No history = crippled trade guilds

rumple9

Zos stop messing with the game and ruining it. Faction lock last week, guild traders this week. Yeh your killing it zos

StabbityDoom

Pevey wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

GarnetFire17 wrote: »

The Trade guilds are just inconvenienced for a bit, they aren't crippled. They can't function as they normally would. They will just have to adapt and wait our the storm. It's okay to back away from the ledge lol

Have you even been in a trade guild? Like, one that has to do auctions and raffles just to make their bid every week? You can't say something like this if you have. You'd know how much trade guilds survive by tracking this stuff.

That person runs a fairly large trade guild. (Not that I agree with them on this, just saying)

Welp. Then I just disagree with them drastically.

RANKK7

What a failure. Now let's see how much time to fix this and no official word yet about WHEN.

DeadlyHammer

Hey Zos, did you even stop to think that if you were going to do something like this that would so severely impact/cripple guilds and their ability to track guild bank deposits, you could maybe at least give us enough of a heads up so that all GM's that track donations/raffle purchases this way could all lock their guild banks and implement back up procedures before we all lost vital donation info?
That would have taken very little time on your part, and would have eliminated most if not all of the resentment and pissed off customers you are currently dealing with.

Wildberryjack

Wait, is this a bug or was it intentional? Because if intentional... holy crap Batman! Really?

Pevey

Wildberryjack wrote: »

Wait, is this a bug or was it intentional? Because if intentional... holy crap Batman! Really?

Intentional — emergencynmeasure to try to fix some issues

GarnetFire17

We are shutting down gold raffles. We are doing the item raffles and auctions as usual. We are not enforcing requirements, and we have a long list of applicants and are not taking any more. It's definitely a big mess but its not something that guilds can't adapt to or handle while things get fixed. I think we are doing a pretty good job of holding the fort down to be honest.

yodased

ZOS_GinaBrunoZOS_GinaBruno
Community Manager
Hey all, just to update, the change we made to PC NA and EU earlier disabled all guild history, not just the addons utilizing it. This is not a permanent change, but a stopgap until we have a chance to identify and fix the core issue. Thanks for understanding, and apologies for any confusion this may have initially caused.

While I love a good pitchfork party and I have torches at the ready, unfortunately for this one, we just gotta wait the storm.

I really doubted that they would remove such a critical portion of big data from guilds like that without warning, that would be dumb even for them.

yodased

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/6128689#Comment_6128689

GarnetFire17

The big thing is for Guild Leadership to spread the word using Discord guild mails, whatever guild webpage they use, spam guild chat, use all kinds of communication you can to get ahead of this and let your members know and get ahead of the issue.

Iarao

[quote=
Edit: in light of "that person runs a fairly large trade guild" - I'd be legitimately interested to see what you do to run your guild and how you adapt to not having accessible info on your sales.[/quote]

doesnt mean they run auctions, raffles, etc. some GLs just pay for the trader. if you are in a crappy spot and have hundreds of millions....... or you can make enough in a week doing whatever to pay for it, some do.

Dont_do_drugs

redspecter23 wrote: »

A much bigger immediate issue needs to be addressed that is connected directly to the lack of history and this has been long standing. There is no way to turn off the ability to deposit gold into guild banks. Let that sink in for a moment. People are still depositing gold into the banks, possibly for legit raffles. There is zero record of this transaction. Even if the tracking is turned back on, will be be able to see these older deposits? 5 days? Once turned back on, if the history will only go back 5 days, you can't do a weekly raffle. The first two days will be cut off.

Please ZOS, enable the ability to turn off guild gold deposits while this stopgap is in place. Players are throwing gold into a void with no record. That's unacceptable.

no need to worry. last time zos did that, the history was complete when activated to 10 days again, the infos still are getting recorded at the server. u just cant request it anymore. it will only become a problem, if zos needs longer than 10 days to fix it.

Iarao

StabbityDoom wrote: »

reoskit wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

This is just ridiculous. This is crippling to running guilds, especially trade guilds. Is ZoS truly this hellbent on destroying communities?

I also thought it was VERY INTERESTING that they dropped the world premiere of the trailer at EXACTLY trader flip. Like, to the second.... thanks. So much.

Who knew that'd be the nicest thing they did to trade guilds this week? I sure didn't.

I actually was screaming at my monitor. "HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO US?! DO YOU EVEN KNOW WE EXIST?!"

I mayyyy have issues.

hmm doomity, look at ur name. no MAY about it :P

StabbityDoom

Iarao wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

reoskit wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

This is just ridiculous. This is crippling to running guilds, especially trade guilds. Is ZoS truly this hellbent on destroying communities?

I also thought it was VERY INTERESTING that they dropped the world premiere of the trailer at EXACTLY trader flip. Like, to the second.... thanks. So much.

Who knew that'd be the nicest thing they did to trade guilds this week? I sure didn't.

I actually was screaming at my monitor. "HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO US?! DO YOU EVEN KNOW WE EXIST?!"

I mayyyy have issues.

hmm doomity, look at ur name. no MAY about it :P

Well, ya know how I roll!

reoskit

Doomity!! Lololol. Stabby, you have been renamed! Ooh boy, I needed that. ❤️

wavingblue

Really don't understand how this could have happened. Looking at natch potes the game should not have been cratered like this. But taking away history completely with no fix in sight is brutal... can only hope it comes back at some point. Really starting to run out of reasons to stick with this game as the under the table changes not only gain momentum but completely break the product. There is way too much new content being pushed out versus no attempt to not only fix other underlying problems but have a QA process that catches things before actual release.

ZOS_Ragnar

We have had to remove additional comments from this thread. Please keep your post civil.

Also as provided above by @yodased, here is Gina's response from another thread where this issue is being discussed.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey all, just to update, the change we made to PC NA and EU earlier disabled all guild history, not just the addons utilizing it. This is not a permanent change, but a stopgap until we have a chance to identify and fix the core issue. Thanks for understanding, and apologies for any confusion this may have initially caused.

MojaveHeld

No doubt about it, this was a really dumb move on ZOS' part. You don't use a nuclear option out of the blue, and it's absolutely baffling that anyone thought this was an okay idea, even as a desperate stopgap measure.

StabbityDoom

Honestly, like was said above, even some warning would have been nice so we could lock down the banks.

thermatico

Is this the only option to "identify and fix the core issue" (that's been going on for months)? It seems like there would be much better less player-affecting ways to do this. I could be wrong but this seems drastic.

VaranisArano

Master Merchant not being there is meh? Now we PC players can experience what the pricing situation is like on console.

But the guild history...that's a major functionality to lose, even temporarily. Hope it gets fixed quickly!

srfrogg23

StabbityDoom wrote: »

They cannot check donations, raffle purchases, guild dues. They cannot even use master merchant to help with pricing, because no history. Please understand how dire this is. I NEVER complain like this on the forums. But you are killing us.

Do you have Excel on your computer?

VaranisArano

srfrogg23 wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

They cannot check donations, raffle purchases, guild dues. They cannot even use master merchant to help with pricing, because no history. Please understand how dire this is. I NEVER complain like this on the forums. But you are killing us.

Do you have Excel on your computer?

That could work...if they say "everyone has to mail Officer X their donations/raffle purchases so we can keep track in excel."

I joined guilds who had a sales requirement, no raffle. There's no keeping track of that in Excel.

And I hate to think what that does to guild bank withdrawals.

Ackwalan

ZOS_RyanM wrote: »

We have had to remove additional comments from this thread. Please keep your post civil.

Also as provided above by @yodased, here is Gina's response from another thread where this issue is being discussed.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey all, just to update, the change we made to PC NA and EU earlier disabled all guild history, not just the addons utilizing it. This is not a permanent change, but a stopgap until we have a chance to identify and fix the core issue. Thanks for understanding, and apologies for any confusion this may have initially caused.

If the mod and devs didn't have the same symbol next to their name, people would take a dev response more serious, and a mod response for what it is. When we see a "Z" next to a thread and it turns out to be a hall monitor response, expect to get trolled.

girlpoison

ZOS_RyanM wrote: »

We have had to remove additional comments from this thread. Please keep your post civil.

Also as provided above by @yodased, here is Gina's response from another thread where this issue is being discussed.

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Hey all, just to update, the change we made to PC NA and EU earlier disabled all guild history, not just the addons utilizing it. This is not a permanent change, but a stopgap until we have a chance to identify and fix the core issue. Thanks for understanding, and apologies for any confusion this may have initially caused.

But is reducing guild history from 10 days to 5 days and denying add ons access to any additional history a permanent change? Because THAT is breaking for managing trade guilds that rely on top sellers and in-guild raffles to raise money for traders. 5 days doesn't cover an entire guild week, how can we tell our members "sorry we booted you, we didn't see your 200k sales on Tuesday because it was out of our ability to track within the game?"

I already spend more time in ESO managing trade guilds by updating the roster, raffles, auction and events every week, and crippling our use of add ons just makes it so that we have to go 100% manual to keep up with these events. I don't about the console economy, but on PC it takes millions of gold to secure a trader every week. Even the less-than-desirable spots are going for over a million due to the influx of players and number of guilds being created. Trading guilds need all the contributions they can get to fight for their traders. And we need these add ons to reward our members who are doing everything they can to keep us in the battle.

srfrogg23

VaranisArano wrote: »

srfrogg23 wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

They cannot check donations, raffle purchases, guild dues. They cannot even use master merchant to help with pricing, because no history. Please understand how dire this is. I NEVER complain like this on the forums. But you are killing us.

Do you have Excel on your computer?

That could work...if they say "everyone has to mail Officer X their donations/raffle purchases so we can keep track in excel."

I joined guilds who had a sales requirement, no raffle. There's no keeping track of that in Excel.

And I hate to think what that does to guild bank withdrawals.

Appoint a guild treasurer and an alternate. Filter all financial transactions through them.

Acrolas

Maxx7410 wrote: »

But now the game runs much better!!! maybe the functions from MM should be provided by ZOS?

Add-ons don't have the same process regulation that the game itself does, so it would have to be on a feature-to-feature basis. Pushing a clone of a real-time, data-intensive add-on would fundamentally alter the recommended system requirements. And then we'd have different performance issues to deal with, as it's one thing to disable an add-on you aren't actively using and having all that data natively collected whether you're using it or not.

That's why ESO Logs is supported but not integrated.

It was probably only a matter of time before something like the discussed issue became a reality, and this might be the impetus needed to break something like master merchant into smaller user categories. Basic Seller add-on with just single-value item estimates. A few different Guild Administrator add-ons with more robust tracking tools for their specific tasks.

Then if something like this happens again, you don't get the complete meltdown of a large add-on. You'd still have your reference numbers, there would just be a delay in reporting while the error is fixed. Sort of like how eBay Partner Network still works even when there are bugs and other issues affecting data reports.

Jaeysa

srfrogg23 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

srfrogg23 wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

They cannot check donations, raffle purchases, guild dues. They cannot even use master merchant to help with pricing, because no history. Please understand how dire this is. I NEVER complain like this on the forums. But you are killing us.

Do you have Excel on your computer?

That could work...if they say "everyone has to mail Officer X their donations/raffle purchases so we can keep track in excel."

I joined guilds who had a sales requirement, no raffle. There's no keeping track of that in Excel.

And I hate to think what that does to guild bank withdrawals.

Appoint a guild treasurer and an alternate. Filter all financial transactions through them.

That doesn't fix the fact that guild sales you need the history in order to track.

StabbityDoom

srfrogg23 wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

They cannot check donations, raffle purchases, guild dues. They cannot even use master merchant to help with pricing, because no history. Please understand how dire this is. I NEVER complain like this on the forums. But you are killing us.

Do you have Excel on your computer?

What i'm talking about is all of the lost data NOW. Such as taxes from guild sales, or if someone donated and didn't know of this bug.

Iarao

StabbityDoom wrote: »

Iarao wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

reoskit wrote: »

StabbityDoom wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

This is just ridiculous. This is crippling to running guilds, especially trade guilds. Is ZoS truly this hellbent on destroying communities?

I also thought it was VERY INTERESTING that they dropped the world premiere of the trailer at EXACTLY trader flip. Like, to the second.... thanks. So much.

Who knew that'd be the nicest thing they did to trade guilds this week? I sure didn't.

I actually was screaming at my monitor. "HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO US?! DO YOU EVEN KNOW WE EXIST?!"

I mayyyy have issues.

hmm doomity, look at ur name. no MAY about it :P

Well, ya know how I roll!

lol yeah i do