose just because I'm queued for Cyrodiil.

I don't think you read my post.

You can still play in normal IC and port out if you want to queue for any other content including Alliance locked Cyro campaigns.

In other words I am not advocating to get rid of the port out of IC as things stand.

I was presenting an alternative whereby, those who do not wish to queue for other content could join an instance of double Telvar IC where you cannot port out or queue for other content. Instead you would have to get out of dodge city via the sewers. As such you would only join this hypothetical new locked in IC double Telvar instance, if you were happy not to be queued for other content and had to leave via the sewers. Otherwise just carry on joining the normal IC instance and port out whenever you wish.

zaria

The_Ayatollah wrote: »

React wrote: »

Most of the time these are players that are in IC to farm telvar, which is a high value resource because of the "risk" associated with farming it - but that risk is non existent when you can simply press a key, hold block and heal/defensive ult for 15 seconds, and escape any player in the game regardless of their skill level or damage.

And may I ask what risk do you (or any ganker) take when you enter the zone with 0 tel var and hunt a person who holds let's say 10k tel var? Because to me it looks like you can get all the reward and no risk. So how is that high risk for you?
Actually this is very common strategy for gankers, they go to IC holding 0 tel var, they gank people and if they fail they lose nothing, if they succed they gain a lot of reward, so I don't understand this concept of "high risk - high reward" when some playeres (and especially those who use nb class) take no risk but just reward.

LOL reminds me of I on an PvE NB build in IC, trying to do an quest during mayhem who I did not know had started.
Killed some mob and got attacked fought back, killed the guy and got an +X telvar achievement, it was over 10 K.
Yes this was some other quester who did not know you should bank it, leave 100 or 1000 if pro.
I obviously cloaked went into sneak and found an place to port out while hiding better.

Now for the gankers, they will are unlikely to strike gold like I did here as in jackpot they build up more and more over time unless they camp at the return paths who porting avoids.

SeaGtGruff

It is not "misinformation" that we used to be able to queue for a different campaign while already in Cyrodiil or IC back before IC got its own campaigns. We absolutely could do that.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/5946803/#Comment_5946803

Vaqual

Orbital78 wrote: »

I would rather they just totally remove losing tel var all together. It might entice more people to visit IC.

Then they have to remove the bonus multiplier and it will be just another uneventful grind.

FlopsyPrince

Vaqual wrote: »

Orbital78 wrote: »

I would rather they just totally remove losing tel var all together. It might entice more people to visit IC.

Then they have to remove the bonus multiplier and it will be just another uneventful grind.

It already is an uneventful grind, except for getting ganked, for many of us.

I still like the quests, but the idiocy of having to watch continually for gankers, especially ones camping by objectives during events, is disgusting.

sarahthes

One good solution could just be a queue delay if you try to port out. Then you can port out for legit reasons, but you may have to fight for it for a while.

darvaria

The BEST solution is to fix something that really needs fixing. LIKE STUCK IN COMBAT.