Beginning of the end for Crown Crates.

Reistr_the_Unbroken

Davor wrote: »

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

All of you are forgetting that Crown Crates are different than Blizzards loot boxes- in Blizzards loot boxes it was completely random, so you had no idea what you would get.

With the Crown Crates they give some for free during daily rewards or twitch drops, or you have to buy them- but at least they had the rewards on the page so you could actually see them, try them out and if you liked them then you could buy them with gems.

So like how a drug dealer will give out free samples. Wow Zenimax is becoming more ethical by the second.

Come on people keep it up. Let's see how much of a good light you can put Zenimax in. You are just giving us more ammunition on how sleazy they are.

I guess that makes me a bad person as well since I support this sleazy company. I guess I am hooked on the ESO drug.

What kind of crap analogy is that? All I was stating is that Blizzard has the gamble crates, but with ZoS you could buy what you wanted with the gems you saved up.

Davor

Imperial_Voice wrote: »

You guys arent just counting your chickens before theyve hatched, youre counting them any eggs have been laid. I would approach this with more than a healthy dose of cautious optimism if I were you.

So true. By law at least in Ontario, Canada this is not gambling since it doesn't give out real money. So what will have to happen and this can take years if not decades (from politicians stalling) a new definition of gambling will have to be made. This is why it falls outside of lots of government districts.

This is a start. All it does is give light to it. Now we need people to call on CNN so this can be showed to everyone and then maybe parents who don't know and think their kid is only playing a soccer/football, football, baseball, hockey game will take a double look now.

After all this can be a public nightmare. I am sure CNN will use the word gambling it will make great headlines.

EA making minors gamble and receive millions of dollars of minor's. Great headline. Someone in the US please call CNN or sent an email or how ever it's done in this age.

Davor

Juju_beans wrote: »

If gaming companies are forced to remove loot boxes then they will just use other methods to generate revenue.
Increased prices in crown store, higher sub price, move to a pay to play only structure, etc.

They are a business and they need to make money.

And so? Many companies have tried this and failed. So all this means that is ESO will be caput. I rather have no ESO if it means it is only there because of gambling. What ever happened companies make a game so people can play them because it's good and works well? Why rely on gambling?

So as I said before, what is Zenimax Online Studios business? Is it to make video games or it makes a video game so people gamble?


Damn we really need a multi quote button here.

Davor

Krayl wrote: »

its funny to me that people are celebrating this.

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

If you believe that in this day and age a game company can afford to carry a staff capable of continuous content development and still have no required monthly fee to rely on, you're going to be sadly mistaken.

This concept that the crown store is some greedy zero-cost money pit for ZOS is sad/funny.

So you are saying that ZOS is a company that makes a video game so people can gamble then, instead of a company that makes video games. If the DLC and expansions can't sustain ESO then ESO should be shut down. Perfect example given as to why ZOS is not a gaming company but a gambling company.

Davor

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

What I've never gotten is that I just won't spend real money for a mystery box. Every crate I've gotten was free and everything I've bought related to the crate store was via the resultant free gems. Yet, there are plenty of things hidden in crates I wouldn't mind buying straight up if they were in the crown store where I can see exactly what I'm getting for my money.

Guess what I'm trying to say is that putting all the crate items in the crown store would earn more money from me. Am I really the minority?

Yes you are in the minority. If you were not, then lots of the non purchasable items would be put out on sale and not time exclusive either so people "jump" on and know they might not ever get it again. If it was profitable to put them on sale then Zenimax would after all they are a company to make money. Since this tactic doesn't make as much money would mean we are in the minority.

Reistr_the_Unbroken

Davor wrote: »

Krayl wrote: »

its funny to me that people are celebrating this.

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

If you believe that in this day and age a game company can afford to carry a staff capable of continuous content development and still have no required monthly fee to rely on, you're going to be sadly mistaken.

This concept that the crown store is some greedy zero-cost money pit for ZOS is sad/funny.

So you are saying that ZOS is a company that makes a video game so people can gamble then, instead of a company that makes video games. If the DLC and expansions can't sustain ESO then ESO should be shut down. Perfect example given as to why ZOS is not a gaming company but a gambling company.

Please don’t spam the thread

Reistr_the_Unbroken

Davor wrote: »

Krayl wrote: »

its funny to me that people are celebrating this.

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

If you believe that in this day and age a game company can afford to carry a staff capable of continuous content development and still have no required monthly fee to rely on, you're going to be sadly mistaken.

This concept that the crown store is some greedy zero-cost money pit for ZOS is sad/funny.

So you are saying that ZOS is a company that makes a video game so people can gamble then, instead of a company that makes video games. If the DLC and expansions can't sustain ESO then ESO should be shut down. Perfect example given as to why ZOS is not a gaming company but a gambling company.

Quit spamming the thread dude

Davor wrote: »

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

Davor wrote: »

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

All of you are forgetting that Crown Crates are different than Blizzards loot boxes- in Blizzards loot boxes it was completely random, so you had no idea what you would get.

With the Crown Crates they give some for free during daily rewards or twitch drops, or you have to buy them- but at least they had the rewards on the page so you could actually see them, try them out and if you liked them then you could buy them with gems.

So like how a drug dealer will give out free samples. Wow Zenimax is becoming more ethical by the second.

Come on people keep it up. Let's see how much of a good light you can put Zenimax in. You are just giving us more ammunition on how sleazy they are.

I guess that makes me a bad person as well since I support this sleazy company. I guess I am hooked on the ESO drug.

What kind of crap analogy is that? All I was stating is that Blizzard has the gamble crates, but with ZoS you could buy what you wanted with the gems you saved up.

Sorry I have quoted the wrong person.

Oh! It’s alright
And I think to put everything in a single post you put all the quotes in the text box- sorry if it sounds weird but I’ve seen it before but I’m not sure how to word it

Pheefs

Davor wrote: »

So like how a drug dealer will give out free samples. Wow Zenimax is becoming more ethical by the second.

Come on people keep it up. Let's see how much of a good light you can put Zenimax in. You are just giving us more ammunition on how sleazy they are.

yikes, that's quite a leap!
crates are simply "here are all the prizes you MIGHT win"
even if you compare it with RL gambling its the duckies at the carnival or "The Claw"...
you can spend $100 dollars at the duckies in an attempt to win that 8ft tall unicorn if you want to, that's one of the benefits of adulting... deciding when to ignore 'acting responsibly' towards ones own wallet.

& the real point is they greatly reduced "the sleaze" as you call it when the crates became easily available without purchase, protecting themselves legally and in the land of public relations

Juju_beans

Davor wrote: »

AcadianPaladin wrote: »

What I've never gotten is that I just won't spend real money for a mystery box. Every crate I've gotten was free and everything I've bought related to the crate store was via the resultant free gems. Yet, there are plenty of things hidden in crates I wouldn't mind buying straight up if they were in the crown store where I can see exactly what I'm getting for my money.

Guess what I'm trying to say is that putting all the crate items in the crown store would earn more money from me. Am I really the minority?

Yes you are in the minority. If you were not, then lots of the non purchasable items would be put out on sale and not time exclusive either so people "jump" on and know they might not ever get it again. If it was profitable to put them on sale then Zenimax would after all they are a company to make money. Since this tactic doesn't make as much money would mean we are in the minority.

And where are you getting your stats from ?
You have no insight as to how much money is made.

ZOS is a private company.

I've bought time limited items with my crowns. I don't buy crowns..these are the ones I get from subbing.

Glurin

This whole argument started, or at least went mainstream, because EA likes to put actual in game progression behind loot box pay walls. With horrendous odds of success no less. That's something ZoS does not do.

Imagine if you started ESO with the DK class, and all other classes had to be unlocked via crown crates. Each class having say, 5% chance at best of showing up, with some arbitrary class like wardens having a less than 1% chance. In addition, in order to use weapons other than sword and board, you have to buy crown crates. Two handed and restoration staves have a 10% chance of appearing, bows have maybe 4%, and destruction staves maybe 1%. Dual wield, well, you have better odds of winning the state lottery, which you would have to do to have the money to buy enough crown crates to get dual wield.

Want to do some crafting? Great! Just buy some crown crates. Each crafting skill line has a whole 2% chance of being in the crate, except jewelry crafting because it's new and exciting, so we're giving that a .01% chance.

What's that? You bought the Dark Brotherhood DLC? Wonderful! Of course the only way to level that skill line is to buy special dark brotherhood crown crates and hope to get a contract to drop from one of them.

That's the kind of *** EA pulls all the time, and is the primary reason loot boxes have become targets. It's no surprise they would be the ones balking at the Belgium ruling.

Crown crates, by comparison, are quite harmless and a good source of revenue. Especially considering that they have mechanisms in place to enable you to get the specific items you want before you go spending your life savings. Aside from the crate only mounts of course, which I think are a mistake on ZoS's part and is akin to them putting their toe over the line. Same goes for any gem only content.

Hippie4927

I fail to see how Crown Crates constitute 'gambling'. You always get items worth more than what you paid for the crate. Nothing in the crates is P2W. The crates cannot be sold for real money and neither can the items in them. So, how is it gambling?

One thing I have noticed in all the articles/videos posted about this topic is that Zenimax is never mentioned. Belgium didn't go after Zeni. Have you ever asked yourself "why?"

If you don't like the crates, just don't buy them!

Acrolas

UrQuan wrote: »

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

More content is released because there's continued interest in new content.
New collectibles are released because there's continued interest in new collectibles.

Both types are budgeted. Neither are a reflection of the revenue stream they carve.


But crates are more related to the renewable items that ZOS regularly struggles to generate interest in - consumables. Nobody really batted an eye at the Starter Packs, and I'm guessing very few people bought those just for the consumables. But ZOS couldn't offer new Starter Packs forever. The value of the collectibles included would be diminished by all the consumables we weren't using. So, crates. We're still getting consumables, but we're self-managing our inventory of them with the gem option.

Even if a lot of us are treating crates like the Starter Packs and focusing more on the collectibles, ZOS can say that there's a strong interest in consumables. It's functionally true if we continue to buy crates.

And then we get more consumables because there's continued interest in consumables. It doesn't matter if we call them crappy potions and scrolls after we get them. They've turned their otherwise weakest product category into possibly the strongest contender for our crowns.

If only we could make hybrids that viable in the actual game...

idk

Krayl wrote: »

its funny to me that people are celebrating this.

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

If you believe that in this day and age a game company can afford to carry a staff capable of continuous content development and still have no required monthly fee to rely on, you're going to be sadly mistaken.

This concept that the crown store is some greedy zero-cost money pit for ZOS is sad/funny.

This. They will make bank one way or another. (I don’t buy crates). They cannot slip back to requiring subscriptions.

Davor

ZOS is a private company? So they are a parent company then. I am sure Zenimax is a publicly traded company. If I am wrong thank you for the clarification @Juju_beans. As for where I get my stats from? Common sense? After all Zenimax is a company that wants to make money. They sue other companies to make money. They also make stuff in the crown store for as little as possible and sell it as much as the market will bear. So if they can sell one item that takes say a week to make and sell it for the same cost of the base game that would mean they would do more of this if it sold. So since they are not sold and are in crates and or time exclusive tells me that they don't sell.

So common sense. Does common sense say this the other way? If so, I don't see it. Not saying I am wrong but it's my opinion which I forgot to say. Sorry for that and listing it as fact. I apologize for it.


@Pheefs about the duckies at a carnival, thing is you have to earn it by your own competence. The loot boxes are like an instant scratch ticket hoping to get the biggest prize.

If anything should be compared to then that would be card collections. Baseball/hockey cards Magic the Gathering. That is like buying a loot box with no money being returned from the company selling them.

Thing is I never herd of companies who do this prey on kids for gambling. Maybe I am wrong all this time and this is/was a bad practice after all. So it if is, then that doesn't mean it's right.

We play video games. Companies make video games. Companies shouldn't be making video games in order to make money from gambling.

So in the end what are we playing? IS ESO a video game or is ESO a video game made in order for Zenimax Online Studios to make money from gambling? After all people keep saying the DLC and Expansons is not enough to keep ESO alive.

Reistr_the_Unbroken

Glurin wrote: »

This whole argument started, or at least went mainstream, because EA likes to put actual in game progression behind loot box pay walls. With horrendous odds of success no less. That's something ZoS does not do.

Imagine if you started ESO with the DK class, and all other classes had to be unlocked via crown crates. Each class having say, 5% chance at best of showing up, with some arbitrary class like wardens having a less than 1% chance. In addition, in order to use weapons other than sword and board, you have to buy crown crates. Two handed and restoration staves have a 10% chance of appearing, bows have maybe 4%, and destruction staves maybe 1%. Dual wield, well, you have better odds of winning the state lottery, which you would have to do to have the money to buy enough crown crates to get dual wield.

Want to do some crafting? Great! Just buy some crown crates. Each crafting skill line has a whole 2% chance of being in the crate, except jewelry crafting because it's new and exciting, so we're giving that a .01% chance.

What's that? You bought the Dark Brotherhood DLC? Wonderful! Of course the only way to level that skill line is to buy special dark brotherhood crown crates and hope to get a contract to drop from one of them.

That's the kind of *** EA pulls all the time, and is the primary reason loot boxes have become targets. It's no surprise they would be the ones balking at the Belgium ruling.

Crown crates, by comparison, are quite harmless and a good source of revenue. Especially considering that they have mechanisms in place to enable you to get the specific items you want before you go spending your life savings. Aside from the crate only mounts of course, which I think are a mistake on ZoS's part and is akin to them putting their toe over the line. Same goes for any gem only content.

EA is why I don’t touch my Star Wars Battlefront 2 game ever.

Glurin

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

Glurin wrote: »

This whole argument started, or at least went mainstream, because EA likes to put actual in game progression behind loot box pay walls. With horrendous odds of success no less. That's something ZoS does not do.

Imagine if you started ESO with the DK class, and all other classes had to be unlocked via crown crates. Each class having say, 5% chance at best of showing up, with some arbitrary class like wardens having a less than 1% chance. In addition, in order to use weapons other than sword and board, you have to buy crown crates. Two handed and restoration staves have a 10% chance of appearing, bows have maybe 4%, and destruction staves maybe 1%. Dual wield, well, you have better odds of winning the state lottery, which you would have to do to have the money to buy enough crown crates to get dual wield.

Want to do some crafting? Great! Just buy some crown crates. Each crafting skill line has a whole 2% chance of being in the crate, except jewelry crafting because it's new and exciting, so we're giving that a .01% chance.

What's that? You bought the Dark Brotherhood DLC? Wonderful! Of course the only way to level that skill line is to buy special dark brotherhood crown crates and hope to get a contract to drop from one of them.

That's the kind of *** EA pulls all the time, and is the primary reason loot boxes have become targets. It's no surprise they would be the ones balking at the Belgium ruling.

Crown crates, by comparison, are quite harmless and a good source of revenue. Especially considering that they have mechanisms in place to enable you to get the specific items you want before you go spending your life savings. Aside from the crate only mounts of course, which I think are a mistake on ZoS's part and is akin to them putting their toe over the line. Same goes for any gem only content.

EA is why I don’t touch my Star Wars Battlefront 2 game ever.

It's the reason what interest I had in that one went up in smoke the moment I heard about it.

Oh, I also forgot to mention that in order to make my example an accurate comparison, the only way to level your class skills, crafting skills, and weapon skills is to buy more crown crates and get duplicates.

Yeah, you heard me. You've finally gotten your sorcerer from a crown crate, but he's stuck at level 1 until you get another sorcerer from a crown crate. God help you if you want to get far enough along to actually use an ultimate ability.

idk

Davor wrote: »

ZOS is a private company? So they are a parent company then. I am sure Zenimax is a publicly traded company. If I am wrong thank you for the clarification @Juju_beans. As for where I get my stats from? Common sense? After all Zenimax is a company that wants to make money. They sue other companies to make money. They also make stuff in the crown store for as little as possible and sell it as much as the market will bear. So if they can sell one item that takes say a week to make and sell it for the same cost of the base game that would mean they would do more of this if it sold. So since they are not sold and are in crates and or time exclusive tells me that they don't sell.

So common sense. Does common sense say this the other way? If so, I don't see it. Not saying I am wrong but it's my opinion which I forgot to say. Sorry for that and listing it as fact. I apologize for it.


@Pheefs about the duckies at a carnival, thing is you have to earn it by your own competence. The loot boxes are like an instant scratch ticket hoping to get the biggest prize.

If anything should be compared to then that would be card collections. Baseball/hockey cards Magic the Gathering. That is like buying a loot box with no money being returned from the company selling them.

Thing is I never herd of companies who do this prey on kids for gambling. Maybe I am wrong all this time and this is/was a bad practice after all. So it if is, then that doesn't mean it's right.

We play video games. Companies make video games. Companies shouldn't be making video games in order to make money from gambling.

So in the end what are we playing? IS ESO a video game or is ESO a video game made in order for Zenimax Online Studios to make money from gambling? After all people keep saying the DLC and Expansons is not enough to keep ESO alive.

Your wrong. It helps to google things first.

Zenimax, the parent company, is private. It’s not publicly traded.

Hokiewa

Davor wrote: »

ZOS is a private company? So they are a parent company then. I am sure Zenimax is a publicly traded company. If I am wrong thank you for the clarification @Juju_beans. As for where I get my stats from? Common sense? After all Zenimax is a company that wants to make money. They sue other companies to make money. They also make stuff in the crown store for as little as possible and sell it as much as the market will bear. So if they can sell one item that takes say a week to make and sell it for the same cost of the base game that would mean they would do more of this if it sold. So since they are not sold and are in crates and or time exclusive tells me that they don't sell.

So common sense. Does common sense say this the other way? If so, I don't see it. Not saying I am wrong but it's my opinion which I forgot to say. Sorry for that and listing it as fact. I apologize for it.


@Pheefs about the duckies at a carnival, thing is you have to earn it by your own competence. The loot boxes are like an instant scratch ticket hoping to get the biggest prize.

If anything should be compared to then that would be card collections. Baseball/hockey cards Magic the Gathering. That is like buying a loot box with no money being returned from the company selling them.

Thing is I never herd of companies who do this prey on kids for gambling. Maybe I am wrong all this time and this is/was a bad practice after all. So it if is, then that doesn't mean it's right.

We play video games. Companies make video games. Companies shouldn't be making video games in order to make money from gambling.

So in the end what are we playing? IS ESO a video game or is ESO a video game made in order for Zenimax Online Studios to make money from gambling? After all people keep saying the DLC and Expansons is not enough to keep ESO alive.

There is so much factually wrong with this. Too much to type but I can assure you Zenimax is a privately owned company and not publicly traded.

Sevn

Davor wrote: »

Krayl wrote: »

its funny to me that people are celebrating this.

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

If you believe that in this day and age a game company can afford to carry a staff capable of continuous content development and still have no required monthly fee to rely on, you're going to be sadly mistaken.

This concept that the crown store is some greedy zero-cost money pit for ZOS is sad/funny.

So you are saying that ZOS is a company that makes a video game so people can gamble then, instead of a company that makes video games. If the DLC and expansions can't sustain ESO then ESO should be shut down. Perfect example given as to why ZOS is not a gaming company but a gambling company.

So the many players who don't require the shinies from the crown store or are responsible enough to say no thanks should have their livelihood come to a halt because you don't like crown crates?

Wouldn't a more appropriate option be you just find another game that does everything you want? Unbelievable.

Numerikuu

Kadoin wrote: »

I honestly will never understand how anyone can be addicted to gambling and need regulation to protect themselves from it. I really won't.

It's targeted psychological manipulation. The rush/high said addicted person experiences when getting an item they're after (or a rare or whatever) is no different to the high that drug addicts and daredevils chase.

Jim Sterling did a few videos on this topic explaining exactly how loot boxes/crates work, how these companies have studied and perfected their effects, and aimed them specifically at those most vulnerable. Don't get me started on them targeting children and grooming them to be addicts in the future.

This has been a long time coming. If the gaming industry won't regulate itself? Then someone has to.

Androconium

Turelus wrote: »

Let's wait and see what happens first before we start declaring victory.

The fact it's at least being investigated and looked into actively though is a nice start. Also remember that companies could always up the prices of items to offset the loss from loot boxes, victories could fast become defeats.

Also remember that you are on the Company's side.

Androconium

Hokiewa wrote: »

LordSarevok wrote: »

idk wrote: »

LordSarevok wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Premature to think ESO will have to ditch crates. If anything, smart companies will make adjustments if needed. Cash shop will still be strong revenue regardless.

Not premature to think this. Belgium is charging EA with criminal misconduct for not complying. The fact that EA pushed harder has caused 15 other countries to follow suite.

It’s is nothing but premature conjecture.

Belgium is only one country
Charges are meaningless. It’s the end result, which can be substantial or absolutely nothing, that matter.

Any arm chair attorney can tell you that much. Basically your counting your chickens before they hatch.

It may be premature conjecture of the outcome on the criminal prosecution. Yet it is not when the country has passed laws and all other gaming companies have already complied. It is not conjecture in to say in that in Belgium loot box's are illegal, and will not exist in their current format. All other companies have made loot box's earn able in game.

It's premature period. Gaming companies always evolve and what happens in a tiny country is certainly not precedent for the entire world. Again, be careful what you wish for, especially if you live in a small country where the gamer population is relatively low compared to the rest of the world. It may not work out the way you think

All other companies have most certainly not complied otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussion btw. I got what, 15 free crates last month for nothing more then logging in?

Really? Go back and review Fallout 3's history.
If the issue is significant enough, they'll change.

pdebie64b16_ESO

I hope loot boxes got banned from MMO games, for ESO make those loot boxes awards exclusive to ESO+ members in a quest form/event or something like that on a regular base like every month a chance to get an Apex Mount.

Simple math: 15 crown crates cost 5000 crowns, 5500 crowns cost almost 40 dollar, ESO+ cost 41.99 dollar for a 3 month subscription.

Win Win situation for ZOS and players without wasting real life money on gambling and RNG.

leepalmer95

greenmachine wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

...remember that companies could always up the prices of items to offset the loss from loot boxes, victories could fast become defeats.

No, no, no I'm sure the shareholders of the company will understand that profits are just going to be lower. I'm sure they'll be cool with that. They wouldn't raise the prices of the games, or dlc, or in-game items to make up their lost money. They wouldn't cut funding for servers, or staff, or maintenance. Keep in mind, they invested in the company for the love of the lore, and the fun, and the spirit of MMOs in general. They'll sacrifice for us as they always have. It's time to celebrate!

They could just be good companies and make a good game with good quality dlc's then offer set price cosmetics.

Not every game company decided to feed off people weakness to gambling to make money.

Androconium

Acrolas wrote: »

The EU is probably singling out EA and FIFA because soccer is far more popular across the pond, and because your luck with FIFA loot boxes directly affects your in-game performance. With the game's E rating, that would be predatory as you're coercing minors into a P2W situation.

EA also has physical offices in many of these countries, making the company easier to directly legislate per region.

But ZOS is fine for now, as "France and England have both criticized loot boxes, but say they don't violate gambling laws."

Governing Law.

For residents of North America, these Terms of Service and all Disputes (as defined in Section 15 above) shall be governed by the laws of the State of Maryland, USA, excluding its conflicts of laws rules and principles that would result in another State or country's laws applying to these Terms of Service or any Disputes.

If You reside outside of North America, then these Terms of Service and all Disputes shall be governed by the laws of England, excluding its conflicts-of-law rules and principles that would result in another State or country's laws applying to these Terms of Service or any Disputes.
https://www.abcactionnews.com/newsy/ea-is-reportedly-under-investigation-in-belgium-for-use-of-loot-boxes


I don't see any path for conflicts of law to apply here. It's not just a matter of "Belgum says, so Belgium wins". There has to be substantial evidence that Belgium is more deserving and relevant of a jurisdiction to determine the outcome than the status quo (England).

If a certain US state steps in, that's different. That's why sweepstakes aren't available to certain individuals in certain states. But I think before all's done, there will be a distinction in loot boxes. Those where randomness is a major factor affecting an individual's competitiveness in game content, and those where randomness provides no competitive advantage in game content.

And because of all the "this crate season is nothing but crap" threads, I think we've determined that the heat on Crown Crates is much more about not being able to get a passive collectible that you would have used crowns on anyway than anything that impacts in-game skill or success.

Hot air.

Everything you have said here is a moot point, if a nation changes its legislation that bans the use of in game gambling, then the likely outcome is the product itself will be banned from sale in those countries.

The legislation of MD and the UK will still apply.

You are also forgetting that the debate around gaming addiction is hotting up and sooner, rather than later it will become a political issue. Politicians do not like to be unemployed.

leepalmer95

Sergykid wrote: »

they can't ban the gambling in games, that way they should close all types of casinos or slot games. They will just add one more row at the game's description: "contains gambling"

They certainly can.

At the very least games with gambling will come with M+ ratings and there will be a big sign that there is irl gambling in the game.

Casino's only allow adults and there is all sorts of gambling laws and rules, loot boxes are basically online gambling in game but are too new for laws and restrictions to have been set.

Greedy companies jumped on the easy and downright lazy money because of the fact there wasn't many laws.

Pretty sure parents would think completely different if a game they went to buy for their kids had a big fat 'contains irl addictive gambling' writing over it.

UrQuan

lagrue wrote: »

DanteYoda wrote: »

Sergykid wrote: »

they can't ban the gambling in games, that way they should close all types of casinos or slot games. They will just add one more row at the game's description: "contains gambling"

Slots and casinos are not aiming at children and under age minors.. Game companies are.

Funny because the vast majority of games out there with loot boxes are rated T or M games not intended for child audiences.

I have yet to see a kid's game offer this feature.

have you heard of Fifa? It's EA's big cash cow, one of the worst examples of predatory loot boxes, one of the main games driving different gambling commissions to directly address loot boxes, and it's rated E for Everyone. I think you need to be at least 11 or 12 to play the Ultimate Team Mode, which is where the loot boxes come in, but still. It's clearly aimed at kids - they're a huge portion of the player base, and EA is fleecing them.

Acrolas wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

The only reason ZOS is able to release DLC and Expansions is because they are making money from crown crates and the store.

More content is released because there's continued interest in new content.
New collectibles are released because there's continued interest in new collectibles.

Both types are budgeted. Neither are a reflection of the revenue stream they carve.


But crates are more related to the renewable items that ZOS regularly struggles to generate interest in - consumables. Nobody really batted an eye at the Starter Packs, and I'm guessing very few people bought those just for the consumables. But ZOS couldn't offer new Starter Packs forever. The value of the collectibles included would be diminished by all the consumables we weren't using. So, crates. We're still getting consumables, but we're self-managing our inventory of them with the gem option.

Even if a lot of us are treating crates like the Starter Packs and focusing more on the collectibles, ZOS can say that there's a strong interest in consumables. It's functionally true if we continue to buy crates.

And then we get more consumables because there's continued interest in consumables. It doesn't matter if we call them crappy potions and scrolls after we get them. They've turned their otherwise weakest product category into possibly the strongest contender for our crowns.

If only we could make hybrids that viable in the actual game...

FYI @Acrolas your quoting got messed up somewhere. I wasn't the one who said what you quoted.

Androconium

Juju_beans wrote: »

I've never liked the thought of "We're the government and we're here to help".
Not everyone is so irresponsible that they need the government to intervene to protect them from themselves.

It's not a case of being protected from yourself.

It's a case of being protected from predatory marketing.

Let's not forget, that the only thing you ever buy here is a temporary licence to use software.
The rest of it is intangible and not a physical product.

Androconium

Reistr_the_Unbroken wrote: »

All I was stating is that Blizzard has the gamble crates, but with ZoS you could buy what you wanted with the gems you saved up.

When you redeem crate items for gems, you only get a third of their 'value'.
That makes buying with gems 3 times more expensive.
You can only get gems from crate purchases.

yay gems.

Glurin

Androconium wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

I've never liked the thought of "We're the government and we're here to help".
Not everyone is so irresponsible that they need the government to intervene to protect them from themselves.

It's not a case of being protected from yourself.

It's a case of being protected from predatory marketing.

In other words, "We're the government and we're here to help protect you from yourself."