Power Surge Change?

Lord_Eomer

Anyway this change screw MagSorc and have to bear for next 3 months.

Varana

...

ccfeeling

mocap wrote: »

so sorc healer with Mother's Sorrow could be a thing? At least as a hybrid dd-heal for dungeons...

I can do the same thing with typical DPS pet build easily , Twilight Matriarch provides great healing which scales my magicka pool instantly , we don't even have to wait 3 second CD , works in mobile fight .

About the power surge revamp for sorc healer , the direction is correct , but the requirement is absolutely wrong , CD should be reduced to 1 sec , how this delay healing works better than current healing skills ? Why sorc healer slot this new power surge instead of other healing skills , such as orb , regen , Altar , Spring which provide instant healing and great functions .

itscompton

ccmedaddy wrote: »

lmao this is the last week of PTS and most of the patch notes is basically them saying "we'll figure this out later".

ZOS wyd...

Except for eclipse which they changed and broke for multi Target use and instead of saying we'll figure this out later they just said "f*ck it, you're stuck with a single Target ability now"

Ezhh

I have at this point decided I won't be playing my sorc healer anymore, and I don't see this making me change my mind. It's not the new healing ability sorc healer needs by a long way.

What it does instead is leave me worried my DD mag sorc will become far less enjoyable to play as well. I often need that passive healing, especially if using group finder or doing vMA (I've never used the flappy bird healer of eye-pain). But a heal that heals after heals and only every 3 seconds? This won't work. So I could switch to crit surge, but then I take a huge dps loss unless I add in another source of major sorcery. Then it's a battle between bar space and pots, and I don't want to burn pots for every single thing I do. I could switch some skills around instead sure, but... the flexibility is gone and the skill that made me fall in love with the class ends up as a dead skill either way.

I guess this just leaves my stam sorc feeling like it can really make use of class skills!

universal_wrath

Ezhh wrote: »

I have at this point decided I won't be playing my sorc healer anymore, and I don't see this making me change my mind. It's not the new healing ability sorc healer needs by a long way.

What it does instead is leave me worried my DD mag sorc will become far less enjoyable to play as well. I often need that passive healing, especially if using group finder or doing vMA (I've never used the flappy bird healer of eye-pain). But a heal that heals after heals and only every 3 seconds? This won't work. So I could switch to crit surge, but then I take a huge dps loss unless I add in another source of major sorcery. Then it's a battle between bar space and pots, and I don't want to burn pots for every single thing I do. I could switch some skills around instead sure, but... the flexibility is gone and the skill that made me fall in love with the class ends up as a dead skill either way.

I guess this just leaves my stam sorc feeling like it can really make use of class skills!

I don't see a space bar issue if you want to use crit surge. For my atleast, I don't run pots, I use surge on my mag sorc for major sorcery. Now that major was taken from surge and aoe was gutted, I will take out lightening spalsh and switch it with either anthorpy or degen for that nice dot and major sorcery, and switch power surge with crit surge.

universal_wrath

universal_wrath wrote: »

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Ezhh wrote: »

I have at this point decided I won't be playing my sorc healer anymore, and I don't see this making me change my mind. It's not the new healing ability sorc healer needs by a long way.

What it does instead is leave me worried my DD mag sorc will become far less enjoyable to play as well. I often need that passive healing, especially if using group finder or doing vMA (I've never used the flappy bird healer of eye-pain). But a heal that heals after heals and only every 3 seconds? This won't work. So I could switch to crit surge, but then I take a huge dps loss unless I add in another source of major sorcery. Then it's a battle between bar space and pots, and I don't want to burn pots for every single thing I do. I could switch some skills around instead sure, but... the flexibility is gone and the skill that made me fall in love with the class ends up as a dead skill either way.

I guess this just leaves my stam sorc feeling like it can really make use of class skills!

I don't see a space bar issue if you want to use crit surge. For my atleast, I don't run pots, I use surge on my mag sorc for major sorcery. Now that major was taken from surge and aoe was gutted, I will take out lightening spalsh and switch it with either anthorpy or degen for that nice dot and major sorcery, and switch power surge with crit surge.

For next patch, people who were using power surge will use crit surge with no issue as they most likely will be adding anthropy to their bar anyway. Those who who don't use surge at all on live and use power pots instead should not talk as much about a skill they never use. Though i totally understand how it feel to far a signeture skill gutted same as DK wing. RIP fellow mag sorcs whom actually use power surge over power pots. Time to adopt... again.

Ezhh

universal_wrath wrote: »

I don't see a space bar issue if you want to use crit surge. For my atleast, I don't run pots, I use surge on my mag sorc for major sorcery. Now that major was taken from surge and aoe was gutted, I will take out lightening spalsh and switch it with either anthorpy or degen for that nice dot and major sorcery, and switch power surge with crit surge.

I don't think that makes it okay that power surge is now quite useless (certainly for those of us who have been using it, and with debatable value for healers), or okay that major brutality is still available while major sorcery is not without additional skills.

As people have said, throw major sorcery onto crit surge and all is well, but I still don't see this being a great help to my healer, which is what it was meant to do. Feels like a wasted opportunity to improve things, and something that just lowers the chance to play the game in differing ways while still being reasonable in your role.

PapaWeeb

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

They really should just put Major Sorcery on the base ability and both morphs and everyone is happy. ZoS can experiment with Power Surge as a healing tool and we can use Critical Surge on both Mag and Stam sorc just the way we are used to.

Makes too much sense, sorry no bueno

Hotdog_23

After reading some more I see that it has an 18m radius which is pretty big especially since it travels with you compared to other AOE heals on other class skill line. So you will cast it less plus it last at least 50% long than any other skill if not 4 times as long.

For reference: source https://en.uesp.net/wiki except the Sorcerer part I seen from kirchhofftr tooltip.

DK- Cinder storm is pathetic at 5 meters-- fixed in one spot-- heals every second-- last 18 seconds with passive--cost 4590 magicka

Warden - Healing seed is 8 meters last 6 seconds-- fixed in one spot—cost 2430, no access to PTS not sure how they changed this as I have seen no tool tips.

NB - Refreshing path--17 meters but it is only a corridor not a circle-- fixed in one spot—last 12 seconds with passive--Heals every second--cost 3510 magicka

Necro – Spirit Guardian not really sure it just says around you--heals every 2 seconds one morph the ghost takes 10% of damage to you and the other only last 8 seconds but does twice the healing—cost 2430 magicka

Nerco also have Braided Tether –28m as long as you are between the corpse and the other player--heals every second—cost 3240

Templar – Cleansing ritual morph into Ritual of Retribution-- fixed in one spot--12 meter-- last 12 seconds-- heals every 2 seconds—cost 4320 magicka

Cleansing ritual morph into Extended Ritual-- fixed in one spot --12 meter-- last 24 seconds-- heals every 2 seconds—cost 4320 magicka

Sorcerer - Power surge 18 meters that travels with you—Last 33 seconds heals every 3 seconds—cost 3270 magicka

Ekzorka

Just tested it in simple DLC Public Dungeon. Very low healing from the direct damage, no more healing from AoE crit. In every mob pack I risked to die - in simple Public Dungeon! It's not just a bad change, it's awful change. Now the Warden Lotus skill seems more effective than this Surge that just... was changed for who?
I didn't thought that there will be more worse after food nerfing. I was wrong. You making the game more difficult, but don't offer anything instead. Bad optimization, high ping and bugs also making content hard.

Kolzki

Sorc’s class identity is that they have to use two skill slots for everything they do. Double slot matriarch, double slot the familiar. Now you will need to slot a second heal over time if you want to reliably proc their class heal over time. Class identity confirmed.

Zypheran

What was wrong with the skill up to now??
I completely understand fine tuning skills that were under or over performing but making dramatic changes to the very core function of skills without a shred of insight, the week before the patch goes live.... when nobody was complaining about the skill.... well, that's just inconsiderate!
This change makes no sense.
Its aggravated by the fact that the solution was so simple and obvious (put Major Sorc on base skill)
Its clear that they don't give a rats ass about feedback or what the players think. If they did, this would have been done in the first PTS patch. Either they don't care about our feedback or this was only decided last minute, which shows lack of forethought.

katorga

Developer Comment: Statistically we found that magicka Sorcerers were using the Major Sorcery version of Surge more than the Major Brutality version of the ability.....

jypcy

Beardimus wrote: »

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jypcy wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Goodbye its use in vMA

Really don't get todays change. I'm all foe helping sorc healers but as a solo DD sorc i don't get the use for this skill. Fark.
Who thought sorcs had OP heals???? Anyone?

You can just use crit surge instead for even greater healing than you currently have on live. Entropy is also worth consideration now, so can be your source of major sorcery if you don’t have another source of it and want it (with the added bonus of additional heals or mag sustain).
Full disclosure, I did/do think surge is a bit much for self survivability, but I don’t think I’d go so far as to say overpowered.

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

Why ZOS?

Magicka Sorc will not rely on Power Surge for solo contents,

As power surge is destroyed, crit surge should grant Major Sorcery too.

See above. If you don’t want to run pots, just use entropy.

*edit to add:

Kolzki wrote: »

*And yes, spell power pots exist for difficult content. And we could slot entropy, which is completely op, but pet sorcs aren't really known for their spare bar slots. It would be nice to think that mag builds could exist without entropy, particularly in aoe situations.

Major sorcery really isn’t necessary to clear content. And if you’re trying to score push or optimize your build anyway, I can’t offhand think of a better potion to use than spell power pots.

I assume you suggest stashing the extra skill on the overload bar right...oh wait.

Bar space is the issue, (for both solo PvP DD & Sorc Healer in particular if you run a pet) this id a weird AF change.

Tine for pets to be one barred at the least

Agreed that pets are in a weird place where idk that they really offer enough anymore to require two slots (tormenter and clannfear especially), but if single barring them just puts them on a timer like most other pets in the game, I probably wouldn’t be a fan of that either.

I don’t have much to offer on magsorcs in pvp. I can understand why they’d be hurt by this change, although I’m guessing there are workarounds. For sorc healer I expect you’d rely on your own heals instead of surge, so you’d only add it now if you already had bar space for it, especially given that it doesn’t sound all that powerful with a 3 sec cd. Which should indicate that the new iteration didn’t really hit the intended mark, but regardless, solo magsorc (at least in PvE, probably in PvP too as far as I’m concerned) will be fine even if these changes get pushed through as is.

Xvorg

Kolzki wrote: »

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Xvorg wrote: »

Kolzki wrote: »

Fun facts from a quick test of power surge on pts:

• the blood magic passive can proc it but needs to crit off a crystal frags proc (totally unreliable) or mines.
• the critical leach cp passive can proc it every 5 seconds, if it crits.No passive crits anymore
• the healing morph of degeneration, structured entropy, can proc it reasonably reliably.
• the dual weild healing morphs and crushing weapon proc can proc it reasonably often for a small dps cost. the first one is not very reliable on a magsorc
• orc's unflinching rage passive can proc it every 4 seconds if the heal crits (long live the orc master race).No passive crits anymore
• vigor and ring of preservation could work at the cost of lots of skill slots for a weird stam sorc off healer thing.

Then you have to slot pelinal's to convert spell dmg to wpn dmg
So, for a mag sorc, structured entropy is an option to proc power surge. I can't see another way to reliably proc it on a mag sorc without spamming pet heals (or being an actual healer with a resto staff/orbs). I would rather run degeneration with crit surge instead, but entropy is an option if you want to run power surge for some off healing. Weirdly, stam sorcs actually look like they might be able to proc power surge more reliably than mag sorcs.

Also, the self healing from structured entropy (or other self heal crits) can only activate power surge if you've taken damage. Over healing doesn't work. If there's no incomming damage or you're soaking it up with a shield then you won't proc power surge with a self heal.

@Xvorg you might have missed the bit on the first line where I said

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Kolzki wrote: »

Fun facts from a quick test of power surge on pts:

The critical leach cp passive:


The orc's unflinching rage passive:


My comment on the stamina skills was for a pure stamina character that provides some group healing. You don't need pelinals for that. I'm really just suggesting that stamina sorcs probably have better ways to proc power surge than double destro staff mag sorcs do.

Is the amount of heal higher than the base one? If yes, then it's Ok

I remember a patch where ZoS said that no passive would crit anymore (maybe it was the same when proc set stopped crit) but I could be wrong.