High Isle's frustrating Warden changes are a disappointing step back.

Aldoss

Mr_Stach wrote: »

With Wild Guardian being all bleedy with Hemorrhage, Eternal Guardian is VERY Bland now. So in efforts to alleviate that, here's the Arctic Guardian, refocusing the damage to Frost Damage and dealing extra damage to chilled targets with the Maul ability.

I love this idea because the bear's true potential has always been stuck behind the execute component, which is the most useless place for an execute to be. This is compounded by the bear's sometimes haptic ai targeting. It already suffers from massive delay in group v group settings.

Make the activation weaker than the execute scale of the bleed damage morph, but it can be used more readily for burst, like most ultimates. Love the idea of chilled scaling.

ESO_Nightingale

Aldoss wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

With Wild Guardian being all bleedy with Hemorrhage, Eternal Guardian is VERY Bland now. So in efforts to alleviate that, here's the Arctic Guardian, refocusing the damage to Frost Damage and dealing extra damage to chilled targets with the Maul ability.

I love this idea because the bear's true potential has always been stuck behind the execute component, which is the most useless place for an execute to be. This is compounded by the bear's sometimes haptic ai targeting. It already suffers from massive delay in group v group settings.

Make the activation weaker than the execute scale of the bleed damage morph, but it can be used more readily for burst, like most ultimates. Love the idea of chilled scaling.

Personally, i think that the idea of chilled scaling in general is good, especially chilled execute scaling. However, i don't think bear needs this. As mag bear is already 15% of our damage, this type of scaling makes bear so incredibly much of our damage it's just insane. I'd rather see bear's passive damage nerfed significantly (and that loss scaled into new frost damage abilities) and it's activation not touched at all first. I also think chilled scaling should be reserved for another type of frost damage skill. Maybe even northern storm. Bear is too good right now.

LeHarrt91

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

ESO_Nightingale

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

the only problem i have with frozen gate being turned into another version of scalding rune is that it's just a bit boring. if it had some kind of unique scaling, like execute/execute based on chilled or some other damage bonus it'd probably be fair game.

LeHarrt91

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

the only problem i have with frozen gate being turned into another version of scalding rune is that it's just a bit boring. if it had some kind of unique scaling, like execute/execute based on chilled or some other damage bonus it'd probably be fair game.

Scaling like Venomous Claw?

ESO_Nightingale

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

the only problem i have with frozen gate being turned into another version of scalding rune is that it's just a bit boring. if it had some kind of unique scaling, like execute/execute based on chilled or some other damage bonus it'd probably be fair game.

Scaling like Venomous Claw?

That could possibly work but wasn't exactly what i had in mind.

Mr_Stach

Something I think is interesting is Wardens passive for getting 200% Status Chance with Winter's Embrace skills.

I really wish that Zos leaned into that more, such as adding different effects to enemies that are Chilled, like Chilled based Executes, or Damaging a Chilled enemy spreads chilled to nearby enemies.

ESO_Nightingale

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Something I think is interesting is Wardens passive for getting 200% Status Chance with Winter's Embrace skills.

I really wish that Zos leaned into that more, such as adding different effects to enemies that are Chilled, like Chilled based Executes, or Damaging a Chilled enemy spreads chilled to nearby enemies.

a chilled based execute set is something i've suggested before. with a mythic item. provided it was balanced properly, i think it'd provide a fantastic damage bonus to chilled which promotes using as many sources of frost damage as possible, while also providing the necessary high uptime for the minor brittle, glacial presence and frostbite buffs. Would be really nice to have. as we'd have natural execute when going in a full frost damage build. it'd be balanced by needing a high chilled proc rate and taking up a mythic slot.

SEINTDARKNES

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Something I think is interesting is Wardens passive for getting 200% Status Chance with Winter's Embrace skills.

I really wish that Zos leaned into that more, such as adding different effects to enemies that are Chilled, like Chilled based Executes, or Damaging a Chilled enemy spreads chilled to nearby enemies.

a chilled based execute set is something i've suggested before. with a mythic item. provided it was balanced properly, i think it'd provide a fantastic damage bonus to chilled which promotes using as many sources of frost damage as possible, while also providing the necessary high uptime for the minor brittle, glacial presence and frostbite buffs. Would be really nice to have. as we'd have natural execute when going in a full frost damage build. it'd be balanced by needing a high chilled proc rate and taking up a mythic slot.

Woow! I need this!

I really forget that we could get mythics that could make more viable frost dmg or make some interesting choices, I think this mythic concept is amazing because reinforce the statement of play like you want!

ESO_Nightingale

SEINTDARKNES wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Something I think is interesting is Wardens passive for getting 200% Status Chance with Winter's Embrace skills.

I really wish that Zos leaned into that more, such as adding different effects to enemies that are Chilled, like Chilled based Executes, or Damaging a Chilled enemy spreads chilled to nearby enemies.

a chilled based execute set is something i've suggested before. with a mythic item. provided it was balanced properly, i think it'd provide a fantastic damage bonus to chilled which promotes using as many sources of frost damage as possible, while also providing the necessary high uptime for the minor brittle, glacial presence and frostbite buffs. Would be really nice to have. as we'd have natural execute when going in a full frost damage build. it'd be balanced by needing a high chilled proc rate and taking up a mythic slot.

Woow! I need this!

I really forget that we could get mythics that could make more viable frost dmg or make some interesting choices, I think this mythic concept is amazing because reinforce the statement of play like you want!

Thanks, i've made all sorts of custom set and skill ideas. i'm very happy with this one for a set. it combines two of my favourite types of things for eso combat. executes and frost dps

Mr_Stach

I really think Zos has done some great things to add some Frost Centric Itemization and the only real gap to Frost Warden being really great is as we've listed over and over Frost Class Skills that Aren't Used or are reiterated on again and again till they have no purpose.

Like at this point Arctic Blast may as well not have a stun at all because that aspect is completely useless. Crystalized Slab gets a random stun that does not really help the on-demand stun that Warden just needs in their kit.

Then beyond that there are Stamina Warden has no direct damage type buffs since Warden boosts Frost and Magic Damage, since Zos has been heavily leaning into adding Bleed Damage into the Stamden Kit, I would look at changing Piercing Cold to reflect that, switch up Magic Damage to Bleed Damage would create a clear design that Magicka Warden is a Master of Ice, and Stamina Warden excels a Bleed. (Also as a side note: switch Magicka Morphs to Frost Damage to reinforce the master of Ice thing..... Please, they aren't even real animals they can be cold if I want)

Karivaa

Make bears great again?

Mr_Stach

They just gave Feral Guardian Hemorrhage, so that's cool.

SEINTDARKNES

And we could have the other bear doing frost damage and giving some kind of extra buff so that way both bears will be pick, because rn feral guardian will be on top of eternal guardian because eternal only does Magicka damage and revive but for my experience it's really rare when the bear die even in solo arenas so i think a buff will be nice.

Mr_Stach

Also it's a free revive, so even if you need to resummon it's really not that big of a deal

ESO_Nightingale

SEINTDARKNES wrote: »

And we could have the other bear doing frost damage and giving some kind of extra buff so that way both bears will be pick, because rn feral guardian will be on top of eternal guardian because eternal only does Magicka damage and revive but for my experience it's really rare when the bear die even in solo arenas so i think a buff will be nice.

It's confusing to me that they didn't see this coming.

LeHarrt91

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

We cannot even test the damage of Frozen gate on a dummy because it does not trigger unless a target is pulled.

ESO_Nightingale

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

We cannot even test the damage of Frozen gate on a dummy because it does not trigger unless a target is pulled.

Yeah. Retreat being useful for dps would require it to act like barbed or fire rune.

SEINTDARKNES

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Also it's a free revive, so even if you need to resummon it's really not that big of a deal

Right, you just lose a couple seconds but nothing that important but the worst part is if somehow the bear die 2 times in a row he will stuck in limbo and can't revive until 1 minute later xD

ESO_Nightingale

SEINTDARKNES wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Also it's a free revive, so even if you need to resummon it's really not that big of a deal

Right, you just lose a couple seconds but nothing that important but the worst part is if somehow the bear die 2 times in a row he will stuck in limbo and can't revive until 1 minute later xD

Yeah compared to heaps more damage, a delayed respawn means nothing at all. Especially since it doesn't die in trials.

ESO_Nightingale

Karivaa wrote: »

Make bears great again?

They are already great, it's just that they didn't forsee that their huge buff to wild guardian would completely invalidate eternal guardian, and make bear's already insane dps (remember it's currently 15% of our damage in pve) even higher(about 18%) when it should honestly be heavily reduced and rebalanced into warden's base dps kit anyway.

SEINTDARKNES

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

SEINTDARKNES wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Also it's a free revive, so even if you need to resummon it's really not that big of a deal

Right, you just lose a couple seconds but nothing that important but the worst part is if somehow the bear die 2 times in a row he will stuck in limbo and can't revive until 1 minute later xD

Yeah compared to heaps more damage, a delayed respawn means nothing at all. Especially since it doesn't die in trials.

That's true the bear can't die in trials and realistically the bear isn't that good for pvp too so i think if they don't buff eternal guardian just will be behind the shade of feral guardian.

Mr_Stach

I honestly think Permafrost could be a good PvP Morph if it did more than just slow people down, In pvp everyone is running some sort of Snare Immunity, Maybe removing the Protections and going for Major Brittle or something make Permafrost just super annoying due to you taking a ton of extra Crit Damage

ESO_Nightingale

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

So with Frozen Gate and morphs I can get a tooltip of about 14k+ (with raid dummy buffs), this is quite decent PvE damage, the only issue is that its one time burst and has the pull enemy (obviously not bosses) and pull ally depending on morph which could pull the tank.
This skill has a lot of potential to be a great skill, it could have a DoT added after the Portal is triggered (similar to Scalding Rune) or it could have 2 additional delayed bursts of damage (kind of like Daedric Curse).

We cannot even test the damage of Frozen gate on a dummy because it does not trigger unless a target is pulled.

Yeah

Mr_Stach wrote: »

I honestly think Permafrost could be a good PvP Morph if it did more than just slow people down, In pvp everyone is running some sort of Snare Immunity, Maybe removing the Protections and going for Major Brittle or something make Permafrost just super annoying due to you taking a ton of extra Crit Damage

If we go this route, I'd give major brittle to northern.

Mr_Stach

The "Masters of Ice" not having access to Major Brittle in their class kit is really odd. Hopefully they get it after of course making it so it's more useful that Minor Brittle which it currently..... isn't. Because Crit Damage Caps.

ESO_Nightingale

Mr_Stach wrote: »

The "Masters of Ice" not having access to Major Brittle in their class kit is really odd. Hopefully they get it after of course making it so it's more useful that Minor Brittle which it currently..... isn't. Because Crit Damage Caps.

It's been made a bit more useful with the cp nerfs.

LeHarrt91

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

The "Masters of Ice" not having access to Major Brittle in their class kit is really odd. Hopefully they get it after of course making it so it's more useful that Minor Brittle which it currently..... isn't. Because Crit Damage Caps.

It's been made a bit more useful with the cp nerfs.

Yeah but also the one set that does give it doesnt deal enough DPS.

SEINTDARKNES

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

The "Masters of Ice" not having access to Major Brittle in their class kit is really odd. Hopefully they get it after of course making it so it's more useful that Minor Brittle which it currently..... isn't. Because Crit Damage Caps.

It's been made a bit more useful with the cp nerfs.

Yeah but also the one set that does give it doesnt deal enough DPS.

It supposed to be a pvp monster set but I don't se where is the pvp part neither the pve with such low dmg and duration.

Mr_Stach

Nunatak doesn't do enough damage, the length of the debuff is bad, and Zos has this weird fascination with frost ticks to activate effects.

Increase the Damage and duration of the Ice to 8 seconds, make the Major Brittle happen when the Ice spawns. I'd probably increase the debuff to 8 seconds.

Who know I might completely off on everything, but whatevs.

ESO_Nightingale

SEINTDARKNES wrote: »

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

The "Masters of Ice" not having access to Major Brittle in their class kit is really odd. Hopefully they get it after of course making it so it's more useful that Minor Brittle which it currently..... isn't. Because Crit Damage Caps.

It's been made a bit more useful with the cp nerfs.

Yeah but also the one set that does give it doesnt deal enough DPS.

It supposed to be a pvp monster set but I don't se where is the pvp part neither the pve with such low dmg and duration.

honestly i have no idea either. i they said it was supposed to be for area control but the radius is really small, so much so that people could literally walk out of it and in the initial design, it didn't even apply major brittle to enemies who couldn't be immobilsed. it was just a giant bruh moment.