[Class Rep] Templar Feedback Thread

StarOfElyon

Why can't sunshield scale with my max stat? The debuff to really Witchmothers Brew is going to hurt.

casparian

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

About what I figured I guess I'll let the pts run and hopefully we get a few more benificial changes for both Stam and mag.

For total dark the only nerf was really so it doesnt totally screw dk's right? Should still work the same on everyone else unless I missed something?

No, damage per tick was also nerfed (by 25%).

Mrsinister2

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

About what I figured I guess I'll let the pts run and hopefully we get a few more benificial changes for both Stam and mag.

For total dark the only nerf was really so it doesnt totally screw dk's right? Should still work the same on everyone else unless I missed something?

No, damage per tick was also nerfed (by 25%).

Lol that is just great

Thanks for the info man

Minno

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

About what I figured I guess I'll let the pts run and hopefully we get a few more benificial changes for both Stam and mag.

For total dark the only nerf was really so it doesnt totally screw dk's right? Should still work the same on everyone else unless I missed something?

No, damage per tick was also nerfed (by 25%).

Lol that is just great

Thanks for the info man

Yes Templar got gutted. Time to level that Warden lol

Mr_Nobody

so they:

1) Ultranerfed Dark Flare
2) Gave a meaningless buff to Sweeps which cannot be hit in PvP anyways, and even if you hit them you are most likely to heal the enemy.
3) Ultrabuffed Shards, i guess thats our new spammable in PvP?

4) - Anyone checked the Sun Shield changes? What atually are those and how they perform?

Joy_Division

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

Problem is hitting something mobile with toppling.

Mrsinister2

Joy_Division wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

Problem is hitting something mobile with toppling.

I was hoping to see something that would help it and make it a more viable gap closer but it got a damage nerf and a change I probably won't make any use of ever.

Vapirko

Ritual is obviously a welcomed change for stamplars, but it’s not quite enough. We will also be operating with lower max stats now and damage is going up on a lot of other classes. PoL change isn’t too bad, jabs change is good if it worked better.

StarOfElyon

Why wouldn't they just make one morph of Sun Fire increase in duration instead of both? Templars need a bursty projectile.

technohic

I've had no problem using jabs when it is not super laggy. Just did some testing on the PTS and it feels pretty good right now. It weaves pretty nicely now.

Extended ritual on my stamplar ticks about 10 points higher than the HOT on my Rally.

I used empowering sweeps on my stamplar as a defensive. It now is much better to just wait for DBOS. Ironic that they fixed the range, but killed the utility.

I seem to be getting ravager procs much more often. Not sure if they missed a note or something. Think there was something about rapid strikes being counted as melee damage, maybe Jabs is now as well?

Stx

I'm pissed they are taking major protection off of sweeps. It's such an underrated ultimate... but now I'll never use it.

katorga

Stx wrote: »

I'm pissed they are taking major protection off of sweeps. It's such an underrated ultimate... but now I'll never use it.

Same here. Really underwhelmed so far.

Losing major protection on resto ult will pretty much kill my mag sorc too.

Mitaka211

Have to say , i am so disappointed with the patch notes. Yet again they decide to pamper to the popular classes and leave us in the dust. Stamplars pretty much got completely ignored. And yet nothing but absurd dmg buffs to other classes . What am i supposed to do, spam vigor faster? The little jokes left in there just rubbed salt in the wounds. Sorcs and DKs were always better than templar and they spend all this time tweaking and buffing them, we got a big middle finger in our face.
GIVE US MORE CHOICES FOR STAMINA , HOW HARD IS IT TO UNDERSTAND?

Jabbs_Giggity

Not sure why, or how to explain it...but the direction that ZOS is going seems as if they are getting ready to just remove Templar from Class choice altogether. @Checkmath can you please say something for christ's sake?? Necromancer is a complete rework of the Templar class. All other classes are being reworked, buffed, etc. Templar has lost all identity and being tweaked ONLY to make player avoid using...like WTF! I honestly don't even want to play the game anymore with this new direction. Not going to re-grind a new class just to "compete". Changes to food/drink is atrocious. This is just getting rediculous...

EtTuBrutus

Minno wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

About what I figured I guess I'll let the pts run and hopefully we get a few more benificial changes for both Stam and mag.

For total dark the only nerf was really so it doesnt totally screw dk's right? Should still work the same on everyone else unless I missed something?

No, damage per tick was also nerfed (by 25%).

Lol that is just great

Thanks for the info man

Yes Templar got gutted. Time to level that Warden lol

It didn't though.

StarOfElyon

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Mrsinister2 wrote: »

I don't no how I feel about all this I need someone smarter to tell me if Templar is gonna better, worse or pretty much the same.

Hopefully more changes or I'm just not seeing the good stuff in the current changes?

Stamplar: minimally better thanks to Ritual healing change, but relatively worse compared to other buffed classes. Can now run heavy though if that's your thing.

Magplar: worse due to TD nerf, better due to Race Against Time change (no more vampirism), Exploiter builds are possible now though if you want to run 75 Thaum.

About what I figured I guess I'll let the pts run and hopefully we get a few more benificial changes for both Stam and mag.

For total dark the only nerf was really so it doesnt totally screw dk's right? Should still work the same on everyone else unless I missed something?

No, damage per tick was also nerfed (by 25%).

Lol that is just great

Thanks for the info man

Yes Templar got gutted. Time to level that Warden lol

It didn't though.

I'm interested in reading your reasons for saying that.

EtTuBrutus

Don't underestimate how great the off balance change is (70% more dmg, FREE OFF GLOBAL STUN albeit moot since off balance is being applied by a stun, 200% resource return).

Sweeps cooldown buff? Awesome.

Barrage scaling with the proper cp is a wonderful change. It did good dmg before, now i have no problem pumping up thaum to get exploiter. There's a reason every competitor in pve uses that passive. The 10% buff is huge and now we have a reliable way to get it. Plus it now does 1 extra tick.

Cresent should be more reliable, sucks about empowering i used it on my no cp build.

Total dark is gonna be missed, but it was already bad in small scale. It'll still be ok in solo play still just not as punishing.

Rip babe/ reflective ranged spam.

Dark flare is totally outclassed by barrage now imo. Especially vs skilled opponents. It'll still wreck noobs.

Checkmath

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Not sure why, or how to explain it...but the direction that ZOS is going seems as if they are getting ready to just remove Templar from Class choice altogether. @Checkmath can you please say something for christ's sake?? Necromancer is a complete rework of the Templar class. All other classes are being reworked, buffed, etc. Templar has lost all identity and being tweaked ONLY to make player avoid using...like WTF! I honestly don't even want to play the game anymore with this new direction. Not going to re-grind a new class just to "compete". Changes to food/drink is atrocious. This is just getting rediculous...

As much as I know, that Elsweyr changes are to bring skills inline with some etablished standards, kind of like a standard for placeable aoes, pbaoes, single target spammables and aoe spammables. Same goes for single target dots, which now all follow some same rules. This patch mostly was to bring tooltips inline between all the different classes and weapons. I hope, that this will be a good base for a total class rebalancing, where passives are looked at and also which classes and toons perform poorly or too strong in which content and then get adjusted specifically.

Joy_Division

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Don't underestimate how great the off balance change is (70% more dmg, FREE OFF GLOBAL STUN albeit moot since off balance is being applied by a stun, 200% resource return).

Sweeps cooldown buff? Awesome.

Barrage scaling with the proper cp is a wonderful change. It did good dmg before, now i have no problem pumping up thaum to get exploiter. There's a reason every competitor in pve uses that passive. The 10% buff is huge and now we have a reliable way to get it. Plus it now does 1 extra tick.

Cresent should be more reliable, sucks about empowering i used it on my no cp build.

Total dark is gonna be missed, but it was already bad in small scale. It'll still be ok in solo play still just not as punishing.

Rip babe/ reflective ranged spam.

Dark flare is totally outclassed by barrage now imo. Especially vs skilled opponents. It'll still wreck noobs.

The buff is only good if you can hit targets and the charge is too slow to do that. Also, the minimum range restriction has got to go.

iaminc

What about temp tanks , we’ve lost any way of applying cc outside time stop or volcanic rune!

How hard is it to add a cc to an existing skill for Templar’s for God’s sake.

StarOfElyon

I would really like it if I didn't have to choose between Dark Flare and Solar Barrage

EtTuBrutus

Joy_Division wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Don't underestimate how great the off balance change is (70% more dmg, FREE OFF GLOBAL STUN albeit moot since off balance is being applied by a stun, 200% resource return).

Sweeps cooldown buff? Awesome.

Barrage scaling with the proper cp is a wonderful change. It did good dmg before, now i have no problem pumping up thaum to get exploiter. There's a reason every competitor in pve uses that passive. The 10% buff is huge and now we have a reliable way to get it. Plus it now does 1 extra tick.

Cresent should be more reliable, sucks about empowering i used it on my no cp build.

Total dark is gonna be missed, but it was already bad in small scale. It'll still be ok in solo play still just not as punishing.

Rip babe/ reflective ranged spam.

Dark flare is totally outclassed by barrage now imo. Especially vs skilled opponents. It'll still wreck noobs.

The buff is only good if you can hit targets and the charge is too slow to do that. Also, the minimum range restriction has got to go.

Yea missing a target bc you're 20m away is ridiculous. How has that not been fixed yet. Until yesterday when i saw the notes, I hadnt used toppling for a while, so maybe the speed nerf helped. I don't recall having issues vs magicka, but mainly the expedition pot users of the past. Minimum range makes sense to me even though it is frustrating in lag. I back bar a masters ice so locking down is easier for me.

Aren't you the person to get the speed of the charge looked at? Cinibri has done about 50 write ups displaying the issue.

Checkmath

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Don't underestimate how great the off balance change is (70% more dmg, FREE OFF GLOBAL STUN albeit moot since off balance is being applied by a stun, 200% resource return).

Sweeps cooldown buff? Awesome.

Barrage scaling with the proper cp is a wonderful change. It did good dmg before, now i have no problem pumping up thaum to get exploiter. There's a reason every competitor in pve uses that passive. The 10% buff is huge and now we have a reliable way to get it. Plus it now does 1 extra tick.

Cresent should be more reliable, sucks about empowering i used it on my no cp build.

Total dark is gonna be missed, but it was already bad in small scale. It'll still be ok in solo play still just not as punishing.

Rip babe/ reflective ranged spam.

Dark flare is totally outclassed by barrage now imo. Especially vs skilled opponents. It'll still wreck noobs.

The buff is only good if you can hit targets and the charge is too slow to do that. Also, the minimum range restriction has got to go.

Yea missing a target bc you're 20m away is ridiculous. How has that not been fixed yet. Until yesterday when i saw the notes, I hadnt used toppling for a while, so maybe the speed nerf helped. I don't recall having issues vs magicka, but mainly the expedition pot users of the past. Minimum range makes sense to me even though it is frustrating in lag. I back bar a masters ice so locking down is easier for me.

Aren't you the person to get the speed of the charge looked at? Cinibri has done about 50 write ups displaying the issue.

Speed and minimum distance was months ago talked about with the devs and they even said, that they will address it with wrathstone. But nothing happened.

technohic

Checkmath wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Don't underestimate how great the off balance change is (70% more dmg, FREE OFF GLOBAL STUN albeit moot since off balance is being applied by a stun, 200% resource return).

Sweeps cooldown buff? Awesome.

Barrage scaling with the proper cp is a wonderful change. It did good dmg before, now i have no problem pumping up thaum to get exploiter. There's a reason every competitor in pve uses that passive. The 10% buff is huge and now we have a reliable way to get it. Plus it now does 1 extra tick.

Cresent should be more reliable, sucks about empowering i used it on my no cp build.

Total dark is gonna be missed, but it was already bad in small scale. It'll still be ok in solo play still just not as punishing.

Rip babe/ reflective ranged spam.

Dark flare is totally outclassed by barrage now imo. Especially vs skilled opponents. It'll still wreck noobs.

The buff is only good if you can hit targets and the charge is too slow to do that. Also, the minimum range restriction has got to go.

Yea missing a target bc you're 20m away is ridiculous. How has that not been fixed yet. Until yesterday when i saw the notes, I hadnt used toppling for a while, so maybe the speed nerf helped. I don't recall having issues vs magicka, but mainly the expedition pot users of the past. Minimum range makes sense to me even though it is frustrating in lag. I back bar a masters ice so locking down is easier for me.

Aren't you the person to get the speed of the charge looked at? Cinibri has done about 50 write ups displaying the issue.

Speed and minimum distance was months ago talked about with the devs and they even said, that they will address it with wrathstone. But nothing happened.

What was the blurb about the brief snare on gap closer being raised?

StarOfElyon

With so much poison and bleed damage in the game, I think we needs the cleansing ritual to continue removing negative effects while you're standing in it every couple of seconds because what's happening is that purging is becoming pointless when opponents can just reapply the poisons. Like, on any given night I'm in a match where a guy is just spamming poison injection at me non-stop, like that's his one and only job.

Neoauspex

Checkmath wrote: »

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Not sure why, or how to explain it...but the direction that ZOS is going seems as if they are getting ready to just remove Templar from Class choice altogether. @Checkmath can you please say something for christ's sake?? Necromancer is a complete rework of the Templar class. All other classes are being reworked, buffed, etc. Templar has lost all identity and being tweaked ONLY to make player avoid using...like WTF! I honestly don't even want to play the game anymore with this new direction. Not going to re-grind a new class just to "compete". Changes to food/drink is atrocious. This is just getting rediculous...

As much as I know, that Elsweyr changes are to bring skills inline with some etablished standards, kind of like a standard for placeable aoes, pbaoes, single target spammables and aoe spammables. Same goes for single target dots, which now all follow some same rules. This patch mostly was to bring tooltips inline between all the different classes and weapons. I hope, that this will be a good base for a total class rebalancing, where passives are looked at and also which classes and toons perform poorly or too strong in which content and then get adjusted specifically.

The intention behind this balance pass is great, but they need to take counterplay into account in addition to math. I'm not sure what they are bringing Eclipse in line with, but I know there's no other skill in the game that gives CC immunity without CCing.

I honestly don't like the Wings change for DKs either in the overall scope of things; these two changes remove the deterrent to completely speccing for ranged combat, which already has an inherent advantage of safety at range. I feel like there's gonna be more battles of zergs just standing 35m away just plinking at each other.

EtTuBrutus

Neoauspex wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Not sure why, or how to explain it...but the direction that ZOS is going seems as if they are getting ready to just remove Templar from Class choice altogether. @Checkmath can you please say something for christ's sake?? Necromancer is a complete rework of the Templar class. All other classes are being reworked, buffed, etc. Templar has lost all identity and being tweaked ONLY to make player avoid using...like WTF! I honestly don't even want to play the game anymore with this new direction. Not going to re-grind a new class just to "compete". Changes to food/drink is atrocious. This is just getting rediculous...

As much as I know, that Elsweyr changes are to bring skills inline with some etablished standards, kind of like a standard for placeable aoes, pbaoes, single target spammables and aoe spammables. Same goes for single target dots, which now all follow some same rules. This patch mostly was to bring tooltips inline between all the different classes and weapons. I hope, that this will be a good base for a total class rebalancing, where passives are looked at and also which classes and toons perform poorly or too strong in which content and then get adjusted specifically.

The intention behind this balance pass is great, but they need to take counterplay into account in addition to math. I'm not sure what they are bringing Eclipse in line with, but I know there's no other skill in the game that gives CC immunity without CCing.

I honestly don't like the Wings change for DKs either in the overall scope of things; these two changes remove the deterrent to completely speccing for ranged combat, which already has an inherent advantage of safety at range. I feel like there's gonna be more battles of zergs just standing 35m away just plinking at each other.

Idk, reflect in general is broken. No 1 skill should cost effectively shut down an entire play style like wings does. Reflect in the snb skill line is balanced imo. 1v1. That's counterplay.

Neoauspex

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

Neoauspex wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

Jabbs_Giggity wrote: »

Not sure why, or how to explain it...but the direction that ZOS is going seems as if they are getting ready to just remove Templar from Class choice altogether. @Checkmath can you please say something for christ's sake?? Necromancer is a complete rework of the Templar class. All other classes are being reworked, buffed, etc. Templar has lost all identity and being tweaked ONLY to make player avoid using...like WTF! I honestly don't even want to play the game anymore with this new direction. Not going to re-grind a new class just to "compete". Changes to food/drink is atrocious. This is just getting rediculous...

As much as I know, that Elsweyr changes are to bring skills inline with some etablished standards, kind of like a standard for placeable aoes, pbaoes, single target spammables and aoe spammables. Same goes for single target dots, which now all follow some same rules. This patch mostly was to bring tooltips inline between all the different classes and weapons. I hope, that this will be a good base for a total class rebalancing, where passives are looked at and also which classes and toons perform poorly or too strong in which content and then get adjusted specifically.

The intention behind this balance pass is great, but they need to take counterplay into account in addition to math. I'm not sure what they are bringing Eclipse in line with, but I know there's no other skill in the game that gives CC immunity without CCing.

I honestly don't like the Wings change for DKs either in the overall scope of things; these two changes remove the deterrent to completely speccing for ranged combat, which already has an inherent advantage of safety at range. I feel like there's gonna be more battles of zergs just standing 35m away just plinking at each other.

Idk, reflect in general is broken. No 1 skill should cost effectively shut down an entire play style like wings does. Reflect in the snb skill line is balanced imo. 1v1. That's counterplay.

I'm not saying wings shouldn't be adjusted, just seems like with both of these changes they're really promoting a specific play style. Agree that Defensive Posture is balanced. But for instance, everyone is questioning the math on Dark Flare but really the main reason not to use it just got taken out of the game.

Nirnroot420

A lot of drama in this thread right now over what amounts to slight changes. The Total Dark nerf kinda sucks, but it was a niche skill at best and debatable even in 1v1 PvP situations. It won't ruin any magplars day when you can just use shock clench. Otherwise, magplar got a pretty nice buff with the improved damage to Blazing Spear and the duration/cast time changes on several skills. Magplar is 100% fine and may even be better in the new chapter, but everyone is going to look worse next to the necro.

Stamplar on the other hand really needed some love to keep up and stay in line with the other classes. While I've only played mag, I can't see how stamplar stays competitive in PVP with its current toolkit. That side of the class surely needs some love.

StarOfElyon

Nirnroot420 wrote: »

A lot of drama in this thread right now over what amounts to slight changes. The Total Dark nerf kinda sucks, but it was a niche skill at best and debatable even in 1v1 PvP situations. It won't ruin any magplars day when you can just use shock clench. Otherwise, magplar got a pretty nice buff with the improved damage to Blazing Spear and the duration/cast time changes on several skills. Magplar is 100% fine and may even be better in the new chapter, but everyone is going to look worse next to the necro.

Stamplar on the other hand really needed some love to keep up and stay in line with the other classes. While I've only played mag, I can't see how stamplar stays competitive in PVP with its current toolkit. That side of the class surely needs some love.

Total Dark is very useful. Direct attacks such as Shot Clench can make it very difficult for my team to close the gap on opponents, TD punishes my opponent while I gain ground. It also forces snipers to retreat and gives me a chance to heal or purge poison. Typically it forces the opponent to use weaker attacks or AOE. For players who don't play with a destruction staff, like me, my MagPlar is able to use TD offensively and defensively. It's best to put it on opponents as soon as possible so that they don't start hitting me with knockdowns from a distance. It's very disruptive.