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The "Balance" of Mag Sorcs
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Derra✭✭✭✭✭
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No you precisely can not do that because you have to fight within 15m of your target - which you don’t have to on live.
The cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing - because the ability on pts now fills two roles instead of one. One is being a melee stun - this directly counteracts the mobility and evasive part of streak.
If you´re using it in both regards you have to streak way more often than the cost increase makes up for.
If i give you more resources, it is a boon.
If i give you a new way to use those resources, that also is a boon.
Arguing that the former is not a boon just because of the latter is silly.
It is like getting a million dollar gift and saying it does precisely nothing because you also got the option to buy a million-dollar yacht.
It´s not a boon when it´s only used in that way because something else was taken away.
It´s not a boon if it forces you into a playstyle that directly contradicts it´s other function.
You can still use flame clench for the same purpose, so it was not taken away. Its not like the range is shorter than bolt.
You realize that what you´re saying makes zero sense yes?
You did not understand what i mean. Okay, let me rephrase.
You say that you now have to use bolt escape for CC, because reach CC was removed. I say that while reach CC was removed, clench CC was not. You can only use it at relatively close range, yes, but that is also true for bolt escape CC. So, nothing was taken away that you would *have* to replace with bolt escape CC. You can instead replace it with clench CC.
No.
I understand precisely what you meant. It just makes no sense.
Why would I replace a good 15m cc with a worse one - while I slot the good one either way.
You suggest I slot two abilities to do the same thing - one of those being worse an every way than the other and can’t see that what you say is hysterical?
Also the function that was taken away i talked about was having a ranged cc and anytimer in one slot with streak being the only cc option after not costing you barspace.
So yeah. You don’t understand and what you say makes no sense because of that.
Look. You can still keep using clench, like you do now on live and in this case the stacking cost reduction on streak increases your mobility, at the cost of using a slot for clench.
OR, you can drop clench, save a slot, and use bolt for both mobility and CC, which you can do thanks to the cost reduction on streak
This puts the theoretical advantage gained from the cost reduction ad absurdum. You have to streak 1x more in every situation where you would have been at range previously.
Also you can not drop clench and save a slot because that means losing a Spammable.
You have no idea what you talk about.
It can’t be that hard to understand that fighting within 15m is a huge difference from fighting within 36. Saying those scenarios are even remotely the same is simply lying or stupid.
That being said I agree with reach nerfs - it was a stupid ability.
Just not with all the other sorc nerfs slapped on top (except with twilight and harness those I agree with aswell).Edited by Derra on August 1, 2019 8:50AM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
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No you precisely can not do that because you have to fight within 15m of your target - which you don’t have to on live.
The cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing - because the ability on pts now fills two roles instead of one. One is being a melee stun - this directly counteracts the mobility and evasive part of streak.
If you´re using it in both regards you have to streak way more often than the cost increase makes up for.
If i give you more resources, it is a boon.
If i give you a new way to use those resources, that also is a boon.
Arguing that the former is not a boon just because of the latter is silly.
It is like getting a million dollar gift and saying it does precisely nothing because you also got the option to buy a million-dollar yacht.
It´s not a boon when it´s only used in that way because something else was taken away.
It´s not a boon if it forces you into a playstyle that directly contradicts it´s other function.
You can still use flame clench for the same purpose, so it was not taken away. Its not like the range is shorter than bolt.
You realize that what you´re saying makes zero sense yes?
You did not understand what i mean. Okay, let me rephrase.
You say that you now have to use bolt escape for CC, because reach CC was removed. I say that while reach CC was removed, clench CC was not. You can only use it at relatively close range, yes, but that is also true for bolt escape CC. So, nothing was taken away that you would *have* to replace with bolt escape CC. You can instead replace it with clench CC.
No.
I understand precisely what you meant. It just makes no sense.
Why would I replace a good 15m cc with a worse one - while I slot the good one either way.
You suggest I slot two abilities to do the same thing - one of those being worse an every way than the other and can’t see that what you say is hysterical?
Also the function that was taken away i talked about was having a ranged cc and anytimer in one slot with streak being the only cc option after not costing you barspace.
So yeah. You don’t understand and what you say makes no sense because of that.
Look. You can still keep using clench, like you do now on live and in this case the stacking cost reduction on streak increases your mobility, at the cost of using a slot for clench.
OR, you can drop clench, save a slot, and use bolt for both mobility and CC, which you can do thanks to the cost reduction on streak
This puts the theoretical advantage gained from the cost reduction ad absurdum. You have to streak 1x more in every situation where you would have been at range previously.
You have to fight within 15 of target either way(assuming you want to CC with clench or bolt) so i don't see how this is a factor for being or not being able to keep using clench.Also you can not drop clench and save a slot because that means losing a Spammable.
You get a free slot. If you need a spammable, use it for a spammable.It can’t be that hard to understand that fighting within 15m is a huge difference from fighting within 36. Saying those scenarios are even remotely the same is simply lying or stupid.
I'm sorry but I never said there is no difference between fighting within 15m and within 36m, or that those scenarios are the same.
I'm just opposing your claim that "the cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing". It either allows you to free a slot (if you drop clench, and use the reduced cost to cover using bolt for CC) or it gives you better mobility (if you keep clench and use the reduced cost to cover more ground).
Edited by Sharee on August 1, 2019 10:55AM0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The lack of bar space comes from our defenses. It requires three shields or two shields and two pet slots to have a solid defense. Block and dodge require no slot whatsoever. That's the problem right there.
The Problem is that you sorcs are used to be nearly invincible, and to keep this state you create bar space problems by slotting a ridiculous amount of defense skills. Grow a pair and get in line with the other mag classes you spoiled brats.
EDIT: i mean three shields come on, lol
Yeah, I can see you having troubles with sorcs. Competent players haven't.1 -
Ender1310✭✭✭✭Streak nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Frag nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Shields nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Healing Ward nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Whats your problem now?
OR OR OR
The mechanics of the class are just that OP?
That many core nerfs and still this class is really really good. Or ALL sorcs are lite players and everyone else just sucks.
1 -
Ender1310✭✭✭✭We gladly gave up on pets if we get a proper healing and frag stun back. Power surge is not a viable option for noCP.
Frag buffed? I rather have a cc than 20%damage output.
Streak is bugged, costly and easily counterable by a gapclose.
I remember when people laugh about pets on pvp and now it seems it is a standard.
Magsorc is predictable: roll one and learn its weeknesses.
Oh I forgot:
Rune cage buffed nerfed buffed nerfed to the ground - Magsorc adapted
You guys are all sooo gud at your class. And every other player is just not. Zomg. Lolz. Guys just roll Mag sorc over represent the F out of it all you need to do.0 -
rasdasa✭✭I play mag sorc, I use no shields and no pets, it may be stupid, but I find that it makes the game more exciting.0
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rasdasa✭✭Once you aren't using shields and pets you realize there is one thing we lack, and that's a convenient stun in our class skill line. We have the one from streak, but by the time I streak, readjust my view with a controller (I play PS4) it's really a pretty difficult stun to utilize easily as opposed to something like what you get from flame clench.0
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Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭KurtAngle2 wrote: »Streak nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Frag nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Shields nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Healing Ward nerfed - Magsorc adapted
Whats your problem now?
Shields weren't really nerfed and the magsorcer got his pet ENORMOUSLY buffed to the point that they do *** of dps and healings whilst messing with targeting. All of this whilst maintaining great dps and best execute in the game
Shields got nerfed twice. First was the big duration nerf. And I remember very well certain people crying "oh, now bad sorczzz can't be carried by shields anymore, suckeeerz!".
Well, sorcs still here. Certain people still moaning about shields. Leads me to believe those people are the problem and they will always complain - until the class gets deleted.
Told you.2 -
stritzi✭✭✭[The lack of bar space comes from our defenses. It requires three shields or two shields and two pet slots to have a solid defense. Block and dodge require no slot whatsoever. That's the problem right there.
The Problem is that you sorcs are used to be nearly invincible, and to keep this state you create bar space problems by slotting a ridiculous amount of defense skills. Grow a pair and get in line with the other mag classes you spoiled brats.
EDIT: i mean three shields come on, lol
Yeah, I can see you having troubles with sorcs. Competent players haven't.
Not really actually, but as some one that plays sorc and other classes i am able to see and unterstand the differences and you dear sir are nothing more than a sorc fanboi, cheeers friendo!
Edited by stritzi on August 1, 2019 4:35PM1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭[The lack of bar space comes from our defenses. It requires three shields or two shields and two pet slots to have a solid defense. Block and dodge require no slot whatsoever. That's the problem right there.
The Problem is that you sorcs are used to be nearly invincible, and to keep this state you create bar space problems by slotting a ridiculous amount of defense skills. Grow a pair and get in line with the other mag classes you spoiled brats.
EDIT: i mean three shields come on, lol
Yeah, I can see you having troubles with sorcs. Competent players haven't.
Not really actually, but as some one that plays sorc and other classes i am able to see and unterstand the differences and you dear sir are nothing more than a sorc fanboi, cheeers friendo!
Sure. And you suggested dropping the three shields, which has been meta until Twilight changes. *facepalm*
You may be playing multiple classes, but you have mastered none of them.0 -
stritzi✭✭✭
dude thats a pleb meta, you dont need three shields, and if you do l2p. But i guess we are talking about different levels of pvp, you seem to be a lazy pug stomper, not interested in competition, so just lets stop here, you bore me, your one and only argument is: i am good you are bad; thats the essence of nearly every post of yours.[The lack of bar space comes from our defenses. It requires three shields or two shields and two pet slots to have a solid defense. Block and dodge require no slot whatsoever. That's the problem right there.
The Problem is that you sorcs are used to be nearly invincible, and to keep this state you create bar space problems by slotting a ridiculous amount of defense skills. Grow a pair and get in line with the other mag classes you spoiled brats.
EDIT: i mean three shields come on, lol
Yeah, I can see you having troubles with sorcs. Competent players haven't.
Not really actually, but as some one that plays sorc and other classes i am able to see and unterstand the differences and you dear sir are nothing more than a sorc fanboi, cheeers friendo!
Sure. And you suggested dropping the three shields, which has been meta until Twilight changes. *facepalm*
You may be playing multiple classes, but you have mastered none of them.
But hey, have fun!
Cheers cheesus!
Edited by stritzi on August 2, 2019 5:44AM0 -
Iskiab✭✭✭✭✭
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The cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing - because the ability on pts now fills two roles instead of one. One is being a melee stun - this directly counteracts the mobility and evasive part of streak.
If you´re using it in both regards you have to streak way more often than the cost increase makes up for.
If i give you more resources, it is a boon.
If i give you a new way to use those resources, that also is a boon.
Arguing that the former is not a boon just because of the latter is silly.
It is like getting a million dollar gift and saying it does precisely nothing because you also got the option to buy a million-dollar yacht.
Can’t argue with sorcs. They’re the class that’s ‘nerfed every patch’ but mysteriously always ends up top dog.
Has there ever in the history of ESO ever been a patch that nerfs them without a buff somewhere else? I doubt it.Edited by Iskiab on August 2, 2019 12:07PMLooking for any guildies I used to play with:
Havoc Warhammer - Alair
LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
PRX and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
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dude thats a pleb meta, you dont need three shields, and if you do l2p. But i guess we are talking about different levels of pvp, you seem to be a lazy pug stomper, not interested in competition, so just lets stop here, you bore me, your one and only argument is: i am good you are bad; thats the essence of nearly every post of yours.[The lack of bar space comes from our defenses. It requires three shields or two shields and two pet slots to have a solid defense. Block and dodge require no slot whatsoever. That's the problem right there.
The Problem is that you sorcs are used to be nearly invincible, and to keep this state you create bar space problems by slotting a ridiculous amount of defense skills. Grow a pair and get in line with the other mag classes you spoiled brats.
EDIT: i mean three shields come on, lol
Yeah, I can see you having troubles with sorcs. Competent players haven't.
Not really actually, but as some one that plays sorc and other classes i am able to see and unterstand the differences and you dear sir are nothing more than a sorc fanboi, cheeers friendo!
Sure. And you suggested dropping the three shields, which has been meta until Twilight changes. *facepalm*
You may be playing multiple classes, but you have mastered none of them.
But hey, have fun!
Cheers cheesus!
Yeah, it's not like someone like Malcolm, possibly the best magsorc player currently, is running that.
You are the boring one here. I'm giving examples and explanations. You're just claiming your way was the best, freshman, and then just insult everybody around. Your posts are devoid of any actual content and that leads to the conclusion that your understanding of the game is equally lacking.2 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭
dude thats a pleb meta, you dont need three shields, and if you do l2p. But i guess we are talking about different levels of pvp, you seem to be a lazy pug stomper, not interested in competition, so just lets stop here, you bore me, your one and only argument is: i am good you are bad; thats the essence of nearly every post of yours.[The lack of bar space comes from our defenses. It requires three shields or two shields and two pet slots to have a solid defense. Block and dodge require no slot whatsoever. That's the problem right there.
The Problem is that you sorcs are used to be nearly invincible, and to keep this state you create bar space problems by slotting a ridiculous amount of defense skills. Grow a pair and get in line with the other mag classes you spoiled brats.
EDIT: i mean three shields come on, lol
Yeah, I can see you having troubles with sorcs. Competent players haven't.
Not really actually, but as some one that plays sorc and other classes i am able to see and unterstand the differences and you dear sir are nothing more than a sorc fanboi, cheeers friendo!
Sure. And you suggested dropping the three shields, which has been meta until Twilight changes. *facepalm*
You may be playing multiple classes, but you have mastered none of them.
But hey, have fun!
Cheers cheesus!
Potatoes still squabbling for nerfs before final PTS patch I see.
You seem like you get farmed on a regular basis and use the typical potato excuse that you play a challenging class. Carry on2 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭
The cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing - because the ability on pts now fills two roles instead of one. One is being a melee stun - this directly counteracts the mobility and evasive part of streak.
If you´re using it in both regards you have to streak way more often than the cost increase makes up for.
If i give you more resources, it is a boon.
If i give you a new way to use those resources, that also is a boon.
Arguing that the former is not a boon just because of the latter is silly.
It is like getting a million dollar gift and saying it does precisely nothing because you also got the option to buy a million-dollar yacht.
Can’t argue with sorcs. They’re the class that’s ‘nerfed every patch’ but mysteriously always ends up top dog.
Has there ever in the history of ESO ever been a patch that nerfs them without a buff somewhere else? I doubt it.
Wolf hunter was a patch where sorcs were nothing but free AP. I could regularly one shot them through their shields and anything stam was running riot over them with swift.
The murkmire sorc was the strongest I have ever played and close to invincible.( I have played sorc only after morrowind )
Since then a lot of things have been adjusted. The problem is the potatoes are still in murkmire and call for unwarranted nerfsEdited by PhoenixGrey on August 2, 2019 5:08PM0 -
ThePedge✭✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.2 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Don't forget 2 or 3 dots and a curse before kiting. It's going to be great lol0 -
NuarBlack✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Don't forget 2 or 3 dots and a curse before kiting. It's going to be great lol
Lear 2 slot a gap closer
Gap closer 22m
Streak 15m
So unless your reflexes are slower you have the advantage. If you get kited in eso you got outplayed bad. Go play play a different pvp mmo where it takes actual effort to stay in top of a target.4 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Don't forget 2 or 3 dots and a curse before kiting. It's going to be great lol
Lear 2 slot a gap closer
Gap closer 22m
Streak 15m
So unless your reflexes are slower you have the advantage. If you get kited in eso you got outplayed bad. Go play play a different pvp mmo where it takes actual effort to stay in top of a target.
A sorc just streaked through you.
What you have to do to gap close to him:
1, break free
2, turn camera 180 degrees
3, press the gap closer button.
What the sorc has to do to get out of gap closer range:
1, press the streak button again.
Any bets which one can be done faster?3 -
kalunte✭✭✭✭✭+1 for sorc dominating the world, it looks like the only "working as intended" class, thats why it looks so strong. skills can be combo-ed reliably*, shields do theyr job, streaks do theyr job, pets soak dmg. everything works fine.
wardens have theyr delayed combo working fine too (bit harder to land tho)
not all class can see all theyr skills working as intented and that's the big difference to me
0 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭+1 for sorc dominating the world, it looks like the only "working as intended" class, thats why it looks so strong. skills can be combo-ed reliably*, shields do theyr job, streaks do theyr job, pets soak dmg. everything works fine.
wardens have theyr delayed combo working fine too (bit harder to land tho)
not all class can see all theyr skills working as intented and that's the big difference to me
Sorc does fine at long range just like you describe. Sorc falls apart at melee range. Projectile spells like Frags and Reach fail to fire more often than they succeed when the target is right in your face. This is a massive detriment to Sorc damage output (pressure) because you are just standing there for a whole GCD doing nothing but mashing your mouse buttons!#CAREBEARMASTERRACE4 -
kalunte✭✭✭✭✭well, since there is no restriction from being melee i dont think the range matters much to sorcs. maybe timings are differents because of skills travel times, but nothing more.0
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grannas211✭✭✭✭✭
✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Lol. You can play any class you want when you’re in a 20 man group.0 -
NuarBlack✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Don't forget 2 or 3 dots and a curse before kiting. It's going to be great lol
Lear 2 slot a gap closer
Gap closer 22m
Streak 15m
So unless your reflexes are slower you have the advantage. If you get kited in eso you got outplayed bad. Go play play a different pvp mmo where it takes actual effort to stay in top of a target.
A sorc just streaked through you.
What you have to do to gap close to him:
1, break free
2, turn camera 180 degrees
3, press the gap closer button.
What the sorc has to do to get out of gap closer range:
1, press the streak button again.
Any bets which one can be done faster?
Then you got out played. You can do steps 1 and 2 at the same time. Hitting streak twice still requires 2 globals. Hitting you with the stun also means they had to use it in specific direction not necessarily the ideal direction so you let yourself get set up if so and it shortens the relative distance it created with you by having to streak through you. Chances are you can still catch them with a gap closer even after 2 streaks. If not they blew resources on double streaking. And any class would have been able to use a CC + escape mechanic to get away from you not just sorc. A NB that can CC you and cloak is just as gone for example.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Don't forget 2 or 3 dots and a curse before kiting. It's going to be great lol
Lear 2 slot a gap closer
Gap closer 22m
Streak 15m
So unless your reflexes are slower you have the advantage. If you get kited in eso you got outplayed bad. Go play play a different pvp mmo where it takes actual effort to stay in top of a target.
A sorc just streaked through you.
What you have to do to gap close to him:
1, break free
2, turn camera 180 degrees
3, press the gap closer button.
What the sorc has to do to get out of gap closer range:
1, press the streak button again.
Any bets which one can be done faster?
Then you got out played. You can do steps 1 and 2 at the same time. Hitting streak twice still requires 2 globals.
But you have to use gap closer within one global, not two.
There is exactly one second (one global) between the first and the second streak. You have one second before the sorc leaves gap closer range - but you are stunned. It is not possible to break free AND use a gap closer in the same second, because of the break free animation.Edited by Sharee on August 4, 2019 8:19PM3 -
NuarBlack✭✭✭✭The streak buff in Scalebreaker is easily the dumbest thing in the world.
On live, the same sorc just streaked and shielded away from a group of 20 of us. He had 10k+ in shields at all times and streaked 5 times WITH extra cost. Couldn't catch him.
That's going to be even easier? Lmfao I'm playing MagSorc next patch. Can't die.
Don't forget 2 or 3 dots and a curse before kiting. It's going to be great lol
Lear 2 slot a gap closer
Gap closer 22m
Streak 15m
So unless your reflexes are slower you have the advantage. If you get kited in eso you got outplayed bad. Go play play a different pvp mmo where it takes actual effort to stay in top of a target.
A sorc just streaked through you.
What you have to do to gap close to him:
1, break free
2, turn camera 180 degrees
3, press the gap closer button.
What the sorc has to do to get out of gap closer range:
1, press the streak button again.
Any bets which one can be done faster?
Then you got out played. You can do steps 1 and 2 at the same time. Hitting streak twice still requires 2 globals.
But you have to use gap closer within one global, not two.
There is exactly one second (one global) between the first and the second streak. You have one second before the sorc leaves gap closer range - but you are stunned. It is not possible to break free AND use a gap closer in the same second, because of the break free animation.
Like I said landing a CC then using an escape mechanic will most always let someone get away. CC + cloak means someone is gone too. CC + major expedition + los means someone gets away. If you are off CC cd there is a good chance a good player will use that to get away. Not just a sorc with streak.2 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
No you precisely can not do that because you have to fight within 15m of your target - which you don’t have to on live.
The cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing - because the ability on pts now fills two roles instead of one. One is being a melee stun - this directly counteracts the mobility and evasive part of streak.
If you´re using it in both regards you have to streak way more often than the cost increase makes up for.
If i give you more resources, it is a boon.
If i give you a new way to use those resources, that also is a boon.
Arguing that the former is not a boon just because of the latter is silly.
It is like getting a million dollar gift and saying it does precisely nothing because you also got the option to buy a million-dollar yacht.
It´s not a boon when it´s only used in that way because something else was taken away.
It´s not a boon if it forces you into a playstyle that directly contradicts it´s other function.
You can still use flame clench for the same purpose, so it was not taken away. Its not like the range is shorter than bolt.
You realize that what you´re saying makes zero sense yes?
You did not understand what i mean. Okay, let me rephrase.
You say that you now have to use bolt escape for CC, because reach CC was removed. I say that while reach CC was removed, clench CC was not. You can only use it at relatively close range, yes, but that is also true for bolt escape CC. So, nothing was taken away that you would *have* to replace with bolt escape CC. You can instead replace it with clench CC.
No.
I understand precisely what you meant. It just makes no sense.
Why would I replace a good 15m cc with a worse one - while I slot the good one either way.
You suggest I slot two abilities to do the same thing - one of those being worse an every way than the other and can’t see that what you say is hysterical?
Also the function that was taken away i talked about was having a ranged cc and anytimer in one slot with streak being the only cc option after not costing you barspace.
So yeah. You don’t understand and what you say makes no sense because of that.
Look. You can still keep using clench, like you do now on live and in this case the stacking cost reduction on streak increases your mobility, at the cost of using a slot for clench.
OR, you can drop clench, save a slot, and use bolt for both mobility and CC, which you can do thanks to the cost reduction on streak
This puts the theoretical advantage gained from the cost reduction ad absurdum. You have to streak 1x more in every situation where you would have been at range previously.
You have to fight within 15 of target either way(assuming you want to CC with clench or bolt) so i don't see how this is a factor for being or not being able to keep using clench.Also you can not drop clench and save a slot because that means losing a Spammable.
You get a free slot. If you need a spammable, use it for a spammable.It can’t be that hard to understand that fighting within 15m is a huge difference from fighting within 36. Saying those scenarios are even remotely the same is simply lying or stupid.
I'm sorry but I never said there is no difference between fighting within 15m and within 36m, or that those scenarios are the same.
I'm just opposing your claim that "the cost adjustment to streak does precisely nothing". It either allows you to free a slot (if you drop clench, and use the reduced cost to cover using bolt for CC) or it gives you better mobility (if you keep clench and use the reduced cost to cover more ground).
Which is still true bc the theoretical advantage of the cost reduction get nullified in practice by having to fight within 15m now.
It’s not about what cc you use.
It’s about the range you have to fight in.
This reduction in range is what makes the cost reduction a necessity rather than a buff and results in it having no positive impact in magica management overall.
You keep comparing different builds on pts.
You need to compare pts build to live builds to properly assess what the streak change does.
On pts you generally need to streak 1x more which means unless you streak atleast 4x in a row the cost reduction didn’t save you any magica compared to live where you started streaking from further away.
If you play sorc you should know streaking up to 4x cost stack and higher is a rather rare occurrence.
This leads me to the statement of the streak cost reduction doing nothing (for magica management because it gets counteracted by having to use the ability more in a state with not enough cost stacks).Edited by Derra on August 5, 2019 9:20AM<Noricum>
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Which is still true bc the theoretical advantage of the cost reduction get nullified in practice by having to fight within 15m now.
It’s not about what cc you use.
Of course it is about what CC you use. If you keep using clench for CC, then you dont have to use bolt for CC, and the cost reduction will allow you to use more bolts for mobility instead.
It has nothing to do with range either. You *want* to fight within 15m, since thats where you can CC your opponents. You aren't doing any more bolting than live - less in fact since you no longer have to(want to) constantly stay out of gap closer range."On pts you generally need to streak 1x more which means unless you streak atleast 4x in a row the cost reduction didn’t save you any magica compared to live where you started streaking from further away."
Why would you need to streak 1x more when you want to stay and fight in 15m range, using clench for CC?
Of course if you don't use clench for CC you do need to streak 1x more(to CC), but in that case the cost reduction freed you a slot.
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stritzi✭✭✭@Sharee
even 15m is too close for sorcs to fight and thats the problem, they just want to keep their whole potential at max range, which i understand because they are used to it, but i guess dks were also used to reflecting wings, things are changing get over it.
it will be interesting how the upcoming patch cuts into the survivability of sorcs once it has settled, but i guess it wont be that bad. Plebb sorcs probably will perform worse while good sorcs wont be affected much and that would actually be a preferable developement in that regards.
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