2022: ESO's Worst Year, A Retrospective

BlakMarket

sarahthes wrote: »

I have to say, finding open trials and even cores that are recruiting is significantly harder now than it was 6 months ago. Filling raids also seems to be a lot more difficult.

It's sad. I came back (after a 6 month break) specifically to get Planesbreaker and Swash. But finding cores has been very very hard so far.

Around 90% of pug prog raid leads left after u35. Not even exaggerating. Extremely sad tbh

BlakMarket

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The trade guild I'm in is doing great and the crafting mats I sell have stayed basically the same prices for quite awhile now. If a trade guild isn't doing well it could be due to their location or other reasons because I continue to see the same guilds in the same locations and these aren't dropping like flies.

Oh what guild?

edit: also, are you having any issues with block today?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oo3r7htWAx8
for pc

Katheriah

Sounds like the worst question in the world to find out stuff about people, but that might be me.

LesserCircle

Kingsindarkness wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The trade guild I'm in is doing great and the crafting mats I sell have stayed basically the same prices for quite awhile now. If a trade guild isn't doing well it could be due to their location or other reasons because I continue to see the same guilds in the same locations and these aren't dropping like flies.

Oh what guild?

edit: also, are you having any issues with block today?

[snip]

"What is Raiding like in ESO? Something like this"
Yeah

[edited to remove quote]

sarahthes

BlakMarket wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

I have to say, finding open trials and even cores that are recruiting is significantly harder now than it was 6 months ago. Filling raids also seems to be a lot more difficult.

It's sad. I came back (after a 6 month break) specifically to get Planesbreaker and Swash. But finding cores has been very very hard so far.

Around 90% of pug prog raid leads left after u35. Not even exaggerating. Extremely sad tbh

Some of us left before that. I refuse to raid lead anymore because burning out on it is part of why I quit.

Elsonso

sarahthes wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

Troodon80 wrote: »

If we had more questing content being streamed, do you really think viewership would skyrocket? It almost assuredly wouldn't. It's not because content creators are "only" showing raids and PvP. That's just pure speculation and guesswork on your part.

Be careful when comparing games. ESO and FFXIV may be MMO games, but that does not mean they appeal to the same audience demographics.

ESO may appeal to a demographic that does not value video content as much as the people who play FFXIV.

But it used to.

So what happened?

Actually, I do not think that ESO has ever really appealed to the Twitch video crowd. At least, not the social part of Twitch. Thousands will show up for ESO Live and the January press event, but just hanging out with other players on Twitch has never really taken off with this game. It does not help that ZOS was late to the party with the Stream Team.

Troodon80

Elsonso wrote: »

Be careful when comparing games. ESO and FFXIV may be MMO games, but that does not mean they appeal to the same audience demographics.

ESO may appeal to a demographic that does not value video content as much as the people who play FFXIV.

I'm very well aware. But that's part of the problem with saying it's because of the type of content being streamed. It wouldn't matter if everything being streamed was "casual" or "hard core end game." The game itself appeals to completely different audiences. The audiences themselves don't have the same desires so far as streaming goes. Nor, I dare say, is the viewership indicitive of actual player population.

sarahthes

Elsonso wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

Troodon80 wrote: »

If we had more questing content being streamed, do you really think viewership would skyrocket? It almost assuredly wouldn't. It's not because content creators are "only" showing raids and PvP. That's just pure speculation and guesswork on your part.

Be careful when comparing games. ESO and FFXIV may be MMO games, but that does not mean they appeal to the same audience demographics.

ESO may appeal to a demographic that does not value video content as much as the people who play FFXIV.

But it used to.

So what happened?

Actually, I do not think that ESO has ever really appealed to the Twitch video crowd. At least, not the social part of Twitch. Thousands will show up for ESO Live and the January press event, but just hanging out with other players on Twitch has never really taken off with this game. It does not help that ZOS was late to the party with the Stream Team.

The number of viewers has dropped a ton though. Summer/Fall 2020 is when I first got involved in the ESO Twitch community and there were a lot of streamers pulling in 200-350 viewers. The community was vibrant and active, and fairly interconnected between PvP and PvE endgame. Now it's so much smaller.

Tandor

sarahthes wrote: »

BlakMarket wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

I have to say, finding open trials and even cores that are recruiting is significantly harder now than it was 6 months ago. Filling raids also seems to be a lot more difficult.

It's sad. I came back (after a 6 month break) specifically to get Planesbreaker and Swash. But finding cores has been very very hard so far.

Around 90% of pug prog raid leads left after u35. Not even exaggerating. Extremely sad tbh

Some of us left before that. I refuse to raid lead anymore because burning out on it is part of why I quit.

From what I have read, and it was predicted, some of the decline in endgame PvE apart from the combat changes and burnout more generally is also down to account-wide-achievements. Some of the veteran players used to get the achievements on their main and then still be happy to take other players through the content on their alts because they also got the achievements so there was a purpose to it, now they don't see the point in doing so beyond altruism which only goes so far.

Ruslanchik

The game is no longer a game, but a set of errors, bugs, nothing works. I'm tired of putting up with this disrespectful attitude. No matter how much you write, they still do not correct mistakes. Breaking the game is right! Making updates that are not needed at all! Way to go, developers. Personally, I'm leaving. Garbage - not a game

Elsonso

sarahthes wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

Troodon80 wrote: »

If we had more questing content being streamed, do you really think viewership would skyrocket? It almost assuredly wouldn't. It's not because content creators are "only" showing raids and PvP. That's just pure speculation and guesswork on your part.

Be careful when comparing games. ESO and FFXIV may be MMO games, but that does not mean they appeal to the same audience demographics.

ESO may appeal to a demographic that does not value video content as much as the people who play FFXIV.

But it used to.

So what happened?

Actually, I do not think that ESO has ever really appealed to the Twitch video crowd. At least, not the social part of Twitch. Thousands will show up for ESO Live and the January press event, but just hanging out with other players on Twitch has never really taken off with this game. It does not help that ZOS was late to the party with the Stream Team.

The number of viewers has dropped a ton though. Summer/Fall 2020 is when I first got involved in the ESO Twitch community and there were a lot of streamers pulling in 200-350 viewers. The community was vibrant and active, and fairly interconnected between PvP and PvE endgame. Now it's so much smaller.

Yes, and that is an interesting trend. Unfortunate for those who try to make a bit from streaming ESO on Twitch.

I have dropped Twitch almost completely, and the reason for that is ADVERTISING. I am a "channel flipper" so I pop into a stream to see what is happening, and if I like it, I stick around. If all I see is some ad playing because I am not a subscriber, I go off and do something else. That same ad will play on every stream I try, it isn't likely to be anything I am interested in, and the result is just me wasting time when I could be doing something else. I choose to do something else. Where I used to watch several hours of Twitch streams every week, ESO and others, I now watch... ZERO.

In my case, the fact that I am not in ESO streams anymore is secondary to the fact that I am just not on Twitch anymore. No way I am going to subscribe to every streamer I wandered into just to get ads removed.

Metrics are interesting, but understanding what drives them, and what makes them change, is no simple matter. There are a lot of factors involved. I would not discount the combined effects of a generally disinterested (in watching streams) player base and increased focus on video advertising on the platform.

Cryptor

It's been arguably the best year in ESO ever for me. I have never seen this many players active in my guild and in the new content as it releases. Having a blast.

SilverBride

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The trade guild I'm in is doing great and the crafting mats I sell have stayed basically the same prices for quite awhile now. If a trade guild isn't doing well it could be due to their location or other reasons because I continue to see the same guilds in the same locations and these aren't dropping like flies.

Oh what guild?

edit: also, are you having any issues with block today?

It's not my guild so I don't feel it's my place to name them, but this guild and the one I was in previously (that I left after new leadership was lacking) are both doing great with sales. But I'd like to know which guilds fell apart because I still see a lot of familiar trade guilds in spots they have been occupying for a very long time.

And it seems that block was fixed.

Troodon80

SilverBride wrote: »

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh yeah, it was fixed all right.

SilverBride

Troodon80 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh yeah, it was fixed all right.

That's what another poster said and I had no reason to doubt them.

But block is a bug anyway, and one that has been or will be fixed. One bug does not constitute the worst year ever.

ForumBully

I don't really ever use block, so for me this doesn't matter...such a great year /s

BlakMarket

Cryptor wrote: »

It's been arguably the best year in ESO ever for me. I have never seen this many players active in my guild and in the new content as it releases. Having a blast.

After watching your stream, are you quite new to ESO? And very casual? I started noticing the problems closer to middle/end game content for me.

Everaen

This is the first full year I played ESO. Previous years, I would dip in for a couple of months, and then find other games. This year, I grinded out sixteen level 50 characters, now sitting at 1450-ish CP.

I can say, there's a lot to do in this game if you haven't been grinding it for years. It is fun still if you're relatively fresh to the grind.

But I can also say, I can see the signs of an aging game.

I work in tech. I know generally companies don't spend the money to go re-write/optimize old code -- partly because the devs who created the old code are gone to other projects/companies now, and partly because re-writing/optimizing old code doesn't make the company new money.

That's probably why so many bugs keep landing with these updates. Newer and/or less talented devs are tweaking things that unintentionally break code that past devs implemented. And cutting edge talent is likely being shifted to newer projects with newer engines and capabilities, leaving behind a mostly maintenance crew of devs to keep the ESO lights on.

That doesn't mean ESO is in jeopardy necessarily. Look at WoW, still going strong. Players don't necessarily need the best graphics and animations to stick to a game. But all the newer and upcoming hyped MMOs will offer similar gameplay to ESO. The devs at ESO should strive to at least offer as few hiccups as possible. A solid, dependable, fun experience.

DemonicGoat

SilverBride wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The trade guild I'm in is doing great and the crafting mats I sell have stayed basically the same prices for quite awhile now. If a trade guild isn't doing well it could be due to their location or other reasons because I continue to see the same guilds in the same locations and these aren't dropping like flies.

Oh what guild?

edit: also, are you having any issues with block today?

It's not my guild so I don't feel I have the right to name them, but this guild and the one I was in previously (that I left after new leadership was lacking) are both doing great with sales. But I'd like to know which guilds fell apart because I still see a lot of familiar trade guilds in spots they have been occupying for a very long time.

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh, I see.well maybe you could reach out to the guild leader and ask him if theyre recruiting? Esofam?

The big one that died? Project Vitality.

https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/wnrjct/update_from_nefas_on_project_vitality_in_update_35/

226 raid leads down to 60 at the time of this video.1600 raids down to 60-120 per month. etc etc.

Katheriah

SilverBride wrote: »

Troodon80 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh yeah, it was fixed all right.

That's what another poster said and I had no reason to doubt them.

But block is a bug anyway, and one that has been or will be fixed. One bug does not constitute the worst year ever.

It's not one bug. It's a consistent stream of bugs that shouldn't be there.

Block is a great example because it's been broken for weeks after trying to fix something and not been tested properly. Now when they try to fix it again they break it further.

Just like the stylepage drop that's broken 3 or 4 times in a row.

I played through this year's story and done all quests. I've never seen this amount of bugs in quests, and never before had to restart this many quests.

CrashTest

Katheriah wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

edit: also, are you having any issues with block today?

They fixed block. Block is great! Nothing to see here.

What colour would you like your next sorry-guar to be btw?

It should be blue to match the death recap screen that those who still want to play will be seeing more of thanks to today's block bug fix.

baltic1284

Katheriah wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Troodon80 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh yeah, it was fixed all right.

That's what another poster said and I had no reason to doubt them.

But block is a bug anyway, and one that has been or will be fixed. One bug does not constitute the worst year ever.

It's not one bug. It's a consistent stream of bugs that shouldn't be there.

Block is a great example because it's been broken for weeks after trying to fix something and not been tested properly. Now when they try to fix it again they break it further.

Just like the stylepage drop that's broken 3 or 4 times in a row.

I played through this year's story and done all quests. I've never seen this amount of bugs in quests, and never before had to restart this many quests.

I feel you there will bugs happen yes. they do but not like this, and say you fixed one just to break it even further, come on now really. In all though you shouldn't have to fight for a fix just for the fix to break what is reported even more. For the first time since i started playing this game back in 2014 and for Beta testing i fianlly watched the game update properly with no issues for the first time ever.

me_ming

Tandor wrote: »

me_ming wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

The development of next year's chapter is likely already done so I guess you probably need to aim for 2024. And I'm sorry to be the lone voice here, but I had no bugs at all this year. I know that pvp and endgame players did, but I haven't any interest in those modes - so it's not something I'm going to get my knickers in a twist over, since there's already plenty of that going on around here.

I hope you all find what you're looking for in this game, but if you're expecting major changes next year you may be whistling in the wind.

I'm just curious, [snip] what if the chapter next year added more content for PvP or if they made it that you can't solo kill a single overland monster? what if they made it that you NEED to group to actually accomplish anything in the next patch or chapter? [snip]

[edited for baiting]

That's very unfair. What @TaSheen actually said was that she didn't have any problems and wouldn't dwell on other people's problems because they were doing so already - that's totally different to saying they shouldn't complain either.

Like her, I haven't suffered from any bugs this year and I've also adapted to any changes that affected me which was primarily the change to AwA to which I was very opposed. However, I adapted the way I play the game with a resulting loss of revenue to ZOS and that's that.

[snip]

And please don't tell me about adopting to this game. I've been adopting to this game since they took out Templar's Blinding Light skill, or Breath of Life being able to heal 3 people at the same time and from behind a wall, or when Shards could stan, or when Repentance was a skill templar healers actually slotted. So yeah, I've been to a lot of changes in this game and adopted.

What I've noticed with most "solo" players (not all, but most) they are really here just because they are enjoying the game, their always defense is "if you don't enjoy it, then leave". That's what you do when you buy a single player game, you buy it because you want to enjoy it. That is NOT what an MMORPG is. That is why many players have endured ESO through all it's changes. We are here because we love this game. We are here despite our classes and races and whatnots being nerfed to the ground. We are not players thinking one day we will just drop this game because it's not fun for us anymore. We want to be listened too. [snip]

[edited for baiting & to remove quote]

AzuraFan

me_ming wrote: »

[snip]

She's not responsible for keeping the game alive so you can play it. I'm sure most players are like her (I know I am) and wouldn't keep playing a game that's no longer fun for them. I wouldn't expect those who enjoy trials and vet content and PvP to keep playing, when it's no longer fun for them, because I'm enjoying overland.

(It's not only solo players who would leave if the game is no longer fun. There have been a lot of discussions -- including in this thread -- about endgame players, those who enjoy vet content and trials, who have left. That's fine. They don't owe me, a player who doesn't participate in those activities, a thing.)

[edited to remove quote]

Paralyse

The block bug is extremely bad.
The vHOF purge bug is bad.

Other than those two issues, I have enjoyed the game for the most part in 2022. Yes, there are annoyances, things to be fixed, features I'd wish they added; I don't like Tribute, but don't care if it's in the game for others to enjoy. The constant "change for change's sake" when it comes to balancing classes in PvE has really been rougher to deal with. I spend much more time than I used to farming transmute crystals just to keep up with every new update and the radical meta shifts that come with it.

But -- with the amount of money and time I have spent in and on ESO, there's no other game on the market that I would even consider looking at for more than a minute. I'm too old and have spent way too much money and time to go somewhere else, losing all my friends that I've made in ESO along the way from beta in late 2013 to today. I've long since retired from the dumpster fire that is WoW (haven't even bought new expansion yet, first time since Lich King.)

For better or worse, ESO is my home. now and in the future, until the servers are dead and gone. If they fix it, great! If not, I'll play it anyway.

For what it's worth, by the way, we are not having any difficulty filling vet/vet HM trials on most of my discord servers, but trifecta progression cores such as GS, TTT, etc have been greatly hurt by the block bug and seem to be dying off.

One final thought -- there are a large, large number of players who have never done a trial, never set foot in Cyrodiil, don't do battlegrounds, don't run vet or vet DLC dungeons, and don't care about parsing or the meta. They log on, quest, craft, do housing, maybe play some Tribute, RP with a guild or a group, or just walk around the world taking everything in. If you ask those players what they think about ESO, you will get different answers than if you ask the forums. It's dangerous to assume that the forums somehow "represent" the ESO player base; the forums are merely one subset of the many different ESO players. The forums tend to attract people who have an axe to grind because there's not anywhere else for those people to vent their opinion; as a result, someone reading these forums might think the game was in much worse shape than it is, simply because they're only seeing one side of the story.

(Angry people are much more likely to come post here to gripe about something than happy people are to come post here about how much they enjoy something.)

dinokstrunz

The treatment of ESO this year has been shockingly bad, the worst on ESOs records, we're dropping back to pre one tamriel level of awkwardness. ESO is no longer considered a top 5 or 10 MMO anymore. [snip]

[edited for bashing]

CrashTest

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

The trade guild I'm in is doing great and the crafting mats I sell have stayed basically the same prices for quite awhile now. If a trade guild isn't doing well it could be due to their location or other reasons because I continue to see the same guilds in the same locations and these aren't dropping like flies.

Oh what guild?

edit: also, are you having any issues with block today?

It's not my guild so I don't feel I have the right to name them, but this guild and the one I was in previously (that I left after new leadership was lacking) are both doing great with sales. But I'd like to know which guilds fell apart because I still see a lot of familiar trade guilds in spots they have been occupying for a very long time.

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh, I see.well maybe you could reach out to the guild leader and ask him if theyre recruiting? Esofam?

The big one that died? Project Vitality.

https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/wnrjct/update_from_nefas_on_project_vitality_in_update_35/

226 raid leads down to 60 at the time of this video.1600 raids down to 60-120 per month. etc etc.

That's the brutal truth.

As for trading guilds, sales are down in some big trading guilds which is unusual after a patch. When I say "big" I mean billion+ per week. I won't say anything more as I don't want to out my guild or other big players bc anyone who's into serious trading, knows that bidding wars are cutthroat. I swear by the Nine that kiosk bidding is the unofficial ESO PvP.

Elsonso

ForumBully wrote: »

I don't really ever use block, so for me this doesn't matter...such a great year /s

Aye. Any game is a great experience if you stay away from all the bugs.

DemonicGoat wrote: »

The big one that died? Project Vitality.

226 raid leads down to 60 at the time of this video.1600 raids down to 60-120 per month. etc etc.

Did Project Vitality ever recover from Update 35? I sort of lost track, and interest.

SilverBride

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

It's not my guild so I don't feel I have the right to name them, but this guild and the one I was in previously (that I left after new leadership was lacking) are both doing great with sales. But I'd like to know which guilds fell apart because I still see a lot of familiar trade guilds in spots they have been occupying for a very long time.

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh, I see.well maybe you could reach out to the guild leader and ask him if theyre recruiting? Esofam?

The big one that died? Project Vitality.

https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/wnrjct/update_from_nefas_on_project_vitality_in_update_35/

226 raid leads down to 60 at the time of this video.1600 raids down to 60-120 per month. etc etc.

I don't doubt that some trial guilds were affected by U35, but I was replying specifically to the claim that trade guild sales are down.

DemonicGoat

SilverBride wrote: »

DemonicGoat wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

It's not my guild so I don't feel I have the right to name them, but this guild and the one I was in previously (that I left after new leadership was lacking) are both doing great with sales. But I'd like to know which guilds fell apart because I still see a lot of familiar trade guilds in spots they have been occupying for a very long time.

And it seems that block was fixed.

Oh, I see.well maybe you could reach out to the guild leader and ask him if theyre recruiting? Esofam?

The big one that died? Project Vitality.

https://www.reddit.com/r/elderscrollsonline/comments/wnrjct/update_from_nefas_on_project_vitality_in_update_35/

226 raid leads down to 60 at the time of this video.1600 raids down to 60-120 per month. etc etc.

I don't doubt that some trial guilds were affected by U35, but I was replying specifically to the claim that trade guild sales are down.

So,.. you see these numbers and accept them? The loss of these endgame players also translates to less mats and gear flowing into traders. and also Im guessing you would now concede there has been a large decline in player base?

@CrashTest's post #389 up above yours does detail his trade guild experience which ties right into the loss of all those raiders.

Did you happen to get a chance to ask your gm if theyre recruiting,.. any trade guild that has been unaffected by whats going on should be in high demand so Id understand if no more slots were available but I have about 5 years of hoarded items I want to offload.

Thanks!