Guild trader listings being changed to 14 days??!?

allochthons · April 29

From this comment:

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Hello, All. We have received a lot of feedback regarding the changes to the Mail expiration timers on the PTS. We understand the concerns raised around shortening Mail timers, specifically in instances where a player may need to step away from the game for an extended period of time, and that with this shortened window they may miss items or gold coming from Guild Traders through the Mail.

As we reviewed this feedback and investigated those concerns, our data revealed that the vast majority of items listed at Guild Traders sell within a week. If an item does not sell by then, it typically doesn't sell during that listing period. In light of this, Guild Trader listings will now be reduced from 30 to 14 days. All Mail expiration timers will remain at 14 days. To be clear, the timer for Mail expiration will be 14 days from when the item sells or is returned to the player. A Guild Trader listing will expire 14 days from when an item is listed. This will affect all new Mail items and Guild Trader listings from U42 launch onward.

We understand that this may not be the news some of you were hoping to hear, and want to provide context for this decision. Based on the data of how quickly items typically sell, the team felt that 30 days for Guild Trader listings was unnecessarily long, and reducing the Mail expiration timers and the Guild Trader listings will allow for improvements in server performance by reducing strain on the database.

If you plan on being away from the game for an extended period, we recommend taking those personal plans into account when making decisions regarding Guild Trader listings.

We hope this information has been insightful, and as always, you are welcome to leave additional feedback in the PTS section of the Forums.

allochthons · April 29

This is an APPALLINGLY bad idea.

Using the trading guild system on console is already incredibly time consuming.
I spend literally hours every week keeping 3 guild trader memberships full: 1 capital, 1 secondary (Vivec right now, sometimes Grahtwood), and 1 third tier. Most of what I sell is motifs, furniture blueprints, and overland gear. It usually takes a week or 3 to sell, because those aren't high-volume items like potions, materials, or food. My Clockwork Reliquary runebox sold after 45 days. Timbercrow usually takes 2-3 months. And those items are at competitive (albeit very expensive) prices.

If I have to relist things twice as often, I simply WON'T.

PLEASE DON'T MAKE THIS CHANGE.

MidniteOwl1913 · April 29

These changes basically make the system twice as expensive to use. It will have a negative impact on trading. If I'm getting half the time the fees should reflect that.

Araneae6537 · April 29

Hmm, that’s true for many listings, although I’ve found that furnishings sometimes take longer to sell. It would be nice if there was an option to list longer, maybe for a higher tax?

It’s a shame that they feel the mail needs to expire after only 14 days as 30 days seems more reasonable to cover vacations, moving, other irl stuff… I do wonder how other games can have non-expiring mail, or why it’s a problem in ESO. 🤔

dragonlord500 · April 29

err wrong section of the forums to discuss this isn't it?

ArchangelIsraphel · April 29

......some higher priced items take longer than a week to sell, but they do eventually sell (Like golded gear, high end furnishings, ext..) this is a phenomenally bad idea that shows a lack of understanding of the portion of your player base that trades.

This data is honestly TOO wide spread- of course it's going to seem like things don't sell within 30 days when there are tons of inexpensive listings for low-end items that no one is going to purchase! (like green recipes that people get all the time)

More expensive items might take longer to sell- but do sell eventually! This is just shooting guilds in the foot by forcing members to pay twice for listing fees

Why even do this? it makes no sense

Danikat · April 29

I'm not sure how I feel about this.

In my other MMO there's no time limit for listings on the (global) store and my arbitrary rule has always been 15 days, for both sales and buy orders, if it's still up after that I take it down and relist at a different price. So this decision is pretty much what I picked for myself given the freedom to choose.

Also I'm one of the people who was worried about missing gold from sales, or having to manually remove everything when I go away (yes there have been times I've been away for more than 14 days, without quitting the game, and it will happen again) so I'm glad they're addressing that.

On the other hand I've definitely had items in ESO sell after more than 14 days and the guild store UI makes it time consuming to list stuff, so it will be annoying to have to update sales more often.

Overall I suppose this is an improvement for me over the previous plan, but it's irritating, especially because it seems odd that after 10 years they've now decided the mail system is a problem.

Grec1a · April 29

I price my items competitively and haven't had anything returned to me unsold in several months. However plenty of items take longer than 14 days to sell - one sold last week after 26 days. That item was a PVP armour piece, but I've had motifs, furnishing plans, master writs and collectible fragments take a while to sell (and also sell within minutes!). It's not like I can stop listing slow-moving items, as it's not possible to predict in advance what they'll be...

dmnqwk · April 29

I think this is a wonderful idea.

They looked at the numbers, then acted without letting individual personal bias taint by people decrying it going 'oh but for ME I will use confirmation bias and a failure to accept this because ONE item out of HUNDREDS sold after longer'.

I am glad they used data and not the personal opinions of the forums.

RicAlmighty · April 29

[Removed]

heaven13 · April 29

Furnishing and expensive furnishing recipes typically move a lot slower than other stuff. This is a horrible change.

DenverRalphy · April 29

I can't help but think this is more an attempt to curb crazy high prices on the traders, by encouraging players to price items to sell faster rather than sit there longer for huge payouts. If that's the case, I could argue both for and against it.

wolfie1.0. · April 29

More proof that this game can't support a central selling method.

Varana · April 29

dragonlord500 wrote: »

err wrong section of the forums to discuss this isn't it?

No, because this will also affect those players who (understandably) do not look into the PTS forums.

ClowdyAllDay · April 29

So you expect us to believe that the guild traders and the mail are whats responsible for bad server performance?

Really?

Grec1a · April 29

dmnqwk wrote: »

They looked at the numbers, then acted without letting individual personal bias taint by people decrying it going 'oh but for ME I will use confirmation bias and a failure to accept this because ONE item out of HUNDREDS sold after longer'.

I am glad they used data and not the personal opinions of the forums.

Well they need to make this 'data' available to the players then. Even with pricing my items within the cheapest 1-3 on TTC (maybe 4th cheapest if there's a weird 'outlier', like a 10k item priced at 100g) there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as to what does or doesn't sell quickly. Why does one fragment of the swamp jelly pet sell within an hour and a different one take 20 days, when they're both the same price?

What 'vast majority of items' sell within a week? All of them? Or are some things - like furnishings or recipes - always slower to shift? If so, I won't bother listing them then. Or I'll just list everything at 50% of the lowest priced item on TTC.

This is preferable to the team's suggestion of including Elder Scrolls Online in my vacation planning

I already have to plan around my colleagues, my partner, my partner's colleagues, my dogsitter, etc., etc. I don't need to add ESO to the mix! Talk about turning a 'fun' game into a second job...

JoeCapricorn · April 29

The fact that everyone hates this change is just going to mean they are going to force it through and not listen to feedback.

wolfie1.0. · April 29

Grec1a wrote: »

dmnqwk wrote: »

They looked at the numbers, then acted without letting individual personal bias taint by people decrying it going 'oh but for ME I will use confirmation bias and a failure to accept this because ONE item out of HUNDREDS sold after longer'.

I am glad they used data and not the personal opinions of the forums.

Well they need to make this 'data' available to the players then. Even with pricing my items within the cheapest 1-3 on TTC (maybe 4th cheapest if there's a weird 'outlier', like a 10k item priced at 100g) there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason as to what does or doesn't sell quickly. Why does one fragment of the swamp jelly pet sell within an hour and a different one take 20 days, when they're both the same price?

What 'vast majority of items' sell within a week? All of them? Or are some things - like furnishings or recipes - always slower to shift? If so, I won't bother listing them then. Or I'll just list everything at 50% of the lowest priced item on TTC.

This is preferable to the team's suggestion of including Elder Scrolls Online in my vacation planning I already have to plan around my colleagues, my partner, my partner's colleagues, my dogsitter, etc., etc. I don't need to add ESO to the mix! Talk about turning a 'fun' game into a second job...

I mean the easy solution is to clear out your mail and remove any listings before you leave on vacation if it's going to be one longer than the time frame.

Grec1a · April 29

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

I mean the easy solution is to clear out your mail and remove any listings before you leave on vacation if it's going to be one longer than the time frame.

Won't be an issue if they provide the data to show me how to sell everything within a week...

Carcamongus · April 29

How will making us list items more often reduce server strain?

spartaxoxo · April 29

Grec1a wrote: »

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

I mean the easy solution is to clear out your mail and remove any listings before you leave on vacation if it's going to be one longer than the time frame.

Won't be an issue if they provide the data to show me how to sell everything within a week...

Most items are being listed too expensive if they don't sell within a week, tbh.

wolfie1.0. · April 29

Grec1a wrote: »

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

I mean the easy solution is to clear out your mail and remove any listings before you leave on vacation if it's going to be one longer than the time frame.

Won't be an issue if they provide the data to show me how to sell everything within a week...

Lower your prices.

Well can't complain about zos not doing anything about Inflation.

Grec1a · April 29

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

Lower your prices.

Well can't complain about zos not doing anything about Inflation.

Er... yeah... That's why I said I'd rather list all my items at 50% of the lowest priced item on TTC than include ESO in my vacation planning...

I'd like to spend the evening before I fly out making sure I've packed everything I need without my luggage being overweight, checking in online and seeing if there are any roadworks on the way to the airport - rather than doing ESO guild trader/inbox maintenance. I guess my priorities are all wrong...

wolfie1.0. · April 29

Grec1a wrote: »

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

Lower your prices.

Well can't complain about zos not doing anything about Inflation.

Er... yeah... That's why I said I'd rather list all my items at 50% of the lowest priced item on TTC than include ESO in my vacation planning...

I'd like to spend the evening before I fly out making sure I've packed everything I need without my luggage being overweight, checking in online and seeing if there are any roadworks on the way to the airport - rather than doing ESO guild trader/inbox maintenance. I guess my priorities are all wrong...

My response was a little tongue and cheek. I will be honest, I don't exactly like the change. But it can be worked around. And ya I also find it annoying that if I'm going to go on an extended trip thst I have to find a way to login or schedule time to clean out my games mail service and trades before I go.

CrashTest · April 29

This will tank prices.

wolfie1.0. · April 29

CrashTest wrote: »

This will tank prices.

Not really, most items do sell within 14 days in some areas they will sell within hours. It's the outlier items that will stick around and the really rare items that will be most impacted but those are all high risk/reward items. At most it will curb inflation.

SilverBride · April 29

If my listings don't sell in a few days I usually take them down and relist at a lower price. The exception bring furnishings that sometimes take a couple of weeks because someone has to be looking for that particular furnishing as opposed to general crafting mats etc..

I don't know if this will affect how I sell now but it does raise some concerns.

huntgod_ESO · April 29

So this makes listing expensive items, 1 million and up pretty stupid expensive, since higher cost items, unless lowballed, can take a cycle or two to sell, not they are twice as expensive to list and you have to do it way more often.

Why change this now, 10 years into release. I have no doubt that most items do sell withing 7-14 days, but the ones that don't are going to be at the high end of the market...I mean if the goal it to further depress the value of gold by pushing people to list at lower prices, this will work wonders.

CGPsaint · April 29

Based on the data of how quickly items typically sell, the team felt that 30 days for Guild Trader listings was unnecessarily long, and reducing the Mail expiration timers and the Guild Trader listings will allow for improvements in server performance by reducing strain on the database.

1.) Is the cost to list an item going to be halved since we're effectively going to have to list unsold items twice in order to get the same listing duration for harder to sell items?

2.) If the goal is to reduce strain on the database to improve server performance, wouldn't it make more sense to try and get people to stop listing so much garbage on traders? Maybe slightly increase the value when selling to merchants so that people don't try and sell every single item that they loot on guild traders.

huntgod_ESO · April 29

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

CrashTest wrote: »

This will tank prices.

Not really, most items do sell within 14 days in some areas they will sell within hours. It's the outlier items that will stick around and the really rare items that will be most impacted but those are all high risk/reward items. At most it will curb inflation.

It will actually create massive deflation...as listers are going to be far more aggressive to push prices down so they can get faster sales.

Carcamongus · April 29

CGPsaint wrote: »

Based on the data of how quickly items typically sell, the team felt that 30 days for Guild Trader listings was unnecessarily long, and reducing the Mail expiration timers and the Guild Trader listings will allow for improvements in server performance by reducing strain on the database.

1.) Is the cost to list an item going to be halved since we're effectively going to have to list unsold items twice in order to get the same listing duration for harder to sell items?

2.) If the goal is to reduce strain on the database to improve server performance, wouldn't it make more sense to try and get people to stop listing so much garbage on traders? Maybe slightly increase the value when selling to merchants so that people don't try and sell every single item that they loot on guild traders.

It's comical to pick up some garbage by accident and see TTC has data on it. There's also the style mats for the 8 basic motifs plus Imperial, which crafting merchants sell and people list on guild traders. It puzzles me as to why. Surely someone who knows how to use a guild trader also knows the merchants sell those, right?

To solve some of the garbage problem, maybe make some of them bind on pickup so they can't be listed?