[Class Rep] Nightblade Feedback Thread

Lifecode666

assassin's will need to be rolled back to x4 light attack proc.

Strider__Roshin

Ankael07 wrote: »

LegacyDM wrote: »

All you guys hating on cloak.remember magicka nb doesn’t have a class shield nor stamina to dodge roll forever. + there are over s dozen counters to cloak. Cloak is really our only defense without relying on shade morph. If anything it needs a buff.

I dont hate cloak but its not a MNB's only defence by any means. There is the Shadow Barrier passive giving major resistances, Strife heals you based on damage done, Siphoning strikes also healing you and providing some sustain, Summon Shades to teleport and inflict Minor Maim which can now be cast without targeting an enemy and lastly Blur giving Major Evasion.

What I hate instead is every nightblade playing innocent and saying ''We're squishy, we were made to be assassins coming out of shadows and killing in seconds then escaping''

They were squishy before this update. Now if you're squishy as a Nightblade it's because you chose to be.

BohnT

Daus wrote: »

Ankael07 wrote: »

LegacyDM wrote: »

All you guys hating on cloak.remember magicka nb doesn’t have a class shield nor stamina to dodge roll forever. + there are over s dozen counters to cloak. Cloak is really our only defense without relying on shade morph. If anything it needs a buff.

I dont hate cloak but its not a MNB's only defence by any means. There is the Shadow Barrier passive giving major resistances, Strife heals you based on damage done, Siphoning strikes also healing you and providing some sustain, Summon Shades to teleport and inflict Minor Maim which can now be cast without targeting an enemy and lastly Blur giving Major Evasion.

What I hate instead is every nightblade playing innocent and saying ''We're squishy, we were made to be assassins coming out of shadows and killing in seconds then escaping''

They were squishy before this update. Now if you're squishy as a Nightblade it's because you chose to be.

No they were not. People saying Stamnb or Nightblades in general were squishy had crappy builds and questionable player skill

Strider__Roshin

BohnT wrote: »

Daus wrote: »

Ankael07 wrote: »

LegacyDM wrote: »

All you guys hating on cloak.remember magicka nb doesn’t have a class shield nor stamina to dodge roll forever. + there are over s dozen counters to cloak. Cloak is really our only defense without relying on shade morph. If anything it needs a buff.

I dont hate cloak but its not a MNB's only defence by any means. There is the Shadow Barrier passive giving major resistances, Strife heals you based on damage done, Siphoning strikes also healing you and providing some sustain, Summon Shades to teleport and inflict Minor Maim which can now be cast without targeting an enemy and lastly Blur giving Major Evasion.

What I hate instead is every nightblade playing innocent and saying ''We're squishy, we were made to be assassins coming out of shadows and killing in seconds then escaping''

They were squishy before this update. Now if you're squishy as a Nightblade it's because you chose to be.

No they were not. People saying Stamnb or Nightblades in general were squishy had crappy builds and questionable player skill

I would say the same about anyone claiming they weren't squishy. They were the easiest spec to kill. If anyone was struggling to kill one they had a crappy spec or questionable skill. At least when it came to stamblades. Magblades have always been a pain.

olsborg

Give blur skill the same snare/root immunity/cleanse as medium armor skill so magblades dont have to run 2h forward momentum to stay mobile.

RavenSworn

Silver_Strider wrote: »

RavenSworn wrote: »

1)The class lacks a group synergy skill. This will add more utility for the class with the healer or tank role. The best choice for this is Path of Darkness.

2) much has been done to alleviate tanking and healing for nb, thank you for the changes. I can't say much bout pvp but in terms of pve, Mirage / double take should switch places with aspect of terror. It doesn't make any sense for this ability to be in the assassin skill line when it's used defensively. It will also be in line with the shadow defensive / tanking tree.

I think you could add Blur to the list of skills that would be great for a Synergy.

Think switching Veiled Strike with Blur would be more appropriate than Aspect of Terror. AoT is sort of weird in either skill line but since its used for defensive purposes, it seems more appropriate to be in the Tank skill line than in an Assassin Skill Line.

Veiled strike I feel, is more useful for the lower levels, as it acts as a spammable, something akin to sorcerers at lower levels with the pet, mage fury and crystal shard.

The reason why aspect I feel is more in line with the assassin skill line, an assassin is an aspect of terror and death. In fact, take away the minor maim from one of the morphs and replaced it with minor vulnerability.

I'm on the fence for blur to be a group synergy but why not? Nb needs it to be more optimal for trial healing.

Oakmontowls_ESO

My main gripe is the continual gutting of our sustain. I did the math and while our magika sustain skill (siphoning attacks) does have the highest return by about 80 magika per second, it is the only sustain skill that requires you to have a perfect rotation in order to make the most of it. It is also is one of two that has an initial cost of magika the other being templar. The magika per second with taking in account the cost of the skill for each class is as follows: Nightblade has 265.45, Templar has 180, Dk(with ult gen of 3.5 per second) has 161, and warden has 148.13. It is a little harder to compare Sorc but in order to match the resource return of Nb they have to cast Dark conversion every 17.69 seconds.
While these numbers seem overwhelmingly in nb's favor they don't take into account the fact that in order to get the 265 magika per second you also have to land 20 light attacks in 20 seconds as well as letting the buff completely expire. As others have mentioned, it also punishes you for using heavy attacks since the skill does not give increased resources for the extra time spent.

doctor_refuel

To give my points some perspective, I started playing in October 2017 as a Dunmer magicka nightblade and I'm still maining it. I'm afraid I won't be able to sum up my feedback in only two points, but I'll try to keep it brief and hopefully some of it will be useful for the class reps and meet devs vision.

General

• Staffs. I hate that giant piece of wood on my back, no wonder I can't sneak : )) I mean, being ranged is nice and all, but I'd love a setup with classic weapons with added magical abilities, buffs and debuffs to be more viable. DW or something like Arcane Archer. Imagine reworking the Bow line to include some magicka morphs and synergize it with classes like Magblades or Magwardens, how cool would that be? One hell of a work, but very very cool : ) That was always my vision of a Nightblade. This does indeed feel like a darker version of Sorcerer in everything but name.

PVE

• My only pain point is Strife. I feel it'd be more fair, if it cost somewhere in the region of Elemental Weapon. I mean I'm still using it most of the time, but it's only out of habit, which I'm learning to break. Once the group has dedicated healers, you are better served with Force Pulse. Same cost, better passives, more damage and it can be sustained with LA rotation.
• Very good job otherwise developers! It feels great to play, there is always something to learn, something to get better at and when you do, you are rewarded.

PVP

• Strife again. The same reasoning as in PVE, plus it's reflectable as others have mentioned and the off-heal isn't terribly powerful, so it's even worse than in PVE.
• Sneaking in general. I'm playing a Nightblade, I'd expect to be mobile and difficult to catch while dealing high single target damage and being generally squishy when cought. None of that seems to be very true for me, except for the squishiness when cought : ) I have abandoned Cloak and use heavy armor to become more tanky and I usually kill my opponents (if they are around my level, ie, the fight is even) by keeping up all my pricy buffs and rather slowly grinding them to execute, but once they hit less than 25% HP they are admittedly dead. By playing a Nightblade as the name implies, I didn't kill any good tanky players as they laughed off my ambush and I ended up dead on the floor soon after or I killed my target and my escape was thwarted by any of the 20 ways it can be and I still ended up dead on the floor. By playing a Nightblade as a bruiser with lots of buffs and healing, my performance has improved a lot. I'm finding Bolt Escape to be much better on demand mobility and escape skill in one nice package than anything Nightblades have. Shade is great, but if I want to use it to escape, I have to put it in a safe location, find the enemy, initiate fight and when the point comes I could teleport back and save my skin from Zaan for example, the shade is usually already gone (in BGs at least).

sage2000

1. Please gut NB survivability. Nerf cloak into the ground. Provide further nerfs to roll dodge. Force us to become yet another heavy armor brawler, or better yet make it so we are simply a free kill. At the very least make it so that medium armor is no longer viable for any class in PvP.

2. Please take away our burst. Nerf incap into the ground. Take away the spectral bow and make relentless focus just a button push that sends love and blissful feelings to our enemy. Nerf surprise attack to complete the removal of our burst.

In summary, please take away everything that makes our class fun, unique, and effective in PvP. /s

On a more serious note though, my two greatest pain points in regards to NB:

1. The forum warriors who have a relentless agenda of nerfing stamblades into the ground.

2. The infiltration of this very thread by people who don't main the class and just want it nerfed.

aeowulf

Pain points without suggestions:

Class sustain is still not tank-friendly. For example exectutioner will only proc when using a damaging assasination skill (DPS skill that is unlikely to be equipped by a tank), that costs more that you would get back under all circumstances, that requires perfect timing and a soon to be dead mob. It really needs reviewing, the change to help NB tanks last year did nothing to help NB tanks.

The fun went from NB tanking when Sap tanking died out. Related to the above I know, but would love to see sap tanking return. It was a class-unique way of tanking.

Edziu

1. hmm, if you dont want to give back anything like small purge to cloak then maybe add snare removal to double take?
everyone are ussing shuffle at all costing stamina, I want to use double take instead of shuffle jsut becasue it cost magica, no stamina and its class skill, why class skill cant have something unque like this atlest snare removal if you dont want add also immunity, speedbuff isnt that big thing in this skill because it can be ignored if we going with speedbuff potions or just bow dodge speedbuff

2. malevolent offering...who ever wanted it? bring back old agony, this wasnt the best skill but was great as utility for range combos like sorc can, melvolent not only is not used on nb healers becaue its really stupid skill costing health + scaling only from magica, why its not even scaling froms tamina and why I cant healm myself with it? if we going with it

ascan7

1) Strife costs too much. If you need to nerf Nightblade DPS, nerf other skills because by nerfing Strife you are just hurting tanks and healers, while DPS just use Force Shock instead

2) Soul Harvest, Reaper's Mark and Debilitate are too weak or unuseful compared to the other morph. Blur and Drain Power could be improved.

Sandman929

1. Sap Essence should work the way Inhale works on a DK. I don't understand why a class with Siphoning, supposedly pulling the health out of enemies, is stuck with a flat heal (and a percentage increase) rather than a heal based on damage done.
2. Malevolent Offering....who is this for?

Rianai

Open world PvP/Magblade POV

It will be more than 2 points and i'll just let the class representatives decide what to do with it

I also want to note that my 2 main pain points aren't related directly to the class itself, but to game performance (lags/desyncs/bugs) and gear balance (proc sets) and as long those two points remain, the following class related points are second rate for me.

In no particular order:

Lack of snare removal
Being forced to crawl arround is annoying enough in itself, but additionally it also negatively impacts Cloak and Shadow Image - my main defensive skills. Aoe of any kind becomes much harder to avoid when snared, so Cloak is broken much more easily and Shadow Image requires movement too for efficient use.

Unreliable and unpredictable behaviour of Cloak
The problem is not that things break Cloak. There needs to be counters to stealth (some of those could need some buffs even). If i get hit by visible Aoe and cloak gets broken as a result, that's ok. The problem is, that often i can't tell if cloak will get broken or not. I won't know if someone (and who) used a detect pot. I often don't know who marked me, so i don't know whom to focus or avoid. And sometimes i don't even know, what breaks it. It would be much better if i could tell who and what exactly is breaking my cloak, so i can try to play arround the counter instead of spamming it and hoping it starts working at some point.

Side Note: I like the suggestion of @ak_pvp regarding cloak. Making it a more reliable invisibility tool but removing the damage mitigation. Unfortunately this would require a complete rework of how stealth works in this game, so it is very unlikely to happen.

Piercing Mark
Even though i use it myself, i don't think it is a well designed skill. Again, counters to cloak are good and neccessary. But not hardcounters like this. Unavoidable, long duration, insane range, can be cast from stealth, ... It is bearable in a 1vs1 or XvsX, but usually a death sentence when solo and outnumbered, even more so when i can't even identify the markblade.
(Right now Sloads is much worse than Mark though. Playing solo has never been more frustrating for me. Cloak is unusable in like 90% of my fights).

Combination of high burst and high escapability/Synergy with proc sets (could be split into 2 points, but closely connected imo)
I'm generally not a fan of high burst from stealth. I don't like be be on the reciving end, nor do i enjoy playing such builds. I know, some players enjoy ganking, and it won't go away most likely. But imo builds which are capable of oneshotting others should be forced to spend more than 1 or 2 seconds out of stealth. Instant burst from stealth with on demand invisibility right after and enough sustain to stay in cloak long enough to get away shouldn't be a thing. It is not entirely class related, because it is usually proc sets (mainly Caluurion, Velidreth and Zaan), which allow high burst on more or less survivable builds, at least in noCP PvP. But even though those sets might not be balanced on other classes either, nightblades tend to have the best synergy with those sets: Minor Berserk and Incap/Soul Harvest for increased proc dmg, strong CC to ensure otherwise avoidable procs hit, being able to guarantee Caluurion procs with Shadowy Disguise + Concealed Weapon, ...
NBs are a class without delayed burst skills or many class DoTs and imo they are designed arround this with cheap and strong ultimates, good offensive passives and the hardest hitting non-ultimate skill in the game. But proc sets circumvent this draw-back of not having delayed burst and allow a NB to stack multiple dmg sources in one GCD, allowing uncounterable oneshots from stealth with the ability to stealth again right after (the less time someone has to spend visible, the less likely he is getting caught with Mark, Sloads, Snares or the like).
Maybe it isn't as bad with CP, but i'm mainly playing on Sotha, so it is an issue for me.

Merciless Resolve
This skill has recived multiple buffs over the course of the last year to the point where it became too good imo. Especially the latest change (keeping stacks after the buff runs out) was unneccessary and allows much more defensive/passive gamplay while still retaining high burst capabilities. Previously it would require more agressive gameplay, now a NB can just cloak arround, light attacking only once in a while and still build and keep up the bow proc. Playing against someone who constantly spams cloak mid-fight isn't very fun without reliable cloak counter, and the buff to Merciless was also a huge buff to this annoying playstyle (also applies to stamblades and dodge spam to some extent).
I do not want to see a damage nerf to Assassin's Will (or any skill for that matter) though, because it would just force the class more into proc sets.

Not as crucial as the previous points, but I'll mention it nonetheless for the sake of completeness:
No unreflectable ranged class skills
Fighting a DK with Wings as a ranged magblade is just a pain. No way to pressure them, unless i completely change my playstyle (melee build) or slot certain weapon skills, which are still not enough dmg. Trying to break Wings is often suicide, and most DKs doesn't seem to have an issue with using this skill every 6s while going offensive inbetween. And not only my offense is hampered, my healing (Strife) is too.

Darieltis

MisterBigglesworth wrote: »

Pain Point #1: Malevolent Offering doesn't need to exist.

Pain Point #2: Nightblade is severely lacking Command Humanoid type spells.

It's part of the illusion school. Just sayin'

Malevolent Offering is a good addition to Bloodmage Healers - burst heal, adds 3% healing due to siphoning passives, and costs health instead of magicka - giving a second resource pool for healing.

To answer the main question, as a NB healer since essentially launch I'm overall pleased with the changes that have been happening lately. That being said, my comments would be:

1) I agree with the lack of synergy. Path is an option, but with the continued nerfs to healing/damage of Path - I'm a little nervous about what would be sacrificed for this change. Blur might also be an option - given that skills like bone shield have a synergy attached. Heck, even cripple could have a synergy given that inner fire has one and is placed on the target just as cripple is.

2) The death of sap tanking - this was a fun and dynamic play style. One that I enjoyed immensely. I'd love to see the opportunity for this to make a comeback.

Brazen_Blade

From a magblade PVE perspective:

1) Count me in with the others regarding lack of class synergies. I think Path and its morphs offer the best opportunity here, or maybe the newer health for heals versions of Malevolent Offering. As a PVE DPS, Nightblades fall far behind in this area compared to Magsorcs and Magplars. Same with the support roles - a Nightblade healer has nothing to offer for synergies besides their Ultimates or the Undaunted Orbs for group synergies.

2) Lack of passive group buffs. Adding these might make the class too strong over others in group PVE, but I think a start could be the Hemorrhage passive offering Minor Sorcery as well as Minor Savagery. Perhaps some passive buffs like Minor Vitality to allies could be worked in, and would go with the theme of the class.

NightbladeMechanics

MisterBigglesworth wrote: »

Pain Point #1: Malevolent Offering doesn't need to exist.

Pain Point #2: Nightblade is severely lacking Command Humanoid type spells.

It's part of the illusion school. Just sayin'

What do you mean by "command humanoid type spells?" Like clones in shadow/illusion magic?

bardx86

Micah_Bayer wrote: »

I hate how easy my class is, there is no other class that can perform as well as me in PvP. My pain is how easy PvP is.

totally agree!

OdinForge

My observations as a pvp stamnb since 1.3, and pvp magnb since 1.8.

I think stamnb is fine for the moment. You get a lot of build diversity options when playing stamnb. I don't even think incap needs to be changed, but would be okay with it losing the stun. This ultimate only became a proper stamina scaling ultimate after dark brotherhood.

Magnb has so many problems that two pain points alone aren't even worth thinking about. In pvp current magnb feels like a bit of a hot mess. Perma cloak is bad game design, and really strong for those who prefer to avoid fighting, and it doesn't help magnb the same way it does stamnb because of snares and roots for actual combat.

Magnb was a standout class for 1v1s because of its sustain and healing capability. It has received many nerfs either indirectly or directly, and even magsorc feels more fun to play open world.

I wish magnb played like it used to before softcap removal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rn92Vj_HDl4

Silver_Strider

Ankael07 wrote: »

LegacyDM wrote: »

All you guys hating on cloak.remember magicka nb doesn’t have a class shield nor stamina to dodge roll forever. + there are over s dozen counters to cloak. Cloak is really our only defense without relying on shade morph. If anything it needs a buff.

I dont hate cloak but its not a MNB's only defence by any means. There is the Shadow Barrier passive giving major resistances, Strife heals you based on damage done, Siphoning strikes also healing you and providing some sustain, Summon Shades to teleport and inflict Minor Maim which can now be cast without targeting an enemy and lastly Blur giving Major Evasion.

What I hate instead is every nightblade playing innocent and saying ''We're squishy, we were made to be assassins coming out of shadows and killing in seconds then escaping''

That's subjective and based on how the NB is built. All of NB's toolkit is geared towards being hard to hit and escaping danger, with a few skills skimming the line as useful for other purposes as well.
Let's look at those skills you listed.
Blur, Major Evasion to avoid damage with a morph that reduces damage further with Minor Resolve+Ward or a morph to grant Major Expedition. While Mirage isn't the worst skill, it doesn't provide much protection in the grand scheme of things (A single sharpened weapon cuts thru it like butter) whereas Major Expedition allows for much more maneuverability, which is a fairly useful thing in PvP overall.
Shadow Image allows for a free repositioning tool that allows us to shake off pursues while also making them deal less damage so we don't take as much damage as we build distance between the shade and the NB to utilize the teleport for maximum effectiveness; after all, if you die prior to using the teleport, it's kind of redundant as an escape tool and the damage it does it extremely lackluster so it sure isn't helping to kill anyone.
Strife and Siphoning Strikes can be viewed in a number of ways; some can view them as mitigation tools, some can view them as sustain tools, etc. However, depending on how the NB is built, both Strife and SS can be used as anything. It can be used to help keep them alive long enough to get to safety, or they can be used for a Stand your Ground approach. Since other classes handle the Stand your Ground approach better than NB though, a lot of their toolkit is relatively seen as "escape or die" in the eyes of most NBs.

RavenSworn wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

RavenSworn wrote: »

1)The class lacks a group synergy skill. This will add more utility for the class with the healer or tank role. The best choice for this is Path of Darkness.

2) much has been done to alleviate tanking and healing for nb, thank you for the changes. I can't say much bout pvp but in terms of pve, Mirage / double take should switch places with aspect of terror. It doesn't make any sense for this ability to be in the assassin skill line when it's used defensively. It will also be in line with the shadow defensive / tanking tree.

I think you could add Blur to the list of skills that would be great for a Synergy.

Think switching Veiled Strike with Blur would be more appropriate than Aspect of Terror. AoT is sort of weird in either skill line but since its used for defensive purposes, it seems more appropriate to be in the Tank skill line than in an Assassin Skill Line.

Veiled strike I feel, is more useful for the lower levels, as it acts as a spammable, something akin to sorcerers at lower levels with the pet, mage fury and crystal shard.

The reason why aspect I feel is more in line with the assassin skill line, an assassin is an aspect of terror and death. In fact, take away the minor maim from one of the morphs and replaced it with minor vulnerability.

I'm on the fence for blur to be a group synergy but why not? Nb needs it to be more optimal for trial healing.

I'd rather see Reaper's Mark gain a Minor Vulnerability buff, since Piercing Mark is pretty much the go to morph as it has the longer duration and has PvP implications whereas RM is sort of meh in comparison.

As for making the spammable not accessible at lower levels, it's not as though ZOS hasn't adjusted skills in the past to make the spammable skills closer to the top (Chains and Whip, Force Pulse and Clutch, Snipe and Poison Arrow) so I'd imagine they could just rearrange Veiled Strike as the 1st skill in Assassin with Assassin's Blade moving down to 3rd, while Path of Darkness becomes the 1st skill in Shadow and Blur being the 3rd skill in Shadow in its place. A bit more switching then they're used to but not impossible either.

Own

Cloak breaking to mages wrath, sloads. Flame clench DoT going through roll dodge when flame clinch misses. Hauntjng curse not being blockable. People are stacking 2-3 and theres nothing a NB can do. Sloads stacking. 10 second defiles.

_Salty_

Ive mained a Nightblade tank since console launch. It used to be a very dynamic way of tanking. Every update has gutted the class skills that defined the spec. Its a shred of its former glory. We are left with using sets to replace these skills.

My guild used to love running with me because I provided off heals and extra damage that made Vet dungeon runs quick and painless. While a Nightblade lacked group synergies and skills/passives/utilities that benifit the whole group, they made up for by providing what other tanks cannot. It had an identity.

There are obvious pain points stated by others that I wont bother touching on since they have been heavily discussed.

2 pain points.

1. Power extraction is pure garbage. Under powered and honestly a lazy half baked morph that provides nothing unique.

There is no reason to pick this skill on a stamblade unless you hate yourself. Id rather slam my baby maker in a car door than slot this skill.

Zos decided to make Nighblades a disease class. The skill does disease damage but there isn't anything disease related about it other than scaling. Make it have a percent chance to proc minor defile like siphoning had a 15% chance of procing resource return. (I believe they should remove the befoul CP all together and take a look at defile sets in general) I say this since it ties into Zos's half baked idea of disease/Nightbade pairing.

Or what Id prefer is to make it an AOE taunt, or heroism or both. Nightblade has access to maim with shades so why not give minor heroism through another skill so nightblades dont have to run heroic slash if they dont want to.

Or Just up the damage or reduce cost.

Give stamina Nightblade tanks(or all specs ) a reason to run it. Currently their isn't one. For a skill called power extraction it only extract the casters stamina. You can do better Zos.

2. No group utility other than ult gen.

There is no reason to take a Nightblade tank of any spec over a DK or even a Warden in the hardest content. Now before someone says "hurdur I have tanked all content on my Nightblade, L2P Salty" remind yourselves that Templar and Nightblade are still far behind in their current state. This is fact.

Idea for group utilty:

Make dark cloak morph heal the caster and provide an AOE minor protection to the group in a 8 Meter radius. Up the protection time for the group to 8 seconds and keep the timer at 3 seconds for the caster. This will provide protection to all the mele stam and mele mag specs. Its supposed to be a cloak right? This might encourage different group compositions and give Nightblades a niche for tanking. As we know tanks can be more than meat shields and each one should provide different group benifits.

I could go on. But Ill keep the giant wall of text to a minimum.

Juhasow

My 2 pain points about nightblade ?

1. This is mainly PvP. Too strong connection of cloaking and roll dodging making it one of the most effective defensive mechanics in the game allowing stamblade to restart fight multiple times on demand and restore resources in the meantime.

2. This is both PvP and PvE. Acces to 2 very strong high dmg cheap abilities increases the damage potential tremendously. I am talking about Grim Focus and Death Stroke. First one is very cheap considering it provides 20 seconds minor berserk plus very bursty damage proc (the size of execute abilities dmg) for free , second one opens too strong burst combos considering how often it can be used and it also grants increased sustained dmg pressure.

Strider__Roshin

_Salty_ wrote: »

Ive mained a Nightblade tank since console launch. It used to be a very dynamic way of tanking. Every update has gutted the class skills that defined the spec. Its a shred of its former glory. We are left with using sets to replace these skills.

My guild used to love running with me because I provided off heals and extra damage that made Vet dungeon runs quick and painless. While a Nightblade lacked group synergies and skills/passives/utilities that benifit the whole group, they made up for by providing what other tanks cannot. It had an identity.

There are obvious pain points stated by others that I wont bother touching on since they have been heavily discussed.

2 pain points.

1. Power extraction is pure garbage. Under powered and honestly a lazy half baked morph that provides nothing unique.

There is no reason to pick this skill on a stamblade unless you hate yourself. Id rather slam my baby maker in a car door than slot this skill.

Zos decided to make Nighblades a disease class. The skill does disease damage but there isn't anything disease related about it other than scaling. Make it have a percent chance to proc minor defile like siphoning had a 15% chance of procing resource return. (I believe they should remove the befoul CP all together and take a look at defile sets in general) I say this since it ties into Zos's half baked idea of disease/Nightbade pairing.

Or what Id prefer is to make it an AOE taunt, or heroism or both. Nightblade has access to maim with shades so why not give minor heroism through another skill so nightblades dont have to run heroic slash if they dont want to.

Or Just up the damage or reduce cost.

Give stamina Nightblade tanks(or all specs ) a reason to run it. Currently their isn't one. For a skill called power extraction it only extract the casters stamina. You can do better Zos.

2. No group utility other than ult gen.

There is no reason to take a Nightblade tank of any spec over a DK or even a Warden in the hardest content. Now before someone says "hurdur I have tanked all content on my Nightblade, L2P Salty" remind yourselves that Templar and Nightblade are still far behind in their current state. This is fact.

Idea for group utilty:

Make dark cloak morph heal the caster and provide an AOE minor protection to the group in a 8 Meter radius. Up the protection time for the group to 8 seconds and keep the timer at 3 seconds for the caster. This will provide protection to all the mele stam and mele mag specs. Its supposed to be a cloak right? This might encourage different group compositions and give Nightblades a niche for tanking. As we know tanks can be more than meat shields and each one should provide different group benifits.

I could go on. But Ill keep the giant wall of text to a minimum.

Really spot-on suggestions!

Ragnaroek93

1) Would like if stamnb would have more pressure and less frontloaded burst. Solution: Remove the stun from Incap, buff the damage from Assassins Will a bit but turn it into a dot, stammorph for Cripple.
2) Rework Cloak and give Nbs another defensive ability to defend themselves. Cloak together with frontloaded burst will never be balanced. Defensive wise Cloak is fine, what's not fine are Instafrags out of Cloak. Solution: Tune down Cloak and buff the survivability of all medium armor builds, maybe give them a damage shield or something like that.

I'm only talking about stamnb, I don't play magnb enough to make a statement about that class.

Datthaw

So...

This new nb heal, I'm not feeling it so much. Been trying it on a hybrid, sitting at like 35k hp in cyro, and it just feels meh. Maybe its because I'm still below 50? I was excited for it but now ehh, idk ill keep trying it.

Snares... I don't really want to beat a dead horse but changing cloak to stack cost but added snare revoval.

I'm going three, don't hurt me. The "in combat" with mercy bow feels very inconsistent. Say I kill a target at the last few second of my timer, but it's proc'd. Sometimes when I recast and move on the next target it's still proc'd, sometimes I need to rebuild stacks. Idk what the difference is I never left combat and it's not like I waited 30 seconds to find my next target. I don't like the lack of consistency or clarity I'm feeing. Atleast say like if you don't attack a target for x seconds it resets.

Narvuntien

Hemorrhage
With an assasination ability slotted

Gains Minor Force

Dealing Critical Damage grants you and your group Minor Savagery, increasing Weapon Critical Strike rating by 657 for 20 seconds.

Part of the reason NB are so strong in PVE is that have a bonus crit damage over and above minor force. I suggest they just get minor force so it cannot be stacked.

This will be a buff to solo players....

Remove the Major Defile from Death Stroke, I think that is the biggest frustration with the skill, its just too overloaded for how little it costs. Killers blade is such a good execute I just don't feel like I need that defile. Incap, Killers blade, Dead.

JobooAGS

Narvuntien wrote: »

Hemorrhage
With an assasination ability slotted

Gains Minor Force

Dealing Critical Damage grants you and your group Minor Savagery, increasing Weapon Critical Strike rating by 657 for 20 seconds.

Part of the reason NB are so strong in PVE is that have a bonus crit damage over and above minor force. I suggest they just get minor force so it cannot be stacked.

This will be a buff to solo players....

Remove the Major Defile from Death Stroke, I think that is the biggest frustration with the skill, its just too overloaded for how little it costs. Killers blade is such a good execute I just don't feel like I need that defile. Incap, Killers blade, Dead.

Wouldnt you have to do the same to templars and how would this be a buff?

Narvuntien

JobooAGS wrote: »

Narvuntien wrote: »

Hemorrhage
With an assasination ability slotted

Gains Minor Force

Dealing Critical Damage grants you and your group Minor Savagery, increasing Weapon Critical Strike rating by 657 for 20 seconds.

Part of the reason NB are so strong in PVE is that have a bonus crit damage over and above minor force. I suggest they just get minor force so it cannot be stacked.

This will be a buff to solo players....

Remove the Major Defile from Death Stroke, I think that is the biggest frustration with the skill, its just too overloaded for how little it costs. Killers blade is such a good execute I just don't feel like I need that defile. Incap, Killers blade, Dead.

Wouldnt you have to do the same to templars and how would this be a buff?

Minor force is 12% instead of 10%.

Oh I forgot about that, my templar is a tank lol.. well *shrug* why not they did it to NMG and Sunderflame I think everything in the game should start getting classified under the minor major system.... Its better than nerfing skills in my opinion.

JobooAGS

Narvuntien wrote: »

JobooAGS wrote: »

Narvuntien wrote: »

Hemorrhage
With an assasination ability slotted

Gains Minor Force

Dealing Critical Damage grants you and your group Minor Savagery, increasing Weapon Critical Strike rating by 657 for 20 seconds.

Part of the reason NB are so strong in PVE is that have a bonus crit damage over and above minor force. I suggest they just get minor force so it cannot be stacked.

This will be a buff to solo players....

Remove the Major Defile from Death Stroke, I think that is the biggest frustration with the skill, its just too overloaded for how little it costs. Killers blade is such a good execute I just don't feel like I need that defile. Incap, Killers blade, Dead.

Wouldnt you have to do the same to templars and how would this be a buff?

Minor force is 12% instead of 10%.

Oh I forgot about that, my templar is a tank lol.. well *shrug* why not they did it to NMG and Sunderflame I think everything in the game should start getting classified under the minor major system.... Its better than nerfing skills in my opinion.

What patch are you in? Minor force is 10% now