Overland Content Feedback Thread

FlopsyPrince

CP5 wrote: »

They also seemed caught off guard that the card game wasn't well received, and speaking of the interview the answer given was identical to the one given back in December, implying no feedback from this thread or anywhere else has been internalized by the team. It is their game, but that doesn't mean they have an all encompassing knowledge of what areas it could be improved or how, if omnipotence was a tangible skill it would probably be required everywhere.

It reminds me when Blizzard announced a mobile game (I forget which one) that most people did not want on mobile and they held up a phone to ask if everyone didn't have a smartphone. They were only shocked (in both cases) because they didn't think things through well.

FlopsyPrince

spartaxoxo wrote: »

LashanW wrote: »

If capacity to complete is the main criteria, then why do enemies in overland/quests generally have 30k+ health? Why not reduce it to 1 HP? Like the critters. Why not reduce health of story bosses to like 10HP? Everyone would be able to one shot all enemies with their bare hands and complete overland/questing content then. Think about it.

Because this isn't a walking sim. There is a nominal difficulty level that new player may find a little challenging, but not anything that would actually prevent them from questing. It starts at being a small challenge for new players and becomes trivial for experienced players. All players can complete it, but not all players will have the same level of ease.

I remember dying on a regular basis when I started playing just after Summerset released.

Lysette

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Actually let me put it this way.

What if Dark Souls had a piece of armor that I could equip that made the game trivially easy. Once I put it on, I can't unequip it. Everyone who isn't in that gear is experiencing a dark, brutal and difficult game. I'm experiencing a cake walk.

Can you really say I'm experiencing the same game? Wouldn't you say they should give an option to unequip that so that I can experience the same game as others? Wouldn't you be blaming dark souls for making such a gear item rather than me for wanting to shed this easy mode, and actually get to experience the game the way the majority of players gets to experience it? Because that's what having a lot of skill feels like in this game. I can't unlearn good timing. I have to actively try to play poorly or in some cases literally stop attacking at all. I'm not kidding about that. Literally stop attacking at all, to experience the full story that people in the same way as the majority of players experience it.

Sometimes I don't mind. It's like a TellTale game. I'm relaxed and having a good time and giving my hands a break. Others it really kills immersion. When I find it killing immersion, I just stop playing. I have to be in a specific mindset to enjoy it, even if I want to play the game.

I should just be able to play when I want to play by using optional difficulty settings.

Yeah, I agree - and if you could get that in an own instance, I am all for it. I just don't want to have this in the same instance as I'm playing, because it will not just reduce my enjoyment of the game but as well yours, when you struggle with an enemy, and the next newbie comes in and kills it with a few strikes and takes the victory from you. That is the other way round than what we casuals experience when you guys come and kill our targets while passing by. These player groups should not be mixed.

Problem is though, that ZOS isn't likely to give you your own instance - and that is why I'm protective of my game play, it is endangered by your request and it might not be that much fun to play anymore, if both groups are in the same instance.

Then advocate for a separate instance rather than argue there's no problem here? Because honestly, there's a problem here. I prefer a slider and don't see players being together as an issue in an MMO. It worked for LOTRO, don't see why it wouldn't work here. I do see a separate instance as better than maintaining the status quo. But no matter the solution they choose, they need to do something. It's a design problem that's completely unfair to higher power players. We're essentially punished for getting better at the game due to the design decision to give us literally no options for increasing difficulty. It's consumer unfriendly game design and flawed.

I did, I even asked for giving me my own instance and I offered to pay like 100 bucks per year for it, if I would get my private instance (a model Bethesda is using in Fallout 76). That would be totally worth it for me, that I can just quest on my own, with no interference by anyone and experience the stories as they were designed. Optional of course, that I can as well be among the others and play the card game with them for example - to me that would be the best solution, but not likely to happen.

You see, I have a similar problem, always be confronted with crippled quests, where half or more of the foes I should encounter are dead or not there and if I do that quest with a different character I might be lucky and see what I should have encountered, but then the foes in a different location of the quest are missing - I have always to deal with crippled quests, that is a design flaw as well.

spartaxoxo

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Actually let me put it this way.

What if Dark Souls had a piece of armor that I could equip that made the game trivially easy. Once I put it on, I can't unequip it. Everyone who isn't in that gear is experiencing a dark, brutal and difficult game. I'm experiencing a cake walk.

Can you really say I'm experiencing the same game? Wouldn't you say they should give an option to unequip that so that I can experience the same game as others? Wouldn't you be blaming dark souls for making such a gear item rather than me for wanting to shed this easy mode, and actually get to experience the game the way the majority of players gets to experience it? Because that's what having a lot of skill feels like in this game. I can't unlearn good timing. I have to actively try to play poorly or in some cases literally stop attacking at all. I'm not kidding about that. Literally stop attacking at all, to experience the full story that people in the same way as the majority of players experience it.

Sometimes I don't mind. It's like a TellTale game. I'm relaxed and having a good time and giving my hands a break. Others it really kills immersion. When I find it killing immersion, I just stop playing. I have to be in a specific mindset to enjoy it, even if I want to play the game.

I should just be able to play when I want to play by using optional difficulty settings.

Yeah, I agree - and if you could get that in an own instance, I am all for it. I just don't want to have this in the same instance as I'm playing, because it will not just reduce my enjoyment of the game but as well yours, when you struggle with an enemy, and the next newbie comes in and kills it with a few strikes and takes the victory from you. That is the other way round than what we casuals experience when you guys come and kill our targets while passing by. These player groups should not be mixed.

Problem is though, that ZOS isn't likely to give you your own instance - and that is why I'm protective of my game play, it is endangered by your request and it might not be that much fun to play anymore, if both groups are in the same instance.

Then advocate for a separate instance rather than argue there's no problem here? Because honestly, there's a problem here. I prefer a slider and don't see players being together as an issue in an MMO. It worked for LOTRO, don't see why it wouldn't work here. I do see a separate instance as better than maintaining the status quo. But no matter the solution they choose, they need to do something. It's a design problem that's completely unfair to higher power players. We're essentially punished for getting better at the game due to the design decision to give us literally no options for increasing difficulty. It's consumer unfriendly game design and flawed.

I did, I even asked for giving me my own instance and I offered to pay like 100 bucks per year for it, if I would get my private instance (a model Bethesda is using in Fallout 76). That would be totally worth it for me, that I can just quest on my own, with no interference by anyone and experience the stories as they were designed. Optional of course, that I can as well be among the others and play the card game with them for example - to me that would be the best solution, but not likely to happen.

Well, they are already said they aren't likely to do any solution. So you might as well not let that stop you. Besides not having to play with other players, what other benefits do you think that would bring to the game?

spartaxoxo

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

LashanW wrote: »

If capacity to complete is the main criteria, then why do enemies in overland/quests generally have 30k+ health? Why not reduce it to 1 HP? Like the critters. Why not reduce health of story bosses to like 10HP? Everyone would be able to one shot all enemies with their bare hands and complete overland/questing content then. Think about it.

Because this isn't a walking sim. There is a nominal difficulty level that new player may find a little challenging, but not anything that would actually prevent them from questing. It starts at being a small challenge for new players and becomes trivial for experienced players. All players can complete it, but not all players will have the same level of ease.

I remember dying on a regular basis when I started playing just after Summerset released.

Yeah but death is just a flesh wound.

Lysette

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Actually let me put it this way.

What if Dark Souls had a piece of armor that I could equip that made the game trivially easy. Once I put it on, I can't unequip it. Everyone who isn't in that gear is experiencing a dark, brutal and difficult game. I'm experiencing a cake walk.

Can you really say I'm experiencing the same game? Wouldn't you say they should give an option to unequip that so that I can experience the same game as others? Wouldn't you be blaming dark souls for making such a gear item rather than me for wanting to shed this easy mode, and actually get to experience the game the way the majority of players gets to experience it? Because that's what having a lot of skill feels like in this game. I can't unlearn good timing. I have to actively try to play poorly or in some cases literally stop attacking at all. I'm not kidding about that. Literally stop attacking at all, to experience the full story that people in the same way as the majority of players experience it.

Sometimes I don't mind. It's like a TellTale game. I'm relaxed and having a good time and giving my hands a break. Others it really kills immersion. When I find it killing immersion, I just stop playing. I have to be in a specific mindset to enjoy it, even if I want to play the game.

I should just be able to play when I want to play by using optional difficulty settings.

Yeah, I agree - and if you could get that in an own instance, I am all for it. I just don't want to have this in the same instance as I'm playing, because it will not just reduce my enjoyment of the game but as well yours, when you struggle with an enemy, and the next newbie comes in and kills it with a few strikes and takes the victory from you. That is the other way round than what we casuals experience when you guys come and kill our targets while passing by. These player groups should not be mixed.

Problem is though, that ZOS isn't likely to give you your own instance - and that is why I'm protective of my game play, it is endangered by your request and it might not be that much fun to play anymore, if both groups are in the same instance.

Then advocate for a separate instance rather than argue there's no problem here? Because honestly, there's a problem here. I prefer a slider and don't see players being together as an issue in an MMO. It worked for LOTRO, don't see why it wouldn't work here. I do see a separate instance as better than maintaining the status quo. But no matter the solution they choose, they need to do something. It's a design problem that's completely unfair to higher power players. We're essentially punished for getting better at the game due to the design decision to give us literally no options for increasing difficulty. It's consumer unfriendly game design and flawed.

I did, I even asked for giving me my own instance and I offered to pay like 100 bucks per year for it, if I would get my private instance (a model Bethesda is using in Fallout 76). That would be totally worth it for me, that I can just quest on my own, with no interference by anyone and experience the stories as they were designed. Optional of course, that I can as well be among the others and play the card game with them for example - to me that would be the best solution, but not likely to happen.

Well, they are already said they aren't likely to do any solution. So you might as well not let that stop you. Besides not having to play with other players, what other benefits do you think that would bring to the game?

To me that is just about questing - I'm not fond of questing in a whole, but as that is the main thing in overland, I want to do that as well. But it is just not fun to have always crippled quests. That is much like your gameplay is crippled because you are too powerful, my game play is crippled by other players, who convert the quest experience into a joke, and a bad one at it.

And now you want to make overland more attractive to players like you - which means to me, even more will be playing "in my" instance and cripple my quests even more and eventually even camp the end bosses - you can imagine, that is not making me happy.

This said, it is a better experience on the NA server - that is better suited to my play hours, which are typical at those hours where ZOS is doing their maintenance. So yeah, I had to leave my 16 characters on EU to have some fun with my now 7 characters on NA. But I have by far not that many costumes and houses there and I had to buy a couple of things with crowns again like a banker and the necro class.

spartaxoxo

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Actually let me put it this way.

What if Dark Souls had a piece of armor that I could equip that made the game trivially easy. Once I put it on, I can't unequip it. Everyone who isn't in that gear is experiencing a dark, brutal and difficult game. I'm experiencing a cake walk.

Can you really say I'm experiencing the same game? Wouldn't you say they should give an option to unequip that so that I can experience the same game as others? Wouldn't you be blaming dark souls for making such a gear item rather than me for wanting to shed this easy mode, and actually get to experience the game the way the majority of players gets to experience it? Because that's what having a lot of skill feels like in this game. I can't unlearn good timing. I have to actively try to play poorly or in some cases literally stop attacking at all. I'm not kidding about that. Literally stop attacking at all, to experience the full story that people in the same way as the majority of players experience it.

Sometimes I don't mind. It's like a TellTale game. I'm relaxed and having a good time and giving my hands a break. Others it really kills immersion. When I find it killing immersion, I just stop playing. I have to be in a specific mindset to enjoy it, even if I want to play the game.

I should just be able to play when I want to play by using optional difficulty settings.

Yeah, I agree - and if you could get that in an own instance, I am all for it. I just don't want to have this in the same instance as I'm playing, because it will not just reduce my enjoyment of the game but as well yours, when you struggle with an enemy, and the next newbie comes in and kills it with a few strikes and takes the victory from you. That is the other way round than what we casuals experience when you guys come and kill our targets while passing by. These player groups should not be mixed.

Problem is though, that ZOS isn't likely to give you your own instance - and that is why I'm protective of my game play, it is endangered by your request and it might not be that much fun to play anymore, if both groups are in the same instance.

Then advocate for a separate instance rather than argue there's no problem here? Because honestly, there's a problem here. I prefer a slider and don't see players being together as an issue in an MMO. It worked for LOTRO, don't see why it wouldn't work here. I do see a separate instance as better than maintaining the status quo. But no matter the solution they choose, they need to do something. It's a design problem that's completely unfair to higher power players. We're essentially punished for getting better at the game due to the design decision to give us literally no options for increasing difficulty. It's consumer unfriendly game design and flawed.

I did, I even asked for giving me my own instance and I offered to pay like 100 bucks per year for it, if I would get my private instance (a model Bethesda is using in Fallout 76). That would be totally worth it for me, that I can just quest on my own, with no interference by anyone and experience the stories as they were designed. Optional of course, that I can as well be among the others and play the card game with them for example - to me that would be the best solution, but not likely to happen.

Well, they are already said they aren't likely to do any solution. So you might as well not let that stop you. Besides not having to play with other players, what other benefits do you think that would bring to the game?

To me that is just about questing - I'm not fond of questing in a whole, but as that is the main thing in overland, I want to do that as well. But it is just not fun to have always crippled quests. That is much like your gameplay is crippled because you are too powerful, my game play is crippled by other players, who convert the quest experience into a joke, and a bad one at it.

And now you want to make overland more attractive to players like you - which means to me, even more will be playing "in my" instance and cripple my quests even more and eventually even camp the end bosses - you can imagine, that is not making me happy.

I'm surprised you don't like questing. What do you enjoy in Overland, if I may ask? I know you've expressed not liking seeing other players, but it's a multiplayer game, you know? What benefits do you think your idea would bring the broader playerbase? I asking sincerely, as I think it will help me understand what you'd like to see better.

Lysette

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Actually let me put it this way.

What if Dark Souls had a piece of armor that I could equip that made the game trivially easy. Once I put it on, I can't unequip it. Everyone who isn't in that gear is experiencing a dark, brutal and difficult game. I'm experiencing a cake walk.

Can you really say I'm experiencing the same game? Wouldn't you say they should give an option to unequip that so that I can experience the same game as others? Wouldn't you be blaming dark souls for making such a gear item rather than me for wanting to shed this easy mode, and actually get to experience the game the way the majority of players gets to experience it? Because that's what having a lot of skill feels like in this game. I can't unlearn good timing. I have to actively try to play poorly or in some cases literally stop attacking at all. I'm not kidding about that. Literally stop attacking at all, to experience the full story that people in the same way as the majority of players experience it.

Sometimes I don't mind. It's like a TellTale game. I'm relaxed and having a good time and giving my hands a break. Others it really kills immersion. When I find it killing immersion, I just stop playing. I have to be in a specific mindset to enjoy it, even if I want to play the game.

I should just be able to play when I want to play by using optional difficulty settings.

Yeah, I agree - and if you could get that in an own instance, I am all for it. I just don't want to have this in the same instance as I'm playing, because it will not just reduce my enjoyment of the game but as well yours, when you struggle with an enemy, and the next newbie comes in and kills it with a few strikes and takes the victory from you. That is the other way round than what we casuals experience when you guys come and kill our targets while passing by. These player groups should not be mixed.

Problem is though, that ZOS isn't likely to give you your own instance - and that is why I'm protective of my game play, it is endangered by your request and it might not be that much fun to play anymore, if both groups are in the same instance.

Then advocate for a separate instance rather than argue there's no problem here? Because honestly, there's a problem here. I prefer a slider and don't see players being together as an issue in an MMO. It worked for LOTRO, don't see why it wouldn't work here. I do see a separate instance as better than maintaining the status quo. But no matter the solution they choose, they need to do something. It's a design problem that's completely unfair to higher power players. We're essentially punished for getting better at the game due to the design decision to give us literally no options for increasing difficulty. It's consumer unfriendly game design and flawed.

I did, I even asked for giving me my own instance and I offered to pay like 100 bucks per year for it, if I would get my private instance (a model Bethesda is using in Fallout 76). That would be totally worth it for me, that I can just quest on my own, with no interference by anyone and experience the stories as they were designed. Optional of course, that I can as well be among the others and play the card game with them for example - to me that would be the best solution, but not likely to happen.

Well, they are already said they aren't likely to do any solution. So you might as well not let that stop you. Besides not having to play with other players, what other benefits do you think that would bring to the game?

To me that is just about questing - I'm not fond of questing in a whole, but as that is the main thing in overland, I want to do that as well. But it is just not fun to have always crippled quests. That is much like your gameplay is crippled because you are too powerful, my game play is crippled by other players, who convert the quest experience into a joke, and a bad one at it.

And now you want to make overland more attractive to players like you - which means to me, even more will be playing "in my" instance and cripple my quests even more and eventually even camp the end bosses - you can imagine, that is not making me happy.

I'm surprised you don't like questing. What do you enjoy in Overland, if I may ask? I know you've expressed not liking seeing other players, but it's a multiplayer game, you know? What benefits do you think your idea would bring the broader playerbase? I asking sincerely, as I think it will help me understand what you'd like to see better.

It is not that I do not like to see them, I don't like them messing up my questing experience. I said I'm not fond of questing, that is because I'm averse to running errands for others - and most quests are of that kind - fetch this, talk to that person, bring this to another person and so on - running around doing errands, not my cuppa

So my characters are very selective about which quests they want to do - an example - freeing hostages from a heavily guarded fortress, where the hostages would be killed, if I do not infiltrate very carefully and free them in a stealthy way - sounded really fun, my kind of quest, doing it stealthy. And what was that quest really like - people running in, killing everything, none of the hostages was getting killed like the quest suggested in case of the infiltration failing - that was a really bad experience - that quest was not fun to do at all.

And when I experience things like that a couple of times in a row, I start to hate questing and especially those ignorant others, who just go in killing everything, not caring about the story of the quest at all. I do not like other players in my quests, that simple. Very very rarely I can experience a quest like it was designed - that is fun to do then, that is exciting - but with others around it is just a mess and crippled.

Lysette

What I like to see better - solo mode for a quest, if I like to do it solo (with or without Mirri) - like the harborage quests. At least when it is inside, the outdoor parts can stay as they are. But when it comes to the really exciting parts, I would like to do them on my own, uninterrupted, with all the foes I should encounter actually there - that I can feel accomplished, when the quest is over - and not like not deserving those XP, because others have done the work or pretty much no foes being around.

Aardappelboom

Lysette wrote: »

It is not that I do not like to see them, I don't like them messing up my questing experience. I said I'm not fond of questing, that is because I'm averse to running errands for others - and most quests are of that kind - fetch this, talk to that person, bring this to another person and so on - running around doing errands, not my cuppa

So my characters are very selective about which quests they want to do - an example - freeing hostages from a heavily guarded fortress, where the hostages would be killed, if I do not infiltrate very carefully and free them in a stealthy way - sounded really fun, my kind of quest, doing it stealthy. And what was that quest really like - people running in, killing everything, none of the hostages was getting killed like the quest suggested in case of the infiltration failing - that was a really bad experience - that quest was not fun to do at all.

And when I experience things like that a couple of times in a row, I start to hate questing and especially those ignorant others, who just go in killing everything, not caring about the story of the quest at all. I do not like other players in my quests, that simple. Very very rarely I can experience a quest like it was designed - that is fun to do then, that is exciting - but with others around it is just a mess and crippled.

To be honest, what you are describing is very much the same experience we're getting when it comes to difficulty, we also want to enjoy the quest as it is intended, it's not so much the other people that bother me it's the fact that they can barge in and destroy the place in mere seconds.

Even though I can, I think it's a lot more fun to have the challenge, maybe even be motivated to sneak past the guard instead of attacking him, it all helps toward a more immersive experience.

I followed this topic for some time and after all of your replies I'd start thinking you'd benefit from this enhanced difficulty yourself. 🙂

Lysette

Aardappelboom wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

It is not that I do not like to see them, I don't like them messing up my questing experience. I said I'm not fond of questing, that is because I'm averse to running errands for others - and most quests are of that kind - fetch this, talk to that person, bring this to another person and so on - running around doing errands, not my cuppa

So my characters are very selective about which quests they want to do - an example - freeing hostages from a heavily guarded fortress, where the hostages would be killed, if I do not infiltrate very carefully and free them in a stealthy way - sounded really fun, my kind of quest, doing it stealthy. And what was that quest really like - people running in, killing everything, none of the hostages was getting killed like the quest suggested in case of the infiltration failing - that was a really bad experience - that quest was not fun to do at all.

And when I experience things like that a couple of times in a row, I start to hate questing and especially those ignorant others, who just go in killing everything, not caring about the story of the quest at all. I do not like other players in my quests, that simple. Very very rarely I can experience a quest like it was designed - that is fun to do then, that is exciting - but with others around it is just a mess and crippled.

To be honest, what you are describing is very much the same experience we're getting when it comes to difficulty, we also want to enjoy the quest as it is intended, it's not so much the other people that bother me it's the fact that they can barge in and destroy the place in mere seconds.

Even though I can, I think it's a lot more fun to have the challenge, maybe even be motivated to sneak past the guard instead of attacking him, it all helps toward a more immersive experience.

I followed this topic for some time and after all of your replies I'd start thinking you'd benefit from this enhanced difficulty yourself. 🙂

I was thinking about that as well, but I can definitely not do 3 times as hard yet. Hard to say actually, it is rare that my health is dropping at all or that I have to activate my damage shield or start the regen booster (vigor or something similar). And potions, I have them but I am not using them, there is no need to. My problem is that I might not get out of the red in time when a latency spike happens. Those few times when I got killed were mainly due to latency spikes - and most often with characters who's health boost was based on fast attacks - like with dual wielding. So, yeah, it is hard to say if I could do it or not, latency spikes are really bad and then I'm not able to escape the red in time and get the full blown heavy attack.

Well, Mirri and I where lately in spellscar in the group area - there are more foes all at once and we could stand our ground, so maybe I could, maybe not, that is really a matter of latency for me. Well, my poor Mirri was beaten hard, she is just combat level 7 yet, but I could keep her alive at least.

And yeah to immersion, if it is a stealth mission I'm not going to kill anyone, if I don't have to. And if I have to I want to be the silent death, killing without to be seen. But that is not in my reach yet, I am not powerful enough to kill in a single blow.

LashanW

Lysette wrote: »

Yeah, and that is why people play it wrong, if they go for getting to level 50 the quickest way possible. The game is fun to play by not levelling as fast as possible, but by doing this and that and slowly get to level 50 - that is what an RPG is like normally, you get to the top rather slowly while experiencing the game world. That "endgame" mentality of a lot of people is what is killing that concept. They grind their way to the top instead of playing through the content - and once they are "veterans" they find out, that they played the game in a way it was not meant to be played - bad luck, I would say.

There are many overland zones and probably like a thousand story quests in this game at this point. How long can you stay low level while doing these? They all give XP. If you explore the zone fully and do every quest you come across, you won't stay low level for long. Even small things like discovering places and unlocking wayshrines give you XP. As far as I know, you cannot disable XP gain in this game.

There is another problem, low level character today is significantly stronger than a low level character two years ago. Even without considering any new gear, newly added skills / features and obviously the CP system. Here's how,

This is from patch notes on Update 29 (when we got the new CP system)


Old CP system was pretty strong, the new CP system is comparatively weaker. However ZoS didn't just delete that extra power completely from CP system, they moved some of that power to the raw stats of all characters, even level 1 toons fresh out of character creation screen.

So now it's much more difficult to nerf my characters even if I wanted to. (compared to what I could do 2 years ago by removing all CP). I can't reduce my base stats more than that.

Lysette

LashanW wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

Yeah, and that is why people play it wrong, if they go for getting to level 50 the quickest way possible. The game is fun to play by not levelling as fast as possible, but by doing this and that and slowly get to level 50 - that is what an RPG is like normally, you get to the top rather slowly while experiencing the game world. That "endgame" mentality of a lot of people is what is killing that concept. They grind their way to the top instead of playing through the content - and once they are "veterans" they find out, that they played the game in a way it was not meant to be played - bad luck, I would say.

There are many overland zones and probably like a thousand story quests in this game at this point. How long can you stay low level while doing these? They all give XP. If you explore the zone fully and do every quest you come across, you won't stay low level for long. Even small things like discovering places and unlocking wayshrines give you XP. As far as I know, you cannot disable XP gain in this game.

There is another problem, low level character today is significantly stronger than a low level character two years ago. Even without considering any new gear, newly added skills / features and obviously the CP system. Here's how,

This is from patch notes on Update 29 (when we got the new CP system)


Old CP system was pretty strong, the new CP system is comparatively weaker. However ZoS didn't just delete that extra power completely from CP system, they moved some of that power to the raw stats of all characters, even level 1 toons fresh out of character creation screen.

So now it's much more difficult to nerf my characters even if I wanted to. (compared to what I could do 2 years ago by removing all CP). I can't reduce my base stats more than that.

Ah this explains, why my new characters reach about 32-34k on their main combat resource (with food) - I was wondering already how this can be and if I was just too stupid in the past to get it up.

Btw one can stay below level 50 for long, if the amount of available playing hours per week is like 15-20hrs and one has no idea where skyshards are and has to search for them. And spreading out that limited time to play over 21 characters - that leads then to eventually gaining 4-5 levels per character past level 25 per year - so this can go on for years to be below level 50. None of my characters is higher than 40 and I tried to avoid to get more levels too quickly - exactly because I know that the game is not fun in overland, if I overpower them.

This actually goes back to an experience on the PTS I made years ago - I was boosted to level 50 there - and I felt really weak with that level, it was not like with my low level characters on the live server. So why the heck would I ever want to reach 50 then?- Maybe it is different now, but from that experience comes my aversion against gaining levels quickly and rather concentrate on new characters and let the whole team stay below level 50.

And in case you ask, why I could feel weak on the PTS with level 50 - well, the stats where missing, but I did not have more skill points than I had on the live server, so all the benefits of level 50, I could not use, because I lacked the skill points to spend in these new skills. As a result my characters felt so powerless - and that is why I avoid gaining levels and do not use XP scrolls, even they pile up in my bank.

Well, and then questing - with 21 characters I can do 105 quests and still each of them has just done 5 - this will not get them levels quickly. So even if I'm questing, I can well stay below level 50 for a very long time.

Parasaurolophus

I would like to just say here. I think I'm still optimistic about CCG. I've never played a game like this before, but if it's fun and the rewards are worth it, that'd be great, wouldn't it? Many players will have a reason to enter the game not only for crafting dailies. If ZoS can fill the game with some fun non-combat activities, that would be great. But here it is important to note what exactly is interesting. Because I still think that that visual novel, which is a chain of dialogue without gameplay, which is called a quest by ZoS, is not at all fun. Yes, I agree with an empty and casual overland, but only if there are some other exciting activities in the game that will always be available, including solo.

Lysette

Parasaurolophus wrote: »

I would like to just say here. I think I'm still optimistic about CCG. I've never played a game like this before, but if it's fun and the rewards are worth it, that'd be great, wouldn't it? Many players will have a reason to enter the game not only for crafting dailies. If ZoS can fill the game with some fun non-combat activities, that would be great. But here it is important to note what exactly is interesting. Because I still think that that visual novel, which is a chain of dialogue without gameplay, which is called a quest by ZoS, is not at all fun. Yes, I agree with an empty and casual overland, but only if there are some other exciting activities in the game that will always be available, including solo.

I'm actually curious how people will accept that card game. The reaction in the forum was not that great at all. To me it will be the first on monday to try out, I hope we will get our starting decks right away, otherwise it will be a mess if so many people are doing a quest to acquire them. hm, but we have to get our tutorial lesson at some point, so who knows. I want to play that game, and be it just with NPCs - it is good that it doesn't require other players to play it.

Agenericname

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Lysette wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I don't see anything sad about being powerful and succeeding. What I find sad is struggling when we are supposed to be a hero.

Also, river trolls are just slightly harder trash mobs.

I disagree that overland mobs and story fights are too easy or are broken in any way. They aren't. We just have different preferences.

It is sad because there's no way to change it, not because there's something wrong with wanting an easy experience. It is sad because this game becomes that trivial to someone who isn't even wearing the best gear out there, they'd have an even easier time. Well except in that last fight, I mostly didn't even attack Latvulaan at all and won that one. Not having anyway to change that is sad.

Many players are perfectly fine with overland just as it is and the game has been very successful since it was changed with One Tamriel. The real issue is that different players have different expectations and preferences for how they liked to play. The fact that some players prefer something different than what overland currently is doesn't mean it's broken.

If players can get so powerful gathering basic gear that they can't actually play the game and still have an engaging experience, then yes, the Overland is broken. They don't have to fix that problem by taking away the overland that people like, but there is a clear issue.

That is the question if it is broken - let's take Dark Souls, for example, is that game broken, just because I think it is by far too hard to be fun?- What if I would expect it to be changed to be easier to play to feel included?- Is that game broken or is it not? Just because it is not fulfilling my requirements, does not mean, it is broken - it is just not the game for me - simple as that.

Dark Souls doesn't offer anything that allows you to dismantle the gameplay experience with no remedy. Overland does. It shouldn't be possible for a player to break the experience so much that they have to stop playing to engage with it, without any solution offered at all. The lack of any option is a design flaw.

No, you have that problem, because you expect something from overland what it is not. It is not meant to be a challenge, it is meant to be a story-driven, adventurous theme-park like experience, where you play through the story. Some called it a visual novel, well yeah, it is something like this - and that is what most seem to enjoy, a story-driven theme park, where playing through the story is easy and can be complete even by those, not caring about game mechanics. Overland is just not the area, where you should expect challenge, because there is none, by design. It is meant to be a playground, not a battle field.

No. I don't have just because of expectations. The gameplay this game sells itself on is an action based rpg, but you to stop engaging in action gameplay to experience the rpg part after you collect enough gear. The gameplay experience you experience when you are new is not remotely reflective of the gameplay experience you get later merely because you played well.

That is a fundamental design flaw. Many of the people love this game the way it is only because they haven't obtained the power level to change the nature of the gameplay. I know because they literally stated they have implied the companions are like the average player, power wise. If you don't have that level of power, this game is an easy action rpg. If you do have that level of power, you can't do the action part anymore. Because stuff will die too quick.

Yeah, and that is why people play it wrong, if they go for getting to level 50 the quickest way possible. The game is fun to play by not levelling as fast as possible, but by doing this and that and slowly get to level 50 - that is what an RPG is like normally, you get to the top rather slowly while experiencing the game world. That "endgame" mentality of a lot of people is what is killing that concept. They grind their way to the top instead of playing through the content - and once they are "veterans" they find out, that they played the game in a way it was not meant to be played - bad luck, I would say.

I was the one implying that companions are modelled after an average player in overland, or just slightly below them. And now go and watch people playing in overland. Does that look to you as if they are much stronger than their companions, if those are level 20?- To me it doesn't, they are as bad as they were before, just in better gear.

If someone had to meet those conditions to make the game less fun, then I would agree. But you can easily hit the point where overland is extremely lackluster playing the game naturally.

Ive been playing for going on five years. I dont grind XP. I barely buy recipes/plans, prefering to acquire everything through organic gameplay. Thats how little effort I put into "jumping into endgame."

I didnt need to grind to 50 or jump into an "endgame" mentality. I do endgame things because its all that is available that isnt remotely mind numbing. Id much prefer to actually quest, at least some of the time. From a personal perspective, when my game becomes only endgame activities, thats an issue. Its an issue because activities like trials require a lot more coordination and have a lot less freedom than other activities.

I agree about FO76 though, if we have our own private instances where we could modify the difficulty the same way we can there, I would absolutely play it and I would absolutely pay for it. It doesnt matter if the progress is shared or not. And to be frank, I doubt Id come back, much like FO76. I have zero interest in a 30 queen fight or finding the most broken combo to one-shot everything in the game, but I have an option there. Here I do not.

SilverBride

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

spartaxoxo

SilverBride wrote: »

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

You're basically saying because it's fine for some people, it's not bad game design that it can break for others just by normal gameplay.

It being fine for some, in no way negates that it is broken for others. If I serve three bowls of soup to a table, and one of them has a bunch of hair in it, the majority of other soup being okay doesn't make the hair soup okay too.

It's obviously broken if you reach the point where you can't play the game the way it is marketed, as an action RPG.

I never said I wanted the Overland changed directly. It is not necessary to change the overland to solve the problem that I presented. But it is a problem, and the problem is not with me. The problem is broken game design. The game breaks at too high of a power level. It barely qualifies as the same genre anymore. That's a problem.

Daraklus

Just a friendly reminder, I went through the first two odd hours of a new player experience in this video, playing as much as I could as a "New player" might.

And I will keep pointing at it as long as I humanly can.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yq_58WP35-c

spartaxoxo

Also, I just want to make it clear. That I like current Overland sometimes. I don't mind games with low or even no-combat. I also like hard games. This is my current backlog of games. All of these are recent purchases I just haven't gotten around too yet. (Curse, midguard, and fifa were free with my plus sub).



I am not saying that there is anything wrong with liking overland the way it currently is, even if it is easy for you. I think I have showcased pretty well how easy it is for some of us, but there are others for whom it is a challenge.

I am saying the lack of literally any difficulty options is a design failure. It should never be possible to play the game wrong through normal gameplay, and end up with a game that is very nearly an entirely different genre of game. But that's what is going on when stuff dies that quickly. There are times when I don't mind stuff like walking sims. There also times when I want to play something more challenging. With ESO, I should be able to do both because the game should remain an action game, regardless of what I'm doing or my build.

SilverBride

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

You're basically saying because it's fine for some people, it's not bad game design that it can break for others just by normal gameplay.

It being fine for some, in no way negates that it is broken for others. If I serve three bowls of soup to a table, and one of them has a bunch of hair in it, the majority of other soup being okay doesn't make the hair soup okay too.

It's obviously broken if you reach the point where you can't play the game the way it is marketed, as an action RPG.

I never said I wanted the Overland changed directly. It is not necessary to change the overland to solve the problem that I presented. But it is a problem, and the problem is not with me. The problem is broken game design. The game breaks at too high of a power level. It barely qualifies as the same genre anymore. That's a problem.

Not all players at higher levels find it a problem. I can easily solo world bosses and many dungeons and story bosses and I prefer it that way. Being an action RPG doesn't mean that all the action needs to be challenging.

What I am saying is that we all have different expectations and preferences for how we like to play. Overland as it is meets some players preferences but doesn't meet others. But that doesn't mean it's a bad design.

spartaxoxo

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

You're basically saying because it's fine for some people, it's not bad game design that it can break for others just by normal gameplay.

It being fine for some, in no way negates that it is broken for others. If I serve three bowls of soup to a table, and one of them has a bunch of hair in it, the majority of other soup being okay doesn't make the hair soup okay too.

It's obviously broken if you reach the point where you can't play the game the way it is marketed, as an action RPG.

I never said I wanted the Overland changed directly. It is not necessary to change the overland to solve the problem that I presented. But it is a problem, and the problem is not with me. The problem is broken game design. The game breaks at too high of a power level. It barely qualifies as the same genre anymore. That's a problem.

Not all players at higher levels find it a problem. I can easily solo world bosses and many dungeons and story bosses and I prefer it that way. Being an action RPG doesn't mean that all the action needs to be challenging.

What I am saying is that we all have different expectations and preferences for how we like to play. Overland as it is meets some players preferences but doesn't meet others. But that doesn't mean it's a bad design.

Being an action RPG doesn't mean it all needs to be challenging. But it does mean I should be able to engage in action RPG game play. Not attacking on purpose is not action RPG gameplay.

SilverBride

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

You're basically saying because it's fine for some people, it's not bad game design that it can break for others just by normal gameplay.

It being fine for some, in no way negates that it is broken for others. If I serve three bowls of soup to a table, and one of them has a bunch of hair in it, the majority of other soup being okay doesn't make the hair soup okay too.

It's obviously broken if you reach the point where you can't play the game the way it is marketed, as an action RPG.

I never said I wanted the Overland changed directly. It is not necessary to change the overland to solve the problem that I presented. But it is a problem, and the problem is not with me. The problem is broken game design. The game breaks at too high of a power level. It barely qualifies as the same genre anymore. That's a problem.

Not all players at higher levels find it a problem. I can easily solo world bosses and many dungeons and story bosses and I prefer it that way. Being an action RPG doesn't mean that all the action needs to be challenging.

What I am saying is that we all have different expectations and preferences for how we like to play. Overland as it is meets some players preferences but doesn't meet others. But that doesn't mean it's a bad design.

Being an action RPG doesn't mean it all needs to be challenging. But it does mean I should be able to engage in action RPG game play. Not attacking on purpose is not action RPG gameplay.

I understand what you are saying but I don't know how else they could have designed it. If they had made overland mobs and story bosses scale in difficulty to the player that would break it for those who enjoy being able to easily defeat enemies that once gave them a hard time. That is why I say the solution should address the individual players' preferences rather than overland itself.

spartaxoxo

Actually let me use a better analogy than hair in soup, because clearly that's not working.


Let me tell you something about a food delivery order I placed not too long ago. I ordered the chicken Alfredo and a side chicken caesar salad. What I received was a side garden salad.

Many, many people all over the world love garden salad. I actually enjoy garden salad. It's pretty good, especially when I add a bit of bacon bits. I didn't want to complain though because I already had to complain about my last order from doordash due to half my food being missing. I know at a certain point they stop offering refunds if they suspect you're a problem customer. So I decided to just suck it up and eat the garden salad and not say anything about getting a refund.

That other people love garden salad and it's the most popular salads in the world does not make me getting one that day a non-issue. That I love garden salad actually, and thus it was still an enjoyable meal also does not make that a non-issue. I paid for chicken caesar salad, so chicken caesar is what I should have been able to eat. And the lack of option to remedy that is pretty unfair.

When you get to a certain power level, you have to sometimes pick if you want to play this game like an action game OR an RPG. If you choose to leave on your gear, you have to purposefully not engage in action and pull your punches. If you choose to unequip your gear, you're basically shedding part of what makes it an RPG..

I shouldn't have to choose between the two just because I have gotten good at the game. I should always have the option to play the main story like it's action RPG. I would strongly prefer if those options were super strong so that it could be a challenging one too. But I'll definitely take a change that retains it being relatively easily, but at least I don't have to pull punches any longer. Because that's the game everyone not at my power level is playing.

spartaxoxo

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

You're basically saying because it's fine for some people, it's not bad game design that it can break for others just by normal gameplay.

It being fine for some, in no way negates that it is broken for others. If I serve three bowls of soup to a table, and one of them has a bunch of hair in it, the majority of other soup being okay doesn't make the hair soup okay too.

It's obviously broken if you reach the point where you can't play the game the way it is marketed, as an action RPG.

I never said I wanted the Overland changed directly. It is not necessary to change the overland to solve the problem that I presented. But it is a problem, and the problem is not with me. The problem is broken game design. The game breaks at too high of a power level. It barely qualifies as the same genre anymore. That's a problem.

Not all players at higher levels find it a problem. I can easily solo world bosses and many dungeons and story bosses and I prefer it that way. Being an action RPG doesn't mean that all the action needs to be challenging.

What I am saying is that we all have different expectations and preferences for how we like to play. Overland as it is meets some players preferences but doesn't meet others. But that doesn't mean it's a bad design.

Being an action RPG doesn't mean it all needs to be challenging. But it does mean I should be able to engage in action RPG game play. Not attacking on purpose is not action RPG gameplay.

I understand what you are saying but I don't know how else they could have designed it. If they had made overland mobs and story bosses scale in difficulty to the player that would break it for those who enjoy being able to easily defeat enemies that once gave them a hard time. That is why I say the solution should address the individual players' preferences rather than overland itself.

LOTRO fixed this with their difficulty slider. They had the same design problem and chose to fix it a way that targeted the player rather than the overland itself. It's fine if they fix it that way, for me. What is not fine is them saying there is no problem and doing nothing.

SilverBride

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Videos showing a player easily beating a mob or quest boss shows that the fight is easy for that particular player. But it doesn't show that it's easy for everyone. And it doesn't show why this is supposed to be a bad thing.

Rich pointed out that a lot of players still find overland challenging. Then there are those who just enjoy a relaxed questing experience. Overland is fine just as it for these players.

This is why I say that overland isn't broken, because it works very well for a lot of players just as it is now.

This doesn't mean that I don't think some things should be done to make it more enjoyable for those who prefer a more challenging experience. But the solution should address the player, such as debuffs and challenge banners, rather than change something that isn't a problem for most.

You're basically saying because it's fine for some people, it's not bad game design that it can break for others just by normal gameplay.

It being fine for some, in no way negates that it is broken for others. If I serve three bowls of soup to a table, and one of them has a bunch of hair in it, the majority of other soup being okay doesn't make the hair soup okay too.

It's obviously broken if you reach the point where you can't play the game the way it is marketed, as an action RPG.

I never said I wanted the Overland changed directly. It is not necessary to change the overland to solve the problem that I presented. But it is a problem, and the problem is not with me. The problem is broken game design. The game breaks at too high of a power level. It barely qualifies as the same genre anymore. That's a problem.

Not all players at higher levels find it a problem. I can easily solo world bosses and many dungeons and story bosses and I prefer it that way. Being an action RPG doesn't mean that all the action needs to be challenging.

What I am saying is that we all have different expectations and preferences for how we like to play. Overland as it is meets some players preferences but doesn't meet others. But that doesn't mean it's a bad design.

Being an action RPG doesn't mean it all needs to be challenging. But it does mean I should be able to engage in action RPG game play. Not attacking on purpose is not action RPG gameplay.

I understand what you are saying but I don't know how else they could have designed it. If they had made overland mobs and story bosses scale in difficulty to the player that would break it for those who enjoy being able to easily defeat enemies that once gave them a hard time. That is why I say the solution should address the individual players' preferences rather than overland itself.

LOTRO fixed this with their difficulty slider. They had the same design problem and chose to fix it a way that targeted the player rather than the overland itself. It's fine if they fix it that way, for me. What is not fine is them saying there is no problem and doing nothing.

We may not agree on all the fine points of what the problem is or isn't, but we do agree that they could do something such as a difficulty slider.

Aardappelboom

spartaxoxo wrote: »

LOTRO fixed this with their difficulty slider. They had the same design problem and chose to fix it a way that targeted the player rather than the overland itself. It's fine if they fix it that way, for me. What is not fine is them saying there is no problem and doing nothing.

I fully agree and like to add, as I said before: even when looking at this from a business perspective, it'd be a good business decision to make the main attraction of your product attractive to a broader audience. Especially when taking into account that the battle spirit and battle level system already do what we're basically asking.

So I also don't get how this issue is being downplayed the way it is.

Lysette

In a way @LashanW has shown, why that is, that the game feels so different for a new character than it felt a few years ago. We have buffed up basic stats and not even just a bit more, significantly higher basic stats. The thing is just, that a real newbie is very likely to spread out his attribute points among all 3 stats - he has as well not yet a clue, what armor is good for him, he has no traits on it and eventually no enchantment as well. So he might just wear a mixture of what he finds. And when the time comes, where he gets new skills unlocked, he might not have skill points to use them yet.

Furthermore it is as well likely that he waits for the animation to play in full before he does his next move - and he is as well not that likely to weave properly or at all. I certainly had no clue about that when I started playing ESO, I waited until the animation had played and I did either a weapon attack or a skill. And if someone plays like this, then he has a challenge.

The game is basically scaled so, that a really new player doesn't have a bad time, while it is still challenging for him. It takes him much longer to actually use unlocked skills, because he doesn't know where skyshards are. And it might take him a longer amount of time, to actually have gear with traits on it and with enchantments. And as well until he gets, that spreading attribute points among stats is not a good idea in ESO - whereas in pretty much any other RPG that is the way to do it.

so TL;DR is - normal overland should not be changed, simply because a new player can go everywhere he wants and he should not have such a bad experience, that he is leaving the game. So whatever ZOS might or might not be doing, if they do something, it has to be separate from the normal game - I would go either for paid private instances or separate veteran instances. The first could be economically viable for ZOS - but if their mega server is capable of doing that, is a different story. Unfortunately with separate instance there is eventually the farming issue to be addressed too.

Well, that is not an easy decision to make and just ZOS knows, if their megaserver would be capable of that.

Elistix

Hail from Middle-Earth, my fellow Tamrielians!

It has been a long time I've not touched ESO seriously in the past couple of months. My time spent wandering the lands of Eriador on the Treebeard slow-prog server of The Lord of the Rings Online and seeing the sights... And testing something over these beautiful lands.

Treebeard is one of the game's Legendary Servers, which also has the added feature of altering one's own difficulty of play in ways that it makes the player character weaker (Like Battle Spirit being used) and most important of all, adds to the immersion of being a character in a world where hostile forces are encroaching ever so more on the innocent Free Peoples.

Normal : No changes
Hard : Slight Increase in Damage Taken and Slight Decrease in Damage done (Some XP bonus)
Harder : Increase in Damage Taken and Decrease in Damage Done (Large XP bonus)
Dangerous : Great Increase in Damage Taken and Great Decrease in Damage Done (Bigger XP bonus)
Deadly : Extreme increase in Damage Taken and Extreme Decrease in Damage Done. (Great XP bonus only)

And man, is it an immersive experience. To fight enemies that are far underneath my level of play and still having to be careful with my footing. Yet it never felt as if I was slowed down to a crawl either. Things took a little more time, yes. but not enough to feel like my time felt wasted. And... It was completely OPTIONAL for me to do such a playthrough!

A feature like this would thrive in the world of ESO, for we have Battle Spirit, a buff that can be used and expanded upon with different modifiers to allow players to play the world of The Elder Scrolls Online at it's fullest of potentials. Imagine it! Being able to alter your difficulty from :

Novice - Decrease in Damage Taken and Increase in Damage Done (Decrease of XP gain to further focus mainly on the story aspect of the game and allow the player to take their time and learn how to use their mechanics.)

Apprentice - The Game as it is currently, for those who are used to playing ESO but don't want added challenge or feel like they are coming out of novice and want to try something a little spicier. (No XP changes.)

Journeyman- Small increase to damage taken and decrease to damage done, enemies will be flagged and attacks aimed towards you will be a little faster to test your reaction time. Healing is not reduced. (Small XP increase)

Expert - A larger increase to damage taken and larger decrease to damage done, enemies will be flagged and their abilities will be cast with far smaller delays than Journeyman. Healing reduced slightly. (bigger XP increase)

Master - Extreme increase to damage taken and Extreme decrease to damage done. Enemies will not be messing around. Once you flag them, their abilities wlll be almost instant and keep you on your toes! Healing is greatly decreased and tactics will be a bigger factor than ever before. (GREAT XP increase.)

and of course.. What would an Elder Scrolls game be, without the highest of them all?

Legendary - You are fodder to the enemies of the Free Peoples of Tamriel. Prepare yourself for you'll need to carefuly plan your attacks and encounters. Squads of enemies will bear the difficutly of Master, but with an added twist : They can run away and seek reinforcements if nearby.

Should you prove yourself a worthy foe, can you survive the onslaught should you fail to reach that retreating enemy?

But now you may ask yourself.. Only XP bonus? No other rewards? And I believe that we could have an extra reward. Tied to classes. Begin a new adventure and change your difficulty as early as level 5 and you'll be eligible to a title, perhaps even a piece of cosmetic tied to the theme of the class! Or a memento... Or all of the above! The sky is the limit in ESO. And nobody wants to see a world thrive and succeed more than it's players.

Oh and an increase to Furnishing Mats dropped in the world would be nice too if we're playing on the harder modes.

So please, ZOS. If you read this, concider following the Lord of the Rings Online's footsteps. And improve upon it with the world scaling system of ESO. You have a gold mine of content under your hands from community, to content creation to potentially other things!

Lysette

Elistix wrote: »

Hail from Middle-Earth, my fellow Tamrielians!

It has been a long time I've not touched ESO seriously in the past couple of months. My time spent wandering the lands of Eriador on the Treebeard slow-prog server of The Lord of the Rings Online and seeing the sights... And testing something over these beautiful lands.

Treebeard is one of the game's Legendary Servers, which also has the added feature of altering one's own difficulty of play in ways that it makes the player character weaker (Like Battle Spirit being used) and most important of all, adds to the immersion of being a character in a world where hostile forces are encroaching ever so more on the innocent Free Peoples.

Normal : No changes
Hard : Slight Increase in Damage Taken and Slight Decrease in Damage done (Some XP bonus)
Harder : Increase in Damage Taken and Decrease in Damage Done (Large XP bonus)
Dangerous : Great Increase in Damage Taken and Great Decrease in Damage Done (Bigger XP bonus)
Deadly : Extreme increase in Damage Taken and Extreme Decrease in Damage Done. (Great XP bonus only)

And man, is it an immersive experience. To fight enemies that are far underneath my level of play and still having to be careful with my footing. Yet it never felt as if I was slowed down to a crawl either. Things took a little more time, yes. but not enough to feel like my time felt wasted. And... It was completely OPTIONAL for me to do such a playthrough!

A feature like this would thrive in the world of ESO, for we have Battle Spirit, a buff that can be used and expanded upon with different modifiers to allow players to play the world of The Elder Scrolls Online at it's fullest of potentials. Imagine it! Being able to alter your difficulty from :

Novice - Decrease in Damage Taken and Increase in Damage Done (Decrease of XP gain to further focus mainly on the story aspect of the game and allow the player to take their time and learn how to use their mechanics.)

Apprentice - The Game as it is currently, for those who are used to playing ESO but don't want added challenge or feel like they are coming out of novice and want to try something a little spicier. (No XP changes.)

Journeyman- Small increase to damage taken and decrease to damage done, enemies will be flagged and attacks aimed towards you will be a little faster to test your reaction time. Healing is not reduced. (Small XP increase)

Expert - A larger increase to damage taken and larger decrease to damage done, enemies will be flagged and their abilities will be cast with far smaller delays than Journeyman. Healing reduced slightly. (bigger XP increase)

Master - Extreme increase to damage taken and Extreme decrease to damage done. Enemies will not be messing around. Once you flag them, their abilities wlll be almost instant and keep you on your toes! Healing is greatly decreased and tactics will be a bigger factor than ever before. (GREAT XP increase.)

and of course.. What would an Elder Scrolls game be, without the highest of them all?

Legendary - You are fodder to the enemies of the Free Peoples of Tamriel. Prepare yourself for you'll need to carefuly plan your attacks and encounters. Squads of enemies will bear the difficutly of Master, but with an added twist : They can run away and seek reinforcements if nearby.

Should you prove yourself a worthy foe, can you survive the onslaught should you fail to reach that retreating enemy?

But now you may ask yourself.. Only XP bonus? No other rewards? And I believe that we could have an extra reward. Tied to classes. Begin a new adventure and change your difficulty as early as level 5 and you'll be eligible to a title, perhaps even a piece of cosmetic tied to the theme of the class! Or a memento... Or all of the above! The sky is the limit in ESO. And nobody wants to see a world thrive and succeed more than it's players.

Oh and an increase to Furnishing Mats dropped in the world would be nice too if we're playing on the harder modes.

So please, ZOS. If you read this, concider following the Lord of the Rings Online's footsteps. And improve upon it with the world scaling system of ESO. You have a gold mine of content under your hands from community, to content creation to potentially other things!

I like this - because there is something in for me as well - I said before, that something like this should benefit a larger crowd and this would definitely do that. And it would as well allow, to make parts of the game easier (eventually just for a short while) with a trade-off in XP gain - which could be good when faced with something slightly too hard for now, but where one could grow into, if there is a way, to experience it first with reduced difficulty (thinking of world bosses here). And it could as well help newbies to face their first quest end bosses on a level, which suits them more - and the gap between trash mob and end boss would not be so harsh, until they can go back to normal.

For my personal point of view, journeyman sounds like something I could apply to my younger characters right away - and my higher ones could attempt expert (if latency allows for it), well the latter maybe with the exception of bosses (guess, I'd need this exception). So yeah, highly likely that I would use that as well. And for world bosses the cowardly setting for me -. eh, novice I mean.

So yeah great idea.