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Skyshards account bound
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AlboMalefica✭✭✭✭Fleshreaper wrote: »AlboMalefica wrote: »
In my original post I stated one of the ways they would add skyshards account bound was to make achievements account bound, which directly leads to everything else I had said regarding that. Obviously there are other ways they could implement this, like make it the same as how champion points work now.
I agree there is a huge issue with CP atm & that’s a discussion for a different thread. I honestly don’t believe skyshards should be account bound, takes away the exploring & questing part of the game, having cp doesn’t.
You are obviously free to disagree with me and more power to you for doing so
I have been around here a while, I remember having to grind every character to Vet 12, then 14. I had 3 characters at 14 at that time and had done every quest outside of Cryodiil and Craglorn with those two other characters. I know where most of the wanting skyshard to be account bound is coming from. It's not coming from not wanting to explore the world, it's from wanting to stay out of Cryodiil. I would be willing to bet that if just the Cryodiil skyshards were account bound, this topic would blow over fairly quickly. Having just leveled a Warden and having put points into tank spec, I can understand wanting to have extra skill points at my finger tips. I have no interest in playing this character much. He is tank specced for running normal dungeons, as I find that fun and I don't want to spend 45 minutes in a que for a normal random. But I also would like to run some dailies with this character and running quests in tank spec, is a pain and is not fun. So, having access to extra skill points would allow me to add additional skill, so then I could have an off spec to do dailies with. However, I am willing and am in the process of farming skyshards for this character. So....
Yeah I did the same with levelling the vet ranks etc. And levelling/questing/skyshard hunting on a would be tank is never fun (if you’re set up as a tank) so I do understand how helpful it can be.
I’m sure most would agree to the cyrodiil skyshards being account bound, I would still disagree however. Yes it easily sets off my ocd that the 4 skyshards hidden behind enemy gates are not easy to get. I still feel however that changing how skyshard are obtained isn’t the best course of action.
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Fleshreaper✭✭✭✭✭AlboMalefica wrote: »
Yeah I did the same with levelling the vet ranks etc. And levelling/questing/skyshard hunting on a would be tank is never fun (if you’re set up as a tank) so I do understand how helpful it can be.
I’m sure most would agree to the cyrodiil skyshards being account bound, I would still disagree however. Yes it easily sets off my ocd that the 4 skyshards hidden behind enemy gates are not easy to get. I still feel however that changing how skyshard are obtained isn’t the best course of action.
Not that you were asking for it or even need it but I can certainly respect the OCD part of it.0 -
Kidgangster101✭✭✭✭✭
✭So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
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AlnilamE✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
"Contorting the statistics to fit what you say" sounds more like what you're doing but I digress.To follow-up my previous post:
https://tinyurl.com/yae9ph5b
This is my Sorcerer build, with no crafting and no non-combat passives. Only the things necessary for maximum PvE DPS and basic survivability.
This requires 104 skill points. If you craft, that goes up to 253 skill points. If you PvP, that's a whole lot more that I don't even want to think about.
TL;DR You need waaay more than 64 skill points to make a character work.
then quest, you will be over 100 before you hit 50. that's pretty damn close to where you said you need. If you want to craft, you should have to do some work to get to that point. And you only need 87 to be able to do max level writs on all your toon, so don't know where you're getting an extra 149 for all that.
Again, with the cherry picking of what I say.
Writs are not only what crafting is. You need upgrades, research, etc etc. And you did do work to get to that point. You leveled the skills. Skill points are just an artificial limiter that has no real reason to be in place.
And no, questing is even worse than Skyshards. Each large zone has about 3 skill points from quests, not including DLC like Dark Brotherhood where every quest has a skill point. You would have to complete the entirety of the overland to get the amount of skill points you would need.
Once again, being disingenuous just to keep a broken system in place. You could be a politician!
So, you get them on the toon you're going to craft on. Styles have already become account bound, no need on other toons.
And if for whatever reason my main is not my crafter?
I have to take a crafter through the entire world just to get enough skill points to both craft and not suck in combat?
You're really making me LOL here...especially with your use of the word toon
do dps until you get enough, than respec... you make me LOL as wel
So I need to waste a large sum of gold now instead of being provided with a basic QOL feature that should have been in the game since launch?To follow-up my previous post:
https://tinyurl.com/yae9ph5b
This is my Sorcerer build, with no crafting and no non-combat passives. Only the things necessary for maximum PvE DPS and basic survivability.
This requires 104 skill points. If you craft, that goes up to 253 skill points. If you PvP, that's a whole lot more that I don't even want to think about.
TL;DR You need waaay more than 64 skill points to make a character work.
then quest, you will be over 100 before you hit 50. that's pretty damn close to where you said you need. If you want to craft, you should have to do some work to get to that point. And you only need 87 to be able to do max level writs on all your toon, so don't know where you're getting an extra 149 for all that.
Again, with the cherry picking of what I say.
Writs are not only what crafting is. You need upgrades, research, etc etc. And you did do work to get to that point. You leveled the skills. Skill points are just an artificial limiter that has no real reason to be in place.
And no, questing is even worse than Skyshards. Each large zone has about 3 skill points from quests, not including DLC like Dark Brotherhood where every quest has a skill point. You would have to complete the entirety of the overland to get the amount of skill points you would need.
Once again, being disingenuous just to keep a broken system in place. You could be a politician!
So, you get them on the toon you're going to craft on. Styles have already become account bound, no need on other toons.
And if for whatever reason my main is not my crafter?
I have to take a crafter through the entire world just to get enough skill points to both craft and not suck in combat?
You're really making me LOL here...especially with your use of the word toon
and who is being disingenuous now? there are 416 skill points in the game... don't need them all
You kind of do, especially with the number of skills present in ESO.Maybe there should be a separate server that combines all of the 'make X account-wide' requests.
In this special needs server, you get:
- All the skill points in the game, so you don't have to find skyshards or run content previously completed
- All the motifs in the game so you can immediately create your special outfit
- All drop sets as craftable sets once you've found each item
- All currencies, including writ vouchers, available in the daily 'participation trophy' rewards
- Hirelings for Jewelry and Alchemy
- One giant trading kiosk for everybody
- Every skin available for Crowns or for gold from a special vendor
- Free daily Crown Crates and a special mount each week for logging in
- Riding skills at max immediately
I think that covers all the effort nerfs requested over the past few months. Combine these all into the special needs server so everyone who wants an effort-free game is on an even playing field. Provide a one-time server transfer so the players who want this don't lose anything.
Problem solved.
I like how basic QOL things like an auction house, account wide skyshards, and a horse that runs faster than the player are all "special needs" requests for "effort-free" gameplay
Like Jesus, you really define gameplay as collectibles, teleporting, and jogging?
My main is a full crafter, full healer spec, and full pvp spec, and I have enough... and still need to get 30 more from PVP, since I don't do that a ton. You have your opinion, and you'll contort the statistics to fit what you say.
Your build needed 104 skill points. I state that you get 100 from just quest leveling. You then say you need 260 or so to do a full dps/crafter spec. There's 410 in the game. Then you say you need to get damn near all of them. I digress as well.
The over arching point is that of course you can do all of that, but you shouldn't have to
It is called playing the game. MMOs survive on content being repeated. New characters and random bind on pick-up equipment from dungeons are but two of the ways ZoS entices us into repeating content. Making players obtain certain things like sky shards and lore books on each character is in the long term good for the game. Letting us start with fully finished characters or characters that are fully finished with a few hours of dolmen runs is detrimental to the long term stability of the game.
about content to be repeated it wont have big prolem if it was atleast rewarding something except that you character is unplayable if you dont repear atlest some of this content about which you dont care
Your character is not unplayable. I have a level 22 stamplar that is playing very well at the moment. I'm actually quite impressed.
in gw2 this was good done with it as you had reward for exploring full map again and again - and material needed for legendary weapon adn with this point people was grinding full exploration for just reward as their alt could be 100% playabe without even making single step on pve zone but playing only pvp
I have not PvPd in Guild Wars 2. Are you saying that you can get Hero Points in PvP? Because you can't get your elite specs done without going out and gathering hero points. And while getting map completions gives a reward, I'm sure it will become a chore by the time you go for the 3rd character's map completion as well, particularly if they keep adding more zones, if running around discovering things is not your cup of tea. Are the rewards really that good? Are they better than getting the skill points you need in ESO? Or is it literally the same thing?Kidgangster101 wrote: »But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
CP was designed to be account bound and the amount of effort required for it reflects that. Skyshards were designed to be character-bound and the amount of effort required reflects that too. Changing one of the other would have to adjust the amount of effort (ie, you now need to collect 10 skyshards on a character to get a skill point)
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
Absolutely. However, they should not that if they focus only on getting levels as fast as possible, they are then setting themselves up for not having as many skill points as they think they need for their perfect build. Choices have consequences.People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
Indeed. I am one of those people who has a full-time job and obligations and multiple characters. I understand that MMORPGs are designed for long-term play and if I want to try all the classes and roles, then my time investment will have to be greater. I currently have 10 permanent characters and one perma-death character. Not all of them are at 100% where I want them to be, but one by one they are getting there.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Yes, but quality of life should not upend game progression. Look at things that ESO has done: Introduced XP scrolls/potions, adapted the CP system to have an XP scale (which heavily punishes people like myself, who have always been above the CP cap), added more skill points with each new zone.
Guild Wars 2's big QoL improvement was adding mounts, which made exploring the original zones quite a bit faster, but they didn't just say "you explored it once, it's now explored on all your characters".
I don't play WoW or FF14, so I don't know how their systems work. Are you saying that you can buy a boost, create a character and then jump into the equivalent of vet Trials in ESO?
The Moot Councillor2 -
karekiz✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don't play WoW or FF14, so I don't know how their systems work. Are you saying that you can buy a boost, create a character and then jump into the equivalent of vet Trials in ESO?
Don't know about FF14
EQ1 offers heroic characters that start at 85 - level 100 <Maybe even 95> was cap back when that was introduced. <110 is now>. WoW boosts to 110 and cap is 120.
WoW I think is meant to skip old expansions and put you closer to the newest expansion with the most population. EQ1 puts you where you can start grouping with higher level people since the population is of course mostly max level.
I don't think we need exactly this even though I am for accountwide skyshards.Edited by karekiz on December 7, 2018 7:25PM0 -
tmbrinks✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Nobody is saying they shouldn't do QoL improvements. Just that this isn't a QoL improvement. It is a game breaking change. Currently you have to actually make a choice when choosing what skill you want, what passive you want to unlock with your skill points, as you'll unlock skills quicker than you level. With the extra 143 skill points from having all the skyshards, you will be able to unlock every skill you want, right when you level it up, making your character significantly more powerful, especially in any under-50 campaigns/content.
The game does provide for a way of changing your character from dps to heals to tank, and from pve to pvp to crafting. It's called the respec shrine. And if you don't want to pay for it in order to convert, you can make the choice to get more skill points so that you don't have to spend the gold. And lets be honest. It only costs 20k to respec a character with 400 skill points, and it's incredibly easy to get 20k in gold.
If you choose to level more than 1 toon, you know you'll need to get a few more skill points. That being said, most peoples alternate characters are only used for 1 role, since they'd rather do "everything" on their main. And it's already been shown that if you level by questing you'll have enough skill points to do any one role you want in this game. And again, if you choose to want to do more, you can get skill points by one of the myriad of methods this game has for doing so. You are not required at all to get skyshards.
I have chosen to emphasize the word choose because that is the crux of the matter. You want to be able to choose to do any role, and you don't want to do anything to earn it. There are multiple ways around the "issue" that everybody has with this..
1. Level via questing/dungeons/delves collecting along the way instead of dolmen farming/skyreach - you'll have enough to do any 1 role you want!!!!
2. Only collect the minimum you need and respec when you want to do other content
3. Spend a couple of hours getting the shards/skill points you need to be able to flex between roles more quickly
4. Create alts for specific roles so you don't have to change between characters for each thing. You get 8 slots (15 with crowns!)
5. Get extra skill points from dungeons
6. Get extra skill points from questing
7. Get extra skill points from Cyrodill (this would be painful though)
8. Get extra skill points from skyshards
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra DestroyerThe Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger70,730 achievement points2 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭AlboMalefica wrote: »The problem I see with skyshards being account wide is that skyshards are directly linked to achievements in game so does that mean achievements should be account wide or remove the achievements for skyshards altogether?
If it’s the first choice then you’re gonna have a brand new character with undaunted 10, your highest pvp rank and then best trial you’ve completed title already with the added x amount of skill points. Honestly would there be any point in making a new character as all sense of achievement has gone out the window?
If it’s the second choice, then a lot of achievement hunters will be upset (not as dramatic as the first choice but their voices on this subject would matter)
I do understand it’s a grind but it is an MMORPG after all and this is only my opinion so take it as you please 😊
Bolded for emphasis:
I think that's the point. People want max level characters in optimal race/class/etc so they can just hop characters when gameplay changes. Rather than adapt, they just wanna switch FOTM. And since you can't change class...well, why not make everything accountwide so they can easily get to level 50 by doing dolmen grind or Skyreach, assign all their CPs, have access to 143+64 skill points with little time/effort invested.
All the people who say "oh, but I'd still have to level the skill line"...it's not that hard and if you're grinding using the above methods with xp pots/group buffs/etc, it's not the chore y'all are making it out to be. The only exceptions are guild/alliance/soul where level is tied to your rank rather than just using the skill line. And we've already seen that people think those should be account bound too.
Why do you go straight to FOTM? There are 5 classes. I want to use all of them for end game content because it is fun to mix it up. I also like having 1 as a magicka class and one as a stamina class. That means 10. I actually have 3 of each class, because it comes in handy for certain events. Only 7 or 8 are max level, but at least one of class. We can make the argument without resorting to the term 'FOTM' and all its negative connotations.
While I am not bothered when I lack skill points and am willing to go out and get them as needed, I would be happy too if my max level characters all of a sudden got a skill point windfall. I just personally don't see why skyshards should be treated any differently than quest skill points, especially since skyshard skill points are easier to collect than quest skill points or dungeon skill points. It all comes down to a mindset. I am able to except that some alts are hamstrung due to the need to collect more skill points. Some people get frustrated by this and want it now.
It is fun playing different skills as different classes. The more I have at max level, the less I have to respec to switch between builds. I would love to get a skill point dump upon hitting 50. I am also fine as-is.1 -
Kidgangster101✭✭✭✭✭
✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Nobody is saying they shouldn't do QoL improvements. Just that this isn't a QoL improvement. It is a game breaking change. Currently you have to actually make a choice when choosing what skill you want, what passive you want to unlock with your skill points, as you'll unlock skills quicker than you level. With the extra 143 skill points from having all the skyshards, you will be able to unlock every skill you want, right when you level it up, making your character significantly more powerful, especially in any under-50 campaigns/content.
The game does provide for a way of changing your character from dps to heals to tank, and from pve to pvp to crafting. It's called the respec shrine. And if you don't want to pay for it in order to convert, you can make the choice to get more skill points so that you don't have to spend the gold. And lets be honest. It only costs 20k to respec a character with 400 skill points, and it's incredibly easy to get 20k in gold.
If you choose to level more than 1 toon, you know you'll need to get a few more skill points. That being said, most peoples alternate characters are only used for 1 role, since they'd rather do "everything" on their main. And it's already been shown that if you level by questing you'll have enough skill points to do any one role you want in this game. And again, if you choose to want to do more, you can get skill points by one of the myriad of methods this game has for doing so. You are not required at all to get skyshards.
I have chosen to emphasize the word choose because that is the crux of the matter. You want to be able to choose to do any role, and you don't want to do anything to earn it. There are multiple ways around the "issue" that everybody has with this..
1. Level via questing/dungeons/delves collecting along the way instead of dolmen farming/skyreach - you'll have enough to do any 1 role you want!!!!
2. Only collect the minimum you need and respec when you want to do other content
3. Spend a couple of hours getting the shards/skill points you need to be able to flex between roles more quickly
4. Create alts for specific roles so you don't have to change between characters for each thing. You get 8 slots (15 with crowns!)
5. Get extra skill points from dungeons
6. Get extra skill points from questing
7. Get extra skill points from Cyrodill (this would be painful though)
8. Get extra skill points from skyshards
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
I'm still not understanding how this is game breaking lol. It is not even close to game breaking at all. WOW and FF14 are GAME BREAKING when you are basically in end game from toon creation. WE are not asking for that. WE are simply asking to have 1 tedious very time consuming brain numbing boring feature to be done once. (Especially on console due to no add on features to show skyshard. So that means constantly looking at a map on phone or computer to get to the spot).
qual·i·ty of life
noun
the standard of health, comfort, and happiness experienced by an individual or group.
Again tell me in exact full detail how it is game breaking to be level 20 with all skyshards or level 3 with all skyshards? There is no difference at all as YOU still can not unlock the skill lines either way. They are there just as you level. It doesn't alter the end game at all because YOU still put in the work lol. Seriously tell me how this isn't quality of life.Edited by Kidgangster101 on December 7, 2018 9:08PM4 -
Fleshreaper✭✭✭✭✭
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
No, YOU are wrong. No, one is asking to come out of the load screen and jump into end-game. Congrats, herp derp, look at me I'm trying to make a point. You're still wrong. Unless you want to be in favor of CPs also being character bound, you're wrong. Skill points mean absolutely nothing without leveling a skill line, which no one is asking to be removed.5 -
xandervalo✭✭✭rexagamemnon wrote: »Skyshards, wayshrines, alliance war ranks, are just a few items that should be account bound
i think crafting too i hate switching to my crafter it would be nice to unlock all of it on one character (BS,WW,Clothing,Provisioning,Alch,Enchant, and def FIghters guild and mages guild omg its so long looking for lorebooks.)0 -
Taleof2Cities✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭xandervalo wrote: »rexagamemnon wrote: »Skyshards, wayshrines, alliance war ranks, are just a few items that should be account bound
i think crafting too i hate switching to my crafter it would be nice to unlock all of it on one character (BS,WW,Clothing,Provisioning,Alch,Enchant, and def FIghters guild and mages guild omg its so long looking for lorebooks.)
That's a discussion for another thread.
(My answer is a firm 'no' by the way.)3 -
Dradhok✭✭✭Someone said sky shard farming adds a sense of discovery. I agree when it is your first couple characters, but after that it is just a tedious grind. Perhaps they need to be randomized so you have to search a little to find them.2 -
tmbrinks✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Fleshreaper wrote: »
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
No, YOU are wrong. No, one is asking to come out of the load screen and jump into end-game. Congrats, herp derp, look at me I'm trying to make a point. You're still wrong. Unless you want to be in favor of CPs also being character bound, you're wrong. Skill points mean absolutely nothing without leveling a skill line, which no one is asking to be removed.
Your skill lines level faster than you can get skill points right now. With those points you'd be able to unlock them faster. Thus making you stronger, faster, and able to level more skill faster.
Thank you for insulting me by the way, that's the perfect way to get your point acrossThe Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra DestroyerThe Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger70,730 achievement points1 -
Kidgangster101✭✭✭✭✭
✭Fleshreaper wrote: »
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
No, YOU are wrong. No, one is asking to come out of the load screen and jump into end-game. Congrats, herp derp, look at me I'm trying to make a point. You're still wrong. Unless you want to be in favor of CPs also being character bound, you're wrong. Skill points mean absolutely nothing without leveling a skill line, which no one is asking to be removed.
Your skill lines level faster than you can get skill points right now. With those points you'd be able to unlock them faster. Thus making you stronger, faster, and able to level more skill faster.
Thank you for insulting me by the way, that's the perfect way to get your point across
Btw it doesn't level faster as you can still have only 5 moves and 1 ultimate on your bar still lol. It doesn't change anything about the level up process of the game what so ever for a player that has already done this before.
Again we are not saying give all players skyshards, we are saying make them account bound. I just leveled a toon from 3-30 before I switched out of my level 4 gear then went from 30 to max. So tell me how it's hard and game breaking when I can do it mostly in level 4 gear? Lol3 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »<snip>
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. <snip>
Dumbing down the gameplay is not a quality of life improvement, and your second sentence gives away the true purpose behind the proposal. As a game gets larger, it should take longer to complete it - why else add more content? For a small subset of players tho', as a game gets larger it needs to be made easier.
Time spent on a game comes in two ways. First, how long you have available per week, and second, how many weeks it takes to achieve your ambitions. There seems to be an assumption that if Player A has 50 hours per week and can therefore "finish" the content in X weeks, because Player B only has 25 hours per week the game should be simplified so that he too can finish it in X weeks. What's wrong with the idea that if Player B only has half the time that Player A has it'll take him twice as long to "finish" the content?
Yet time and again in this sort of thread we see patronising comments about how players opposed to dumbing down the game don't have "proper jobs", aren't "casual players", and should "get real" and understand that not everybody can afford to take more than a few hours to level a character for "endgame". I've only been playing an hour or two a day at most since launch and have 28 characters, yet I'm relaxed about the time it's taking me to progress them and I don't camp the forum demanding shortcuts and handouts. MMORPGs are intended to be played for years rather than weeks or months, and just because you choose to level from 1 to 50 in a couple of days at a dolmen or in a dungeon doesn't mean you should then immediately be entitled to receive all the skyshard achievements that a previous character earned.
"Quality of life improvements" are things like providing a proper search function at trader kiosks, or implementing a re-order function on the character selection screen, not structural gameplay changes.6 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
Your selective editing of my post takes it out of context and makes your reply rather meaningless.
So yes, lets be real.
I'll explain it then.
If ZoS wanted to get rid of "Lazy" grinding. Alkir dolmen trains would simply reward 0 XP. We have a leveling route that is 24/7 hour up that you can literally AFK in and ZoS has chosen <not that they don't know> to simply let it be.
Call it what you want, but can you really honestly find something lazier than running to a spot - AFK to watch netflix - Rinse and repeat? Account wide skyshard or not it will be used. Adding account wide won't all of a sudden make those who love questing drop everything and run to dolmens. It won't make those running dolmens....stop running dolmens.
It appears need to explain.
Just FYI, over the years Zos has reduced the XP at certain grinding locations. At some point it becomes ridiculous to try to stop the behavior, but it is absurd to suggest the behavior should then be rewarded which is what you seem to be suggesting.
So grind as you want but if you want sky shards you will have to go get them. As I have stated, no one in this thread has provided anything worthy to compel Zos to make the suggestion in the OP happen. This post I quoted is no different.
Edited by idk on December 7, 2018 10:03PM5 -
Kidgangster101✭✭✭✭✭
✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »<snip>
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. <snip>
Dumbing down the gameplay is not a quality of life improvement, and your second sentence gives away the true purpose behind the proposal. As a game gets larger, it should take longer to complete it - why else add more content? For a small subset of players tho', as a game gets larger it needs to be made easier.
Time spent on a game comes in two ways. First, how long you have available per week, and second, how many weeks it takes to achieve your ambitions. There seems to be an assumption that if Player A has 50 hours per week and can therefore "finish" the content in X weeks, because Player B only has 25 hours per week the game should be simplified so that he too can finish it in X weeks. What's wrong with the idea that if Player B only has half the time that Player A has it'll take him twice as long to "finish" the content?
Yet time and again in this sort of thread we see patronising comments about how players opposed to dumbing down the game don't have "proper jobs", aren't "casual players", and should "get real" and understand that not everybody can afford to take more than a few hours to level a character for "endgame". I've only been playing an hour or two a day at most since launch and have 28 characters, yet I'm relaxed about the time it's taking me to progress them and I don't camp the forum demanding shortcuts and handouts. MMORPGs are intended to be played for years rather than weeks or months, and just because you choose to level from 1 to 50 in a couple of days at a dolmen or in a dungeon doesn't mean you should then immediately be entitled to receive all the skyshard achievements that a previous character earned.
"Quality of life improvements" are things like providing a proper search function at trader kiosks, or implementing a re-order function on the character selection screen, not structural gameplay changes.
What other mmo games have you played? Maybe that's why you seem to lack knowledge in how they actually work lol.
Each game has their own unique thing they end up doing. Here's the list of the last 2 I played and what they did.
Dcuo- allowed you to pay money to get to max level and provided you gear. They also allowed you to skip content very fast.
They had achievements much like here where you complete x task and get z reward between 10-100. Every 100 points gave you a skill point for that toon. Eventually they made it so you can pay their version of crowns to unlock said achievements on other toons on the same account meaning all of your toons shared everything.
Ff14- made a potion that cost 60 dollars and leveled you from 1-60 (level cap is 70). On top of that it literally caught you up to newest dlc content allowing you to skip at least 1000 hours of game play (not sure exact number but just saying you bypassedthe main game, all their monthly updates and then their second dlc and their updates putting you on the most current quest line as the rest of the community.) And on top of that it gave you full raid gear for level 60 (gear literally people grinded months for just shortly before this launched.) And to top it all off one toon could swap between every single class in the game (maybe 15ish to choose from) and all their stuff was shared.
Many other games end up doing similar things as I stated that is quality of life. Maybe not to you but to the community. So if all those other games found ways to make lots and lots of money off "jump potions" it is a matter of time before eso does. And then everyone that invested lots of time will come back to the forum crying over those changes.
All people want to do is play with their friends. I don't enjoy getting on and doing skyshards for all my toons. (I already did what I needed for my toons) this is suppose to be a massive multiplayer online game to play with friends. Not a massive single player online of skyshard hunting lol. Bringing more people on skyshard hunts doesn't make it more enjoyable.
Amd if they actually do share skyshards I guarantee you people will buy more toon slots and then zos makes $$$$$$$$$. 1 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »Kidgangster101 wrote: »<snip>
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. <snip>
Dumbing down the gameplay is not a quality of life improvement, and your second sentence gives away the true purpose behind the proposal. As a game gets larger, it should take longer to complete it - why else add more content? For a small subset of players tho', as a game gets larger it needs to be made easier.
Time spent on a game comes in two ways. First, how long you have available per week, and second, how many weeks it takes to achieve your ambitions. There seems to be an assumption that if Player A has 50 hours per week and can therefore "finish" the content in X weeks, because Player B only has 25 hours per week the game should be simplified so that he too can finish it in X weeks. What's wrong with the idea that if Player B only has half the time that Player A has it'll take him twice as long to "finish" the content?
Yet time and again in this sort of thread we see patronising comments about how players opposed to dumbing down the game don't have "proper jobs", aren't "casual players", and should "get real" and understand that not everybody can afford to take more than a few hours to level a character for "endgame". I've only been playing an hour or two a day at most since launch and have 28 characters, yet I'm relaxed about the time it's taking me to progress them and I don't camp the forum demanding shortcuts and handouts. MMORPGs are intended to be played for years rather than weeks or months, and just because you choose to level from 1 to 50 in a couple of days at a dolmen or in a dungeon doesn't mean you should then immediately be entitled to receive all the skyshard achievements that a previous character earned.
"Quality of life improvements" are things like providing a proper search function at trader kiosks, or implementing a re-order function on the character selection screen, not structural gameplay changes.
<snip> What other mmo games have you played? Maybe that's why you seem to lack knowledge in how they actually work lol. <snip>
I've played quite a few MMOs since The Realm in 1998, including Neocron, Rubies of Eventide, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, AC2, WAR, WoW, EQ2, FFX1, FFXIV, TSW, VG, CoH, SWG, LoTRO, TSW:L, AoC, Lineage 2, Tabula Rasa, SWTOR, BDO, NW, Fallen Earth, GW, GW2, Rift, and doubtless a few others I can't remember off the top of my head as well as quite a few MUDs. You?
In terms of your own stated experience of two other games, I've actively supported the idea of players being able to buy an expensive crown store token to provide instant maxed characters (assuming they've already maxed one character the hard way), that's not an issue for me and I'd much prefer it to making structural changes to the basic gameplay. See Post #12 in this thread!1 -
therift✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Another 5-10 pages have gone by, so it's time to repost
Delete all skyshards in the game. Move those skill points to character progression where they belong. Convenience is overrated. End the gimme-gimme culture. Just play the game.1 -
idk✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Another 5-10 pages have gone by, so it's time to repost
Delete all skyshards in the game. Move those skill points to character progression where they belong. Convenience is overrated. End the gimme-gimme culture. Just play the game.
TES is very much about exploration. It seems the sky shards are part of what Zos put into this game for exploration so to say they belong somewhere else seems more self serving than anything more. So it comes up short of being a compelling idea for change.
1 -
heaven13✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »Kidgangster101 wrote: »So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Nobody is saying they shouldn't do QoL improvements. Just that this isn't a QoL improvement. It is a game breaking change. Currently you have to actually make a choice when choosing what skill you want, what passive you want to unlock with your skill points, as you'll unlock skills quicker than you level. With the extra 143 skill points from having all the skyshards, you will be able to unlock every skill you want, right when you level it up, making your character significantly more powerful, especially in any under-50 campaigns/content.
The game does provide for a way of changing your character from dps to heals to tank, and from pve to pvp to crafting. It's called the respec shrine. And if you don't want to pay for it in order to convert, you can make the choice to get more skill points so that you don't have to spend the gold. And lets be honest. It only costs 20k to respec a character with 400 skill points, and it's incredibly easy to get 20k in gold.
If you choose to level more than 1 toon, you know you'll need to get a few more skill points. That being said, most peoples alternate characters are only used for 1 role, since they'd rather do "everything" on their main. And it's already been shown that if you level by questing you'll have enough skill points to do any one role you want in this game. And again, if you choose to want to do more, you can get skill points by one of the myriad of methods this game has for doing so. You are not required at all to get skyshards.
I have chosen to emphasize the word choose because that is the crux of the matter. You want to be able to choose to do any role, and you don't want to do anything to earn it. There are multiple ways around the "issue" that everybody has with this..
1. Level via questing/dungeons/delves collecting along the way instead of dolmen farming/skyreach - you'll have enough to do any 1 role you want!!!!
2. Only collect the minimum you need and respec when you want to do other content
3. Spend a couple of hours getting the shards/skill points you need to be able to flex between roles more quickly
4. Create alts for specific roles so you don't have to change between characters for each thing. You get 8 slots (15 with crowns!)
5. Get extra skill points from dungeons
6. Get extra skill points from questing
7. Get extra skill points from Cyrodill (this would be painful though)
8. Get extra skill points from skyshards
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
I'm still not understanding how this is game breaking lol. It is not even close to game breaking at all. WOW and FF14 are GAME BREAKING when you are basically in end game from toon creation. WE are not asking for that. WE are simply asking to have 1 tedious very time consuming brain numbing boring feature to be done once. (Especially on console due to no add on features to show skyshard. So that means constantly looking at a map on phone or computer to get to the spot).
qual·i·ty of life
noun
the standard of health, comfort, and happiness experienced by an individual or group.
Again tell me in exact full detail how it is game breaking to be level 20 with all skyshards or level 3 with all skyshards? There is no difference at all as YOU still can not unlock the skill lines either way. They are there just as you level. It doesn't alter the end game at all because YOU still put in the work lol. Seriously tell me how this isn't quality of life.
Quality of Life would be adding the skyshards to the map pins as POI, not just giving them to you already collected. I think that would be perfectly acceptable, in fact.PC/NAMountain God | Leave No Bone Unbroken | Apex Predator | Pure Lunacy | Depths Defier | No Rest for the Wicked | In Defiance of DeathMeet my characters :
Defanged the Devourer | Nature's Wrath | Relentless Raider | True Genius | Bane of Thorns | Subterranean Smasher | Ardent Bibliophile
vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vDSA | vMoL HM | vHoF HM | vAS+2 | vCR+2 | vBRP | vSS HM | vKA | vRGIT DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE THEY'RE ALL THE SAME NOW, THANKS ZOS3 -
tmbrinks✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »Kidgangster101 wrote: »So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Nobody is saying they shouldn't do QoL improvements. Just that this isn't a QoL improvement. It is a game breaking change. Currently you have to actually make a choice when choosing what skill you want, what passive you want to unlock with your skill points, as you'll unlock skills quicker than you level. With the extra 143 skill points from having all the skyshards, you will be able to unlock every skill you want, right when you level it up, making your character significantly more powerful, especially in any under-50 campaigns/content.
The game does provide for a way of changing your character from dps to heals to tank, and from pve to pvp to crafting. It's called the respec shrine. And if you don't want to pay for it in order to convert, you can make the choice to get more skill points so that you don't have to spend the gold. And lets be honest. It only costs 20k to respec a character with 400 skill points, and it's incredibly easy to get 20k in gold.
If you choose to level more than 1 toon, you know you'll need to get a few more skill points. That being said, most peoples alternate characters are only used for 1 role, since they'd rather do "everything" on their main. And it's already been shown that if you level by questing you'll have enough skill points to do any one role you want in this game. And again, if you choose to want to do more, you can get skill points by one of the myriad of methods this game has for doing so. You are not required at all to get skyshards.
I have chosen to emphasize the word choose because that is the crux of the matter. You want to be able to choose to do any role, and you don't want to do anything to earn it. There are multiple ways around the "issue" that everybody has with this..
1. Level via questing/dungeons/delves collecting along the way instead of dolmen farming/skyreach - you'll have enough to do any 1 role you want!!!!
2. Only collect the minimum you need and respec when you want to do other content
3. Spend a couple of hours getting the shards/skill points you need to be able to flex between roles more quickly
4. Create alts for specific roles so you don't have to change between characters for each thing. You get 8 slots (15 with crowns!)
5. Get extra skill points from dungeons
6. Get extra skill points from questing
7. Get extra skill points from Cyrodill (this would be painful though)
8. Get extra skill points from skyshards
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
I'm still not understanding how this is game breaking lol. It is not even close to game breaking at all. WOW and FF14 are GAME BREAKING when you are basically in end game from toon creation. WE are not asking for that. WE are simply asking to have 1 tedious very time consuming brain numbing boring feature to be done once. (Especially on console due to no add on features to show skyshard. So that means constantly looking at a map on phone or computer to get to the spot).
qual·i·ty of life
noun
the standard of health, comfort, and happiness experienced by an individual or group.
Again tell me in exact full detail how it is game breaking to be level 20 with all skyshards or level 3 with all skyshards? There is no difference at all as YOU still can not unlock the skill lines either way. They are there just as you level. It doesn't alter the end game at all because YOU still put in the work lol. Seriously tell me how this isn't quality of life.
Quality of Life would be adding the skyshards to the map pins as POI, not just giving them to you already collected. I think that would be perfectly acceptable, in fact.
This. Thank you.The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra DestroyerThe Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger70,730 achievement points1 -
Kidgangster101✭✭✭✭✭
✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »Kidgangster101 wrote: »So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Nobody is saying they shouldn't do QoL improvements. Just that this isn't a QoL improvement. It is a game breaking change. Currently you have to actually make a choice when choosing what skill you want, what passive you want to unlock with your skill points, as you'll unlock skills quicker than you level. With the extra 143 skill points from having all the skyshards, you will be able to unlock every skill you want, right when you level it up, making your character significantly more powerful, especially in any under-50 campaigns/content.
The game does provide for a way of changing your character from dps to heals to tank, and from pve to pvp to crafting. It's called the respec shrine. And if you don't want to pay for it in order to convert, you can make the choice to get more skill points so that you don't have to spend the gold. And lets be honest. It only costs 20k to respec a character with 400 skill points, and it's incredibly easy to get 20k in gold.
If you choose to level more than 1 toon, you know you'll need to get a few more skill points. That being said, most peoples alternate characters are only used for 1 role, since they'd rather do "everything" on their main. And it's already been shown that if you level by questing you'll have enough skill points to do any one role you want in this game. And again, if you choose to want to do more, you can get skill points by one of the myriad of methods this game has for doing so. You are not required at all to get skyshards.
I have chosen to emphasize the word choose because that is the crux of the matter. You want to be able to choose to do any role, and you don't want to do anything to earn it. There are multiple ways around the "issue" that everybody has with this..
1. Level via questing/dungeons/delves collecting along the way instead of dolmen farming/skyreach - you'll have enough to do any 1 role you want!!!!
2. Only collect the minimum you need and respec when you want to do other content
3. Spend a couple of hours getting the shards/skill points you need to be able to flex between roles more quickly
4. Create alts for specific roles so you don't have to change between characters for each thing. You get 8 slots (15 with crowns!)
5. Get extra skill points from dungeons
6. Get extra skill points from questing
7. Get extra skill points from Cyrodill (this would be painful though)
8. Get extra skill points from skyshards
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
I'm still not understanding how this is game breaking lol. It is not even close to game breaking at all. WOW and FF14 are GAME BREAKING when you are basically in end game from toon creation. WE are not asking for that. WE are simply asking to have 1 tedious very time consuming brain numbing boring feature to be done once. (Especially on console due to no add on features to show skyshard. So that means constantly looking at a map on phone or computer to get to the spot).
qual·i·ty of life
noun
the standard of health, comfort, and happiness experienced by an individual or group.
Again tell me in exact full detail how it is game breaking to be level 20 with all skyshards or level 3 with all skyshards? There is no difference at all as YOU still can not unlock the skill lines either way. They are there just as you level. It doesn't alter the end game at all because YOU still put in the work lol. Seriously tell me how this isn't quality of life.
Quality of Life would be adding the skyshards to the map pins as POI, not just giving them to you already collected. I think that would be perfectly acceptable, in fact.
This right here I've mentioned numerous numerous times as well and people don't even agree with that. I still say I earned them so they should be free, but i.would be 100% okay with a marker on my map so I can get a few over time without having to constantly be comparing markers to a spot on the map from PC. (Not to mention some of the skyshard locations in certain maps are completely wrong online so I use to search the wrong spot to have to just wander around doing it myself). But people denied me this request as well. People just want to watch others suffer lol.Edited by Kidgangster101 on December 9, 2018 1:29AM2 -
tmbrinks✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »Kidgangster101 wrote: »Kidgangster101 wrote: »So what's the difference between us getting skyshards account bound at level one and us putting in the hours upon hours of wasted real life time to gather them on a new toon? I can have all skyshards in the game by level 15-20.
The way the zones work they scale with your level. You will never be in danger like you use to be in the old days. Zones use to be a specific level making getting skyshards near impossible unless someone carried you. But now I can still have all skyshards before I even hit 50 and I still have to level the skill lines.
But again CP is account bound lol. You guys against a qol feature is amazing tbh. No one is asking for quest skill points or dungeon skill points. People are talking about open world skyshards. People are trying to make it so you don't go here press interaction button on 8+ toons. Me collecting skyshard 1 is no different then me collecting it for the 7th time. There is no group content so a fight is never ever different.
As far as people choosing to level in dolmans or grinding or doing quests again that is their choice. You don't pay their sub so who are you to tell someone there is a certain way to play? If devs didn't want xp grinding spots it would be nerfed. They would make it so you only gain xp through quests, bit they haven't. In fact they made it easier to grind xp by the level scaling. You never ever have to leave your starting town to reach max level and get gear while doing so.
People need to realize not everyone has multiple hours a day to play and people enjoy playing different classes. There is a very different build to being a tank or healer or dps. Again if the devs only wanted someone to play just one toon you would only be allowed to create one too. (Before everyone goes well I only have one toon why does anyone else need more than one toon) again because they pay to play that way lol.
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. Every mmo that has ever existed always does quality of life changes. (DCUO has jump potions and shared skill points to make you stronger. Ff14 has a jump potions to make you almost max level/gear/and skip all old content. Wow has a jump potions to level a new toon and they give you one at the start of the game free if you purchased their dlc) that is just to name a few. Wow and ff14 are going very strong because of these changes so I ask again what is wrong with unlocking skyshards as a quality of life? Leveling to max level as a new player in other games seem worse than unlocking skyshards lol. It is only a matter of time before eso loses players and they allow a potion to jump to say 500cp for 50 bucks and I will be here to see everyone's tears because that is more game breaking lol
Nobody is saying they shouldn't do QoL improvements. Just that this isn't a QoL improvement. It is a game breaking change. Currently you have to actually make a choice when choosing what skill you want, what passive you want to unlock with your skill points, as you'll unlock skills quicker than you level. With the extra 143 skill points from having all the skyshards, you will be able to unlock every skill you want, right when you level it up, making your character significantly more powerful, especially in any under-50 campaigns/content.
The game does provide for a way of changing your character from dps to heals to tank, and from pve to pvp to crafting. It's called the respec shrine. And if you don't want to pay for it in order to convert, you can make the choice to get more skill points so that you don't have to spend the gold. And lets be honest. It only costs 20k to respec a character with 400 skill points, and it's incredibly easy to get 20k in gold.
If you choose to level more than 1 toon, you know you'll need to get a few more skill points. That being said, most peoples alternate characters are only used for 1 role, since they'd rather do "everything" on their main. And it's already been shown that if you level by questing you'll have enough skill points to do any one role you want in this game. And again, if you choose to want to do more, you can get skill points by one of the myriad of methods this game has for doing so. You are not required at all to get skyshards.
I have chosen to emphasize the word choose because that is the crux of the matter. You want to be able to choose to do any role, and you don't want to do anything to earn it. There are multiple ways around the "issue" that everybody has with this..
1. Level via questing/dungeons/delves collecting along the way instead of dolmen farming/skyreach - you'll have enough to do any 1 role you want!!!!
2. Only collect the minimum you need and respec when you want to do other content
3. Spend a couple of hours getting the shards/skill points you need to be able to flex between roles more quickly
4. Create alts for specific roles so you don't have to change between characters for each thing. You get 8 slots (15 with crowns!)
5. Get extra skill points from dungeons
6. Get extra skill points from questing
7. Get extra skill points from Cyrodill (this would be painful though)
8. Get extra skill points from skyshards
How much you want to do is your choice. Do as much as you find most enjoyable. If you don't enjoy any them, then YOU ARE PLAYING THE WRONG GAME. BECAUSE ALL OF THOSE ARE THE GAME!!!!!
You are honestly asking to be able to role a character out of load screen and be able to do end-game content. Is this because of "meta" changes? Because the only place it would actually potentially matter would be running in a vCR +3 group going for Gryphon Heart, or running vBRP going for "The Unchained" or maybe vHoF and going for "Tick-Tock Tormenter" If you're not doing one of these 3... you're okay running a Redguard over a Khajiit (or vice-versa) for your Stamplar!
(I'm speaking of "you" in the plural to all in favor of this, not the quoted post in particular)
I'm still not understanding how this is game breaking lol. It is not even close to game breaking at all. WOW and FF14 are GAME BREAKING when you are basically in end game from toon creation. WE are not asking for that. WE are simply asking to have 1 tedious very time consuming brain numbing boring feature to be done once. (Especially on console due to no add on features to show skyshard. So that means constantly looking at a map on phone or computer to get to the spot).
qual·i·ty of life
noun
the standard of health, comfort, and happiness experienced by an individual or group.
Again tell me in exact full detail how it is game breaking to be level 20 with all skyshards or level 3 with all skyshards? There is no difference at all as YOU still can not unlock the skill lines either way. They are there just as you level. It doesn't alter the end game at all because YOU still put in the work lol. Seriously tell me how this isn't quality of life.
Quality of Life would be adding the skyshards to the map pins as POI, not just giving them to you already collected. I think that would be perfectly acceptable, in fact.
This right here I've mentioned numerous numerous times as well and people don't even agree with that. I still say I earned them so they should be free, but i.would be 100% okay with a marker on my map so I can get a few over time without having to constantly be comparing markers to a spot on the map from PC. (Not to mention some of the skyshard locations in certain maps are completely wrong online so I use to search the wrong spot to have to just wander around doing it myself). But people denied me this request as well. People just want to watch others suffer lol.
Who has not agreed with that? I am completely and utterly against having skyshards be account bound, but they should be marked on console... along with lorebooks, points of interest, once you've discovered them on one character.The Unshattered - Tenacious Dreamer - Hurricane Herald - Godslayer - Dawnbringer - Gryphon Heart - Tick Tock Tormenter - Immortal Redeemer - Dro-m'Athra DestroyerThe Unchained - The Brilliant - Moth Trusted - The Just - Oathsworn - Bedlam's Disciple - Temporal Tempest - Curator's Champion - Fist of Tava - Invader's Bane - Land, Air, and Sea Supremacy - Zero Regrets - Battlespire's Best - Bastion Breaker - Ardent Bibliophile - Subterranean Smasher - Bane of Thorns - True Genius - In Defiance of Death - No Rest for the Wicked - Nature's Wrath - Undying Endurance - Relentless Raider - Depths Defier - Apex Predator - Pure Lunacy - Mountain God - Leave No Bone Unbroken - CoS/RoM/BF/FH Challenger70,730 achievement points2 -
xaraan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭If they were to do something as 'gimme dis' as make skyshards account bound, then anyone who has collected say... the almost 2000 skyshards I have should have that number applied across all my accounts and allow those that did the work to forever have a reward for that work as newer players are given the easier road.-- @xaraan --
nightblade: Xaraan • templar: Xaraan-dar • dragon-knight: Xaraanosaurus • necromancer: Xaraan-qa • warden: Xaraanodon • sorcerer: Xaraan-ra
AD • NA • PC0 -
Edziu✭✭✭✭✭
✭If they were to do something as 'gimme dis' as make skyshards account bound, then anyone who has collected say... the almost 2000 skyshards I have should have that number applied across all my accounts and allow those that did the work to forever have a reward for that work as newer players are given the easier road.
hmm to this I could pin example of prices...
morrowind chapter has been released, this was not cheap at start ofc, everyone who really wanted have bought this
other people who just doesnt care for this or didnt want to pay that much they just left this and was still playing without this
after some time morrowind had price lowered and was few times on sale - thanks to this more people convinced to buy it and ofc there was also people crying for this as they bought it for much much more than after time people who waited for sale
and aftersome more time battlegrounds (which was also big reason and for many people only reason to buy this chapter) was moved just into basic game and warden to crown store after price was more lowered for this chapter
even more people was happy by most of those changes as mainly bg's in basic game and morrowind even more cheaper
and here also ofc was people hated this becasue they payed for this much before and much more
but there was people who jsut dont care about this if thye bought it before, they had also opinion as morrowind could be changed to be just free or as dlc into eso+ as for they was enough to see more people playing in it and be happy as they knowed they bough it when it was on "hype" and fresh because they wanted to play this as early as they could and they know after time an product is less valuable because is "burned out"
and what this mean into your post @xaraan ?
as you are this one who have gathered these shards before because you wantedd to have your alts much earlier to be playable etc and you now would have pain to everyone who could have account shared them for their newest alts which they was not creating before you because they didnt want to pay this price like you as gathering these tedious shards
and ofc would be many people here who will not care about people who not yet have done their 15 alts like them becasue many of them can think as others could not have time as them to gather them on that many alts or just have not fun of this but they have waited long time (if it would be introduced) to create even their 1st alts so they was playing mainly only 1 character if even alts while you was playing these alts for long time before instead of single character for really long
PS: @xaraan please think about other players feelings to something in game instead of posting selfish post as:
you was forced to do these shards while suffering of this because it was borind etc so every other player also should suffer for their new alts like you0 -
TheTombstone✭✭✭Yeah, the argument of "We did it this way so therefore everyone must do it." Is a terrible argument. Things change, for better or worst. Quite a bit of things need to change in the game to hold onto its player base.3 -
Kidgangster101✭✭✭✭✭
✭TheTombstone wrote: »Yeah, the argument of "We did it this way so therefore everyone must do it." Is a terrible argument. Things change, for better or worst. Quite a bit of things need to change in the game to hold onto its player base.
That's what I've been saying all along and I'm one of the players with 8 toons and more than enough skillpoints on them now but I understand the time I spent on them and it doesn't bother me as it brings excitement and keeps the player base up so the game doesn't die. This is one of the buggiest mmo games I've played and things are broken from over 3 years ago so anything to keep the game alive is what we need. Stop being selfish people.1 -
Fleshreaper✭✭✭✭✭Kidgangster101 wrote: »<snip>
On a last note quality of life changes are always needed to improve the state of the game. The more content we get the more quality of life is needed. <snip>
Dumbing down the gameplay is not a quality of life improvement, and your second sentence gives away the true purpose behind the proposal. As a game gets larger, it should take longer to complete it - why else add more content? For a small subset of players tho', as a game gets larger it needs to be made easier.
Time spent on a game comes in two ways. First, how long you have available per week, and second, how many weeks it takes to achieve your ambitions. There seems to be an assumption that if Player A has 50 hours per week and can therefore "finish" the content in X weeks, because Player B only has 25 hours per week the game should be simplified so that he too can finish it in X weeks. What's wrong with the idea that if Player B only has half the time that Player A has it'll take him twice as long to "finish" the content?
Yet time and again in this sort of thread we see patronising comments about how players opposed to dumbing down the game don't have "proper jobs", aren't "casual players", and should "get real" and understand that not everybody can afford to take more than a few hours to level a character for "endgame". I've only been playing an hour or two a day at most since launch and have 28 characters, yet I'm relaxed about the time it's taking me to progress them and I don't camp the forum demanding shortcuts and handouts. MMORPGs are intended to be played for years rather than weeks or months, and just because you choose to level from 1 to 50 in a couple of days at a dolmen or in a dungeon doesn't mean you should then immediately be entitled to receive all the skyshard achievements that a previous character earned.
"Quality of life improvements" are things like providing a proper search function at trader kiosks, or implementing a re-order function on the character selection screen, not structural gameplay changes.
@Tandor So, you are all in favor of making CPs character bound instead of account bound. Because if you are not, then your hole statement there goes right up in flames. As it's just "YOUR" opinion as to what you feel is acceptable amount of grinding. I would really like to know your opinion on CPs....5
