Solving AotP

ShadowProc

_Crow wrote: »

My guild (AP not AoTOP ), Is pulling players into Cyro that have never played before, people are logging in to just play with us in mass. What's funny is that WAY more people like Zerging then don't... which is why Zergs are a thing LOL.

People hate on us every night, but the funny thing is, the other big guilds that bring in the most players into PvP that actually do stuff in cyro and make PvP better, don't hate us, and even want to GvG us! The people hating on us are the "Zone generals" that no one wants around anymore because Guilds have taken over, and solo players that zerg surf, cry about zergs, and don't go play in Shor for some reason.

AP helps players that guilds have closed their doors to, that like teamwork, like a chill environment, and want to learn more about the basics of PvP

We now split up our 72+ man raids when we need to and take multiple keeps at once, and if AD or DC stack, we are going to stack when we need to. We are growing bigger every day and we are going to keep helping new players, and we are going to keep getting more powerful, so get used to seeing us

_Crow wrote: »

My guild (AP not AoTOP ), Is pulling players into Cyro that have never played before, people are logging in to just play with us in mass. What's funny is that WAY more people like Zerging then don't... which is why Zergs are a thing LOL.

People hate on us every night, but the funny thing is, the other big guilds that bring in the most players into PvP that actually do stuff in cyro and make PvP better, don't hate us, and even want to GvG us! The people hating on us are the "Zone generals" that no one wants around anymore because Guilds have taken over, and solo players that zerg surf, cry about zergs, and don't go play in Shor for some reason.

AP helps players that guilds have closed their doors to, that like teamwork, like a chill environment, and want to learn more about the basics of PvP

We now split up our 72+ man raids when we need to and take multiple keeps at once, and if AD or DC stack, we are going to stack when we need to. We are growing bigger every day and we are going to keep helping new players, and we are going to keep getting more powerful, so get used to seeing us

Wow. What a disconnect you have. Enjoy fighting yourself.

Elong

Sandman929 wrote: »

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_Crow wrote: »

My guild (AP not AoTOP ), Is pulling players into Cyro that have never played before, people are logging in to just play with us in mass. What's funny is that WAY more people like Zerging then don't... which is why Zergs are a thing LOL.

People hate on us every night, but the funny thing is, the other big guilds that bring in the most players into PvP that actually do stuff in cyro and make PvP better, don't hate us, and even want to GvG us! The people hating on us are the "Zone generals" that no one wants around anymore because Guilds have taken over, and solo players that zerg surf, cry about zergs, and don't go play in Shor for some reason.

AP helps players that guilds have closed their doors to, that like teamwork, like a chill environment, and want to learn more about the basics of PvP

We now split up our 72+ man raids when we need to and take multiple keeps at once, and if AD or DC stack, we are going to stack when we need to. We are growing bigger every day and we are going to keep helping new players, and we are going to keep getting more powerful, so get used to seeing us

All that is pretty admirable, but you must realize what kind of horrible gaming experience those numbers creates. Offering relative safety and fun PvP experience to players new to Cyrodiil is great, I certainly prefer that the ego-maniacal pre-teen measuring contest that fills zone chat, but don't you think there should be a tiny bit of moderation?
I can't imagine the gameplay is very stellar from within such a large stack either.

He knows. He just doesn't care.

Red_Nine

NBrookus wrote: »

Shhhhh, @NirnStorm . I heard AP and DIG gvg'd and the server's didn't die. Although afterwards one hamster had to be retired early.

I can verify this is true.

Red_Nine

"Before you made your guild, I spent some time with Vae-Victus officers, providing them with assistance in hope they would reduce their numbers and stop the crashes when approaching a keep where they were."

VV usually ran 1 full raid with a smaller second group, maybe 2 full raids max. Blaming guilds for grouping up and getting organized is not the answer. Cyrodiil is a war zone and is supposed to be for large group vs. large group play. If there are crashes when players group up in AvA, then it's up to ZOS to fix it. There was as time, back in the day where even larger PvP battles happened routinely without such crashes.

Red_Nine

Elong wrote: »

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Sandman929 wrote: »

_Crow wrote: »

My guild (AP not AoTOP ), Is pulling players into Cyro that have never played before, people are logging in to just play with us in mass. What's funny is that WAY more people like Zerging then don't... which is why Zergs are a thing LOL.

People hate on us every night, but the funny thing is, the other big guilds that bring in the most players into PvP that actually do stuff in cyro and make PvP better, don't hate us, and even want to GvG us! The people hating on us are the "Zone generals" that no one wants around anymore because Guilds have taken over, and solo players that zerg surf, cry about zergs, and don't go play in Shor for some reason.

AP helps players that guilds have closed their doors to, that like teamwork, like a chill environment, and want to learn more about the basics of PvP

We now split up our 72+ man raids when we need to and take multiple keeps at once, and if AD or DC stack, we are going to stack when we need to. We are growing bigger every day and we are going to keep helping new players, and we are going to keep getting more powerful, so get used to seeing us

All that is pretty admirable, but you must realize what kind of horrible gaming experience those numbers creates. Offering relative safety and fun PvP experience to players new to Cyrodiil is great, I certainly prefer that the ego-maniacal pre-teen measuring contest that fills zone chat, but don't you think there should be a tiny bit of moderation?
I can't imagine the gameplay is very stellar from within such a large stack either.

He knows. He just doesn't care.

No, it's simply NOT HIS PROBLEM to solve.

Katahdin

Yea we know immediately when AP logs into Cyrodiil even when we are standing in Brindle.

But yes it is ZoS problem to solve when players playing the game as intended causes the server to have a heart attack.

NBrookus

While it's true that ultimately the onus is on ZOS to fix their performance issues so the game can be played the way it was advertised, complaining about performance issues while deliberately behaving in ways that you KNOW makes it worse is not very rational.

courier

To the op, I think someone mentioned this before... The way to pull them back is to take a back keep, if one doesn't work then take two. I know full well DC are good at taking AD trikeeps to make us pull back and clean up, it's the same with EP. If your computer can't handle the big fights (let's be honest lots of rigs can't handle them) rally some troops and go take stuff, threaten their scrolls so the zone generals beat them into submission and they come home to defend.

Elong

Red_Nine wrote: »

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Elong wrote: »

Sandman929 wrote: »

_Crow wrote: »

My guild (AP not AoTOP ), Is pulling players into Cyro that have never played before, people are logging in to just play with us in mass. What's funny is that WAY more people like Zerging then don't... which is why Zergs are a thing LOL.

People hate on us every night, but the funny thing is, the other big guilds that bring in the most players into PvP that actually do stuff in cyro and make PvP better, don't hate us, and even want to GvG us! The people hating on us are the "Zone generals" that no one wants around anymore because Guilds have taken over, and solo players that zerg surf, cry about zergs, and don't go play in Shor for some reason.

AP helps players that guilds have closed their doors to, that like teamwork, like a chill environment, and want to learn more about the basics of PvP

We now split up our 72+ man raids when we need to and take multiple keeps at once, and if AD or DC stack, we are going to stack when we need to. We are growing bigger every day and we are going to keep helping new players, and we are going to keep getting more powerful, so get used to seeing us

All that is pretty admirable, but you must realize what kind of horrible gaming experience those numbers creates. Offering relative safety and fun PvP experience to players new to Cyrodiil is great, I certainly prefer that the ego-maniacal pre-teen measuring contest that fills zone chat, but don't you think there should be a tiny bit of moderation?
I can't imagine the gameplay is very stellar from within such a large stack either.

He knows. He just doesn't care.

No, it's simply NOT HIS PROBLEM to solve.

Of course it is. ZOS aren't going to and aren't capable of fixing this. When will any of you realise this? If they could, they would. What we have left in this game is an ability to make do with we have and try to get the best out of the game for everyone.
Cyrodiil has been stated on many occasions by the devs as being for solo, small, and large groups. Many times.

fastolfv_ESO

can confirm 80% of my raid crashes at same location, its known and its why such poor quality players are doing it. The engine cannot support the amount of players in one place

Ruckly

What I've been doing since the start of the campaign is logging in, taking a look at the map and see if there is anything worth playing for and if lag is radiating across the map over a non-essential point, and if nothing log out and do something else. Sometime later log in again and do the same thing again. There really are better things to do than play with multi-second latency and useless siege. I am not bound to cyrodill by proprietary necessity or a need to fill a raid schedule. Others who are more invested might need to find an alternative solution. This one works for me. It doesn't solve the original problem but none of the forums smartest have a solution either so maybe there isn't one. I can work around it.

Thoragaal

NBrookus wrote: »

... complaining about performance issues while deliberately behaving in ways that you KNOW makes it worse is not very rational.

I don't think the complaints mainly come from the people in these large groups, but if then I agree with you. Personally I never play in the evenings because of the lag/delay/disconnects.

Elong wrote: »

Of course it is. ZOS aren't going to and aren't capable of fixing this. When will any of you realise this? If they could, they would. What we have left in this game is an ability to make do with we have and try to get the best out of the game for everyone.
Cyrodiil has been stated on many occasions by the devs as being for solo, small, and large groups. Many times.

"If they could, they would"
If that's the case then I'd like to see ZOS come out and say it. Other publishers, of other games, takes notice of their issues and even if they don't have a solution for it right away they come out and say it. If I'm not mistaken Blizzard came out and said "we're aware of it.. we plan on changing the engine.. we will update the servers.. but it will take time, it's not an easy fix, but a fix is coming" and people calmed down a great bit knowing what's going on and knew there was no reason to keep ranting about the issue (what ever the issue was, I can't remember, it was like 8 years ago I quit WoW).

The only reason for ZOS to not coming out and say it is because, just like you said, they don't have any intentions of changing it. If they came out and said "We're aware of the performance issues. But we don't know what to do about them" people would freak out. If we look at the changes they've made through out the years they've continously made it more difficult for small scalers and rewarded large scale combat, which begs the question "why would they encourage this gameplay when it makes for a really poor gameplay experience?".
I have 3 possible reasons for it, 1) They DO have a solution coming, 2) They have given up on Cyrodiil and don't really care what happens, or 3) They have no overarching vision for Cyrodiil.

As far as I can tell, enrouraging large scale combat and rewarding funneling droves of people into the same area, with the consequences we're experiencing, will eventually cause people to stop going into Cyrodiil entierly. Which I'm certain ZOS is very well aware of.

Elong

Thoragaal wrote: »

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NBrookus wrote: »

... complaining about performance issues while deliberately behaving in ways that you KNOW makes it worse is not very rational.

I don't think the complaints mainly come from the people in these large groups, but if then I agree with you. Personally I never play in the evenings because of the lag/delay/disconnects.

show previous quotes

Elong wrote: »

Of course it is. ZOS aren't going to and aren't capable of fixing this. When will any of you realise this? If they could, they would. What we have left in this game is an ability to make do with we have and try to get the best out of the game for everyone.
Cyrodiil has been stated on many occasions by the devs as being for solo, small, and large groups. Many times.

"If they could, they would"
If that's the case then I'd like to see ZOS come out and say it. Other publishers, of other games, takes notice of their issues and even if they don't have a solution for it right away they come out and say it. If I'm not mistaken Blizzard came out and said "we're aware of it.. we plan on changing the engine.. we will update the servers.. but it will take time, it's not an easy fix, but a fix is coming" and people calmed down a great bit knowing what's going on and knew there was no reason to keep ranting about the issue (what ever the issue was, I can't remember, it was like 8 years ago I quit WoW).

The only reason for ZOS to not coming out and say it is because, just like you said, they don't have any intentions of changing it. If they came out and said "We're aware of the performance issues. But we don't know what to do about them" people would freak out. If we look at the changes they've made through out the years they've continously made it more difficult for small scalers and rewarded large scale combat, which begs the question "why would they encourage this gameplay when it makes for a really poor gameplay experience?".
I have 3 possible reasons for it, 1) They DO have a solution coming, 2) They have given up on Cyrodiil and don't really care what happens, or 3) They have no overarching vision for Cyrodiil.

As far as I can tell, enrouraging large scale combat and rewarding funneling droves of people into the same area, with the consequences we're experiencing, will eventually cause people to stop going into Cyrodiil entierly. Which I'm certain ZOS is very well aware of.

If people stop playing in Cyrodiil, the complaints stop. That's what they hope for in my opinion.

CyrusArya

AP? That’s Army of the Packed right?

XamXam777

Funnily enough, I lag and dc in primetime regardless of whether AP is raiding or not. It's a consequence of a large number of players congregating in one spot for particular objectives as by design of the map. Whether or not a large Zerg is directing the action to one spot, it still happens.

The tri-faction stack at Fare on Saturday night and even BRK last night (Tuesday), was the AP zerg present? No. And still, everyone lagged to *** and dc'ed. That's just how the map *** works. We all like to congregate together for certain objectives. It happens all the time in primetime.

Ultimately the blame for the horrible performance we all experience in these scenarios (that they designed) should be squared at ZOS.

But seriously, the notion that AP deliberately does this is or doesn't suffer from performance issues is hilarious. We suffer from the same lag issues everyone else does. We have multiple people dc each run (I'm usually one of them), we can't always execute our abilities, we ping-pong across the map and we get stuck in texture bugs every time we run.

I came to this game for large-scale OW PvP encounters. The many large-scale fights I've been a part of since joining AP have been insanely fun despite the lag and performance issues. It's up to ZOS to fix the performance and make the game playable as it was advertised.

montiferus

XamXam777 wrote: »

Funnily enough, I lag and dc in primetime regardless of whether AP is raiding or not. It's a consequence of a large number of players congregating in one spot for particular objectives as by design of the map. Whether or not a large Zerg is directing the action to one spot, it still happens.

The tri-faction stack at Fare on Saturday night and even BRK last night (Tuesday), was the AP zerg present? No. And still, everyone lagged to *** and dc'ed. That's just how the map *** works. We all like to congregate together for certain objectives. It happens all the time in primetime.

Ultimately the blame for the horrible performance we all experience in these scenarios (that they designed) should be squared at ZOS.

But seriously, the notion that AP deliberately does this is or doesn't suffer from performance issues is hilarious. We suffer from the same lag issues everyone else does. We have multiple people dc each run (I'm usually one of them), we can't always execute our abilities, we ping-pong across the map and we get stuck in texture bugs every time we run.

I came to this game for large-scale OW PvP encounters. The many large-scale fights I've been a part of since joining AP have been insanely fun despite the lag and performance issues. It's up to ZOS to fix the performance and make the game playable as it was advertised.

Translation. I am part of the problem and I don't care.

It is too bad more people don't want to get better at the game and prefer to get carried by numbers.

evivnada

Maybe just maybe it's fun to run in those groups because of the people leading and members of that group.. don't crap on other peoples play style because you didnt get the invite

Red_Nine

Translation. I am part of the problem and I don't care.

It is too bad more people don't want to get better at the game and prefer to get carried by numbers.

It is absurd to blame players for a game performance issue.

frozywozy

lol

Ranger209

Red_Nine wrote: »

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Translation. I am part of the problem and I don't care.

It is too bad more people don't want to get better at the game and prefer to get carried by numbers.

It is absurd to blame players for a game performance issue.

and if you redline a car at 140 mph until the engine blows don't blame the driver, blame the manufacturer because blaming the driver would be absurd.

evivnada

Your analogy is absurd. Most of us pay to play a game.. they are getting paid to maintain the game.

It would be absurd for you to think we should walk on eggshells because they don't fix the game.

Elong

evivnada wrote: »

Your analogy is absurd. Most of us pay to play a game.. they are getting paid to maintain the game.

It would be absurd for you to think we should walk on eggshells because they don't fix the game.

When are you going to realise they don't want to or can't?

jaime1982

courier wrote: »

Does this happen on #weekdays?

YES, happening right now lol. Its insane

barshemm

Hung around tonight to see how bad it is. All the action was up north, I could barely get skills off at Fare.

Think maybe I will switch to shor or do bgs on evenings prime time.

_Crow

We split up our raids more then half the time tonight, and DC and AD still could not even get their scrolls back while we were on LOL, before you guys judge us, maybe you should run in one of our raids and see for yourself how it is . Our doors are always opened!

Anyway, see you guys out there!

Kadoin

I simply quit. Took a while, but I won't be dealing with a ball of tards. In fact, aside from logging for daily rewards I won't log. I've already been logging less because Murkmire patch disappointed me and the performance is bad in both PvE and PvP. The bugs are also crap, and I especially don't like how the server stops your healing and shielding when you get a certain # of people on you, almost as if its intentionally done in a poor attempt to reduce lag.

If someone wants to stack a bunch of idiots to chase one to three people, I say let them. But when the servers are empty and they roll around with no competition, they should not come to the forums and start talking about "how to save PvP," "How to save X server," "X server is empty," "We need more players in X," "We need more competition," or whatever classic garbage gets spewed by the perpetrators on the forums every time. You decide to play in a harmful way? Don't come crying when more people quit and/or simply refuse to play.

Also, don't blame ZOS because even if the servers were not laggy you have a massive overwhelming advantage versus anyone that isn't also stacked like a sardine. To seriously pretend otherwise and mask it under the term "fun" is a joke.

Also, I wouldn't call someone calling a faction stack a lead or leader. I would just call them a faction stacker. I seriously doubt anyone knows or gives any real damn about who he is, only that they will have easy "AP" to farm because they know that the other alliances won't be stacking.

Recremen

_Crow wrote: »

We split up our raids more then half the time tonight, and DC and AD still could not even get their scrolls back while we were on LOL, before you guys judge us, maybe you should run in one of our raids and see for yourself how it is . Our doors are always opened!

Anyway, see you guys out there!

Honey, people are trying to be polite over here. It's not a good idea to poke the lion, as it were.

_Crow

Recremen wrote: »

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_Crow wrote: »

We split up our raids more then half the time tonight, and DC and AD still could not even get their scrolls back while we were on LOL, before you guys judge us, maybe you should run in one of our raids and see for yourself how it is . Our doors are always opened!

Anyway, see you guys out there!

Honey, people are trying to be polite over here. It's not a good idea to poke the lion, as it were.

Sweetie, I have been leading raids of all kinds for 3+ years, and I have learned that all the toxic and pathetic small man AD/DC groups, and failed "zone generals" are just above the FD NPC's as far as their impact in Cyro and zone chat goes. Not to mention they are pure cancer for the PvP community. The only opinion I give 2 craps about are other raid leads of guilds that make PvP worth playing and my amazing guild members

Ruckly

_Crow wrote: »

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Recremen wrote: »

_Crow wrote: »

We split up our raids more then half the time tonight, and DC and AD still could not even get their scrolls back while we were on LOL, before you guys judge us, maybe you should run in one of our raids and see for yourself how it is . Our doors are always opened!

Anyway, see you guys out there!

Honey, people are trying to be polite over here. It's not a good idea to poke the lion, as it were.

Sweetie, I have been leading raids of all kinds for 3+ years, and I have learned that all the toxic and pathetic small man AD/DC groups, and failed "zone generals" are just above the FD NPC's as far as their impact in Cyro and zone chat goes. Not to mention they are pure cancer for the PvP community. The only opinion I give 2 craps about are other raid leads of guilds that make PvP worth playing and my amazing guild members

You are imputing yourself.

He is correct though. Only raid leads(or whoever relevant) can give direction to create lag to shut down the other teams siege and skills. Lag generation is the meta but not a very good one.

Recremen

_Crow wrote: »

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Recremen wrote: »

_Crow wrote: »

We split up our raids more then half the time tonight, and DC and AD still could not even get their scrolls back while we were on LOL, before you guys judge us, maybe you should run in one of our raids and see for yourself how it is . Our doors are always opened!

Anyway, see you guys out there!

Honey, people are trying to be polite over here. It's not a good idea to poke the lion, as it were.

Sweetie, I have been leading raids of all kinds for 3+ years, and I have learned that all the toxic and pathetic small man AD/DC groups, and failed "zone generals" are just above the FD NPC's as far as their impact in Cyro and zone chat goes. Not to mention they are pure cancer for the PvP community. The only opinion I give 2 craps about are other raid leads of guilds that make PvP worth playing and my amazing guild members

Cool, then maybe respect my opinion, as one of the raid leads for Fantasia, when I tell you that people are trying to be polite here and that gloating about a single good night is in incredibly poor form, by your own standards, by disparaging the efforts of an entire faction. And I don't know how it is on EP, as I rarely play my EP character, but the "zone generals" on AD are not especially toxic and average out to be somewhere around "pretty chill". It's rather rude to go calling these well-meaning people "pure cancer" when on average they help vocalize valuable map objectives and get the ball rolling on faction coordination.