Is Swift balanced?

_Ahala_

Swift is fine as is

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

_Ahala_ wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

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Ragnarock41 wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

or changing swift so its stil %10 but only works with sprint.

I would be okay with this, good suggestion. The only char I use swift on is my magDK so I can sprint faster, so that would be fine for me.

I think it would put it in line with other options.

I'd say that'd make swift worthless

Better to have such a thing worthless than an absolute must have on any build.

Better to have such a thing balanced than to make it completely worthless... just look at sun shield, cliff racer, trapping webs, fire rune, impulse, blade cloak, wrecking blow, wings, siphoning strikes, frag, rune prison, streak, and eye of flame if you want examples...

Instead of asking for nerfs to swift you should be asking for range buffs for class skills to 7m and 2h skills to 10m and asking zos to fix their targeting system...

Not everyone wants to crawl around permasnared and get devoured by heavy armor zergs or be denied the ability to kite completely because zos decided to deny snare immunity to anyone not wearing medium armor or using forward momentum or reflective plate and then put powerful snares on half of the abilities in the game (including a mgap closer because why not)

If swift gets nerfed and snares don’t that’s just gonna be another buff to zergs

Again, I don't feel the need to explain. You'll understand me when those ''heavy armor zergs'' start using it themselves and only then you will realize that it has became a crutch. The sheep are slow learners, but they will adapt eventually, and when they do, it will be quite fun to watch.

Your right... swift in its current form is a crutch... Im just defending it because in a game full of snares and lacking in snare immunity Magden is left with a broken leg... have you tried playing a Magden... trying to aim Deep Fissure while ensnared and rooted every second is absolutely infuriating... and trying to escape a zerg is impossible without allies to Spider-Man to... if Magden got a form of class snare/root immunity that didn’t require it to get brutally murdered by anyone using a Magdk or the only real stam ult then I wouldn’t really care if swift stayed as 10% or became 7.5% or 5% per piece

josh.lackey_ESO

Swift should be 7.5% per jewelry piece

Emma_Overload wrote: »

You know what the REAL problem is? Forward Momentum.

If you want to nerf something, nerf Forward Momentum, because it gives an insane advantage to Stamina over Magicka builds. I'm sick and tired of being snared and rooted all the time, but MY Encase has no effect whatsoever except to waste my magicka.

I have just given in and run a 2h on my Mag Sorc just for Forward Momentum. Can't go back to playing with perma snares and roots.

The solution for Forward Momentum is to cap speed at 100% normal move speed while you are immune to snares and roots. So you could be immune and still move at a normal speed, but you couldn't be immune and move at super speed.

ManDraKE

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Swift is fine because it can be easily countered... just roll some Swift traits yourself!

You know what the REAL problem is? Forward Momentum.

If you want to nerf something, nerf Forward Momentum, because it gives an insane advantage to Stamina over Magicka builds. I'm sick and tired of being snared and rooted all the time, but MY Encase has no effect whatsoever except to waste my magicka.

sure, i take a nerf of forward momentum if magika takes a nerf on healing ward. With it they can recover from pretty much any burst in 1 click and that´s why fighting magblades or magsorcs is incredible boring and frustrating, they can make a millon mistakes during the fight and still recover from pretty much anything (while negating penetration and crit damage), i can spam executes in a low health target clutching on healing ward and not get the kill, is probably the only thing on the game that can easliy save you when you are in execute range, not even block is that effective. Reduce the insane scaling in shield size with low health and increase the cost to avoid people being carried just by spamming 1 button, do we have a deal?

Stamina survability is 100% dependant of mobility, a nerf to FW will probably hurt more than a nerf to vigor. FW is not the problem, speed stacking with a combat system that doesn't really work well with fast moving targets is.

Joy_Division

Swift is fine as is

cpuScientist wrote: »

Amdar_Godkiller wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

ESO_GOD wrote: »

oxygen_thief wrote: »

most bgs modes are broken cause of swift. try to catch prem group which has ball and runs faster than horse. with every new patch this game is getting worse. devs dont know what they are doing

Swift was actually a great addition, it's made the game more fun.

You want to know how ot counter swift? Run swift, yourself.

Your post itself is a proof as to why swift needs a slight nerf.

When the only counter to something is using it yourself, that means its time for the nerf hammer.

Running Swift is not the only counter to Swift, though.

Roots and snares SHOULD be counters to Swift (or any speed boosting mechanic), but they aren't very effective because of.... wait for it.... Forward Momentum and Shuffle. if you want to nerf something, nerf FM and Shuffle, then ALL of us will be on equal footing.

Forward momentum needs a nerf because it grants a CC immunity duration thats far too long for the cost. It's so powerful that it's become a part of many mag builds just based on cost-benefit analysis.

Shuffle OTOH is expensive, and grants hardly any CC immunity duration. It's much easier to spam dodge roll than it is to spam shuffle. It's probably the single skill in this game most in need of a buff besides soul trap and the Tangled Webs skill from the Undaunted skill line. A reduced cost at the very least is long past due.

Well not CC immunity immibilize immunity. Such as snares and roots. They can still be CC'd.

The problem I usually see when people are chasing is you have a few guys just spamming CC like a Sorc just spamming cage, but with no follow up planned. Like they will rune cage then nothing. Basically giving a free immunity. Or javelin but had nothing to follow up with. Then they get their pot and it's an immov so they good to go and get away.

DON'T GIVE FREE CC IMMUNITY, public service announcement.

I'm a Templar. It's what we do.

Stigant

Ranger209 wrote: »

...8-9 meters per second which real world is fairly slow.

Is it? Irl top athletes do 100m under 10s... that puts you at 10m per sec... and that's sprinting with no encunbrance, straight forward and only very short time... is 8-9 m per sec fully geared and carrying a weapon in your hand fairly slow? I'd say it's top Spartan level of physique

rfennell_ESO

Option 4 made my IQ go down... I'm suing

The problem with swift is it makes all my alts without it feel like they are walking. It's literally pain inducing to have to go to crafting stations on my magsorc who is in light armor and lacking swift.

Ranger209

Swift is fine as is

Stigant wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

...8-9 meters per second which real world is fairly slow.

Is it? Irl top athletes do 100m under 10s... that puts you at 10m per sec... and that's sprinting with no encunbrance, straight forward and only very short time... is 8-9 m per sec fully geared and carrying a weapon in your hand fairly slow? I'd say it's top Spartan level of physique

top athletes are clocked at 12.0m per second and above, average is 7 to 8. They aren't leaving the blocks at full speed, they start at 0 and go 100 meters in 10 seconds. So even fully buffed and sprinting you are just only as fast as the fastest humans.

Stigant

Ranger209 wrote: »

Stigant wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

...8-9 meters per second which real world is fairly slow.

Is it? Irl top athletes do 100m under 10s... that puts you at 10m per sec... and that's sprinting with no encunbrance, straight forward and only very short time... is 8-9 m per sec fully geared and carrying a weapon in your hand fairly slow? I'd say it's top Spartan level of physique

top athletes are clocked at 12.0m per second and above, average is 7 to 8. They aren't leaving the blocks at full speed, they start at 0 and go 100 meters in 10 seconds. So even fully buffed and sprinting you are just only as fast as the fastest humans.

Only difference being the encunbrance and range of motion restriction caused by wearing an armor/clothing and weapon/s in your hand/s... I was just surprised by the statement that 8-9 m per sec is fairly slow, because when you factored the above it's actually quite fast movement.

Arthg

Ranger209 wrote: »

Stigant wrote: »

Ranger209 wrote: »

...8-9 meters per second which real world is fairly slow.

Is it? Irl top athletes do 100m under 10s... that puts you at 10m per sec... and that's sprinting with no encunbrance, straight forward and only very short time... is 8-9 m per sec fully geared and carrying a weapon in your hand fairly slow? I'd say it's top Spartan level of physique

top athletes are clocked at 12.0m per second and above, average is 7 to 8. They aren't leaving the blocks at full speed, they start at 0 and go 100 meters in 10 seconds. So even fully buffed and sprinting you are just only as fast as the fastest humans.

7m/s is crazy fast, that's more than 25km/h.
It's roughly the speed of the world record for the one-mile-race (7.22m/s).
Fastest marathon runners hit 5.6m/s or so, i.e. almost 20km/h - for 42kms.

Ragnarock41

Buff Swift. It's 2018, there has to be a troll option

_Ahala_ wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

_Ahala_ wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

.

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

The Uninvited wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

or changing swift so its stil %10 but only works with sprint.

I would be okay with this, good suggestion. The only char I use swift on is my magDK so I can sprint faster, so that would be fine for me.

I think it would put it in line with other options.

I'd say that'd make swift worthless

Better to have such a thing worthless than an absolute must have on any build.

Better to have such a thing balanced than to make it completely worthless... just look at sun shield, cliff racer, trapping webs, fire rune, impulse, blade cloak, wrecking blow, wings, siphoning strikes, frag, rune prison, streak, and eye of flame if you want examples...

Instead of asking for nerfs to swift you should be asking for range buffs for class skills to 7m and 2h skills to 10m and asking zos to fix their targeting system...

Not everyone wants to crawl around permasnared and get devoured by heavy armor zergs or be denied the ability to kite completely because zos decided to deny snare immunity to anyone not wearing medium armor or using forward momentum or reflective plate and then put powerful snares on half of the abilities in the game (including a mgap closer because why not)

If swift gets nerfed and snares don’t that’s just gonna be another buff to zergs

Again, I don't feel the need to explain. You'll understand me when those ''heavy armor zergs'' start using it themselves and only then you will realize that it has became a crutch. The sheep are slow learners, but they will adapt eventually, and when they do, it will be quite fun to watch.

Your right... swift in its current form is a crutch... Im just defending it because in a game full of snares and lacking in snare immunity Magden is left with a broken leg... have you tried playing a Magden... trying to aim Deep Fissure while ensnared and rooted every second is absolutely infuriating... and trying to escape a zerg is impossible without allies to Spider-Man to... if Magden got a form of class snare/root immunity that didn’t require it to get brutally murdered by anyone using a Magdk or the only real stam ult then I wouldn’t really care if swift stayed as 10% or became 7.5% or 5% per piece

Snares need much more nerfing(Im against the idea of giving every class snare immunity, I think the right answer is limiting the uptime on those strong snares and making a minor/major system so zergs can't stack tons of snares on you. I think snares are especially cancer when they are on range skills. Stuff like caltrops , rearming trap, mines, warden ice shards etc feel balanced BUT , something like flying blade having a snare is just stupid to me.

I feel disturbed with how cheap mobility is nowadays, snare immunity and mobility should be an identity for medium armor users but instead everyone has those things now.

I hate to admit but FM is also waaaay to powerful on that regard, but it comes at the cost of losing your only burst heal, so nerfing it too much will just kill the ability and it might kill heavy armor meta for any stam class that isn't a Dk.(thats cause Dks get snare immunity from wings now).

So in a nutshell, Im not happy with mobility creep making telehraphed/cast timed abilities useless, but I think giving everyone the same will not solve that problem in the end.

Snares should work from time to time otherwise some builds and playstyled become useless as result.

Not to mention ground based ults like nova/standart suffer as a result of everyone running like sanic.