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Damage Shields really need to be reworked
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Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
Have I tried it? That's literally how I play my magSorc. The only shields I use are Hardened ward and healing ward, and I survive just fine. So yes, any competent player can survive just fine without shield stacking. Shield stacking is just broken OP.
Um, that IS shield stacking.Minalan owes me a beer.
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Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.3 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality
Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0 -
usmguy1234✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
Have I tried it? That's literally how I play my magSorc. The only shields I use are Hardened ward and healing ward, and I survive just fine. So yes, any competent player can survive just fine without shield stacking. Shield stacking is just broken OP.
By the time you manage to(or fail to in this case) stack a shield on another one, the first is mostly gone if your opponent has any idea of what they're doing. Shield stacking is fine - the whacky performance of harness' regen is not, but that's an entirely separate matter.
If it's really the damage absorption of a hardened + harness that's giving anyone trouble, then they're just plain lacking in damage/can't deal with being kited/failing to weave skills well enough. It's not hard to match the sorc skill for skill, in which case your skill + la should be tearing down the shields almost as fast as, or faster than they can come up.
What is this? Common sense on the forums?Edited by usmguy1234 on June 17, 2018 12:41AMZaghigoth- Orc Stamplar
Soul Razor- Altmer Magsorc
Les Drago- Redguard Stamdk
Eirius- Altmer Magdk
Stormifeth- Altmer Magplar
Disclaimer: My comments are a little sarcasm mixed with truth. If you can't handle that don't respond to me.1 -
usmguy1234✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Stacking in to a single resource doesn't make a viable build... you'll be lacking somewhere. My functional sorc build for pvp has 47k magicka without undaunted. Harness + hardened gives me about 18k worth of shield with 100 in to bastion. Those shields aren't even enough to stand an incap weave. The damage is enough to dip in to about 1/4 of my health.
I can comprehend how people have so much trouble with shield stacks because mine melt like butter. I have max cp and what I feel like is decent champ point spread.Zaghigoth- Orc Stamplar
Soul Razor- Altmer Magsorc
Les Drago- Redguard Stamdk
Eirius- Altmer Magdk
Stormifeth- Altmer Magplar
Disclaimer: My comments are a little sarcasm mixed with truth. If you can't handle that don't respond to me.0 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Kinda interesting how it always has been predominantly NBs complaining about other classes and calling for nerfs.
Pot calling the kettle black...
Best designed class in the game has horrible players that want more quick kills where the other guy can’t fight back.
You know why stacked shields are so bad to forumblades? Because a Sorc with two shields can go offensive for 2-3 GCD instead of spamming one shield button over and over to prevent instant death.
If you can’t kill a shield Sorc with incap strike, defile, and a 20% damage buff for SIX seconds, the problem isn’t shields. I mean, what, do you need 40% damage for six seconds? Major fracture too? A 99% snare for 60 seconds?
Magsorc's will, and should get the nerf hammer soon. It's quite overdue. Oh and yes I'm expecting them to revert Incap back to its original stun mechanic. Also overdue in my opinion.
But yes, anyone with a working pair of eyeballs can observe that shield stacking is vastly over-performing. I doubt they're going to do anything about it though even though this is an endemic issue in this game. Still, one can hope.
Jesus haven't Sorcs been nerfed enough? Guess you haven't played very long. It's honestly NB's time for a nerf.2 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Kinda interesting how it always has been predominantly NBs complaining about other classes and calling for nerfs.
Pot calling the kettle black...
Best designed class in the game has horrible players that want more quick kills where the other guy can’t fight back.
You know why stacked shields are so bad to forumblades? Because a Sorc with two shields can go offensive for 2-3 GCD instead of spamming one shield button over and over to prevent instant death.
If you can’t kill a shield Sorc with incap strike, defile, and a 20% damage buff for SIX seconds, the problem isn’t shields. I mean, what, do you need 40% damage for six seconds? Major fracture too? A 99% snare for 60 seconds?
Magsorc's will, and should get the nerf hammer soon. It's quite overdue. Oh and yes I'm expecting them to revert Incap back to its original stun mechanic. Also overdue in my opinion.
But yes, anyone with a working pair of eyeballs can observe that shield stacking is vastly over-performing. I doubt they're going to do anything about it though even though this is an endemic issue in this game. Still, one can hope.
Jesus haven't Sorcs been nerfed enough? Guess you haven't played very long. It's honestly NB's time for a nerf.
They’re first on the list if anyone needs a nerf. But let’s be honest, they don’t need any adjustments as much as non-nb’s need to learn how to play.
The issue is: Nightblade is THE best designed class in this game. Stealth. Strong up-front burst. Best debuffs of any class. Everything is smooth and works together. You can go on murder sprees in Cyrodiil with bad gear and unmorphed skills.
The players who run it are (consequently?) the loudest on the forums about destroying every other class but their own. People need to bring some perspective here, the only difference on Sorcerer this patch is the rune cage thing, which should probably be a DOT. Fix that.Edited by Minalan on June 17, 2018 8:03AM2 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.Edited by pieratsos on June 17, 2018 8:46AM1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
Dark Exchange and the Twilight are your burst heals. Critical Sure is your HoT. Crystal Frags when proc'd is a hard hitting instant cast like the spectral bow except you can use it more often. Instant cast spammable? Use Crushing Shock or Elemental Weapons.
You already have the tools to have great survivability without shield stacking.
I am talking about PvP here. PvP where you eventually have to slot damaging skills as well, not double barring a (2 hits => dead) pet and use a plethora of PvE stuff just to keep you alive.Edited by Vahrokh on June 17, 2018 10:29AMVaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!
Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
Here is the Sorcerer Helper addon I have updated to work on current ESO0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.
Vigor and rally scale with weapon damage and the healing CP star, should we change that too?2 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Kinda interesting how it always has been predominantly NBs complaining about other classes and calling for nerfs.
Pot calling the kettle black...
Best designed class in the game has horrible players that want more quick kills where the other guy can’t fight back.
You know why stacked shields are so bad to forumblades? Because a Sorc with two shields can go offensive for 2-3 GCD instead of spamming one shield button over and over to prevent instant death.
If you can’t kill a shield Sorc with incap strike, defile, and a 20% damage buff for SIX seconds, the problem isn’t shields. I mean, what, do you need 40% damage for six seconds? Major fracture too? A 99% snare for 60 seconds?
Magsorc's will, and should get the nerf hammer soon. It's quite overdue. Oh and yes I'm expecting them to revert Incap back to its original stun mechanic. Also overdue in my opinion.
But yes, anyone with a working pair of eyeballs can observe that shield stacking is vastly over-performing. I doubt they're going to do anything about it though even though this is an endemic issue in this game. Still, one can hope.
Jesus haven't Sorcs been nerfed enough? Guess you haven't played very long. It's honestly NB's time for a nerf.
They’re first on the list if anyone needs a nerf. But let’s be honest, they don’t need any adjustments as much as non-nb’s need to learn how to play.
The issue is: Nightblade is THE best designed class in this game. Stealth. Strong up-front burst. Best debuffs of any class. Everything is smooth and works together. You can go on murder sprees in Cyrodiil with bad gear and unmorphed skills.
The players who run it are (consequently?) the loudest on the forums about destroying every other class but their own. People need to bring some perspective here, the only difference on Sorcerer this patch is the rune cage thing, which should probably be a DOT. Fix that.
Honestly I don't find rune cage to be OP, it is strong but I have folks live thru it all the time. Hell I live thru it most of the time as well. Thing is if someone has immunity then the rotation is screwed and the Sorc is in a bad spot. It really forces opponents to use some skill against Sorcs now instead of mindless skill spamming. There are counters folks just have to learn to use them. I've meet plenty of players that have already adjusted and I can't land a rune cage. You know the funny thing is we always complain that ZOS nerf some skill thats a classes has to fix an in-balance. Well this time they didn't they buffed a classes to fix issues with perm dodge and perm block and these board still complain.Edited by bardx86 on June 17, 2018 8:57PM0 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.
It does. Healing can be lowered beyond base though.
Healing has defiles that trump the buff sections of it, since defiles are post other buffs and the other healing buffs are not very easily accessible.
Shields are quite strong Xv1, (shield users being the X, me being the 1, I know shields are weak when outnumbered yourself) and no opportunity to soft counter and whittle away at them as you can heals often means you either have to ignore them, or throw a lot of resources into them. If shields had mending amps, and defile debuffs, that would allow you to buff/debuff shields lower/higher than current level.
Defenses without soft counters are bad design. Defenses with hard counters are bad design too, so SB/sloads will be gone
To balance this mobility buffs would be useful, it wouldn't just be an indiscriminate nerf, it'd be a rebalance to add softcounters to something that currently lacks it and then give more flavor to sorcs by buffing another part of them.MagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.0 -
Anti_Virus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.
It's called defile.Power Wealth And Influence.1 -
Anti_Virus✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Dark Exchange and the Twilight are your burst heals. Critical Sure is your HoT. Crystal Frags when proc'd is a hard hitting instant cast like the spectral bow except you can use it more often. Instant cast spammable? Use Crushing Shock or Elemental Weapons.
You already have the tools to have great survivability without shield stacking.
I am talking about PvP here. PvP where you eventually have to slot damaging skills as well, not double barring a (2 hits => dead) pet and use a plethora of PvE stuff just to keep you alive.
@bardx86
funny enough a lot of sorcs argue that rune cage isn't OP and people need to adapt, but when the idea of fixing shield stacking comes up and people suggest class skills that heal mag sorc all of a sudden it's a problem to adapt.
kinda funny.Power Wealth And Influence.1 -
Galarthor✭✭✭✭✭
✭But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
If anything that is a disadvantage. You have to make sacrifices to get a decent defensive tool. You dont have to make any such sacrifices for cloak, dodge, block, and even healing is not punished as harshly as it scales from both max magicka and spell damage which allows for some degree of diversification.
Stacking into max magicka means you will have to sacrifices spell damge, spell pen, or regen. The first two make the sorc less dangerous on the offensive, the latter is deadly to sorc b/c once the resource is gone it's gone. You can't get it back quickly. For cloak, dodge, block you won't have to make such sacrifices. You can go for a lot of regen allowing you to spam this already more powerful defensive abilities even more. Or you could go full spell / weapon damage and pen making you deal a lot more damage. Or you could create a well balanced build that got damage + regen. Something that shield users can't to that extent.
The fact that you are here whining about how sorc's defensive tool scales of the max magicka while your's does not when that is a big advantage rather than a handicap only shows that you haven't thought anything through and are just here to call for nerfs b/c you either have serious L2P issues, just want easy kills, or lack the capability to distinguish between objective facts and subjective perception. I mean even your core arguments are deeply flawed and unsustainable.
And before you come running "but what about resistances, they can be reduced and you have to make a trade-off when you pick gear with resistances as bonus rather than a resource/damage/regen" ... that's true, BUT they also don't cost you several thousand resource every 1 to 6 sec to apply and receive some mitigation! They also ignore CC.
Some of you might now feel like saying: "but they got penetration as a counter" ... guess what, spell damage / weapon damage and max resources are the equivalent counters to shields.
And please don't start with "but but but... I can't crit shields" -> there is a lengthy post above why you can't. Read it!
And just so you understand why you can't defile shields: you also cannot buff shields with major or minor mending!!!!
I really should start opening threads with equivalently ridiculous demands regarding NBs or DKs. For example: make cloak be affected by defile so that respective damage goes through dodge. Some for Cloak. And while we are at it. Make both scale off of max magciak / stamina respectively instead of allowing for 100% mitigation by default. Let it start by 10% mitigation of damage when evading the damage.2 -
ak_pvp✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
If anything that is a disadvantage. You have to make sacrifices to get a decent defensive tool. You dont have to make any such sacrifices for cloak, dodge, block, and even healing is not punished as harshly as it scales from both max magicka and spell damage which allows for some degree of diversification.
Stacking into max magicka means you will have to sacrifices spell damge, spell pen, or regen. The first two make the sorc less dangerous on the offensive, the latter is deadly to sorc b/c once the resource is gone it's gone. You can't get it back quickly. For cloak, dodge, block you won't have to make such sacrifices. You can go for a lot of regen allowing you to spam this already more powerful defensive abilities even more. Or you could go full spell / weapon damage and pen making you deal a lot more damage. Or you could create a well balanced build that got damage + regen. Something that shield users can't to that extent.
The fact that you are here whining about how sorc's defensive tool scales of the max magicka while your's does not when that is a big advantage rather than a handicap only shows that you haven't thought anything through and are just here to call for nerfs b/c you either have serious L2P issues, just want easy kills, or lack the capability to distinguish between objective facts and subjective perception. I mean even your core arguments are deeply flawed and unsustainable.
And before you come running "but what about resistances, they can be reduced and you have to make a trade-off when you pick gear with resistances as bonus rather than a resource/damage/regen" ... that's true, BUT they also don't cost you several thousand resource every 1 to 6 sec to apply and receive some mitigation! They also ignore CC.
Some of you might now feel like saying: "but they got penetration as a counter" ... guess what, spell damage / weapon damage and max resources are the equivalent counters to shields.
And please don't start with "but but but... I can't crit shields" -> there is a lengthy post above why you can't. Read it!
And just so you understand why you can't defile shields: you also cannot buff shields with major or minor mending!!!!
I really should start opening threads with equivalently ridiculous demands regarding NBs or DKs. For example: make cloak be affected by defile so that respective damage goes through dodge. Some for Cloak. And while we are at it. Make both scale off of max magciak / stamina respectively instead of allowing for 100% mitigation by default. Let it start by 10% mitigation of damage when evading the damage.
Cloak is stupid too. But block/dodge all have soft counters that can go through, and is way more sacrificial than shields, block requires running s/b which is a damage loss, and blocking stops stam regen, snares, means you can't weave. And it requires speccing into lowering costs and sustaining it. Dodge also has things that can go through it.
Shields doesn't have these caveats. Shields scales of a damage stat and doesn't require throwing stats things around to be usable, doesn't gimp your damage, doesn't stop regen, and doesn't snare. If shields were worse than block, MagDK meta wouldn't be shields nowadays, despite synergy with block.
Cloak is a little different, it doesn't scale of anything, but its a 1 cost per use, unlike blocks cost increase per hit every 0.25s and doesn't really require an incredible amount of speccing into to use. Cloak is too strong for similar reasons, bad soft counters, too strong hard counters.Edited by ak_pvp on June 17, 2018 11:37PMMagDK main. PC/EU @AK-ESO
Best houseknight EU.1 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.
It does. Healing can be lowered beyond base though.
Healing has defiles that trump the buff sections of it, since defiles are post other buffs and the other healing buffs are not very easily accessible.
Shields are quite strong Xv1, (shield users being the X, me being the 1, I know shields are weak when outnumbered yourself) and no opportunity to soft counter and whittle away at them as you can heals often means you either have to ignore them, or throw a lot of resources into them. If shields had mending amps, and defile debuffs, that would allow you to buff/debuff shields lower/higher than current level.
Defenses without soft counters are bad design. Defenses with hard counters are bad design too, so SB/sloads will be gone
To balance this mobility buffs would be useful, it wouldn't just be an indiscriminate nerf, it'd be a rebalance to add softcounters to something that currently lacks it and then give more flavor to sorcs by buffing another part of them.
Next what ? Nerf DK !! they do shield stacking . Nerf magicka warden they do shield stacking. If noob NBs dont know to play its not the problem of game. I dont have any problem in killing 3 shield stacking magicka warden , dk or sorc. No light armor builds hardly survive 2 seconds against good NB. Magicka NB & templars do shield stacking with 2 shields. Its L2P issue. Nothing more to discuss. Just because you faced some good sorc, sorc is OP and other classes not ? Whats the NB want ? Want to kill without any counter play ? Nerf every class despite NB.
Do want everyone abandon sorc ? Even then problem will not be solved, because its L2P issue.
In fact now magicka DK >> all magicka classes including magicka NBs. Sorc is no where near top tier.Edited by Priyasekarssk on June 18, 2018 1:15AM2 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭yeah honestly the fact that magsorcs have really good sustained dps, and burst damage from a distance and crit/armor debuffs with 15K protection at all times. Yeah it needs a nerf already. PEople that complain about cloak being OP are just bad, theyre probably not even noobs, they just suck. There is 0 counterplay for shields.
Have you not even noticed, DKs and wardens also do shield stacking. "There is 0 counterplay for shields" Who is noob here ?
In fact all light armor do shield stacking. Its their only survival. Why complain only against sorcs ? I am stamina NB. I have no problem. L2P.0 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭Anti_Virus wrote: »
Dark Exchange and the Twilight are your burst heals. Critical Sure is your HoT. Crystal Frags when proc'd is a hard hitting instant cast like the spectral bow except you can use it more often. Instant cast spammable? Use Crushing Shock or Elemental Weapons.
You already have the tools to have great survivability without shield stacking.
I am talking about PvP here. PvP where you eventually have to slot damaging skills as well, not double barring a (2 hits => dead) pet and use a plethora of PvE stuff just to keep you alive.
@bardx86
funny enough a lot of sorcs argue that rune cage isn't OP and people need to adapt, but when the idea of fixing shield stacking comes up and people suggest class skills that heal mag sorc all of a sudden it's a problem to adapt.
kinda funny.
Ruge cage is OP . Fear and Incap is not !!!! Very funny isnt it? How about common poll involving all class players excluding sorcs and NBs ?0 -
Gprime31✭✭✭✭lol leave it the way it is, made a magsorc on the weekend can 1v10-15 kill them all with runecage/ice comet and never die...just streak away and invis pots...thx zos shield stacking is "balanced"0
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Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭lol leave it the way it is, made a magsorc on the weekend can 1v10-15 kill them all with runecage/ice comet and never die...just streak away and invis pots...thx zos shield stacking is "balanced"
Why shield stacking on sorc is unbalanced, other classes is not despite sorc doesnt have a burst heal ? A NB call pull CC + Ice comet combo. Mostly NB go for incap , which even more deadly. A DK can pull root + ice comet combo ?
Leave it. A Time stop and Ice comet any magicka class can pull it even any stamina for that matter. You dont know ice comet can be blocked ? Ice comet is not even a serious ultimate for its huge costs.
L2P issue. FYI many sorcs are old pros in the game. There is not much new sorcs due to nerfs after nerfs. That deoent mean class is overpowered. Its player skill. There is nothing sorc doing , which other classes does not to be even considered as overpowered.Edited by Priyasekarssk on June 18, 2018 2:02AM0 -
Gprime31✭✭✭✭Priyasekarssk wrote: »lol leave it the way it is, made a magsorc on the weekend can 1v10-15 kill them all with runecage/ice comet and never die...just streak away and invis pots...thx zos shield stacking is "balanced"
Why shield stacking on sorc is unbalanced, other classes is not despite sorc doesnt have a burst heal ? A NB call pull CC + Ice comet combo. A DK can pull root + ice comet combo ?
Leave it. A Time stop and Ice comet any magicka class can pull it even any stamina for that matter.
L2P issue. FYI many sorcs are old pros in the game. There is not much new sorcs due to nerfs after nerfs. That deoent mean class is overpowered.
totally agree...i'm very happy with my mag sorc..0 -
PhoenixGrey✭✭✭✭✭
✭PhoenixGrey wrote: »This is in combat and mechanics section because damage shields are OP in every aspect of this game. It's the reason why magicka has insane survivability in comparison to stamina in PvE, and the fact that magSorcs can add 20k+ effective health in 2 seconds by alternating between hardened ward and harness magicka while in PvP is way too strong.
I do not have the solution, but I can offer a few ideas:
1) Make them critable, but have them affected by the users mitigation.
2) Have them affected by defile.
3) Increase the cost of a following damage shield by 33% if applied again within 5 seconds.
I would not suggest doing both suggestion 1 and 2 because that would render damage shields useless. Combining either 1 or 2 with 3 would be fine though.
Yes, I'm expecting to be zerged by QQing magsorcs for stating the obvious, but this is long overdue and we will see posts like this throughout the entire lifetime of ESO until something is done about it.
Shield stacking is expensive though compared to some other defensive mechanics in the game
That fact was conveniently forgotten
Not even close. You'll run out of stamina significantly quicker on a stam character spamming dodge rolling or blocking a soul assault than you would on a magicka character spamming shields.
I didn't conveniently forget anything. You obviously don't play stamina.
You also forgot shimerring shield. Pretty cheap for the shield size it provides don't you think ?
Anyway do what you want with shields. They anyway don't work this patch. I don't remember the last time I saw anything except Sload/ knight slayer / shield breaker / on my death recap. I can guarantee every other mug in a group wears one of these.0 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Priyasekarssk wrote: »lol leave it the way it is, made a magsorc on the weekend can 1v10-15 kill them all with runecage/ice comet and never die...just streak away and invis pots...thx zos shield stacking is "balanced"
Why shield stacking on sorc is unbalanced, other classes is not despite sorc doesnt have a burst heal ? A NB call pull CC + Ice comet combo. Mostly NB go for incap , which even more deadly. A DK can pull root + ice comet combo ?
Leave it. A Time stop and Ice comet any magicka class can pull it even any stamina for that matter. You dont know ice comet can be blocked ? Ice comet is not even a serious ultimate for its huge costs.
L2P issue. FYI many sorcs are old pros in the game. There is not much new sorcs due to nerfs after nerfs. That deoent mean class is overpowered. Its player skill. There is nothing sorc doing , which other classes does not to be even considered as overpowered.
here here!1 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭Anti_Virus wrote: »
Dark Exchange and the Twilight are your burst heals. Critical Sure is your HoT. Crystal Frags when proc'd is a hard hitting instant cast like the spectral bow except you can use it more often. Instant cast spammable? Use Crushing Shock or Elemental Weapons.
You already have the tools to have great survivability without shield stacking.
I am talking about PvP here. PvP where you eventually have to slot damaging skills as well, not double barring a (2 hits => dead) pet and use a plethora of PvE stuff just to keep you alive.
@bardx86
funny enough a lot of sorcs argue that rune cage isn't OP and people need to adapt, but when the idea of fixing shield stacking comes up and people suggest class skills that heal mag sorc all of a sudden it's a problem to adapt.
kinda funny.
Look dude, how may folks on this board state that they have no issue killing a stacking Sorc? Face facts some folks are better than you. Again, SOME FOLKS ARE BETTER THAN YOU, regardless of class. Ever went toe to toe with king richard, methuselah, lucky lucy, fengish? Study the fight, figure out where you lost because you made a mistake. Learn!Edited by bardx86 on June 18, 2018 4:16AM1 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@ak_pvp
The chances are though that ZOS nerfs Shield stacking while leaving oblivion damage as accessible damage type for players in the game.
I still believe nothing would change if shield stacking was removed and Sorcs were given something else in replacement. If it’s adequate defense people will complain about the replacement instead.
It’s visible in every thread of this kind. People claiming that the class would be fine with just 1 shield and no replacing defense show that the true goal is having easy kills.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.3 -
ZOS_JesCadminGreetings, we've removed several comments that were baiting in nature and a few that contained profanity. This is a friendly reminder to read through our forum rules so you know what is and is not permitted in your future posts. Thank you for your understanding.The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited - ZeniMax Online Studios
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pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Whether defile is balanced or not is completely irrelevant. Thats a balance issue with heals/defiles. It has nothing to do with shields or any other defense mechanic.Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.
It does. Healing can be lowered beyond base though.
Healing has defiles that trump the buff sections of it, since defiles are post other buffs and the other healing buffs are not very easily accessible.
Shields are quite strong Xv1, (shield users being the X, me being the 1, I know shields are weak when outnumbered yourself) and no opportunity to soft counter and whittle away at them as you can heals often means you either have to ignore them, or throw a lot of resources into them. If shields had mending amps, and defile debuffs, that would allow you to buff/debuff shields lower/higher than current level.
Defenses without soft counters are bad design. Defenses with hard counters are bad design too, so SB/sloads will be gone
To balance this mobility buffs would be useful, it wouldn't just be an indiscriminate nerf, it'd be a rebalance to add softcounters to something that currently lacks it and then give more flavor to sorcs by buffing another part of them.
Heals have defiles because they have mending. You can debuff ur opponent's heals because they can buff their heals. You can crit people because they can mitigate crits. Thats how counters work. If something doesnt have a counter then its no longer a soft counter. Its a hard counter and that is precisely what you are trying to do with shields.
You cant defile shields because they cant be buffed. You cant crit them because they cant crit. If you put a counter to shields like defile then its not a soft counter. Its by definition a hard counter because there wont be anything you can do to counter it. Im not telling you that shields are good as they are. But the problem is with their design. Not with the fact that they have no counters.
And just to give you some numbers so you can actually understand ur solution, if you were able to defile shields then you would be looking at something like 14k shieldstack (normal sorc builds) at best assuming a hugely nerfed defile. Thats like current no CP shields. And you want that in campaigns where people are pushing 25k dmg tooltips. Its self explanatory what is going to happen. And we are not even considering the fact that you could also defile them in no CP. At that point there wont even be a point to have any shield on ur bar. You will be able to outdmg them by just light attacking.
Again im not telling you that shieldstacking is good. But thats a design issue. Not a balance issue. Putting a defile on shields is a band aid fix that affects everyone but those that actually abuse shieldstacking. Aka the 50k magicka builds. And the only thing you will end up doing, is just force people to stack more magicka to go back to bigger shields again. And if ZOS actually puts also a way to buff shields like mending to counter defile (which would logically be available to sorcs) then i dont even wanna know what is going to happen. And we are not even touching on the consequences to other classes.
I understand that its not ur intention, and probably not the intention of many others proposing these "solutions". But these "solutions" will open pandoras box.1 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Anti_Virus wrote: »Dark exchange is avery good skill, but no on-demand burst heal. Surge requires you to be on the offense fort some heals. Pets suck in open-world PvP.
The skills you named are very good in combination with a strong shield or shield stacking, but only mediocre without.
Well I'm not suggesting to not use a shield lol. I'm just pointing out that the sorc does have great survivability with just the use of Hardened ward, and healing ward. Harness magicka is just Overkill, and it should not be able to stack with hardened.
No. We don’t have great survivability with one shield. Have you ever tried it? I’m guessing not.Damage shields are absolutely too strong. Don't delude yourselves, in a 1v1 its beyond OP, and easily sustainable. It also doesn't have much good soft counters (like cloak)
Yeah it melts 1vX, but so does everything else.
Make shields defiled (though lower defile) and make shields maj/min. Then buff sorc's mobility, small buff for mines, BoL removes snares for 1s, and streak doesn't increase in price when hitting someone.
This would destroy the class pretty much, especially because your spammable nightblade ultimate would basically make it impossible to shield. Agenda much?
I’m so happy sometimes that the devs ignore these garbage suggestions.
1) L2R. I said nerf defile first. I don't even have an NB leveled.
2) No it wouldn't.
I bet you are the first to complain about shieldbreaker/sloads. Newsflash, they wouldn't exist if shields had a soft counters. Cloak may be stronger, but it has the same problems, too strong when not countered, too weak when countered.
The 3 other classes have to deal with it, just look at block: 2K stam every sec, requires heavy building at the cost of damage, all dots go through, bleeds go through resists too (broken) unblockable abilities go through, many AoEs go through, and unblockable CCs go though. Stops stam, snares.
But...But pressure. Congrats, you can pressure anything easier, and with block it goes straight to the health, which can be defiled.
Sorcs could use certain buffs, but don't kid yourself and say shields are fine. Maybe in no CP without bastion, or extra resources, but absolutely not in CP. If they were, MagDKs wouldn't go shields instead of the defense they synergize with, many magplars wouldn't go to shields so they can get their damage off, etc.
Why should you be immune to defiles?
Shields should be immune to defiles because they don't have any equivalent to major/minor mending and major/minor vitality Unless you also want to add those in, but what would be the point? Seems like a lot of trouble just to rebalance something that's already balanced.
Edit - balanced doesn't mean well designed. I find the current implementation of shield design godawful...but it's pretty well balanced.
But shield size scales of mag which can be increased, but has no way to reduce the effectiveness of mag in the same way that mitigation scales of resistance, which can be buffed, but also lowered.
Heals scale with spell dmg and magicka too which can also be increased but not lowered. You are comparing apples with oranges.
It's called defile.
100% off target. Read again.0