PTS Update 24 - Feedback Thread for Dragonknights
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Zulera301✭✭✭✭✭Honestly, I'm curious as to what "identity" ZOS wants DKs to be, because from the way things look and feel on the PTS, it seems they want DKs' identity to be "relegated crafters", since they've slowly stripped away everything that made them shine... or made them any good at all, really.
in their quest for the farcical, nonexistent realm of "balance", they've basically meandered into the wrong lane of traffic, and then tried to swerve so hard that they WAY overcorrected, veered across three lands of traffic and hit a barricade. One small thing (overperforming DoTs, despite DKs not overperforming) led to a HUGE overcorrection (LET'S JUST NERF FREAKING EVERYTHING LOLOLOLOLOL) and it brutally murdered DKs.
I've finally found someone I want fired more than the prude on the design team that hates legs, and it's whoever thought taht nerfing DK into the ground and to the point of being unusable in PvP or even PvE, was a good idea at all.
[And just as a disclaimer, I regualrly PvP and PvE with magicka/stamina versions of all four of the base classes. While I do have my favourites, I've seen ups and downs with each, but that's a whole different can of worms]
TL;DR version:
U23: you can't get nerfs stupider than mine!
U24: hold my crack pipe.Shortly after the formation of the Ebonheart Pact, a Nord woman was given a tour of the Tribunal Temple. When later asked about the experience, she seemed upset. Suffice to say, the Dunmer were not pleased to hear this, and thus they inquired further.
"Well," the Nord frowned, "the priests were very angry and unwelcoming. They kept shouting things at me like "you can't drink that mead in here!" and "somebody stop her, she's running naked!" and "we can't catch her; she's covered in grease!""9 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »This is the official feedback thread for Dragonknights. Please read through all the changes in the patch notes and try them out on the PTS before providing feedback in this thread. Thank you!
Sorry Gina, but why? Developers don't care about what we say.
The class MUST be redesignedSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique4 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Might as well delete all my stam and MDks I'm so tired of this BS with you guys on destroying this class. It's a damn DRAGON KNIGHT! Not a damn salamander or a fire frog. It's supposed to have crazy dot damage.
pretty much this. It ends up being nor a Dragon neither a KnightSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique6 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MartiniDaniels wrote: »Plz remember that DK dots were buffed last patch to match various nerfs and cost increases (corrosive, molten whip, fossilize all severely nerfed in U23). Now this change makes that buff to dots useless, while nerfs remained in place.
Given that you introduced PVP buffs to sorcs, templars and wardens this patch, and given fact that DK was not over-performing in U23, looks like class will be completely dead.
I said that some patches ago when they introduced seething fury... a buff that will justify future nerfs on a class that was far from being OPSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
dalishdelightSoul ShrivenAlso, these changes will make the seething fury mechanic useless too, cause nobody will slot burning embers or engulfing flames. You could argue using flames of oblivion to build up the fury stack, but at that point you probably get more dps just light attack weaving and using your spammable/molten whip.Edited by dalishdelight on September 24, 2019 2:23AM2 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭dalishdelight wrote: »Also, these changes will make the seething fury mechanic useless too, cause nobody will slot burning embers or engulfing flames. You could argue using using flames of oblivion to build up the fury stack, but at that point you probably get more dps just light attack weaving and using your spammable/molten whip.
Good point.
Now it is perfect time to get old inferno and old chainsSarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique2 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Wet Noodle is back!!!!Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique1 -
Quasaur✭✭The Good:
Molten Armaments getting Major Sorcery and Brutality with the benefit to heavy attacks is good for both stam and mag specs, who will be doing a fair bit of heavy-attacking in the near future.
Obsidian Shard: Healing two people at once is a good thing and increases the odds the user might receive the heal.
The Bad:
Engulfing Flames: It looks like tying the strength of the buff to spell damage was to make MagDK useful in group activities. Please let every DK who slots Engulfing Flames give the group the full 10% bonus. MagDKs will be leveled and brought into group activities if they can do enough damage, buff or no. Also, no one likes to have their group buff diminished. Who has 3330+ spell damage? This nerf is a stomp to the head of a class that's already bleeding on the ground.
Burning Embers: The cost increase and damage decrease for a melee, light-armour class that relies on doing damage to survive is going to make some content more difficult to complete.
Request:
Since ESO is homogenising the classes, please make one of the Protective Scale morphs act like Ball of Lightning with a gap-creator, stun, and absorbance of several projectiles. That way if a DK were to accidentally run into a zerg or a nightblade, or any other class in the coming patch they have an escape. Plus, it would make DKs better at mat-farming in their new BiS role as crafters.
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Zer0_CooL✭✭✭✭✭
✭Why is it, that the necromancers "blocking armor" gets priorised over the "fiery grip"? Is it suposed to work like this or just something that has been lost in the process?0 -
ketsparrowhawk✭✭✭✭✭Stonefist - I appreciate that they're trying to do something with this (nearly) dead skill, but the new Stonefist is boring. The visual effect is dull and bland.. can barely see it. The audio effect is also dull and bland.. can barely hear it. The cost is too high. The secondary stun effect is unwanted. This will most often result in DK's giving people CC immunity when they don't really mean to. Plus, if a DK wants to stun someone they're gonna use fossilize.. of course.
I think there is potential, but it needs to be spiced up. Make the projectile BIGGER, and make it a glowing chunk of solidified LAVA that explodes when it hits its target. Get rid of the stun and give it something else. Minor Fracture + a snare maybe?
Also.. enough with the stacking mechanics already. I feel like the whole game is a grim focus at this point.
edit: typoEdited by ketsparrowhawk on September 24, 2019 1:34PM4 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭ketsparrowhawk wrote: »Stonefist - I appreciate that they're trying to do something with this (nearly) dead skill, but the new Stonefist is boring. The visual effect is dull and bland.. can barely see it. The audio effect is also dull and bland.. can barely hear it. The cost is too high. The secondary stun effect is unwanted. This will most often result in DK's giving people CC immunity when they don't really mean to. Plus, if a DK wants to stun someone they're gonna use fossilize.. of course.
I think there is potential, but it needs to be spiced up. Make the projectile BIGGER, and make it a glowing chunk of solidified LAVA that explodes when it hits its target. Get rid of the stun and give it something else. Minor Fracture + a snare maybe?
Also.. enough with the stacking mechanics already. I feel like the whole game is a grim focus at this point.
edit: typo
i wont use Fossilize, that cost is too much for stamDK.
and stun is GREAT effect for PvP, but for PvE, maybe not so much. And I agree, could be giving stun immunity at the wrong time, especially when other DK's stonefist also counted.
that's why i'm advocating to off-balance instead. 10% damage from CP, another 10% and stun from Heavy/2H.August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭ketsparrowhawk wrote: »
i do. its pretty great.
too bad the regen and damage reduction is only on that circle, it doesnt go with you. on CP PVP Cyro, people rarely cluster together unless they're a zergling.
again, thats why StoneFist should be OB, not stun.August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
Dottzgaming✭✭✭✭✭(PVP focused post)
The DK class was, to put it nicely, dumpstered with this patch.
We were given ridiculous cost increases on our skills without corresponding sustain changes. DK sustain was finally in a pretty good place and now we are being taken back to where our sustain is easily some of the worst in the game. I know sustain is being nerfed across the board, but from my testing, these changes effect DK way more than theyre effecting other classes. Adding an instantaneous status effect to the morphs of Searing Strike was not enough.
The DoT "standards" that apply to skills like Degen and Soul trap can NOT also apply to the DK class. Stam and Mag DK heavily rely on Searing Strike and Fiery Breath for success, and both skills are laughably bad in Dragonhold. We are, by design, a more DoT centric class (part of the reason i was drawn to the class in the first place). We REQUIRE our DoTs to be strong for our success, and in this patch, they're atrocious.
On my magDK, my Volatile armor is my strongest class DoT. The extra effect DoT on my armor buff deals more damage than my 2 primary class DoTs from my "damage" line. And please dont take this as "let's nerf volatile's damage", this is a plea for a buff on the damage to Embers/Engulfing. Because Embers damage was also nerfed so hard, in turn, the healing on this skill was also severely hurt.
On my StamDK, the poison status effect is my hardest hitting DoT. It isnt until the near end of Venomous does that skill take over in terms of damage. In addition, the combined neutering of the DK DoT kit, the nerfs on Dizzying swing this patch, and the nerfs on the SnB skill line last patch have put stamDKs in an incredibly tough spot going into next patch.
I understand youre trying to standardize things to make it easier to balance in the future, but certain things need to be considered "rule breakers" - the DK class, needs to be considered a "rule breaker" when it comes to DoT balancing. Our class relies so heavily on DoT damage for the gameplay the class was designed around. When our class DoTs are weak, DKs are weak.
Please consider buffing the DK class DoTs to help keep us competitive, and adjust the cost of our skills slightly (via a passive [maybe increasing the amount of resources combustion restores] or lowering the costs) to help our sustain.Edited by Dottzgaming on September 26, 2019 2:38PM13 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dottzgaming wrote: »(PVP focused post)
In addition, the combined neutering of the DK DoT kit, the nerfs on Dizzying swing this patch, and the nerfs on the SnB skill line last patch have put stamDKs in an incredibly tough spot going into next patch.
I'd argue DK will be in no spot whatsoever into the next patch.
There's no place for stamDK since all other classes will be superior in every way.
Go ahead, name one thing (remember, PvP focused) that stamDK can do better than other class.
(gentle reminder, we're not the only class that have Major Mending in a class skill...)August Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber0 -
Dottzgaming✭✭✭✭✭Dottzgaming wrote: »(PVP focused post)
In addition, the combined neutering of the DK DoT kit, the nerfs on Dizzying swing this patch, and the nerfs on the SnB skill line last patch have put stamDKs in an incredibly tough spot going into next patch.
I'd argue DK will be in no spot whatsoever into the next patch.
There's no place for stamDK since all other classes will be superior in every way.
Go ahead, name one thing (remember, PvP focused) that stamDK can do better than other class.
(gentle reminder, we're not the only class that have Major Mending in a class skill...)
I dont disagree with you at all. Ive been trying really hard to come up with something for my sDK and im just.. stumped atm. However, I do have something on the PTS that i made that i am going to test soon, but even then, i think it's still going to still feel weak compared to other classes since one of our main strengths - sustained dmg - is just.. gone.2 -
satanio✭✭✭✭I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.0
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MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭GeorgeBlack wrote: »
While other classes receive mighty buffs just for being slotted or cast once in 20 seconds (ahem, netch, multiple purges, recovery, major buff, zero cost, +2% damage for being slotted, can be spammed for ulti gain and healing). NETCH is NOT OVERLOADED. AT ALL. LOOK AT STAMFIST that IS OP and FUN for IDENTITY)I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.
Try it in PVP
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MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Can developers please provide explanation for so hard nerf of obsidian shard morph of stamfist?
That ability was used only by few people because it is costly and easily dodged at distance, while in melee fossilize is much better. But still it had it's uses, and now it is heavily nerfed in range, lost stun, and only compensation for this is heal of another, random target. This may be an attempt to make it more useful for healers, but then it should give something more like some buff to the target maybe. Major protection for 3 seconds for example. Healing 2 random targets with condition to hit another target first (for miserable damage)... that is so unreliable way to heal, that this morph is effectively dead, also with such cost.1 -
Davadin✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dottzgaming wrote: »Dottzgaming wrote: »(PVP focused post)
In addition, the combined neutering of the DK DoT kit, the nerfs on Dizzying swing this patch, and the nerfs on the SnB skill line last patch have put stamDKs in an incredibly tough spot going into next patch.
I'd argue DK will be in no spot whatsoever into the next patch.
There's no place for stamDK since all other classes will be superior in every way.
Go ahead, name one thing (remember, PvP focused) that stamDK can do better than other class.
(gentle reminder, we're not the only class that have Major Mending in a class skill...)
I dont disagree with you at all. Ive been trying really hard to come up with something for my sDK and im just.. stumped atm. However, I do have something on the PTS that i made that i am going to test soon, but even then, i think it's still going to still feel weak compared to other classes since one of our main strengths - sustained dmg - is just.. gone.
hang on to that build, we're getting a new patch in pts Monday morning, bruhAugust Palatine Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Gray Host
Greymoor 6.0.7 PvP : Medium 2H/SnB The Destroyer
Dragonhold 5.2.11 PvE : Medium DW/2H The Blood Furnace
March 2021 (too lazy to add CP) PvP: Medium DW/Bow The Stabber1 -
satanio✭✭✭✭
Since when is PvP rotation based? It’s like me saying to you try old Dizzy & Dragon Leap in PvE... you can do it but it sucks.MartiniDaniels wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »
While other classes receive mighty buffs just for being slotted or cast once in 20 seconds (ahem, netch, multiple purges, recovery, major buff, zero cost, +2% damage for being slotted, can be spammed for ulti gain and healing). NETCH is NOT OVERLOADED. AT ALL. LOOK AT STAMFIST that IS OP and FUN for IDENTITY)I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.
Try it in PVP
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JusticeSouldier✭✭✭✭@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_GinaBruno @Gilliamtherogue It should be melee smashing punch with such fist.
not that "pew-pew" with pebbles.
Quick mouse sketch of Stonefist (srry have no time today to draw it more accurate, detailed, in action)
all classes. pc platform, dissapointed.8 -
Numerikuu✭✭✭✭✭
✭JusticeSouldier wrote: »@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_GinaBruno @Gilliamtherogue It should be melee smashing punch with such fist.
not that "pew-pew" with pebbles.
Quick mouse sketch of Stonefist (srry have no time today to draw it more accurate, detailed, in action)
^This. That and i feel like it should shatter on impact. That's the image I got in my head when reading 'Stone Fist'.
Nice sketch btw!7 -
SilverPaws✭✭✭✭✭
Since when is PvP rotation based? It’s like me saying to you try old Dizzy & Dragon Leap in PvE... you can do it but it sucks.MartiniDaniels wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »
While other classes receive mighty buffs just for being slotted or cast once in 20 seconds (ahem, netch, multiple purges, recovery, major buff, zero cost, +2% damage for being slotted, can be spammed for ulti gain and healing). NETCH is NOT OVERLOADED. AT ALL. LOOK AT STAMFIST that IS OP and FUN for IDENTITY)I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.
Try it in PVP
PvP has rotations as well, but you would know that if you would pvp 0 -
satanio✭✭✭✭SilverPaws wrote: »
Since when is PvP rotation based? It’s like me saying to you try old Dizzy & Dragon Leap in PvE... you can do it but it sucks.MartiniDaniels wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »
While other classes receive mighty buffs just for being slotted or cast once in 20 seconds (ahem, netch, multiple purges, recovery, major buff, zero cost, +2% damage for being slotted, can be spammed for ulti gain and healing). NETCH is NOT OVERLOADED. AT ALL. LOOK AT STAMFIST that IS OP and FUN for IDENTITY)I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.
Try it in PVP
PvP has rotations as well, but you would know that if you would pvp
So you're saying to me, that you are maintaining rotation that consist of more than 6 spells? while PvPing? So that is the "reactive" combat every PvPer is talking about? Rotation based pvp?
I was under assumption that PvP is combo based and pve rotation based... 1 -
SilverPaws✭✭✭✭✭SilverPaws wrote: »
Since when is PvP rotation based? It’s like me saying to you try old Dizzy & Dragon Leap in PvE... you can do it but it sucks.MartiniDaniels wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »
While other classes receive mighty buffs just for being slotted or cast once in 20 seconds (ahem, netch, multiple purges, recovery, major buff, zero cost, +2% damage for being slotted, can be spammed for ulti gain and healing). NETCH is NOT OVERLOADED. AT ALL. LOOK AT STAMFIST that IS OP and FUN for IDENTITY)I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.
Try it in PVP
PvP has rotations as well, but you would know that if you would pvp
So you're saying to me, that you are maintaining rotation that consist of more than 6 spells? while PvPing? So that is the "reactive" combat every PvPer is talking about? Rotation based pvp?
I was under assumption that PvP is combo based and pve rotation based...
:dumb:0 -
satanio✭✭✭✭SilverPaws wrote: »SilverPaws wrote: »
Since when is PvP rotation based? It’s like me saying to you try old Dizzy & Dragon Leap in PvE... you can do it but it sucks.MartiniDaniels wrote: »GeorgeBlack wrote: »
While other classes receive mighty buffs just for being slotted or cast once in 20 seconds (ahem, netch, multiple purges, recovery, major buff, zero cost, +2% damage for being slotted, can be spammed for ulti gain and healing). NETCH is NOT OVERLOADED. AT ALL. LOOK AT STAMFIST that IS OP and FUN for IDENTITY)I'm really having fun trying to maintain max stacks of Seething Fury and Stagger in rotation. it's tedious but satisfying.
Try it in PVP
PvP has rotations as well, but you would know that if you would pvp
So you're saying to me, that you are maintaining rotation that consist of more than 6 spells? while PvPing? So that is the "reactive" combat every PvPer is talking about? Rotation based pvp?
I was under assumption that PvP is combo based and pve rotation based...
:dumb:
no u0
